We Now Play In A Game Mode Where You Have To Burn Through 3 Health Bars To Kill Someone - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

We Now Play In A Game Mode Where You Have To Burn Through 3 Health Bars To Kill Someone

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  • Archeia.8905Archeia.8905 Member
    edited March 10, 2019

    @Farout.8207 said:

    @Archeia.8905 said:

    @Farout.8207 said:

    Nobody asked for it and it is killing my preferred game mode.

    Plenty of people asked for it lol. Overall wvw is more active than I've seen it in awhile so idk how the mount is killing the game mode. Does it have issues? sure. They can be fixed tho. QQ'ing about it isn't going to change anything since it's here to stay.

    How much time do you have playing WvW? Not trying to be rude, just trying to get some perspective about the people that are all for it.

    somewhere around 3400 hours. I'm not saying there aren't issues with it (like it shouldn't be immune to CC thats just silly/maybe remove 1 endurance bar so you only have 2 leaps?) but crying without offering opinions on possible nerfs/ways to balance it are rather pointless, like much of the forum is doing at the moment. They wont remove it after all.

    Personally while the mount has issues it's made WvW feel a bit less stale for me and I'm pretty happy that WvW finally has an exclusive and unique reward tied to it, I do think it's a shame the collection was so easy to finish and could have had a bit more of a grind to keep people around a bit longer imo. Although if they intend to add additional mounts in the future to WvW (hopefully more balanced ones) I'd like the collections to require a bit more grind to them.

    Also the big issue with things is player retention. The influx of new players is great but the real question is will they stick around. I've seen/heard from several people that they intend to but the question is will the gain of new players outweigh the loss of veterans that're apparently quitting (personally I dont know any since most of the old WvW'ers already quit lol)

  • Clownmug.8357Clownmug.8357 Member ✭✭✭

    @tobin.6754 said:

    In case you didn't know, people can use them to contest camps while waiting for allies to respawn. It's much more annoying than the wasted time chasing some random person on a mount in the middle of nowhere.

    I don't understand what this gotta do with zerglings getting "ganked" running back to zerg.

    And I don't understand why 10k extra hp matters in a fight that is almost completely pointless.

  • Conqueror.3682Conqueror.3682 Member ✭✭✭

    I want a dismount trap like the ones the forged put in the pof maps

    Fall down seven times, get up eight.

  • tobin.6754tobin.6754 Member ✭✭
    edited March 10, 2019

    @Clownmug.8357 said:

    And I don't understand why 10k extra hp matters in a fight that is almost completely pointless.

    It's more than just 10k hp, but I don't think anything said here will change people's minds.

    Anet might as well make people on mount immune to damage, so they can avoid all fight.

  • Clownmug.8357Clownmug.8357 Member ✭✭✭

    @Duckota.4769 said:

    @Clownmug.8357 said:

    @tobin.6754 said:

    In case you didn't know, people can use them to contest camps while waiting for allies to respawn. It's much more annoying than the wasted time chasing some random person on a mount in the middle of nowhere.

    I don't understand what this gotta do with zerglings getting "ganked" running back to zerg.

    And I don't understand why 10k extra hp matters in a fight that is almost completely pointless.

    Its not just 10k hp. The fact you think that is all it is tells me you shouldn't speak on balance much if that is all you see it as. Its 10k hp with 3 dodges. Non CCable. Requires a ton of burst to dismount. Leaving me with no cooldowns if I even manage to dismount. At which point you can hop off and have all of your cooldowns. Not very engaging.

    Unless the person you want to dismount is capping or defending something , your struggle has as much to do with balance as costume brawl fights.

  • Baldrick.8967Baldrick.8967 Member ✭✭✭

    @tobin.6754 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    That's not really the point. The point is why is it such a huge loss if people like that get away? Wouldn't you rather encounter players who actually want to fight a roamer? I mean, I'm not above killing people just because I see them and they're on the enemy team, but when they can't even put up a fight it's nowhere near as fun as encountering your nemesis on the field - the one who will give you a good fight every time and you never know who will come out on top.

