i do not support the dismounting ability. this kinda make it impossible hard for roamer they can be wipe easily by zerg. especially if u have use 1 of your player to dismount the enemy, if you have more numbers u will have mounted ppl chasing dismounted one. how is that fair?
You need to fix Keep's tactics, it is annoying to know that there are people who pull it just to waste it and there is nothing the players can do to avoid it.
you are aware that we can already set it to be private. ppl just don't want to restrict access, it is not that we can't.
Any changes to the damage of the siege pull? Right now it feels a little weak for the time it takes per pull. Obviously you don't want it to be the go-to instead of rams, but it feels like it has quite a bit of room left.
If you're gonna take out the jump ability, at least make the mount faster. There's no point in using it when the rest of your zerg can easy stay behind you without the Warclaw.
Working on a new mounted skill to dismount other mounted players. This may also dismount yourself. We're still debating that. Feedback welcome.
A skill to dismount someone? Might as well just remove the mount. I would appreciate some way of having less situations where people are just staring at each other on their mounts instead of doing something engaging, but this is not it. Having to damage the mount to dismount someone seems fair, but the mount has too much health currently for that to be viable to any but high-damage ranged builds or a thief doing steal+backstab
Except it's not. It may depends on class, but I'm not entirely confident of that. My necro, engie, guard, ele have mount health of 10972. My rev has 12069.
@C Cspace Cowboy.5903 said:
Ya'll need to remove the ability to be stealthed on mount. It may not be a problem in pve, but in wvw its absolutely broken. When a 50 man zerg can stealth out of render distance and then just bomb on people who had no idea.
This really needs to be dealt with. Easy way to fix it is to give the person reveal on mounting up, then have the same kind of debuff watchtower gives where one can only be in stealth for 2-3 seconds before being forced out whilst mounted. So it wouldn't really affect groups that would mount up and take a veil for stealth, but would deal with those super-coordinated groups that will blast smoke fields far away then mount up with their 12+ seconds of stealth to go obscene distances to engage.
@Digger.8659 said:
If you're gonna take out the jump ability, at least make the mount faster. There's no point in using it when the rest of your zerg can easy stay behind you without the Warclaw.
Except it's not. It may depends on class, but I'm not entirely confident of that. My necro, engie, guard, ele have mount health of 10972. My rev has 12069.
My Scourge has 12069(96? idr). Every other stream I've watched on Twitch had the same as me. Did you have all masteries unlocked on all those classes?
@Zaraki.5784 said:
Trap is fine but the dismount skill is a bad idea imho.
You haven't even bothered to give an opinion? I wish people would give constructive feedback on why they think dismount skill is a bad idea.
Players are doing either the following regarding mounts which is why there needs to be an opportunity to dismount players, especially if you're on a mount:
running past each other entirely since who ever dismounts first is at a dis-advantage
heavily favors ranged classes since if you engage on a melee class your enemy who is most likely still mounted will either troll you with mount evades or just run away laughing
hanging around like vultures not engaging in fights (literally being useless) because they want to fancy finish someone letting others do all the work for them prior
Hands down we need an appropriate way to dismount a player on a mount and as long as it dismounts both then combat can proceed as normal. I hope you understand this view point and reconsider why you think dismount skill is a 'bad idea'.
Except it's not. It may depends on class, but I'm not entirely confident of that. My necro, engie, guard, ele have mount health of 10972. My rev has 12069.
My Scourge has 12069(96? idr). Every other stream I've watched on Twitch had the same as me. Did you have all masteries unlocked on all those classes?
Everything is maxed. I have over 8k points left doing nothing.
@Kaatora.3186 said:
Except it's not. It may depends on class, but I'm not entirely confident of that. My necro, engie, guard, ele have mount health of 10972. My rev has 12069.
Its your 10% rune buff affecting the mount hp.
Anyway, someone mentioned the trap would be good for "mass dismount".
Yeah, no.
As we have seen over the last weeks, the mounts cause little to no problem with larger groups and zerging. Even smallscale, once you go over 5 peeps you can easily force a dismount by focus fire and thus the enemy has to engage or loose people. Most zergs now choose to fully dismount before battle, as do guild groups.
A trap is pointless. No one will use it. Why? Because it cost supplies. No one will spend supplies to dismount people that will dismount anyway. This is as redundant as putting a reveal trap inside a ballooned tower.
The dismounting is only an issue in very small scale and random 1v1 encounters.
So Anet... save yourself time. Dont make a stupid trap no one will use 2 days after the novelty wears off.
gaggle - /ˈɡaɡ(ə)l/ - noun
A disorderly group of Asura. "The gaggle of Asura tried to agree on whether a phase-shifted thermonuclear energy matrix was sufficiently powerful for a device capable of heating bread"
I think breakbars are a good idea (lol would be funny if they made them scale with the number of enemies around trololol)
I think it would be fair for warclaw skills to require supply to execute.
Sniff would be more useful if it revealed enemies to your allies when you used the skill....I can't really say I use the skill often in the first place, it might feel more attention worthy if it did a little more (ie. allies can see the enemies as well).
RIP little jump dismounts - I use it to feel stylish - please replace it with something fab
As a primarily PvE player who got back into WvW only because of Warclaw's speed and safety of traversal, I dislike the idea of a dismount skill. It will just bring back the ganking and have the trolls - oh, pardon me, "roamers" - rejoice, while encouraging the new WvW players to return back to their previous activities. Traps - I can understand; they require planning and cost time and supply, but not a ranged mount skill.
If it still happens, I would hope that other limitations are considered extra to "dismounts both players", such as:
being a fairly long channel that roots you in place (so that you can dismount someone who's trying to get into a tower by timing the skill, but not just gank anyone catching up to the zerg from afar),
requires supply so that it's not spammable without resupplying,
has a minimum number of players required to trigger - like, you can dismount a group of, say, 3 roamers in a terrifying AoE roar, but not a single scrub catching up to their tag,
or if that's a ranged attack like a thrown lance, that should at least be evadable,
knockdowns the player who used the dismount skill.
Otherwise the new mount's usefulness will be hampered even more - and it already feels anemic after the nerfs.
@Lishtenbird.2814 said:
As a primarily PvE player who got back into WvW only because of Warclaw's speed and safety of traversal, I dislike the idea of a dismount skill. It will just bring back the ganking and have the trolls - oh, pardon me, "roamers" - rejoice, while encouraging the new WvW players to return back to their previous activities. Traps - I can understand; they require planning and cost time and supply, but not a ranged mount skill.
