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Could War Eternal be about Menzies as well?


Slowpokeking.8720

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@Slowpokeking.8720 said:

@"Eekasqueak.7850" said:Eeh if he shows up it will be in the same way as Dhuum. I doubt the very minor presence of a handful of his minions on a small chunk of land in the ocean will have much bearing on the plot either.

Dhuum was imprisoned, but Menzies is the most powerful non dragon villain for now. I can't see why should he be a raid boss instead of a main plot villain.

I find the statement "most powerful non-dragon villain" to be highly questionable.

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@perilisk.1874 said:

@Slowpokeking.8720 said:Now we saw Fissure of Woe was overran by Menzies' Shadow Army. I bet if we are going to have a break on the dragons, we will have to deal with Balthazar's death and the new war god.

unlikely, menzies would be better suited as raid material then carry an entire LW season

There' s still one left this season, right?

Yes, but that'll be about Qadim again.

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@The Greyhawk.9107 said:

@"Eekasqueak.7850" said:Eeh if he shows up it will be in the same way as Dhuum. I doubt the very minor presence of a handful of his minions on a small chunk of land in the ocean will have much bearing on the plot either.

Dhuum was imprisoned, but Menzies is the most powerful non dragon villain for now. I can't see why should he be a raid boss instead of a main plot villain.

I find the statement "most powerful non-dragon villain" to be highly questionable.

Who else? Abaddon is long gone. Dhuum is strong but he was never 100% freed and was stripped out from his god power. I doubt he is stronger than Menzies.

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@Slowpokeking.8720 said:

@"Eekasqueak.7850" said:Eeh if he shows up it will be in the same way as Dhuum. I doubt the very minor presence of a handful of his minions on a small chunk of land in the ocean will have much bearing on the plot either.

Dhuum was imprisoned, but Menzies is the most powerful non dragon villain for now. I can't see why should he be a raid boss instead of a main plot villain.

I find the statement "most powerful non-dragon villain" to be highly questionable.

Who else? Abaddon is long gone. Dhuum is strong but he was never 100% freed and was stripped out from his god power. I doubt he is stronger than Menzies.

We know next to nothing about him though or if he has any significant powers at all. We know his name, his motivations and that he appears to be tactically and strategically astute as a Commander of Forces. Dhuum was a God and post Godhood had observable and demonstrable power and strength. I would at the very least say in the raid he would be considered stronger than Menzies. Assuming Menzies is alive, his power and strength is a complete unknown and cannot be said to be especially strong on a personal level until shown. Mad King Thorn would be a more accurate villain for that title right now since we have encountered him and has proven so far someone we cannot permanently overcome.

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@Randulf.7614 said:

@"Eekasqueak.7850" said:Eeh if he shows up it will be in the same way as Dhuum. I doubt the very minor presence of a handful of his minions on a small chunk of land in the ocean will have much bearing on the plot either.

Dhuum was imprisoned, but Menzies is the most powerful non dragon villain for now. I can't see why should he be a raid boss instead of a main plot villain.

I find the statement "most powerful non-dragon villain" to be highly questionable.

Who else? Abaddon is long gone. Dhuum is strong but he was never 100% freed and was stripped out from his god power. I doubt he is stronger than Menzies.

We know next to nothing about him though or if he has any significant powers at all. We know his name, his motivations and that he appears to be tactically and strategically astute as a Commander of Forces. Dhuum was a God and post Godhood had observable and demonstrable power and strength. I would at the very least say in the raid he would be considered stronger than Menzies. Assuming Menzies is alive, his power and strength is a complete unknown and cannot be said to be especially strong on a personal level until shown. Mad King Thorn would be a more accurate villain for that title right now since we have encountered him and has proven so far someone we cannot permanently overcome.

Dhuum was mostly chained and never 100% freed, even in the raid he was put down.

Menzies was able to start war on Balthazar's domain when his brother was still the god. At the same time send his forces to aid Abaddon and we saw the Shadow Army was all over Realm of Torment. I think it's safe to assume he is stronger than Dhuum after the godhood.

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@Slowpokeking.8720 said:

@"Eekasqueak.7850" said:Eeh if he shows up it will be in the same way as Dhuum. I doubt the very minor presence of a handful of his minions on a small chunk of land in the ocean will have much bearing on the plot either.

Dhuum was imprisoned, but Menzies is the most powerful non dragon villain for now. I can't see why should he be a raid boss instead of a main plot villain.

I find the statement "most powerful non-dragon villain" to be highly questionable.

Who else? Abaddon is long gone. Dhuum is strong but he was never 100% freed and was stripped out from his god power. I doubt he is stronger than Menzies.

We know next to nothing about him though or if he has any significant powers at all. We know his name, his motivations and that he appears to be tactically and strategically astute as a Commander of Forces. Dhuum was a God and post Godhood had observable and demonstrable power and strength. I would at the very least say in the raid he would be considered stronger than Menzies. Assuming Menzies is alive, his power and strength is a complete unknown and cannot be said to be especially strong on a personal level until shown. Mad King Thorn would be a more accurate villain for that title right now since we have encountered him and has proven so far someone we cannot permanently overcome.

