Why do poeple make such a big fuss about no downstate when it is the norm in 90% of other games?

[Obtena.7952]

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Easy ... they can sell mount skins ... it's a business decision.

And no .. what is better is the eye of the beholder. It's COMPLETELY subjective.

Ah so like i have saying this whole time, pandering to casuals with handholding to sell skins dumbing the game down for the dedicated minority, got it.

Like I have been saying this whole time ... it looks like you aren't playing the right game, not that GW2 doesn't do something the way you think it should.

I had no complaints (except mirage balance lol) pre-mounts. Still doesn't make the game not worse in the ways i just described. In other PvP games when devs do this kitten they actually fix it.

Sure, there are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that. If that market share is a group of players you don't share the same values with that Anet panders to ...

you

aren't playing the right game.

By your logic heavilly pay to win games are also perfectly fine, just because something sells doesn't mean it's good. Look, i know you are just taking this from a "realistic" approach but i want my devs to fix their games and not just jump towards the next disaster game to repeat the cycle, which is why i play few games, but play those a lot.

Devs aren't going to fix anything in this game because of what 90% of other games do, PERIOD. Maybe you are new to GW2 but the history of this game is Anet doing things they way they want, not cloning of other games. Whether you frivolous label something good or bad doesn't mean much either. This game has down state ... and if Anet thought it was a bad idea, they would remove it. Clearly they don't. You thinking downstate is bad because other games don't have it means nothing.

Sounds to me that you should pick and play games for the things you like in them instead of complaining of the things you don't. If this game has flaws you don't like and you think it panders to an audience resulting in bad decisions because of money and profits over fun and 'being good', I don't see why you continue to play it. I've only ever seen you complain.

And yeah ... for SOME people, heavily P2W games are perfectly fine ... and they play them and enjoy them. The marketshare of players those games capture is indicative of how many people think it's perfectly fine. I know this offends your sense of what an MMO should be ... but you need to get over that pretty fast because MMO's aren't about you.

I am stating that downstate is bad because it only helps the outnumbering/worse players that get carried by it.

It does make a game objectively bad, just because some poeple like kitten doesn't mean it doesn't still taste like kitten.

Guess i will repeat myself ... again.

There are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

No, but it does make what you say irrelevant ... Anet is going to appeal to a certain market of players and if those players spend money on the game and Anet will continue to try to appeal to them. Whether you are right or wrong doesn't matter. That's why how you think about this game doesn't make sense. It's not an academic exercise in being the 'most correct MMO ever'. It's a business.

[Anput.4620]

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Easy ... they can sell mount skins ... it's a business decision.

And no .. what is better is the eye of the beholder. It's COMPLETELY subjective.

Ah so like i have saying this whole time, pandering to casuals with handholding to sell skins dumbing the game down for the dedicated minority, got it.

Like I have been saying this whole time ... it looks like you aren't playing the right game, not that GW2 doesn't do something the way you think it should.

I had no complaints (except mirage balance lol) pre-mounts. Still doesn't make the game not worse in the ways i just described. In other PvP games when devs do this kitten they actually fix it.

Sure, there are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that. If that market share is a group of players you don't share the same values with that Anet panders to ...

you

aren't playing the right game.

By your logic heavilly pay to win games are also perfectly fine, just because something sells doesn't mean it's good. Look, i know you are just taking this from a "realistic" approach but i want my devs to fix their games and not just jump towards the next disaster game to repeat the cycle, which is why i play few games, but play those a lot.

Devs aren't going to fix anything in this game because of what 90% of other games do, PERIOD. Maybe you are new to GW2 but the history of this game is Anet doing things they way they want, not cloning of other games. Whether you frivolous label something good or bad doesn't mean much either. This game has down state ... and if Anet thought it was a bad idea, they would remove it. Clearly they don't. You thinking downstate is bad because other games don't have it means nothing.

Sounds to me that you should pick and play games for the things you like in them instead of complaining of the things you don't. If this game has flaws you don't like and you think it panders to an audience resulting in bad decisions because of money and profits over fun and 'being good', I don't see why you continue to play it. I've only ever seen you complain.

And yeah ... for SOME people, heavily P2W games are perfectly fine ... and they play them and enjoy them. The marketshare of players those games capture is indicative of how many people think it's perfectly fine. I know this offends your sense of what an MMO should be ... but you need to get over that pretty fast because MMO's aren't about you.

I am stating that downstate is bad because it only helps the outnumbering/worse players that get carried by it.

