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Raids and discrimination.


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@sigur.9453 said:

@"Chrysaliss.8720" said:Easiest solution for the raiding inaccessibility would be to make it impossible to link li/kp in the chat. As well as any other potentialy abusable items.

not showing another players weapon setup anymore -> potentialy abusable.no more titles -> potentialy abusable.

I can confirm this, I called out a lot of players using random weapons and it resulted in them being kicked. chronos running gs on fights you need focus pulls (and giving shit boons as result), power bs that runs sword/sword and other random shit in "high" 250li/40kp+ groups.

Also the amount of times people try to join with "envoy's herald" or the cm titles, but refuse to show them. I hate the linking of kp/li because it shows rng and when u started, I'm 100% pro the system rs3 has where you can use a quicklink (you can't cheat this btw) that says your boss kill, no more getting badluck with kp and i rather have someone that can quickchat 20matthias kills than 500li+ at this point but can only play power dps and only managed to kill matthias 3-5 times cause he got carried through, which is super possible at this point, raiding for a full year of 52weeks and only do the easy 7li bosses give 364li and then add the 2LI from gorse pre and TC for the weeks it gave LI too. Think it adds up to 400+li for 52weeks of no effort raids where you can hard carry people through with healing while ignoring mechanics, and another 52LI if you do deimos range which is incredibly easy too if you dps because all the effort is on tank, BK and HK

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@Chrysaliss.8720 said:

@Chrysaliss.8720 said:Easiest solution for the raiding inaccessibility would be to make it impossible to link li/kp in the chat. As well as any other potentialy abusable items.

so no more different classes then i guess. -> potentialy abusable.not showing another players weapon setup anymore -> potentialy abusable.no more titles -> potentialy abusable.no more mastery levels shown -> potentialy abusable.no more minis -> potentialy abusable.no more special skins -> potentialy abusable.

Okay. Most of this is just stupid and you know this. Taking things to extreme on purpose doesnt help your point.

.........its a stupid solution to a selfmade problem.raids are not inaccessible. some people just do not have the time/mindset to participate.raiders ARE raiding. non raiders find in inaccessible, because???i see a lot of raid guilds recruiting, even whole trainings communities. raids are no solo player experience you hotjoin on the go. you are a 10th % of a group, not less not more.nobody is forced to play with anyone, its a game, you said it yourself.

I am going to assume you have played WoW and know how it works there. In WoW the only way to prove your skill is the achievement, that you have killed the boss ONCE. There is no other possible proof. Also WoW bosses are 1000x times more complex.

In GW2 there is the LI/KP..... You see the problem already?

Also I never said that I dont raid. I just see the issue unlike other people here mindlessly defending it.

Those are not stupid points. Players want to separate good from the bad. Li/kp is not ideal but it is the best we have right now. If you take that away players will find something diferent and you will call that a problem.

If i killed VG 200 times i dont want to play in party with random players that killed it less then 50 times (if i am not hosting a training). That is how it is.

Maybe Li and kp is not needed in wow because raids are more dificult there so if someone killed it he is likely to have propper build and stuff.

Here raids are easy so trained monkeys can do them but rest of the game is sooo much easier that most players are worse then trained monkeys.

Also I dont enjoy just killing the boss but efficient strategies so I want to play with players that are better then trained monkeys. Thats why i need some indicator. Without indicator i would only raid with my guilds because it wouldnt be fun and I think most raiders that are experianced would do the same (if they arent doing that already)

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@Chrysaliss.8720 said:

@Henry.5713 said:An easy and ultimately pointless solution that would force people to use even more arbitrary means of proving ones experience. We'd either have most groups demand the use of API linking sites or worse have things like asking for AP return.

Imagine if they removed all inaccessibilities and barriers from any job position in the real world. People would certainly be happy to join the top management without any work, experience or knowledge involved - well, until those companies went bankrupt in droves. There are reasons why there are requirements for certain positions, the game is no expection. The requirements set might not always seem to make sense but why settle for someone good if you can easily have someone great in the current climate?

3rd party API site would work only if Anet opened the API for them. Also if you have read the EULA. (I guess you did not). Reading informations about other players from API is a bannable offense. So if you use dps meter and kick someone for having low dps could potencialy get you banned.

