Mesmer Patch-Preview — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Mesmer Patch-Preview

Xstein.2187Xstein.2187 Member ✭✭✭
edited February 28, 2019 in Mesmer

Mesmer

After watching mesmer builds develop following our last update, we have a few more adjustments for both chronomancers and mirages.
While we think that Signet of Inspiration's new functionality is working well, it's a little too strong, so we're slightly reducing both the recharge time and the extension of the boon duration. This still leaves it a little on the strong side, but we don't want to remove it entirely. Similarly, the Danger Time trait ended up being too strong; we've been seeing some very high damage numbers coming out of chronomancers who are also bringing support skills.

Lowering the defiance-bar damage on Signet of Humility made it fairer when compared to other defiance-breaking skills, but left it in an unsatisfying place due to its high recharge time. We're lowering the recharge time in PvE areas to allow it to be used more frequently in situations where additional defiance damage is needed.

Finally, we're slightly reducing the duration of the Mirage Cloak dodge in order to make it more like the normal dodge move. When we first built the mirage specialization, we felt that the dodge window had to be larger than a normal dodge in order to compensate for the fact that the player doesn't move with the dodge. As players have become more accustomed to the specialization, we've found that this advantage is no longer necessary. Coupled with the superspeed that's granted by the other minor trait, mirages can travel significantly farther than a normal dodge while attacking. This change does not affect the window for an ambush attack, which has always been on a separate timer.

• Exhaustion: This boon now stacks in duration up to 3 times.
• Confusion: This no longer deals damage when a skill is prevented from activating due to an invalid position of the target relative to the caster.

• Tides of Time: This skill's collision logic has been updated to reduce instances where the projectile could be unexpectedly destroyed. The returning wave now returns toward the current location of the mesmer rather than trying to predict the mesmer's future location based on movement speed and direction. This skill now applies quickness while traveling outward and alacrity while returning.
• Well of Recall: Reduced the recharge time of this skill from 30 seconds to 25 seconds.
• Signet of Humility: Reduced the recharge time of this skill from 180 seconds to 120 seconds in PvE only.
• Signet of the Ether: This skill's recharge time now begins at the same time as phantasm skills are recharged.
• Mirage Cloak: All applications of this skill's effect have had their duration reduced to match the duration of a normal dodge roll. This change does not affect the timing window for ambush skills.
• Speed of Sand: Superspeed's duration has been reduced to match Mirage Cloak's duration.
• Imaginary Axes: Reduced the amount of torment stacks applied in PvP and WvW from 3 to 1. This skill can no longer be used on targets behind the mesmer.
• Ambush Assault: This skill can no longer be used on targets behind the mesmer.
• Split Surge: This skill can no longer be used on targets behind the mesmer.
• Signet of Inspiration: Lowered the extended durations of boons that this skill grants from 5 seconds to 3 seconds. Lowered the recharge time from 30 seconds to 20 seconds.
• Axes of Symmetry: Reduced this skill's damage in WvW to match the PvP version of this skill. The number of confusion stacks that this applies is now 3 in all game modes.
• Illusionary Ambush: Increased the recharge time of this skill from 20 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW only.
• Mimic: Reduced the recharge time of this skill from 40 seconds to 30 seconds.
• Cry of Pain: The number of confusion stacks that this trait allows Cry of Frustration to apply has been decreased from 2 to 1 in all game modes.
• Ineptitude: The confusion duration of this trait has been reduced from 3 seconds to 2 seconds in PvP and WvW.
• Danger Time: The bonus critical-hit chance that this trait grants against slowed enemies has been reduced from 30% to 15%.

<13

Comments

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    Good luck getting out of aoe's now...

    Oh and they changed MC but not the ambush cast times, beautiful...

    I understood the nerf to power block because danger time was buffed and used together it would be over the top, but now since they already nerfed what they wanted, they decided to nerf danger time too.

    The degenerate

  • Curunen.8729Curunen.8729 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    One other thing - going by the previous balance patch statement of "wanting mirage to be able to have the ability to sustain in longer engagements" - funnily these changes are going to push me even more into the high burst fast ttk gameplay... Because it will be kill fast or die, and we still are going to have the ability to unload absurd direct/condi burst on opponents. More IH condi bombs incoming... xD

    Would be funny if it wasn't also so disappointing.