It does make a game objectively bad, just because some poeple like kitten doesn't mean it doesn't still taste like kitten.

Guess i will repeat myself ... again.

There are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

No, but it does make what you say irrelevant ... Anet is going to appeal to a certain market of players and if those players spend money on the game, whether you are right or wrong doesn't matter.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

I just want a good game.

WvW is basically a PvE mode now, these mounts wouldn't fly in any other PvP game. Removing substance and dumbing down for money, that's just sad.

[Obtena.7952]

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Easy ... they can sell mount skins ... it's a business decision.

And no .. what is better is the eye of the beholder. It's COMPLETELY subjective.

Ah so like i have saying this whole time, pandering to casuals with handholding to sell skins dumbing the game down for the dedicated minority, got it.

Like I have been saying this whole time ... it looks like you aren't playing the right game, not that GW2 doesn't do something the way you think it should.

I had no complaints (except mirage balance lol) pre-mounts. Still doesn't make the game not worse in the ways i just described. In other PvP games when devs do this kitten they actually fix it.

Sure, there are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that. If that market share is a group of players you don't share the same values with that Anet panders to ...

you

aren't playing the right game.

By your logic heavilly pay to win games are also perfectly fine, just because something sells doesn't mean it's good. Look, i know you are just taking this from a "realistic" approach but i want my devs to fix their games and not just jump towards the next disaster game to repeat the cycle, which is why i play few games, but play those a lot.

Devs aren't going to fix anything in this game because of what 90% of other games do, PERIOD. Maybe you are new to GW2 but the history of this game is Anet doing things they way they want, not cloning of other games. Whether you frivolous label something good or bad doesn't mean much either. This game has down state ... and if Anet thought it was a bad idea, they would remove it. Clearly they don't. You thinking downstate is bad because other games don't have it means nothing.

Sounds to me that you should pick and play games for the things you like in them instead of complaining of the things you don't. If this game has flaws you don't like and you think it panders to an audience resulting in bad decisions because of money and profits over fun and 'being good', I don't see why you continue to play it. I've only ever seen you complain.

And yeah ... for SOME people, heavily P2W games are perfectly fine ... and they play them and enjoy them. The marketshare of players those games capture is indicative of how many people think it's perfectly fine. I know this offends your sense of what an MMO should be ... but you need to get over that pretty fast because MMO's aren't about you.

I am stating that downstate is bad because it only helps the outnumbering/worse players that get carried by it.

It does make a game objectively bad, just because some poeple like kitten doesn't mean it doesn't still taste like kitten.

Guess i will repeat myself ... again.

There are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

No, but it does make what you say irrelevant ... Anet is going to appeal to a certain market of players and if those players spend money on the game, whether you are right or wrong doesn't matter.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

I just want a good game.

Just because there are things in the game you don't like, doesn't mean it's not a good game. If you don't like the game because of the market it appeals to, little you say will change that because it's the market it appeals to that sustains the game. Again, this isn't about you being right or wrong. It's a business. If you don't like how Anet runs that business, don't patronize it. if you aren't part of the market it appeals to, why are you playing it?

[Anput.4620]

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Easy ... they can sell mount skins ... it's a business decision.

And no .. what is better is the eye of the beholder. It's COMPLETELY subjective.

Ah so like i have saying this whole time, pandering to casuals with handholding to sell skins dumbing the game down for the dedicated minority, got it.

Like I have been saying this whole time ... it looks like you aren't playing the right game, not that GW2 doesn't do something the way you think it should.

I had no complaints (except mirage balance lol) pre-mounts. Still doesn't make the game not worse in the ways i just described. In other PvP games when devs do this kitten they actually fix it.

Sure, there are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that. If that market share is a group of players you don't share the same values with that Anet panders to ...

you

aren't playing the right game.

By your logic heavilly pay to win games are also perfectly fine, just because something sells doesn't mean it's good. Look, i know you are just taking this from a "realistic" approach but i want my devs to fix their games and not just jump towards the next disaster game to repeat the cycle, which is why i play few games, but play those a lot.

Devs aren't going to fix anything in this game because of what 90% of other games do, PERIOD. Maybe you are new to GW2 but the history of this game is Anet doing things they way they want, not cloning of other games. Whether you frivolous label something good or bad doesn't mean much either. This game has down state ... and if Anet thought it was a bad idea, they would remove it. Clearly they don't. You thinking downstate is bad because other games don't have it means nothing.

