Soulbeast - Why is Stance Stacking allowed in this game? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Soulbeast - Why is Stance Stacking allowed in this game?

Lithril Ashwalker.6230Lithril Ashwalker.6230 Member ✭✭✭
edited March 12, 2019 in Ranger

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Comments

  • Zexanima.7851Zexanima.7851 Member ✭✭✭

    It makes sense mechanically the way they have it. It's more active and allows for diversity in their uses. If it helps, just think of them like fighting stances and when you active multiple your ranger just becomes a MMA fighter for a few seconds.

    "Maining" necromancer now but I play all professions really.
    Lets work together to improve the player's experience.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Why would it make sense to not have it stack? I see no reason to limit players that want to do so.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • InsaneQR.7412InsaneQR.7412 Member ✭✭✭✭

    If the stances dont stack thex would have a way longer duration or be togglable.
    Getting free 66% boon duration with perma protection, regen, swiftness and fury?
    How would that change the current situation?

  • I don't like this idea. I do like the idea of adding more stunbreaks to stances

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  • i like the fact that stances should be toggle-able but if it happened they would need to be changed to be toned down

  • Skotlex.7580Skotlex.7580 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 27, 2019

    I was actually thinking among these same lines about stances. I'd make thematically sense to have a stance "permanently" on until it's turned off or the player switches to a different stance.

    When a stance is disabled it'd go into cooldown, and "on trigger" bonuses would still apply only when triggering (so moa stance could be permanent boon duration bonus, but the boons it gives apply only on cast).

    Granted, some stances would need a redesign (specially warrior's), but at least that would give them more sense.

  • @Skotlex.7580 said:
    I was actually thinking among these same lines about stances. I'd make thematically sense to have a stance "permanently" on until it's turned off or the player switches to a different stance.

    When a stance is disabled it'd go into cooldown, and "on trigger" bonuses would still apply only when triggering (so moa stance could be permanent boon duration bonus, but the boons it gives apply only on cast).

    Granted, some stances would need a redesign (specially warrior's), but at least that would give them more sense.

    this is what i had in mind. choices for playstyle instead of facerolling

  • DeceiverX.8361DeceiverX.8361 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Skotlex.7580 said:
    I was actually thinking among these same lines about stances. I'd make thematically sense to have a stance "permanently" on until it's turned off or the player switches to a different stance.

    When a stance is disabled it'd go into cooldown, and "on trigger" bonuses would still apply only when triggering (so moa stance could be permanent boon duration bonus, but the boons it gives apply only on cast).

    Granted, some stances would need a redesign (specially warrior's), but at least that would give them more sense.

    And what if a player decides only to use one stance?
    It would need to equate to a signet passive in power for this reason.

    You sure that Sniper idea is as good as you thought it was gonna be?
    Because I think my original idea is better.

  • Crystal Paladin.3871Crystal Paladin.3871 Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 1, 2019

    @Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:
    In all games I have ever played, including guild wars 1, IF you used another stance it would automatically cancel the other active stance then place it on cooldown. how in the hell can I be bear, dolyak, moa same time?! am i MANBEARPIG!?!?!?!

    Disable this from happening with ALL stances in the game or things considered stances and buff the stances so that having one up at a time would be worth it rather than having them on longer cooldowns. Don't allow them to stack

    Makes sense... It could lead to some interesting playstyles... stance active until we switch to another stance
    Dolyak active- can't be cc'd and kicked like a ragdoll by holos
    Moa active - boon uptimes perma until we switch to diff stance(stab and prot should be made unavailable during this stance)
    Vulture- perma poison inflicting / might generation stance(would make a cool bruiser)
    Griffon - evades... Might invite lot of nerfs
    Bear stance - perma condi cleanse every 2 secs :p
    Owp - perma double hits... So cool...

    If this were to become a reality, switching from one stance to another should have some delay... Like 30 secs delay between stance switching... Current stance has to be deactivated so the next stance becomes available after 30 secs... Ranger could take on any role and adapt to any situation...

  • anduriell.6280anduriell.6280 Member ✭✭✭

    Although i like the idea i doubt Anet will rework the spec to adapt that funcitonality.