    I guess that's why I have a positive view of the warclaw? It gets me to those fights I want in less time and brings those same enemies to me faster as well. Who cares if helpless players who I will kill in <10 seconds get away more often?

    Maybe those players should learn to fight? How do you get better if you just run away?

    The mount didn't change much for me, roaming has been dead anyway with the "marked" debuff and stale balancing. Now people just avoid fight altogether .

    Maybe they don't have solo roamer builds on? Maybe they have no interest in pointless one v one in the middle of no where when they aren't built for it against someone who clearly is?

    Maybe they know exactly how to fight- and that doesn't include pandering to some solo specc'd 'roamer' who thinks they should stop and fight on a build not meant for it, they'd rather get back to the group where their build functions?

  • Susy.7529Susy.7529 Member ✭✭✭

    Well it could be worse, you could face a necro with 4 health bars :p

  • HazyDaisy.4107HazyDaisy.4107 Member ✭✭✭✭

    So far my record for longest 1vX CHASE ME is from ABL nwc to land just south of bay WG reservoir. I got dismounted somewhere around the moas at east bay wall and probably would've gotten further on foot if the other team hadn't sandwhiched me and my pursuers in from the south. It's OK though because I didn't die alone :).

    Anyway, testing continues!

    [HaHa] Hazardous Hallucination - Sorrows Furnace

  • Jasher.6580Jasher.6580 Member ✭✭

    @Baldrick.8967 said:

    @tobin.6754 said:

    @AliamRationem.5172 said:

    That's not really the point. The point is why is it such a huge loss if people like that get away? Wouldn't you rather encounter players who actually want to fight a roamer? I mean, I'm not above killing people just because I see them and they're on the enemy team, but when they can't even put up a fight it's nowhere near as fun as encountering your nemesis on the field - the one who will give you a good fight every time and you never know who will come out on top.

    I guess that's why I have a positive view of the warclaw? It gets me to those fights I want in less time and brings those same enemies to me faster as well. Who cares if helpless players who I will kill in <10 seconds get away more often?

    Maybe those players should learn to fight? How do you get better if you just run away?

    The mount didn't change much for me, roaming has been dead anyway with the "marked" debuff and stale balancing. Now people just avoid fight altogether .

    Maybe they don't have solo roamer builds on? Maybe they have no interest in pointless one v one in the middle of no where when they aren't built for it against someone who clearly is?

    Maybe they know exactly how to fight- and that doesn't include pandering to some solo specc'd 'roamer' who thinks they should stop and fight on a build not meant for it, they'd rather get back to the group where their build functions?

    I think this guy hit the nail on the head.

  • Kylden Ar.3724Kylden Ar.3724 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Duckota.4769 said:

    @EremiteAngel.9765 said:
    No more Mesmer 1-shot shatter combo from invis for you hehehehe

    Just nvm. You paste the same heheheeheher thing everywhere you go and call all roamers 1 shot builds then go make a thread saying you're a roamer. Just stop.

    His problem was that he wanted to roam cause he has no zerg that wants him, but refused to get off the one class he knows to do it.

    How many times we gotta tell you GRIND IS NOT CONTENT there ANet?

    Leader of Tyrian Adventure Corp [TACO], [RaW][TACO] Alliance, Kaineng.

  • displayname.8315displayname.8315 Member ✭✭✭

    Everyone gets to use the mount.. not just the side that beat you. Sorry your group wasn't as good with your mounts and strategies. Maybe lopsided matches is your real concern.

  • omg necros have FOUR healthbars. Yet they're the squishiest usually the first to die and the best target in fights. What a dumb post.

  • DanAlcedo.3281DanAlcedo.3281 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @EremiteAngel.9765 said:
    No more Mesmer 1-shot shatter combo from invis for you hehehehe

    They can still do it but only kill my Mount.

    Ohhh wait they are now faster then me.....

    RiP

  • L A T I O N.8923L A T I O N.8923 Member ✭✭✭

    @Duckota.4769 said:

    @Clownmug.8357 said:

    @tobin.6754 said:

    In case you didn't know, people can use them to contest camps while waiting for allies to respawn. It's much more annoying than the wasted time chasing some random person on a mount in the middle of nowhere.