Sounds to me that you should pick and play games for the things you like in them instead of complaining of the things you don't. If this game has flaws you don't like and you think it panders to an audience resulting in bad decisions because of money and profits over fun and 'being good', I don't see why you continue to play it. I've only ever seen you complain.

And yeah ... for SOME people, heavily P2W games are perfectly fine ... and they play them and enjoy them. The marketshare of players those games capture is indicative of how many people think it's perfectly fine. I know this offends your sense of what an MMO should be ... but you need to get over that pretty fast because MMO's aren't about you.

I am stating that downstate is bad because it only helps the outnumbering/worse players that get carried by it.

It does make a game objectively bad, just because some poeple like kitten doesn't mean it doesn't still taste like kitten.

Guess i will repeat myself ... again.

There are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

No, but it does make what you say irrelevant ... Anet is going to appeal to a certain market of players and if those players spend money on the game, whether you are right or wrong doesn't matter.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

I just want a good game.

Just because there are things in the game you don't like, doesn't mean it's not a good game. If you don't like the game because of the market it appeals to, little you say will change that because it's the market that sustains the game. Again, this isn't about you being right or wrong. It's a business. If you don't like how Anet runs that business, don't patronize it. if you aren't part of the market it appeals to, why are you playing it?

Because quality of product, especially in gaming, isn't decided on how much money it makes, That's the reason cashgrabs make so much money.

[Obtena.7952]

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Easy ... they can sell mount skins ... it's a business decision.

And no .. what is better is the eye of the beholder. It's COMPLETELY subjective.

Ah so like i have saying this whole time, pandering to casuals with handholding to sell skins dumbing the game down for the dedicated minority, got it.

Like I have been saying this whole time ... it looks like you aren't playing the right game, not that GW2 doesn't do something the way you think it should.

I had no complaints (except mirage balance lol) pre-mounts. Still doesn't make the game not worse in the ways i just described. In other PvP games when devs do this kitten they actually fix it.

Sure, there are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that. If that market share is a group of players you don't share the same values with that Anet panders to ...

you

aren't playing the right game.

By your logic heavilly pay to win games are also perfectly fine, just because something sells doesn't mean it's good. Look, i know you are just taking this from a "realistic" approach but i want my devs to fix their games and not just jump towards the next disaster game to repeat the cycle, which is why i play few games, but play those a lot.

Devs aren't going to fix anything in this game because of what 90% of other games do, PERIOD. Maybe you are new to GW2 but the history of this game is Anet doing things they way they want, not cloning of other games. Whether you frivolous label something good or bad doesn't mean much either. This game has down state ... and if Anet thought it was a bad idea, they would remove it. Clearly they don't. You thinking downstate is bad because other games don't have it means nothing.

Sounds to me that you should pick and play games for the things you like in them instead of complaining of the things you don't. If this game has flaws you don't like and you think it panders to an audience resulting in bad decisions because of money and profits over fun and 'being good', I don't see why you continue to play it. I've only ever seen you complain.

And yeah ... for SOME people, heavily P2W games are perfectly fine ... and they play them and enjoy them. The marketshare of players those games capture is indicative of how many people think it's perfectly fine. I know this offends your sense of what an MMO should be ... but you need to get over that pretty fast because MMO's aren't about you.

I am stating that downstate is bad because it only helps the outnumbering/worse players that get carried by it.

It does make a game objectively bad, just because some poeple like kitten doesn't mean it doesn't still taste like kitten.

Guess i will repeat myself ... again.

There are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

No, but it does make what you say irrelevant ... Anet is going to appeal to a certain market of players and if those players spend money on the game, whether you are right or wrong doesn't matter.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

I just want a good game.

Just because there are things in the game you don't like, doesn't mean it's not a good game. If you don't like the game because of the market it appeals to, little you say will change that because it's the market that sustains the game. Again, this isn't about you being right or wrong. It's a business. If you don't like how Anet runs that business, don't patronize it. if you aren't part of the market it appeals to, why are you playing it?

Because quality of product, especially in gaming, isn't decided on how much money it makes

OK .. but the quality of a product is not decided by you either. For some people, the quality is better based on some of the features you don't like. Again, what is good or bad is a subjective assessment; the market share the game captures indicates the appeal it has in the market and is also indicative of its quality for that market segment. If the market segment that the game targets thought it was trash quality, the game would lose some part of that share.

I think you have a lot to learn about how things work ... in general.

[Anput.4620]

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:Easy ... they can sell mount skins ... it's a business decision.

And no .. what is better is the eye of the beholder. It's COMPLETELY subjective.

