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Requiem: Caithe - thoughts and feelings?


Cerioth.7062

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Are you reading the full version or the bugged half version?

I'll likely read it later, but again I don't like the artwork. I know it isn;t important, but after how dreadful the Rytlock pic looked I hoped they'd find something more representational.

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I was really moved by the story. But I'm also terribly sad, having hoped there might be a secret Caithe had to tell as the final chaper approaches - something about her service to Aurene, some sort of hope after the needless sacrifice. Yet just as with Rytlock and Zafirah , Caithe is lost too.

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Overall this one was disappointing. It was the one I looked forward to the most in hopes it shared light on Aurene branding her, but instead we just go into more detail on a bunch of things we already knew from the sylvari blod posts, Season 2, and HoT/S3. They even seem to retcon the original lore of Faolain having a different personality before the two went traveling through Tyria.

In the end, Zafirah's and Rytlock's were far more interesting to me.

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I liked getting some more depth into Caithes side of things in the past, I’ve always been a little curious about that as a sylvari fan.

Apparently the commander has disappeared, I wonder if that’s going to be important next episode.

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@Zalani.9827 said:I liked getting some more depth into Caithe a side of things in the past, I’ve always been a little curious about that as a sylvari fan.

Apparently the commander has disappeared, I wonder if that’s going to be important next episode.

Once the Commander has finished venting on every major boss in mainland Tyria via a timeloop, they'll reappear

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I liked the additional insight into Faolain as an abuser--Caithe as a victim of serious abuse puts a lot of her actions into perspective. Especially considering, this abuse began almost as soon as she was born. The nature of Sylvari makes it into an insidious combination of early child abuse as well as relationship abuse. I think Anet did a good job of putting Caithe's actions into perspective.Konig, I don't think the lore about Faolain having a different personality was retconned. Rather, we have been given additional insight into why her personality was different. Faolain has always been a sociopath--but when the world was new and she only had the other Firstborn to rely on, she put a nice face on for her own preservation. As she became more confident and secure, more of her true nature began to emerge--thus the "different personality"

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@"Weindrasi.3805" said:I liked the additional insight into Faolain as an abuser--Caithe as a victim of serious abuse puts a lot of her actions into perspective. Especially considering, this abuse began almost as soon as she was born. The nature of Sylvari makes it into an insidious combination of early child abuse as well as relationship abuse. I think Anet did a good job of putting Caithe's actions into perspective.Konig, I don't think the lore about Faolain having a different personality was retconned. Rather, we have been given additional insight into why her personality was different. Faolain has always been a sociopath--but when the world was new and she only had the other Firstborn to rely on, she put a nice face on for her own preservation. As she became more confident and secure, more of her true nature began to emerge--thus the "different personality"

Why did the Sociopath embrace the Darkness of the Dream's counterpart to Orr? What is the Darkness of the Dream's counterpart to Orr? It clearly helped her to subjugate and corrupt the Nightmare Court Members(turning the Fern Hounds darker and meaner) without subjugating her but what is it?

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@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:Overall this one was disappointing. It was the one I looked forward to the most in hopes it shared light on Aurene branding her, but instead we just go into more detail on a bunch of things we already knew from the sylvari blod posts, Season 2, and HoT/S3. They even seem to retcon the original lore of Faolain having a different personality before the two went traveling through Tyria.

In the end, Zafirah's and Rytlock's were far more interesting to me.

Yeah, I like Rytlock's story the most. The recent event really hurt his pride that he doesn't even want to hold Sohothin anymore.

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@"VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.3618" said:Orr? what has Orr to do with this?

It is stated that before Faolain took over the Nightmare Court she met a Great Darkness and while Caithe fled it Faolain embraced it. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dream_of_Dreams#cite_note-8 is the Ingame source of this information...

Interestingly enough Caithe mentions having saw Zhaitan personally at the end of Chapter 1 of the Sylvari Personal Story... Since Zhaitan obviously couldn't subjugate Faolain it lends to question what exactly did he give her or say to her that would make her bold enough to drop the nice act and be capable of permanently corrupting unwilling Sylvari of the Nightmare Court(the willing members seem sane) to the Nightmare?

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It was interesting to see how she connected with Aurene. She didn't do it out of simply acting on her Wyld Hunt. She did it because Aurene was the only creature she saw fit to connect with (I'm using connect as a loose term for trust).

Everything she did was outside of everyone she should have trusted because her whole life is about being used. Even her whole existence as Sylvari was about being used by Mordremoth so it was definitely understandable.

Hit me quite hard when she spoke about the Commander as well since she never realized that out of all other people who would be affected by Aurene's death, it would be the person she should have trusted to begin with, which is the Commander.

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I'm quite pleased it seems the opening of the Episode will just be Caithe saying "Hey lets die together" and not something silly like "I have a plan", or anyone else turning around and saying "I have a plan", which I would have hated.

Still leaves open the possibilities for what is actually going to happen.

