Updated Upcoming Warclaw bug fixes/changes

[Karnasis.6892]

@"Dawdler.8521" said:

You do realize it's the exact same reason people keep saying delete the mesmer, right? It doesnt matter how much you nerf it.

Also what people are posting is suggestions, ideas and desires - not actual nerfs that Anet has made and implemented or even suggested in the OP. You're nerf raging over nothing.

Except it was a desire that people wanted a dismount skill in the first place and the devs caved. If people are vocal enough the devs will change it.

I dunno why we need anymore "suggestions" since once the dismount skill gets implemented, we won't need anymore changes. Anything beyond that and the mount might as well not exist.

[Dawdler.8521]

@Karnasis.6892 said:

@"Dawdler.8521" said:

You do realize it's the exact same reason people keep saying delete the mesmer, right? It doesnt matter how much you nerf it.

Also what people are posting is suggestions, ideas and desires - not actual nerfs that Anet has made and implemented or even suggested in the OP. You're nerf raging over nothing.

Except it was a desire that people wanted a dismount skill in the first place and the devs caved. If people are vocal enough the devs will change it.

I dunno why we need anymore "suggestions" since once the dismount skill gets implemented, we won't need anymore changes. Anything beyond that and the mount might as well not exist.This is a forum. Public forums are meant for this purpose. And yes, of course devs "caved". Probably because they took a look at how it played and thought... "yeah we kind of agree, this need a dismount". Anyone can see that just from 5 minutes of WvW. It's not even an argument of whether the mount is strong, weak or need to be nerfed. It needs a dismount, a way to

fight other mounts

, period. In fact, I see that as a

buff

.

[Karnasis.6892]

@"Dawdler.8521" said:

This is a forum. Public forums are meant for this purpose. And yes, of course devs "caved". Probably because they took a look at how it played and thought... "yeah we kind of agree, this need a dismount". Anyone can see that just from 5 minutes of WvW. It's not even an argument of whether the mount is strong, weak or need to be nerfed. It needs a dismount, a way to fight other mounts, period. In fact, I see that as a buff.

And that's fine, I wasn't arguing the about the dismount skill but rather using it as an example. But the amount of times I've seen "suggestions" that were blatantly aimed at nerfing the mount for some arbitrary reason is absurd. So I'm just hoping the devs don't change anything else AFTER the dismount skill comes in.

[Strider Pj.2193]

@Karnasis.6892 said:

@"Dawdler.8521" said:

This is a forum. Public forums are meant for this purpose. And yes, of course devs "caved". Probably because they took a look at how it played and thought... "yeah we kind of agree, this need a dismount". Anyone can see that just from 5 minutes of WvW. It's not even an argument of whether the mount is strong, weak or need to be nerfed. It needs a dismount, a way to

fight other mounts

, period. In fact, I see that as a

buff

.

And that's fine, I wasn't arguing the about the dismount skill but rather using it as an example. But the amount of times I've seen "suggestions" that were blatantly aimed at nerfing the mount for some arbitrary reason is absurd. So I'm just hoping the devs don't change anything else AFTER the dismount skill comes in.

And the forum suggestions were what encouraged the mount to be added..

It cuts both ways.

Where the mount ends up will be a uncomfortable compromise for both sides of the debate. Speed in order to get back to the fight, dodges for counterplay to prevent a solo from being ganked , and a dismount skill to allow counterplay to a mount getting a free pass to anywhere on the map.

(BTW, three dodges are too many.. of two doesn’t get someone where they want to be then it’s poor awareness... ?)

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@Strider Pj.2193 said:(BTW, three dodges are too many.. of two doesn’t get someone where they want to be then it’s poor awareness... ?)

Yeah I did find it odd they went that direction. The raptor only has 2 leaps, and I think everyone is fine making that work all over tyria.

Of course, it should be said that the 3rd leap is a mastery unlock, but /shrug.

[Lishtenbird.2814]

@Turkeyspit.3965 said:The raptor only has 2 leaps, and I think everyone is fine making that work all over tyria.

1 proper raptor leap in Tyria is worth more than 3 anemic kitten convulsions.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@Lishtenbird.2814 said:

@Turkeyspit.3965 said:The raptor only has 2 leaps, and I think everyone is fine making that work all over tyria.