If it still happens, I would hope that other limitations are considered extra to "dismounts both players", such as:
being a fairly long channel that roots you in place (so that you can dismount someone who's trying to get into a tower by timing the skill, but not just gank anyone catching up to the zerg from afar),
requires supply so that it's not spammable without resupplying,
has a minimum number of players required to trigger - like, you can dismount a group of, say, 3 roamers in a terrifying AoE roar, but not a single scrub catching up to their tag,
or if that's a ranged attack like a thrown lance, that should at least be evadable,
knockdowns the player who used the dismount skill.
Otherwise the new mount's usefulness will be hampered even more - and it already feels anemic after the nerfs.
I don't know if you're trolling or not, but in case you aren't - have you considered that wvw is just not the gamemode for you ? Wvw for many people including myself is the only reason we play gw2 the last pve thing I've done was get to 450 weaponsmithing only to have a certain sigil on my weapons for wvw, I had not left the shiverpeaks for around 6 months now I only connect to either join wvw immediately or kill some ice wyrms while waiting in the queue.
WvW is not ment for people who want to get dank skins dyes or what ever it is you are trying to get by grinding camp guards, wvw is based around a concept of being a deadly battlefield in which the players who play in the most organised and strategic manner prevail - yes that includes "roaming" and "ganking" it's not supposed to be risk free to travel from point a to point b thus why so many oppose the mounts current state, as an un cc able armored race car with 3 evades which makes it impossible to roam or ambush anyone and that doesn't only hinder with small scale play it makes it absolutely impossible to intercept zergs, use mass stealth and combined with the glider makes it very easy to form an endless stream of reinforcement to objectives under attack causing the attacking side to be punished much less by poor organisation and tactics.
This gamemode is not about grinding up pieces of rocks safely so you could get your chest plate trimmed or god knows what it is you need safe passage for in wvw
@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
Hey all, just wanted to put out a quick note about some upcoming Warclaw changes.
Short-term
We're working on a fix for the issue where people can get stuck on their mount, and still have their 3 evades and such. There may be more than one bug that causes this, but we think we're getting the most egregious one.
We're going to remove the jump on dismount. It's one of the biggest things used to bypass walls/gates and it was faster to remove the jump rather than try to fix each of those individually.
Fix to the sitting in box achievement areas so you can mount up in them.
Medium to Long-term
Working on a dismount trap
Working on a new mounted skill to dismount other mounted players. This may also dismount yourself. We're still debating that. Feedback welcome.
Even Longer term
We're considering adding break-bars to the WvW Mount. It's still a big if, as this will also require UI considerations.
Edit: Added cat box achievement fix.
All these ideas sound great.
The break bar idea, I believe should be limited to only showing up to a person attached to a door because being instantly dismounted by another player while dedicating time to using the warclaw as siege, it should have time to react like one in a sense.
Otherwise a skill to dismount other players would be a big and much needed thing.
(At the end of the day, if a person doesn't want to face an encounter and fight, they are going to run. Look at Mesmers and Thieves, they can literally teleport away forever and thats fine? So why is running on a mount that bad?)
Also, Mounts should be able to help your team mates without a mount and promote various strategies.
Having a mount and escorting a golem or a transformation/banner skills is such a slow process or people still without mounts are hugely disadvantaged. Having each mount perhaps be able to attach a skill onto a nearby player on foot to speed them up could be a nice addition. Helping fellow players while also creating strategies like having small warclaw squadrons to attach speed on to players to rush themselves into an enemy zerg quicker, etc.
Founder of Affinitus Nemus [AFNM]
"Join Us, We're Lonely" - Our Guild At Some Point
Any way we can pick up seige weapon with a mount so siege doesn't just sit there idle when not used. 1(one) sick weapon can be picked up and dropped to deploy. With every use while mounted, lose portable seige hp. To compensate, mounts carrying siege can't dodge/dash or will travel slower as they are holding a bundle. Something along these lines.
Working on a new mounted skill to dismount other mounted players. This may also dismount yourself. We're still debating that. Feedback welcome.
If you guys thinking in a new skill, rather than adding the behaviour to skill 1, then should be a dismount with range, so you can actually dismount from lets say 1200 range, like a chain, its the only thing that i can think right now in order to not be forced to play longbow soulbeast.
This is the most important change imo, maybe i can get back into game with this change.
Ranged attack is the current plan. Exact range tbd.
Could dismount functionality be added to the current gate-chain skill? Seems like it'd be pretty fitting.
That was the original plan. But that skill turned out so bloated in terms of how it needed to be implemented that I really didn't want to put anything else on it.
How about just copying the Engage skill, just make it so if it misses it doesn't dismount the user? Or give it some bigger AoE to compensate the leap range.
@Hadi.6025 said:
Hey please dont infracture my post... But why wasn't this thought of before the release of Warclaw mounts? No one in the studio thought " how will other players engage each other in smaller groups? " if everyone is on mounts it's just cat and mouse and no one can dismount unless they want to engage. This ruins the WvW experience for both sides because.. 1. Theres no risk you can just Run from people you dont want to fight, theres no challenge in it. 2. Mount has too much health so even if i use maul to engage , i cant deal enough damage to get the other player off mount as im trying to catch up to them. Players always going to complain about getting ganked thats a natural occurrence in WvW . That's like saying oh man im getting outnumbered constantly. That's just the part of WvW , sometimes you will get outnumbered. Don't make it easier for that small group of players who never want to play and just Karma train for dailies and log out.
HOW TO BALANCE WAR CLAW:
Reduce the mount health from 10k to 5000-4000 and make BOTH players dismount when using engage target. That's how you balance war claw.
Thought's on defiance bar?
If it's anything like the War banner tactivators, i'm going to have to say no to that idea. Give them skills that can make them immune to CC but still give counter play like a skill that gives mount stability, instead of the current 100% immunity to all CC's. That is just ridiculous.
As if people weren't already running from combat before the Warclaw? People were and there wasn't a risk of running away then either. Look at the thief and mesmer, they literally have builds for running.
Just because it's harder to bully someone who wants to avoid combat, people are complaining.
I think it's better that people who would have run away anyway get to run, it's not fun being pummeled by an encounter you were already trying to run from.
