[WvW] Double Shortbow Roaming

[kuteykathy.8123]

Hi all! Sharing some outnumbered clips with commentary and a dash of humor B)Available in HD for viewing comfort!

Build Link: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQJAVVn8lCFOhdmCGmCkmiFYCz7LcGaDzhwSYLULBEAKAA-j1xHQBKS9H2oLgX7PcQlfXUJIAuEAx7JAQKAq0pB-w

Edit: Build Link updated

[Turk.5460]

Nice video. Your build link has Impaling Lotus equipped, but you're using Unhindered Combatant in your video. I think you'd also get much more utility for your playstyle out of Trappers Respite, rather than ~1k Mugs in Dire gear.

[kuteykathy.8123]

@Turk.5460 said:Nice video. Your build link has Impaling Lotus equipped, but you're using Unhindered Combatant in your video. I think you'd also get much more utility for your playstyle out of Trappers Respite, rather than ~1k Mugs in Dire gear.

Thanks for that catch! I forgot to change the dodge when updating the old build link template :) Ah... the whirl combo days haha!

I've tried trapper's respite and while I like the additional pressure it can apply, I find that Mug on steal has saved me in some pretty close encounters due to the ~2k heal I can get from using it even while stunned.

[babazhook.6805]

Hve you cinsidered Runes of Aristocracy a try in that build? I was using anti-toxin myself up until i remembered I had these runes stored in my locker. Now you are in SB/SB and along with the DA line have plenty of access to weakness in your build. With weakness applied on dodge , on steal and on application of poison along with the blast field , you have ooodles of weakness coming in from Sb/sb.

You lose some cleanse but Aristocracy should get you ~500 condition damage with relative ease. This pushing your condition damage significantly higher.

[Krypto.2069]

Kuteykathy,

Thank you for posting your video! :smiley:I REALLY ENJOYED IT! WELL DONE! :+1:

[SecretNinjaSox.2348]

Nice vid. :) Would be cool to see you incorporate shadowstep for the extra mobility. Did that guy at the end log out? lol

[melandru.3876]

stopped watching after i saw the first fight, mithril rank spellbreaker with rifle that used two dodges in a row to minimal pressure? (1.08-1.10 min mark)

lol

it's depressing to see such bad players, on such high ranks

[JonnyForgotten.4276]

@"kuteykathy.8123" said:Hi all! Sharing some outnumbered clips with commentary and a dash of humor B)Available in HD for viewing comfort!

Build Link: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQJAVVn8lCFOhdmCGmCkmiFYCz7LcGaDzhwSYLULBEAKAA-j1xHQBKS9H2oLgX7PcQlfXUJIAuEAx7JAQKAq0pB-w

Edit: Build Link updated

Always a pleasure watching you fight. :)What have you been using since the DD changes?

[kuteykathy.8123]

@babazhook.6805 said:Hve you cinsidered Runes of Aristocracy a try in that build? I was using anti-toxin myself up until i remembered I had these runes stored in my locker. Now you are in SB/SB and along with the DA line have plenty of access to weakness in your build. With weakness applied on dodge , on steal and on application of poison along with the blast field , you have ooodles of weakness coming in from Sb/sb.

You lose some cleanse but Aristocracy should get you ~500 condition damage with relative ease. This pushing your condition damage significantly higher.

I haven't tried aristocracy runes yet, but it could be interesting with how quickly it would generate stacks of might. I haven't had a chance to really play on my thief after the DD changes, so I'll have to see how well it fits with my playstyle after the shuffling of traits and what I decide to pick. Thanks for sharing about this!

[kuteykathy.8123]

@Krypto.2069 said:Kuteykathy,

Thank you for posting your video! :smiley:I REALLY ENJOYED IT! WELL DONE! :+1:

Thank you for the kind comment! I'm glad to hear you really enjoyed it! :)

[kuteykathy.8123]

@melandru.3876 said:stopped watching after i saw the first fight, mithril rank spellbreaker with rifle that used two dodges in a row to minimal pressure? (1.08-1.10 min mark)

lol

it's depressing to see such bad players, on such high ranks

Just goes to show that rank doesn't always mean anything lol.

That being said, it's quite possible that the person was messing around with a new gimmick, was new to warrior, etc. Perhaps they're a very different player on a different build/profession. :) You never know!

[kuteykathy.8123]

@JonnyForgotten.4276 said:

@"kuteykathy.8123" said:Hi all! Sharing some outnumbered clips with commentary and a dash of humor B)Available in HD for viewing comfort!