1 proper raptor leap in Tyria is worth more than 3 anemic kitten convulsions.

True, that sounds about right, but only with Canyon jumping I think? It's been so long since playing with stock raptor lol.

[Cyric.7813]

For me warclaw its 3d hp pool that help you escape or get closer (melee build advantage)

Mb shared hp like mount utility from living story, or vulnerability to cc, or both or smth like that make it less imba

It should be only free 33% swiftness effect no hp no evades imo

[salvio.3248]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Hey folks!

I wanted to make an updated version of this post, given the recent release and a few bits of extra info on the progress of some items.

Short-term

• We're working on a fix for the issue where people can get stuck on their mount, and still have their 3 evades and such. There may be more than one bug that causes this, but we think we're getting the most egregious one. - Done 3/26
• We're going to remove the jump on dismount. It's one of the biggest things used to bypass walls/gates and it was faster to remove the jump rather than try to fix each of those individually. - Partially Done 3/26 - We know there are several other bugs that allow people to get a similar effect to the automatic jump on dismount. It's so far been a hard bug to crack, but we're working on it.
• ~~ Fix to the sitting in box achievement areas so you can mount up in them.~~ - Done 3/26
• Mounts will no longer be able to be stealthed. We felt mounts provide enough value without stealth and, as many have noticed, there were several visual bugs with stealth involved. - Done 3/26
• We know there are still several areas people can break in to keeps/towers or otherwise get to places you shouldn't be able to. If you find one, please don't post them on the forums. You are welcome to send them to me in a PM here or discord. We'll be fixing these as we find them. Many will probably be able to be fixed whenever we find a fix for the other ways to jump upon dismount.

Medium to Long-term

• Working on a dismount trap - Rough prototype is done internally. Still experimenting with costs, area size, fx, etc.
• Considering a dismount trick. Something that can be used with less planning and by players who don't have the mount. The user experience of using consumables during conflict is not the greatest, but it still may be useful for players to have.
• Working on a new mounted skill to dismount other mounted players. This will also dismount yourself and put both players into combat briefly. - Rough prototype is done internally. Going to need fx and we're determining how to unlock it. Currently leaning towards a new mastery. Determining if it should have a cost, outside of burning the cooldown on use.

Even Longer term

• We're considering adding break-bars to the WvW Mount. It's still a big if, as this requires UI considerations. - We have break-bars working internally with no UI. There is some debate about whether we'll still need this if we do some of the features from above. All this being said, there is a chance that UI considerations stop us from doing this. We could try some other solutions to make CC's usable against mounts.

help a lot takes the bugs, and the hacks when it will take ???good arena net for delivering the game to the hacks and bots because someone to give way is missing

[KryTiKaL.3125]

@Karnasis.6892 said:

@"Dawdler.8521" said:

This is a forum. Public forums are meant for this purpose. And yes, of course devs "caved". Probably because they took a look at how it played and thought... "yeah we kind of agree, this need a dismount". Anyone can see that just from 5 minutes of WvW. It's not even an argument of whether the mount is strong, weak or need to be nerfed. It needs a dismount, a way to

fight other mounts

, period. In fact, I see that as a

buff

.

And that's fine, I wasn't arguing the about the dismount skill but rather using it as an example. But the amount of times I've seen "suggestions" that were blatantly aimed at nerfing the mount for some arbitrary reason is absurd. So I'm just hoping the devs don't change anything else AFTER the dismount skill comes in.

After they do that, and possibly even with the addition of a break bar which might not be necessary, the mount will be fine.

Do keep in mind as well that when you start throwing around the phrase "Oh they caved" I feel like that creates an atmosphere where they are less willing to heed community feedback, which is something that is already lacking for this game. Granted not all feedback is constructive or even reasonable, but there are hidden gems out there that do fit into that category. I saw it with the recent balance patch, they actually addressed Mirage Cloak on Mirage and Silent Scope on Deadeye. Did it fix the problems? Ehhh on Mirage kind of if only to root out the players getting pretty hard carried by the lengthy evade duration and the nerf to Silent Scope didn't really stop the perma stealthing honestly...but at least they noticed and tried something.

