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RIP Banner Slaves and warriors in general


Atticus.7194

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I don't get the RIP BS Warrior sentiment here ... I don't actually see much changing, other than you can perma banner a group if you decide to pick up your banners (if I understand correctly). If that's not a valuable option for groups, meta will reflect that. The strange thing here is that no one desires to be a banner slave all the time, so the tone of the thread is ... confusing.

Either you want to be a banner slave 100% of the time or you don't. If you don't, you have to recognize banners need to be changed .

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The only thing I am a bit afraid of is 5 man content (fractals). It is possible that bs warrior might not be the optimal anymore. I wouldn't be sad if we actually had proper bursty power dps build to fill dps spot. But as SPB has average at best burst, other dpses will still be favored. So much for balance.

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Banners had their nerf coming for a VERY long time, come on. Multiple thousands of free stats just for being in an area? Come on. When many other traits and abilities like this got changed Banners were the ones that remained untouched. Now they got their update. It's still going to be useful for the DPS increase alone. Again, free stats are just that good.

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@DanAlcedo.3281 said:A 4 second downtime with alacrity doesn’t sound to bad.

And if i read the new trait effect correctly, everybody gets the double effect.So + 30 stats for everyone and - 55 stats for the warrior.

IF it works like this i would be happy.

If only the warrior gets the double stats, THEN i am not happy.

ONLY the warrior gets double stats, everyone else gets baseline 100

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@Atticus.7194 said:

@DanAlcedo.3281 said:A 4 second downtime with alacrity doesn’t sound to bad.

And if i read the new trait effect correctly, everybody gets the double effect.So + 30 stats for everyone and - 55 stats for the warrior.

IF it works like this i would be happy.

If only the warrior gets the double stats, THEN i am not happy.

ONLY the warrior gets double stats, everyone else gets baseline 100

RIP then indeed.

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The change should make banners a lot less clunky for open-world, at least, as you can now use them without fear that you've wasted the cooldown when you move on. I'm not really sure why you'd want to use them in open-world, though, as they're still static attribute bonuses with no play to them, which just seems hopelessly boring to me.

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@BlackTruth.6813 said:Like c'mon, at least put a cd reduction on banners trait, seriously rampage is already too good to not have. And elite banner would have to be lowered down to 135 second cd to be even worth picking up in sPvP.

Just pick your Banner up before it runs out and you'll get 60 seconds off the cooldown. Will be the new micro management for the class.

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@Blocki.4931 said:

@BlackTruth.6813 said:Like c'mon, at least put a cd reduction on banners trait, seriously rampage is already too good to not have. And elite banner would have to be lowered down to 135 second cd to be even worth picking up in sPvP.

Just pick your Banner up before it runs out and you'll get 60 seconds off the cooldown. Will be the new micro management for the class.

Well I'm talking about sPvP, elite banner does need a cd reduction for that to even compete with rampage. Other banners are like w/e, nothing will change in PvE.

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Winds of Disenchantment: This is now a channeled skill, and it will follow the warrior.

I assume this means on castor.currently I have to pop all my utils to get close enough to fire it off, its then dodge run, weave try to stay alive.on castor means I have to stand there and die?with a big gold bubble saying shoot me nowhmmm

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@Turkeyspit.3965 said:

@"Belorn.2659" said:Lets use some very loose counting and rounding the numbers a bit, and I will also start with MO as it is the closest we have to a golem. The average power dps player has around 23k dps where about 3k came from banners. The average banner slave personal dps is 19k, where 2k came from banners. The total damage banners give is then 5
3 +2 = 17k, giving the banner slave a total dps of 19-2 + 5
3+2 = 34k dps vs the 23 -3 = 20k that an additional dps role would bring to the table. 34 is a bigger number than 20, so a banner slave is better when paired with 5 power dps players. With the nerf we can simply half that banners effect making the warrior doing 19-2 + (5*3 +2)/2 = 25.5. 25.5 is also a bigger number than 20.

Interesting stuff. So what about in a fractal environment? Are BS still worth taking, or would it be better to run DPS warrior with banners?

Fractals parties are already half the size, so it depend even more on composition. Lets make the same calculations for Siax (https://gw2raidar.com/global_stats/area-17028). I will use the average dps of 20k that dh has, mostly because it has the highest reports and seems like a very average of averageness.