Ah so like i have saying this whole time, pandering to casuals with handholding to sell skins dumbing the game down for the dedicated minority, got it.

Like I have been saying this whole time ... it looks like you aren't playing the right game, not that GW2 doesn't do something the way you think it should.

I had no complaints (except mirage balance lol) pre-mounts. Still doesn't make the game not worse in the ways i just described. In other PvP games when devs do this kitten they actually fix it.

Sure, there are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that. If that market share is a group of players you don't share the same values with that Anet panders to ...

you

aren't playing the right game.

By your logic heavilly pay to win games are also perfectly fine, just because something sells doesn't mean it's good. Look, i know you are just taking this from a "realistic" approach but i want my devs to fix their games and not just jump towards the next disaster game to repeat the cycle, which is why i play few games, but play those a lot.

Devs aren't going to fix anything in this game because of what 90% of other games do, PERIOD. Maybe you are new to GW2 but the history of this game is Anet doing things they way they want, not cloning of other games. Whether you frivolous label something good or bad doesn't mean much either. This game has down state ... and if Anet thought it was a bad idea, they would remove it. Clearly they don't. You thinking downstate is bad because other games don't have it means nothing.

Sounds to me that you should pick and play games for the things you like in them instead of complaining of the things you don't. If this game has flaws you don't like and you think it panders to an audience resulting in bad decisions because of money and profits over fun and 'being good', I don't see why you continue to play it. I've only ever seen you complain.

And yeah ... for SOME people, heavily P2W games are perfectly fine ... and they play them and enjoy them. The marketshare of players those games capture is indicative of how many people think it's perfectly fine. I know this offends your sense of what an MMO should be ... but you need to get over that pretty fast because MMO's aren't about you.

I am stating that downstate is bad because it only helps the outnumbering/worse players that get carried by it.

It does make a game objectively bad, just because some poeple like kitten doesn't mean it doesn't still taste like kitten.

Guess i will repeat myself ... again.

There are some aspects of the game you don't like that are worse, even if that's an objective assessment. But again, what happens in other games is irrelevant and as long as Anet has a successful formula for getting a market share of players and getting them to shell out their money for things, there is little you are going to say that will change that.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

No, but it does make what you say irrelevant ... Anet is going to appeal to a certain market of players and if those players spend money on the game, whether you are right or wrong doesn't matter.

Still doesn't make me wrong.

I just want a good game.

Just because there are things in the game you don't like, doesn't mean it's not a good game. If you don't like the game because of the market it appeals to, little you say will change that because it's the market that sustains the game. Again, this isn't about you being right or wrong. It's a business. If you don't like how Anet runs that business, don't patronize it. if you aren't part of the market it appeals to, why are you playing it?

Because quality of product, especially in gaming, isn't decided on how much money it makes

OK .. but that's not decided by you either. For some people, the quality is better based on some of the features you don't like. Again, what is good or bad is a subjective assessment; the market share the game captures indicates the appeal it has in the market and is also indicative of it's quality for that market segment.

I think you have a lot to learn about how things work ... in general.

Whenever a game has a more dedicated and less casual fanbase it shows in the redeemable qualities and depth/options of the game, those games just offer way more than other games.

Most boardgame players agree monopoly is shit compared to most of the quality games they play, yet monopoly prints 10x as much money as any of those games. Why are you even seeing this from anets perspective and not a player perspective anyways?

[Obtena.7952]

@Anput.4620 said:Whenever a game has a more dedicated and less casual fanbase it shows in the redeemable qualities and depth/options of the game, those games just offer way more than other games.

Most boardgame players agree monopoly is kitten compared to most of the quality games they play, yet monopoly prints 10x as much money as any of those games. Why are you even seeing this from anets perspective and not a player perspective anyways?

That's nice ... it doesn't change anything I have I said.I see this from the REALISTIC perspective ... I don't see any other way to look at it. I mean, what makes you think the players of this game who make up the market that play it agree with you? Your whole thread is based on the fact that most of the people who play were complaining about no down state ... seems to me the player perspective IS inline with what Anet is doing there.

At this at this point, your ego is telling you that you speak for all players. That's certainly not real.

[Anput.4620]

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:Whenever a game has a more dedicated and less casual fanbase it shows in the redeemable qualities and depth/options of the game, those games just offer way more than other games.

Most boardgame players agree monopoly is kitten compared to most of the quality games they play, yet monopoly prints 10x as much money as any of those games. Why are you even seeing this from anets perspective and not a player perspective anyways?