[Karnasis.6892]

@"KryTiKaL.3125" said:

After they do that, and possibly even with the addition of a break bar which might not be necessary, the mount will be fine.

Do keep in mind as well that when you start throwing around the phrase "Oh they caved" I feel like that creates an atmosphere where they are less willing to heed community feedback, which is something that is already lacking for this game. Granted not all feedback is constructive or even reasonable, but there are hidden gems out there that do fit into that category. I saw it with the recent balance patch, they actually addressed Mirage Cloak on Mirage and Silent Scope on Deadeye. Did it fix the problems? Ehhh on Mirage kind of if only to root out the players getting pretty hard carried by the lengthy evade duration and the nerf to Silent Scope didn't really stop the perma stealthing honestly...but at least they noticed and tried something.

I think I'm more upset due to the fact if we had a test realm to change things BEFORE it reaches the live servers I wouldn't have gotten to play the mount in it's original form and having a blast, to have it all taken away because of very loud and consistent "feedback". Had it been done on a form of PTR I think I would have been more on board because it would be in an iterative phase of development where bugs/issues could have been caught and had no bearing on my live server game play.

On the other hand, I am of the mindset that devs shouldn't listen to the player base since as humans we are very fickle. And the last 2-3 weeks since the mount's launch on the forums has proven that on both sides of the argument of the mount (and that's not including the anti mount talk BEFORE it was even announced). If something is made for the game unless it is absolutely game breaking (like crashes your game or allows you to exploit) it shouldn't be changed. This is my opinion, and also I know that would just make me a bad developer (and why I don't make games for a living XD)

I actually don't even agree with balance changes in PvE because there will always be a dominant class/build in PvE, and we're just swapping it out for something else. In WvW however I agree with balance changes to classes/builds since some are just oppressive in WvW/PvP.

[KryTiKaL.3125]

@Karnasis.6892 said:

@"KryTiKaL.3125" said:

After they do that, and possibly even with the addition of a break bar which might not be necessary, the mount will be fine.

Do keep in mind as well that when you start throwing around the phrase "Oh they caved" I feel like that creates an atmosphere where they are less willing to heed community feedback, which is something that is

already

lacking for this game. Granted not all feedback is constructive or even reasonable, but there are hidden gems out there that do fit into that category. I saw it with the recent balance patch, they actually addressed Mirage Cloak on Mirage and Silent Scope on Deadeye. Did it fix the problems? Ehhh on Mirage

kind of

if only to root out the players getting pretty hard carried by the lengthy evade duration and the nerf to Silent Scope didn't really stop the perma stealthing honestly...but at least they noticed and tried

something

.

I think I'm more upset due to the fact if we had a test realm to change things BEFORE it reaches the live servers I wouldn't have gotten to play the mount in it's original form and having a blast, to have it all taken away because of very loud and consistent "feedback". Had it been done on a form of PTR I think I would have been more on board because it would be in an iterative phase of development where bugs/issues could have been caught and had no bearing on my live server game play.

On the other hand, I am of the mindset that devs shouldn't listen to the player base since as humans we are very fickle. And the last 2-3 weeks since the mount's launch on the forums has proven that on both sides of the argument of the mount (and that's not including the anti mount talk BEFORE it was even announced). If something is made for the game unless it is absolutely game breaking (like crashes your game or allows you to exploit) it shouldn't be changed. This is my opinion, and also I know that would just make me a bad developer (and why I don't make games for a living XD)

I actually don't even agree with balance changes in PvE because there will always be a dominant class/build in PvE, and we're just swapping it out for something else. In WvW however I agree with balance changes to classes/builds since some are just oppressive in WvW/PvP.

Well as you said that opinion you hold would essentially be "wrong" in that context and thats why you don't design video games, but also keep in mind that just because it is your opinion that doesn't validate it as fact, or even your personal "truth"; an opinion can still be wrong. Not taking shots at you for it, just making it clear that it doesn't really function as an "excuse" of sorts. Like if an opinion I hold is wrong then I encourage someone to convince me that it is and I have had some opinions I've held in the past proven entirely fucking wrong and I'm okay with that. Not to get too philosophical or anything but it kind of feels like thats what a lot of internet culture has issues dealing with. Someone holding an opinion possibly born of ignorance or lack of perspective and someone trying to inform them otherwise and they get extremely offended.