Dhuum was mostly chained and never 100% freed, even in the raid he was put down.

Menzies was able to start war on Balthazar's domain when his brother was still the god. At the same time send his forces to aid Abaddon and we saw the Shadow Army was all over Realm of Torment. I think it's safe to assume he is stronger than Dhuum after the godhood.

And Dhuum waged war on Grenth and managed to break free from an immensely powerful set of seals twice. We have seen the direct power of Dhuum. Menzies right now is just a name from the old game who was a good commander and aided 2 more powerful beings. There is no doubt he had a great army and there is no he was a tactically excellent otherwise he wouldn't be able to wage such a war. But it is safe to say his own power is entirely unknown and unproven. He could very well be what you say, but it def isn't conclusive.

You clearly seem to have some fascination with this largely unknown entity and that is fine and kinda understandable given his air of mystery, but any speculation or facts about him will always have a huge question mark overhead until he is introduced into the GW2 Universe. And so far, beyond a weapon name and an Army which the NPCs in the map said are cursed to fight Balthazar forever (and thus wherever his magic is detected such as in Kralk and Aurene), Menzies right now is an historical entry only.

As for how he should be introduced, given his lack of backstory and so far irrelevance in GW2 and being an utter unknown to almost all players I think he is a good choice for a Season arc. A raid would be fairly one dimensional, but a Season arc could more readily build into him, expand on his backgrounds and God lore etc. The poetntial would be huge. A complimentary raid where we have to take down one his most powerful Lieutenants could also exist. He could go from largely nothing to an epic villain. Of course that would require commitment from the writers and given the handling of Scarlet, Joko, Baelfire, Balthazar and 3 Dragons, I remain less than hopeful they have the necessary skill set to write a truly engrossing villain over a long arc.

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@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:I would hardly call a marginal presence in the shattered remains of the Burning Forest to be "overrun".

Marginal, but more than can be said for the completely absent Eternals. If the Forest is a representative sample of the Fissure, then the Shadow Army is the only force remaining there, save the wildlife.

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@Randulf.7614 said:

@"Eekasqueak.7850" said:Eeh if he shows up it will be in the same way as Dhuum. I doubt the very minor presence of a handful of his minions on a small chunk of land in the ocean will have much bearing on the plot either.

Dhuum was imprisoned, but Menzies is the most powerful non dragon villain for now. I can't see why should he be a raid boss instead of a main plot villain.

I find the statement "most powerful non-dragon villain" to be highly questionable.

Who else? Abaddon is long gone. Dhuum is strong but he was never 100% freed and was stripped out from his god power. I doubt he is stronger than Menzies.

We know next to nothing about him though or if he has any significant powers at all. We know his name, his motivations and that he appears to be tactically and strategically astute as a Commander of Forces. Dhuum was a God and post Godhood had observable and demonstrable power and strength. I would at the very least say in the raid he would be considered stronger than Menzies. Assuming Menzies is alive, his power and strength is a complete unknown and cannot be said to be especially strong on a personal level until shown. Mad King Thorn would be a more accurate villain for that title right now since we have encountered him and has proven so far someone we cannot permanently overcome.

Dhuum was mostly chained and never 100% freed, even in the raid he was put down.

Menzies was able to start war on Balthazar's domain when his brother was still the god. At the same time send his forces to aid Abaddon and we saw the Shadow Army was all over Realm of Torment. I think it's safe to assume he is stronger than Dhuum after the godhood.

And Dhuum waged war on Grenth and managed to break free from an immensely powerful set of seals twice. We have seen the direct power of Dhuum. Menzies right now is just a name from the old game who was a good commander and aided 2 more powerful beings. There is no doubt he had a great army and there is no he was a tactically excellent otherwise he wouldn't be able to wage such a war. But it is safe to say his own power is entirely unknown and unproven. He could very well be what you say, but it def isn't conclusive.

You clearly seem to have some fascination with this largely unknown entity and that is fine and kinda understandable given his air of mystery, but any speculation or facts about him will always have a huge question mark overhead until he is introduced into the GW2 Universe. And so far, beyond a weapon name and an Army which the NPCs in the map said are cursed to fight Balthazar forever (and thus wherever his magic is detected such as in Kralk and Aurene), Menzies right now is an historical entry only.

As for how he should be introduced, given his lack of backstory and so far irrelevance in GW2 and being an utter unknown to almost all players I think he is a good choice for a Season arc. A raid would be fairly one dimensional, but a Season arc could more readily build into him, expand on his backgrounds and God lore etc. The poetntial would be huge. A complimentary raid where we have to take down one his most powerful Lieutenants could also exist. He could go from largely nothing to an epic villain. Of course that would require commitment from the writers and given the handling of Scarlet, Joko, Baelfire, Balthazar and 3 Dragons, I remain less than hopeful they have the necessary skill set to write a truly engrossing villain over a long arc.

