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Why do skilled roamers avoid fighting other skilled roamers?


EremiteAngel.9765

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@Spartacus.3192 said:

@"Sylosi.6503" said:Because most WvW players who still play WvW on a frequent basis are basically PvE players at heart who use WvW as a substitute for a social life, rather than looking for good (challenging) PvP. No actual PvP player would put up with the pitiful quality of "PvP" in WvW where the majority of fights are not close in the slightest. (let's not even go into how infrequent fights are on top of that...)

I remember last time I watched Helseth stream (long ago), a bit after they let you queue for PvP from WvW, he went into WvW duelled a warrior, beat him, said "this is stupid, I can just kite him" and went back to PvP, that is the response of an actual PvP player to the "PvP" of WvW.

Rather WvW roamers don't wont to lose any more brain cells playing the same tiny conquest maps on a restricted amulet build system that requires you to be on a circle to win. In WvW you have huge maps, able to LOS, dont need to stand on a circle that the entire enemy team will bomb. They also have the ability to play a wider variety of builds. Its refreshing to come across players actually experimenting with diverse builds which is virtually impossible in PvP.

Im talking small scale roaming here not Zergs.

If there comes a day when ANET implements the pvp amulet system in WvW will be the day i uninstall.

Also LOL at quoting Helseth who plays mesmer which is literally the most OP duelling class in WvW like since forever.

Yea but the concept is there...Being mostly a PvP player you're forced to play with a lot of restrictions such as mobility and builds, then you find a WvW player who "duels" on flat ground and wouldnt know how to kite or LoS if it slapped him in the face, most likely reliant on overtuned stats to do most of the work rather than skill.

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@sephiroth.4217 said:

@"Sylosi.6503" said:Because most WvW players who still play WvW on a frequent basis are basically PvE players at heart who use WvW as a substitute for a social life, rather than looking for good (challenging) PvP. No actual PvP player would put up with the pitiful quality of "PvP" in WvW where the majority of fights are not close in the slightest. (let's not even go into how infrequent fights are on top of that...)

I remember last time I watched Helseth stream (long ago), a bit after they let you queue for PvP from WvW, he went into WvW duelled a warrior, beat him, said "this is stupid, I can just kite him" and went back to PvP, that is the response of an actual PvP player to the "PvP" of WvW.

Rather WvW roamers don't wont to lose any more brain cells playing the same tiny conquest maps on a restricted amulet build system that requires you to be on a circle to win. In WvW you have huge maps, able to LOS, dont need to stand on a circle that the entire enemy team will bomb. They also have the ability to play a wider variety of builds. Its refreshing to come across players actually experimenting with diverse builds which is virtually impossible in PvP.

Im talking small scale roaming here not Zergs.

If there comes a day when ANET implements the pvp amulet system in WvW will be the day i uninstall.

Also LOL at quoting Helseth who plays mesmer which is literally the most OP duelling class in WvW like since forever.

Yea but the concept is there...Being mostly a PvP player you're forced to play with a lot of restrictions such as mobility and builds, then you find a WvW player who "duels" on flat ground and wouldnt know how to kite or LoS if it slapped him in the face, most likely reliant on overtuned stats to do most of the work rather than skill.

Well that's the point thought right? The node fighting aspect of PvP structures the feel of the entire game mode. I played a lot of PvP the first few years and it was a lot of fun for a while but eventually I just got tired of the same fights in the same circles. So it's like even if the micro level play is more skill oriented the game mode itself is tedious. I play video games to have fun and PvP just isn't that much fun after a few thousand games imo.

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Lol, it does amuse me that people want WvW to be like the only game mode in this game that's an even bigger failure.

This is a pve game with some incidential pvp. Ever since the esparwats dream died, balance is entirely focused on raids. It's not a criticism of it, but pretending anything else at this point, well...

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@Nimon.7840 said:

@"Sylosi.6503" said:Because most WvW players who still play WvW on a frequent basis are basically PvE players at heart who use WvW as a substitute for a social life, rather than looking for good (challenging) PvP. No actual PvP player would put up with the pitiful quality of "PvP" in WvW where the majority of fights are not close in the slightest. (let's not even go into how infrequent fights are on top of that...)