    My ears, how are you! | Kourna Jackrabbit for default Springer

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    I’m kind of glad I shelved my Mesmer in pve and pvp. Mirage definitely needed shaving on its condi output which they did. I don’t agree with their MC change though and not changing EM. Especially seeing how it can stack 3 times. So do they really think 12 seconds (realistically 12s with 100% Endurance) of Exhaustion is good?

    Edit: Grammar/clarification. Typing from phone.

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    i like the mirage nerfs. long awaited
    but im not sure how is chrono meant to share alacrity by soi in 1 clone cs. chrono changes seems strange

    make prepardness baseline plz

  • Curunen.8729Curunen.8729 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @phokus.8934 said:
    I’m kind of glad I shelved my Mesmer in pve and pvp. Mirage definitely needed shaving on its condi output which they did. I don’t agree with their MC change though and not changing EM. Especially seeing how it can stack 3 times. So so they really think 12 seconds of Exhaustion is good?

    6s currently on EM, so if that stacked 3 times from simply dodging during a daze then it's beyond ridiculous.

    My ears, how are you! | Kourna Jackrabbit for default Springer

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    @phokus.8934 said:
    I’m kind of glad I shelved my Mesmer in pve and pvp. Mirage definitely needed shaving on its condi output which they did. I don’t agree with their MC change though and not changing EM. Especially seeing how it can stack 3 times. So so they really think 12 seconds of Exhaustion is good?

    EM was already trash anyway. I think the change was to target unhindered combatant, if you remove chill cripple and immobilize you'll get 9 sec of exhaustion lmfao.

    Would like to hear fatsomething (the thief) opinion on it, since he thought EM was good even with 6sec exhaustion.

    The degenerate

  • @Xstein.2187 said:
    Mirage
    Overall I like the mirage changes.
    My only exceptions are:
    1. If mirage cloak time is reduced, mirages should be able to back up at the pace of a normal dodge roll as well. Right now mirage is screwed if it needs to move backwards, particularly in PvE where there is a lot of AoE. This is also not fair relative to other classes.
    2. I would highly prefer to have EM changed in some shape or form to remove the exhaustion, even if it involves the removal of stun brakes. However, I believe the condi cleanse is an important aspect to keep.

    Chrono
    1. I love that they split some quickness with alacrity in Tides of Time.
    2. I understand reducing the value of SoI relative to the wells. However, chronos need some major radius changes. It is not a reliable exception for all allies to stand in a 240 radius. This is something community members have stated way before this patch notice. This is the most disappointing aspect with chrono and mesmer at this moment for me and it is devastating that the devs increased the radius of some other skills but didn't touch the functionality or radius of the wells. Based on the patch, the devs must obviously think they are fine the way they are.

    chrono impact forever dictated by the skill of others instead of yourself, RIP!
    Who would want to play a game like that or consider it fun?

    The thing is expected this to happen after they saw how you can abuse SoI they reduced the boon extension even the number is exactly as a I predicted.
    I also said what will happen as an result players are forced to play an even tighter meta in PvE. I don't know how those changes effect the DPS chrono if the class is till viable it is a good chance we need another in the group meta if not things get really messy and we falling back more and more to the wvw meta

  • EpicTurtle.8571EpicTurtle.8571 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 1, 2019

    Well color me surprised, they actually hit things that needed to be hit. Not sure I agree with the MC nerf without any adjustments to other skills though, especially Ether Barrage and Chaos Vortex. Also not sure the Cry of Pain nerf was needed in PvE.

  • kasoki.5180kasoki.5180 Member ✭✭✭

    @Safandula.8723 said:
    i like the mirage nerfs. long awaited
    but im not sure how is chrono meant to share alacrity by soi in 1 clone cs. chrono changes seems strange

    I assume casting SoI in CS is now gonna effect quickness generated by ToT. But if you take two wells and mimic instead of SoI you can actually triple cast wells. I'm gonna test it out but its possible that SoI actually falls out of kit for fractals

  • Solori.6025Solori.6025 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Curunen.8729 said:
    One other thing - going by the previous balance patch statement of "wanting mirage to be able to have the ability to sustain in longer engagements" - funnily these changes are going to push me even more into the high burst fast ttk gameplay... Because it will be kill fast or die, and we still are going to have the ability to unload absurd direct/condi burst on opponents. More IH condi bombs incoming... xD

    Would be funny if it wasn't also so disappointing.

