SoulBeast Pew-Pew is out of hand

[Kylden Ar.3724]

The solution is simple, and the groundwork was set in the last patch.

1) Taking the soulbeast spec line disables pet swap- you only have top slot.

Done.

The problem is not that SmokeBeast rangers exist. The problem is that they can also have great sustain or chase/disengage on pet swap.

[Baldrick.8967]

@Skada.1362 said:

@CETheLucid.3964 said:

@Skada.1362 said:I run an almost identical build as this dude in the video and 15k longbow autos are common

So you're completely glass and per the video the best you're going to be doing is roamstomping randys of various skill levels unaware 1v1. In any scenario where you're the one caught out, you're the one whos going to be tasting the floor or running away hoping you can set up your combo somehow.

Also it'd be a shame if someone reflected your arrows back at you... or your teammates. Or dodged/blocked the attack of opportunity Long Range Shot. Or wasted it on Rapid Fire without the former's range modifier as most soulbeasts do. There went your cheese damage.

It's a one trick pony and the longbow variant is actually inferior to the axe/warhorn combo used in the vid. It's strong but it's not OP. It's a pubstomper. Any half-competent player knows this variant of soulbeast is glass and can be shattered and their combo negated in a number of ways.

Roflcopter, running that build you still have access to stealth on longbow, smokescale leap/warhorn. You also get passive signet of the stone, or simply replace signet of the wild for another signet of the stone. Oh and reflects? LEL like Soulbeast don't have access to tons of unblockable attacks. Obviously this build is glassy and you can make easy modifications to it to gain more OP defenses, unblockables or what ever the kitten you want. The point is that with the insane over the top amounts of damage modifiers available to soulbeast paired together with longbow it becomes the cheesiest kitten in MMORPG history.

Besides, there is literally no need to "combo" anything as 111111 on longbow will do just fine in 9/10 cases. The issue isn't just the damage, its DAMAGE PLUS THE 1500+ KITTEN RANGE. I got no issue with soulbeasts running up to my thief mauling me for 30k in melee. I have issues getting hit for up to 17k 1500 + range auto attack. Fun fun buff my thief shortbow attack to deal atleast 10k dmg please.

So now there is a counter to you appearing out of stealth and one shotting people whilst they can't move or combo down them in 0.2 seconds, NOW thiefs start to complain about OP builds? Fail, no problem, disappear reset fight and try again or disappear into the distance...

LOL, Karma's a bitch isn't it?

[Burnfall.9573]

By Loot for Life(Enjoy)

[SweetPotato.7456]

@Inoki.6048 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:All that needs to be done is to have the damage modifier from "Sic 'Em!" reduced either to 5% or 10%. Ranger in general has enough damage modifiers as is. It really does not need +40% on a single skill.

when I mentioned this earlier people were like "what are you talking about, bruh".

but it's not just Sic'Em that is the problem. Multiple traits that allow the Soulbeast to reach without Sic'Em over 4k power, 260% ferocity and 70% accuracy. that is the real issue.

this here is my soulbeast with bloodlust sigil, not ruins, without might stacks and Sic'Em, enjoy.

btw, we need a new mount.

Can I have your build please. thank you. and stop making ranger useless :P

[Creaitov.6328]

@Revolution.5409 said:

@"Skada.1362" said:Roflcopter, running that build you still have access to stealth on longbow, smokescale leap/warhorn. You also get passive signet of the stone, or simply replace signet of the wild for another signet of the stone. Oh and reflects? LEL like Soulbeast don't have access to tons of unblockable attacks. Obviously this build is glassy and you can make easy modifications to it to gain more OP defenses, unblockables or what ever the kitten you want. The point is that with the insane over the top amounts of damage modifiers available to soulbeast paired together with longbow it becomes the cheesiest kitten in MMORPG history.

Besides, there is literally no need to "combo" anything as 111111 on longbow will do just fine in 9/10 cases. The issue isn't just the damage, its DAMAGE PLUS THE 1500+ KITTEN RANGE. I got no issue with soulbeasts running up to my thief mauling me for 30k in melee. I have issues getting hit for up to 17k 1500 + range auto attack. Fun fun buff my thief shortbow attack to deal atleast 10k dmg please.