That's nice ... it doesn't change anything I have I said.I see this from the REALISTIC perspective ... I don't see any other way to look at it.

My problem is that if everyone had that perspective everything would just go to shit.

Just look at EA, they are shit yet basically print money.

[spectrito.8513]

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:Whenever a game has a more dedicated and less casual fanbase it shows in the redeemable qualities and depth/options of the game, those games just offer way more than other games.

Most boardgame players agree monopoly is kitten compared to most of the quality games they play, yet monopoly prints 10x as much money as any of those games. Why are you even seeing this from anets perspective and not a player perspective anyways?

That's nice ... it doesn't change anything I have I said.I see this from the REALISTIC perspective ... I don't see any other way to look at it.

My problem is that if everyone had that perspective everything would just go to kitten.

Just look at EA, they are kitten yet basically print money.

Yes, make it P2W ANet !!!!! More $$$$ this way

[Obtena.7952]

@Anput.4620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Anput.4620 said:Whenever a game has a more dedicated and less casual fanbase it shows in the redeemable qualities and depth/options of the game, those games just offer way more than other games.

Most boardgame players agree monopoly is kitten compared to most of the quality games they play, yet monopoly prints 10x as much money as any of those games. Why are you even seeing this from anets perspective and not a player perspective anyways?

That's nice ... it doesn't change anything I have I said.I see this from the REALISTIC perspective ... I don't see any other way to look at it.

My problem is that if everyone had that perspective everything would just go to kitten.

That doesn't make sense ... what do you mean 'if everyone'? If everyone has the perspective of realism, we would have less nonsensical complaints where people pretend what they think is the 'correct' and only way things should be done and where people think they speak for everyone.

Anet makes a game, it appeals to a market that sustains it ... for many years now. How is everything going to shit? What you are saying doesn't match reality.

[Kylden Ar.3724]

@"Mil.3562" said:You must be new. The reasons cannot be more obvious :

1. This is GW2, not other games.
2. Other games have no finisher animations, where in GW2 many players actually use real cash to buy those down-state finishers.
3. Other games have no downed skills, we have.
4. Other games have no wvw
5. And yah, did I mention this is GW2, not other games?

He seems to be. I never saw him post in WvW until the mount came out and 'ruined his fun'. Which is funny as he's on my block list in game and I only ever see his location as Lion's Arch with such low AP that he's barely played the game at all. Post history indicates he only took an interest in WvW after PoF hit (asking about a WvW Deadeye build in July of 2018) when the idea of a CoD style ganker first came into the game. Probably a third of his current post count is anti-mount, which is when we started seeing him everywhere complaining he could not make people fight him with the mount in play anymore.

Anyone paying attention knows that's code for, "I can't gank people 1v1 set up for team builds anymore."

Which, I get being mad your play-style is ruined by patches. I really do. The marked and revealed stuff in WvW really put a hamper on my stealth scouting. The Warclaw really put another nail in scouting as once you're spotted in enemy territory you're dead.

What I don't get is whining here about it instead of adapting. He clearly gets most of the game mode concepts from his posts, he gets the game core concepts, so why not just adapt? Join the zerg if you want fights. Be a Scrapper, Holosmith, or Soulbeast if you want to roam. But being mad that ANet is trying to make ganking nearly impossible because it doesn't fit the concept of their game and is simply un-fun and a mode turn off for those being ganked and thinking you'll turn back the clock is wasting both his time and everyone else's.

ANet made it clear they really don't want Roamers in WvW anymore. Fine, I dusted off my Revenant, Guardian, and Engineer.

ANet want GW2 to be different from other MMO, another reason why we have no ' holy trinity classes '. But I think that idea failed badly because now players only want dps class for raids and fractals. The game has no holy trinity but only holy singularity lol

So very true. I don't know why people bother grinding out Legendary anymore when it's pure DPS or go home.

[SkyShroud.2865]

@Anput.4620 said:

@"SkyShroud.2865" said:In other games, instead of "down", they give you healer to ress them. In this game, they remove ress to be replace with downs.

No? Most video games don't have dedicated healers, and the ones that do they can only res you when you are dead and it takes a long time, you can't be saved by having numbers basically.

Since you mentioned "most video games don't have dedicated healers". I would like some clarification, which games have and which games don't?

Taking a long time to ress someone and not possible to ress anyone are two very different thing. The combat change accordingly to that as well which involve focusing on people attempting to ress than focusing people that is resisting.

