Horse Mounts Discussion!

[Batel.9206]

@"Danikat.8537" said:Adding to the horse references already mentioned there was a section in Edge of Destiny where some of the characters go through an asura gate and know they've ended up a very long way from home when they see horses in the distance. They were able to recognise them, so clearly knew what they were, but were very surprised to see them.

They weren't surprised, actually. The narration reveals nothing about the characters' thoughts - [shakes fist at bad writing] - but if anything, they may have been confused because the asura gate they were looking into kept glitching out and showing images of different random landscapes. One of those landscapes was "a grassy plain where wild horses ran." The characters hadn't gone through the gate yet (and in fact had to wait for the gate to flash to a location that was somewhat recognizable and not dangerous before they could jump through). we'll just ignore the fact that asura gates don't work that way, because this book doesn't play nicely with lore...at all... So, if they weren't at all surprised at seeing horses, the logical thing to assume would be that horses are a normal, ordinary part of Tyria...that we've never seen.Ahem, rambling over now.

Horse mounts would be lovely, even if norn and charr would look ridiculous riding them. :D

[Donari.5237]

@Aplethoraof.2643 said:

@Donari.5237 said:

@Aplethoraof.2643 said:TBF, horses could have existed from wherever humans came from (as they are not native to Tyria and were brought here by their Gods). The ornaments and such would have simply been a takeaway from wherever they came from originally.

Wellllll ... how many ancient Sumerian motifs do we have in our everyday Terran culture? Humans came to Tyria a

very

long time ago. I think there must have been/still be horses in modern Tyria for them to be something influencing figures of speech and festival entertainments.

Horses might have been very influential to human culture (which would make sense, beasts of burden are a reason humans are able to thrive generally). It all depends on what the history of humans was before they came to Tyria.

Plenty of ancient motifs are still around IRL. The Double-Headed Eagle, which is well-known in Russia and Scotland (and likely other countries) originates from ancient Mesopotamia and could be even older than that. The ouroboros has been used in many civilisations and is still recognized today, I believe early accounts of it stretch back to 13th century BC Egypt. The mistletoe originates from ancient norse and celtic mythology and is well-known today. The ankh, another well-known and popular symbol originates from 3000 BC. And those are only a few examples off the top of my head, I'm sure there are plenty more. Ancient motifs tend to stick around through the ages (other cultures tend to adopt them as well, and carry them forward into the next generations).

A very fair point. Motifs do stick around. But hmm. Do they stick around as catch phrases? Like the DR NPC talking about wild horses can't drag her somewhere.

Regardless, you are right, some imagery does persist through the ages, albeit with changed connotations and applications. We still reference dodos (though those lived a lot more recently in our history than the gap in time between humans arriving in Tyria and now). So horses could have mattered enough to have vestigial commentary even now. Still I lean to them being around (see: Destiny's Edge). And there was just an artistic decision not to render horses. Maybe for aesthetic reasons, animating them would be hard? But see centaurs. And see: cats. Bizarre angular bolsters, most Tyrian felines are ... so not doing the animal justice doesn't prevent putting them in the game. (Canines, awesomely done here. Felines, just that one in the Captain's office in Amnoon. But I digress). Here's hoping that one day ANet either definitively states equines are extinct or puts them in the game. Maybe in Cantha?

[Tiviana.2650]

I want a Dolyak mount. It could be like a bulldozer and just bodytoss anything that gets in its way lol. But im happy with the upcoming cat mount.

[Omega.6801]

@Drecien.4508 said:No. Dead horse. Horses do not exist in tyria.

Basically this^^ But I'm sure this simple explanation can be found in the other thread as well.

[derd.6413]

we know horses exsist because of engi pistols

[Algreg.3629]

sure, get your horse. You will be the scooter dude in the motorcycle gang of fantastical beasts.

[Tommo Chocolate.5870]

Personally I wouldn't really be interested in a horse mount, although I might be interested in a fantastical horse-like creature as a few people have suggested. I like the fact that GW2 mounts aren't real-world animals, and there are other imaginary creatures I'd be more interested in seeing as mounts (e.g. kirin, cobalt mokele).