Wait, let me understand one thing, you are a thief player. In wvw you can use DE that gets 1500 ranges as a ranger the same dps as a ranger and perma stelth. Can you choose DD with which you have incredible mobility, 3 dodges and spamming at least 15k vault and request nerf ranger when your profession can do the same and more efficiently? it's fun xD

lol so many things wrong here.

• Deadeye has less effective range than ranger because they use a rifle while rangers use bows. Even if the tooltip says the same 1500 range, in practice rangers have a little bit more because of how projectiles work in this game. And lets not forget that DEs have to sacrifice their mobility in order to get this 1500 range by kneeling.
• In order to achieve a comparable ranged burst with DE you have to spam three round burst, which drains your initiative really really fast. For reference, using it twice leaves you completely empty unless you take trickery for extra ini. On the other hand rangers have all of their cooldowns except rapid fire to work with AND the weapon swap cooldowns as well, because remember thief shares its initiative pool with both weapon sets.
• DD has great mobility and evasion, I agree, but its ability to engage, specially for the staff daredevil you're talking about, took a big hit with the swipe nerf. Good luck getting near a ranger now :^)
• 15k dmg per vault? lol stop lying. Unless they were running some weird pure glass build or had access to outside sources of damage boosts, vault can't deal that much damage. On average it deals less than half of what you said, maybe reaching 10k after stacking lead attacks on a squishy target with little toughness. But its nowhere near to at least 15k per vault lol at least not without proper setup.

Rifle DE is pretty much garbage right now. I'm suprised to find someone complaning about it. If you're going to complain about DE at least complain about the stupid cheesy oneshot backstab build come on lol.

@melandru.3876 said:

@Creaitov.6328 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Creaitov.6328 said:

@Mokk.2397 said:

@RisenHowl.2419 said:

@Mokk.2397 said:What's out of hand is the Scourge ,Firebrand Meta .And your just Mad because people found a way to upset that precious meta .Its not the SB that's over powered it that you are under armored. Dump the Meta and put some cloths on . I want to see more Soul beasts in WvW so we can trash this ridiculous Scourge bomb Boon share Meta . You accuse Rangers of the least effort for the reward ? Look in the mirror .Scourge , Firebrand, Holosmith and Mirage take the least effort in game .Rangers/Soul Beast have to dump every thing into power and precision with little defense and no chance of survival if they mess up the skill chain.And that's just to crack the defenses of the current Meta cheese builds .Ya that's right , the current Meta is total cheese at the highest level this game has ever encountered .I'm proud of all the rangers, soul beast and druids out there because at least they have to use a great deal of effort and skill to play decently.So kitten you and the horse you rode in on !

Check out the videos, if you think hitting for 50k+ means "run more armor" you need a better grasp of how math works. That would one shot anyone.

You can also see all of the mobility and invulns, that should not be available to a class that hits that hard.

Sic em needs dropped to 10%

You cant go by that video because its completely one sided .What are the opponents wearing?Who knows ? Just looking at it I can see they're probably not wearing hardly any armor at all.And they.er not trying to retaliate,attack or even run away which leaves me to believe all the opponents are inexperienced and unequipped.Probably PVE noobs .That's the problem with these videos being used as definitive evidence they're BIASED . I can tell you from experience that that kind of damage is impossible against experienced well equipped opponents.Other classes have far more invuls ,evades and mobility than a soulbeast does by far.So please stop covering over the facts with BS.All you have to support your argument is an edited single sided video that some kitten put together to get Youtube hits.You need to get a grasp on reality!

I guess if you aren't able to react fast enough against someone who can burst you down in a couple seconds at ~1800 range, sometimes with the help from stealth, you're a PvE noob now huh? :^)

Sure, the guy in the video is running a extremely cheese build, but that doesn't mean this is not a problem.

@ProverbsofHell.2307 said:The only problem with Soulbeast, is the arrow trajectory exceeding 1500 range into 1800 range.

Player character skills that exceed 1500 range are broken. The game wasn't designed with that in mind. You can kite 1500 range with dodges etc, but 1800 range is RIP.

THIS. Guns follow the rules and their projectiles don't go past the range in the tooltip, while bows for some reason are able to go a little bit past their supposed max range.