    Yea, it's gonna be funny to see the "Mesmer has too much evasion" crowd complain about something else they dont like, since condi burst still wasn't really addressed.
    Owell.
    Glad I switched to something else. It's looking real good for holo and ranger right now.

    Tingle my stingleberry

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Daishi.6027 said:
    Biggest disappointment for me is 35 on Illusionary Ambush, like lol okay. Just drop 15 seconds on it I guess, were people having that much trouble finding the real one? I guess they didn't like people taking that instead of portal.

    The stupidest thing is that overall and compared to a targeted blink or the "high" 25s cd skills, its randomness was weighed up by its low cd. You could end up anywhere, teleporting into walls instead of on top or end up facing the wrong direction or inside zergs, but it was worth the chance. At 35s cd, its feels pointless to consider taking.

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • RIP! Which braindead class do I switch to now? Boonbeast looks good.

  • Dadnir.5038Dadnir.5038 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Existencial question: If exhaustion is a boon does this mean that signet of inspiration will increase it's duration? Does this mean that concentration will increase it as well??!!!
    Ah... Philosophy, philosophy...

  • Curunen.8729Curunen.8729 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @Daishi.6027 said:
    Biggest disappointment for me is 35 on Illusionary Ambush, like lol okay. Just drop 15 seconds on it I guess, were people having that much trouble finding the real one? I guess they didn't like people taking that instead of portal.

    The stupidest thing is that overall and compared to a targeted blink or the "high" 25s cd skills, its randomness was weighed up by its low cd. You could end up anywhere, teleporting into walls instead of on top or end up facing the wrong direction or inside zergs, but it was worth the chance. At 35s cd, its feels pointless to consider taking.

    Yeah absolutely - sometimes it doesn't move you much at all which is a problem if using it to avoid a melee cleave. Nevermind that it is also fairly weak without 3 clones out.

    I see IA as the equivalent of Steal, however by itself IA is pretty harmless as an offensive tool (aside from gs ambush which hits immediately) and requires follow up of some other movement and shatter combo to do anything. Defensively it still has a rng chance to kitten up with bad placement.

    Sure I was expecting it to go to 25/30s. But 35s? Lol why when you can take signet of midnight at 30s. And I guess the mc on it is also going to be 0.75s?

    My ears, how are you! | Kourna Jackrabbit for default Springer

  • bennypig.6428bennypig.6428 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    @Curunen.8729 said:
    Why has the superspeed from Speed of Sand also been reduced? Isn't it now likely to be shorter distance than normal dodge (on phone, don't have numbers and can't remember pof beta properly)?

    Why has EM (both of them) not been looked at, especially considering contextual exhaustion duration changes on UC?

    Can we have our vigour and jaunts back with this?

    Axe 2 is going to be indirectly shown up with not being able to cover much of the animation with dodge.

    Overall if MC is going back to 0.75s there needs to be a serious look at the cumulative effect other past nerfs will have given some of them (such as vigour uptime) will no longer have been an issue.

    FYI, forward move distant with superspeed under 0.75s is 300, which is exactly the same as a dodge roll, while strafing moves 270.

    Being able to cover your channel skill with dodge that prevent being interrupted is very powerful. Why do you think that it is normal that it should be able to cover a long channeling skill which would be easily interrupted if it is used by other profession? Waiting for the right moment to use a skill is healthy for the game. Just spamming it without a chance to be interrupted is not. Not to mention that you also gain ambush skill after you cover a skill with dodge.

  • bennypig.6428bennypig.6428 Member ✭✭✭

    @Curunen.8729 said:

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @Daishi.6027 said:
    Biggest disappointment for me is 35 on Illusionary Ambush, like lol okay. Just drop 15 seconds on it I guess, were people having that much trouble finding the real one? I guess they didn't like people taking that instead of portal.

    The stupidest thing is that overall and compared to a targeted blink or the "high" 25s cd skills, its randomness was weighed up by its low cd. You could end up anywhere, teleporting into walls instead of on top or end up facing the wrong direction or inside zergs, but it was worth the chance. At 35s cd, its feels pointless to consider taking.

    Yeah absolutely - sometimes it doesn't move you much at all which is a problem if using it to avoid a melee cleave. Nevermind that it is also fairly weak without 3 clones out.