@Aplethoraof.2643 said:

@Donari.5237 said:

@Aplethoraof.2643 said:TBF, horses could have existed from wherever humans came from (as they are not native to Tyria and were brought here by their Gods). The ornaments and such would have simply been a takeaway from wherever they came from originally.

Wellllll ... how many ancient Sumerian motifs do we have in our everyday Terran culture? Humans came to Tyria a

very

long time ago. I think there must have been/still be horses in modern Tyria for them to be something influencing figures of speech and festival entertainments.

Horses might have been very influential to human culture (which would make sense, beasts of burden are a reason humans are able to thrive generally). It all depends on what the history of humans was before they came to Tyria.

Plenty of ancient motifs are still around IRL. The Double-Headed Eagle, which is well-known in Russia and Scotland (and likely other countries) originates from ancient Mesopotamia and could be even older than that. The ouroboros has been used in many civilisations and is still recognized today, I believe early accounts of it stretch back to 13th century BC Egypt. The mistletoe originates from ancient norse and celtic mythology and is well-known today. The ankh, another well-known and popular symbol originates from 3000 BC. And those are only a few examples off the top of my head, I'm sure there are plenty more. Ancient motifs tend to stick around through the ages (other cultures tend to adopt them as well, and carry them forward into the next generations).

The earliest known image of a gryphon is from the 4th millennium BC. I gather that images of gryphons are still around nowadays, and they occasionally even feature in fantasy computer games.

@Donari.5237 said:A very fair point. Motifs do stick around. But hmm. Do they stick around as catch phrases? Like the DR NPC talking about wild horses can't drag her somewhere.

This is a great question. The only examples I can think of are "dead as the dodo" (which you've sort of mentioned already), and use of the word 'dinosaur' to mean "someone or something that has not adapted to changing circumstances". Both of these refer to the fact that the creatures in question are extinct, rather than any features of live dodos or dinosaurs. It seems extremely unlikely that, say, an ogre would know what breaking a bad tempered horse is like if they were long extinct.

(Of course, dinosaurs aren't extinct precisely because they did adapt to changing circumstances, but there we go...)

[Aplethoraof.2643]

@Donari.5237 said:Here's hoping that one day ANet either definitively states equines are extinct or puts them in the game. Maybe in Cantha?

Maybe next xpac we'll go into space and find the astroequines.

[sorudo.9054]

they are/were in tyria tho, if there were no horses we would also not have a skeleton riding a horse in northern kryta.wether they live now or not is simply a question to ponder about, they don't really need to be alive where we are, they could still be thriving somewhere else.

[Doggie.3184]

Not much of a fan of horses. Maybe if they were Centaurs.

[Vancho.8750]

Maybe the horses were a Ascalon/Orr thing and with all the Moas around there is chance that they ride them.Also before there is horse there should be this majestic creature https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/835131#Comment_835131 .

[Aediph.2873]

@"DietPepsi.4371" said:I'd be happy with a sand-horse skin for the jackal personally. Riding a giant doggo is weird to me.

Edit: but not as weird as riding a giant floating stingray.

Found this elemental horse picture in my google search.

Looks a bit grotesque, but I love the idea of a sand elemental horse : )Gonna update this post with something closer to what I'm thinking of for that horse typeEdit: Found this nicely modeled unicorn mount in one of the final fantasy games:

and below, several different elemental horses (Earth is the closest I could get so far to a Sand Elemental Horse in my mind)

Tempted to make this thing into a wallpaper : X

@Tiviana.2650 said:I want a Dolyak mount. It could be like a bulldozer and just bodytoss anything that gets in its way lol. But im happy with the upcoming cat mount.Although it's not a horse, the thought of bulldozing through a WvW zerg on a Dolyak, flinging people out of the way makes me laugh!

[Danikat.8537]

@Aediph.2873 said:

@Tiviana.2650 said:I want a Dolyak mount. It could be like a bulldozer and just bodytoss anything that gets in its way lol. But im happy with the upcoming cat mount.Although it's not a horse, the thought of bulldozing through a WvW zerg on a Dolyak, flinging people out of the way makes me laugh!