Humans can be fickle and they can more than definitely be emotionally impulsive, thats just how people function, but that doesn't mean all of the feedback is worthless or should go unheeded. This is especially the case in regards to PvP balance because, and no offense meant, Anets Devs aren't exactly...the most competent PvPers in the game, at least not from my experience.

While yes there is "feedback" that is less than reasonable or even just entirely fueled by someone getting salty I don't think that applies here. As someone who roams on a melee character with a lack of 3k+ Rapid Fire hits from 1500 range they do sorely need to address the issue and a means to addressing it is giving the Mount a tool to dismount other players. They won't take away the dodges, they won't take away the other skills, all they are doing is giving the mount something to actually balance out the mount itself. I cannot count how many times I have come across someone in WvW while they are mounted and they just don't have to fight me if they don't want to fight me, they stay mounted and run away. Even if I land the dismount attack they still skitter off. That is not healthy for a Player verses Player environment.

Things do need to change consistently in games like MMORPGs or really any other game that qualifies as a "live service" because devs are people too, they are not infallible and while they are probably very knowledgeable and experienced in their jobs they are not exempt from that definition; they are still human and humans are not perfect. So in some cases they might not consider a certain outcome and no human can ever ascertain what the future holds so they can't foresee what some balance changes might do or what an addition to the game might do. A hypothesis can be made, sure, but a hypothesis is a hypothesis because it is meant to be proven or disproven. Yes this is why they need a test server, I've asked this question before actually to one of the Devs directly and they said that they have technical limitations that kind of prohibit them from doing so. Maybe that will change? Who knows. People thought that build templates were probably not going to be a thing ever and Anet just revealed that they have been working on them.

[Ben Phongluangtham.1065]

Only a quick update on mount stuff this week: We're adding a 5 second cool down on the Warclaw Mount skill if you dismount/are dismounted for any reason.

[DemonSeed.3528]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Only a quick update on mount stuff this week: We're adding a 5 second cool down on the Warclaw Mount skill if you dismount/are dismounted for any reason.

This should at least lessen the frequency of vulture stomping [by the same person anyway]. I think the 5s CD before remounting is a step forward. Good to see some positive changes coming, hoping to see more soon.

[Randulf.7614]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Only a quick update on mount stuff this week: We're adding a 5 second cool down on the Warclaw Mount skill if you dismount/are dismounted for any reason.

WvW only I assume? I noticed the jump off dismount change affected pve too.

What is the need for it though. Surely if you are dismounted, you go into combat anyway

I agree some tweaks are needed, but im concerned the mount is going to be nerfed into uselessness soon if the trend continues - don't forget plenty of us love the Warclaw in WvW.

[Strider Pj.2193]

@Randulf.7614 said:

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Only a quick update on mount stuff this week: We're adding a 5 second cool down on the Warclaw Mount skill if you dismount/are dismounted for any reason.

WvW only I assume? I noticed the jump off dismount change affected pve too.

What is the need for it though. Surely if you are dismounted, you go into combat anyway

Very briefly. If you mount stomp, the need for combat ends because the toon you stomped is double downed.

What some were doing is hovering, stomping and downs, remounting and continuing the process.

[Strider Pj.2193]

@Randulf.7614 said:

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Only a quick update on mount stuff this week: We're adding a 5 second cool down on the Warclaw Mount skill if you dismount/are dismounted for any reason.

WvW only I assume? I noticed the jump off dismount change affected pve too.

Well.... it is a WvW Mount. That’s likely why the coding carries over to keep it different and thus, easier to code changes.

And... it’s a WvW Mount. Honestly, it offers nothing to PvE minus a skin.

[Karnasis.6892]

@"KryTiKaL.3125" said:Well as you said that opinion you hold would essentially be "wrong" in that context and thats why you don't design video games, but also keep in mind that just because it is your opinion that doesn't validate it as fact, or even your personal "truth"; an opinion can still be wrong. Not taking shots at you for it, just making it clear that it doesn't really function as an "excuse" of sorts. Like if an opinion I hold is wrong then I encourage someone to convince me that it is and I have had some opinions I've held in the past proven entirely kitten wrong and I'm okay with that. Not to get too philosophical or anything but it kind of feels like thats what a lot of internet culture has issues dealing with. Someone holding an opinion possibly born of ignorance or lack of perspective and someone trying to inform them otherwise and they get extremely offended.

