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Removing Language Restrictions for EU World Linking


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  • ArenaNet Staff

As we prepare for world restructuring in World vs. World, we’ll be removing language restrictions in the upcoming EU world links. This will help us create fairer links and gather data on the impact of grouping together players who speak different languages.

To discuss the change, we have created this thread and we welcome your feedback. Please make sure to only use the current thread and not create new threads, so that we can gather your feedback. Thank you!

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@"Abaddon.7120" said:Language restrictions like "bad words"?

Currently, EU linkages are based on matching German-primary worlds with German secondaries, and likewise for Spanish, French, and default. This means a far greater chance on every world of encountering people who don't speak the same language. In exchange, it will far far easier for ANet to balance the numbers.

And, importantly, it will allow ANet to collect data on how such a change affects gameplay. Do people adapt? Or move worlds? Do they play more or less? Do they get used to it? That will be incredibly useful for ANet in determining match up algorithms for WvW Restructuring (aka Alliances). Obviously, it's easier to balance with as few restrictions as possible. What's not obvious is: whether it matters for the most part or if it's just a concern of a vocal minority. (Probably both -- ANet wants to answer: how much of each?)

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@"Stephane Lo Presti.7258" said:As we prepare for world restructuring in World vs. World, we’ll be removing language restrictions in the upcoming EU world links. This will help us create fairer links and gather data on the impact of grouping together players who speak different languages.

To discuss the change, we have created this thread and we welcome your feedback. Please make sure to only use the current thread and not create new threads, so that we can gather your feedback. Thank you!

here big hint for you, as i seen german or french or maybe spanish guy before linking stuff in chat in WvW.we cant click it we do not know wtf he wants us to deffend.

so remove all languages from "interest points" and force english for every1 or we simply cant click on what they want us to deffend.or make it clickable in all languages even tho i never understood which fool decide to make client (any given game) in multiple langauges its probably most dumbest thing u can do forcing people to split community and eventually u have to reunite em which is gonna be a pain in the arse for every1 again.

edit

btw ill be laughing when u mix germans with france server..one nation building million sieges in their towers/keeps the other 1 is dodging every fight to ppt behind enemy back brilliant couple.add the spanish to it to dodge all fights during night when no1 plays best ppt server ever, inc soon!

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  • ArenaNet Staff

I want to make a specific statement about the part of this discussion where players' feedback address countries: this change is not about the countries, it's about the language and the fact that it won't be used during the next World Linking. I want to be extra clear that, while countries and languages are related, we will not allow any aggressive or disrespectful comment about the country of origin or culture or players. On the extreme end of the spectrum, racism or xenophobia will get forum posters a temporary or permanent ban.

You can talk about the impact that this could have on the gameplay (for example the fact that there are time zones) or the current language servers, but we will infract posts who take an aggressive stance on what is said about players speaking French, German or Spanish.

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@Stephane Lo Presti.7258 said:I want to make a specific statement about the part of this discussion where players' feedback address countries: this change is not about the countries, it's about the language and the fact that it won't be used during the next World Linking. I want to be extra clear that, while countries and languages are related, we will not allow any aggressive or disrespectful comment about the country of origin or culture or players. On the extreme end of the spectrum, racism or xenophobia will get forum posters a temporary or permanent ban.

You can talk about the impact that this could have on the gameplay (for example the fact that there are time zones) or the current language servers, but we will infract posts who take an aggressive stance on what is said about players speaking French, German or Spanish.

Just for extra clarification: for the next relink (28/06/2019), will the national servers be linked with international ones, or not ? I understood that not, but other people that yes, so just to be crystal clear

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We've always been abble to put the direct link of towers/camp and keep in the chat and the link is automatically translated in the language each has for its client.

That won't destroy community has for now it will keeps server just open the association to every server.

Talking as a part of the french community, I think it will be well receive from half of the community and the other will hate it.Of course some people will move, as it always has been. To be on a server linked to the same language as much as the opposite. After all, it has been years EU servers are crowded with french and german.

I like the idea personnally and as usual people complain but they'll eventually get use to it.As when the alliances will be out, everyone will be mixed up but alliances from the same languages will ofc emerged.

We're not abble.to play together as french, I don't think it will change much once we'll be mixed up with other servers xD our dilema has always been old ppt ranger lover against pro meta fighting players that never really tried to.understand each other.

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  • most commanders in germany use english commands like "bomb" "fake push" "mats" and lots of others already today as they are much shorter and easier to pronounce in english than in german and in a meta like we have it now everything needs to be called super fast.