    I see IA as the equivalent of Steal, however by itself IA is pretty harmless as an offensive tool (aside from gs ambush which hits immediately) and requires follow up of some other movement and shatter combo to do anything. Defensively it still has a rng chance to kitten up with bad placement.

    Sure I was expecting it to go to 25/30s. But 35s? Lol why when you can take signet of midnight at 30s. And I guess the mc on it is also going to be 0.75s?

    IA is not only a blink. It comes with very strong utilities. Evade, break target, and ambush skill gained by the player and clones. You said that it is not so good as a gap closer, but with power build it can be comboed with sword ambush or gs ambush. With condi build you can follow it by axe 3, or scepter 3, or jaunt. How is it useless as a gap closer?
    For example, roll for initiative(meta utility for S/D thief) gives evade, initiative point and stunbreak has a CD of 40s. I guess you condi mirage main have to actually learn to see enemy animation to dodge, decide what to dodge, time your skill, but not just rotate your CD. Just like me as a thief main, if i miss one steal to mirage in duel on a point, i lose. Do you condi mirage have the same problem? Now i would say it condi mirage now actually requires more skill to use but still very strong. Spamming skill is not a winning strat now.

  • Curunen.8729Curunen.8729 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @bennypig.6428 said:

    @Curunen.8729 said:
    Why has the superspeed from Speed of Sand also been reduced? Isn't it now likely to be shorter distance than normal dodge (on phone, don't have numbers and can't remember pof beta properly)?

    Why has EM (both of them) not been looked at, especially considering contextual exhaustion duration changes on UC?

    Can we have our vigour and jaunts back with this?

    Axe 2 is going to be indirectly shown up with not being able to cover much of the animation with dodge.

    Overall if MC is going back to 0.75s there needs to be a serious look at the cumulative effect other past nerfs will have given some of them (such as vigour uptime) will no longer have been an issue.

    FYI, forward move distant with superspeed under 0.75s is 300, which is exactly the same as a dodge roll, while strafing moves 270.

    Being able to cover your channel skill with dodge that prevent being interrupted is very powerful. Why do you think that it is normal that it should be able to cover a long channeling skill which would be easily interrupted if it is used by other profession? Waiting for the right moment to use a skill is healthy for the game. Just spamming it without a chance to be interrupted is not.

    Thanks for the numbers for forward dodge. Side is slightly worse then.

    Regarding cover cast - I only talk about axe 2. Nothing else, because no other mesmer skill has the same problem (everything else will be fine as it always was).

    It is the only weapon skill aside from sword and axe auto attack that requires to melee to function (nevermind how mediocre it is aside from axe 3 clone spawn setup). Mesmer is one of the classes that has always been highly disincentivised from auto attacking in melee range - because it can't take much punishment, hence the gameplay of go in for burst and back out again.

    The other melee skill - blurred frenzy - has built in evade for this reason, even though more often it's used defensively.

    Sometimes yes you can axe 2 through someone without taking much damage, but a lot of the time if not using dodge to protect it's a case of eating more damage than dishing out... Kind of double edged sword there.

    I would actually prefer that the evade frame from axe 3 was moved to axe 2 for this reason and now hope to see this happen in a future patch.

    My ears, how are you! | Kourna Jackrabbit for default Springer

  • Simonoly.4352Simonoly.4352 Member ✭✭✭

    Axe and Cry of Pain nerfs are good. Changes to how ambush skills can't be used on targets behind you also good (for the most part).

    I'm unsure about the Mirage Cloak change. Seems to amplify issues with needing to get out of AoE immediately in all game modes. Especially if you need to go backwards. One way to possibly reduce the impact of this though: put that Jaunt charge back!

    The change to exhaustion is going to, of course, make Elusive Mind an even worse trait. The potential to having exhaustion durations of 10 seconds plus seems very very broken. No trait is worth such a massive penalty and, quite frankly, Mesmer doesn't need this trait - just needs to be changed entirely now.

  • Curunen.8729Curunen.8729 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @bennypig.6428 said:

    @Curunen.8729 said:

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @Daishi.6027 said:
    Biggest disappointment for me is 35 on Illusionary Ambush, like lol okay. Just drop 15 seconds on it I guess, were people having that much trouble finding the real one? I guess they didn't like people taking that instead of portal.

