Are other healers viable in a raid?

[Rico.6873]

All I ever see are Druids and Chrono'sAnd sometimes a Necro scourge healerWhat about the other supports?Do those only have a spot on certain bosses or are non of them accepted and usable on other raid bosses?Was curios about them, cause I once used Aligade on Samarog with dwarf stance for the stability and we destroyed the boss easily (could have been carried so dont hold me on it)Since I saw that Elementist was given buffs so it could buff a 10 man group instead of a 5 man group in the balance patchIt made me wonder how other support professions would be in a raid and if we will ever see other supports being used actively in certain boss fights

[8235E844-3CC1-4724-8B86-45]

This game isn't scaled properly for individual damage do the most optimal healers aren't played. Druids and chronos are played because of the buffs they offer. 1 druid with a scourge and pack runes spread is becoming the meta for some boss fights/groups as is "Aligade".... Gl.

[thrag.9740]

If your going to have 2 healers, chrono + staff aura tempest is in my opinion the best. Why don't people use it? Well for one thing, if your only bringing one healer, it has to be druid basically. So not as many people have a heal tempest. In my static, I run heal tempest at the bosses we want 2 healers. Seems great. Just killed qadim cm tonight with it.

edit: sorry druid + staff aura tempest, derp derp

[RaidsAreEasyAF.8652]

@thrag.9740 said:If your going to have 2 healers, chrono + staff aura tempest is in my opinion the best. Why don't people use it? Well for one thing, if your only bringing one healer, it has >to be druid basically. So not as many people have a heal tempest. In my static, I run heal tempest at the bosses we want 2 healers. Seems great. Just killed qadim cm >tonight with it.

I really like to play it in pugs on scepter warhorn. Druids and Chronos in Pugs usually suck and with scepter warhorn i can extend some boons and provice 25 stacks of might and fury to the entire party. Scepter Warhorn (Heal) Tempest is the most fun build i played since Chronojail. You also get a sick 10 man Outplay button for stuff like qadim Breakbar or CA clap.

[Safandula.8723]

There are 2 good comps rn. 2 chronos+1/2 healers or, chromo+fb+renegade+ healIn both comps u should have at least 1 druid, cuz easy might fury, goe, spirits and all the cc, but other healer can be anything. Renegade for alacrity, scrapper on heavy condition fights, tempest for even easier boons and better healing than druid. Didnt see firebrand yet but it can work ofc.All healers except for fb gives some good effect, I like rev a lot, cuz ferocity, kalla elite, big cc, perma alacrity for 10 man coverage and big big healsDruid is just most versatile and u can easily pick 2 druids for fc and it will work well. Scrapper for example will be useless on most of fights, rev or fb, won't work on fights where it's hard to stack.Last time I see more and more ppl asking for fv/Rev in fractals and just for healers in raids

[ollbirtan.2915]

All healers except for fb gives some good effectClassic example of general community's ignorance about other heal classes. FB healer doesn't give any useful effects, no. Quickness, stab, aegis, protec, fury, might etc? I'm not even going to mention the shared Bane Signet through traiterd PI. No --- nothing of that sort at all.

[Safandula.8723]

@ollbirtan.2915 said:

All healers except for fb gives some good effectClassic example of general community's ignorance about other heal classes. FB healer doesn't give any useful effects, no. Quickness, stab, aegis, protec, fury, might etc? I'm not even going to mention the shared Bane Signet through traiterd PI. No --- nothing of that sort at all.

Nothing unique that can not be given from someone else. All boons can be covered in chrono/druid comp, while druid offers more offensive buffs(buffs not boons). Yea i agree about bane signet but it can be also covered from dh. So it rly has nothing special to offer

Edit:FB ofc is good but it can deal 30k dps in raid scenario while giving all things u mentioned, so it better to enslave rev to heal. Ofc fb can also do it but imo it's a waste spot and there are much better options

[Asum.4960]

@Safandula.8723 said:

@ollbirtan.2915 said:

All healers except for fb gives some good effectClassic example of general community's ignorance about other heal classes. FB healer doesn't give any useful effects, no. Quickness, stab, aegis, protec, fury, might etc? I'm not even going to mention the shared Bane Signet through traiterd PI. No --- nothing of that sort at all.