  • i dont think language will disturb the existing guilds or communities.Our guild Dmon is a mix guild. We have english lead, most members are german and we play currently on fissure of woe - linked to gandara and theres always room to talk in motherlanguage if people want to. (everyone can create extra voice channels on their discord or ts as they like) also your family and real life friends are not effected by this GW2 change so you wont degrade in speaking your mother language ;)

  • the calls in team or mapchat are also almost similar to what is used on german servers and a "30 red inc @ keep homes" will everyone get. also its possible to link every location into the chats so wont matter.

the ones who wont accept a lead not in their motherlanguage will seek and organise with others of the same thinking or speech skills anyway. its the freedom of choice what company you have around you and what not. cant control this via any system ingame. its the community's part to sort it under themselves. in the end the gameplay will not be much different than now.

just to take a thought on the T5 deletion - with a view on the german scene it would make sense to delete T5 and merge all the german t5 servers into the other remaining but it will lead to much movement on the other servers as when the germans who are now left scattered in t5 merge together into the active servers you will see a blobbin overpower towards the other international servers.

so people will migrate on international servers to have manpower again and you will see some international servers as empty desert.

i would currently estimate the remaining community potential in EU of 3 Tiers if you merge all people together so that there will be commanders on every server to have all 4 maps played actively again like it was in the past.

thats about what i estimate also for europe if there ever will be an alliance system - like about 9 alliances if everything would be active again.9 alliances cause not in every alliance are not always all people online at the same time or logged into wvw.

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Ok... i will never talk in chat anymore on WvW, i will play without chatting...This is bad for a MMORPG to stay Alone because i never found my language here...First game where language is destroyed and let player not allowed to speak their language....This is bad, really bad.WvW Forget me, i will never come back.

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I am not tooo sure what to think of this...my written english might be better than my spoken english as i barely use a voice chat with people not from my home country, i can communicate if i want to, sometimes i just want to relax and then i don't like thinking sbout how to express something... maybe i should change game language soon if wvw becomes international.this change would allow links for servers which have the problem being a language specific one but being too big for a link which go to smaller servers. I haven't played that much wvw in the last few months...The next problem i see is with people reluctant too speak english or cannot speak english...

Whoever finds mistakes please keep them... writing english texts on my smartfone is horrible

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@Deavild.8530 said:Ok... i will never talk in chat anymore on WvW, i will play without chatting...This is bad for a MMORPG to stay Alone because i never found my language here...First game where language is destroyed and let player not allowed to speak their language....This is bad, really bad.WvW Forget me, i will never come back.

@Lyre.8079 said:I am not tooo sure what to think of this...my written english might be better than my spoken english as i barely use a voice chat with people not from my home country, i can communicate if i want to, sometimes i just want to relax and then i don't like thinking sbout how to express something... maybe i should change game language soon if wvw becomes international.this change would allow links for servers which have the problem being a language specific one but being too big for a link which go to smaller servers. I haven't played that much wvw in the last few months...The next problem i see is with people reluctant too speak english or cannot speak english...

Whoever finds mistakes please keep them... writing english texts on my smartfone is horrible

What language?

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I think this change sounds like a wonderful opportunity for us Europeans to get to know each other better.

There's always been a big language barrier in online European communities between lingua-franca-English-speakers (people from the UK, Scandinavia, the Netherlands, the Baltics, and other small language groups across Europe who don't have the population to form large communities) and the communities that speak the big national languages like German and French.

But I am sure the language barrier has eroded since I started playing online games 20 years ago. I am sure French, German, and other Europeans will be able to communicate just fine, and I look forward to meeting more of my neighbours.

And I want to encourage my German and French and Spanish counterparts to engage as much as possible with the rest of us.

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IMHO Anet might get a preliminary taste even before changing the setup. By calling Zenimax team from TESO and ask them what they observed in Cyrodiil. I'm not making an advertisement. I left this game ages ago and will probably stay in GW2. But in terms of mixing languages and more important, cultures, they might know what this has brought to the WvW in their game. Some of this will, IHMO, also apply to GW2 WvW.

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Keeping five Tiers in the EU and two months relink cycle, is part of the problem with the current system. Aswell as transfers creating ever changing populations, no matter if you open up links between National and international servers.

It's just that, some servers are used to their own kind of culture, community and playstyles. Even the current system has these issues, which can cause some toxicity.(Please don't link us with Drakkar or vizunah)

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Thank you, ANET. Great idea!At long last, something is being done to correct the decisions from April 2016 about matchmaking wvw servers. The problem was less within the match-making algorhythm as it was in the quite static server linking policy. Those 2-months realignments were made along language lines and that gave not enough wiggle room to allow for balanced results.I am pleased to learn ANET finally took up my suggestion from September 2017: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/1362/anet-please-rethink-european-server-pairingFor all those who think the world will end when they are being paired with other designated language servers:

@"Lennox.7135" said:Surely there were good intentions at heart when this system was set up. Maybe it was thought players of different language backgrounds shouldn't be forced to deal with one another. Maybe it was thought we don't get along with each other. Don't worry! Europeans are used to a lot of neighbours speaking in different tongues and we are fine with it. In fact, in every other Guild Wars section, whether in structured PvP or PvE we already play and cooperate alongside each other regardless of language. Furthermore, every one of the 14 "international" European servers which are paired together in WvW consists of players coming from countries ranging from Russia to Portugal speaking many different languages. If they can do it so can the French, Germans and Spanish.