    The stupidest thing is that overall and compared to a targeted blink or the "high" 25s cd skills, its randomness was weighed up by its low cd. You could end up anywhere, teleporting into walls instead of on top or end up facing the wrong direction or inside zergs, but it was worth the chance. At 35s cd, its feels pointless to consider taking.

    Yeah absolutely - sometimes it doesn't move you much at all which is a problem if using it to avoid a melee cleave. Nevermind that it is also fairly weak without 3 clones out.

    I see IA as the equivalent of Steal, however by itself IA is pretty harmless as an offensive tool (aside from gs ambush which hits immediately) and requires follow up of some other movement and shatter combo to do anything. Defensively it still has a rng chance to kitten up with bad placement.

    Sure I was expecting it to go to 25/30s. But 35s? Lol why when you can take signet of midnight at 30s. And I guess the mc on it is also going to be 0.75s?

    IA is not only a blink. It comes with very strong utilities. Evade, break target, and ambush skill gained by the player and clones. You said that it is not so good as a gap closer, but with power build it can be comboed with sword ambush or gs ambush. With condi build you can follow it by axe 3, or scepter 3, or jaunt. How is it useless as a gap closer?
    For example, roll for initiative(meta utility for S/D thief) gives evade, initiative point and stunbreak has a CD of 40s. I guess you condi mirage main have to actually learn to see enemy animation to dodge, decide what to dodge, time your skill, but not just rotate your CD. Just like me as a thief main, if i miss one steal to mirage in duel on a point, i lose. Do you condi mirage have the same problem? Now i would say it condi mirage now actually requires more skill to use but still very strong. Spamming skill is not a winning strat now.

    Following IA up with axe 3 is not common unless I want to force a dodge to eat the follow up burst - because it also wastes two important defensive detargets/evades in quick succession, and as only having prestige (which is also unreliable/fails a lot on axe mirage due to additional phantasmal axe from axe trait delayed hit breaking it immediately unless making distance and not attacking with axe for at least a second before using. Nevermind reflect anti synergy with this) this opens a window of vulnerability.

    Jaunt is long in cooldown now so usually better to save what is likely only 1 charge (most of the time) for a juke or something else.

    Aside from that I personally don't have any burst following IA. Staff ambush is a case of walk/dodge away from it. So tbh it can be considered more of a defensive utility, to buy a few seconds with detargrt (rng and clones permitting - as said sometimes you get nothing and immediately pressured again).

    Personally after this change I see it as Blink/SoM just as it used to be years ago with Blink/Decoy.

    For the record I would have been fine with IA at 25 or 30s (it was 30s in pof beta iirc), to be in the ball park of blink, SoM, StG etc. I just think 35 is excessive given its unreliability.

    My ears, how are you! | Kourna Jackrabbit for default Springer

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Power Chrono will probably be the go to spec when the balance update hits. Scepter/Torch/GS, Sword/Torch/GS or even Sword/Focus/GS could be really good variants with Lost Time.

    Maybe some form of Chronobunker as well but we’ll see.

  • I have no experience with Mesmer and little experience in WvW in general, but I was going to start running Mirage condi roamer soon. Do you think the build will now become obsolete, or will replacing Axe with Scepter be enough? Or perhaps the class will have to be built more as a hybrid?

  • Is Mesmer the only class getting 100% nerfs and no buffs in this update? That's fine if the "mesmer too much everything" narrative stops, but something tells me it won't.

    I am a bit concerned about being able to get out of AOEs with the change to MC. I've dealt with some pretty oppressive Scourges lately who seem to be able to blanket huge areas with giant red circles, chain dropping them on me and in my path as I'm trying to run away.

    They really need to give us Jaunt back.

    They also need to just replace EM already.

    Soulbeast is starting to look better and better. At least it gets to be stupidly OP without much of the community complaining about it.

  • Sodeni.6041Sodeni.6041 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    I like the changes overall, they should bring mirage more in line with other specs in PvP and balance things out better.

    However, I would like to see Dune Cloak and Elusive mind (especially with the changedexhaustion mechanic on daredevil) to be looked at. Breaking a one second daze with EM should not give the same amount of exhaustion as breaking out of a 3 second headbutt stun for example.

    I also think reducing the superspeed time on dodge is good. It will now be (again) hard to get out of AoEs as a mirage, same as pre PoF or early PoF days.

