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No more language specific servers


DamiVlad.2689

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Idk if you've been playing the game long enough language isn't really a problem when 90% of the time you're just following tag and push when they push etc. Same with pinging objectives on map. If it's got swords then you know ppl trying to tell you stuff is being attacked. Nevertheless the language barrier does suck if you're not in the loop, that much is sure. Experience; ran with spanish + korean comms. Easy to follow + understand what it is that they're trying to get done.

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I think this is long overdue. I have posted in the past, asking for this to be done. Reddit doesn't seem so happy about it, but when is that sub-community right about anything, especially anything WvW-related? Almost never.

@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

As we prepare for world restructuring in World vs. World, we’ll be removing language restrictions in the upcoming EU world links. This will help us create fairer links and gather data on the impact of grouping together players who speak different languages.

What I see is ANet admitting that they need more information to make WvW Restructuring successful. Like anyone posting in this thread, they can guess how people will behave; they can't be sure. For example, they might be interested in how many people who chose English for the game spend gems to find an English link versus how many who don't or how many play less for the 2 months (And we can imagine similar questions for those who chose French or German or Spanish).

The good news is: this means they are close enough to the actual restructuring that they are starting to focus on player choices/behavior, not just on the technical hurdles of "can we pull it off."The bad news means: lots of cranky people who don't want to adjust to a polyglot 21st Century. I consider this minor since, on any given day, WvWarriors are cranky about something. This has the silver lining of giving us something new to discuss.You and I seem to disagree on a lot in these forums, but I agree with what you have said here. Globalization is a problem for some people in the real world; people who cannot or will not adapt. Those who adapt, succeed. Those who cannot, do not.

Language-restricted linkings were never available for any other language community in GW2; note especially all the French, Portugese and Spanish-speakers on the NA servers. Note also the Dutch, Polish, Russian, Hungarian, Greek, Swedish and other communities that play on EU servers. They still play the game without the problems people are writing about here and on Reddit. Because they are superficial problems. Take a page from their playbook. Change =! bad.

The language restrictions for WvW linkages were always artificial limitations on linking strength and flexibility. As we move towards Alliances, this change is a good change.

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I really like the idea. I'm from elona and yes, there will be some people not comfortable with english teamchat AT THE BEGINNING, but im sure they will realize it's for their own good. We have very good TS activity and im sure there will be enough people being interested in international leads. Maybe not all of them, but for sure the majority.

When it comes to coordination in teamchat, everyone understands english calls about enemies / structures.

I'm looking forward to it, since they can balance out some balance shit for stuck in t5 servers. Maybe some international servers will have bad linking periods if they will fight without link, but to be honest, elona, kodasch and riverside had to play like this for years now. So why not them aswell.

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@"Adzekul.3104" said:The language restrictions for WvW linkages were always artificial limitations on linking strength and flexibility. As we move towards Alliances, this change is a good change.True, I dont think it matter if its good or not, I believe Anet realized it was necessary because a "language preference" limitation under alliances wouldnt work in practice. Too many would choose not use it.

Think about it. International players probably outweigh national 10 to 1, which means that national guilds will think they can "hide" among the masses - just like they can and will do now on random EU servers. Its nothing strange. When everyone can do this at will with no transfers... that little "language preference" checkbox would literally be a please-put-my-guild-on-the-loosing-server-cause-we-want-to-be-gimped checkbox. And that not even counting loose players which definetly wouldnt use it out of fear of being randomized toward a smaller subsection of servers, pretty sure they would take the hit of getting on a regular EU server despite possible language barrier. Plus the fact that once you have a national alliance going, that national alliance wont care whether it end up on a national or international server since it would be its own contained unit with its own discord and structure etc, hell it can even recruit more of the same nationality on any server and watch them join the next reshuffle.

Language preferences would be pointless, because most people arent idiots.

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People complaining about different languages and leads, get over it. This is simply a test run for Alliances because they need to work out how to 'balance' populations via different time-zones/play times. Example: The ONE and ONLY Spanish server has NEVER had a link since launch because they're the ONLY Spanish server in EU. They play at a different 'prime time' to most of the other EU servers due to having Mexicans, etc...