There is of course another way to give that gaping balancing problem a temporary fix: change the number of fixed slots every language is alotted in wvw. Most of the imbalance comes from the fact the 7 German language servers got assigned to 5 slots in the 15 slot wvw roster back in 2016. There is a proposal to solve that too:https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/54645/anet-temporary-solution-please-slash-one-german-slot-down-from-5-to-4

What worries me is the thought this new approach by ANET might mean we have to wait a lot longer for the radical new match-making ideas they proposed to us free of the initial server decision and only based on guild and friends list ties. Well, at least something is being done and I welcome the direction. Anyway, it won't be for all eternity, so let's give it a try.

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@"reddie.5861" said:here big hint for you, as i seen german or french or maybe spanish guy before linking stuff in chat in WvW.we cant click it we do not know kitten he wants us to deffend.so remove all languages from "interest points" and force english for every1 or we simply cant click on what they want us to deffend.or make it clickable in all languages even tho i never understood which fool decide to make client (any given game) in multiple langauges its probably most dumbest thing u can do forcing people to split community and eventually u have to reunite em which is gonna be a pain in the kitten for every1 again.

You are mistaken. This problem doesn't exist since the client is programmed to display links in the language you have chosen for yourself. My client runs in English and when a Spanish player with a Spanish language client links a wvw keep into the chat, my client will translate that link into English automatically and vice versa. The same goes for every other location link, skin link etc. Every link is displayed in your client's language. We see that every day since many of my guild mates use another language within their client and all links are displayed in their respective languages.

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@DamiVlad.2689 said:

@"Stephane Lo Presti.7258" said:I want to make a specific statement about the part of this discussion where players' feedback address countries: this change is not about the countries, it's about the language and the fact that it won't be used during the next World Linking. I want to be extra clear that, while countries and languages are related, we will not allow any aggressive or disrespectful comment about the country of origin or culture or players. On the extreme end of the spectrum, racism or xenophobia will get forum posters a temporary or permanent ban.

You can talk about the impact that this could have on the gameplay (for example the fact that there are time zones) or the current language servers, but we will infract posts who take an aggressive stance on what is said about players speaking French, German or Spanish.

Just for extra clarification: for the next relink (28/06/2019), will the national servers be linked with international ones, or not ? I understood that not, but other people that yes, so just to be crystal clear

There are no "national servers." All worlds are (and always have been) international. The only distinction ever made is whether language is used as one more component in determining which worlds are matched with which.

This change, for at least one linkage period, will remove that distinction.

In other words: yes, a German-language world could be linked up with a default-language world. For example, Elona (DE, primary world) could be matched with Aurora (no specific language). This will allow, for example, ANet to shore up Baruch (ES, running lower on pop than others) and without any other ES world to pair with. It will also give them more opportunities to match the lowest pop worlds with a world of appropriate size, rather than what's left among the same-language worlds.


As I've said elsewhere, this is an obvious experiment to take before Restructuring. If it works, it gives ANet better flexibility in matching Alliances. And if it doesn't work, they can adjust their formulas accordingly. All of this is better to discover now, rather than during Restructuring; people have such high expectations, it's important to take as much of the guesswork out as possible.

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@Nora.9207 said:

@"Stephane Lo Presti.7258" said:I want to make a specific statement about the part of this discussion where players' feedback address countries: this change is not about the countries, it's about the language and the fact that it won't be used during the next World Linking. I want to be extra clear that, while countries and languages are related, we will not allow any aggressive or disrespectful comment about the country of origin or culture or players. On the extreme end of the spectrum, racism or xenophobia will get forum posters a temporary or permanent ban.

You can talk about the impact that this could have on the gameplay (for example the fact that there are time zones) or the current language servers, but we will infract posts who take an aggressive stance on what is said about players speaking French, German or Spanish.

Good grief - so you ask for our opinion and then tell us to shut up and be nice. Imo the "us and them" mentality we have over in Europe is part of our culture - and often part of our banter and fun - and I think, being as the French have wonderfully been determined to preserve their French culture for many years and not become Americanised (iirc keeping USA programes to no more than 20% of their tv time) then maps with French speakers (and I love them for this) will be battles in 2 languages ... will be a little rum. eh? Baguette wars ftw!

Methinks it wasn't really meant as such, Anet probably -knows- there has always been a playful rivalry between european nations (hell, US players arent exactly covert when they do the same with us frenchies specifically), though I have seen some displays of genuine insults hurled on the chat because of one's nationality. At this point it can be hard for Anet to differentiate what's playful and what isn't

On the matter of the change itself, it's perfectly fine in my opinion, WvW will find a way to make it work, and most players are at the very least exposed to the English language through interactions with other players, they'll improve passively, and other players can help by pointing objectives with little added (which they already do).

I'm a lot more positive in knowing progress is being made on the WvW restructuring, I dare hope to enjoy some full on WvW throughout summerbreak.

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