At the end of the day, there was always people running away from combat and we shouldn't act like the Warclaw changed that, it hasn't. It just means people who have no mercy for someone who had no intention of fighting in the first place, don't always get their kill. Good.
I run with a small group of players and we still run from encounters that we know better than to take on. Running isn't new, don't act like Anet has royally messed up by not thinking of adding this stuff sooner.
Founder of Affinitus Nemus [AFNM]
"Join Us, We're Lonely" - Our Guild At Some Point
@Drastic.8920 said:
Please consider an ICD if a player was forced to dismount.
I second this, no player who is dismounted and can OOC (OUT OF COMBAT) really quickly like a dash thief or a Mirage with ports, should be able to mount up instantly. Please put a CD on it if the mount was killed or player was forcefully dismounted. Like 20 seconds or something.
Like that matters, Mesmers still have the capacity to out run people on mounts because they can stealth, teleport and move quickly. It won't matter mount or not, that mesmer will disappear and wait out the cooldown if they wanted to run.
Founder of Affinitus Nemus [AFNM]
"Join Us, We're Lonely" - Our Guild At Some Point
Why would we get dismount skill or break bar ? Is this one more case of going after vocal community of qqers ? Im sorry butlong time ago we had same deal with mobs in Orr, qq mobs kill me - nerf.
Mounts do have problem , but for sure its not on side of inability to dismount.
Quite honestly , every second spent on that is wasted second that could go into work on classes balance or even new elites.
2c
@martin.3692 said:
have you considered that wvw is just not the gamemode for you ?
Have you considered that it might not be financially viable to maintain a game mode for a fringe hardcore PvP community in a primarily casual PvE game, and furthermore, to also cater to a fringier "roaming" community? WvWers don't really bring money to GW2 outside of server transfers, and with Alliances, even that will likely be gone; all they do is eat out server resources daily, and then boast how they don't care about fashion, story, PvE and so on, and then their game mode is gradually dying in its own stasis field while the rest of the game evolves. Mount skins are at least some sort of profit from that section of players, and the more players are interested in these skins, the better - and to get them interested in a mount that's useless in PvE, they should find WvW enjoyable instead of frustrating, whether hardcore mode supporters like that or not. And that's also likely why WvW mounts were developed and released before Alliances.
As we have seen over the last weeks, the mounts cause little to no problem with larger groups and zerging. Even smallscale, once you go over 5 peeps you can easily force a dismount by focus fire and thus the enemy has to engage or loose people. Most zergs now choose to fully dismount before battle, as do guild groups.
A trap is pointless. No one will use it. Why? Because it cost supplies. No one will spend supplies to dismount people that will dismount anyway. This is as redundant as putting a reveal trap inside a ballooned tower.
The dismounting is only an issue in very small scale and random 1v1 encounters.
So Anet... save yourself time. Dont make a stupid trap no one will use 2 days after the novelty wears off.
I completely agree. I don't see much use in a dismount trap. Not only in zergs, but also when there is just a small group of enemy players attacking a tower or a camp the defenders (at least me and those who aren't afraid of a pixle death) usually directly jump in with or without mount and so all are dismounted and fighting, no need for a trap. I haven't seen any situation in which a dismount trap would be useful.
The dismount trap shouldn't just dismount a single time, it should make a 2000-5000 radius nomount zone for next 1-2 minutes. Or to make it more simple, everyone cought in that radius when the trap goes off gets the "Cannot mount" debuff for next 1-2 minutes. This should apply to both enemies and allies.
Or.. just make 2 different traps:
First dismounts only enemies and applies 30sec of "Cannot mount", smaller radius (around 1000)
Second dismounts everyone and applies 1-2min of "Cannot mount" to all players, big radius (2000-5000) to promote a fight without the use of mounts
Working on a new mounted skill to dismount other mounted players. This may also dismount yourself. We're still debating that. Feedback welcome.
If you guys thinking in a new skill, rather than adding the behaviour to skill 1, then should be a dismount with range, so you can actually dismount from lets say 1200 range, like a chain, its the only thing that i can think right now in order to not be forced to play longbow soulbeast.
This is the most important change imo, maybe i can get back into game with this change.
Ranged attack is the current plan. Exact range tbd.
If it's going to be a projectile attack, you need to fix projectiles. A lot of the time when I use either dancing dagger or throw axe at a mount, the projectile will stoot up really high rather than at the mounted user.
@martin.3692 said:
have you considered that wvw is just not the gamemode for you ?
Have you considered that it might not be financially viable to maintain a game mode for a fringe hardcore PvP community in a primarily casual PvE game, and furthermore, to also cater to a fringier "roaming" community? WvWers don't really bring money to GW2 outside of server transfers, and with Alliances, even that will likely be gone; all they do is eat out server resources daily, and then boast how they don't care about fashion, story, PvE and so on, and then their game mode is gradually dying in its own stasis field while the rest of the game evolves. Mount skins are at least some sort of profit from that section of players, and the more players are interested in these skins, the better - and to get them interested in a mount that's useless in PvE, they should find WvW enjoyable instead of frustrating, whether hardcore mode supporters like that or not. And that's also likely why WvW mounts were developed and released before Alliances.
Alliances and mounts are apples and oranges so far as development is concerned. One is a complete rework of the current system; the other is built off the rig of an existing mount. Pretty easy to figure out which is easier to implement.
And Anet should not cater to players who refuse to learn the mode they play, or they'll lose more players than they gain by making the gameplay so simplistic.
You won't need a mount to stay on tag if you learn how to push with the tag and survive. Nor do you need a mount to join a tag if you're not comfortable traversing the map alone since commanders waypoint and map hop often.
Basically I don't like the attitude that the smallest renewal is washed out immediately just because it prevents old behaviour - people become more open for new things!
To the entmount skill - sounds interesting, I would consider a short range of 300-600 appropriate, so that escape in occupied areas is still possible.
breakbar - I still don't know what this would be necessary for - the necessary damage to bring a player from the pet is my opinion completely sufficient. but as long as the breakbar can't be tilted by 1-2 players, yes, by me.
much more important to me are the bugfix things - that can't come fast enough!
Making mounts cc'able would honestly be a very welcomed change in wvw, considering how currently it's possible to dodge all the initial spike from enemy groups without any tactical efforts and just one push them with full cd's.
