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So this is what happens in Season 5/3rd Expansion


Michram.6853

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Aurene is going to have little baby dragons,One created from death magicSecond created from plant magicThird created from fire magicForth created from crystal magicFifth created from ice magic

The only missing magic is water/illusion magics.

Death baby dragon, let's call him Zhaitaffy/Joko junior, will replace Elder Dragon Zhaitan's magics. - will be all about necromancy and will patronize Aurene's wild nature.Plant baby dragon, let's call him Planty, will replace Mordremoth's magics. - will be all about those who use the Nature as a weapon against baddies and will patronize Aurene's love to the nature.Fire baby dragon, let's call him Balthmordus, will replace Primordus. - will be all about the fight and strenght and will patronize Aurene's virtues and glory.Crystal baby dragon (Aurene's favourite) will replace Kralkatorrik together with his Mother, let's call him Aurelios, will symbolize the power of empathy and good will.Ice baby dragon will replace Jormag, let's call him Chiller, will symbolize the power of partying and having fun, cherishing the good fight.

So we'll have at least 5 new characters. And Aurene will keep them in order from above.

And the only dragon that Aurene doesn't have the magics is Deep Sea Dragon.

Cantha confirmed, Tengu playable race confirmed, the PC as a grandparent confirmed.

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I know this is a joke post, but I really hope ArenaNet avoids the "three and pregnant" plot. There are other dragons out in the world, and we have a ritual to free dragon minions from their mental enslavement.

@Arden.7480 said:And the only dragon that Aurene doesn't have the magics is Deep Sea Dragon.

Technically she doesn't have Primordus' or Jormag's either. Balthazar somehow converted those into his own form of magic. It's why there's no show of the Bloodstone's magic either.

Aurene merely has Kralkatorrik's and demigod Balthazar's magic, and a portion of Zhaitan's and Mordremoth's magic (which seems to be Death and Mind respectively - there's never a show of plant or shadow among Kralk or Aurene, though there is among Primordus and Jormag).

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I wouldn't put any money on the "three and pregnant" plot, but I would put even money on Aurene "dying for real this time" plot. She discovers a way to balance magic by transforming herself into something lifeless or without consciousness. Perhaps transforming herself into shrines across Tyria that act as magic routers/capacitors.

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@"Psientist.6437" said:I wouldn't put any money on the "three and pregnant" plot, but I would put even money on Aurene "dying for real this time" plot. She discovers a way to balance magic by transforming herself into something lifeless or without consciousness. Perhaps transforming herself into shrines across Tyria that act as magic routers/capacitors.

But that would make 0 sense, as her being ALIVE is exactly what you are describing already

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@"Psientist.6437" said:I wouldn't put any money on the "three and pregnant" plot, but I would put even money on Aurene "dying for real this time" plot. She discovers a way to balance magic by transforming herself into something lifeless or without consciousness. Perhaps transforming herself into shrines across Tyria that act as magic routers/capacitors.

She's not going to die, that ship has sailed.

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I just hope they bring something really epic. in a way on another the season 4 was too predictable, except directions that was too stupid that no one can believe to be true as the sudden death of Joko and Aurene's lightning resurrection.> @Psientist.6437 said:

Aurene's too young to be tied down with a family. She deserves the chance to travel and explore herself. Besides, if there is anything that will plant the Torment in her soul, it would be raising 5 kids as a single mother.

The Pact would create some sort of social welfare for Dragons too. They will discover that tax on rich people will work better than fight elder dragons directly.

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And if Aurene consumes DSD's magics in Expansion 3, then there will be a 6th baby dragon, let's call him Bub, and will be ugly and no one will like him, but then it will turn into a beautiful angelic dragon, and everyone will see that you shouldn't judge anyone by someone's appearance.

You don't know how much fun I'm having writing those stuff. ;)

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@Blocki.4931 said:

@"Psientist.6437" said:I wouldn't put any money on the "three and pregnant" plot, but I would put even money on Aurene "dying for real this time" plot. She discovers a way to balance magic by transforming herself into something lifeless or without consciousness. Perhaps transforming herself into shrines across Tyria that act as magic routers/capacitors.