    I don't understand what this gotta do with zerglings getting "ganked" running back to zerg.

    And I don't understand why 10k extra hp matters in a fight that is almost completely pointless.

    Its not just 10k hp. The fact you think that is all it is tells me you shouldn't speak on balance much if that is all you see it as. Its 10k hp with 3 dodges. Non CCable. Requires a ton of burst to dismount. Leaving me with no cooldowns if I even manage to dismount. At which point you can hop off and have all of your cooldowns. Not very engaging.

    It's like the spirits of the renegades
    If you Alone IT requires a little focus to kill (except you gotta kill a moveable object and ruin a Burst)
    OR you let 10 minstrel fb's sneeze on IT
    There's a difference
    Yes as skilled guildgroup you can easily kill the nonbuffed mounts trying to engage
    As a roamer there's nothing you can do against IT. Same counts if you running around 4-5

  • Fat Disgrace.4275Fat Disgrace.4275 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Duckota.4769 said:

    @EremiteAngel.9765 said:
    No more Mesmer 1-shot shatter combo from invis for you hehehehe

    Just nvm. You paste the same heheheeheher thing everywhere you go and call all roamers 1 shot builds then go make a thread saying you're a roamer. Just stop.

    This player runs 30k, how can someone get "1shot" with that health in the first place

  • Eramonster.2718Eramonster.2718 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2019

    @Archeia.8905 said:

    @Farout.8207 said:

    Nobody asked for it and it is killing my preferred game mode.

    Plenty of people asked for it lol. Overall wvw is more active than I've seen it in awhile so idk how the mount is killing the game mode. Does it have issues? sure. They can be fixed tho. QQ'ing about it isn't going to change anything since it's here to stay.

    There was plenty of players around for beetle race too.

    Add more game-specific counterplay to mounts. Ballista #3 skill dismounting was a very good choice, but I think we could have more. Perhaps a layable trap or even a new piece of siege (a canon that eats 5 supply from you and fires a net and all it does is dismount players).

    Detection trap and skill for stealth has always been a joke. The last thing we need is to build a trap or siege to stop a mounted player. One of the two scenarios, the mounted player will be long gone by then or already engaged you :lol:. Last but not least, supplies (starter players can't carry alot of supplies.)

  • Tiny Doom.4380Tiny Doom.4380 Member ✭✭✭

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:

    @tobin.6754 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    if people don't wanna fight why bother? theyre probably on a zerg build and not much of a challenge anyways.

    If they don't want to fight, why bother coming to a competitive game mode? Most people that get "ganked" running back to zerg will end up being 1 push anyway.

    they want to fight. in zergs. sort of obvious.

    Also, scouting. I play a zerker staff Ele (Tempest) and have done for six years. I have literally no interest in fighting anyone 1v1. About the only way I'd win would be if my opponent was afk. I'm either backline with a zerg, taking out siege or, often, watching the map and calling out reports. I frequently travel across the map to see what's happening when swords pop or something contests so I can call it in map or team. The Mount is somewhat useful for that now but, due to my pre-existing hatred of mounts due to their extreme nausea-inducing inertia, I'm not using mine if I can possibly avoid it.

    The point is, there are legitimate activities WvW players can be involved in that don't involve fighting other players 1v1. Yes, it's a competetive game mode but it was designed as a competetive Team-based game mode based on taking and holding structures and dominating territory. I realize that died for a lot of people years ago because of a series of poor design decisions by the developers but there are still people who make some attempt to play the game mode the way it was originally intended, increasingly pointless though that seems even to those of us still doing it.

    Also, on the idea that just because the Warclaw is here it will always be here and we should all stop whining about... they said that about all BLs being Desert BL. Not that I think the mount will be removed but it's been proven before that enough people whining loudly enough for long enough can wear away stone.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

    @Duckota.4769 said:

    @EremiteAngel.9765 said:
    No more Mesmer 1-shot shatter combo from invis for you hehehehe

    Just nvm. You paste the same heheheeheher thing everywhere you go and call all roamers 1 shot builds then go make a thread saying you're a roamer. Just stop.

