Give Jaunt 3 charges again

[Sampson.2403]

3 jaunts is better than 2 jaunts bro. Did did didn't cha no ? It's a QoL thing for harlem globetrotter meme players like myself. 33% bro

[MikeL.8260]

@sephiroth.4217 said:

Bro its the forums, everyone here is high plat or legendary and anyone they speak too is middle silver or below.

Well my main char is Digressio and you can see me often in the EU pvp lobby, nothing to hide, in most of my matches I play against people with Indomidable and Ruthless Legend titles so..

[praqtos.9035]

@Sampson.2403 said:3 jaunts is better than 2 jaunts bro. Did did didn't cha no ? It's a QoL thing for harlem globetrotter meme players like myself. 33% broDude, look at mesmer nerfs they have applied before?They not just nerfed core class,they butchered it. How is your specific MIRAGE change would help the class?In fact jaunt doesnt even deserve to be an elite skill. Its more of an utility ...at best.

[Sampson.2403]

I'm not saying that it's going to drastically change mesmer in anyway lol, i just want 3 jaunts. Having an extra jaunt is definitely noticeable tho and that's all that I'm after here. Sometimes having something as simple as an extra jaunt can make a mans day.

[praqtos.9035]

I dont even understand how this going to make your day ... In my vision any mirage build is unplayble without blind shatter trait. If they would make 20s cd on jaunt this would be much better than 3rd jaunt

[otto.5684]

@Twilight Tempest.7584 said:

@"LegendaVagyok.9132" said:Please do not buff anything for Mesmer, let it rather be an useless or less played class.Just leave everything as is, thus savings us from biased people who would criticizing and crying all day long on pvp forum because it’s so unfair and unfun playing against Mesmer which is broken design (sounds familiar right?)Imo the current state of b chrono is borderline useless (plenty better alternatives for that role), pwr shatter is meme (only a handful of players can do it right) and we got a mediocre c mirage which is nerfed to the point where you could not see much of it and literally every spec (more or less) can cleanse with every other skills.

I see what you're saying. There's no question Mesmers were overtuned for a while. The last thing I'd want to see is Mesmers returning to FOTM status. Right now, I think they're squarely middle-of-the pack in terms of performance, neither overperforming nor underperforming, which is okay. But because they were nerfed in often nonsensical ways to get to this point, they're kind of a mess. Too many skills and traits were simply gutted rather than shaved or reworked, destroying entire weapons, utilities, traitlines, and synergies in the process. Viable build variety is at an all time low. And if those builds aren't something we enjoy playing, oh well. The only good thing is the essential end of forum whining.

One side-effect of such heavy-handed re-positioning within the class hierarchy is that those who continue to play Mes are likely at least decent at it. This perpetuates the anecdotal myth that the class is still too strong and requires further nerfs. For example:

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75678/condi-bunker-chrono

. Unfortunately, due to its good run, Mes may always suffer a stigma where people who lose to it automatically think they lost to the class rather than the player.

When you say middle of the pack, I am not sure what pack you are talking about. Even before Feb nerf, Mesmer was not doing that hot in top tiers. After last 2 patches it has no build that can compete in any form. Mesmer is currently is the worst performing class. Even ele is now better.

Ya the 1 shot build still has some steam, but it is hardly viable in higher tiers.

[BlackTruth.6813]

So you can z-axis teleport over and over? Lolz.

[DragonFury.6243]

@Vieux P.1238 said:

@DragonFury.6243 said:NoNoNoNo

NO NO NO is not a valid argument.& at the point it's been skinned, like nill damage output from confusion & only 2 jumps of 450 range with 20 second cooldown, why is it still considered an Elite? If you going to reduce everything that makes it an Elite. Add something to at least keep it as one. 1 jaunt been removed out of 3. Cooldown should of been reduced to 15 sec each. confusion damage from jaunt been reduced, add at least more range to it. It's only fare.