But that would make 0 sense, as her being ALIVE is exactly what you are describing already

It makes some sense. It would reduce the chance of the Kormir-Traheane effect occurring which we already see happening with Aurene. What are people calling her, crystal dragon jesus? We also don't know that she can balance magic by herself in her current form. We don't have any clue as to who else could help her and there is the chance that being a "magic balancer" comes with risks. Perhaps the risk can never be fully mitigated. We do know Aurene is willing to sacrifice herself. We also know there is a big reveal about The All coming. Since she is a crystal dragon, she would be able to create crystal spaces/ artifacts.

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@"Psientist.6437" said:I wouldn't put any money on the "three and pregnant" plot, but I would put even money on Aurene "dying for real this time" plot. She discovers a way to balance magic by transforming herself into something lifeless or without consciousness. Perhaps transforming herself into shrines across Tyria that act as magic routers/capacitors.

I personally find it more likely that she replaces many of them for a little while, until we realize she can't hold as much or as many different magics as we think and we start having to branch out to find other dragons that she can disperse some of the aspects to. If that's a thing. With no origin lore on Elder Dragons it's kind of hard to predict though.

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@"Psientist.6437" said:It makes some sense. It would reduce the chance of the Kormir-Traheane effect occurring which we already see happening with Aurene. What are people calling her, crystal dragon jesus?

It wouldn't really make sense given the plot so far as told us we need six living Elder Dragons to stabilize the world. It's not just about maintaining magic either, but maintaining The All itself. If a large number of shrines was sufficient, then the elder races would have made more Bloodstones while the Elder Dragons slept.

Aurene's being called a literal crystal dragon jesus because it's a trope and in War Eternal that's what she pretty much becomes in her asanine resurrection and how the Order of the Crystal Bloom treat her as if she died for their sins. How folks react to Aurene is nothing akin to Kormir or Trahearne.

We also don't know that she can balance magic by herself in her current form. We don't have any clue as to who else could help her and there is the chance that being a "magic balancer" comes with risks. Perhaps the risk can never be fully mitigated.We actually do know that she cannot balance magic by herself, and we do know there are risks that come with balancing magic - and we know those risks can be mitigated. The entire purpose of the champion role is to mitigate those risks:

Glint: You will see, Scion, that absorbing magic comes naturally. But the power, its temptations...they exact a price.Glint: Champion, this magic is powerful and dangerous. Share the burden so she can absorb it.Glint: Good. Power has many uses, Scion. By choosing to share it and heal wounds, you strengthen your bond with mortals.Glint: Remember that bond. As the power grows, so will the dangers. And the temptations.Glint: More powerful still, and more dangerous...Glint: Well done. When Elder Dragons gorge on magic with abandon, the world falls out of balance. We have no choice but to act.Glint: To use power responsibly is to know when and how to share it—and when not to use it at all. Now continue to the next trial.https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Scion_%26_Champion#In_Glint.27s_Lair

As for who can replace the other Elder Dragons: unless ArenaNet is deciding to go against established lore in yet another retcon, we do have some potential replacements, depending on what the requirements for replacements are. We also have a ritual that will allow us to free potential replacements from Elder Dragon control much like Glint was.

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@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@"Psientist.6437" said:It makes some sense. It would reduce the chance of the Kormir-Traheane effect occurring which we already see happening with Aurene. What are people calling her, crystal dragon jesus?

It wouldn't really make sense given the plot so far as told us we need six
living
Elder Dragons to stabilize the world. It's not just about maintaining magic either, but maintaining The All itself. If a large number of shrines was sufficient, then the elder races would have made more Bloodstones while the Elder Dragons slept.

Aurene's being called a literal crystal dragon jesus because
and in War Eternal that's what she pretty much becomes in her asanine resurrection and how the Order of the Crystal Bloom treat her as if she died for their sins. How folks react to Aurene is nothing akin to Kormir or Trahearne.

We also don't know that she can balance magic by herself in her current form. We don't have any clue as to who else could help her and there is the chance that being a "magic balancer" comes with risks. Perhaps the risk can never be fully mitigated.We actually do know that she cannot balance magic by herself, and we do know there are risks that come with balancing magic - and we know those risks can be mitigated. The entire purpose of the champion role is to mitigate those risks:

Glint: You will see, Scion, that absorbing magic comes naturally. But the power, its temptations...they exact a price.Glint: Champion, this magic is powerful and dangerous. Share the burden so she can absorb it.Glint: Good. Power has many uses, Scion. By choosing to share it and heal wounds, you strengthen your bond with mortals.Glint: Remember that bond. As the power grows, so will the dangers. And the temptations.Glint: More powerful still, and more dangerous...Glint: Well done. When Elder Dragons gorge on magic with abandon, the world falls out of balance. We have no choice but to act.Glint: To use power responsibly is to know when and how to share it—and when not to use it at all. Now continue to the next trial.