People also seem to quickly forget about the 'Invisible squad mode' tag that was 'accidentally' added a week ago or so that wasn't ready for release yet. This in itself will make running 'language specific' groups if people want to be that 'butt-hurt' about being linked to International servers when they play on X server so they can speak their own native language. This also helps ANet with upcoming links that would cause issues, example: 7 German servers, 2 full, 3 Very high, 2 High - the 'population balance' would unbalance/overstack/under populate a server unintentionally without ANet doing this.

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@Fish.2769 said:People complaining about different languages and leads, get over it. This is simply a test run for Alliances because they need to work out how to 'balance' populations via different time-zones/play times. Example: The ONE and ONLY Spanish server has NEVER had a link since launch because they're the ONLY Spanish server in EU. They play at a different 'prime time' to most of the other EU servers due to having Mexicans, etc...

People also seem to quickly forget about the 'Invisible squad mode' tag that was 'accidentally' added a week ago or so that wasn't ready for release yet. This in itself will make running 'language specific' groups if people want to be that 'butt-hurt' about being linked to International servers when they play on X server so they can speak their own native language. This also helps ANet with upcoming links that would cause issues, example: 7 German servers, 2 full, 3 Very high, 2 High - the 'population balance' would unbalance/overstack/under populate a server unintentionally without ANet doing this.

Anet hasnt given any update about alliances in ages. The test run youre talking about is nothing but your speculation. God knows when alliances come out, i for certain cant wait another 1-2 years before anything (with a big maybe) information wise will be released regarding alliances.

At this point talking about alliances is like talking about Half-life 3 release.

To me it simply seems like anet wants to stop national servers from getting steamrolled (in fights) by international servers.

Furthermore server population doesnt describe the quality of the server. These days nobody cares about winning tiers and climbing, they care about winning and having tons of fights.

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@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"Adzekul.3104" said:The language restrictions for WvW linkages were always artificial limitations on linking strength and flexibility. As we move towards Alliances, this change is a good change.True, I dont think it matter if its good or not, I believe Anet realized it was
necessary
because a "language preference" limitation under alliances wouldnt work in practice. Too many would choose not use it.

Think about it. International players probably outweigh national 10 to 1, which means that national guilds will think they can "hide" among the masses - just like they can and will do now on random EU servers. Its nothing strange. When
everyone
can do this at will with no transfers... that little "language preference" checkbox would literally be a
please-put-my-guild-on-the-loosing-server-cause-we-want-to-be-kitten
checkbox. And that not even counting loose players which definetly wouldnt use it out of fear of being randomized toward a smaller subsection of servers, pretty sure they would take the hit of getting on a regular EU server despite possible language barrier. Plus the fact that once you have a national alliance going, that national alliance wont care whether it end up on a national or international server since it would be its own contained unit with its own discord and structure etc, hell it can even recruit more of the same nationality on any server and watch them join the next reshuffle.

Language preferences would be pointless, because most people arent idiots.

I wish i could thumbs up, vote helpful 10 times.

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So far all nations (except for Spanish, German and French) could work together and speak universal (English) language. Why would those big three not adapt and open their written language to others? What, is it too hard to speak not native one or just shameful using any other language? Lmao.Like for real, if u want to cooperate with homies, use TS/Discord/Guild chat, without language restrictions you can meet more people, get more allies to fight with and improve your english language if u have problems with it. Or just dont care about this change, stay in hermetic community, keep talking in native in teamchat and receive some fromage, frog, baguette, military and mexican wall jokes. Both sides will probably still be amused.

Btw, Alliances coming, Summer 2022 is closer than you think!