Why not both? I love the idea of a dolyak mount too. It could be slower than the other mounts, but harder to knock you off, and just ram through enemies.

[Aediph.2873]

@Danikat.8537 said:

@Aediph.2873 said:

@Tiviana.2650 said:I want a Dolyak mount. It could be like a bulldozer and just bodytoss anything that gets in its way lol. But im happy with the upcoming cat mount.Although it's not a horse, the thought of bulldozing through a WvW zerg on a Dolyak, flinging people out of the way makes me laugh!

Why not both? I love the idea of a dolyak mount too. It could be slower than the other mounts, but harder to knock you off, and just ram through enemies.

Makes me think of Ganondorf's giant horse offspring in Zelda: Breath of the Wild. That thing is HUGE, but it's powerful and can knock stuff out of the way :P

[Tiviana.2650]

Silly thought but with all the centaurs running around, you would think horses would show up. Oh well toss me a saddle on a centaur, good enough!

[Zalani.9827]

The only way you can get a horse is if you can capture Mr. Gum Drops from the Mad King.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mr._Gum_Drops

[Ashen.2907]

Quoting JP is a solid way to lose any support I might have otherwise had for an idea.

[Kossage.9072]

Horses have existed in the world of Tyria in the past; it's unknown if they came with gods, Forgotten and humans from the Mists or were native to the world. In fact, in the treasure trove of Canthan lore called An Empire Divided, which is still one of the most comprehensive lore documents ever created for either GW game, it has historically been documented that a horse caused the death of the first Canthan Emperor Kaineng Tah (albeit there was some foul play going on behind the scenes if we look at the details of the chronicled accident more closely):

His death came from an unlikely event: while on an extended hunting expedition, his favorite horse improbably threw Kaineng Tah. It is doubtful that the faithful, well-trained beast would have done this out of belligerence, though Canthan history does classify the death as completely accidental. It seems more likely that one or more of the emperor's fellow huntsmen spooked the horse. Fragmentary records of an unexplained wound on the horse's rump and three more such wounds on Kaineng Tah himself would appear to support this interpretation.

Cantha referenced horses as recently as Factions Cantha in 1072 AE, when Zumo the Beggar claimed to have been riding a horse. So at the very least knowledge of these beasts survived throughout the centuries. :)

Horses have also become known in Elona, Orr, Ascalon and Kryta, and Palawa Joko deridingly called centaurs such as Zhed Shadowhoof plough horses. Knowledge of them has even spread to other races such as the pet master ogres who equate taming rock dogs with bad-tempered horses:

Nojara: Proper taming can take months, even years, but we don't have time for that. We have to break them like you'd break a bad-tempered horse, and quickly. Overpower them.

As recently as 1325 AE, we've seen equine hoofprints around the stables of the Hunting Lodge in Queensdale, and even got to hear this lovely exchange as part of the ambient dialogue in the Shire of Beetletun which shows that children are well aware of what at least ponies look like, so much so that they ask for one as a present:

Victoria: Centaurs ruined my party. I hate them so much.
Spencer: But didn't you ask for a pony?
Victoria: Ponies are cute. Centaurs are ugly and mean.

Given Caithe, Logan and Rytlock's revelation via the asura gate in Edge of Destiny (Caithe's lovely singing in that scene notwithstanding), and horses not being seen anywhere in Tyria or Elona as of this writing, it's unclear if horses still exist in Central Tyria and Elona (let alone Cantha) or not. However, given how there's also a distinct lack of e.g. corrupted skritt models in the Elder Dragons' armies (when we know that skritt and other races without corrupted models can definitely be corrupted by Elder Dragons; there's even concept art of a Branded bear, and for some unfortunate reason we haven't gotten a Branded bear in game yet), this may simply be a lack of assets being used rather than horses no longer existing in present day Central Tyria etc. lorewise. As recently as around Living World Season 2, ANet artist Ruan Jia even made concept art of a human cavalry charge set somewhere in Tyria, so the idea has been in the devs' minds too to some extent since launch, it seems.