Also, could you change the leap on spacebar to a separate (dodge key) keybind instead? Some people would like to have a possibility to jump around while running mounted.
@martin.3692 said:
have you considered that wvw is just not the gamemode for you ?
Have you considered that it might not be financially viable to maintain a game mode for a fringe hardcore PvP community in a primarily casual PvE game, and furthermore, to also cater to a fringier "roaming" community? WvWers don't really bring money to GW2 outside of server transfers, and with Alliances, even that will likely be gone; all they do is eat out server resources daily, and then boast how they don't care about fashion, story, PvE and so on, and then their game mode is gradually dying in its own stasis field while the rest of the game evolves. Mount skins are at least some sort of profit from that section of players, and the more players are interested in these skins, the better - and to get them interested in a mount that's useless in PvE, they should find WvW enjoyable instead of frustrating, whether hardcore mode supporters like that or not. And that's also likely why WvW mounts were developed and released before Alliances.
First of all I never said I want the mount to be completely removed, I'm saying there are aspects about it that should be changed.
There's no such thing as a "roaming" community within wvw it is just an integral part of the game mode as a whole and the problem with the current state of the mount is that it just disrupts gameplay in general.
Warclaw skins are worthless especially when everyone are using the option "basic model" for all characters to reduce performance hit. I can't imagine them yeilding much profit
WvW is definitely not dying and surely there are ways to make profit of wvw without introducing disruptive content. The expansions themselves individually cost as if you are buying the game 3 separate times, everybody who owns a mount owns POF which is more profit for the developers then the mount skins could ever accumulate.
"The game outside is evolving" in general what are you ever trying to say ? That wvw players are a burden ? That the best thing you can do is pve and buy lots of skins and care about fashion ? Most people don't care about skins not just the wvw community
What are you even doing in this section of the forum if you despise the game mode so much.
This is no different then any other type of broken content that have ever been added - obviously it's going to be controversial and require rebalancing.
I don’t like the sound of the dismount trap or skill. The mount finally gave us a way to avoid pesky, cancer-spec gankers (perma stealthers and one shotters), and this change would undo it. Ofc gankers will just lay traps all over an area and wait for victims to troll - probably great fun for them, but super tedious for others.
One bug that actually needs fixing is stealth not being instantly removed when mounting.
Rather than a adding new dismount trap or skill, perhaps add dismounting to existing siege weapons. For example shield generator could create a no-mount zone circle for ~8secs which dismounts ppl, and ballista could get a 5th shot for dismounting (could also stun golems) (the projectile could be a rope with two weights at the ends, used to entangle legs).
@Zaraki.5784 said:
Trap is fine but the dismount skill is a bad idea imho.
You haven't even bothered to give an opinion? I wish people would give constructive feedback on why they think dismount skill is a bad idea.
Players are doing either the following regarding mounts which is why there needs to be an opportunity to dismount players, especially if you're on a mount:
running past each other entirely since who ever dismounts first is at an advantage
heavily favors ranged classes since if you engage on a melee class your enemy who is most likely still mounted will either troll you with mount evades or just run away laughing
hanging around like vultures not engaging in fights (literally being useless) because they want to fancy finish someone letting others do all the work for them prior
Hands down we need an appropriate way to dismount a player on a mount and as long as it dismounts both then combat can proceed as normal. I hope you understand this view point and reconsider why you think dismount skill is a 'bad idea'.
Well my only reason is because with warclaw I was finally able to run away from ganking class when they engaged me.
"Sticks and stones may break your bones but words will never be able to injure you!"
The Grim Adventures of Billy & Mandy
@Ahratan.1098 said:
I don’t like the sound of the dismount trap or skill. The mount finally gave us a way to avoid pesky, cancer-spec gankers (perma stealthers and one shotters), and this change would undo it. Ofc gankers will just lay traps all over an area and wait for victims to troll - probably great fun for them, but super tedious for others.
One bug that actually needs fixing is stealth not being instantly removed when mounting.
Working on a new mounted skill to dismount other mounted players. This may also dismount yourself. We're still debating that. Feedback welcome.
If there's gonna be a dismount skill it should dismount the attacker as well and have some way for the attacked to still avoid. By timing the dodge (which exhausts endurance) or another form of counter. Leaving the attacker dismounted.
Yeah I know "roaming". If I go there on a support spec and am ganked by a thief while trying to run I suck at playing. If I switch to mirage, fight back and hunt them down I suck because I chose a broken build ¯_(ツ)_/¯
I hope you also fix THE BUG THAT KICKS EVERYONE IN THE MAP FROM THE GAME AND PARTIALLY RESETS THE MAP
I'm not going to say what it is in the forum, because I'd rather not see people abusing it and get disconnected from the game every 2 minutes.
@Glider.5792 said:
The dismount trap shouldn't just dismount a single time, it should make a 2000-5000 radius nomount zone for next 1-2 minutes. Or to make it more simple, everyone cought in that radius when the trap goes off gets the "Cannot mount" debuff for next 1-2 minutes. This should apply to both enemies and allies.
Or.. just make 2 different traps:
First dismounts only enemies and applies 30sec of "Cannot mount", smaller radius (around 1000)
Second dismounts everyone and applies 1-2min of "Cannot mount" to all players, big radius (2000-5000) to promote a fight without the use of mounts
That would actually be pretty cool..
A trap that dismounts enemies and allies within radius, a big radius.
Working on a new mounted skill to dismount other mounted players. This may also dismount yourself. We're still debating that. Feedback welcome.
If there's gonna be a dismount skill it should dismount the attacker as well and have some way for the attacked to still avoid. By timing the dodge (which exhausts endurance) or another form of counter. Leaving the attacker dismounted.
Yeah I know "roaming". If I go there on a support spec and am ganked by a thief while trying to run I suck at playing. If I switch to mirage, fight back and hunt them down I suck because I chose a broken build ¯_(ツ)_/¯
No you're not just move with somebody next time. Yes you can play mirage as long as you want there's no rule against it, it will just be nerfed in the future
No you're not just move with somebody next time. Yes you can play mirage as long as you want there's no rule against it, it will just be nerfed in the future
@Silver.2076 said:
Basically I don't like the attitude that the smallest renewal is washed out immediately just because it prevents old behaviour - people become more open for new things!