    This player runs 30k, how can someone get "1shot" with that health in the first place

    I’ll take that guess: He’s bad?

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • Spartacus.3192Spartacus.3192 Member ✭✭✭

    yup i agree. i dont even bother fighting someone if he/she is on a mount. Just not worth it and low chance of successs. Same goes both ways. Ive seen a zerg come around a corner. I hop on my mount and because im in my own controlled territory the enemy has ZERO chance of catching me. Previously i would have been dead meat.

    Stupid design.

    Mount needs to be susceptible to CC, plus lower HP. It should purely be for mobility just like in PVE.

  • displayname.8315displayname.8315 Member ✭✭✭

    How many people crying about mount are in the wood league I wonder. Nobody cares about you solos and your precious camp. That's a waste of time and any good group will tell you not to chase squirrels.

    If someone runs from you maybe your just not worth their time. I know that hurts the ego but it's true. Think I'm gunna miss a good fight to get kited by 3 mirage. heh..hehe

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @K THEN.5162 said:
    this mount has completely robbed numerous people of the desire to engage in combat completely.

    Incorrect. The mount has completely robbed players from engaging in one sided combat. If two players want to fight each other, they aren't going to stay mounted for long. The people who aren't engaging in combat on the mount now probably didn't want to before they got the mount, except now they have a choice in the matter, vs. before they were just run down by high mobility Mesmer/Ranger/Holo/Thief, and those health pools you are complaining about, were gone within 1.5 seconds (at least according to combat logs).

    The Warclaw hasn't ruined WvW, it has just shaken up the playstyle a bit, which is a good thing. If that means those who solo roam have to live with only fighting against willing opponents vs. anyone who crosses their path, well sorry for your loss. If playing 1v1 is your thing, you might be better off in Conquest mode, but then again many roamers aren't interested in straight up 1v1, but would rather just ambush other players for easy kills.

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2019

    @Farout.8207 said:
    The vast majority of the PVE players will be gone once they get their mounts or the maps stop being a constant KTrain

    Are you not aware that one sentence counter-argues the rest of your entire post? Yes, this week has been terrible for those who want to WvW "properly", whatever that means. But after Tuesday the server queues will be gone, the skill lag / FPS issues will be back to their usual poor levels, and the majority of PvE players will be gone from the game mode, minus those who still don't have the mount, OR, the ones who are interested in playing WvW and are learning their way.

    Veteran players leave every game mode in every game for every reason. Will some leave because of mounts? Sure. Probably some left because they disagreed with the Mesmer nerfs (too much or not enough), others may have left because of the nerfs to DE.

    But how many Veteran players are coming back because of profession reworks, or renewed interest in WvW? Shocking to think, but many WvW players hated having to run everywhere all the time. You don't know, and neither do I.

    TL:DR - this week was a kittenshow but everything gets back to normal on Tuesday, and WvW with Warclaw is the new normal.

  • Farout.8207Farout.8207 Member ✭✭✭

    @Turkeyspit.3965 said:

    @Farout.8207 said:
    The vast majority of the PVE players will be gone once they get their mounts or the maps stop being a constant KTrain

    Are you not aware that one sentence counter-argues the rest of your entire post?

    Not really the mount will still be there, people are still going to to mount up and run, there will be still be double the entities on the map (players + mounts) which will equal more lag, roaming will suffer, and I definitely know veteran players that are refusing to play.

    Also, are you not aware that you are trying to discredit my entire post by cherry picking one sentence out of an entire paragraph I wrote?

    ~Cleetus

  • shiri.4257shiri.4257 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2019

    @Farout.8207 said:

    @Helluva.3796 said:
    Dismount should happen on damage taken to mounted rider.....

    There never should have been mounts in the first place. Nobody asked for it and it is killing my preferred game mode.

    I asked for it. thank you for hurting my feelings.

    Spectre [VII] - Wood League Champion. Making "fight guilds" stack on higher tiers since 2013.
    Michelin rated WvW guild since 2015. The gold standard. Never transferred, never reformed, adapting and reloading with or without Anet.