Wasn't planning to use it as an excuse, more like taking a jab at myself :P. But I find what you say to be true.

My biggest issue from the feedback so far has been that the mount had been out for like, an hour and people were already posting listing all the things wrong with the mount and already saying what definitively needs to be changed. Some of this was kneejerk, some of it was honestly hatred for the mount in the first place, and some was just playing it but not adjusting to a new way to play. I hadn't even gotten to really play the mount until a week after all the initial changes had been hotfixed in (I had the mount the next day after launch, but queues were so high I couldn't give it a real test), but I feel like I missed out on some of the fun/unfun shenanigans. But after playing on the mount for zerg play and roaming I haven't personally run into many issues with both versions of play. But apparently it's not enough and people are STILL calling for nerfs.

Humans can be fickle and they can more than definitely be emotionally impulsive, thats just how people function, but that doesn't mean all of the feedback is worthless or should go unheeded. This is especially the case in regards to PvP balance because, and no offense meant, Anets Devs aren't exactly...the most competent PvPers in the game, at least not from my experience.

No but it just seems like everyone has the answer to balance without giving anything a chance initially. But that's just feelings I suppose.

While yes there is "feedback" that is less than reasonable or even just entirely fueled by someone getting salty I don't think that applies here. As someone who roams on a melee character with a lack of 3k+ Rapid Fire hits from 1500 range they do sorely need to address the issue and a means to addressing it is giving the Mount a tool to dismount other players. They won't take away the dodges, they won't take away the other skills, all they are doing is giving the mount something to actually balance out the mount itself. I cannot count how many times I have come across someone in WvW while they are mounted and they just don't have to fight me if they don't want to fight me, they stay mounted and run away. Even if I land the dismount attack they still skitter off. That is not healthy for a Player verses Player environment.

Well my line of thought is that not every class SHOULD be able to dismount other mounts. I mean some classes/builds shouldn't be able to do anything to a mount. I feel that random fights should still happen, but more fights should take place in objectives more often as people should be fighting over the circle as opposed to somewhere random on the map. However I also know that cutting off reinforcements from zergs is a viable tactic so fight swill happen anywhere.

BUT the big disclaimer here is that not everyone is at the same skill level, build comfort, etc. and I can see the appeal of a dismount option and I'm not totally against it. I AM however more concerned about the 1200 range dismount range.

Things do need to change consistently in games like MMORPGs or really any other game that qualifies as a "live service" because devs are people too, they are not infallible and while they are probably very knowledgeable and experienced in their jobs they are not exempt from that definition; they are still human and humans are not perfect. So in some cases they might not consider a certain outcome and no human can ever ascertain what the future holds so they can't foresee what some balance changes might do or what an addition to the game might do. A hypothesis can be made, sure, but a hypothesis is a hypothesis because it is meant to be proven or disproven. Yes this is why they need a test server, I've asked this question before actually to one of the Devs directly and they said that they have technical limitations that kind of prohibit them from doing so. Maybe that will change? Who knows. People thought that build templates were probably not going to be a thing ever and Anet just revealed that they have been working on them.

Yeah but then one solid build (nothing overly broken, just solid) gets nerfed because it's used more often than some other class. Those are the nerfs I don't like, and no I don't believe in the fallacy of buffing everything else to match. But I'm not naive, I know the community will find another top tier build and we start this song and dance all over. I think it's basically a waste of time and energy to balance a game like that.

However if it's a totally unbeatable build/class that has no counter play, sure, nerf away. But there have been times I am like "Huh, why?" to a change to a solid build that wasn't totally broken.