You literally dodge it and they don't die. Whenever i play vs a necro or core ele etc they die to it but when it is a core war or thief they suddenly know how to dodge it twice and counterattack hmmmm.....

Am I the only one who thinks this is wrong? That having skills in the game that force you to dodge twice or pop an invuln/teleport or else you die is not ok?

looks at new arc divider

lol

Also dodging doesn't solve the 1800~ range problem. Considering most teleports and gapclosers have a range of 1200 you're still short by a considerable amount if you decide to retaliate (but I guess you could use those to escape maybe? I dunno).

@melandru.3876 said:

@CETheLucid.3964 said:

@"Skada.1362" said:I run an almost identical build as this dude in the video and 15k longbow autos are common

So you're completely glass and per the video the best you're going to be doing is roamstomping randys of various skill levels unaware 1v1. In any scenario where you're the one caught out, you're the one whos going to be tasting the floor or running away hoping you can set up your combo somehow.

Also it'd be a shame if someone reflected your arrows back at you... or your teammates. Or dodged/blocked the attack of opportunity Long Range Shot. Or wasted it on Rapid Fire without the former's range modifier as most soulbeasts do. There went your cheese damage.

It's a one trick pony and the longbow variant is actually inferior to the axe/warhorn combo used in the vid. It's strong but it's not OP. It's a pubstomper. Any half-competent player knows this variant of soulbeast is glass and can be shattered and their combo negated in a number of ways.

yeah because soulbeast have no 4 sec unblockable trait on a 10 sec cooldownso what burst exactly are you gonna reflect/block?

if an auto attack hit you for 15k allready, and the average wvw'er has 20-25k health can you imagine?

Speaking of the unblockable trait, doesn't it also proc from dismounting from the warclaw?

i have honnestly no idea (i plat boobeast if i go ranger) what does happen on dismount (both wvw and pve) is the merge animation when you dismountnot sure if it triggers unstoppable union, i don't think so as technically you were allready in beastmode

I don't play ranger so I can't personally check and confirm this, but that's what I've been told before. I agree that it shouldn't trigger but sometimes spaghetti code happens. According to the wiki, when you dismount it doesn't actually preserve beastmode but instead you instantly reenter it, so it would make sense for the traits to trigger. (https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Beastmode , check the latest change notes).

@aspirine.5839 said:How about less range but slightly more damage.. that will stop some of the pew pew and rangers can still get the kill but need to be closer for it to work.

The problem with this is that in order to do that you would need to nerf longbow, a core weapon, and as much as I hate getting deleted from long range I'd rather see soulbeast get nerfed rather than core ranger. Maybe change some traits so they are slightly weaker baseline but get bonuses in medium to close range similar to how daredevil gets bonuses when staying in melee range.

[RisenHowl.2419]

yeah, slb is fine. the insane damage modifiers don't need looked at, no sir!

[Emberheart.8426]

@"RisenHowl.2419" said:

yeah, slb is fine. the insane damage modifiers don't need looked at, no sir!

Those warclaw 1-shots are legit. Very good balance right there

[Shroud.2307]

@"RisenHowl.2419" said:

yeah, slb is fine. the insane damage modifiers don't need looked at, no sir!

Requires 2 whole trait lines and 3 - 4 skills to be pre-cast. It's called a gimmick. If it kills you twice it's on you, not them. Deadeye was a different story since you could never anticipate the damage with 100% accuracy.

Soulbeast isn't the only thing capable of one shots and there are various builds in most professions capable of multi-hit "one shots" (eg. Fresh Air Weaver, Static Discharge Holosmith, etc.). Heck, True Shot is basically Rapid Fire condensed in to a single skill if the Dragonhunter is glassy. I've been hit by that skill for 16k before.

I'll keep bumping my initial suggestion to change the way "Sic 'Em!" interacts with the Ranger. It is the main culprit in it's damage. If it's still problematic after changing this skill, other things can be addressed.

I'm not disagreeing that Soulbeast is overtuned and low risk, but that players need to stop dismissing their own skill/awareness and using meme videos as an argument for why it should be gutted.

[Dashingsteel.3410]

I don't get it... If soulbeast is sooo overtuned why isn't it the most represented profession in wvw?? I never hear anyone say leave the map and come back as a soulbeast. Nope, not once.