  • alain.1659alain.1659 Member ✭✭✭

    So I want to ask one thing. As many people hate specific professions as roamers, especially thieves and rangers, what do you want them to do now? Their roaming ability is taken from them. They are not welcome in zergs. And again many people argued that backflipping is bad, ganking sucks, scouting is garbage etc. What should they do now? Leave wvw altogether?

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2019

    @alain.1659 said:
    So I want to ask one thing. As many people hate specific professions as roamers, especially thieves and rangers, what do you want them to do now? Their roaming ability is taken from them. They are not welcome in zergs. And again many people argued that backflipping is bad, ganking sucks, scouting is garbage etc. What should they do now? Leave wvw altogether?

    How is their roaming ability taken from them?

    Before the mount was introduced, solo / small groups of players could:

    • flip paper camps/towers
    • kill sentries
    • kill dolyaks to deny supply / upgrades
    • tap keeps to deny waypoints
    • scout enemy movements and report to teamchat
    • pull tactics / repair / disable enemy siege until friendly zerg can respond
    • prevent enemy roamers from doing everything listed above
    • ambush zerg players running back to tag to deny reinforcements

    So now after the mount, the last one is harder to do, but what else has changed?

    EDIT: see, all that has really changed is it makes it more difficult for roamers to engage in one-sided fights where they have the advantage. All the outrage about the loss of this edge is pretty telling imo.

  • KrHome.1920KrHome.1920 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2019

    @Duckota.4769 said:

    @Blocki.4931 said:
    How can you even complain about the mount health when it only matters BEFORE a fight??? If they mount up during a fight by disengaging then they don't even participate in the fight whatsoever. This whole argument is flawed and awful.

    Because none of you want to fight and you never dismount. Unless it 50v2. But if its 2v3 and you're on the way back to your zerg oh were the gankers now. Whatever dude. Its not about winning fights for all of us or having the tactical advantage. You ever consider that some of us look for outnumbered fights because want a disadvantage? Or we want a harder fight? This promotes less fights on a small level and dumb fights on a zerg level.

    Don't know where you are playing. Nothing has changed in WvW in EU except the gank squads are minimized and everyone wastes less time for traveling - which is exactly what the game mode needed.

    So you either

    • play in a weird region,
    • you used to play in a gank squad or
    • you don't play at all.
  • Farout.8207Farout.8207 Member ✭✭✭

    @Turkeyspit.3965 said:

    @alain.1659 said:
    So I want to ask one thing. As many people hate specific professions as roamers, especially thieves and rangers, what do you want them to do now? Their roaming ability is taken from them. They are not welcome in zergs. And again many people argued that backflipping is bad, ganking sucks, scouting is garbage etc. What should they do now? Leave wvw altogether?

    How is their roaming ability taken from them?

    Before the mount was introduced, solo / small groups of players could:

    • flip paper camps/towers
    • kill sentries
    • kill dolyaks to deny supply / upgrades
    • tap keeps to deny waypoints
    • scout enemy movements and report to teamchat
    • pull tactics / repair / disable enemy siege until friendly zerg can respond
    • prevent enemy roamers from doing everything listed above
    • ambush zerg players running back to tag to deny reinforcements

    So now after the mount, the last one is harder to do, but what else has changed?

    EDIT: see, all that has really changed is it makes it more difficult for roamers to engage in one-sided fights where they have the advantage. All the outrage about the loss of this edge is pretty telling imo.

    You are correct, a huge part of roaming for me is killing those players trying to make it back to their Zerg. For instance, say a server is hitting hills and our defenders at the keep are picking off their Zerg one player at a time, as a roamer I am contributing quite a lot by preventing those players from returning to the fight, bringing additional supply, etc... With the mount they just dodge, dodge, dodge and are instantly out of danger and back into the fight. Why anyone would want to introduce a mechanic that guarantees attackers safe passage back into the fight is beyond me. It just promotes the blob mentality.