I remember last time I watched Helseth stream (long ago), a bit after they let you queue for PvP from WvW, he went into WvW duelled a warrior, beat him, said "this is stupid, I can just kite him" and went back to PvP, that is the response of an actual PvP player to the "PvP" of WvW.

That's funny. I think it's the exact opposite way.

Then you'd be wrong, putting aside most actual PvP players (and I mean in a general sense not specific to this game's PvP) from both WvW and PvP quit long ago or barely play anymore, the pattern for better WvW players (roamers especially) was to go from WvW to PvP. Frankly it was even the pattern for not so good roamers who weren't playing WvW as a substitute for a social life, for the simple reason you get far more action in PvP than roaming in WvW.

If you are looking for "good (challenging) PvP" gw2 is the wrong game for you.

Correct, which is why I log in occasionally for a week or two to see if by some miracle if things like WvW have improved (it hasn't, it is in an even sadder state the previous time I played), then go back to playing actual PvP games for the next X months until my next little visit to GW2.

And when they get into wvw, where the first challenge occurs in crafting a good build, they often choose pretty poorly.Because spvp makes you not flexible by having these stupid set stat amulets

Nah, it is just more balanced and less carried by cheese (it is still cheesy of course), because they throw out most of the broken runes, sigils, stat combos and the game was designed around that game mode (e.g - look at stealth / mobility - the balance to those in PvP is the game mode itself, roaming in WvW on the other hand...)

You can't just say that wvw isn't good PvP. It actually is. But you need to find these people that are as good as you are.

It is trash tier PvP, the basis of decent, skilled, even fun PvP is competition, and I don't mean that in some "esports" way. I simply mean having opponents that are around the same experience / skill / outlook toward the game as each other, so you get at least vaguely competitive encounters. WvW is complete garbage at that, which is exactly why you had people try to get that with things like GvG.

WvW is "PvP" for PvE players, it is low skill, casual, undemanding to the point you can simply join a zerg and have the commander basically think for players to varying degrees, making decisions for them directly or indirectly on things that are considered fundamental to most PvP games like positioning.

Which to be fair actually suits the playerbase of a casual MMORPG where most players are more concerned about playing dress-up than anything else.

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@Sylosi.6503 said:

@Sylosi.6503 said:Because most WvW players who still play WvW on a frequent basis are basically PvE players at heart who use WvW as a substitute for a social life, rather than looking for good (challenging) PvP. No actual PvP player would put up with the pitiful quality of "PvP" in WvW where the majority of fights are not close in the slightest. (let's not even go into how infrequent fights are on top of that...)

I remember last time I watched Helseth stream (long ago), a bit after they let you queue for PvP from WvW, he went into WvW duelled a warrior, beat him, said "this is stupid, I can just kite him" and went back to PvP, that is the response of an actual PvP player to the "PvP" of WvW.

That's funny. I think it's the exact opposite way.

Then you'd be wrong, putting aside most actual PvP players (and I mean in a general sense not specific to this game's PvP) from both WvW and PvP quit long ago or barely play anymore, the pattern for better WvW players (roamers especially) was to go from WvW to PvP. Frankly it was even the pattern for not so good roamers who weren't playing WvW as a substitute for a social life, for the simple reason you get far more action in PvP than roaming in WvW.

If you are looking for "good (challenging) PvP" gw2 is the wrong game for you.

Correct, which is why I log in occasionally for a week or two to see if by some miracle if things like WvW have improved (it hasn't, it is in an even sadder state the previous time I played), then go back to playing actual PvP games for the next X months until my next little visit to GW2.

And when they get into wvw, where the first challenge occurs in crafting a good build, they often choose pretty poorly.Because spvp makes you not flexible by having these stupid set stat amulets

Nah, it is just more balanced and less carried by cheese (it is still cheesy of course), because they throw out most of the broken runes, sigils, stat combos and the game was designed around that game mode (e.g - look at stealth / mobility - the balance to those in PvP is the game mode itself, roaming in WvW on the other hand...)

You can't just say that wvw isn't good PvP. It actually is. But you need to find these people that are as good as you are.