if you want an argument go back and see the merged mesmer threadwe dont Anet to start returning skills to its original design because if they do that the next thing we ll see scourge want his dhuumfire and sand savant back and FC damage back DJ unblockable back etc etcthe skill nerfed for a reason same for all other professionand as long mirage have Self-Deception no 1 want to fight that unhealthy game play the clone vomit is some how equal to scourge corrupt and condi vomityou just have to admit that nerfing jaunt dhuumfire and other was a healthy step to the game modeand i personal want other elite nerfed to be inline with jaunt that mean any panic elite or press to win elite some thing like dagger storm , rampage and many morebut we both know Anetthat mean we have to wait ......... a lot

[Vieux P.1238]

You take a little, you give back a little is all i'm saying. B)

[FyzE.3472]

@mortrialus.3062 said:OP thinks mirage needs buffs.

OK. The amount of likes on this is just... Showing,. People are still mad at mesmers.

[Widmo.3186]

Okay, you get Mirage's 3rd Jaunt back, I get old DD ele. Deal.Also Id like to get old DD teef Steal, old Alacrity, oh and maybe bring back old Scrapper and Zerker.

The future is now old man, no king rules forever and Mirage ruled quite too long.

[XECOR.2814]

Mesmer is fine lul.

[Quadox.7834]

@Widmo.3186 said:Okay, you get Mirage's 3rd Jaunt back, I get old DD ele. Deal.Also Id like to get old DD teef Steal, old Alacrity, oh and maybe bring back old Scrapper and Zerker.

The future is now old man, no king rules forever and Mirage ruled quite too long.

I mean you can get old DD ele back but it would be complete trash now.

[praqtos.9035]

@otto.5684 said:When you say middle of the pack, I am not sure what pack you are talking about. Even before Feb nerf, Mesmer was not doing that hot in top tiers. After last 2 patches it has no build that can compete in any form. Mesmer is currently is the worst performing class. Even ele is now better.

Ya the 1 shot build still has some steam, but it is hardly viable in higher tiers.Its true... Except even playing berserk amulet you arent really oneshotting...@DragonFury.6243and as long mirage have Self-Deception no 1 want to fight that unhealthy game play the clone vomit is some how equal to scourge corrupt and condi vomitSelf decepton trait is terrible and never been playedand i personal want other elite nerfed to be inline with jaunt that mean any panic elite or press to win elite some thing like dagger storm , rampage and many moreTo be on par with jaunt this elite skills need to be 240s cd. Rampage can two shot people on nearly on the same cooldown as jaunt(2counts) that travel way more distance with just 1 button compared to mesmer using both jaunts at once.

[Sindrener.1592]

Buff thief please

[Vieux P.1238]

@praqtos.9035 said:

@otto.5684 said:When you say middle of the pack, I am not sure what pack you are talking about. Even before Feb nerf, Mesmer was not doing that hot in top tiers. After last 2 patches it has no build that can compete in any form. Mesmer is currently is the worst performing class. Even ele is now better.

Ya the 1 shot build still has some steam, but it is hardly viable in higher tiers.Its true... Except even playing berserk amulet you arent really oneshotting...@DragonFury.6243and as long mirage have Self-Deception no 1 want to fight that unhealthy game play the clone vomit is some how equal to scourge corrupt and condi vomitSelf decepton trait is terrible and never been playedand i personal want other elite nerfed to be inline with jaunt that mean any panic elite or press to win elite some thing like dagger storm , rampage and many moreTo be on par with jaunt this elite skills need to be 240s cd. Rampage can two shot people on nearly on the same cooldown as rampage that travel way more distance with just 1 button compared to mesmer using both jaunts at once.

Are ppl really comparing skill's to cheap old jaunt? Like really? Jaunt? a 450 range mini me blink & all of you asking for what in exchange? Wow, the biases is strong.

[Daishi.6027]

In the case of Jaunt remove confusion, give original charges and cooldown. But mirage does need more, however condi needs to be restrained.

For something designed as quoted by a-net to “live longer in fights” it now survives less than most mediums or heavies unless you run.

Compare any power mes to a holo, war, or thief. Condi only does okay, because condi like always only needs one stat to kill.