    ~Cleetus

  • alain.1659alain.1659 Member ✭✭✭

    @Turkeyspit.3965 said:

    @alain.1659 said:
    So I want to ask one thing. As many people hate specific professions as roamers, especially thieves and rangers, what do you want them to do now? Their roaming ability is taken from them. They are not welcome in zergs. And again many people argued that backflipping is bad, ganking sucks, scouting is garbage etc. What should they do now? Leave wvw altogether?

    How is their roaming ability taken from them?

    Before the mount was introduced, solo / small groups of players could:

    • flip paper camps/towers
    • kill sentries
    • kill dolyaks to deny supply / upgrades
    • tap keeps to deny waypoints
    • scout enemy movements and report to teamchat
    • pull tactics / repair / disable enemy siege until friendly zerg can respond
    • prevent enemy roamers from doing everything listed above
    • ambush zerg players running back to tag to deny reinforcements

    So now after the mount, the last one is harder to do, but what else has changed?

    EDIT: see, all that has really changed is it makes it more difficult for roamers to engage in one-sided fights where they have the advantage. All the outrage about the loss of this edge is pretty telling imo.

    First of all my question was about their role, as many people dislike all the roaming activities, what is for thief and ranger? To clear things up, I do not play thief or ranger in wvw but either scrapper or necro. But there are so many stupid arguments on the forum about those two that I really wanna ask, what would you all want them to do? Everyone dislikes backflippers, gankers etc and comms do not want them (rightfully). So it seems many players want them to stop existing in wvw. The hate is that strong.

    Second, flipping camps, killing sentries and all things you said have become really hard. Response time is too short with a mounted player. So if you are against a semi-capable server, there will be at least 2-3 people on your head before you capture the camp. Ambushing zerg players is not possible either as far as I've heard. And to dismount a player you should play "gank/cheesy build" or you have no chance. I tried it with my belowed scrapper. It is either "play a gank build" or "die" now.

    ps: Lets not forget the classic response for those who does not like the mount system "you are a ganker, now you cannot kill me, ha ha ha! suffer!". Not all those who are against mounts or can see the problems are mesmers, thieves or rangers guys.

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Farout.8207 said:

    @Turkeyspit.3965 said:

    @alain.1659 said:
    So I want to ask one thing. As many people hate specific professions as roamers, especially thieves and rangers, what do you want them to do now? Their roaming ability is taken from them. They are not welcome in zergs. And again many people argued that backflipping is bad, ganking sucks, scouting is garbage etc. What should they do now? Leave wvw altogether?

    How is their roaming ability taken from them?

    Before the mount was introduced, solo / small groups of players could:

    • flip paper camps/towers
    • kill sentries
    • kill dolyaks to deny supply / upgrades
    • tap keeps to deny waypoints
    • scout enemy movements and report to teamchat
    • pull tactics / repair / disable enemy siege until friendly zerg can respond
    • prevent enemy roamers from doing everything listed above
    • ambush zerg players running back to tag to deny reinforcements

    So now after the mount, the last one is harder to do, but what else has changed?

    EDIT: see, all that has really changed is it makes it more difficult for roamers to engage in one-sided fights where they have the advantage. All the outrage about the loss of this edge is pretty telling imo.

    You are correct, a huge part of roaming for me is killing those players trying to make it back to their Zerg. For instance, say a server is hitting hills and our defenders at the keep are picking off their Zerg one player at a time, as a roamer I am contributing quite a lot by preventing those players from returning to the fight, bringing additional supply, etc... With the mount they just dodge, dodge, dodge and are instantly out of danger and back into the fight. Why anyone would want to introduce a mechanic that guarantees attackers safe passage back into the fight is beyond me. It just promotes the blob mentality.

    And you had a significant advantage over those "players" trying to make it back to their zerg. Full zerk Heralds, Marauder Scourge with nobody giving them swiftness, glass Eles, etc. Can you not realize how unfun it must have been for those players to get ambushed into a fight, where they were mathematically at a huge disadvantage to a roamer with Vitality/Toughness on their gear and Energy Sigils? And that if the fight didn't go your way, you could skirt away to safety, or reset and try again?

    So that's gone now, and while the tactic of cutting off reinforcements is sound, the Warclaw compensates because the defenders have them as well! Faster reinforcements from across the map / garrison, running supply, attacking other T2/T3 objectives and forcing them to respond.