  • Sodeni.6041Sodeni.6041 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    Great, first the absolute gutting of jaunt cooldown and now gutting of illusionary ambush, one of the skills that allowed you to actually chase other high mobility roaming classes in WvW.

    I also find the reasoning for the mirage cloak nerf ridiculous. That's almost worse than purity of purpose. Almost.

    I always wanted to have illusionary ambush to be a F5 skill for the mirage so even people without infinite horizon could get all their clones to do an ambush once in a while. It would also fit the mirage theme very well because of the "deception" aspect on the skill and enemy's target breaking.

  • Whatever, mesmers only seem to be seeing nerfs .... random nerfs even, and random un needed buffs like scepter 2. I went through the skills to see something that is interesting instead of illusionary ambush, not much there ><

    Maybe make Mirage advance instant cast and the return is the one that have cast time? just kidding that will also get nerfed.
    And don't you dare to try chrono, they will nerf that too. =p

  • Quadox.7834Quadox.7834 Member ✭✭✭

    @phokus.8934 said:
    Power Chrono will probably be the go to spec when the balance update hits. Scepter/Torch/GS, Sword/Torch/GS or even Sword/Focus/GS could be really good variants with Lost Time.

    Maybe some form of Chronobunker as well but we’ll see.

    In what gamemode do you mean?

    // Yanim

  • Levetty.1279Levetty.1279 Member ✭✭✭

    People complained that Mirage was too strong in PvP so they nerfed its ability to avoid aoe spam in PvE? Makes sense. Once again Mirage has a worse dodge and its elite spec mechanic is a detriment.

    I hope at least Chorno isn't hit too hard by these changes.

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @phokus.8934 said:
    Power Chrono will probably be the go to spec when the balance update hits. Scepter/Torch/GS, Sword/Torch/GS or even Sword/Focus/GS could be really good variants with Lost Time.

    Maybe some form of Chronobunker as well but we’ll see.

    In what gamemode do you mean?

    Pvp and to some extent, wvw.

  • Levetty.1279Levetty.1279 Member ✭✭✭

    And while we are on the topic of Mirage, now that Cry of frustration is nerfed and useless again, can we buff non shatter mirage damage up after it was nerfed for this build. I mean it will still die to any random aoe attack but it would be something.

  • Quadox.7834Quadox.7834 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    @phokus.8934 said:

    @Quadox.7834 said:

    @phokus.8934 said:
    Power Chrono will probably be the go to spec when the balance update hits. Scepter/Torch/GS, Sword/Torch/GS or even Sword/Focus/GS could be really good variants with Lost Time.

    Maybe some form of Chronobunker as well but we’ll see.

    In what gamemode do you mean?

    Pvp and to some extent, wvw.

    Chrono bunker is untouched or buffed in PvP, while power chrono will be nerfed. Not sure why you think power chrono would then be meta after patch in PvP?

    // Yanim

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 28, 2019

    @Turk.5460 said:
    Just make it .75s like every other profession's dodge key. The extra .25s is the biggest problem with Mirage Cloak by far.

    @Safandula.8723 said:
    And BTW mirage cloak last for 1 sec. Bit to much

    Vallun balance suggestion video also focused on mc time.

    And turns out devs check mesmer forums but for the worst reasons:

    @Cardolan.9123 said:

    Mirage Cloak
    Preventing the mirage from using it while CC'd is unlikely, I think some of its coding is related to Distortion which can always be used while CC'd. However it's possible to change its duration since it was buffed from 0.75s to 1s before, and it's also possible to put exhausion on it since they just need to copy the Elusive Mind coding and remove the stunbreak & condi cleanse effect.

    Can't be bothered to look for more, but I remember I and some others answered the why MC was 1sec a kittenton of times.

    The degenerate

  • Turk.5460Turk.5460 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:
    Can't be bothered to look for more, but I remember I and some others answered the why MC was 1sec a kittenton of times.

    Fantastic, that doesn't mean that it truly needed to be 1s. ANET's reasoning for the change were identical to the reasons I gave in that thread in pretty much every way.

    Fort Aspenwood
    Jekkies

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741 said:

    Exhaustion I said was a poor mechanic when it was applied to thief, I stand by that for Elusive Mind and even more so now with it now stacking. I feel so sorry for thieves.