[Simonoly.4352]

I'd say it's a good time to reinstate the third Jaunt charge and bring the ammo recharge down, now that Anet have rebalanced so much of the primary sustain of Mirage. Two 450 range teleports with a 30 second ammo recharge is absolutely not Elite worthy anymore - it's essentially a really terrible pre-2015 Blink. Ditch the direct damage and confusion and make it all about survivability through quick repositioning just outside of melee range. Also fix the leap combo so you can Jaunt into a combo field to gain the same benefits as other leaps do in the game.

[Master Ketsu.4569]

@EpicTurtle.8571 said:

@"Master Ketsu.4569" said:Mesmers would need a redo to their phantasm rework before any buff to the class could be justified. The current design of the class is just bad for the game in general.

Hell, it's not just bad for GW2. You could copy Mesmers design concept of "rotate defenses while 4-9 clones do the work for you", add it to any PvP oriented game and it would have a negative impact. It would be bad for Overwatch, bad for League of Legends, bad for DOTA, bad for SMITE, bad for Apex, bad for BDO, bad for Blade+Soul, bad for just about anything. The problem with this kind of design is it's uninteractive playstyle means it's either good enough to win fights and therefore breaks the game due to lack of meaningful counterplay, or it's not good enough to win fights and therefore is useless. This is what Anet refuses to accept about the direction they have taken with Mesmers design, it's impossible to properly balance.

You need a redo to your same tired argument. If you're dying to phantasms or clones at this point you need to get better.

Talking about a classes design =/= talking about which class is OP

[EpicTurtle.8571]

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@EpicTurtle.8571 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:Mesmers would need a redo to their phantasm rework before any buff to the class could be justified. The current design of the class is just bad for the game in general.

Hell, it's not just bad for GW2. You could copy Mesmers design concept of "rotate defenses while 4-9 clones do the work for you", add it to any PvP oriented game and it would have a negative impact. It would be bad for Overwatch, bad for League of Legends, bad for DOTA, bad for SMITE, bad for Apex, bad for BDO, bad for Blade+Soul, bad for just about anything. The problem with this kind of design is it's uninteractive playstyle means it's either good enough to win fights and therefore breaks the game due to lack of meaningful counterplay, or it's not good enough to win fights and therefore is useless. This is what Anet refuses to accept about the direction they have taken with Mesmers design, it's impossible to properly balance.

You need a redo to your same tired argument. If you're dying to phantasms or clones at this point you need to get better.

Talking about a classes design =/= talking about which class is OP

And your perception of Mesmers design is still flawed as usual.

[Twilight Tempest.7584]

@otto.5684 said:

@Twilight Tempest.7584 said:

@"LegendaVagyok.9132" said:Please do not buff anything for Mesmer, let it rather be an useless or less played class.Just leave everything as is, thus savings us from biased people who would criticizing and crying all day long on pvp forum because it’s so unfair and unfun playing against Mesmer which is broken design (sounds familiar right?)Imo the current state of b chrono is borderline useless (plenty better alternatives for that role), pwr shatter is meme (only a handful of players can do it right) and we got a mediocre c mirage which is nerfed to the point where you could not see much of it and literally every spec (more or less) can cleanse with every other skills.

I see what you're saying. There's no question Mesmers were overtuned for a while. The last thing I'd want to see is Mesmers returning to FOTM status. Right now, I think they're squarely middle-of-the pack in terms of performance, neither overperforming nor underperforming, which is okay. But because they were nerfed in often nonsensical ways to get to this point, they're kind of a mess. Too many skills and traits were simply gutted rather than shaved or reworked, destroying entire weapons, utilities, traitlines, and synergies in the process. Viable build variety is at an all time low. And if those builds aren't something we enjoy playing, oh well. The only good thing is the essential end of forum whining.

One side-effect of such heavy-handed re-positioning within the class hierarchy is that those who continue to play Mes are likely at least decent at it. This perpetuates the anecdotal myth that the class is still too strong and requires further nerfs. For example:

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75678/condi-bunker-chrono

. Unfortunately, due to its good run, Mes may always suffer a stigma where people who lose to it automatically think they lost to the class rather than the player.