To the entmount skill - sounds interesting, I would consider a short range of 300-600 appropriate, so that escape in occupied areas is still possible.
breakbar - I still don't know what this would be necessary for - the necessary damage to bring a player from the pet is my opinion completely sufficient. but as long as the breakbar can't be tilted by 1-2 players, yes, by me.
much more important to me are the bugfix things - that can't come fast enough!
This is a pretty fantastic point.
In WvW people get angry that their favourite gamemode is not receiving changes and once they receive changes to revitalize some of the game play experience, it is met with hate because it changes a small aspect about what they were used to. You wanted change and then proceeded to throw hate and insults at Anets competence because you don't like the changes because you want changes that don't change anything.
Founder of Affinitus Nemus [AFNM]
"Join Us, We're Lonely" - Our Guild At Some Point
No you're not just move with somebody next time. Yes you can play mirage as long as you want there's no rule against it, it will just be nerfed in the future
You kinda missed the joke I was trying to make.
an yes sorry about that did not notice i'm just on a frenzy here hating on people who don't get the true spirit of wvw
Removing the mount is not on the table. "But what about (other unrelated issue)" is also not useful in this thread. This is why developers prefer Reddit - irrelevant replies get filtered.
Ranged dismounts sound reasonable to me provided they're not completely unavoidable. There does need to be some counterplay to something that will inevitably be used for ganking, within reason. One of my major concerns with the WvW meta lately, separate to mounts, has been the amount of stuff you just can't effectively counter because it's either unblockable or spammed so fast that timing your counters becomes meaningless.
@Malfrador.3615 said:
There is a lot of server side skill lags since the Warclaw got introduced. Before, there were lags when all 3 servers fought each other with 50+. Now there is a lot of lag even with only 2 servers and less than 100 people involved in the fight.
Please fix.
Yes, address the LAG issue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Come play on reset Ben and see for yourself.
@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
Hey all, just wanted to put out a quick note about some upcoming Warclaw changes.
Short-term
We're working on a fix for the issue where people can get stuck on their mount, and still have their 3 evades and such. There may be more than one bug that causes this, but we think we're getting the most egregious one.
We're going to remove the jump on dismount. It's one of the biggest things used to bypass walls/gates and it was faster to remove the jump rather than try to fix each of those individually.
Fix to the sitting in box achievement areas so you can mount up in them.
Medium to Long-term
Working on a dismount trap
Working on a new mounted skill to dismount other mounted players. This may also dismount yourself. We're still debating that. Feedback welcome.
Even Longer term
We're considering adding break-bars to the WvW Mount. It's still a big if, as this will also require UI considerations.
Edit: Added cat box achievement fix.
In my opinion (repeat, only an opinion) if we will have a skill to dismount players, then the break bar on mounts is not a vital detail anymore. A separate skill with a channeling time is too complicated - I think the best variant may be to adjust the skill 1 to dismount a player if it lands against a mount.
The dismount trap is an absolute inutile add-on to the WvW. No matter if it uses or not resources to deploy. What is the follow-up after a player (or more) trigger a trap? They are dismounted. And then? They will mount again, no tactic or strategic advantage for the owner of the trap, only the frustration for the unlucky dismounted.
To have a follow up after dismounting a player using a trap you should stay araound the trap (you and your group, of course). This is a very suitable way to promote ganking. Not roaming - you should watch the trap, so in the same place . Or to place a lot of traps at the spawn point of a server during a large fight and to place a 5 man team waiting for them . ANet, please don't bring us another useless device in WvW. Moreover, with a good trolling potential.
The dismount skill may resolve the problem with the mounts contesting camps by running in circle while the attackers cannot touch the runner. May resolve ... but a better way may be to prevent the mounted players to capture and to contest objectives. Any intention from ANet regarding this detail?
@Lishtenbird.2814 said:
As a primarily PvE player who got back into WvW only because of Warclaw's speed and safety of traversal, I dislike the idea of a dismount skill. It will just bring back the ganking and have the trolls - oh, pardon me, "roamers" - rejoice, while encouraging the new WvW players to return back to their previous activities. Traps - I can understand; they require planning and cost time and supply, but not a ranged mount skill.
If it still happens, I would hope that other limitations are considered extra to "dismounts both players", such as:
being a fairly long channel that roots you in place (so that you can dismount someone who's trying to get into a tower by timing the skill, but not just gank anyone catching up to the zerg from afar),
requires supply so that it's not spammable without resupplying,
has a minimum number of players required to trigger - like, you can dismount a group of, say, 3 roamers in a terrifying AoE roar, but not a single scrub catching up to their tag,
or if that's a ranged attack like a thrown lance, that should at least be evadable,
knockdowns the player who used the dismount skill.
Otherwise the new mount's usefulness will be hampered even more - and it already feels anemic after the nerfs.
I don't know if you're trolling or not, but in case you aren't - have you considered that wvw is just not the gamemode for you ? Wvw for many people including myself is the only reason we play gw2 the last pve thing I've done was get to 450 weaponsmithing only to have a certain sigil on my weapons for wvw, I had not left the shiverpeaks for around 6 months now I only connect to either join wvw immediately or kill some ice wyrms while waiting in the queue.
WvW is not ment for people who want to get dank skins dyes or what ever it is you are trying to get by grinding camp guards, wvw is based around a concept of being a deadly battlefield in which the players who play in the most organised and strategic manner prevail - yes that includes "roaming" and "ganking" it's not supposed to be risk free to travel from point a to point b thus why so many oppose the mounts current state, as an un cc able armored race car with 3 evades which makes it impossible to roam or ambush anyone and that doesn't only hinder with small scale play it makes it absolutely impossible to intercept zergs, use mass stealth and combined with the glider makes it very easy to form an endless stream of reinforcement to objectives under attack causing the attacking side to be punished much less by poor organisation and tactics.
This gamemode is not about grinding up pieces of rocks safely so you could get your chest plate trimmed or god knows what it is you need safe passage for in wvw
I supposed players who likes PvP find it fun to gank players in wvw who are not good at pvp or who do not enjoy pvp and called that an essential part of wvw?
Why is running from point A to point B not supposed to be risk free? You are confusing PvP with WvW environment. And it's not totally risk free either, but at least we have a choice not to engage on a one to one fight. With all these nerfs coming to the Warclaw, yes i call it nerf, what good is the mount in the end? Gankers, not WvWer, are endlessly calling for nerfs, one after another, just because they missed their cheesy assault every time someone on a mount ran pass them on a mount?
