Understanding Condis: Chilled v Slow

[Scared.7195]

Hello everyone, what is the difference between these two condis really? I went on the wiki and slow has 50% slower actions and dodges and chilled has 66% less movement speed and skill recharge. Is there really a difference between these two and would combining them be any good?

[dtox.8397]

Slow - Reduced animation speed (opposite of quickness)Chill - Your movement is slowed (walking, similar to cripple) and ur recharge rate of ur skills is slower.

A Slowed foe will take longer to hit you, their action is slower. A Chilled foe will run in a decreased pace, taking them longer to get to you (and also the slower recharge rate effect)

[Mikkel.8427]

Chill's overlap with Cripple is actually something that bothers me. It should be the opposite of Alacrity and ONLY slow skill recharge.

[KrHome.1920]

@Mikkel.8427 said:Chill's overlap with Cripple is actually something that bothers me. It should be the opposite of Alacrity and ONLY slow skill recharge.It does not overlap. It's a stronger version of cripple that on top adds a cooldown debuff. Thererfor it is a very rare condition in the game (only reapers use it in larger extents as their spec mechanic to compensate their limited mobility), while cripple is flying around everywhere.

Stating that cripple overlaps with chill is like stating that cripple overlaps with immobility (all three slow you down: 50%, 66%, 100%). It does not make sense.

Reworking chill to your suggested functionality would have to result in a complete rework of the reaper spec.

[Mikkel.8427]

@"KrHome.1920" said:

"It's a stronger version of cripple that on top adds a cooldown debuff"Exactly...

"it used to be very rare condition in the game"Fixed that for you. The only conditions I would consider 'rare' these days are Slow and maybe Immobilize. Chill has had its access increased substantially over the years on top of the job with the most access being a permanent and meta-defining feature of the competitive modes.

"Reworking chill to your suggested functionality would have to result in a complete rework of the reaper spec"There is nothing stopping them from adding a "Chilling a foe also applies cripple" trait OR adding a movement impairment element to chill applied by reapers OR Increasing reaper's access to chill after its power is reduced OR removing the cooldown debuff instead of the movement impairment, etc. A 'complete rework' would be wholly unnecessary.

Also, what's wrong with reworks? I LOVE when anet is bold enough to rework something. Keeps the game alive for me.

I believe chill should be simplified to do ONE thing (I don't care which). Especially when both of the things it does are individually powerful enough to justify using the condition. Of course, that's just one small part of my issue with the way conditions in general function in this game.

Small thought experiment/tangent since we're on the subject of chill:IF cripple/chill/immobilize are intended to be part of a progression of movement impairment, why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously? Why not have the more powerful condition overwrite the weaker version? So, Immobilize would overwrite chill/cripple. Chill would overwrite cripple. Chill and cripple wouldn't be able to be applied to a target already immobilized (they cant move any slower....).Which would:-Reduce UI clutter-Reduce the maximum number of 'cover conditions' that can be applied to a target at one time (the REAL issue with condition damage)

-Make application timing actually skillful

Of course, implementing something like that WOULD require a 'complete rework' that would extend far beyond just Reaper. It also will never happen...

To answer my own question- "why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously?"Primarily, because every condition seems to be intended to have a unique effect. This is where (I believe) the overlap between chill and cripple exists... having the same exact function (but stronger) is not unique. Which is why the recast portion of chill is tacked on.

[ZhouX.8742]

@Mikkel.8427 said:

@"KrHome.1920" said:

"

It's a stronger version of cripple that on top adds a cooldown debuff

"Exactly...

"

it used to be very rare condition in the game

"Fixed that for you. The only conditions I would consider 'rare' these days are Slow and maybe Immobilize. Chill has had its access increased substantially over the years on top of the job with the most access being a permanent and meta-defining feature of the competitive modes.

"

Reworking chill to your suggested functionality would have to result in a complete rework of the reaper spec

"There is nothing stopping them from adding a "Chilling a foe also applies cripple" trait OR adding a movement impairment element to chill applied by reapers OR Increasing reaper's access to chill after its power is reduced OR removing the cooldown debuff instead of the movement impairment, etc. A 'complete rework' would be wholly unnecessary.

Also, what's wrong with reworks? I LOVE when anet is bold enough to rework something. Keeps the game alive for me.