  • Skotlex.7580Skotlex.7580 Member ✭✭✭

    @DeceiverX.8361 said:

    @Skotlex.7580 said:
    I was actually thinking among these same lines about stances. I'd make thematically sense to have a stance "permanently" on until it's turned off or the player switches to a different stance.

    When a stance is disabled it'd go into cooldown, and "on trigger" bonuses would still apply only when triggering (so moa stance could be permanent boon duration bonus, but the boons it gives apply only on cast).

    Granted, some stances would need a redesign (specially warrior's), but at least that would give them more sense.

    And what if a player decides only to use one stance?
    It would need to equate to a signet passive in power for this reason.

    Not totally true, since you can stack signet effects, but not stance effects. So its possible for them to be somewhat better.

  • Straegen.2938Straegen.2938 Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 1, 2019

    Warrior stances stack as well and it isn't a problem. The only real problem with Soulbeast stances is the Dolyak Stance stacking with protection. That stance should apply protection rather than stack with it.

    Now if stances had no cool down and only one could be active at a time, that could be interesting.

  • Take some karate, fencing, boxing, kendo, judo, etc. classes. When you get good, you basically transition between multiple "stances" with every move you make and every breath you take. Maybe that's what they're trying to emulate? I've never really paid attention...

  • @anduriell.6280 said:
    Although i like the idea i doubt Anet will rework the spec to adapt that funcitonality.

    Not true, I pitched the idea for venom share to be given to other players to ha e it scale off of the users stats instead years ago to many in game devs and they loved it. I can do it again if I had suooort.from community. Rangers have alot of love lately, even with tomorrow's spirit change

  • @TorontoTech.4937 said:
    Take some karate, fencing, boxing, kendo, judo, etc. classes. When you get good, you basically transition between multiple "stances" with every move you make and every breath you take. Maybe that's what they're trying to emulate? I've never really paid attention...

    So. Stance weaver???

  • The idea of stances being a toggle where you can have the effect "permanently" doesn't work with their current iteration. You could, in theory, only slot 1 into your build, activate it permanently and then forget about it with no consequence. At that point it's literally just a signet.

  • Revenants can switch stances and switch back forth between stances

  • @Crystal Paladin.3871 said:
    Revenants can switch stances and switch back forth between stances

    thats legends, i guess it is considered a stance in some text

  • Biff.5312Biff.5312 Member ✭✭✭✭

    As to why, I don't know. Maybe so it's viable to actually load your panel with stance skills. Either way, I'm just glad you can stack them. I'm not sure why it has to work like another game, although I do agree that the term 'stance' seems to suggest that you are preparing for a specific type of combat benefit. Change the name and keep the stacking.

  • @Biff.5312 said:
    As to why, I don't know. Maybe so it's viable to actually load your panel with stance skills. Either way, I'm just glad you can stack them. I'm not sure why it has to work like another game, although I do agree that the term 'stance' seems to suggest that you are preparing for a specific type of combat benefit. Change the name and keep the stacking.

    i wouldnt even mind the name change xD even for war

    make them like the improved ferocity buffs on rev where its not called a stance but a class buff.

  • Hannelore.8153Hannelore.8153 Member ✭✭✭

    Being able to switch them and pick and chose which one we use would be alot more dynamic and tactical, right now its just spam.

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  • Swagger.1459Swagger.1459 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2019

    You...

    "Soulbeast - Why is Stance Stacking allowed in this game?"

    "In all games I have ever played, including guild wars 1, IF you used another stance it would automatically cancel the other active stance then place it on cooldown. how in the hell can I be bear, dolyak, moa same time?! am i MANBEARPIG!?!?!?!

    Disable this from happening with ALL stances in the game or things considered stances and buff the stances so that having one up at a time would be worth it rather than having them on longer cooldowns. Don't allow them to stack"

    Me..

    Explains "stance" to you... Points out facts of https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stance and the fact YOU ENJOY STACKING BUFFS AND EFFECTS, LIKE STEALTH, yet other profession buffs and effects are somehow problematic so you want "Don't allow them to stack"...