When it comes to the future of horses in Tyria, I could see a few alternatives beyond ANet just choosing not to show them or even tease them in any way:

1) Horse mount skin for raptor or warclaw. They'd have to tweak some of the animations on at least the former a bit (like they did for e.g. the gecko skin for springer) but otherwise I could see either one of these mounts having such a unique custom skin which they can monetize on the gemstore. This would also allow the devs to eventually include a custom kirin skin from Cantha depending on a few factors: namely, would they be ok adding a wise, speaking being as a mere mount (as kirin were more like protectors of areas and we could speak with them at length) and if the shrine guardian is also a being capable of speech (I'm still hoping for more lore on it and several other mounts).

2) We actually meet and get to interact with horses in a future living world map if we ever explore the mysterious grassy plain which Caithe, Logan and Rytlock saw via the asura gate. There's already the lasso mechanic in game as seen with some of the hydra events (as recently as the ancient hydra chase in Thunderhead Peaks) so we could easily have a dynamic event or even a heart where we find stray horses, lasso them and return them to the pen, or we even get to temporarily ride a horse in such circumstances. The living world map could also be used by devs to tease the reason why we haven't seen horses in game before that moment and perhaps hint at more lore surrounding these equines. :)

[Aediph.2873]

@"Kossage.9072" said:Horses have existed in the world of Tyria in the past; it's unknown if they came with gods, Forgotten and humans from the Mists or were native to the world. In fact, in the treasure trove of Canthan lore called An Empire Divided, which is still one of the most comprehensive lore documents ever created for either GW game, it has historically been documented that a horse caused the death of the first Canthan Emperor Kaineng Tah (albeit there was some foul play going on behind the scenes if we look at the details of the chronicled accident more closely):

His death came from an unlikely event: while on an extended hunting expedition, his favorite horse improbably threw Kaineng Tah. It is doubtful that the faithful, well-trained beast would have done this out of belligerence, though Canthan history does classify the death as completely accidental. It seems more likely that one or more of the emperor's fellow huntsmen spooked the horse. Fragmentary records of an unexplained wound on the horse's rump and three more such wounds on Kaineng Tah himself would appear to support this interpretation.

Cantha referenced horses as recently as Factions Cantha in 1072 AE, when

Zumo the Beggar

claimed to have been riding a horse. So at the very least knowledge of these beasts survived throughout the centuries. :)

Horses have also become known in Elona, Orr, Ascalon and Kryta, and Palawa Joko deridingly called centaurs such as Zhed Shadowhoof plough horses. Knowledge of them has even spread to other races such as the pet master ogres who equate taming rock dogs with bad-tempered horses:

Nojara:

Proper taming can take months, even years, but we don't have time for that. We have to break them like you'd break a bad-tempered horse, and quickly. Overpower them.

As recently as 1325 AE, we've seen equine hoofprints around the stables of the Hunting Lodge in Queensdale, and even got to hear this lovely exchange as part of the

ambient dialogue in the Shire of Beetletun

which shows that children are well aware of what at least ponies look like, so much so that they ask for one as a present:

Victoria:

Centaurs ruined my party. I hate them so much.

Spencer:

But didn't you ask for a pony?

Victoria:

Ponies are cute. Centaurs are ugly and mean.

Given Caithe, Logan and Rytlock's revelation via the asura gate in Edge of Destiny (Caithe's lovely singing in that scene notwithstanding), and horses not being seen anywhere in Tyria or Elona as of this writing, it's unclear if horses still exist in Central Tyria and Elona (let alone Cantha) or not. However, given how there's also a distinct lack of e.g. corrupted skritt models in the Elder Dragons' armies (when we know that skritt and other races without corrupted models can definitely be corrupted by Elder Dragons; there's even concept art of a

Branded bear

, and for some unfortunate reason we haven't gotten a Branded bear in game yet), this may simply be a lack of assets being used rather than horses no longer existing in present day Central Tyria etc. lorewise. As recently as around Living World Season 2, ANet artist Ruan Jia even made

concept art of a human cavalry charge

set somewhere in Tyria, so the idea has been in the devs' minds too to some extent since launch, it seems.