At this rate we are going, we will be back to not being able to get to where we want without being knocked down for like a million times. Well, I agree that might as well go back to not having mount in WvW at all. Many Wvwers, old and new, who actually enjoyed Warclaw as it is now will eventually leave this game mode again because many are not veteran forum players < who come to the forum and cried for nerfs for everything when things are not going their ways.
The Warclaw is still very new in WvW, please give it some time and learn to accept, adapt and you will may change your perspectives eventually and find a way to satisfy that bully urge...
Comments
i do not support the dismounting ability. this kinda make it impossible hard for roamer they can be wipe easily by zerg. especially if u have use 1 of your player to dismount the enemy, if you have more numbers u will have mounted ppl chasing dismounted one. how is that fair?
you are aware that we can already set it to be private. ppl just don't want to restrict access, it is not that we can't.
Any changes to the damage of the siege pull? Right now it feels a little weak for the time it takes per pull. Obviously you don't want it to be the go-to instead of rams, but it feels like it has quite a bit of room left.
If you're gonna take out the jump ability, at least make the mount faster. There's no point in using it when the rest of your zerg can easy stay behind you without the Warclaw.
A skill to dismount someone? Might as well just remove the mount. I would appreciate some way of having less situations where people are just staring at each other on their mounts instead of doing something engaging, but this is not it. Having to damage the mount to dismount someone seems fair, but the mount has too much health currently for that to be viable to any but high-damage ranged builds or a thief doing steal+backstab
Except it's not. It may depends on class, but I'm not entirely confident of that. My necro, engie, guard, ele have mount health of 10972. My rev has 12069.
This really needs to be dealt with. Easy way to fix it is to give the person reveal on mounting up, then have the same kind of debuff watchtower gives where one can only be in stealth for 2-3 seconds before being forced out whilst mounted. So it wouldn't really affect groups that would mount up and take a veil for stealth, but would deal with those super-coordinated groups that will blast smoke fields far away then mount up with their 12+ seconds of stealth to go obscene distances to engage.
Are these changes going to delay the alliances? Or fixing real WvW issues?
It's the dismount jump, not the leap.
My Scourge has 12069(96? idr). Every other stream I've watched on Twitch had the same as me. Did you have all masteries unlocked on all those classes?
You haven't even bothered to give an opinion? I wish people would give constructive feedback on why they think dismount skill is a bad idea.
Players are doing either the following regarding mounts which is why there needs to be an opportunity to dismount players, especially if you're on a mount:
Hands down we need an appropriate way to dismount a player on a mount and as long as it dismounts both then combat can proceed as normal. I hope you understand this view point and reconsider why you think dismount skill is a 'bad idea'.
edit: fixed wording.
Everything is maxed. I have over 8k points left doing nothing.
Its your 10% rune buff affecting the mount hp.
Anyway, someone mentioned the trap would be good for "mass dismount".
Yeah, no.
As we have seen over the last weeks, the mounts cause little to no problem with larger groups and zerging. Even smallscale, once you go over 5 peeps you can easily force a dismount by focus fire and thus the enemy has to engage or loose people. Most zergs now choose to fully dismount before battle, as do guild groups.
A trap is pointless. No one will use it. Why? Because it cost supplies. No one will spend supplies to dismount people that will dismount anyway. This is as redundant as putting a reveal trap inside a ballooned tower.
The dismounting is only an issue in very small scale and random 1v1 encounters.
So Anet... save yourself time. Dont make a stupid trap no one will use 2 days after the novelty wears off.
gaggle - /ˈɡaɡ(ə)l/ - noun
A disorderly group of Asura.
"The gaggle of Asura tried to agree on whether a phase-shifted thermonuclear energy matrix was sufficiently powerful for a device capable of heating bread"
I think breakbars are a good idea (lol would be funny if they made them scale with the number of enemies around trololol)
I think it would be fair for warclaw skills to require supply to execute.
Sniff would be more useful if it revealed enemies to your allies when you used the skill....I can't really say I use the skill often in the first place, it might feel more attention worthy if it did a little more (ie. allies can see the enemies as well).
RIP little jump dismounts - I use it to feel stylish - please replace it with something fab
As a primarily PvE player who got back into WvW only because of Warclaw's speed and safety of traversal, I dislike the idea of a dismount skill. It will just bring back the ganking and have the trolls - oh, pardon me, "roamers" - rejoice, while encouraging the new WvW players to return back to their previous activities. Traps - I can understand; they require planning and cost time and supply, but not a ranged mount skill.
If it still happens, I would hope that other limitations are considered extra to "dismounts both players", such as:
Otherwise the new mount's usefulness will be hampered even more - and it already feels anemic after the nerfs.
This 100% should be top priority. People are abusing the hell out of this already, it's only going to get worse as time goes on.
yup.. I got a few thousand points spare actually.
Yup, few thousand spare points too.
I read somewhere it varies on class although I cant seem to find that comment at the moment
I don't know if you're trolling or not, but in case you aren't - have you considered that wvw is just not the gamemode for you ? Wvw for many people including myself is the only reason we play gw2 the last pve thing I've done was get to 450 weaponsmithing only to have a certain sigil on my weapons for wvw, I had not left the shiverpeaks for around 6 months now I only connect to either join wvw immediately or kill some ice wyrms while waiting in the queue.
WvW is not ment for people who want to get dank skins dyes or what ever it is you are trying to get by grinding camp guards, wvw is based around a concept of being a deadly battlefield in which the players who play in the most organised and strategic manner prevail - yes that includes "roaming" and "ganking" it's not supposed to be risk free to travel from point a to point b thus why so many oppose the mounts current state, as an un cc able armored race car with 3 evades which makes it impossible to roam or ambush anyone and that doesn't only hinder with small scale play it makes it absolutely impossible to intercept zergs, use mass stealth and combined with the glider makes it very easy to form an endless stream of reinforcement to objectives under attack causing the attacking side to be punished much less by poor organisation and tactics.
This gamemode is not about grinding up pieces of rocks safely so you could get your chest plate trimmed or god knows what it is you need safe passage for in wvw
Just bake the dismount skill right into the chain pull (when used on players).
Pull them right off their high hor-- cat. (And you.)