Its always we need fbs and scourges. If soulbeast was so overtuned and game breaking I guarantee commanders would be exploiting it.

[Creaitov.6328]

@Dashingsteel.3410 said:I don't get it... If soulbeast is sooo overtuned why isn't it the most represented profession in wvw?? I never hear anyone say leave the map and come back as a soulbeast. Nope, not once.

Its always we need fbs and scourges. If soulbeast was so overtuned and game breaking I guarantee commanders would be exploiting it.

Because not everything revolves around zergs lol.

This is like asking why you never see scourges solo roaming despite them being wanted by every commander.

[Dashingsteel.3410]

@Creaitov.6328 said:

@Dashingsteel.3410 said:I don't get it... If soulbeast is sooo overtuned why isn't it the most represented profession in wvw?? I never hear anyone say leave the map and come back as a soulbeast. Nope, not once.

Its always we need fbs and scourges. If soulbeast was so overtuned and game breaking I guarantee commanders would be exploiting it.

Because not everything revolves around zergs lol.

This is like asking why you never see scourges solo roaming despite them being wanted by every commander.

I still say that soulbeast isn't the problem in wvw. It's the aoe classes.

I think mirage is just as overtuned as soulbeast.

[Revolution.5409]

@Creaitov.6328 said:lol so many things wrong here.

• Deadeye has less effective range than ranger because they use a rifle while rangers use bows. Even if the tooltip says the same 1500 range, in practice rangers have a little bit more because of how projectiles work in this game. And lets not forget that DEs have to sacrifice their mobility in order to get this 1500 range by kneeling.
• In order to achieve a comparable ranged burst with DE you have to spam three round burst, which drains your initiative really really fast. For reference, using it twice leaves you completely empty unless you take trickery for extra ini. On the other hand rangers have all of their cooldowns except rapid fire to work with AND the weapon swap cooldowns as well, because remember thief shares its initiative pool with both weapon sets.
• DD has great mobility and evasion, I agree, but its ability to engage, specially for the staff daredevil you're talking about, took a big hit with the swipe nerf. Good luck getting near a ranger now :^)
• 15k dmg per vault? lol stop lying. Unless they were running some weird pure glass build or had access to outside sources of damage boosts, vault can't deal that much damage. On average it deals less than half of what you said, maybe reaching 10k after stacking lead attacks on a squishy target with little toughness. But its nowhere near to at least 15k per vault lol at least not without proper setup.

Rifle DE is pretty much garbage right now. I'm suprised to find someone complaning about it. If you're going to complain about DE at least complain about the stupid cheesy oneshot backstab build come on lol.

Not only rangers can have a higher range, even shortbow thieves can have 2k range, some elementalist skills etc .. and this is something that should be corrected and I agree.

Kneeling is not a loss of mobility when you choose when to fight.

The second point I honestly do not understand, the mechanics of the thief is always based on initiative and that of rangers on CD, if you want a different thief you do not want thief, you will never get the same results in using thief as a SB and it seems right.

Why should I lie? I'm not that kind of person. By using a berserker set and Assassin's Signet I can get that damage, you should try it yourself.

@Creaitov.6328 said:Because not everything revolves around zergs lol.

This is like asking why you never see scourges solo roaming despite them being wanted by every commander.

Everything revolves around the zergs in a game mode designed for big fights, wvw is not pvp.And anyway since the introduction of warclaw, there are many scourges that play as roamers having no more trouble moving quickly.

[spectrito.8513]

@Revolution.5409 said:

Everything revolves around the zergs in a game mode designed for big fights, wvw is not pvp.And anyway since the introduction of warclaw, there are many scourges that play as roamers having no more trouble moving quickly.

So If WvW is designed for big fights why are Scourges roaming ?Also if its designed to big fights why servers cant handle big fights ?

@Revolution.5409 said:wvw is not pvp.Wat ?

[Nimon.7840]

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:All that needs to be done is to have the damage modifier from "Sic 'Em!" reduced either to 5% or 10%. Ranger in general has enough damage modifiers as is. It really does not need +40% on a single skill.

To be fair I think some treatment like scourge would be good enough. Normally sic em just improves pet dmg. And the problem is that sic em works on the soulbeast while in beastmode. So only nerf sic em for beastmode would be good enough I think.