[Anput.4620]

@Kylden Ar.3724 said:

@"Mil.3562" said:You must be new. The reasons cannot be more obvious :

1. This is GW2, not other games.
2. Other games have no finisher animations, where in GW2 many players actually use real cash to buy those down-state finishers.
3. Other games have no downed skills, we have.
4. Other games have no wvw
5. And yah, did I mention this is GW2, not other games?

He seems to be. I never saw him post in WvW until the mount came out and 'ruined his fun'. Which is funny as he's on my block list in game and I only ever see his location as Lion's Arch with such low AP that he's barely played the game at all. Post history indicates he only took an interest in WvW after PoF hit (asking about a WvW Deadeye build in July of 2018) when the idea of a CoD style ganker first came into the game. Probably a third of his current post count is anti-mount, which is when we started seeing him everywhere complaining he could not make people fight him with the mount in play anymore.

Anyone paying attention knows that's code for, "I can't gank people 1v1 set up for team builds anymore."

Which, I get being mad your play-style is ruined by patches. I really do. The marked and revealed stuff in WvW really put a hamper on my stealth scouting. The Warclaw really put another nail in scouting as once you're spotted in enemy territory you're dead.

What I don't get is whining here about it instead of adapting. He clearly gets most of the game mode concepts from his posts, he gets the game core concepts, so why not just adapt? Join the zerg if you want fights. Be a Scrapper, Holosmith, or Soulbeast if you want to roam. But being mad that ANet is trying to make ganking nearly impossible because it doesn't fit the concept of their game

and is simply un-fun and a mode turn off for those being ganked

and thinking you'll turn back the clock is wasting both his time and everyone else's.

ANet made it clear they really don't want Roamers in WvW anymore. Fine, I dusted off my Revenant, Guardian, and Engineer.

ANet want GW2 to be different from other MMO, another reason why we have no ' holy trinity classes '. But I think that idea failed badly because now players only want dps class for raids and fractals. The game has no holy trinity but only holy singularity lol

So very true. I don't know why people bother grinding out Legendary anymore when it's pure DPS or go home.

Here you go and talk about things being unfun again when that has nothing to do with balance.

There is also literally nothing wrong with what you refer to as "ganking", you can't say anything to where it is a wrong thing to do. I don't see why you keep using this word as argument when it is empty really. Why is it so evil to you that i attack someone i meet while traveling? Like isn't that how PvP goes where if you run around and see an enemy you attack? Isn't that standard? I really don't see how you can call this a good PvP mode while saying they pander to casual ktrainers that don't want to fight and just PvD.

Anet didn't make jack clear, otherwise we wouldn't be getting a dismount skill.

Deciding to devolve your mode into a ktrain mode to make money is also sad af.

I don't want fights, i want smallscale fights, like at most involving 4 poeple total but prefferably 1v1 or 1v2.

Like really though, a whole playstyle being ruined by a feature clearly shows the feature isn't balanced, how can you still say the mounts aren't overtuned? Anyone with half a brain sees they are. Also, i mained warrior, not thief back then lol. I just wanted to try it out as i loved the idea of rifle thief.

To me it just seems that you are biased and just want to do your zerging in peace without being bothered in an open world PvP mode. WvW was supposed to be fair game, as these modes are, but now it isn't anymore.

The argument that other games don't do this BS is valid because at this point the mode is devoid from an actual world PvP mode, i don't see how this mode appeals anymore to PvP oriented players. Like why do you want this to be yet another PvE mode? I really don't get it. Can't those poeple just go farm silverwastes or something?

Also, yes, dying isn't fun, but if you die ingame you don't die in real life.

I just want shit to be objectively fair and in balance between all playstyles, how isn't that the fair opinion to have? You basically say "I don't like what you like so you can't like it" now, zergers where excelled in zergs, roamers excelled in roaming and everyone was fine for 6 years, so why remove one of the 2 just to make things unfair? You can't give me another answer than it being in your, and other zergers advantage, that's literally it, pure bias.

Even if the mode is objective-based, that doesn't mean you shouldn't be able to kill poeple to defend them, or preventing them from getting to them, or attacking them along with the objective. All advantages to your team.

I did try to adapt and play longbow, it is still way shit compared to before and the cancerous situations that form while roaming are just mindblowingly bad. I am at backcamp, 20 mounted poeple arrive so i move to hide in a corner, i then kill the guards 1 by 1, a group of necros then comes to take the camp. Or i defend a camp and mounted poeple come back faster than i can kill them 1 by 1, or i can't attack one person for 10 seconds before 2 others jumping on me with cats. This adapting thing doesn't exist, you are telling me to eat soup with a fork after my spoon got replaced. I downed someone 2 times in a 1v2, yet i lost, this is why downstate is bad, it always favours the worse player, why do we need handicapping/handholding like this? Can you tell me how it is fair?