I believe chill should be simplified to do ONE thing (I don't care which). Especially when both of the things it does are individually powerful enough to justify using the condition. Of course, that's just one small part of my issue with the way conditions in general function in this game.

Small thought experiment/tangent since we're on the subject of chill:IF cripple/chill/immobilize are intended to be part of a progression of movement impairment, why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously? Why not have the more powerful condition overwrite the weaker version? So, Immobilize would overwrite chill/cripple. Chill would overwrite cripple. Chill and cripple wouldn't be able to be applied to a target already immobilized (they cant move any slower....).Which would:-Reduce UI clutter-Reduce the maximum number of 'cover conditions' that can be applied to a target at one time (the REAL issue with condition damage)

-Make application timing actually skillful

Of course, implementing something like that WOULD require a 'complete rework' that would extend far beyond just Reaper. It also will never happen...

To answer my own question- "why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously?"Primarily, because every condition seems to be intended to have a unique effect. This is where (I believe) the overlap between chill and cripple exists... having the same exact function (but stronger) is not unique. Which is why the recast portion of chill is tacked on.

Chill is fine , stop complaining it in no way form is considered broken in current metas and has virtually no effect at countering them... This is a null discussion that will get no where except just nerfing something and not really change anything... There are much bigger balance issues wrong with PvP than chill.

[praqtos.9035]

@ZhouX.8742 said:

@Mikkel.8427 said:

@"KrHome.1920" said:

"

It's a stronger version of cripple that on top adds a cooldown debuff

"Exactly...

"

it used to be very rare condition in the game

"Fixed that for you. The only conditions I would consider 'rare' these days are Slow and maybe Immobilize. Chill has had its access increased substantially over the years on top of the job with the most access being a permanent and meta-defining feature of the competitive modes.

"

Reworking chill to your suggested functionality would have to result in a complete rework of the reaper spec

"There is nothing stopping them from adding a "Chilling a foe also applies cripple" trait OR adding a movement impairment element to chill applied by reapers OR Increasing reaper's access to chill after its power is reduced OR removing the cooldown debuff instead of the movement impairment, etc. A 'complete rework' would be wholly unnecessary.

Also, what's wrong with reworks? I LOVE when anet is bold enough to rework something. Keeps the game alive for me.

I believe chill should be simplified to do ONE thing (I don't care which). Especially when both of the things it does are individually powerful enough to justify using the condition. Of course, that's just one small part of my issue with the way conditions in general function in this game.

Small thought experiment/tangent since we're on the subject of chill:IF cripple/chill/immobilize are intended to be part of a progression of movement impairment, why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously? Why not have the more powerful condition overwrite the weaker version? So, Immobilize would overwrite chill/cripple. Chill would overwrite cripple. Chill and cripple wouldn't be able to be applied to a target already immobilized (they cant move any slower....).Which would:-Reduce UI clutter-Reduce the maximum number of 'cover conditions' that can be applied to a target at one time (the REAL issue with condition damage)

-Make application timing actually skillful

Of course, implementing something like that WOULD require a 'complete rework' that would extend far beyond just Reaper. It also will never happen...

To answer my own question- "why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously?"Primarily, because every condition seems to be intended to have a unique effect. This is where (I believe) the overlap between chill and cripple exists... having the same exact function (but stronger) is not unique. Which is why the recast portion of chill is tacked on.

Chill is fine , stop complaining it in no way form is considered broken in current metas and has virtually no effect at countering them... This is a null discussion that will get no where except just nerfing something and not really change anything... There are much bigger balance issues wrong with PvP than chill.A condition that stop your cooldowns from recharging and almost stop your from moving way harder than cripple is fine? Its not even on same level of alacrity,even improved with trait its only 50% with cost of its duration.Changing that chill wont slow movement speed is so hard to implement...will take ages... /s

[Abelisk.5148]

@ZhouX.8742 said:

@Mikkel.8427 said:

@"KrHome.1920" said:

"

It's a stronger version of cripple that on top adds a cooldown debuff

"Exactly...

"

it used to be very rare condition in the game

"Fixed that for you. The only conditions I would consider 'rare' these days are Slow and maybe Immobilize. Chill has had its access increased substantially over the years on top of the job with the most access being a permanent and meta-defining feature of the competitive modes.