The DH then does 17k + 3k from banners, and the bs does 11k + 2k from banners. Assuming you have a comp of 1 druid, 1 chrono , 2 dh and 1 bs you get 11+2+32 = 19 for the bs. With the nerf you get 11 + (2+32)/2 = 15k. 17 > 15, so I would say that in that composition in fractals you should not bring a banner slave. With 4 dps you break even.

But I would be wrong to not point out that my numbers are conservative, rounded to nearest whole number in multiple places, and disregard any benefit to the chrono . A banner slave also do more than just dps like CC, but I think there is a strong case to bring a higher dps class if the build has equal access to many strong CC.

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@Miko.4158 said:Winds of Disenchantment: This is now a channeled skill, and it will follow the warrior.

I assume this means on castor.currently I have to pop all my utils to get close enough to fire it off, its then dodge run, weave try to stay alive.on castor means I have to stand there and die?with a big gold bubble saying shoot me nowhmmm

That would be the case if it didn't destroy all projectiles. Also if you have to use your utility skills to bubble then you're doing something seriously wrong right now. At most it's Balanced Stance you use to not get interrupted.

You are a moving, boon destroying aoe field that blocks projectiles for your own zerg while you move together in a push

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Where are all the warriors? Every patch y'all just accept what happens and wait for the next. This has been happening for soon long, I feel like since they killed zerk warrior in PvP. You want change? Make it known. Create more comments. We have been asking for more damage on GS and change traits, but not to the point where anent recognizes it as an issue.

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@Blocki.4931 said:

@Miko.4158 said:Winds of Disenchantment: This is now a channeled skill, and it will follow the warrior.

I assume this means on castor.currently I have to pop all my utils to get close enough to fire it off, its then dodge run, weave try to stay alive.on castor means I have to stand there and die?with a big gold bubble saying shoot me nowhmmm

That would be the case if it didn't destroy all projectiles. Also if you have to use your utility skills to bubble then you're doing something seriously wrong right now. At most it's Balanced Stance you use to not get interrupted.

You are a moving, boon destroying aoe field that blocks projectiles for your own zerg while you move together in a push

not alot of attacks are projectile . do you even play sb?

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@Miko.4158 said:

@Miko.4158 said:Winds of Disenchantment: This is now a channeled skill, and it will follow the warrior.

I assume this means on castor.currently I have to pop all my utils to get close enough to fire it off, its then dodge run, weave try to stay alive.on castor means I have to stand there and die?with a big gold bubble saying shoot me nowhmmm

That would be the case if it didn't destroy all projectiles. Also if you have to use your utility skills to bubble then you're doing something seriously wrong right now. At most it's Balanced Stance you use to not get interrupted.

You are a moving, boon destroying aoe field that blocks projectiles for your own zerg while you move together in a push

not alot of attacks are projectile . do you even play sb?

Nope. Stopped after the latest nerfs to the bubble, the delay moreso than the duration being cut in half being the reason.

Sure, the AoE fields and Scourge in particular will still be an issue, but let's not pretend there aren't any projectiles.

Didn't people complain about "omg projectile hate" all the time? Why would they do that if there weren't many projectiles that could get blocked in the first place? That's been the bigger part of the bubble for a while now. Nobody loses boons inside of it because all it takes is a second to get out and even if you don't leave it, you're not going to lose all of your boons instantly anyway.

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@Mthe mystery.4615 said:Where are all the warriors? Every patch y'all just accept what happens and wait for the next. This has been happening for soon long, I feel like since they killed zerk warrior in PvP. You want change? Make it known. Create more comments. We have been asking for more damage on GS and change traits, but not to the point where anent recognizes it as an issue.I've gone so far as to ask the Anet employees I see in game. In fact, this guy was PLAYING a berserker. Nothing. They seem to have zero interest in fixing it.

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@Mthe mystery.4615 said:Where are all the warriors? Every patch y'all just accept what happens and wait for the next. This has been happening for soon long, I feel like since they killed zerk warrior in PvP. You want change? Make it known. Create more comments. We have been asking for more damage on GS and change traits, but not to the point where anent recognizes it as an issue.

We're the class that's been asking for a fix to Rush since beta BETA and it's just as bad as it's always been, after a while honestly you get the message.

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