    This morning before work my guild was sieging the outer wall of Bay. After we exhausted their supply, they had Scourges going full on kamikaze, dropping down on our siege, dumping shades, dying, then respawning back at their keep, grabbing supply, and racing back on their mounts to repair the wall. After about 30mins of this I had to leave for work, and the commander ended up pulling off.

    The game has changed, nobody can argue that, but the major complaint I keep seeing is from roamers lamenting the loss of one sided fights and easy kills.

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2019

    @alain.1659 said:
    First of all my question was about their role, as many people dislike all the roaming activities, what is for thief and ranger?

    People don't like getting ganked and forced into an unfair fight. That's a pretty simple concept to grasp, and only applies to my last bullet point. Everything above that remains the work of roamers, and nobody that I know of has any problem with that.

    @alain.1659 said:
    Second, flipping camps, killing sentries and all things you said have become really hard. Response time is too short with a mounted player. So if you are against a semi-capable server, there will be at least 2-3 people on your head before you capture the camp.

    And who are these 2-3 people you are describing? They are not the zerg....they are other roamers. I'd say that is exactly the type of gameplay roamers would (should) want.

    Roamers are complaining that things are harder now that the mount exists, not understanding or willing to recognize that the reason things were easier before was they had an advantage over non-roaming players; an advantage that has now been swallowed by the balancing influence of giving everyone a mount.

    I can't say if that was a design goal for ANET, but I can't help but feel many players are happier for that aspect being changed.

    BTW, the exact same complaints were levied in World of Warcraft way back about the impact flying mounts had on open PvP. The TLDR of it was you couldn't gank someone on a flying mount, so the diagnosis was flying mounts killed world PvP. Now back then you had PvP only servers, so I don't know why anyone would want to actively avoid PvP if they chose to play on a server dedicated to it, but regardless, the complaints always came from the ambusher.

    If two players, both keening for a fight saw each other, nobody was getting on a mount.

  • alain.1659alain.1659 Member ✭✭✭

    @Turkeyspit.3965 said:

    @alain.1659 said:
    First of all my question was about their role, as many people dislike all the roaming activities, what is for thief and ranger?

    People don't like getting ganked and forced into an unfair fight. That's a pretty simple concept to grasp, and only applies to my last bullet point. Everything above that remains the work of roamers, and nobody that I know of has any problem with that.

    @alain.1659 said:
    Second, flipping camps, killing sentries and all things you said have become really hard. Response time is too short with a mounted player. So if you are against a semi-capable server, there will be at least 2-3 people on your head before you capture the camp.

    And who are these 2-3 people you are describing? They are not the zerg....they are other roamers. I'd say that is exactly the type of gameplay roamers would (should) want.

    No they should not. This only results in numbers vs numbers. And with wvw having population issues (some servers are way more crowded for several hours) the speed becomes a real problem for low population servers like mine. Activity hours are not balanced.

    Roamers are complaining that things are harder now that the mount exists, not understanding or willing to recognize that the reason things were easier before was they had an advantage over non-roaming players; an advantage that has now been swallowed by the balancing influence of giving everyone a mount.

    Yes they had. And it was because of their design. I have never cursed a thief for being a thief. Without assassination and mobility he does not have many things. Whereas I can roam, zerg, tank, heal etc with ease. The hp differences, weapon damages, skills etc are all designed according to this. Again I need to clarify that I am playing scrapper or a necro and I do not have a mount.

    I can't say if that was a design goal for ANET, but I can't help but feel many players are happier for that aspect being changed.

    Ofc they are. Who would say no to a buff? Have you ever seen any large mirage players rejecting the long dodges? Or any scourge groups that complain about the immense condi burst? No. People love buffs, even if there are problems with it.

    BTW, the exact same complaints were levied in World of Warcraft way back about the impact flying mounts had on open PvP. The TLDR of it was you couldn't gank someone on a flying mount, so the diagnosis was flying mounts killed world PvP. Now back then you had PvP only servers, so I don't know why anyone would want to actively avoid PvP if they chose to play on a server dedicated to it, but regardless, the complaints always came from the ambusher.