Nothing unique that can not be given from someone else. All boons can be covered in chrono/druid comp, while druid offers more offensive buffs(buffs not boons). Yea i agree about bane signet but it can be also covered from dh. So it rly has nothing special to offer

Edit:FB ofc is good but it can deal 30k dps in raid scenario while giving all things u mentioned, so it better to enslave rev to heal. Ofc fb can also do it but imo it's a waste spot and there are much better options

Especially Radiance Heal FB is pretty underrated for Condi Bosses. With the double condi Signet Share, you can effectively go up to 40 Stacks of Might with 50% uptime, while providing 25 Might base, perma Quickness, Regen, Protection, Fury, Retaliation, Swiftness and Aegis Spam, Stab spam/aoe stunbreaks, decent Vigor uptime, good condi cleanse and high healing output.

But in general I think it's one of the most underrated Healers in Fractals and Raids, even on Virtues without unique damage buffs, the safety and ease of play it provides for everybody else with Aegis, Stab etc., nullifying a lot of the mechanics and interruptions, often end up being a speed increase still.

There is just no point of running it in really, really good groups (aside from condi comps).The problem is, most groups aren't that good to make it not worth it, but everybody thinks they are.

[maxwelgm.4315]

The answer is a simple yes, actually anything which heals is pretty viable because there are no bosses with strict buffing requirements in this game. Getting people to play with you is the real raid, and if that's what you meant, you should stick to Renegade, Druid, Firebrand and Scourge.

[ollbirtan.2915]

@Safandula.8723 said:Yea i agree about bane signet but it can be also covered from dh.

You other comments aside, this one is just gold. First of all, DHs normally don't trait PI. And even some do, a DH in a usual pug comp would rather die than use active Bane Signet to 'waste precious personal DPS'

[Safandula.8723]

@ollbirtan.2915 said:

@Safandula.8723 said:

Yea i agree about bane signet but it can be also covered from dh.

You other comments aside, this one is just gold. First of all, DHs normally don't trait PI. And even some do, a DH in a usual pug comp would rather die than use active Bane Signet to 'waste precious personal DPS'

Ofc they do. Additional 200 power for 5 ppl on broken break bar is boost for party dps. If u don't do that, than it's ur thing

[Zenith.7301]

FB is an incredibly nice carry healer, just like staff tempest. The value of multiple aegis and the guardian supremacy on stability provision cannot be understated.

Honestly, this is a community issue, not a game issue. As long as you can cover boons, any healer will do.

[ollbirtan.2915]

@Zenith.7301 said:FB is an incredibly nice carry healer, just like staff tempest. The value of multiple aegis and the guardian supremacy on stability provision cannot be understated.

Honestly, this is a community issue, not a game issue. As long as you can cover boons, any healer will do.

I couldn't ve said better ! everyone stuck in the mirror comp.

[Lord of the Fire.6870]

Not really FB Heal became practical the default healer for Fractals its took a while to take over some are still seeking druid.(I can only speak for the EU server(s)) I search for both because there are still not so many out there . Main reason for the switch is you getting more dmg in fractals through the new instabilities and the new fractal Siren Riff. On top of old meta got so much nerfs its starting to get better.

In Fractal you can run FB Heal + alacrity renegade or chrono. The new fractal builds for them can be also found on meta battle. Alacrity Renegade is really hard to get some but I saw already some cm runs who were looking for them.

In raids its seems a lot of them prefer quickbrand(Hybrid FB) and heal renegade . I also ran with a scrouge as healer Siren Riffs the deff thanks to barrier is supreme and we had 25 might (Not sure from who) but that is all. I think its a good choice if nothing else works but a bad if it isn't needed.

[Iris Ng.9845]

Every healer has its place in raids. Comp is usually flexible enough to tuck in a second non-druid off healers. Despite what skill levels people think they are, pug groups come in a varied level of memes from greed dps to mechanics ignorance. That's where a second druid is simply helpless at bending backwards for the group.

Scourge heal is good wherever barrier and quick rez are required to help with oneshot mechanics: VG, Sloth, Matthias, Cairn, MO, SH, Dhuum, Qadim. Or if your group is really really bad and you don't mind hitting enrage timer, scourge heal will keep the group alive to scrape by. Full Magic or hybrid, the scourge makes a wicked kiter in Sabetha, Dhuum and Qadim.