When you say middle of the pack, I am not sure what pack you are talking about. Even before Feb nerf, Mesmer was not doing that hot in top tiers. After last 2 patches it has no build that can compete in any form. Mesmer is currently is the worst performing class. Even ele is now better.

Ya the 1 shot build still has some steam, but it is hardly viable in higher tiers.

I'm sure you're right. I just mean Mes is "viable" in skilled hands. Not basement tier like Renegade and Tempest, but not going to get one very far in the LB if that's what matters. I really really hope someone in the balance team looks at the class performance data after this Season and realizes they've knocked Mes down enough. Time to either bring the rest down as well or give Mes a little back. Preferably the former for now. Then do some reworks later because there are some gaping holes in Mes traitlines and weapon options at the moment.

[Twilight Tempest.7584]

@"praqtos.9035" said:I dont even understand how this going to make your day ... In my vision any mirage build is unplayble without blind shatter trait. If they would make 20s cd on jaunt this would be much better than 3rd jaunt

Given the choice, I'd rather have 20s c/d back than third ammo count. Still doesn't make it an "elite" skill, but baby steps, ya know? :smile: I mean look at some in the community already freaking out about such a modest revert.

"Zomg moar z-axis tele."

"Well if you get your third jaunt back we demand our Full Counter, DD Ele, old Scourge, DJ unblockable, etc., etc. back"--as if those are even comparable to reverting either the c/d or ammo count nerf to Jaunt.

[mortrialus.3062]

@"Master Ketsu.4569" said:Mesmers would need a redo to their phantasm rework before any buff to the class could be justified. The current design of the class is just bad for the game in general.

Hell, it's not just bad for GW2. You could copy Mesmers design concept of "rotate defenses while 4-9 clones do the work for you", add it to any PvP oriented game and it would have a negative impact. It would be bad for Overwatch, bad for League of Legends, bad for DOTA, bad for SMITE, bad for Apex, bad for BDO, bad for Blade+Soul, bad for just about anything. The problem with this kind of design is it's uninteractive playstyle means it's either good enough to win fights and therefore breaks the game due to lack of meaningful counterplay, or it's not good enough to win fights and therefore is useless. This is what Anet refuses to accept about the direction they have taken with Mesmers design, it's impossible to properly balance.

Le Blanc has always been a thing in league of legends. Apex has Mirage who literally makes fake versions of himself.

Phantasms are just like any other profession's 4 or 5 weapon skill just with a unusual delivery system that is separate from the mesmer themselves. There's nothing special about phantasms post rework. If anything phantasms are more healthy for the game post rework. The cast animation is used. The attack comes out. And unless we're talking about Chronomancers with Chronophantasma it's just one attack that can be avoided like any other skill and I've always maintained that based on the current design of phantasms Chronophantasma should have never have been allowed to exist in it's current form. You can run out of the way of the torch phantasm's fire cone and the sword phantasms frenzy attack. You can dodge when the shield phantasms would be spawning to prevent them from spawning in the first place. You can dodge the pistol barrage just like you would a thief's unload. You can dodge the greatsword berserker just like you can a warrior's whirlwind blade. The focus is harder to mitigate as it does a lot of chip damage over a longer time like a guardian's Ray of Judgement. But that's just it, it's chip damage. And you can out range it and line of sight it and once you do it can't close the distance.

And unlike before you aren't going to have to deal with literally endless pistol barrages while the mesmer stealth around with prismatic understanding and stealth spam.

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

Making elite comparisons, its amazing how many ppl are against touching Jaunt, despite even mes players stating the condi/damage should be nerfed, and buff the CD/ammo. Any other skill/class people would be all for it as they are still balancing out the skill.

You hoomans never cease to amaze me

[Vieux P.1238]

@Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:Making elite comparisons, its amazing how many ppl are against touching Jaunt, despite even mes players stating the condi/damage should be nerfed, and buff the CD/ammo. Any other skill/class people would be all for it as they are still balancing out the skill.

You hoomans never cease to amaze me

Yeah but the confusion damage in Jaunt has been reduce to almost nill. Just remove it already & give us back 3 jaunt at 600 range with 20sec recharge. No damage but at least mobility.