So while in beastmode the bonus of sic em is just 5-10%. Or maybe even only for soulbeast in general.Like they did it with path of corruption trait that only corrupts 1 boon instead of 2 on shroud ability2, when scourge is slotted

I assure you, coming from someone with years of Ranger experience, that without that skill the damage is significantly less. Don't neuter the spec just because people like to wall hug and meme with it. Focus on what's actually the problem.

Similar issue with Scrappers, it's primarily Bulwark Gyro that's the culprit. It provides an absurd amount of Barrier. As Jawgeous aptly put it, the "I win" button. Mind you, it doesn't exactly delete your character when they press it but, it's pretty well a full fight reset so I'd say the statement is valid.

I think in regards to Ranger, it struggles for a place in WvW and a sniper is where it fits. Because everything has so much damage mitigation in zergs, the only way it can have any impact is to pump out an equally ridiculous amount of damage. Unfortunately for anything that isn't a support spec or with their zerg getting that support, that means they'll blow up in 0.5 seconds. It's a hard thing to balance. If it's damage is reduced too much, Soulbeast becomes near meaningless to use and has no impact in large/medium scale combat anymore. If it's damage is left as is, it remains a braindead cheese spec that farms people who are equally as braindead.

[Revolution.5409]

@spectrito.8513 said:

@Revolution.5409 said:

Everything revolves around the zergs in a game mode designed for big fights, wvw is not pvp.And anyway since the introduction of warclaw, there are many scourges that play as roamers having no more trouble moving quickly.

So If WvW is designed for big fights why are Scourges roaming ?Also if its designed to big fights why servers cant handle big fights ?

@Revolution.5409 said:wvw is not pvp.Wat ?

People are not obliged to follow a commander, but this does not mean WvW works differently, at the end of the week if you want your server to win, cooperation between people is necessary, you can't hope to win a matchup just by conquering villages and killing some pugs.

If to manage, you mean lags and delay the cause is the graphics engine of the game that is quite old now, would need an update.

There are different equipment values in PvP, different amount of statistics, different possibilities of statistics, different mechanics of traits, no enhancement of stat or nourishment in PvP, no mount, Druid is completely different between pvp / wvw to give an example, also the way you win is different.I would say yes, wvw and spvp are totally different.

[Skada.1362]

@Baldrick.8967 said:

@Skada.1362 said:

@CETheLucid.3964 said:

@Skada.1362 said:I run an almost identical build as this dude in the video and 15k longbow autos are common

So you're completely glass and per the video the best you're going to be doing is roamstomping randys of various skill levels unaware 1v1. In any scenario where you're the one caught out, you're the one whos going to be tasting the floor or running away hoping you can set up your combo somehow.

Also it'd be a shame if someone reflected your arrows back at you... or your teammates. Or dodged/blocked the attack of opportunity Long Range Shot. Or wasted it on Rapid Fire without the former's range modifier as most soulbeasts do. There went your cheese damage.

It's a one trick pony and the longbow variant is actually inferior to the axe/warhorn combo used in the vid. It's strong but it's not OP. It's a pubstomper. Any half-competent player knows this variant of soulbeast is glass and can be shattered and their combo negated in a number of ways.

Roflcopter, running that build you still have access to stealth on longbow, smokescale leap/warhorn. You also get passive signet of the stone, or simply replace signet of the wild for another signet of the stone. Oh and reflects? LEL like Soulbeast don't have access to tons of unblockable attacks. Obviously this build is glassy and you can make easy modifications to it to gain more OP defenses, unblockables or what ever the kitten you want. The point is that with the insane over the top amounts of damage modifiers available to soulbeast paired together with longbow it becomes the cheesiest kitten in MMORPG history.

Besides, there is literally no need to "combo" anything as 111111 on longbow will do just fine in 9/10 cases. The issue isn't just the damage, its DAMAGE PLUS THE 1500+ KITTEN RANGE. I got no issue with soulbeasts running up to my thief mauling me for 30k in melee. I have issues getting hit for up to 17k 1500 + range auto attack. Fun fun buff my thief shortbow attack to deal atleast 10k dmg please.