    Don't be, at least for now, it depends on the interpretation.
    My interpretation is that if you remove the 3 MICs you get 9sec exhaustion. But according to thieves the maximum amount is 4 sec, which makes kind of sense because it was suggested on a thief thread that it should depend on the MIC removed, so all in all it's a buff.

    @Turk.5460 said:

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:
    Can't be bothered to look for more, but I remember I and some others answered the why MC was 1sec a kittenton of times.

    Fantastic, that doesn't mean that it truly needed to be 1s. ANET's reasoning for the change were identical to the reasons I gave in that thread in pretty much every way.

    When certain ambushes are more than 1 sec cast time and axe 2 is trash that needs to be covered, 1 sec mc is doomed to fail.
    That's not to mention the distance walked, which is now shorter.

    The degenerate

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    Exhaustion I said was a poor mechanic when it was applied to thief, I stand by that for Elusive Mind and even more so now with it now stacking. I feel so sorry for thieves.

    Don't be, at least for now, it depends on the interpretation.
    My interpretation is that if you remove the 3 MICs you get 9sec exhaustion. But according to thieves the maximum amount is 4 sec, which makes kind of sense because it was suggested on a thief thread that it should depend on the MIC removed, so all in all it's a buff.

    • Unhindered Combatant: The duration of exhaustion that this trait applies when dodging is now 2 seconds if crippled is present, 3 seconds if chilled is present, and 4 seconds if immobilized is present. Exhaustion will now be applied when the dodge is initiated.

    To me it means that given the prevalence of certain conditions it's made UC worse vs necro in general as you're likely to be hit by a 5s exhaustion hit per dodge. To put it bluntly you will have no regen from vigor at all. Ele will shut down your dodge regen with chill because they have double passive frost aura on their support build so that's now 6s exhaustion.

    It's basically increasing the punishment from exhaustion for thieves and mesmers on certain traits and as I said exhaustion in my opinion is a really poor mechanic.

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    Exhaustion I said was a poor mechanic when it was applied to thief, I stand by that for Elusive Mind and even more so now with it now stacking. I feel so sorry for thieves.

    Don't be, at least for now, it depends on the interpretation.
    My interpretation is that if you remove the 3 MICs you get 9sec exhaustion. But according to thieves the maximum amount is 4 sec, which makes kind of sense because it was suggested on a thief thread that it should depend on the MIC removed, so all in all it's a buff.

    • Unhindered Combatant: The duration of exhaustion that this trait applies when dodging is now 2 seconds if crippled is present, 3 seconds if chilled is present, and 4 seconds if immobilized is present. Exhaustion will now be applied when the dodge is initiated.

    To me it means that given the prevalence of certain conditions it's made UC worse vs necro in general as you're likely to be hit by a 5s exhaustion hit per dodge. To put it bluntly you will have no regen from vigor at all. Ele will shut down your dodge regen with chill because they have double passive frost aura on their support build so that's now 6s exhaustion.

    It's basically increasing the punishment from exhaustion for thieves and mesmers on certain traits and as I said exhaustion in my opinion is a really poor mechanic.

    I've the same interpretation as you.

    But according to thieves, if cripple is removed you get 2 seconds of exhaustion, if cripple and chilled are removed or just chilled - you get 3 seconds and if immobilize you get 4 sec independently if other MICs are present. In this view it's a buff because you get lesser overall exhaustion.
    Their interpretation makes sense considering that the change was suggested like that.

    TBH I would prefer my interpretation out of the two, I don't think UC needs a buff. Thief already bypass a ton of mechanics on these game.

    The degenerate

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    Exhaustion I said was a poor mechanic when it was applied to thief, I stand by that for Elusive Mind and even more so now with it now stacking. I feel so sorry for thieves.

    Don't be, at least for now, it depends on the interpretation.
    My interpretation is that if you remove the 3 MICs you get 9sec exhaustion. But according to thieves the maximum amount is 4 sec, which makes kind of sense because it was suggested on a thief thread that it should depend on the MIC removed, so all in all it's a buff.

    • Unhindered Combatant: The duration of exhaustion that this trait applies when dodging is now 2 seconds if crippled is present, 3 seconds if chilled is present, and 4 seconds if immobilized is present. Exhaustion will now be applied when the dodge is initiated.