[KryTiKaL.3125]

@Karnasis.6892 said:

@"KryTiKaL.3125" said:Well as you said that opinion you hold would essentially be "wrong" in that context and thats why you don't design video games, but also keep in mind that just because it is your opinion that doesn't validate it as fact, or even your personal "truth"; an opinion can still be wrong. Not taking shots at you for it, just making it clear that it doesn't really function as an "excuse" of sorts. Like if an opinion I hold is wrong then I encourage someone to convince me that it is and I have had some opinions I've held in the past proven entirely kitten wrong and I'm okay with that. Not to get too philosophical or anything but it kind of feels like thats what a lot of internet culture has issues dealing with. Someone holding an opinion possibly born of ignorance or lack of perspective and someone trying to inform them otherwise and they get

extremely

offended.

Wasn't planning to use it as an excuse, more like taking a jab at myself :P. But I find what you say to be true.

My biggest issue from the feedback so far has been that the mount had been out for like, an hour and people were already posting listing all the things wrong with the mount and already saying what definitively needs to be changed. Some of this was kneejerk, some of it was honestly hatred for the mount in the first place, and some was just playing it but not adjusting to a new way to play. I hadn't even gotten to really play the mount until a week after all the initial changes had been hotfixed in (I had the mount the next day after launch, but queues were so high I couldn't give it a real test), but I feel like I missed out on some of the fun/unfun shenanigans. But after playing on the mount for zerg play and roaming I haven't personally run into many issues with both versions of play. But apparently it's not enough and people are STILL calling for nerfs.

Humans can be fickle and they can more than definitely be emotionally impulsive, thats just how people function, but that doesn't mean all of the feedback is worthless or should go unheeded. This is

especially

the case in regards to PvP balance because, and no offense meant, Anets Devs aren't exactly...the most competent PvPers in the game, at least not from my experience.

No but it just seems like everyone has the answer to balance without giving anything a chance initially. But that's just feelings I suppose.

While yes there is "feedback" that is less than reasonable or even just entirely fueled by someone getting salty I don't think that applies here. As someone who roams on a melee character with a lack of 3k+ Rapid Fire hits from 1500 range they do sorely need to address the issue and a means to addressing it is giving the Mount a tool to dismount other players. They won't take away the dodges, they won't take away the other skills, all they are doing is giving the mount something to actually balance out the mount itself. I cannot count how many times I have come across someone in WvW while they are mounted and they just don't have to fight me if they don't want to fight me, they stay mounted and run away. Even if I land the dismount attack they still skitter off. That is

not

healthy for a

Player verses Player

environment.

Well my line of thought is that not every class SHOULD be able to dismount other mounts. I mean some classes/builds shouldn't be able to do anything to a mount. I feel that random fights should still happen, but more fights should take place in objectives more often as people should be fighting over the circle as opposed to somewhere random on the map. However I also know that cutting off reinforcements from zergs is a viable tactic so fight swill happen anywhere.

BUT the big disclaimer here is that not everyone is at the same skill level, build comfort, etc. and I can see the appeal of a dismount option and I'm not totally against it. I AM however more concerned about the 1200 range dismount range.

Things do need to change consistently in games like MMORPGs or really any other game that qualifies as a "live service" because devs are people too, they are not infallible and while they are probably very knowledgeable and experienced in their jobs they are not exempt from that definition; they are still human and humans are not perfect. So in some cases they might not consider a certain outcome and no human can ever ascertain what the future holds so they can't foresee what some balance changes might do or what an addition to the game might do. A hypothesis can be made, sure, but a hypothesis is a hypothesis because it is meant to be proven or disproven. Yes this is why they need a test server, I've asked this question before actually to one of the Devs directly and they said that they have technical limitations that kind of prohibit them from doing so. Maybe that will change? Who knows. People thought that build templates were probably not going to be a thing ever and Anet

just

revealed that they have been working on them.

Yeah but then one solid build (nothing overly broken, just solid) gets nerfed because it's used more often than some other class. Those are the nerfs I don't like, and no I don't believe in the fallacy of buffing everything else to match. But I'm not naive, I know the community will find another top tier build and we start this song and dance all over. I think it's basically a waste of time and energy to balance a game like that.

However if it's a totally unbeatable build/class that has no counter play, sure, nerf away. But there have been times I am like "Huh, why?" to a change to a solid build that wasn't totally broken.

A lot of the time they do target the wrong things for nerfs or buffs and that can cause similar reactions of "Why?" and I've seen it many times over.