It is trash tier PvP, the basis of decent, skilled, even fun PvP is competition, and I don't mean that in some "esports" way. I simply mean having opponents that are around the same experience / skill / outlook toward the game as each other, so you get at least vaguely competitive encounters. WvW is complete garbage at that, which is exactly why you had people try to get that with things like GvG.

WvW is "PvP" for PvE players, it is low skill, casual, undemanding to the point you can simply join a zerg and have the commander basically think for players to varying degrees, making decisions for them directly or indirectly on things that are considered fundamental to most PvP games like positioning.

Which to be fair actually suits the playerbase of a casual MMORPG where most players are more concerned about playing dress-up than anything else.

Every pvp team i knew of or played with had a commander as well. You can't be organized and working as a single unit if you have multiple people thinking different things and pursuing different visions at the same time. Obviously each individual member of a PvP team had a role to fill but the rotations and the strategic decisions were all entirely centralized just like a wvw raid.

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@MUDse.7623 said:

@"lodjur.1284" said:

Anyone can pick their battles, espec when you can just disengage if you turn out to be wrong. To me that's about as interesting as sieging.you cannot just disengage if you turn out to be wrong, that doesnt work in too many cases. mostly when you manage to disengage, you had that possibility in mind on engage so you made sure you still can disengage. but yes everyone can pick their fights, still sooo many people fail at it - wonder why..

You can on 3 classes, very easily except possibly against people playing these same 3 classes (but usually you can cause disengages are easier than chasing). You don't need to keep it in mind if you class has several long range teleports/leaps and possibly stealth.

yes there are professions with the tools to disengage a fight. yet you still need them ready for a disengage and are not allowed to use them offensively if you think you might need to disengage. they do not have a magic 0 cost 'i am outta here' button.

Which is exactly how everyone uses them. You don't blink into a fight on mesmer for example (overgeneralization as there's obviously times to use them to engage). Also against a lot of classes you have enough mobility skills to do both, or one like shadowstep that allow you to do both with 1 skill.

Also you mention failing at choosing your fights. There isn't anything to fail at unless you're using a very narrow definition of what a correct fight to take is. For me personally, when I am solo, I engage in all fights where I could have a chance to win this includes 1v5s I quite often lose, because to me dying doesn't matter. The only things I actually avoid to engage are groups bigger than 7 (unless I happen to know they are very very bad/new players and it's in a good location), thieves/mesmers/rangers (if they look even remotely competent) and people I know (or kindaish).

there is alot to fail. if you attack a group too big for you to be able to at least disengage again, you failed. if you waste alot of time trying to avoid a fight because you overestimate your opponents, you also failed. unless ofc you do not value your own contribution, then you can waste your time with waiting or dying pointlessly.

I value my time, therefore I like spending it doing something I find fun, such as having challenging fights where it matters what I do. Now if you don't find that fun that's your business, if you'd rather play the objectives to ahead, but that clearly isn't for everyone. But saying that people who don't play the objectives are wasting their time is just an incredibly strange statement.

Also you're calling me narrow-minded after literally saying you can fail at picking what you want to do with your time in a game.

The last category is because with those people we both already know who will win a fight based on what we're playing (and how good the person is ofc) and neither of us would wanna end up 2+v1ing someone, therefore I only really fight people I know at dueling spots.

According to your definition I massively fail at picking my fights tho. Imo there's nothing to actually fail at.thats correct IMO you probably fail at picking your fights. you already realised earlier that IMO picking a challanging fight is far from efficient. it might be what is fun to you and you might perform well in said fight, but from might point of view that is very bad as what i call a roamer.

To me at least, only the fights are actually interesting and that's the way everyone I play with also sees it.thats good that you play with likeminded, doesnt make your view the only right one. you see plenty of people already answered that when they talk about roaming they do not have such a narrowminded view on it as you do, yet you still stand by your opinion to be the only true one. as 'everyone YOU play with' is of that opinion.

You mean like the person who think that everything that isn't scouting or zerging is dueling?