Also comparing real world to a game makes no sense. In RW there are serious consequences, like people could get hurt or die. There is no consequence to dying to a boss. This whole argument is irelevant.

Fact is that something needs to be done to allow more players in raids. You really dont need to kill a boss 250 times to be allowed to raid. Especially since GW2 bosses are insanely easy compared to other mmos.

Bringing real life comparisons into this kind of argument will remain relevant as long as we are talking about real people behind their monitor. People feel like their time was wasted, they do get angry or annoyed, there are communication issues and other matters. There are rules you abide by if you interact with other people. There are rules you follow if you wish to be part of a team.

Why would anyone even assume raids are going to open up to a much wider audience if they just removed all of the multiple and increasingly arbitrary ways of having some sort of safety as far as success rates are concerned? People would avoid pugs entirely if they had no such safety nets. They would stick to statics with trials or similar ways of testing players wishing to join them. Thus closing up raids even further to anyone not able to or wishing to be part of a static or scheduled raiding as a whole.

And no, DPS is not personal information. Neither is using ArcDPS a bannable offense. Next people will be asking to ban someone who complained about the lack of Might as it is none of their business how much Might they received from the Druid.

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@Chrysaliss.8720 said:Easiest solution for the raiding inaccessibility would be to make it impossible to link li/kp in the chat. As well as any other potentialy abusable items.

3 pages in, countless topics, and you fail to realize the core issue of why LI/KP or similar systems see use.

So for the x-th amount of time:LI/KP, level, AP, titles, etc. see use for 1 thing only: trying to group with similar skilled people and maximize success if possible.

Introducing barriers by removing or convoluting the player established systems does not solve the core issue: people wanting to group with similar skilled players.

Case in point: you could make an auto group finder which automatically pairs 10 people immediately for raids. Net result: maximum accessibility, minimal efficiency and chance of success.

If your analysis of this issues is so shallow that your approach is to simply address the symptoms instead of the underlying problem (massive difference in player performance and experience), then your suggestion is useless.

TL;DR:If players want to group with similar skilled other players, especially for challenging content, some way or another will be found to achieve this. That is until the rewards do not justify the effort, which then results in the content getting abandoned. (there is tons of example of this being the case in this very game)

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If you want to fix the problem, fix the entire non raiding playerbase to not be braindead while playing the game. The game does a poor job preparing the player for end game because the strategies you used at level 1 work at level 80 which is tab, auto attack, afk. If you, at this very moment, gave all players in the game an obstacle to break bar or get banned, we would lose half of the player base. If you asked them what half of their selected traits do or get banned, youd lose 75 percent of the player base.

Fix the game to make knowing what cc does or block progress. They should have never nerfed eater of souls in the story. Instead they should have ui that pops up after you wipe indicating, "hey this boss has a powerful attack that you can interrupt. When you see the break bar appear, use longbow 4 to disrupt it" and make the player wipe until they exercise their reading comprehension skills and use longbow 4 on the break bar. Do this with other skills crucial to end game like stacking, dps, supporting, field awareness.

If there wasnt such a huge skill differential, raids would not need such strict requirements because anyone you pick up, youd know that they have basic fundamental skills and you just need to teach them stuff specific to the fight.

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@"Shikaru.7618" said:If you want to fix the problem, fix the entire non raiding playerbase to not be braindead while playing the game. The game does a poor job preparing the player for end game because the strategies you used at level 1 work at level 80 which is tab, auto attack, afk. If you, at this very moment, gave all players in the game an obstacle to break bar or get banned, we would lose half of the player base. If you asked them what half of their selected traits do or get banned, youd lose 75 percent of the player base.

Fix the game to make knowing what cc does or block progress. They should have never nerfed eater of souls in the story. Instead they should have ui that pops up after you wipe indicating, "hey this boss has a powerful attack that you can interrupt. When you see the break bar appear, use longbow 4 to disrupt it" and make the player wipe until they exercise their reading comprehension skills and use longbow 4 on the break bar. Do this with other skills crucial to end game like stacking, dps, supporting, field awareness.

If there wasnt such a huge skill differential, raids would not need such strict requirements because anyone you pick up, youd know that they have basic fundamental skills and you just need to teach them stuff specific to the fight.