As for who can replace the other Elder Dragons: unless ArenaNet is deciding to go against established lore in yet another retcon, we do have some potential replacements, depending on what the requirements for replacements are. We also have a ritual that will allow us to free potential replacements from Elder Dragon control much like Glint was.

Thank you for the link, I loved this part: "The name itself is a Dead Unicorn Trope as few writers are willing to literally use a Crystal Dragon"Aurene's death and resurection was poorly handled. All of those Tyrians who loved Aurene, fought beside her, knew she had eaten a Lich but for some reason forget they live in Tyria and spend days moping around her impaled body. The way the studio tried to sell this scenario was pretentious.

I am not qualified to argue lore with you, however I don't think there is any chance that we see 6 beings take the place of the Elder dragons. Where are they? What would prevent them from going mad with magic sometime in the future? Imo, all signs point to a major revelation concerning The All that changes how we approach maintaining the balance of magic and the integrity of The All. The way Aurene behaves at the end of War Eternal leads me to believe that everyone on Tyria doesn't understand what The All is, but she does. We don't know that The All needs 6 Elder Dragons, we just know that it uses, well used, 6 Elder Dragons.

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@Eekasqueak.7850 said:The resurrection doesn't bother me inherently because they wrote themselves into a corner with the death itself which IMO wasn't needed.

Or was it? Aurene was not the same dragon after she resurrected. She may have discovered something while dead that set her on the path of revealing the true nature of The All. I wouldn't be surprised if her death and resurrection ended up being important plot points that they tried to camouflage with pretentious and unrealistic trauma drama and anguish porn.

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@"Psientist.6437" said:I don't think there is any chance that we see 6 beings take the place of the Elder dragons. Where are they?

Like I said, this depends on the requirements for being able to replace an Elder Dragon. We know Glint, Vlast, and Aurene could. They're technically dragon minions, but they're also literally children of Elder Dragons. Does this mean replacements must be literal children of Elder Dragons? Or can any dragon minion serve as a replacement as implied by Tequatl's power boost from Zhaitan's death? We know that "lesser dragons" like wyverns and skyscales can't become Elder Dragons, so that knocks off Kuunavang, Shiny, and other saltspray dragons off the list.

If a scion is specifically needed, then we're pretty shit outa luck at the moment, and better hope that we can find some more baby dragons out there.

But if "any dragon minion" or even just "certain dragon minions" would suffice, then we have a very huge roster of replacements. Chief among them being the Pale Tree.

Until ArenaNet delves into the plot, however, I doubt we'll get the answer. But Aurene dying to create micro bloodstones across the globe won't be the answer, as we've already been told that bloodstones and Balthazar could not fulfill the role.

What would prevent them from going mad with magic sometime in the future?

The same thing that prevents Aurene from going mad. Her connection to mortals allowing her to share magic and the burden. Whatever replacements we get, we'll have to create that connection with them too. Not likely the Commander doing it this time, but we have plenty of members of Dragon's Watch to fulfill the role as other would-be Elder Dragons' champions.

Imo, all signs point to a major revelation concerning The All that changes how we approach maintaining the balance of magic and the integrity of The All. The way Aurene behaves at the end of War Eternal leads me to believe that everyone on Tyria doesn't understand what The All is, but she does. We don't know that The All needs 6 Elder Dragons, we just know that it uses, well used, 6 Elder Dragons.

Doing this route would make the entire plot of Season 3 and Path of Fire pointless as well as the entire ending for Season 4 with Aurene's death and resurrection and the whole "Elder Dragons do not fear death". Making all the drama of your plot pointless is never a good move.

And if I'm correct in that you're referring to Aurene's talk about how she "wants to" be "cannot describe" what will happen - ArenaNet devs said during Guild Chat that it was basically their handwaving to avoid having to explain what it's like to become an Elder Dragon in order to keep some mystery about what it's like to be an Elder Dragon since Elder Dragons have and still are meant to be beyond mortal comprehension. So I doubt any of that ties into The All not needing six living beings to maintain balance, what we've been told repeatedly since Season 2.