Ele heal is good at blanket heal for 10 men in a big AoE. It's also good at stacking boons for 10 men (notably protection), better condi cleanse in Matthias and SH, and can pull better DPS than druid (scepter/warhorn build). Rebound is particularly useful in CA, Dhuum and tanking Deimos.

Renegade or Firebrand heal is one half of the firebrigade combo. This comp results in higher DPS for the group. Healbrand can overtake the tank role of chrono and doesn't require a druid babysitting in case of team splitting (Xera, Deimos). Heal renegade can hand kite for Deimos and tank any low pressure bosses, and a godly companion to the boonthief.

Boonthief is a unique build which compresses two chrono in one while surpassing the buff capabilities of chronos in a few encounters. Boonthief requires a renegade partner. Boonthief can also be made as a subhealer to squeeze out more DPS of the group by reducing two to a solo druid.

Heal scrapper is an uncharted territory. Its heal output is as strong as a heal ele. It can also stack boon and give quick rez. What makes it unique is the ability to give good block (for the Spore shake at Sloth), reflect, condi cleanse (Sloth, Mathias), a crazy amount of CC, stunbreak and superspeed (escort, river). It can also hand kite at Deimos. The drawback is it's harder to play well, and probably the most casual, most skeptical healer out of all other available healers.

[vermouth.3478]

@Zenith.7301 said:FB is an incredibly nice carry healer, just like staff tempest. The value of multiple aegis and the guardian supremacy on stability provision cannot be understated.

Honestly, this is a community issue, not a game issue. As long as you can cover boons, any healer will do.

This is very true. A healer is expected to give boons as well, not only healing. This is a main reason why a druid is the preferred main healer in many raid situation because this profession covers a balance healing and boons production as well as damage boost with spirits. While a druid happily maintains offensive boons (25 might and fury), defensive boons (swiftness, regen, vigor, protection), and damage boosts from spirits, a Chrono will provide alacrity and quickness with access to many hard cc, pull, reflects, and aegis/distortion if needed. This is where other healer classes may struggle to compete to be the main healer, not the druid's healing ability per se. For example, a staff Tempest is huge in healing and fast rezz with water/arcane, but struggling to provide fury if they don't take fire or air traits or 25 mights without using scepter/warhorn. Surely rebound now gives fury but it kinda negates the usefulness of rebound as emergency healing and it has long CD. Also, a tempest does not provide damage boost like spirits from a druid.

I think a Heal FB is quite close to be the main healer as it also provides very decent healing and boons (25 might only if using staff, fury, regen, quickness, aegis, stability, protection, and on-demand reflects, but it's better paired with an Alacrene to help with 25 might (so the heal fb don't need to take a staff), alacrity, damage boost from soulcleave's summit and assassin's presence. Can also have a quickbrand and a heal Rene instead or even both quickbrand and alacrene, but it's up to personal preference and skills, I guess. Have no experience with a heal scourge, but it's taken because it has unparalleled fast rezz esp with mercy runes variant, but it is lacking in boons production.

[Wisty.4135]

Staff Aura Tempest is my go-to healer unless we need druid specific things like Tides or Entangle.

[Henry.5713]

Druids are certainly optimal for the first healer position or solo healer position (when paired with Chronomancers) but almost all other options are considered to be more optimal for the second healer spot if you happen to need one. Which seems to apply to be most of the pug groups and a lot of statics who tend to play what is needed to succeed rather than a strict speedclear META.But then this is optimal, as in the best option. You were asking about the viability of other builds, however. Most other options are still perfectly viable for the solo healer spot (just not optimal and less accepted than a Druids) while they are already more optimal for the second position.

[ButcherofMalakir.4067]

Just remember that some strategies that are commonly used work with druid as a healer. I would say that 1 druid is a must (at least for might if not spirits) but second healer can be anything.

That beeing said my guild started using heal tempest for mathias 2 weeks ago and i would say kills since then are more smooth (this boss used to be problematic since its very punishing for new people and we have some beginers with us each week)This week we ran tempest druid and diviner ren + boon thief instead of chronos and we had cleanest kill in a long time.

Reason i amtelling this is that each healer is better then "standard" composition in certain scenarios but worse then in others. Pugs will always ask for druid because it is good for everything but other healers excel at diferent things but are bad at others.