Build Link:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQJAVVn8lCFOhdmCGmCkmiFYCz7LcGaDzhwSYLULBEAKAA-j1xHQBKS9H2oLgX7PcQlfXUJIAuEAx7JAQKAq0pB-w

Edit: Build Link updated

Always a pleasure watching you fight. :)What have you been using since the DD changes?

Thanks very much! Glad you enjoyed :)

I have yet to mess around with the build after the DD changes, but I'll try to post an update and some clips once I have some time to play.

[kuteykathy.8123]

@SecretNinjaSox.2348 said:Nice vid. :) Would be cool to see you incorporate shadowstep for the extra mobility. Did that guy at the end log out? lol

Thanks! Unfortunately I don't have room on my bar for shadowstep :( but shortbow 5 still offers great mobility

And yup I'm pretty sure that last guy did haha! :P

[Anput.4620]

So i need to know, this build has been ruined for me with the new "balance", how can you choose between endurance on phys skills +cdr reduce trait and cleanse on dodge? I use antitoxin runes and this has sucked away all the fun.

[JonnyForgotten.4276]

@"Anput.4620" said:So i need to know, this build has been ruined for me with the new "balance", how can you choose between endurance on phys skills +cdr reduce trait and cleanse on dodge? I use antitoxin runes and this has sucked away all the fun.

Honestly, I kind of like it, as I always wanted to run PI with EA. Been running what Kathy posted above, except with Carrion gear, and having pretty good results. The change may not be as rough for me though, because I just started running this build, so the CD reduction/endurance gain on physical skills isn't something I am used to anyway.

[Anput.4620]

@JonnyForgotten.4276 said:

@"Anput.4620" said:So i need to know, this build has been ruined for me with the new "balance", how can you choose between endurance on phys skills +cdr reduce trait and cleanse on dodge? I use antitoxin runes and this has sucked away all the fun.

Honestly, I kind of like it, as I always wanted to run PI with EA. Been running what Kathy posted above, except with Carrion gear, and having pretty good results. The change may not be as rough for me though, because I just started running this build, so the CD reduction/endurance gain on physical skills isn't something I am used to anyway.

PI is kinda bad though, does next to no damage with dire gear, compared to extra dodges 4s cd on your block and everything else etc.

[JonnyForgotten.4276]

@Anput.4620 said:

@JonnyForgotten.4276 said:

@Anput.4620 said:So i need to know, this build has been ruined for me with the new "balance", how can you choose between endurance on phys skills +cdr reduce trait and cleanse on dodge? I use antitoxin runes and this has sucked away all the fun.

Honestly, I kind of like it, as I always wanted to run PI with EA. Been running what Kathy posted above, except with Carrion gear, and having pretty good results. The change may not be as rough for me though, because I just started running this build, so the CD reduction/endurance gain on physical skills isn't something I am used to anyway.

PI is kinda bad though, does next to no damage with dire gear, compared to extra dodges 4s cd on your block and everything else etc.

That's why I was saying use Carrion gear. With the high mobility inherent in the double shortbow set, you are still very survivable, especially running Antitoxin. I admit PI doesn't do a whole lot of damage per proc, but it does add up pretty well when you can get multiple interrupts.

[Anput.4620]

@JonnyForgotten.4276 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@JonnyForgotten.4276 said:

@Anput.4620 said:So i need to know, this build has been ruined for me with the new "balance", how can you choose between endurance on phys skills +cdr reduce trait and cleanse on dodge? I use antitoxin runes and this has sucked away all the fun.

Honestly, I kind of like it, as I always wanted to run PI with EA. Been running what Kathy posted above, except with Carrion gear, and having pretty good results. The change may not be as rough for me though, because I just started running this build, so the CD reduction/endurance gain on physical skills isn't something I am used to anyway.

PI is kinda bad though, does next to no damage with dire gear, compared to extra dodges 4s cd on your block and everything else etc.

That's why I was saying use Carrion gear. With the high mobility inherent in the double shortbow set, you are still very survivable, especially running Antitoxin. I admit PI doesn't do a whole lot of damage per proc, but it does add up pretty well when you can get multiple interrupts.

Then you have infinitely less defense just for a little more damage, this is just massive nerfs overall really.

[kuteykathy.8123]

@"Anput.4620" said:So i need to know, this build has been ruined for me with the new "balance", how can you choose between endurance on phys skills +cdr reduce trait and cleanse on dodge? I use antitoxin runes and this has sucked away all the fun.