    To me it means that given the prevalence of certain conditions it's made UC worse vs necro in general as you're likely to be hit by a 5s exhaustion hit per dodge. To put it bluntly you will have no regen from vigor at all. Ele will shut down your dodge regen with chill because they have double passive frost aura on their support build so that's now 6s exhaustion.

    It's basically increasing the punishment from exhaustion for thieves and mesmers on certain traits and as I said exhaustion in my opinion is a really poor mechanic.

    I've the same interpretation as you.

    But according to thieves, if cripple is removed you get 2 seconds of exhaustion, if cripple and chilled are removed or just chilled - you get 3 seconds and if immobilize you get 4 sec independently if other MICs are present. In this view it's a buff because you get lesser overall exhaustion.
    Their interpretation makes sense considering that the change was suggested like that.

    TBH I would prefer my interpretation out of the two, I don't think UC needs a buff. Thief already bypass a ton of mechanics on these game.

    I don't think it will work like that, I think it will essentially apply a stack of exhaustion per condition removed so removing all 3 hits you with 9s. At least it would then be on par with EM :lol:

  • whoknocks.4935whoknocks.4935 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I am a wvw player and multiclasser, let's be honest the changes are good, but not even close to what mirage really needed in terms of nerfs.

    Nobody run axe anymore when roaming, scepter is the way to go, staff too.
    None of those 2 weapons received a single nerf or change.

    IH still untouched, dodge while CC'd still possible, clone spam still possible, perma reflect on evade still possible.
    Mirage cloak and the other things long 0.75secs would have a minimal impact and condi mirage will be still top 1vs1 brainless roamer, same as boonbeast.

    None of the other specs received a buff, so the situation won't change at all and we will still see bad players abusing trailblazer to feel pro.

  • Lincolnbeard.1735Lincolnbeard.1735 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    Exhaustion I said was a poor mechanic when it was applied to thief, I stand by that for Elusive Mind and even more so now with it now stacking. I feel so sorry for thieves.

    Don't be, at least for now, it depends on the interpretation.
    My interpretation is that if you remove the 3 MICs you get 9sec exhaustion. But according to thieves the maximum amount is 4 sec, which makes kind of sense because it was suggested on a thief thread that it should depend on the MIC removed, so all in all it's a buff.

    • Unhindered Combatant: The duration of exhaustion that this trait applies when dodging is now 2 seconds if crippled is present, 3 seconds if chilled is present, and 4 seconds if immobilized is present. Exhaustion will now be applied when the dodge is initiated.

    To me it means that given the prevalence of certain conditions it's made UC worse vs necro in general as you're likely to be hit by a 5s exhaustion hit per dodge. To put it bluntly you will have no regen from vigor at all. Ele will shut down your dodge regen with chill because they have double passive frost aura on their support build so that's now 6s exhaustion.

    It's basically increasing the punishment from exhaustion for thieves and mesmers on certain traits and as I said exhaustion in my opinion is a really poor mechanic.

    I've the same interpretation as you.

    But according to thieves, if cripple is removed you get 2 seconds of exhaustion, if cripple and chilled are removed or just chilled - you get 3 seconds and if immobilize you get 4 sec independently if other MICs are present. In this view it's a buff because you get lesser overall exhaustion.
    Their interpretation makes sense considering that the change was suggested like that.

    TBH I would prefer my interpretation out of the two, I don't think UC needs a buff. Thief already bypass a ton of mechanics on these game.

    I don't think it will work like that, I think it will essentially apply a stack of exhaustion per condition removed so removing all 3 hits you with 9s. At least it would then be on par with EM :lol:

    Fingers crossed.

    If indeed it will work like that, not only I will be relieved, I will also lmao at their suggestion backfiring.

    The degenerate

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @OriOri.8724 said:
    Just shows that the balance team doesn't have a clue with mesmer. Stuff like this is why I no longer have fun playing the class. Instead of addressing any root balance issues, they just continuously nerf over and over, but since those root issues are never addressed, the nerfs are never enough

    Just play engineer!

    You got rifle holo that's still good!
    You got prot holo that's going to beat everything!
    You're going to get scrapper that will allow you to support and do damage!

    Engineer is all you need!

  • Colly.4073Colly.4073 Member ✭✭✭

    @whoknocks.4935 said:
    Nobody run axe anymore when roaming,

    Wrong.

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