Also from the moment i started playing this game i only played for WvW lol.

Can't you see how this is a simple matter of a change that made the game unfair and unbalanced for lots of poeple? A change that even negatively affects zerglings where i heard that some servers avoid all day then nightcap and win like that. Unless said zerglings didn't care about the fight in the first place and if that is whom you are catering to, poeple that never wanted the fight in any form in the first place then what are you even doing with your game, you can't not call that objectively shit.

Did we ever even met ingame? Lol.

[Kylden Ar.3724]

@Anput.4620 said:

@Kylden Ar.3724 said:

@"Mil.3562" said:You must be new. The reasons cannot be more obvious :

1. This is GW2, not other games.
2. Other games have no finisher animations, where in GW2 many players actually use real cash to buy those down-state finishers.
3. Other games have no downed skills, we have.
4. Other games have no wvw
5. And yah, did I mention this is GW2, not other games?

He seems to be. I never saw him post in WvW until the mount came out and 'ruined his fun'. Which is funny as he's on my block list in game and I only ever see his location as Lion's Arch with such low AP that he's barely played the game at all. Post history indicates he only took an interest in WvW after PoF hit (asking about a WvW Deadeye build in July of 2018) when the idea of a CoD style ganker first came into the game. Probably a third of his current post count is anti-mount, which is when we started seeing him everywhere complaining he could not make people fight him with the mount in play anymore.

Anyone paying attention knows that's code for, "I can't gank people 1v1 set up for team builds anymore."

Which, I get being mad your play-style is ruined by patches. I really do. The marked and revealed stuff in WvW really put a hamper on my stealth scouting. The Warclaw really put another nail in scouting as once you're spotted in enemy territory you're dead.

What I don't get is whining here about it instead of adapting. He clearly gets most of the game mode concepts from his posts, he gets the game core concepts, so why not just adapt? Join the zerg if you want fights. Be a Scrapper, Holosmith, or Soulbeast if you want to roam. But being mad that ANet is trying to make ganking nearly impossible because it doesn't fit the concept of their game

and is simply un-fun and a mode turn off for those being ganked

and thinking you'll turn back the clock is wasting both his time and everyone else's.

ANet made it clear they really don't want Roamers in WvW anymore. Fine, I dusted off my Revenant, Guardian, and Engineer.

ANet want GW2 to be different from other MMO, another reason why we have no ' holy trinity classes '. But I think that idea failed badly because now players only want dps class for raids and fractals. The game has no holy trinity but only holy singularity lol

So very true. I don't know why people bother grinding out Legendary anymore when it's pure DPS or go home.

Here you go and talk about things being unfun again when that has nothing to do with balance.

In fact it does. The very concept of balance exists in games for purposes of enhancing fun.

There is also literally nothing wrong with what you refer to as "ganking", you can't say anything to where it is a wrong thing to do. I don't see why you keep using this word as argument when it is empty really. Why is it so evil to you that i attack someone i meet while traveling? Like isn't that how PvP goes where if you run around and see an enemy you attack? Isn't that standard? I really don't see how you can call this a good PvP mode while saying they pander to casual ktrainers that don't want to fight and just PvD.

It's not a good PvP mode. ANet by recent patches seems to regard it as a PvE sandbox mode simulating siege warfare with occasional PvP. As I have said before, if it was meant to be a PvP mode it would use PvP amulets, keep everyone at same stat level, and disallow foods/boosters.

Anet didn't make jack clear, otherwise we wouldn't be getting a dismount skill.

They have reduced wall HP and introduced the Warclaw. To anyone actually seeing how that impacts the mode it is abundantly clear.

Deciding to devolve your mode into a ktrain mode to make money is also sad af.

On that we agree, except it is not my nor your mode. It is ANets. We do not own it. We just play in it.

I don't want fights, i want smallscale fights, like at most involving 4 poeple total but prefferably 1v1 or 1v2.

So do I, but like I said they seem to be pushing it to minimum squads of 10-15.

Like really though, a whole playstyle being ruined by a feature clearly shows the feature isn't balanced, how can you still say the mounts aren't overtuned? Anyone with half a brain sees they are. Also, i mained warrior, not thief back then lol. I just wanted to try it out as i loved the idea of rifle thief.