"

Reworking chill to your suggested functionality would have to result in a complete rework of the reaper spec

"There is nothing stopping them from adding a "Chilling a foe also applies cripple" trait OR adding a movement impairment element to chill applied by reapers OR Increasing reaper's access to chill after its power is reduced OR removing the cooldown debuff instead of the movement impairment, etc. A 'complete rework' would be wholly unnecessary.

Also, what's wrong with reworks? I LOVE when anet is bold enough to rework something. Keeps the game alive for me.

I believe chill should be simplified to do ONE thing (I don't care which). Especially when both of the things it does are individually powerful enough to justify using the condition. Of course, that's just one small part of my issue with the way conditions in general function in this game.

Small thought experiment/tangent since we're on the subject of chill:IF cripple/chill/immobilize are intended to be part of a progression of movement impairment, why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously? Why not have the more powerful condition overwrite the weaker version? So, Immobilize would overwrite chill/cripple. Chill would overwrite cripple. Chill and cripple wouldn't be able to be applied to a target already immobilized (they cant move any slower....).Which would:-Reduce UI clutter-Reduce the maximum number of 'cover conditions' that can be applied to a target at one time (the REAL issue with condition damage)

-Make application timing actually skillful

Of course, implementing something like that WOULD require a 'complete rework' that would extend far beyond just Reaper. It also will never happen...

To answer my own question- "why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously?"Primarily, because every condition seems to be intended to have a unique effect. This is where (I believe) the overlap between chill and cripple exists... having the same exact function (but stronger) is not unique. Which is why the recast portion of chill is tacked on.

Chill is fine , stop complaining it in no way form is considered broken in current metas and has virtually no effect at countering them... This is a null discussion that will get no where except just nerfing something and not really change anything... There are much bigger balance issues wrong with PvP than chill.

Chill is NOT okay, it is a toxic condition that ruins PvP for me. Thanks a lot Reapers for being incredibly unfun to play against as a melee spec.

[Hylo.1968]

@"LolLookAtMyAP.8394" said:

@ZhouX.8742 said:

@Mikkel.8427 said:

@"KrHome.1920" said:

"

It's a stronger version of cripple that on top adds a cooldown debuff

"Exactly...

"

it used to be very rare condition in the game

"Fixed that for you. The only conditions I would consider 'rare' these days are Slow and maybe Immobilize. Chill has had its access increased substantially over the years on top of the job with the most access being a permanent and meta-defining feature of the competitive modes.

"

Reworking chill to your suggested functionality would have to result in a complete rework of the reaper spec

"There is nothing stopping them from adding a "Chilling a foe also applies cripple" trait OR adding a movement impairment element to chill applied by reapers OR Increasing reaper's access to chill after its power is reduced OR removing the cooldown debuff instead of the movement impairment, etc. A 'complete rework' would be wholly unnecessary.

Also, what's wrong with reworks? I LOVE when anet is bold enough to rework something. Keeps the game alive for me.

I believe chill should be simplified to do ONE thing (I don't care which). Especially when both of the things it does are individually powerful enough to justify using the condition. Of course, that's just one small part of my issue with the way conditions in general function in this game.

Small thought experiment/tangent since we're on the subject of chill:IF cripple/chill/immobilize are intended to be part of a progression of movement impairment, why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously? Why not have the more powerful condition overwrite the weaker version? So, Immobilize would overwrite chill/cripple. Chill would overwrite cripple. Chill and cripple wouldn't be able to be applied to a target already immobilized (they cant move any slower....).Which would:-Reduce UI clutter-Reduce the maximum number of 'cover conditions' that can be applied to a target at one time (the REAL issue with condition damage)

-Make application timing actually skillful

Of course, implementing something like that WOULD require a 'complete rework' that would extend far beyond just Reaper. It also will never happen...

To answer my own question- "why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously?"Primarily, because every condition seems to be intended to have a unique effect. This is where (I believe) the overlap between chill and cripple exists... having the same exact function (but stronger) is not unique. Which is why the recast portion of chill is tacked on.

Chill is fine , stop complaining it in no way form is considered broken in current metas and has virtually no effect at countering them... This is a null discussion that will get no where except just nerfing something and not really change anything... There are much bigger balance issues wrong with PvP than chill.

Chill is NOT okay, it is a toxic condition that ruins PvP for me. Thanks a lot Reapers for being incredibly unfun to play against as a melee spec.