    Might be. Never got into the flying mounts. Left wow before that. But as a pvp only server is for pvp, wvw is for world vs world combat. It is a large battlefield where all types of styles and characters exist. So why risk it if you do not want to fight? Zerging is fun but that is why we try so hard to stay alive in a zerg. That is why many of us use ressing traits in zergs. Still you are right about being free to use different builds without fearing the gankers. This is the only plus I see and it is important. Yet as you see I am not an ambusher and I have many complains.

    If two players, both keening for a fight saw each other, nobody was getting on a mount.

    Thisis another problem. For those who only have HoT, wvw became impossible. I can continue on this but I am afraid that it would just end in "so buy PoF" arguments.

  • HazyDaisy.4107HazyDaisy.4107 Member ✭✭✭✭

    On the plus side though, we play in a game where you see the mounted SB now as opposed to before being shot in the butt with an arrow and spinning around muttering where the hell are you?

    [HaHa] Hazardous Hallucination - Sorrows Furnace

  • Duckota.4769Duckota.4769 Member ✭✭✭

    @KrHome.1920 said:

    @Duckota.4769 said:

    @Blocki.4931 said:
    How can you even complain about the mount health when it only matters BEFORE a fight??? If they mount up during a fight by disengaging then they don't even participate in the fight whatsoever. This whole argument is flawed and awful.

    Because none of you want to fight and you never dismount. Unless it 50v2. But if its 2v3 and you're on the way back to your zerg oh were the gankers now. Whatever dude. Its not about winning fights for all of us or having the tactical advantage. You ever consider that some of us look for outnumbered fights because want a disadvantage? Or we want a harder fight? This promotes less fights on a small level and dumb fights on a zerg level.

    Don't know where you are playing. Nothing has changed in WvW in EU except the gank squads are minimized and everyone wastes less time for traveling - which is exactly what the game mode needed.

    So you either

    • play in a weird region,
    • you used to play in a gank squad or
    • you don't play at all.

    Nah. I play. Not as much as I did before mounts were released for obvious reasons. But people dont fight. They run. Until they outnumber something 3 to 1. Then they turn around. It is what it is. To say I don't play at all is a bit silly though.

  • Sazukikrah.5036Sazukikrah.5036 Member ✭✭✭

    They really need to make downstate have a base set of health too.. im tired of fighting tanky a -2 -2 downed support classes lmfao

  • Farout.8207Farout.8207 Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 12, 2019

    @Turkeyspit.3965 said:

    And you had a significant advantage over those "players" trying to make it back to their zerg. Full zerk Heralds, Marauder Scourge with nobody giving them swiftness, glass Eles, etc. Can you not realize how unfun it must have been for those players to get ambushed into a fight, where they were mathematically at a huge disadvantage to a roamer with Vitality/Toughness on their gear and Energy Sigils? And that if the fight didn't go your way, you could skirt away to safety, or reset and try again?

    I actually roam on full zerker core warrior. It's a decent 1v1 spec but definitely not unbeatable. At one time it stood a chance at running away, but almost every class is just as mobile now and with the mount I have no chance of escaping if people add-on to the fight.

    So that's gone now, and while the tactic of cutting off reinforcements is sound, the Warclaw compensates because the defenders have them as well! Faster reinforcements from across the map / garrison, running supply, attacking other T2/T3 objectives and forcing them to respond.

    But the enemy does return to their blob unhindered therefore reinforcing the assault and I really don't like fighting on a wall.

    This morning before work my guild was sieging the outer wall of Bay. After we exhausted their supply, they had Scourges going full on kamikaze, dropping down on our siege, dumping shades, dying, then respawning back at their keep, grabbing supply, and racing back on their mounts to repair the wall. After about 30mins of this I had to leave for work, and the commander ended up pulling off.

    Sounds fun! /s

    The game has changed, nobody can argue that, but the major complaint I keep seeing is from roamers lamenting the loss of one sided fights and easy kills.

    Some people like hunting down the zerglings, some like being the zergling. But be honest, only one side got screwed here.

    ~Cleetus

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