I'll be playing around with the build this week. The trait reshuffle was a big hit to the build, but here's to hoping a fun alternative or modification can still work :)

For now, running physical traits and keeping antitoxin runes is still going to be the closest to the old build, but much more vulnerable to condis :(

[killy.3278]

@"kuteykathy.8123" said:I'll be playing around with the build this week. The trait reshuffle was a big hit to the build, but here's to hoping a fun alternative or modification can still work :)

For now, running physical traits and keeping antitoxin runes is still going to be the closest to the old build, but much more vulnerable to condis :(

Kathy, did you see my comment on this build from the other thread? Basically stack Trickery instead of Physical skills for cleanse so you don't need to run anti-toxin runes. You also gain more initiative, with the downside of having the "burst" on longer CD.

I've been having success with it in spvp, but haven't really tried it in wvw. But in a wvw build I imagine it'd be something like:http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQJAVVn0MB9OhlOBemC0PhFYCz7LEHWCzfwTYLULBEAKAA-j1xHQBKS9nDq8jN6CuoSQA8EAi3lAwd7PAA-w

[Anput.4620]

@kuteykathy.8123 said:

@"Anput.4620" said:So i need to know, this build has been ruined for me with the new "balance", how can you choose between endurance on phys skills +cdr reduce trait and cleanse on dodge? I use antitoxin runes and this has sucked away all the fun.

I'll be playing around with the build this week. The trait reshuffle was a big hit to the build, but here's to hoping a fun alternative or modification can still work :)

For now, running physical traits and keeping antitoxin runes is still going to be the closest to the old build, but much more vulnerable to condis :(

How about ditching the cleanse trait and going thorn runes?

@killy.3278 said:

@kuteykathy.8123 said:I'll be playing around with the build this week. The trait reshuffle was a big hit to the build, but here's to hoping a fun alternative or modification can still work :)

For now, running physical traits and keeping antitoxin runes is still going to be the closest to the old build, but much more vulnerable to condis :(

Kathy, did you see my comment on this build from the other thread? Basically stack Trickery instead of Physical skills for cleanse so you don't need to run anti-toxin runes. You also gain more initiative, with the downside of having the "burst" on longer CD.

I've been having success with it in spvp, but haven't really tried it in wvw. But in a wvw build I imagine it'd be something like:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQJAVVn0MB9OhlOBemC0PhFYCz7LEHWCzfwTYLULBEAKAA-j1xHQBKS9nDq8jN6CuoSQA8EAi3lAwd7PAA-w

This also looks cool. But antitoxin feels a bit wasted here, the cool thing about it was that you could get 2 cleanses on every dodge, of which you have a lot. Also the torment on interrupt from pressure striking is a lot of damage.

[killy.3278]

The build I posted uses Thorn runes, not anti-toxin.

[Aufwiedersen.3529]

maaan I just found this topic, watched vid, super excited been looking for a condi based wvw thief build. This looked hella fun, scrolled down comments to find its nerfed lol dammit!

I know you said you were going to fiddle with it to see if something can still be made, please let us know if you do :)

Thanks!

[babazhook.6805]

@killy.3278 said:The build I posted uses Thorn runes, not anti-toxin.

I think it would be interesting to compare Thorns to Aristocracy in a double shortbow build. Thorns gives added Poison duration but you SHOULD get much more overall condition damage in an SB build using aristiocracy just becaus of all the Weakness adds. Now I am using in d/d SB build and quite easily maintain 12 stacks might albeit it can drop lower or go higher. This is generally while in D/D as I use SB less frequently. If you go s/b s/b you SHOULD have more weakness adds. I have not tested, as example , using a Blast from SB2 in a poison field for area weakness on multiple enemies. You should in theory get 5 might adds for each. (150 condition damage equivalent)

EDIT: there a one second cooldown on the Might kick in so no multiple might adds on single area weakness BUT you can still easily get 12+ might stacks

[killy.3278]

I did try aristocracy, and in spvp at least, I didn't find it very reliable. Thorn runes inherently has +125 more condi damage built-in, so Might is only worth it if you can maintain 10+ stacks. In +1s there usually isn't time to build up Might, and in 1v1 I can't spare the initiative to blast for weakness, or periodically spend endurance every 3sec to proc Weakening Strikes. Ultimately, while the Might can get high, it's frequently not available when I need it for bursting.

On the other hand, consider that a significant portion of the damage for this build comes from Choking Gas and poison bolt finishers, which are all low duration (2s) Poison applications. I find more often than not these tick for the full damage as people tend not to bother to use their cleanse on poison that doesn't last very long. So Thorn runes giving 50% duration increase is actually a significant damage boost to keep up pressure.