Give necro block/evades and we can discuss

[praqtos.9035]

@Hylo.1968 said:

@"LolLookAtMyAP.8394" said:

@ZhouX.8742 said:

@Mikkel.8427 said:

@"KrHome.1920" said:

"

It's a stronger version of cripple that on top adds a cooldown debuff

"Exactly...

"

it used to be very rare condition in the game

"Fixed that for you. The only conditions I would consider 'rare' these days are Slow and maybe Immobilize. Chill has had its access increased substantially over the years on top of the job with the most access being a permanent and meta-defining feature of the competitive modes.

"

Reworking chill to your suggested functionality would have to result in a complete rework of the reaper spec

"There is nothing stopping them from adding a "Chilling a foe also applies cripple" trait OR adding a movement impairment element to chill applied by reapers OR Increasing reaper's access to chill after its power is reduced OR removing the cooldown debuff instead of the movement impairment, etc. A 'complete rework' would be wholly unnecessary.

Also, what's wrong with reworks? I LOVE when anet is bold enough to rework something. Keeps the game alive for me.

I believe chill should be simplified to do ONE thing (I don't care which). Especially when both of the things it does are individually powerful enough to justify using the condition. Of course, that's just one small part of my issue with the way conditions in general function in this game.

Small thought experiment/tangent since we're on the subject of chill:IF cripple/chill/immobilize are intended to be part of a progression of movement impairment, why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously? Why not have the more powerful condition overwrite the weaker version? So, Immobilize would overwrite chill/cripple. Chill would overwrite cripple. Chill and cripple wouldn't be able to be applied to a target already immobilized (they cant move any slower....).Which would:-Reduce UI clutter-Reduce the maximum number of 'cover conditions' that can be applied to a target at one time (the REAL issue with condition damage)

-Make application timing actually skillful

Of course, implementing something like that WOULD require a 'complete rework' that would extend far beyond just Reaper. It also will never happen...

To answer my own question- "why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously?"Primarily, because every condition seems to be intended to have a unique effect. This is where (I believe) the overlap between chill and cripple exists... having the same exact function (but stronger) is not unique. Which is why the recast portion of chill is tacked on.

Chill is fine , stop complaining it in no way form is considered broken in current metas and has virtually no effect at countering them... This is a null discussion that will get no where except just nerfing something and not really change anything... There are much bigger balance issues wrong with PvP than chill.

Chill is NOT okay, it is a toxic condition that ruins PvP for me. Thanks a lot Reapers for being incredibly unfun to play against as a melee spec.

Give necro block/evades and we can discussThen reaper would lose all his aoe/heavy damage capabilities, like all. You should realize that

[Gamble.4580]

Reaper is fine as it is. In fact it’s prefect! Not op not underpowered.

[Hylo.1968]

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Hylo.1968 said:

@"LolLookAtMyAP.8394" said:

@ZhouX.8742 said:

@Mikkel.8427 said:

@"KrHome.1920" said:

"

It's a stronger version of cripple that on top adds a cooldown debuff

"Exactly...

"

it used to be very rare condition in the game

"Fixed that for you. The only conditions I would consider 'rare' these days are Slow and maybe Immobilize. Chill has had its access increased substantially over the years on top of the job with the most access being a permanent and meta-defining feature of the competitive modes.

"

Reworking chill to your suggested functionality would have to result in a complete rework of the reaper spec

"There is nothing stopping them from adding a "Chilling a foe also applies cripple" trait OR adding a movement impairment element to chill applied by reapers OR Increasing reaper's access to chill after its power is reduced OR removing the cooldown debuff instead of the movement impairment, etc. A 'complete rework' would be wholly unnecessary.

Also, what's wrong with reworks? I LOVE when anet is bold enough to rework something. Keeps the game alive for me.

I believe chill should be simplified to do ONE thing (I don't care which). Especially when both of the things it does are individually powerful enough to justify using the condition. Of course, that's just one small part of my issue with the way conditions in general function in this game.

Small thought experiment/tangent since we're on the subject of chill:IF cripple/chill/immobilize are intended to be part of a progression of movement impairment, why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously? Why not have the more powerful condition overwrite the weaker version? So, Immobilize would overwrite chill/cripple. Chill would overwrite cripple. Chill and cripple wouldn't be able to be applied to a target already immobilized (they cant move any slower....).Which would:-Reduce UI clutter-Reduce the maximum number of 'cover conditions' that can be applied to a target at one time (the REAL issue with condition damage)

-Make application timing actually skillful

Of course, implementing something like that WOULD require a 'complete rework' that would extend far beyond just Reaper. It also will never happen...