That might be the smartest comment in this thread.

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@Krzysztof.5973 said:

@"Shikaru.7618" said:If you want to fix the problem, fix the entire non raiding playerbase to not be braindead while playing the game. The game does a poor job preparing the player for end game because the strategies you used at level 1 work at level 80 which is tab, auto attack, afk. If you, at this very moment, gave all players in the game an obstacle to break bar or get banned, we would lose half of the player base. If you asked them what half of their selected traits do or get banned, youd lose 75 percent of the player base.

Fix the game to make knowing what cc does or block progress. They should have never nerfed eater of souls in the story. Instead they should have ui that pops up after you wipe indicating, "hey this boss has a powerful attack that you can interrupt. When you see the break bar appear, use longbow 4 to disrupt it" and make the player wipe until they exercise their reading comprehension skills and use longbow 4 on the break bar. Do this with other skills crucial to end game like stacking, dps, supporting, field awareness.

If there wasnt such a huge skill differential, raids would not need such strict requirements because anyone you pick up, youd know that they have basic fundamental skills and you just need to teach them stuff specific to the fight.

That might be the smartest comment in this thread.

Especially for a game that was made for exploration and laydback questing. Where end-game supposed to be WvW.

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@"phs.6089" said:Especially for a game that was made for exploration and laydback questing. Where end-game supposed to be WvW.PvE endgame suppose to be WvW? Fun.Majority of content can be casual. That doesn't mean there should't be difficulty steps on your way towards Raids. Game has to teach players basic and more advanced mechanics as they make their way up. There is no tutorial for combo fields and break bars in the game. So how somebody that doesn't know those things is fit to raid? Of course he will encounter a wall. And then we get tons of threads to make raids more "accessible".

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@Krzysztof.5973 said:

@"phs.6089" said:Especially for a game that was made for exploration and laydback questing. Where end-game supposed to be WvW.PvE endgame suppose to be WvW? Fun.Majority of content can be casual. That doesn't mean there should't be difficulty steps on your way towards Raids. Game has to teach players basic and more advanced mechanics as they make their way up. There is no tutorial for combo fields and break bars in the game. So how somebody that doesn't know those things is fit to raid? Of course he will encounter a wall. And then we get tons of threads to make raids more "accessible".

PvE end-game suppose to be fractals that were 50 tiers. It's raids that were forced into casual game. It would be better to remove 8% of raiders and abandon raids, then remove 60% of playerbase, that are playing this game because it is casual. Maybe that way pvp and wvw won't be abandoned ? Maybe they coulc continue to make collection to legendary weapons 2.0 insteda of making it dry -hump farm if not raids?And game won't be like half-opened supermaket that tryes to please all around and in results gets the job only half-done.

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@Agrippa Oculus.3726 said:

@CountMozenrath.7631 said:Nothing about exp but there were a couple with ping kp , but my point is how can you even gain exp if no one wants you in the group

The KP and LI is the demand for proof of experience. Or at least successful boss kills.

Especially Dhuum and Qadim are bosses where you will not just get to tag along. Way to many mechanics which unless practiced will wipe your entire raid.

You getting kicked had nothing to do with being on necromancer but more with not pinging the relevant kill proof and/or LI.

It has to do with necro.I recently joined some groups as necro, because I got kps on him.Instantly got kicked before I even had the chance to ping kps.

Well, who is to blame?-necro has low single target DPS-and only average supportThe only thing necro is good at is rezzing people, but in my opinion, if you need to rezz someone, you failed your job as a support/healer

Problem:If scourge gets more DPS, scourge stacking will be a thing again, so you don't need healers due to barrier overflow. Well there would be solutions

No it doesn't. If you do not have the raid experience as to why TC got kicked, read my explanation above.

TC was not kicked due to being necromancer in this instance. If you want to make this about necro in general, fine. But that has nothing to do with this specific instance and situation.

Ok your post sounded more like: it's only his fault, but it's clearly not all the time this players fault.

The community (and anet) in general is pretty much ignoring a lot of things

(Yes normally I'm also more like: I want to do my kills fast, but then, I'm not allowed to play my favourite class because it benches 4-6k below meta classes)

Go read what I wrote. This is a very specific situation. If you do not understand how Wing 5 works and what the fights require, I explained that up top.