So now there is a counter to you appearing out of stealth and one shotting people whilst they can't move or combo down them in 0.2 seconds, NOW thiefs start to complain about OP builds? Fail, no problem, disappear reset fight and try again or disappear into the distance...

LOL, Karma's a kitten isn't it?

Yeah cuz core s/d thief 1 shots people. Besides Thief is just one of the classes I play, I even play Soulbeast myself because why wouldn't I? The builds in the video I posted earlier is absurdly broken. If you think 15k + unblockable/revealed auto attacks from over 1500 range is even remotley healthy for WvW then you are either new to the game or braindead.

Also, the old d/p Daredevil got rekt in the last patch due to Steal becoming Swipe so no need to worry about Daredevils 1 shot backstabbing you anymore, Deadeyes stealth uptime got neutered with trait nerfs, also add 30 second "Marked" from sentries, guard tower etc etc. I supported the perma stealth nerfs simply because it was unfun to fight against and very bad for the game. YOU clearly aren't very objective !

[alain.1659]

I just tried soulbeast myself. As a previous ranger main before PoF, i found it really easy to play yet hard to master as every profession. In my opinion there are only 2 problematic things; sic em and unstoppable union. With all the projectile hate, maybe UU can stay but sic em is really too good for a single utility skill.Someone said that ranger found his place in wvw as a sniper. That is right. Apart from pew pewing there are only few options. So if a nerf would come, at least ranger should obtain a viable zerg build. Druid healer, stance frontliner etc I do not care. But there should be at least one viable build to balance the nerf.

Ps: there are problems with other professions too like scourges, firebrands etc but as this topic is about rangers, I did not shared any opinion on them.

[LetoII.3782]

@Revolution.5409 said:.

Everything revolves around the zergs in a game mode designed for big fights, wvw is not pvp.

How many parts of the map can a Zerg occupy at the same time?

People are not obliged to follow a commander, but this does not mean WvW works differently, at the end of the week if you want your server to win, cooperation between people is necessary, you can't hope to win a matchup just by conquering villages and killing some pugs.

Completely untrue, matches are won by not fighting.All the bluster during active hours accomplishes a mere fraction of what uncontested night capping does.

[DemonSeed.3528]

@alain.1659 said:Someone said that ranger found his place in wvw as a sniper. That is right. Apart from pew pewing there are only few options. So if a nerf would come, at least ranger should obtain a viable zerg build. Druid healer, stance frontliner etc I do not care. But there should be at least one viable build to balance the nerf.Have to be careful when it comes to nerfs - deadeye's got that treatment without compensation they might not consider it for sbeast too.

[Anput.4620]

@Creaitov.6328 said:

@"Dashingsteel.3410" said:I don't get it... If soulbeast is sooo overtuned why isn't it the most represented profession in wvw?? I never hear anyone say leave the map and come back as a soulbeast. Nope, not once.

Its always we need fbs and scourges. If soulbeast was so overtuned and game breaking I guarantee commanders would be exploiting it.

Because not everything revolves around zergs lol.

This is like asking why you never see scourges solo roaming despite them being wanted by every commander.

Yet whenever balance is discussed here everything revolves around solo roaming and all classes should be balanced around solo roaming and some classes are allowed to be better than others in zerging with the tradeoff of being worse in roaming but nope not the other way around because in roaming everyone should be even and zergling builds shouldn't suffer downsides or tradeoffs for being broken in zergs because zerglings deserve to have their cake and eat it too so the balance discussed here is always "Why is my class build for X bad in Y? It isn't fair that my class can't do everything even though classes good in Y also can't do X well which is fine to me even though that's how balance works because it doesn't affect me."

[snh.7091]

@"alain.1659" said:Someone said that ranger found his place in wvw as a sniper. That is right.you brought up an interesting point and you're correct in what you're stating, but when we think about it it's absurd that longbow projectiles that fly slower than bullets have longer range. Naturally this spot should belong to Deadeyes, I mean, what else are they in the game for? Aren't they supposed to be snipers since their main weapon is a rifle for which they have specific masteries? They were equipped with everything but the most important trait - range.