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@"Weindrasi.3805" said:Konig, I don't think the lore about Faolain having a different personality was retconned. Rather, we have been given additional insight into why her personality was different. Faolain has always been a sociopath--but when the world was new and she only had the other Firstborn to rely on, she put a nice face on for her own preservation. As she became more confident and secure, more of her true nature began to emerge--thus the "different personality"

Originally, the lore given to us was that Faolain's personality changed because Caithe and Faolain were the first sylvari discovered the Nightmare. That Faolain was not "always a sociopath" but became one after being warped by the Nightmare just as we see it warp other sylvari like Tiachren in the Shield of the Moon story. That after finding the Nightmare was when Faolain slowly became more obviously manipulative of Caithe.

@"VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.3618" said:Orr? what has Orr to do with this?

The very first original lore on Faolain, Caithe, and the Nightmare was that they first encountered the Nightmare on their travels through Orr.

As @"Mickey Frogeater.1470" said, there's still an in-game source for Faolain embracing that "great darkness" while Caithe didn't, but the mention of Orr has been lost. I believe it was a forum post on Guildwars2Guru in the early days, but that's been taken down so it's pretty much impossible to find the source anymore (was pretty damn hard before then to find any particular post). Though I don't think that Zhaitan personally is the great darkness Faolain embraced (doesn't make much sense to me unless we're talking about Zhaitan's shadow domain).

@"ThatOddOne.4387" said:I'm quite pleased it seems the opening of the Episode will just be Caithe saying "Hey lets die together" and not something silly like "I have a plan", or anyone else turning around and saying "I have a plan", which I would have hated.

Still leaves open the possibilities for what is actually going to happen.

If anyone comes up with a plan at the beginning, it'd be the Commander - for once.

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@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@"Weindrasi.3805" said:Konig, I don't think the lore about Faolain having a different personality was retconned. Rather, we have been given additional insight into why her personality was different. Faolain has always been a sociopath--but when the world was new and she only had the other Firstborn to rely on, she put a nice face on for her own preservation. As she became more confident and secure, more of her true nature began to emerge--thus the "different personality"

Originally, the lore given to us was that Faolain's personality changed because Caithe and Faolain were the first sylvari discovered the Nightmare. That Faolain was not "always a sociopath" but became one after being warped by the Nightmare just as we see it warp other sylvari like Tiachren in the Shield of the Moon story. That after finding the Nightmare was when Faolain slowly became more obviously manipulative of Caithe.

@"VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.3618" said:Orr? what has Orr to do with this?

The very first original lore on Faolain, Caithe, and the Nightmare was that they first encountered the Nightmare on their travels through Orr.

As @"Mickey Frogeater.1470" said, there's still an in-game source for Faolain embracing that "great darkness" while Caithe didn't, but the mention of Orr has been lost. I believe it was a forum post on Guildwars2Guru in the early days, but that's been taken down so it's pretty much impossible to find the source anymore (was pretty kitten hard before then to find any particular post). Though I don't think that Zhaitan personally is the great darkness Faolain embraced (doesn't make much sense to me unless we're talking about Zhaitan's shadow domain).

@"ThatOddOne.4387" said:I'm quite pleased it seems the opening of the Episode will just be Caithe saying "Hey lets die together" and not something silly like "I have a plan", or anyone else turning around and saying "I have a plan", which I would have hated.

Still leaves open the possibilities for what is actually going to happen.

If anyone comes up with a plan at the beginning, it'd be the Commander - for once.

I would like it more if the commander go‘s: Fuck it! I gonna kill that damn dragon!

Accepting his faith.We have lost, but lets go down with a fight.

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@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:Overall this one was disappointing. It was the one I looked forward to the most in hopes it shared light on Aurene branding her, but instead we just go into more detail on a bunch of things we already knew from the sylvari blod posts, Season 2, and HoT/S3. They even seem to retcon the original lore of Faolain having a different personality before the two went traveling through Tyria.

In the end, Zafirah's and Rytlock's were far more interesting to me.

Maybe they simply want to share her branding story in game - we're going to meet her for sure in the beginning of War Eternal, so we'll have a discussion with her. If they keep this juicy branding stuff to make this in game, then I want that 100 times more than it to be in a short story.

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@ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:It was interesting to see how she connected with Aurene. She didn't do it out of simply acting on her Wyld Hunt. She did it because Aurene was the only creature she saw fit to connect with (I'm using connect as a loose term for trust).

Everything she did was outside of everyone she should have trusted because her whole life is about being used. Even her whole existence as Sylvari was about being used by Mordremoth so it was definitely understandable.

Hit me quite hard when she spoke about the Commander as well since she never realized that out of all other people who would be affected by Aurene's death, it would be the person she should have trusted to begin with, which is the Commander.

yeah, that's really good way to think about it.

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All three Requiems speak to the end of all things. That is, that the failure to defeat Kralk now heralds the apocalypse, the end of days for Tyria. Maybe that's the real takeaway here :'(

Rytlock: "Aurene was the only way to save Tyria.

She was supposed to kill the Crystal Dragon, absorb his magic, and—I don’t know. It’s not like we had better options. Every other plan ends with the annihilation of all existence.