Please go back to my post and tell me exactly where I said that exactly? All I am saying is that I am making my peace with ANet's intent to keep it to sell Gemshop items.

To me it just seems that you are biased and just want to do your zerging in peace without being bothered in an open world PvP mode. WvW was supposed to be fair game, as these modes are, but now it isn't anymore.

And again, you clearly don't pay attention to what I write here or how long I've been around and topics. For the longest time my signature pointed out I lead a roaming/havoc guild, until ANet killed that concept with the Warclaw. So I adapted to the way ANet intends it and play zerg now with a larger guild.

I only play the roaming classes I have when I'm looking to sneak in and out for dailies really quick.

The argument that other games don't do this BS is valid because at this point the mode is devoid from an actual world PvP mode, i don't see how this mode appeals anymore to PvP oriented players. Like why do you want this to be yet another PvE mode? I really don't get it. Can't those poeple just go farm silverwastes or something?

I assume ANet thinks if you want PvP you'll go play the PvP mode.

Also, yes, dying isn't fun, but if you die ingame you don't die in real life.

I just want kitten to be objectively fair and in balance between all playstyles, how isn't that the fair opinion to have? You basically say "I don't like what you like so you can't like it" now, zergers where excelled in zergs, roamers excelled in roaming and everyone was fine for 6 years, so why remove one of the 2 just to make things unfair? You can't give me another answer than it being in your, and other zergers advantage, that's literally it, pure bias.

That train left the station when HoT hit and they introduced elite spec power creep and gliding in WvW. You are about 3-4 years late there. If you thought these things were balanced for the whole 6 years I would hazard you are not playing the same game as the rest of us, or in a time zone all your own.

Even if the mode is objective-based, that doesn't mean you shouldn't be able to kill poeple to defend them, or preventing them from getting to them, or attacking them along with the objective. All advantages to your team.

Agree, if they want to stop to fight me. I am NOT chasing a person half across the map when they clearly don't want to fight and will just lead me into a zerg murderball anyway. If anything the Warclaw made those people easier to spot and ignore.

I did try to adapt and play longbow, it is still way kitten compared to before and the cancerous situations that form while roaming are just mindblowingly bad. I am at backcamp, 20 mounted poeple arrive so i move to hide in a corner, i then kill the guards 1 by 1, a group of necros then comes to take the camp. Or i defend a camp and mounted poeple come back faster than i can kill them 1 by 1, or i can't attack one person for 10 seconds before 2 others jumping on me with cats. This adapting thing doesn't exist, you are telling me to eat soup with a fork after my spoon got replaced. I downed someone 2 times in a 1v2, yet i lost, this is why downstate is bad, it always favours the worse player, why do we need handicapping/handholding like this? Can you tell me how it is fair?

Maybe you should learn you can't gank 1 by 1 anymore, you need to hit and get out, or, god forbid, fight with allies in a team mode, like ANet clearly intends.

Also from the moment i started playing this game i only played for WvW lol.

Sure, ok, that's why you think the mode was balanced and fine the last 6 years? Ok, sure.

Can't you see how this is a simple matter of a change that made the game unfair and unbalanced for lots of poeple? A change that even negatively affects zerglings where i heard that some servers avoid all day then nightcap and win like that. Unless said zerglings didn't care about the fight in the first place and if that is whom you are catering to, poeple that never wanted the fight in any form in the first place then what are you even doing with your game, you can't not call that objectively kitten.

Again, it's not my game. Not yours either. Maybe if you buy a lot of stock you can have a real say. Otherwise vote with your wallet and time. They will not listen here.

Did we ever even met ingame? Lol.

There are 3 reasons someone will hit my block list:

1. It's Monkey or one of his many alt accounts.
2. It's a gold seller.
3. They harassed me after I killed them or had the gall to fail to die to them in WvW/PvP.

As you are 1) Not Monkey or 2) clearly not a gold seller we have to assume you fell into category 3.

You were there BEFORE you started complaining about Warclaw ever other post, and ever since you started I been spot checking where you are. I only have seen you in a WvW map about 30% of the time. The rest is a lot of sitting in LA. So, yeah, you might mostly play WvW when you play, but seems like you sit in LA a lot complaining about Warclaw.

Which doesn't help you. May I recommend this might not be the game for you anymore? I play a lot less these days for similar reasons (and them gutting my main class). But I don't post 3-10 times a day complaining because they have made it clear they don't listen here.