I am not saying what I am doing is better, I am just saying what roaming is, frankly objective playing isn't really roaming, its more often just called scouting or could be called solo havoc. Trying to call me narrowminded for
wanting a term used correctly
is just silly, try keeping a higher debate level in the future please.exactly, you want us to use the term the way you think it is correct. why is it so difficult to apply a broader meaning to what 'roaming' is? and yes i do think myself a roamer and kind of feel a bit offended as you claim that whatever i am doing is not roaming, therefor i will call it narrowminded. during what i call roaming many people apply their focus on different things but trying to use a different word for the activities of every specific roamer would be a little much, dont you think? you just make it easy and say everyone playing like me is a roamer and the rest is doing 'something' but not roaming..

I make it easy by following a clear defining of the word that as a nice bonus happens to be precisely what the actual word roaming means. If you care about your "contribution" you have a clear goal, which means you're not roaming.

"to walk, go, or travel without a fixed purpose or direction" would be the dictionary definition, which while not directly applicable is still relevant.

If you're offended by someone saying that what you're doing is more like scouting, then you're the narrow-minded one as you then clearly think "playstyle x is better than playstyle y". Which I have never said, I just said they aren't the same. I have never claimed that being a roamer somehow makes one a better person than the rest of the population, that'd be you.

Applying a broader term instantly makes it less precise, we classify and label things so we can discuss them in a productive way. Including scouting in roaming makes the term more ambiguous and means that it's impossible to know what someone means when they say it.

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@Jeknar.6184 said:

@"Justine.6351" said:Some of them are friends. Want makes me smh a little is when random people try emulating "I'm just watching" behaviour because they are just groupies.

What exactly is this "I'm just watching" behaviour? I really didn't get what you mean...

People who normally jump into a fight against a foe who is already outnumbered but when its a streamer they recognize they suddenly alter their behavior by standing back and watching their allies die because they know if they pushed in they would alienate their idol and be labeled as uncool. And then they proceed to follow the streamer around "just watching" as a way to associate and demonstrate that they are chill/cool. And once the stream is over they revert back into their Xv1 ganking habit.

@4min to 8min the zap blue sylvari holosmith I recognized as someone who was following Xan [vT] around on one of his streams being all chill "im just watching". In this fight of mine you can see him conflicted between normal behavior and groupie behavior. He didn't have any issues 4v1 blargo the spellbreaker but when dany the chrono and I enter the fight you can see for the next 4 min he cant decide whether to fight or watch because he is unsure of who us 3 are, being afraid to look uncool.

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@Sylosi.6503 said:

@Sylosi.6503 said:Because most WvW players who still play WvW on a frequent basis are basically PvE players at heart who use WvW as a substitute for a social life, rather than looking for good (challenging) PvP. No actual PvP player would put up with the pitiful quality of "PvP" in WvW where the majority of fights are not close in the slightest. (let's not even go into how infrequent fights are on top of that...)

I remember last time I watched Helseth stream (long ago), a bit after they let you queue for PvP from WvW, he went into WvW duelled a warrior, beat him, said "this is stupid, I can just kite him" and went back to PvP, that is the response of an actual PvP player to the "PvP" of WvW.

That's funny. I think it's the exact opposite way.

Then you'd be wrong, putting aside most actual PvP players (and I mean in a general sense not specific to this game's PvP) from both WvW and PvP quit long ago or barely play anymore, the pattern for better WvW players (roamers especially) was to go from WvW to PvP. Frankly it was even the pattern for not so good roamers who weren't playing WvW as a substitute for a social life, for the simple reason you get far more action in PvP than roaming in WvW.

If you are looking for "good (challenging) PvP" gw2 is the wrong game for you.

Correct, which is why I log in occasionally for a week or two to see if by some miracle if things like WvW have improved (it hasn't, it is in an even sadder state the previous time I played), then go back to playing actual PvP games for the next X months until my next little visit to GW2.

And when they get into wvw, where the first challenge occurs in crafting a good build, they often choose pretty poorly.Because spvp makes you not flexible by having these stupid set stat amulets

Nah, it is just more balanced and less carried by cheese (it is still cheesy of course), because they throw out most of the broken runes, sigils, stat combos and the game was designed around that game mode (e.g - look at stealth / mobility - the balance to those in PvP is the game mode itself, roaming in WvW on the other hand...)

You can't just say that wvw isn't good PvP. It actually is. But you need to find these people that are as good as you are.