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@Widmo.3186 said:So far all nations (except for Spanish, German and French) could work together and speak universal (English) language. Why would those big three not adapt and open their written language to others? What, is it too hard to speak not native one or just shameful using any other language? Lmao.

its very easy - they DONT WANT TO.source: i'm german

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Iam pretty sure everyone who say "Come on the language barrier is not so bad" have limit experience with other games. xD The language won't be the problem, but the players who refuse to speak english. Heck, a friend of mine was working for a University as a chemist, they had 2 cooperations: one with a french workgroup and anotherone with the Language department of the University to translate french into - english. xD

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"As we prepare for world restructuring in World vs. World, we’ll be removing language restrictions in the upcoming EU world links. This will help us create fairer links and gather data on the impact of grouping together players who speak different languages. "

Why should alliances / guilds / randoms with different language settings be merged in the same world after alliances have kicked in? Alliances are made to get smaller population entities that are easier to handle to create balanced worlds. So, building balanced worlds of the same language should be no problem at all.

Or does Anet plan to add more language choices like Russian, Swedish, Croatian etc.?

@Widmo.3186 said:So far all nations (except for Spanish, German and French) could work together and speak universal (English) language. Why would those big three not adapt and open their written language to others? What, is it too hard to speak not native one or just shameful using any other language? Lmao.Doesnt make sense at all. There are players from all languages that play on english-speaking servers. And there are players from all languages that dont (for whatever reasons). To keep the latter ones play the game, servers for the more popular languages were created. The less popular languages cant fill a full server, and consequently these ppl might not play WvW at all.

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there has even been a poll lately in german forum asking arenanet to merge the german servers together and close T5 completely

the german scene has melted alot over the years when it comes to numbers. Most of the servers with high population status have been carried by people with much online time lately. Specially Riverside has been closed but only managed to get out of T5 for like 1 or 2 times in the last 6 month. Low amount of players but high online time in that community. But when you have a server with 1 public commander on prime time at reset and he got like 26-30 people only on tag you cant do anything anymore.if people dont react on defence calls in teamchat but rather post "so what? let it fall we cant defend it anyway we are only 3 people vs. 50" it has come to an end of era.

instead of closing T5 arenanet has choosen to drop the language barrier, maybe its the solution with the lowest cost on their side than to assign a programmer to change anything on the tier system now when they plan to change everything anyways.

"go left, dodge right, bomb here, go back", "bubble", "gravi well" "shades", "5 blue inc danelon", "25 red inc keep" is what everyone should understand or learn fast as alot commanders in germany already use that, specially the english version of the skills as they are often in battle easier to pronounce and faster to speak. when it comes to personal communication in motherlanguage people do that in their guilds or communities anyway there wont be much of a change for some regarding friendships and exchange etc. who is playing lonesome got much likely other interest than to chat around anyway.

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please-put-my-guild-on-the-loosing-server-cause-we-want-to-be-kitten checkbox

I disagree. After world restructuring / alliance system all worlds will be nearly the same size. We are probably going to have fewer [DE] and [FR] worlds, but those worlds will have a comparable size to the international ones. I, personally, have chosen to play on a server of my mother tongue when I created my GW2 account and don't see why I should change that.

"Blue Home: 5 reds @ WT, 1 cata" should be understandable by almost everyone/me goes looking for a dictionary.

Blue home, reds and cata yes, sure. I need to guess what WT means. West tower, the tower west of spawn on the home lands? But I couldn't even announce an attack on MF (Mittelfeste, central keep? Earth on red borderlands...) because I don't know international server lingo for that. Sure I'll know them after a few days or at most weeks, but it is not immediately understandable by everyone.

What, is it too hard to speak not native one or just shameful using any other language?I can only speak for myself, but for me it is wearying (not sure if correct word) to use a foreign language. After a hard, annoying work day I'm not sure if I have the energy. Reading and studio quality audio (e.g. voice in story) are fine. Writing is ok. Listening to many people speaking English at the same time, probably with bad mic quality and accents - and that is what I expect for a public WvW TS (or Discord or whatever) - will be too much for me. The choice between headache and PvE is clear.

For guilds probably not much will change. They stick together in their own TS or channel anyway. But for publics this could become very annoying.