I don't know why but I subconsciously feel the 3 skill should be a pull when used on players/NPCs. I suppose I'll blame Mortal Combat.
~ Kovu
edit- Ah, I see that was already suggested but is difficult to implement. Shame.
Ranger, Necromancer, Fort Aspenwood.
All these ideas sound great.
The break bar idea, I believe should be limited to only showing up to a person attached to a door because being instantly dismounted by another player while dedicating time to using the warclaw as siege, it should have time to react like one in a sense.
Otherwise a skill to dismount other players would be a big and much needed thing.
(At the end of the day, if a person doesn't want to face an encounter and fight, they are going to run. Look at Mesmers and Thieves, they can literally teleport away forever and thats fine? So why is running on a mount that bad?)
Also, Mounts should be able to help your team mates without a mount and promote various strategies.
Having a mount and escorting a golem or a transformation/banner skills is such a slow process or people still without mounts are hugely disadvantaged. Having each mount perhaps be able to attach a skill onto a nearby player on foot to speed them up could be a nice addition. Helping fellow players while also creating strategies like having small warclaw squadrons to attach speed on to players to rush themselves into an enemy zerg quicker, etc.
Founder of Affinitus Nemus [AFNM]
"Join Us, We're Lonely" - Our Guild At Some Point
JUST LIKE THE LORAX, WE SPEAK FOR THE TREES!
Any way we can pick up seige weapon with a mount so siege doesn't just sit there idle when not used. 1(one) sick weapon can be picked up and dropped to deploy. With every use while mounted, lose portable seige hp. To compensate, mounts carrying siege can't dodge/dash or will travel slower as they are holding a bundle. Something along these lines.
Add the Breakbar OR the both-dismount-skill. But i think the breakbar will do the job.
How about just copying the Engage skill, just make it so if it misses it doesn't dismount the user? Or give it some bigger AoE to compensate the leap range.
[NUKE]
As if people weren't already running from combat before the Warclaw? People were and there wasn't a risk of running away then either. Look at the thief and mesmer, they literally have builds for running.
Just because it's harder to bully someone who wants to avoid combat, people are complaining.
I think it's better that people who would have run away anyway get to run, it's not fun being pummeled by an encounter you were already trying to run from.
At the end of the day, there was always people running away from combat and we shouldn't act like the Warclaw changed that, it hasn't. It just means people who have no mercy for someone who had no intention of fighting in the first place, don't always get their kill. Good.
I run with a small group of players and we still run from encounters that we know better than to take on. Running isn't new, don't act like Anet has royally messed up by not thinking of adding this stuff sooner.
Founder of Affinitus Nemus [AFNM]
"Join Us, We're Lonely" - Our Guild At Some Point
JUST LIKE THE LORAX, WE SPEAK FOR THE TREES!
Like that matters, Mesmers still have the capacity to out run people on mounts because they can stealth, teleport and move quickly. It won't matter mount or not, that mesmer will disappear and wait out the cooldown if they wanted to run.
Founder of Affinitus Nemus [AFNM]
"Join Us, We're Lonely" - Our Guild At Some Point
JUST LIKE THE LORAX, WE SPEAK FOR THE TREES!
Why would we get dismount skill or break bar ? Is this one more case of going after vocal community of qqers ? Im sorry butlong time ago we had same deal with mobs in Orr, qq mobs kill me - nerf.
Mounts do have problem , but for sure its not on side of inability to dismount.
Quite honestly , every second spent on that is wasted second that could go into work on classes balance or even new elites.
2c
Have you considered that it might not be financially viable to maintain a game mode for a fringe hardcore PvP community in a primarily casual PvE game, and furthermore, to also cater to a fringier "roaming" community? WvWers don't really bring money to GW2 outside of server transfers, and with Alliances, even that will likely be gone; all they do is eat out server resources daily, and then boast how they don't care about fashion, story, PvE and so on, and then their game mode is gradually dying in its own stasis field while the rest of the game evolves. Mount skins are at least some sort of profit from that section of players, and the more players are interested in these skins, the better - and to get them interested in a mount that's useless in PvE, they should find WvW enjoyable instead of frustrating, whether hardcore mode supporters like that or not. And that's also likely why WvW mounts were developed and released before Alliances.
I completely agree. I don't see much use in a dismount trap. Not only in zergs, but also when there is just a small group of enemy players attacking a tower or a camp the defenders (at least me and those who aren't afraid of a pixle death) usually directly jump in with or without mount and so all are dismounted and fighting, no need for a trap. I haven't seen any situation in which a dismount trap would be useful.
The dismount trap shouldn't just dismount a single time, it should make a 2000-5000 radius nomount zone for next 1-2 minutes. Or to make it more simple, everyone cought in that radius when the trap goes off gets the "Cannot mount" debuff for next 1-2 minutes. This should apply to both enemies and allies.
Or.. just make 2 different traps:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCeFWMeskOJhk8N-SvOFCJXA
Fractal speed kills, raids, Black Lion Chest Openings, random.
If it's going to be a projectile attack, you need to fix projectiles. A lot of the time when I use either dancing dagger or throw axe at a mount, the projectile will stoot up really high rather than at the mounted user.
Alliances and mounts are apples and oranges so far as development is concerned. One is a complete rework of the current system; the other is built off the rig of an existing mount. Pretty easy to figure out which is easier to implement.
And Anet should not cater to players who refuse to learn the mode they play, or they'll lose more players than they gain by making the gameplay so simplistic.
You won't need a mount to stay on tag if you learn how to push with the tag and survive. Nor do you need a mount to join a tag if you're not comfortable traversing the map alone since commanders waypoint and map hop often.
Basically I don't like the attitude that the smallest renewal is washed out immediately just because it prevents old behaviour - people become more open for new things!
To the entmount skill - sounds interesting, I would consider a short range of 300-600 appropriate, so that escape in occupied areas is still possible.
breakbar - I still don't know what this would be necessary for - the necessary damage to bring a player from the pet is my opinion completely sufficient. but as long as the breakbar can't be tilted by 1-2 players, yes, by me.
much more important to me are the bugfix things - that can't come fast enough!
Making mounts cc'able would honestly be a very welcomed change in wvw, considering how currently it's possible to dodge all the initial spike from enemy groups without any tactical efforts and just one push them with full cd's.
Also, could you change the leap on spacebar to a separate (dodge key) keybind instead? Some people would like to have a possibility to jump around while running mounted.