Bullets, as a result of flying faster, should fly longer. Ranger longbow arcing projectiles should be capped at 1,5k range, Deadeyes should get default 1.5, range and max. 2k range while kneeling with stealth being kept at bay as it is now and their damage kept within reasonable limits. This would make a lot more sense, before the kids start to shout "it's a game, don't compare it to reality" nonsense. It's not about trying to bring it as close to reality as possible, that will never happen with a fantasy game, but bringing in more sense makes sense.

Also, arrows can be dodged, we all know that, although just by some crazy mastery, but yes, they can. Bullets, however, shouldn't be avoidable. Blockable, sure, reflectable, absolutely, dodged? No. The Matrix had 3 parts, no need for another one. Or, if the aspect of being able to dodge a bullet should remain in the game, then at least increasing bullet velocity much higher than an arrow to make it more difficult to dodge would be closer making more sense.

[Creaitov.6328]

@Inoki.6048 said:

@"alain.1659" said:Someone said that ranger found his place in wvw as a sniper. That is right.you brought up an interesting point and you're correct in what you're stating, but when we think about it it's absurd that longbow projectiles that fly slower than bullets have longer range. Naturally this spot should belong to Deadeyes, I mean, what else are they in the game for? Aren't they supposed to be snipers since their main weapon is a rifle for which they have specific masteries? They were equipped with everything but the most important trait - range.

Bullets, as a result of flying faster, should fly longer. Ranger longbow arcing projectiles should be capped at 1,5k range, Deadeyes should get default 1.5, range and max. 2k range while kneeling with stealth being kept at bay as it is now and their damage kept within reasonable limits. This would make a lot more sense, before the kids start to shout "it's a game, don't compare it to reality" nonsense. It's not about trying to bring it as close to reality as possible, that will never happen with a fantasy game, but bringing in more sense makes sense.

Also, arrows can be dodged, we all know that, although just by some crazy mastery, but yes, they can. Bullets, however, shouldn't be avoidable. Blockable, sure, reflectable, absolutely, dodged? No. The Matrix had 3 parts, no need for another one. Or, if the aspect of being able to dodge a bullet should remain in the game, then at least increasing bullet velocity much higher than an arrow to make it more difficult to dodge would be closer making more sense.

I agree that DE's are snipers, but you can't take away that rangers are by definition also the masters of long range combat lol. Rather than making one of them better than the other like you're proposing, I would rather push for range to be normalized between weapons (as in, no more bows cheating more range than guns) and for a true balance in the numbers (this means nerfing the stupid damage modifiers of soulbeast like sic em and making DE's rifle worth using).

Hopefully after that both classes can fulfill the sniper role but each one in a different way according to their class identity. Rangers would focus more on sustained long range damage while DE's would be more of a hit and run playstyle.

Also I hope I misunderstood your last paragraph. Dodging is a fundamental mechanic of gw2 and absolutely nothing should be able to hit you during the evade frames. One of the reasons people can evade bullets and arrows is that they see the other person aiming at them and they just roll away, "throwing off their aim" and dodging the shot. I don't think bullet velocity has anything to do with this. However, I must say that this is one of the reasons death's judgement is so easy to evade, being awfully predictable with the sfx and the big orange mark over your head. Maybe it should be changed to a channeled skill where the shot gets fired after you release the button, this would allow you to bait evades while also fitting with the "patient sniper" theme they have going on for DE. But anyways, this is another topic and tbh asking anet for balance changes that make sense is like asking for the impossible so eh.

[alain.1659]

You both have valid points guys. But remember that guarsian in thşs game was unable to guard even himself for quite some time :) DE is supposed to be the sniper, I agree. But even gunflame warriors are better than them. The mobility of de makes devs scared I guess. But some professions are like that, they are only given one option and left to die, like ele or rev.

With stances rangers have an incredible chance to be a good zerger and a party roamer. I wish devs would look into that instead of forcing the profession to play as a one trick pony. But again I wished for many things, glamour mesmer, adjusted rev legends, working ele, reworked dh etc. Then I listen to Aerosmith, "Dream On".

[Aeolus.3615]

Arrows won’t be rendered most of times in target client the more cluttter is there to render the worse it becomes.People can’t dodge when all they see is the hit animation.

[Supreme.4051]

Most professions have a cheese 1-shot build in wvw, so stop complaining about soulbeast it's just as bad as all other profession balance in gw2.