To answer my own question- "why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously?"Primarily, because every condition seems to be intended to have a unique effect. This is where (I believe) the overlap between chill and cripple exists... having the same exact function (but stronger) is not unique. Which is why the recast portion of chill is tacked on.

Chill is fine , stop complaining it in no way form is considered broken in current metas and has virtually no effect at countering them... This is a null discussion that will get no where except just nerfing something and not really change anything... There are much bigger balance issues wrong with PvP than chill.

Chill is NOT okay, it is a toxic condition that ruins PvP for me. Thanks a lot Reapers for being incredibly unfun to play against as a melee spec.

Give necro block/evades and we can discussThen reaper would lose all his aoe/heavy damage capabilities, like all. You should realize that

in trade off of the hypothetical chill rework

[praqtos.9035]

@Hylo.1968 said:

@praqtos.9035 said:

@Hylo.1968 said:

@"LolLookAtMyAP.8394" said:

@ZhouX.8742 said:

@Mikkel.8427 said:

@"KrHome.1920" said:

"

It's a stronger version of cripple that on top adds a cooldown debuff

"Exactly...

"

it used to be very rare condition in the game

"Fixed that for you. The only conditions I would consider 'rare' these days are Slow and maybe Immobilize. Chill has had its access increased substantially over the years on top of the job with the most access being a permanent and meta-defining feature of the competitive modes.

"

Reworking chill to your suggested functionality would have to result in a complete rework of the reaper spec

"There is nothing stopping them from adding a "Chilling a foe also applies cripple" trait OR adding a movement impairment element to chill applied by reapers OR Increasing reaper's access to chill after its power is reduced OR removing the cooldown debuff instead of the movement impairment, etc. A 'complete rework' would be wholly unnecessary.

Also, what's wrong with reworks? I LOVE when anet is bold enough to rework something. Keeps the game alive for me.

I believe chill should be simplified to do ONE thing (I don't care which). Especially when both of the things it does are individually powerful enough to justify using the condition. Of course, that's just one small part of my issue with the way conditions in general function in this game.

Small thought experiment/tangent since we're on the subject of chill:IF cripple/chill/immobilize are intended to be part of a progression of movement impairment, why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously? Why not have the more powerful condition overwrite the weaker version? So, Immobilize would overwrite chill/cripple. Chill would overwrite cripple. Chill and cripple wouldn't be able to be applied to a target already immobilized (they cant move any slower....).Which would:-Reduce UI clutter-Reduce the maximum number of 'cover conditions' that can be applied to a target at one time (the REAL issue with condition damage)

-Make application timing actually skillful

Of course, implementing something like that WOULD require a 'complete rework' that would extend far beyond just Reaper. It also will never happen...

To answer my own question- "why allow them to all exist on a target simultaneously?"Primarily, because every condition seems to be intended to have a unique effect. This is where (I believe) the overlap between chill and cripple exists... having the same exact function (but stronger) is not unique. Which is why the recast portion of chill is tacked on.

Chill is fine , stop complaining it in no way form is considered broken in current metas and has virtually no effect at countering them... This is a null discussion that will get no where except just nerfing something and not really change anything... There are much bigger balance issues wrong with PvP than chill.

Chill is NOT okay, it is a toxic condition that ruins PvP for me. Thanks a lot Reapers for being incredibly unfun to play against as a melee spec.

Give necro block/evades and we can discussThen reaper would lose all his aoe/heavy damage capabilities, like all. You should realize that

in trade off of the hypothetical chill reworkChill always been dumb and OP. If you will give evade/blocks then most likely you will lose all aoe capabilities, most likely half of your shroud... Wait... Then this becomes a holosmith....

[Stallic.2397]

Reaper used to be powerful /op. Ever since the beginning of HOT and into POF, but they're finally balanced and tuned.

There's bigger fish to fry than chill/reaper

[ZhouX.8742]

People actually crying about reaper in pvp in 2019

Not even a necro main, just know it's no where close to even requiring attention over the 20+ other things wrong with pvp at the moment

And chill isn't one of those things

Smh