If you can find a wing 5 group which is looking for experienced players and is willing to take a fully inexperienced heal scourge to Dhuum, great. I doubt that will ever be the case. Dhuum is among the 2 hardest bosses with the most instant wipe mechanics in the game. It makes no difference with which class you join when you have no experience, you will get removed. Ergo, it was not due to him being on necromancer.

He wasn't there as dps, he was on a support slot. Those do not get to afk Dhuum like some of the dps. The only thing you are proving here is that one can't take people with no experience along since some are to stubborn to even listen to advice and explanations.

I think that Nimon is not questioning your focus on the OP's particular case (and I wasn't either), although it's still a very specific focus (like you also mention yourself, btw), where you clearly jump into assumptions, which might be completely right, but still assumptions. You were not there with him/her while he/she was kicked (multiple times). And again, you
might
be completely right, and it sounds more than viable to me, that he/she was kicked at least once, for the reasons
you
mention. But he/she mentions multiple kicks! And to be fairly honest, being pre-kicked before you can even show your KP's, LI, etc. happens as well! And I don't even have to explain to you (I hope) for which reasons these particular pre-kicks happen, and which professions are mostly affected by these so called pre-kicks. It's a thing, you know! It happens! It's probably very hard for you to acknowledge it, but believe me, it happens!!!

Never fails, even when necromancers (such as the OP) get legitimately kicked, it will turn into a discussion about class discrimination on the forums. Such is the tao of the necro.

Personally for me, if people want to play necro in a pug I'm commanding, I couldn't care less... But if somebody only has ONE CLASS (especially a dps), I'm going to be very skeptical about their abilities...

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Raids are designed to be exclusive, I don't have the exact dev quote but it could be summed up to "they are not for everyone". We can argue about their place and purpose in a game like GW2, but since they are here, they function the way they are supposed to.

If one is really determined to change that fact, the best option is to simply ignore them and go play more inclusive content, the game has plenty of that. There is a decent chance the current situation is unsustainable long term and sooner or later that would force, either Anet or the raiders themselves to change towards more inclusion. And if that doesn't happen, it would mean Anet has found a way to deliver niche group content for a minority, that is sustainable. As long as its development focus is proportionate to its player numbers, I'm ok with that.

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@phs.6089 said:PvE end-game suppose to be fractals that were 50 tiers. It's raids that were forced into casual game. It would be better to remove 8% of raiders and abandon raids, then remove 60% of playerbase, that are playing this game because it is casual. Maybe that way pvp and wvw won't be abandoned ? Maybe they coulc continue to make collection to legendary weapons 2.0 insteda of making it dry -hump farm if not raids?And game won't be like half-opened supermaket that tryes to please all around and in results gets the job only half-done.

That's not how game development works my sweet summer child. If you remove dev team from raids we won't magically get t3 set of legendary weapons.

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@Krzysztof.5973 said:

@phs.6089 said:PvE end-game suppose to be fractals that were 50 tiers. It's raids that were forced into casual game. It would be better to remove 8% of raiders and abandon raids, then remove 60% of playerbase, that are playing this game because it is casual. Maybe that way pvp and wvw won't be abandoned ? Maybe they coulc continue to make collection to legendary weapons 2.0 insteda of making it dry -hump farm if not raids?And game won't be like half-opened supermaket that tryes to please all around and in results gets the job only half-done.

That's not how game development works my sweet summer child. If you remove dev team from raids we won't magically get t3 set of legendary weapons.

Maybe we would get better metas in LW4 maps instead of rubbish we get for 5 episode? Maybe we get somethign this game supposed to be delivering instead of thing that hardly anyone cares and put players off the game? Bet we would and kids like you wouldn't be here.

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@phs.6089 said:

@phs.6089 said:PvE end-game suppose to be fractals that were 50 tiers. It's raids that were forced into casual game. It would be better to remove 8% of raiders and abandon raids, then remove 60% of playerbase, that are playing this game because it is casual. Maybe that way pvp and wvw won't be abandoned ? Maybe they coulc continue to make collection to legendary weapons 2.0 insteda of making it dry -hump farm if not raids?And game won't be like half-opened supermaket that tryes to please all around and in results gets the job only half-done.