    So if you want this to happen then be prepared for stealth to not stack, nor any other player buffs to stack or your own personal Thief buffs... We can even go to stacking damage modifiers too if you like... Considering your main, at this point, has the ability to be in perma-stealth AND 1 shot unsuspecting players... Or if you fail a gank, then you can easily just run away and reset.

    Yeah, this is on topic, so be careful what you want nerfed because it will hit your profession too... that also enjoys stacking self-buffs and from other players.

  • @Swagger.1459 said:
    You...

    "Soulbeast - Why is Stance Stacking allowed in this game?"

    "In all games I have ever played, including guild wars 1, IF you used another stance it would automatically cancel the other active stance then place it on cooldown. how in the hell can I be bear, dolyak, moa same time?! am i MANBEARPIG!?!?!?!

    Disable this from happening with ALL stances in the game or things considered stances and buff the stances so that having one up at a time would be worth it rather than having them on longer cooldowns. Don't allow them to stack"

    Me..

    Explains "stance" to you... Points out facts of https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stance and the fact YOU ENJOY STACKING BUFFS AND EFFECTS, LIKE STEALTH, yet other profession buffs and effects are somehow problematic so you want "Don't allow them to stack"...

    So if you want this to happen then be prepared for stealth to not stack, nor any other player buffs to stack or your own personal Thief buffs... We can even go to stacking damage modifiers too if you like... Considering your main, at this point, has the ability to be in perma-stealth AND 1 shot unsuspecting players... Or if you fail a gank, then you can easily just run away and reset.

    Yeah, this is on topic, so be careful what you want nerfed because it will hit your profession too... that also enjoys stacking self-buffs and from other players.

    Moa stance, bear stance and other utility skills stacking the buffs are multiple effects vs stealth which is just 1. i do believe YOUR point invalid. my issue was it being considered a "stance" as where you wont see someone using Mantis stance IRL combined with tiger unless they switch stances. now if you comeback and "this isnt RL" then fine, why not just rename them spirits or something else and just completely ignore the other suggestions. IMO renaming them would do the least harm but make sense gamewise AND RL wise.

  • Swagger.1459Swagger.1459 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:

    @Swagger.1459 said:
    You...

    "Soulbeast - Why is Stance Stacking allowed in this game?"

    "In all games I have ever played, including guild wars 1, IF you used another stance it would automatically cancel the other active stance then place it on cooldown. how in the hell can I be bear, dolyak, moa same time?! am i MANBEARPIG!?!?!?!

    Disable this from happening with ALL stances in the game or things considered stances and buff the stances so that having one up at a time would be worth it rather than having them on longer cooldowns. Don't allow them to stack"

    Me..

    Explains "stance" to you... Points out facts of https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stance and the fact YOU ENJOY STACKING BUFFS AND EFFECTS, LIKE STEALTH, yet other profession buffs and effects are somehow problematic so you want "Don't allow them to stack"...

    So if you want this to happen then be prepared for stealth to not stack, nor any other player buffs to stack or your own personal Thief buffs... We can even go to stacking damage modifiers too if you like... Considering your main, at this point, has the ability to be in perma-stealth AND 1 shot unsuspecting players... Or if you fail a gank, then you can easily just run away and reset.

    Yeah, this is on topic, so be careful what you want nerfed because it will hit your profession too... that also enjoys stacking self-buffs and from other players.

    Moa stance, bear stance and other utility skills stacking the buffs are multiple effects vs stealth which is just 1. i do believe YOUR point invalid. my issue was it being considered a "stance" as where you wont see someone using Mantis stance IRL combined with tiger unless they switch stances. now if you comeback and "this isnt RL" then fine, why not just rename them spirits or something else and just completely ignore the other suggestions. IMO renaming them would do the least harm but make sense gamewise AND RL wise.

    All professions allow for effects to stack, that's how the game was designed. And if you want to talk about changing any stacking effects, then we also need to look at stacking stealth as well... See how that works? And you see how asking for other skills on professions to not stack effects looks, while conveniently ignoring the fact that your main takes advantage of stacking effects too?

    Yup, this is not real life. Stance is just a name given to a category of skills by some dev. Makes zero difference what you name a set of skills. We could call them "pizza" or "donut" and they would still function the same by design.