It is trash tier PvP, the basis of decent, skilled, even fun PvP is competition, and I don't mean that in some "esports" way. I simply mean having opponents that are around the same experience / skill / outlook toward the game as each other, so you get at least vaguely competitive encounters. WvW is complete garbage at that, which is exactly why you had people try to get that with things like GvG.

WvW is "PvP" for PvE players, it is low skill, casual, undemanding to the point you can simply join a zerg and have the commander basically think for players to varying degrees, making decisions for them directly or indirectly on things that are considered fundamental to most PvP games like positioning.

Which to be fair actually suits the playerbase of a casual MMORPG where most players are more concerned about
playing dress-up
than anything else.

Super serious pvper over. Having civilized debates in team chat while playing dress up is only part of the battle, we like to pace ourselves.

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@"Sylosi.6503" said:Because most WvW players who still play WvW on a frequent basis are basically PvE players at heart who use WvW as a substitute for a social life, rather than looking for good (challenging) PvP. No actual PvP player would put up with the pitiful quality of "PvP" in WvW where the majority of fights are not close in the slightest. (let's not even go into how infrequent fights are on top of that...)

I remember last time I watched Helseth stream (long ago), a bit after they let you queue for PvP from WvW, he went into WvW duelled a warrior, beat him, said "this is stupid, I can just kite him" and went back to PvP, that is the response of an actual PvP player to the "PvP" of WvW.

And what, kiting is disabled in pvp?

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@aspirine.6852 said:

@"Sylosi.6503" said:Because most WvW players who still play WvW on a frequent basis are basically PvE players at heart who use WvW as a substitute for a social life, rather than looking for good (challenging) PvP. No actual PvP player would put up with the pitiful quality of "PvP" in WvW where the majority of fights are not close in the slightest. (let's not even go into how infrequent fights are on top of that...)

I remember last time I watched Helseth stream (long ago), a bit after they let you queue for PvP from WvW, he went into WvW duelled a warrior, beat him, said "this is stupid, I can just kite him" and went back to PvP, that is the response of an actual PvP player to the "PvP" of WvW.

And what, kiting is disabled in pvp?Its not, you just loose the match since you cant kite while standing on a point the width of your outstreched arms (or 10 asuras).

Not many go into matches to intentionally loose.

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@Kovu.7560 said:I click my utilities. Fear me!(Seriously though, this game has too many kitten buttons to push and keying something like t/g/h just doesn't feel comfortable to me.)

~ Kovu

@Kovu.7560 said:I click my utilities. Fear me!(Seriously though, this game has too many kitten buttons to push and keying something like t/g/h just doesn't feel comfortable to me.)

~ Kovu

A razer Naga or something similar helps a lot for these kind of games. I have swap weapon, dodge, special action, some signets, auto walk etc all bound to my mouse. Couldn't play the game without it.

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@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Sylosi.6503" said:Because most WvW players who still play WvW on a frequent basis are basically PvE players at heart who use WvW as a substitute for a social life, rather than looking for good (challenging) PvP. No actual PvP player would put up with the pitiful quality of "PvP" in WvW where the majority of fights are not close in the slightest. (let's not even go into how infrequent fights are on top of that...)

I remember last time I watched Helseth stream (long ago), a bit after they let you queue for PvP from WvW, he went into WvW duelled a warrior, beat him, said "this is stupid, I can just kite him" and went back to PvP, that is the response of an actual PvP player to the "PvP" of WvW.

And what, kiting is disabled in pvp?Its not, you just loose the match since you cant kite while standing on a point the width of your outstreched arms (or 10 asuras).

Not many go into matches to intentionally loose.This!

The smallscale (1v1 up to 5v5) class mechanic design fails badly when you try to put it into the WvW environment. WvW is balanced for decent survivability in zerg fights regarding what role your spec has to fulfill. That's the reason why spellbreaker sustain is overtuned in WvW (it's a frontline spec) and that's the reason why the game mode offers soldier attributes as default gear.

ANet failed to balance mirage for WvW because nerfing the obvious (endurance utility) would limit other specs sustain options even more.

Lot's of builds are only held in line because they can't cap or hold a point with their absurd mobility. Of curse these builds become a problem when capping and defending is not what you are playing for.