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@"Psientist.6437" said:Thank you for the link, I loved this part: "The name itself is a Dead Unicorn Trope as few writers are willing to literally use a Crystal Dragon"Aurene's death and resurection was poorly handled. All of those Tyrians who loved Aurene, fought beside her, knew she had eaten a Lich but for some reason forget they live in Tyria and spend days moping around her impaled body. The way the studio tried to sell this scenario was pretentious.

A: Joko bounced back up near-instantly, Aurene did not.B: Nobody knew if Joko had an artifact keeping him alive somewhere or the magic was within himself. Most people saw and reacted to Aurene eating a mummy, not going "Aha, she's consuming his magic and gaining it!"C: Emotions. When people get very emotional, they may not think rationally. The commander an Aurene both saw her not moving, appearing dead, and Caithe's crystal blooms that came from a connection to Aurene fade away. Caithe couldn't hear Aurene or feel her emotions/thoughts anymore.

If the person who literally is hearing the thoughts of Aurene and has an intense connection with the dragon goes "she's gone" are you going to go "NOPE, SHE ALIVE CAUSE JOKO."

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@Kalavier.1097 said:

@"Psientist.6437" said:Thank you for the link, I loved this part: "The name itself is a Dead Unicorn Trope as few writers are willing to literally use a Crystal Dragon"Aurene's death and resurection was poorly handled. All of those Tyrians who loved Aurene, fought beside her, knew she had eaten a Lich but for some reason forget they live in Tyria and spend days moping around her impaled body. The way the studio tried to sell this scenario was pretentious.

A: Joko bounced back up near-instantly, Aurene did not.B: Nobody knew if Joko had an artifact keeping him alive somewhere or the magic was within himself. Most people saw and reacted to Aurene eating a mummy, not going "Aha, she's consuming his magic and gaining it!"C: Emotions. When people get very emotional, they may not think rationally. The commander an Aurene both saw her not moving, appearing dead, and Caithe's crystal blooms that came from a connection to Aurene fade away. Caithe couldn't hear Aurene or feel her emotions/thoughts anymore.

If the person who literally is hearing the thoughts of Aurene and has an intense connection with the dragon goes "she's gone" are you going to go "NOPE, SHE ALIVE CAUSE JOKO."

Don't forget D: Until that moment, Aurene and the Elder Dragons only gained new powers from consuming magic from dead Elder Dragons and demigods, and Joko was neither.

Honestly, Aurene becoming immortal because of Joko's magic makes less sense than people believing she'd become immortal because of Joko's magic.

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@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@"Psientist.6437" said:I don't think there is any chance that we see 6 beings take the place of the Elder dragons. Where are they?

Like I said, this depends on the requirements for being able to replace an Elder Dragon. We know Glint, Vlast, and Aurene could. They're technically dragon minions, but they're also literally children of Elder Dragons. Does this mean replacements must be literal children of Elder Dragons? Or can any dragon minion serve as a replacement as implied by Tequatl's power boost from Zhaitan's death? We know that "lesser dragons" like wyverns and skyscales can't become Elder Dragons, so that knocks off Kuunavang, Shiny, and other saltspray dragons off the list.

If a scion is specifically needed, then we're pretty kitten outa luck at the moment, and better hope that we can find some more baby dragons out there.

But if "any dragon minion" or even just "certain dragon minions" would suffice, then we have a very huge roster of replacements. Chief among them being the Pale Tree.

Until ArenaNet delves into the plot, however, I doubt we'll get the answer. But Aurene dying to create micro bloodstones across the globe won't be the answer, as we've already been told that bloodstones and Balthazar could not fulfill the role.

What would prevent them from going mad with magic sometime in the future?

The same thing that prevents Aurene from going mad. Her connection to mortals allowing her to share magic and the burden. Whatever replacements we get, we'll have to create that connection with them too. Not likely the Commander doing it this time, but we have plenty of members of Dragon's Watch to fulfill the role as other would-be Elder Dragons' champions.

Imo, all signs point to a major revelation concerning The All that changes how we approach maintaining the balance of magic and the integrity of The All. The way Aurene behaves at the end of War Eternal leads me to believe that everyone on Tyria doesn't understand what The All is, but she does. We don't know that The All needs 6 Elder Dragons, we just know that it uses, well used, 6 Elder Dragons.