    Ok, so you just want to rename stances now? If so, then change the title and OP to reflect that, and ask the devs to rename these sets of skills on Ranger, Warrior and Ele to something more your liking. Right?

  • Lazze.9870Lazze.9870 Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2019

    @Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:
    In all games I have ever played, including guild wars 1, IF you used another stance it would automatically cancel the other active stance then place it on cooldown. how in the hell can I be bear, dolyak, moa same time?! am i MANBEARPIG!?!?!?!

    Disable this from happening with ALL stances in the game or things considered stances and buff the stances so that having one up at a time would be worth it rather than having them on longer cooldowns. Don't allow them to stack

    Stances were way more build defining in GW1 (like Expert's Dexterity), and when they weren't, they were still just one out of 3-4 "utility" skills, and often still the only stance you took. You had the rare occassion when a ranger in GW1 might had run both Lightning Reflexes and Whirling Defense, but more often than not you ran just one of them. Comparing it to GW2 where both Warrior and Ranger got stance traits that promote running several at once is dumb to begin with. A build defined by stances in GW2 run as many as possible, instead of just one.

    If you don't understand why they are allowed to be stacked in this game, you shouldn't make comments on balancing to begin with. Unless you're simply annoyed by the fact it is named a "stance". At that point I literally don't care. Whirling Defense is an axe skill, lightning reflexes is a survival skill. There is nothing left from GW1 stances as far as ranger goes anyway. It's just another effect in this game, and the game allows effect stacking.

  • @Lazze.9870 said:

    @Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:
    In all games I have ever played, including guild wars 1, IF you used another stance it would automatically cancel the other active stance then place it on cooldown. how in the hell can I be bear, dolyak, moa same time?! am i MANBEARPIG!?!?!?!

    Disable this from happening with ALL stances in the game or things considered stances and buff the stances so that having one up at a time would be worth it rather than having them on longer cooldowns. Don't allow them to stack

    Stances were way more build defining in GW1 (like Expert's Dexterity), and when they weren't, they were still just one out of 3-4 "utility" skills, and often still the only stance you took. You had the rare occassion when a ranger in GW1 might had run both Lightning Reflexes and Whirling Defense, but more often than not you ran just one of them. Comparing it to GW2 where both Warrior and Ranger got stance traits that promote running several at once is dumb to begin with. A build defined by stances in GW2 run as many as possible, instead of just one.

    If you don't understand why they are allowed to be stacked in this game, you shouldn't make comments on balancing to begin with. Unless you're simply annoyed by the fact it is named a "stance". At that point I literally don't care. Whirling Defense is an axe skill, lightning reflexes is a survival skill. There is nothing left from GW1 stances as far as ranger goes anyway. It's just another effect in this game, and the game allows effect stacking.

    just the fact they are called stances tbh :/

  • Swagger.1459Swagger.1459 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:

    @Lazze.9870 said:

    @Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:
    In all games I have ever played, including guild wars 1, IF you used another stance it would automatically cancel the other active stance then place it on cooldown. how in the hell can I be bear, dolyak, moa same time?! am i MANBEARPIG!?!?!?!

    Disable this from happening with ALL stances in the game or things considered stances and buff the stances so that having one up at a time would be worth it rather than having them on longer cooldowns. Don't allow them to stack

    Stances were way more build defining in GW1 (like Expert's Dexterity), and when they weren't, they were still just one out of 3-4 "utility" skills, and often still the only stance you took. You had the rare occassion when a ranger in GW1 might had run both Lightning Reflexes and Whirling Defense, but more often than not you ran just one of them. Comparing it to GW2 where both Warrior and Ranger got stance traits that promote running several at once is dumb to begin with. A build defined by stances in GW2 run as many as possible, instead of just one.

    If you don't understand why they are allowed to be stacked in this game, you shouldn't make comments on balancing to begin with. Unless you're simply annoyed by the fact it is named a "stance". At that point I literally don't care. Whirling Defense is an axe skill, lightning reflexes is a survival skill. There is nothing left from GW1 stances as far as ranger goes anyway. It's just another effect in this game, and the game allows effect stacking.

    just the fact they are called stances tbh :/

    Ok, then get rid of this thread and post in the general profession section asking the devs to rename the skill slots on 3 professions to something else.

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