But Dhuum was put down at least twice and Menzies never was. That's a pretty big achievement.

I agree, I think such a villain needs to be introduced to everyone, not just a raid boss.

GW2 really needs to let casual players be able to experience raid content's story without doing the mechanics.

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@Aaron Ansari.1604 said:

@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:I would hardly call a marginal presence in the shattered remains of the Burning Forest to be "overrun".

Marginal, but more than can be said for the completely absent Eternals. If the Forest is a representative sample of the Fissure, then the Shadow Army is the only force remaining there, save the wildlife.

I dunno. The Skeletal Army is likely still there in The Battlefield as they were similarly not related to the Eternals. And there's anyone who died and belonged in the Fissure of Woe who weren't Eternals (presuming Balthazar didn't force them into becoming Forged too) as well as those who died and belonged in the FoW after Balthazar ransacked it. I would imagine those souls had fled from Kralkatorrik, no doubt taking refuge in whatever new equivalent to the Temple of War there was (presuming that was used for Balthazar's prison as I suspect it was given Abaddon's imprisonment on his particular seat of power, and a new "seat of power" home was made).

In GW1, the Burning Forest was overrun with Shadow Army and had next to no Eternals, while the Eternals were aplenty in other sections. With Eternals gone due to Balthazar during PoF, and Kralkatorrik ravaging the Mists causing spirits to flee for safety in places like The Sanctum, it would make sense all we see is Shadow Army and wildlife there. Be the Shadow Army still numerous or just in small numbers.

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@Slowpokeking.8720 said:

@"Eekasqueak.7850" said:Eeh if he shows up it will be in the same way as Dhuum. I doubt the very minor presence of a handful of his minions on a small chunk of land in the ocean will have much bearing on the plot either.

Dhuum was imprisoned, but Menzies is the most powerful non dragon villain for now. I can't see why should he be a raid boss instead of a main plot villain.

I find the statement "most powerful non-dragon villain" to be highly questionable.

Who else? Abaddon is long gone. Dhuum is strong but he was never 100% freed and was stripped out from his god power. I doubt he is stronger than Menzies.

We know next to nothing about him though or if he has any significant powers at all. We know his name, his motivations and that he appears to be tactically and strategically astute as a Commander of Forces. Dhuum was a God and post Godhood had observable and demonstrable power and strength. I would at the very least say in the raid he would be considered stronger than Menzies. Assuming Menzies is alive, his power and strength is a complete unknown and cannot be said to be especially strong on a personal level until shown. Mad King Thorn would be a more accurate villain for that title right now since we have encountered him and has proven so far someone we cannot permanently overcome.

Dhuum was mostly chained and never 100% freed, even in the raid he was put down.

Menzies was able to start war on Balthazar's domain when his brother was still the god. At the same time send his forces to aid Abaddon and we saw the Shadow Army was all over Realm of Torment. I think it's safe to assume he is stronger than Dhuum after the godhood.

And Dhuum waged war on Grenth and managed to break free from an immensely powerful set of seals twice. We have seen the direct power of Dhuum. Menzies right now is just a name from the old game who was a good commander and aided 2 more powerful beings. There is no doubt he had a great army and there is no he was a tactically excellent otherwise he wouldn't be able to wage such a war. But it is safe to say his own power is entirely unknown and unproven. He could very well be what you say, but it def isn't conclusive.

You clearly seem to have some fascination with this largely unknown entity and that is fine and kinda understandable given his air of mystery, but any speculation or facts about him will always have a huge question mark overhead until he is introduced into the GW2 Universe. And so far, beyond a weapon name and an Army which the NPCs in the map said are cursed to fight Balthazar forever (and thus wherever his magic is detected such as in Kralk and Aurene), Menzies right now is an historical entry only.

As for how he should be introduced, given his lack of backstory and so far irrelevance in GW2 and being an utter unknown to almost all players I think he is a good choice for a Season arc. A raid would be fairly one dimensional, but a Season arc could more readily build into him, expand on his backgrounds and God lore etc. The poetntial would be huge. A complimentary raid where we have to take down one his most powerful Lieutenants could also exist. He could go from largely nothing to an epic villain. Of course that would require commitment from the writers and given the handling of Scarlet, Joko, Baelfire, Balthazar and 3 Dragons, I remain less than hopeful they have the necessary skill set to write a truly engrossing villain over a long arc.

But Dhuum was put down at least twice and Menzies never was. That's a pretty big achievement.

I agree, I think such a villain needs to be introduced to everyone, not just a raid boss.

GW2 really needs to let casual players be able to experience raid content's story without doing the mechanics.

It is an achievement and a nod to him hiding away and letting his army do his work. He never once appeared or showed any signs of his own strength. As it stands, his only power lay entirely in his army. It’s very possible he had to lay low until his army grew to great strength since he was largely unable to do much alone. Unlike Dhuum and Mad King who were able to show great power despite their shackles

We shall see

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