I played rocket boots holo for a few days (not longer because it's dumb). You can escape from everything! It is impossible to chase you down. Such a build can not be punished. It has no purpose other than giving its user the feeling of being superior while he is lacking the intelligence to realize he is carried. And yes at this point I agree with the mentioned "ego problems" on page 1. When someone resets 5 times and still jumps and spams emotes at range he has some serious mental disease. And that happens on a daily basis in WvW.

But at the end of the day it's all about bad game design. You won't change human idocy. You can only put options in line. The elite specs offered the possibility to introduce different roles for any class, e.g. mobile/squishy/single-target or immobile/tanky/AOE. ANet is not competent enough for that task. They could have created a thief spec that deals massive AOE but whose stealth duration is reduced by 50% and whose evades last only 1/2s. Necro could get a pure single target elite shroud with a leap and a teleport for a mobile playstyle at the cost of that huge team fight impact it currently has. I am missing the topic at this point...

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I see a lot of excuses in this thread, but be realistic, like happens with blob fight guilds, roaming guilds also transfer together, in order to farm pugs in servers without much skill, its the virtual ego. Do i need to list them all? (NA)

Im in SoS server, probs the worst pugs ever, everytime i fight someone a friendly pug comes and rally my enemies, and yet im still here, i take it like im doing a challenge mode lol. I have to fight kinda all of those "skilled" roamers all the time, gank squads, and i just have fun doing it, i get their salt often anyway.

And about the "respect" thing, man wtf, this is war and open field unbalanced encounters, sometimes you are outnumbered and sometimes you outnumber your enemy, it happens without control. Feels like the ones with this argument dosent understand that a pvp mode 5v5 exists too. If i see red i engage and win or lose, i fight. I only stop if the fights happens in "designated" duel areas, but if you are having a fight 1v1 somewhere else ill join and participate i dont care.

Also a lot of people seems "scared" to die, or to "feed" enemies, not like we playing a korean mmo when each death removes you esperience or gear or anything. Dont tell me your self steem is that low to actually care about it.

I personally roam with all the classes, i try always diff builds because after 6yrs its the only fun i get in order to not quit the game. and yet "skilled" roamers will just stick to meta to be carried by a build and wont fight another roamer in the same situation, its just how the game is, people need the sense of accomplish without effort, works for the zergs and works for the roaming. Basically its the bandwagon meta.If you see me around in wvw please send me more rage whispers i have a collection in discord!

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@"Mechanix.9315" said:I see a lot of excuses in this thread, but be realistic, like happens with blob fight guilds, roaming guilds also transfer together, in order to farm pugs in servers without much skill, its the virtual ego. Do i need to list them all? (NA)

Im in SoS server, probs the worst pugs ever, everytime i fight someone a friendly pug comes and rally my enemies, and yet im still here, i take it like im doing a challenge mode lol. I have to fight kinda all of those "skilled" roamers all the time, gank squads, and i just have fun doing it, i get their salt often anyway.

And about the "respect" thing, man kitten, this is war and open field unbalanced encounters, sometimes you are outnumbered and sometimes you outnumber your enemy, it happens without control. Feels like the ones with this argument dosent understand that a pvp mode 5v5 exists too. If i see red i engage and win or lose, i fight. I only stop if the fights happens in "designated" duel areas, but if you are having a fight 1v1 somewhere else ill join and participate i dont care.

Also a lot of people seems "scared" to die, or to "feed" enemies, not like we playing a korean mmo when each death removes you esperience or gear or anything. Dont tell me your self steem is that low to actually care about it.

I personally roam with all the classes, i try always diff builds because after 6yrs its the only fun i get in order to not quit the game. and yet "skilled" roamers will just stick to meta to be carried by a build and wont fight another roamer in the same situation, its just how the game is, people need the sense of accomplish without effort, works for the zergs and works for the roaming. Basically its the bandwagon meta.If you see me around in wvw please send me more rage whispers i have a collection in discord!

I'm not sure people are scared to die but people definitely have an idea of how personal a fight might get just by seeing how much of a scarf wearing bunny hopper the other person is or you can feel it when they're zeroing in their focus on you and they've decided they're going to show off for everyone. If they catch you while you're scout typing or you get some sm 3 way lag or something it don't matter and it's not a long shot that someone might make a snarky comment on one of these threads. WvW isn't open world, map activity is going to push people into other people a few times a night if that's all the action happening. I think most of the nerds roaming around would take more chances if the maps were more open world and lack of map activity didn't truncate them further.