In regards to the belief that not every class should be able to dismount players I completely disagree with that notion. You say that it encourages people to fight more on objectives but the problem still remains that if someone doesn't want to fight you then they just don't have to if they are mounted and you can't really do anything about it outside of being a Soulbeast. They would just run up to the objective, see you and go "Oh nevermind" and run off. It has happened multiple times to me. Its not healthy, it also increases the amount of Soulbeasts in WvW purely because its the main contributor to being able to dismount people.

I've likened the WvW mount a lot to Black Desert Online and how mounts were handled in that game. Mounts are fast, and nowhere near easily catchable and damage isn't enough from any class really to dismount another player, however the game has methods in which to dismount other players through 1) A musket 2) A trap 3) A mount skill called Charge. These were in that game since the beginning even when people didn't have mounts with every skill that made them go at 100mph down a road. I saw a lot of the problems that BDO would have suffered from in that context with the WvW mount. Players just avoiding PvP because they don't have to worry about getting dismounted by anything other than a Soulbeast and maybe Deadeye. It makes roaming a less than fun experience, means people can just snag camps or try to snag camps and if they see even a single person approach as they have the circle active they can just mount up and run off. I've seen that happen too. Multiple times. Understand that "ganking" or killing an enemy or enemies before they have a chance to contest or begin to capture a camp can also be important as it doesn't distract other roamers from heading to that camp to check it and may also help in making sure dolyaks, if needed for supply at a keep/tower/garri, don't get slowed or killed en route by these players.

So I don't agree with that notion whatsoever that not every class should be able to dismount players. It means that roaming would get overly flooded with a single class that can do that otherwise you would just have people running around not fighting. You would also have a large number of players getting complacent and even more unwilling than many already are to improve as they can just "mount up and run away" and not have to worry about fighting ever. One of those moments I can describe is I saw this same Mesmer roaming around with the intent of capturing camps go and contest a camp see you coming and then they just mount up, or if you manage to surprise them all they did was go invis, teleport away and out of combat to then mount up and run off. Sure you get to keep the camp but this player just nope'd a fight for the sake of noping it and thats not fun...at all.

[gavyne.6847]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Only a quick update on mount stuff this week: We're adding a 5 second cool down on the Warclaw Mount skill if you dismount/are dismounted for any reason.

Good change Ben, smaller changes like these are much better than big ideas. Now remove stomp from skill 1 and add dismount to it, then we're set.

[Jaidy.1824]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Only a quick update on mount stuff this week: We're adding a 5 second cool down on the Warclaw Mount skill if you dismount/are dismounted for any reason.

GJ Adding a mount to wvw and nerf it to oblivion. Just remove the entire mount would be a better option.

[Klypto.1703]

The amusing part of all this is that originally these people whined about being ganked. Now the same people whine because they can't gank someone because of the mounts lol. Nerf the thief, then mesmer, then mount, just remove all classes and mounts from wvw and play super adventure wvw with a stick.

[Gop.8713]

@Jaidy.1824 said:

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Only a quick update on mount stuff this week: We're adding a 5 second cool down on the Warclaw Mount skill if you dismount/are dismounted for any reason.

GJ Adding a mount to wvw and nerf it to oblivion. Just remove the entire mount would be a better option.

I would like to put forth for your consideration the suggestion that perhaps you may be overreacting slightly. It's a five second cd. That's about as marginal a nerf as is imaginable. I can't think of any legitimate-use situations where this would even come into play . . .

[Glider.5792]

@Gop.8713 said:

@Jaidy.1824 said:

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Only a quick update on mount stuff this week: We're adding a 5 second cool down on the Warclaw Mount skill if you dismount/are dismounted for any reason.

GJ Adding a mount to wvw and nerf it to oblivion. Just remove the entire mount would be a better option.

I would like to put forth for your consideration the suggestion that perhaps you may be overreacting slightly. It's a five second cd. That's about as marginal a nerf as is imaginable. I can't think of any legitimate-use situations where this would even come into play . . .

People still dont seem to understand what the purpose of the mount is...

[Stalkingwolf.6035]

after reading all this changes. i seems like anet didn't properly thought out the implementation of a mount in WvW