When it comes to the future of horses in Tyria, I could see a few alternatives beyond ANet just choosing not to show them or even tease them in any way:

1) Horse mount skin for raptor or warclaw. They'd have to tweak some of the animations on at least the former a bit (like they did for e.g. the gecko skin for springer) but otherwise I could see either one of these mounts having such a unique custom skin which they can monetize on the gemstore. This would also allow the devs to eventually include a custom kirin skin from Cantha depending on a few factors: namely, would they be ok adding a wise, speaking being as a mere mount (as kirin were more like protectors of areas and we could speak with them at length) and if the shrine guardian is also a being capable of speech (I'm still hoping for more lore on it and several other mounts).

2) We actually meet and get to interact with horses in a future living world map if we ever explore the mysterious grassy plain which Caithe, Logan and Rytlock saw via the asura gate. There's already the lasso mechanic in game as seen with some of the hydra events (as recently as the ancient hydra chase in Thunderhead Peaks) so we could easily have a dynamic event or even a heart where we find stray horses, lasso them and return them to the pen, or we even get to temporarily ride a horse in such circumstances. The living world map could also be used by devs to tease the reason why we haven't seen horses in game before that moment and perhaps hint at more lore surrounding these equines. :)

I hadn't paid attention to the ground around the hunting lodge in Queensdale, sure enough there were hoofprints around the stables. Pretty neat little detail : )Love the artwork in this game, gotta give kudos to the artists for the art style! Makes me wonder what a branded horse would look like. Currently googling for any kind of concept art, official or unofficial just to sate my curiosity :X

[starhunter.6015]

Horses exist, a little research shows this... https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Horse

[Kenrik Starling.3659]

Honestly, I think I'd rather have a centaur playable race. Skip horses all together! How cool would that be?! I mean, the only game out there right now thinking about a centaur as a playable race is Crowfall and that's a whole other bag of worms that we need not discuss here. Yes. I'm sticking with my decision. Skip the horse mount. Give us a horse-like playable race! See what I did there?!

[Aediph.2873]

@Jak.8627 said:Honestly, I think I'd rather have a centaur playable race. Skip horses all together! How cool would that be?! I mean, the only game out there right now thinking about a centaur as a playable race is Crowfall and that's a whole other bag of worms that we need not discuss here. Yes. I'm sticking with my decision. Skip the horse mount. Give us a horse-like playable race! See what I did there?!

Not sure exactly how much work would go into implementing playable Centaurs or a horse skin/new mount, but we at least have the lore and doodads to populate the world with their existance to some degree. I feel like people can go back and forth on whether or not any of this should be added. The goal of this thread however was just the discussion of horses as mounts. I never could find any concept art of a branded horse, I'll have to leave it up to my imagination :X

[Furious.1205]

Ohh please!! Stop trying to intellectualize it! Arenanet listen to your audience & make a horse mount skin for goodness sakes. If you guys don't like it don't buy the skin (Sigh). You have made all else including an illogical roller beetle mount with a hovering saddle (Seems like the beetle part is kind of redundant) and yet after all this time someone is still a bit stuffy/ nerdy over introducing a horse into Tyria? Okay gimme me a centaur mount to ride then, GIVE ME anything close to a graceful majestic horse if not the horse itself...

[Balsa.3951]

@Boysenberry.1869 said:I'm sure there have probably been several horse threads by now. Personally, I don't see how a horse mount fits into the game at all given the distinct lack of horses in Tyria. Each mount does something unique and anything that a horse can do we can already do in game. A horse skin of something, sure, but there's no need for a separate mount.

there was a lack of skimmers in game before as wll... i also never saw a skyscale, a warbeast or a springer

[Balsa.3951]

the Dreamer shoots unicorns so Horses are something Tyria know.

I can only imagine anet dont want them bcs they are to hard to animate ... or they are to common in other games and anet want be different