That's not how game development works my sweet summer child. If you remove dev team from raids we won't magically get t3 set of legendary weapons.

Maybe we would get better metas in LW4 maps instead of rubbish we get for 5 episode? Maybe we get somethign this game supposed to be delivering instead of thing that hardly anyone cares and put players off the game? Bet we would and kids like you wouldn't be here.

And by better I hope you mean raid-like

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@phs.6089 said:

@phs.6089 said:Especially for a game that was made for exploration and laydback questing. Where end-game supposed to be WvW.PvE endgame suppose to be WvW? Fun.Majority of content can be casual. That doesn't mean there should't be difficulty steps on your way towards Raids. Game has to teach players basic and more advanced mechanics as they make their way up. There is no tutorial for combo fields and break bars in the game. So how somebody that doesn't know those things is fit to raid? Of course he will encounter a wall. And then we get tons of threads to make raids more "accessible".

PvE end-game suppose to be fractals that were 50 tiers. It's raids that were forced into casual game. It would be better to remove 8% of raiders and abandon raids, then remove 60% of playerbase, that are playing this game because it is casual. Maybe that way pvp and wvw won't be abandoned ? Maybe they coulc continue to make collection to legendary weapons 2.0 insteda of making it dry -hump farm if not raids?And game won't be like half-opened supermaket that tryes to please all around and in results gets the job only half-done.

Noone is removing 60 percent of the player base. There is just one team that does stuff for more hardcore players.

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@"AlexxxDelta.1806" said:Raids are designed to be exclusive, I don't have the exact dev quote but it could be summed up to "they are not for everyone". We can argue about their place and purpose in a game like GW2, but since they are here, they function the way they are supposed to.

If one is really determined to change that fact, the best option is to simply ignore them and go play more inclusive content, the game has plenty of that. There is a decent chance the current situation is unsustainable long term and sooner or later that would force, either Anet or the raiders themselves to change towards more inclusion. And if that doesn't happen, it would mean Anet has found a way to deliver niche group content for a minority, that is sustainable. As long as its development focus is proportionate to its player numbers, I'm ok with that.

iirc the raid team is merged with the fractal team and consist of like 6 or 7members, while the living world team existed of three whole teams each making their own episode and have way more time for one episode, before the employee layoffs happened and more people raid and do t4's+cm's than people who don't raid or barely raid think (people forget that the amount of raiders in a static or raid guild is probably in the 80%) and these are all active players, a great number of them got multiple accounts to raid on too (myself included). If raids weren't populated enough, they'd have stopped after w4 and definitly not announce w7 shortly after last episode release and reinstated the promise they want to vary between a fractal and a new raid wing every other living world release.

Also the biggest twitch viewercount we had on gw2 that wasn't on their official account was all three of teapot his hosted raiding tournaments and if you look the official discord of SnowCrows you can see that arenanet is actually supporting the monthly event they host, they give the top 3 teams a gem price, 2k/player for 1st, 800/player for second and 400/player for third place which is still 32k gems they donate to a gamemode people claim "is a waste of dev time".

Also raids are very inclusive, there are more than enough raid training guilds. It's not anets or raiders their fault some people think they're too good/entitled for those and find they should join exp groups and then complain raiding is too hard to get into.

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@phs.6089 said:

@phs.6089 said:PvE end-game suppose to be fractals that were 50 tiers. It's raids that were forced into casual game. It would be better to remove 8% of raiders and abandon raids, then remove 60% of playerbase, that are playing this game because it is casual. Maybe that way pvp and wvw won't be abandoned ? Maybe they coulc continue to make collection to legendary weapons 2.0 insteda of making it dry -hump farm if not raids?And game won't be like half-opened supermaket that tryes to please all around and in results gets the job only half-done.

That's not how game development works my sweet summer child. If you remove dev team from raids we won't magically get t3 set of legendary weapons.