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@Justine.6351 said:

@Justine.6351 said:Some of them are friends. Want makes me smh a little is when random people try emulating "I'm just watching" behaviour because they are just groupies.

What exactly is this "I'm just watching" behaviour? I really didn't get what you mean...

People who normally jump into a fight against a foe who is already outnumbered but when its a streamer they recognize they suddenly alter their behavior by standing back and watching their allies die because they know if they pushed in they would alienate their idol and be labeled as uncool. And then they proceed to follow the streamer around "just watching" as a way to associate and demonstrate that they are chill/cool. And once the stream is over they revert back into their Xv1 ganking habit.

@4min to 8min the zap blue sylvari holosmith I recognized as someone who was following Xan [vT] around on one of his streams being all chill "im just watching". In this fight of mine you can see him conflicted between normal behavior and groupie behavior. He didn't have any issues 4v1 blargo the spellbreaker but when dany the chrono and I enter the fight you can see for the next 4 min he cant decide whether to fight or watch because he is unsure of who us 3 are, being afraid to look uncool.

Honestly, I'm very impressed by your hammer rev's positioning and movement in the video.A usual criticism I've heard from other revs on using a hammer for roaming is that it lacks the defensive tools compared to alternative weapon choices.But your positioning and movements were top class, making up for whatever deficiency a hammer rev is supposed to have.Your playstyle reminds me of a soulbeast friend of mine who pressures with high damage from range, and kites superbly when focused.I've also seen roaming streamers fight and they usually ignore hammer revs in a group fight because hammer revs are supposedly 'zerg' builds run by zerglings and not a threat.But the amazing thing is it was usually the hammer revs who did the killing blow on these streamers lol...Was a very interesting watch!

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There is a network of roamers spread out over many servers. Many of us have been in the same guilds and roamed side by side off and on over many years. We move around to different servers but kept each other on our friends list. As far as "avoiding" one another in a 1v1, sometimes it is out of mutual respect when we see one another out in the field, and other times it a situation when your like "oh, forget that guy, don't got time for that". Lol

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I think I went through a similar phase of avoiding fights recently XD

I was looking to fight classes that hard counters necros, specifically soulbeasts, for a video collection and ignored anyone that wasn't one.

I've made the soulbeast video collection now so if you meet me out there, I'm currently looking for deadeyes, another spec that hard counters a necro.

Killing me is not hard, but be warned that if you die even once, you're entering my collection =)

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I don't feel like I am fighting individuals; I am fighting builds. The reason I got into roaming was the unpredictability of what you faced. Core classes had build options under the old skill system. Now I just see an elite and I can guess with considerable accuracy what they run and how the fight will turn out. It doesn't matter if I know for a fact that I will stomp them; if the fight will be a boring one, and I already know it, I might as well move on. I don't have anything to prove. Skill? The expansions removed the need for it.

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As someone who plays hybrid mirage I acknowledge opponents who simply do not enjoy or want to engage in a fight with a mirage so don't often tend to make the first move when running by myself (unless going for an objective). If they aren't interested in a fight I'll let it be and move on, if they attack then I'll give a fight.

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Unless it's dueling spot or a very good friend from another server (and I have none) I will not let any bastard pass by me. Doesn't matter bunker or not, I'll chase them across the map if I have to. Especially if they are mirages or Shortbow 5 heroes because fuck your OCC cheese that's why.

@"EremiteAngel.9765" said:Actually now that I think about it, it reminds me of the same pattern for skilled guilds.They bandwagon and crush pug zergs.Like...what is so fun about steamrolling others?Guilds should also really stop bandwagoning and instead spread out and challenge each other instead.Sounds good, DOES NOT WORK. The only roaming guild I had started picking up fights with "skilled" guys, got ultimately demoralized when they encountered some strong bunch and disbanded to merge with some GvG guild. So yeah, ultimately some roaming guilds are about easy fights. Whether it's stomping some other roamers in 7vs2 or farming 11111 bots in 7vs15. Either way it's deluding yet easy and satisfying

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