Even if we somehow did manage to end Kralkatorrik without her, all that magic inside him—from Zhaitan, Mordremoth, and Balthazar…

The boom wouldn’t be pretty.

All of my friends, my family—they’re going to die in this doomed world because I’m a failure."

Zafirah: "Maybe what I had for that short time between my lowest point and the end of all things was as good as it will ever get for me.

Or maybe the vision that saw me standing there at her side during the final battle against Kralkatorrik was meant as a warning for me stay away.

There is no solace in what lies ahead. "

Caithe: "Here, at the end, all I can think about is the beginning... The end has come. Without you, what hope does Tyria have? My duty now is to bear witness to the end of all things. To stand beside your shell as I wait for reality itself to crumble away."

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@DanAlcedo.3281 said:

@"Weindrasi.3805" said:Konig, I don't think the lore about Faolain having a different personality was retconned. Rather, we have been given additional insight into why her personality was different. Faolain has always been a sociopath--but when the world was new and she only had the other Firstborn to rely on, she put a nice face on for her own preservation. As she became more confident and secure, more of her true nature began to emerge--thus the "different personality"

Originally, the lore given to us was that Faolain's personality changed because Caithe and Faolain were the first sylvari discovered the Nightmare. That Faolain was not "always a sociopath" but became one after being warped by the Nightmare just as we see it warp other sylvari like Tiachren in the Shield of the Moon story. That after finding the Nightmare was when Faolain slowly became more obviously manipulative of Caithe.

@"VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.3618" said:Orr? what has Orr to do with this?

The very first original lore on Faolain, Caithe, and the Nightmare was that they first encountered the Nightmare on their travels through Orr.

As @"Mickey Frogeater.1470" said, there's still an in-game source for Faolain embracing that "great darkness" while Caithe didn't, but the mention of Orr has been lost. I believe it was a forum post on Guildwars2Guru in the early days, but that's been taken down so it's pretty much impossible to find the source anymore (was pretty kitten hard before then to find any particular post). Though I don't think that Zhaitan personally is the great darkness Faolain embraced (doesn't make much sense to me unless we're talking about Zhaitan's shadow domain).

@"ThatOddOne.4387" said:I'm quite pleased it seems the opening of the Episode will just be Caithe saying "Hey lets die together" and not something silly like "I have a plan", or anyone else turning around and saying "I have a plan", which I would have hated.

Still leaves open the possibilities for what is actually going to happen.

If anyone comes up with a plan at the beginning, it'd be the Commander - for once.

I would like it more if the commander go‘s: kitten it! I gonna kill that kitten dragon!

Accepting his faith.We have lost, but lets go down with a fight.

Finally going solo, I'd love it.

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@DanAlcedo.3281 said:

@"Weindrasi.3805" said:Konig, I don't think the lore about Faolain having a different personality was retconned. Rather, we have been given additional insight into why her personality was different. Faolain has always been a sociopath--but when the world was new and she only had the other Firstborn to rely on, she put a nice face on for her own preservation. As she became more confident and secure, more of her true nature began to emerge--thus the "different personality"

Originally, the lore given to us was that Faolain's personality changed because Caithe and Faolain were the first sylvari discovered the Nightmare. That Faolain was not "always a sociopath" but became one after being warped by the Nightmare just as we see it warp other sylvari like Tiachren in the Shield of the Moon story. That after finding the Nightmare was when Faolain slowly became more obviously manipulative of Caithe.

@"VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.3618" said:Orr? what has Orr to do with this?

The very first original lore on Faolain, Caithe, and the Nightmare was that they first encountered the Nightmare on their travels through Orr.

As @"Mickey Frogeater.1470" said, there's still an in-game source for Faolain embracing that "great darkness" while Caithe didn't, but the mention of Orr has been lost. I believe it was a forum post on Guildwars2Guru in the early days, but that's been taken down so it's pretty much impossible to find the source anymore (was pretty kitten hard before then to find any particular post). Though I don't think that Zhaitan personally is the great darkness Faolain embraced (doesn't make much sense to me unless we're talking about Zhaitan's shadow domain).

@"ThatOddOne.4387" said:I'm quite pleased it seems the opening of the Episode will just be Caithe saying "Hey lets die together" and not something silly like "I have a plan", or anyone else turning around and saying "I have a plan", which I would have hated.

Still leaves open the possibilities for what is actually going to happen.

If anyone comes up with a plan at the beginning, it'd be the Commander - for once.

I would like it more if the commander go‘s: kitten it! I gonna kill that kitten dragon!

Accepting his faith.We have lost, but lets go down with a fight.

Let's be honest, the Commander already died once, they could just as well jump in to fight Kralk, all guns blazing, all swords swinging and do it with reckless abandon without a care in the world. That sounds like breaking point to me which seems to suit the narrative moving forward since we're at that point where the Commander doesn't know what to do.

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The best thing we have to take away is the setup for the beginning of the episode. Nobody had a plan and we all know it won’t be long before kralkatorrik destroys the world. We’re basically going “screw it, let’s try to kill him anyway”. Caithe will mail us and somebody will have some location to attack him at (new map), and we’re probably just going to go for it

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