Maybe we would get better metas in LW4 maps instead of rubbish we get for 5 episode? Maybe we get somethign this game supposed to be delivering instead of thing that hardly anyone cares and put players off the game? Bet we would and kids like you wouldn't be here.

uhm you do know the living world team exist of THREE different teams right? each including more employyes than the raid/fractal team. I don't remember which team did what episode but it's something people noticed that one team was way better in map design than the others, one team had better story and one team had better events.If you actually bother you will see episode 1/4, 2/5 and 3/6 are made by each team. but you're a special kind of naïve if you actually believe firing the raid devs would improve the living world episodes. I'd really advice to look into how dev teams work, especially in bigger companies where they're specialized in one type of content.

Also if you remove raids from the game, you'd lose a giant chunk of active players. But have fun doing all the meta's with people who have no reason in getting proper builds, gear and game knowledge. All the meta's would have increased chance of failing (just remember chak gerent at release), I know for a fact my casual guild would've died way longer ago if I wasn't the most active member that aided people doing random shit or have questions or need tips on how to do some stuff. And I'd put my hand in a fire if it wouldn't be the same for other guilds too. Just because we want to play with similar skill lvl'd players mean we don't help people when we can.

But I know you have an hatred against raids and raiders, but if you actually believe raids aren't bringing enough money for anet to keep supporting it idk what to say. But I guess they're making w7 because raiders definitly don't fund their own gamemode enough and oh the last Q&A they did, they mentioned they want to try even more to release raids more frequent and said they'd plan on doing fractal one living world episode and a raid the next and repeat. Just please accept that we raiders fund our gamemode, I (like many others) bought plenty of gems and bought a second account with all expansions just to raid on. WE ARE NOT TAKING AWAY FROM OTHER MODES, we get what we deserve and deal with it.

PS: Isn't asking for the removal of one type of content basically hatespeech towards people that play that said content?

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@"Lorfi.7562" said:iirc the raid team is merged with the fractal team and consist of like 6 or 7members, while the living world team existed of three whole teams each making their own episode and have way more time for one episode, before the employee layoffs happened and more people raid and do t4's+cm's than people who don't raid or barely raid

Only one of these two bolded parts can be true. Because if both are true, then Anet is really bad at allocating dev resources on the content that is more popular. If raids are that popular then they shoud have 3 , fully staffed teams working on new wings instead of LS and a small team working on new LW for that small minority of casuals once every blue moon. Given their track record in the industry, I d wager they are pretty capable of allocating resources properly.

Also the biggest twitch viewercount we had on gw2 that wasn't on their official account was all three of teapot his hosted raiding tournaments and if you look the official discord of SnowCrows you can see that arenanet is actually supporting the monthly event they host, they give the top 3 teams a gem price, 2k/player for 1st, 800/player for second and 400/player for third place which is still 32k gems they donate to a gamemode people claim "is a waste of dev time".

I'm confused about this point too. Twitch is all about competitive PvP and to some extent, hardcore PvE content. No one would ever stay and watch a stream about SW farming or how to beat X story boss. That still doesn't prove anything about player activity in different modes in-game.

Also raids are very inclusive, there are more than enough raid training guilds. It's not anets or raiders their fault some people think they're too good/entitled for those and find they should join exp groups and then complain raiding is too hard to get into.

When the dev making said content is saying that it's not meant for everyone, it's a pretty good indication that it's....not meant for everyone. And you won't find me, personally, complaining about anything related to raids at their current state. I'm even opposed to all those watered-down versions proposed here, they should remain as they are. I think they have the development focus, the player numbers and the release schedule they deserve, no need to change a thing as far as I am concerned.

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@AlexxxDelta.1806 said:

@"Lorfi.7562" said:iirc
the raid team is merged with the fractal team and consist of like 6 or 7members, while the living world team existed of three whole teams each making their own episode
and have way more time for one episode, before the employee layoffs happened and
more people raid and do t4's+cm's than people who don't raid or barely raid

Only one of these two bolded parts can be true. Because if
both
are true, then Anet is really bad at allocating dev resources on the content that is more popular. If raids are that popular then they shoud have 3 , fully staffed teams working on new wings instead of LS and a small team working on new LW for that small minority of casuals once every blue moon. Given their track record in the industry, I d wager they are pretty capable of allocating resources properly.