Oh, and not to forget: most players speak English as first or second language. But there are players who don't. They will be mostly locked out from WvW, if they are not in a guild.

Note: I'm not looking as this change as a temporary test. We'll survive that. But I am very afraid that this is a test run for world restructuring without language separation.

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@"Killerassel.2197" said:Blue home, reds and cata yes, sure. I need to guess what WT means. West tower, the tower west of spawn on the home lands? But I couldn't even announce an attack on MF (Mittelfeste, central keep? Earth on red borderlands...) because I don't know international server lingo for that. Sure I'll know them after a few days or at most weeks, but it is not immediately understandable by everyone.It's always been Garni (Garnison) on all other DE servers but ours, and Garrison on the international ones. You'll quickly get used to it (and I'm sure there'll be nice people willing to translate for the first couple of times ;) ). Additionally there's a poi in each WvW objective that you can link into chat via shift+leftclick that will display in each player's client language rather than the language of the poster, so linking objectives is an easy way to avoid confusion.

Note: I'm not looking as this change as a temporary test. We'll survive that. But I am very afraid that this is a test run for world restructuring without language separation.It is, they said as much in their post, and watching the linking and performance of the different language servers on EU, I'm afraid it really is necessary to balance out the language groups. So far nobody knows what influence mixing will ultimately have on server/alliance performance, and personally I prefer them giving it an 8-week test run instead of just coming up with a theoretical "solution" that we'd be stuck with no matter if it practically worked out or not.

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@"Rasimir.6239" said:Additionally there's a poi in each WvW objective that you can link into chat via shift+leftclick that will display in each player's client language rather than the language of the poster, so linking objectives is an easy way to avoid confusion.

Sure. That'll help announce incoming attacks. But if someone posted "garri 10 inc" in chat I'd be searching the map until it is too late. ^^'

But yes, learning the new names will only take little time. I just disagreed with the notion that map chat shorthand would already be universally understandable. Especially shorthand.

Note: I'm not looking as this change as a temporary test. We'll survive that. But I am very afraid that this is a test run for world restructuring without language separation.It is, they said as much in their post, and watching the linking and performance of the different language servers on EU, I'm afraid it really is necessary to balance out the language groups. So far nobody knows what influence mixing will ultimately have on server/alliance performance, and personally I prefer them giving it an 8-week test run instead of just coming up with a theoretical "solution" that we'd be stuck with no matter if it practically worked out or not.

Well, the blog post said:

This will help us create fairer links and gather data on the impact of grouping together players who speak different languages.

Gathering more information about more equally sized links: great. Temporary inconvenience by ignoring the server language for one or more linking periods: ok, if it helps. But the highlighted part worries me that this is supposed to be permanent. And that the part about world restructuring respecting the selected language might be dropped.

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@"Killerassel.2197" said:

please-put-my-guild-on-the-loosing-server-cause-we-want-to-be-kitten
checkbox

I disagree. After world restructuring / alliance system all worlds will be nearly the same size. We are probably going to have fewer [DE] and [FR] worlds, but those worlds
will
have a comparable size to the international ones. I, personally, have chosen to play on a server of my mother tongue when I created my GW2 account and don't see why I should change that.
You
are not representative of the community as a whole which
will take every opportunity at an advantage it can get
.

Even if just a portion of the top guilds on any random current national server decide to "leave" (ie not go national) or form their own, smaller national alliance that choose go to any international server for competetivness/fights/wins whatever you want to call it... that's the death knell of said national server. There's no way it's going to keep itself afloat by restrictions to player counts. And the more that leave, one by one all the others will choose to leave. If it's in T5? Ha! Everyone will uncheck that little checkbox within months just to get away and have a chance at getting somewhere else, somewhere competetive. Somewhere they can win. And those that remain will have no option but to do the same thing.

We're talking cascade failure over time. The "nationality checked" population will erode. It doesnt matter if the first restructure work just fine and create equal servers. Or the second. Touting "for my country!" is irrelevant on the internet. The majority of people will leave a deadlock where they cant win.

TL;DR loot > language

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