-Jursha
First of all I never said I want the mount to be completely removed, I'm saying there are aspects about it that should be changed.
There's no such thing as a "roaming" community within wvw it is just an integral part of the game mode as a whole and the problem with the current state of the mount is that it just disrupts gameplay in general.
Warclaw skins are worthless especially when everyone are using the option "basic model" for all characters to reduce performance hit. I can't imagine them yeilding much profit
WvW is definitely not dying and surely there are ways to make profit of wvw without introducing disruptive content. The expansions themselves individually cost as if you are buying the game 3 separate times, everybody who owns a mount owns POF which is more profit for the developers then the mount skins could ever accumulate.
"The game outside is evolving" in general what are you ever trying to say ? That wvw players are a burden ? That the best thing you can do is pve and buy lots of skins and care about fashion ? Most people don't care about skins not just the wvw community
What are you even doing in this section of the forum if you despise the game mode so much.
This is no different then any other type of broken content that have ever been added - obviously it's going to be controversial and require rebalancing.
What about lag and delay problems? Freezes and disconnects? These are more crucial issues for wvw than dismount traps or other thingies.
I don’t like the sound of the dismount trap or skill. The mount finally gave us a way to avoid pesky, cancer-spec gankers (perma stealthers and one shotters), and this change would undo it. Ofc gankers will just lay traps all over an area and wait for victims to troll - probably great fun for them, but super tedious for others.
One bug that actually needs fixing is stealth not being instantly removed when mounting.
Rather than a adding new dismount trap or skill, perhaps add dismounting to existing siege weapons. For example shield generator could create a no-mount zone circle for ~8secs which dismounts ppl, and ballista could get a 5th shot for dismounting (could also stun golems) (the projectile could be a rope with two weights at the ends, used to entangle legs).
Well my only reason is because with warclaw I was finally able to run away from ganking class when they engaged me.
"Sticks and stones may break your bones but words will never be able to injure you!"
The Grim Adventures of Billy & Mandy
That is part of the game mode wvw is not pvp
If there's gonna be a dismount skill it should dismount the attacker as well and have some way for the attacked to still avoid. By timing the dodge (which exhausts endurance) or another form of counter. Leaving the attacker dismounted.
Yeah I know "roaming". If I go there on a support spec and am ganked by a thief while trying to run I suck at playing. If I switch to mirage, fight back and hunt them down I suck because I chose a broken build ¯_(ツ)_/¯
I hope you also fix THE BUG THAT KICKS EVERYONE IN THE MAP FROM THE GAME AND PARTIALLY RESETS THE MAP
I'm not going to say what it is in the forum, because I'd rather not see people abusing it and get disconnected from the game every 2 minutes.
That would actually be pretty cool..
A trap that dismounts enemies and allies within radius, a big radius.
No you're not just move with somebody next time. Yes you can play mirage as long as you want there's no rule against it, it will just be nerfed in the future
You kinda missed the joke I was trying to make.
This is a pretty fantastic point.
In WvW people get angry that their favourite gamemode is not receiving changes and once they receive changes to revitalize some of the game play experience, it is met with hate because it changes a small aspect about what they were used to. You wanted change and then proceeded to throw hate and insults at Anets competence because you don't like the changes because you want changes that don't change anything.
Founder of Affinitus Nemus [AFNM]
"Join Us, We're Lonely" - Our Guild At Some Point
JUST LIKE THE LORAX, WE SPEAK FOR THE TREES!
an yes sorry about that did not notice i'm just on a frenzy here hating on people who don't get the true spirit of wvw
Removing the mount is not on the table. "But what about (other unrelated issue)" is also not useful in this thread. This is why developers prefer Reddit - irrelevant replies get filtered.
Ranged dismounts sound reasonable to me provided they're not completely unavoidable. There does need to be some counterplay to something that will inevitably be used for ganking, within reason. One of my major concerns with the WvW meta lately, separate to mounts, has been the amount of stuff you just can't effectively counter because it's either unblockable or spammed so fast that timing your counters becomes meaningless.
Delete this cashgrab and focus on WvW not some kitten mount and if not give it 1 hp and max 2 dodges
Yes, address the LAG issue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Come play on reset Ben and see for yourself.
In my opinion (repeat, only an opinion) if we will have a skill to dismount players, then the break bar on mounts is not a vital detail anymore. A separate skill with a channeling time is too complicated - I think the best variant may be to adjust the skill 1 to dismount a player if it lands against a mount.
The dismount trap is an absolute inutile add-on to the WvW. No matter if it uses or not resources to deploy. What is the follow-up after a player (or more) trigger a trap? They are dismounted. And then? They will mount again, no tactic or strategic advantage for the owner of the trap, only the frustration for the unlucky dismounted.
To have a follow up after dismounting a player using a trap you should stay araound the trap (you and your group, of course). This is a very suitable way to promote ganking. Not roaming - you should watch the trap, so in the same place
. Or to place a lot of traps at the spawn point of a server during a large fight and to place a 5 man team waiting for them 
. ANet, please don't bring us another useless device in WvW. Moreover, with a good trolling potential.
The dismount skill may resolve the problem with the mounts contesting camps by running in circle while the attackers cannot touch the runner. May resolve ... but a better way may be to prevent the mounted players to capture and to contest objectives. Any intention from ANet regarding this detail?
I supposed players who likes PvP find it fun to gank players in wvw who are not good at pvp or who do not enjoy pvp and called that an essential part of wvw?
Why is running from point A to point B not supposed to be risk free? You are confusing PvP with WvW environment. And it's not totally risk free either, but at least we have a choice not to engage on a one to one fight. With all these nerfs coming to the Warclaw, yes i call it nerf, what good is the mount in the end? Gankers, not WvWer, are endlessly calling for nerfs, one after another, just because they missed their cheesy assault every time someone on a mount ran pass them on a mount?
At this rate we are going, we will be back to not being able to get to where we want without being knocked down for like a million times. Well, I agree that might as well go back to not having mount in WvW at all. Many Wvwers, old and new, who actually enjoyed Warclaw as it is now will eventually leave this game mode again because many are not veteran forum players < who come to the forum and cried for nerfs for everything when things are not going their ways.
The Warclaw is still very new in WvW, please give it some time and learn to accept, adapt and you will may change your perspectives eventually and find a way to satisfy that bully urge...