Also the biggest twitch viewercount we had on gw2 that wasn't on their official account was all three of teapot his hosted raiding tournaments and if you look the official discord of SnowCrows you can see that arenanet is actually supporting the monthly event they host, they give the top 3 teams a gem price, 2k/player for 1st, 800/player for second and 400/player for third place which is still 32k gems they donate to a gamemode people claim "is a waste of dev time".

I'm confused about this point too. Twitch is all about competitive PvP and to some extent, hardcore PvE content. No one would ever stay and watch a stream about SW farming or how to beat X story boss. That still doesn't prove anything about player activity in different modes
in-game
.

Also raids are very inclusive, there are more than enough raid training guilds. It's not anets or raiders their fault some people think they're too good/entitled for those and find they should join exp groups and then complain raiding is too hard to get into.

When the dev making said content is saying that it's not meant for everyone, it's a pretty good indication that it's....not meant for everyone. And you won't find me, personally, complaining about anything related to raids at their current state. I'm even opposed to all those watered-down versions proposed here, they should remain as they are. I think they have the development focus, the player numbers and the release schedule they deserve, no need to change a thing as far as I am concerned.

GW2efficiency is biased towards players who either care about metrics enough to put up their API there or at least are committed enough to the game to be curious about their stats. And even there, 50% of players with over 4000h of playtime have an average of 11 LI only, and 50% of those with less than 2k hours playtime have no LI at all. It's not much, but the only actual statistics we have point to Raids indeed being a very minor game mode, with only a perceived relevance due to the people actually invested in it being very invested, to the point of playing it competitively regardless of it being easy to play. If anything raids are a very useful and reliable testing grounds for mechanics and gameplay elements that can later get through to their actual main content at the Living World, and definitely should remain as [minor] as they currently are.

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@AlexxxDelta.1806 said:

@"Lorfi.7562" said:iirc
the raid team is merged with the fractal team and consist of like 6 or 7members, while the living world team existed of three whole teams each making their own episode
and have way more time for one episode, before the employee layoffs happened and
more people raid and do t4's+cm's than people who don't raid or barely raid

Only one of these two bolded parts can be true. Because if
both
are true, then Anet is really bad at allocating dev resources on the content that is more popular. If raids are that popular then they shoud have 3 , fully staffed teams working on new wings instead of LS and a small team working on new LW for that small minority of casuals once every blue moon. Given their track record in the industry, I d wager they are pretty capable of allocating resources properly.

If you're going to bold parts of a quote to make you point, try not to misquote. Lorfi never said raids or cms had more people doing them than not, he said that "more people raid and do t4's+cm's than people who don't raid or barely raid THINK".

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Yeah i can see where your coming from. So lets be honest, in every mmo most raiders are a holes, especially the below average ones who think they are good. Youll find that the HoT raiders are more willing to work with you. I suggest you do what most of the bad raiders do and create your own squad and ask for obscene amounts of kp. Noone will question you for fear of getting kicked. Or if your pockets are deep just buy them.

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@Magnus Godrik.5841 said:Yeah i can see where your coming from. So lets be honest, in every mmo most raiders are a holes, especially the below average ones who think they are good. Youll find that the HoT raiders are more willing to work with you. I suggest you do what most of the bad raiders do and create your own squad and ask for obscene amounts of kp. Noone will question you for fear of getting kicked. Or if your pockets are deep just buy them.

Noone will question sure they will leave and find a better team

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@Magnus Godrik.5841 said:Yeah i can see where your coming from. So lets be honest, in every mmo most raiders are a holes, especially the below average ones who think they are good. Youll find that the HoT raiders are more willing to work with you. I suggest you do what most of the bad raiders do and create your own squad and ask for obscene amounts of kp. Noone will question you for fear of getting kicked. Or if your pockets are deep just buy them.

Trying to cheat the system won't have the outcome you hoped for..if you set high expectations, you can be sure they will expect the same.They will have mastered their class.They will have arcdps.They will not kick you, as you obviously can't kick at commander...but they are not gonna stay with you either if you mess everything up.

Every month we have atleast a fake-linker when we are looking for a replacement dps, it becomes clear fast who has experience and who pretends to have.The outcome however never changes, full raid clear on our part..lonely lfg search on the other.

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