Doing this route would make the entire plot of Season 3 and Path of Fire pointless as well as the entire ending for Season 4 with Aurene's death and resurrection and the whole "Elder Dragons do not fear death". Making all the drama of your plot pointless is never a good move.

And if I'm correct in that you're referring to Aurene's talk about how she "wants to" be "cannot describe" what will happen - ArenaNet devs said during Guild Chat that it was basically their handwaving to avoid having to explain what it's like to become an Elder Dragon in order to keep some mystery about what it's like to be an Elder Dragon since Elder Dragons have and still are meant to be beyond mortal comprehension. So I doubt any of that ties into The All not needing six living beings to maintain balance, what we've been told repeatedly since Season 2.

What do you make of Aurne's parting words and last scene in War Eternal? She declares she will reveal All, flaps her wings displacing a fog and revealing the the wide universe. To me, that telegraphs an upcoming and significant revelation concerning The All and that Tyrians are in the dark about the nature of The All.

I never said anything about Bloodstones, why the focus on Bloodstones?

You may be right and we need 6 Elder Dragons or pseudo Elder dragons but we haven't spent any time in game talking about who they could be. A lot will have to happen very fast if that is the direction we are going. If it isn't, I don't agree that anything from previous episodes is wasted since it brought us Aurene. She is new and unique, something Tyria has never seen. Yes, Tyrians have been saying we need 6 living beings but do they know enough about The All to say why or are they just reading their instruments, describing what they see and assuming that is the only way it can be? We are missing a key piece of information, the nature of The All.

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@Kalavier.1097 said:

@"Psientist.6437" said:Thank you for the link, I loved this part: "The name itself is a Dead Unicorn Trope as few writers are willing to literally use a Crystal Dragon"Aurene's death and resurection was poorly handled. All of those Tyrians who loved Aurene, fought beside her, knew she had eaten a Lich but for some reason forget they live in Tyria and spend days moping around her impaled body. The way the studio tried to sell this scenario was pretentious.

A: Joko bounced back up near-instantly, Aurene did not.B: Nobody knew if Joko had an artifact keeping him alive somewhere or the magic was within himself. Most people saw and reacted to Aurene eating a mummy, not going "Aha, she's consuming his magic and gaining it!"C: Emotions. When people get very emotional, they may not think rationally. The commander an Aurene both saw her not moving, appearing dead, and Caithe's crystal blooms that came from a connection to Aurene fade away. Caithe couldn't hear Aurene or feel her emotions/thoughts anymore.

If the person who literally is hearing the thoughts of Aurene and has an intense connection with the dragon goes "she's gone" are you going to go "NOPE, SHE ALIVE CAUSE JOKO."

I think these are nonsense answers based on the tricks the writers used to sell the scenario to players. The tricks only work if we assume Tyrians know as little about their world as we do, as though they are just visiting as well. Which is ridiculous.

Within the first five minutes the Commander or someone else would be looking for any witnesses to what happened. Did anyone see Aurene's magic leave her body? Did any Asuran devices pick up her magic leaving her body. Was there any sign of her magic reaching the other Elder Dragons? There would be plenty of devices and people watching them.

How do soldiers react to the death of their comrades? They get very emotional but they never leave corpses impaled on spikes for days. Tyrians would have had Aurene back alive within minutes. They wouldn't need to prove to themselves that Joko's magic lived on in her, they would have hoped and acted.

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@Psientist.6437 said:

@Eekasqueak.7850 said:The resurrection doesn't bother me inherently because they wrote themselves into a corner with the death itself which IMO wasn't needed.

Or was it? Aurene was not the same dragon after she resurrected. She may have discovered something while dead that set her on the path of revealing the true nature of The All. I wouldn't be surprised if her death and resurrection ended up being important plot points that they tried to camouflage with pretentious and unrealistic trauma drama and anguish kitten.

I don't think they plan that far ahead.

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@Eekasqueak.7850 said:

@Eekasqueak.7850 said:The resurrection doesn't bother me inherently because they wrote themselves into a corner with the death itself which IMO wasn't needed.

Or was it? Aurene was not the same dragon after she resurrected. She may have discovered something while dead that set her on the path of revealing the true nature of The All. I wouldn't be surprised if her death and resurrection ended up being important plot points that they tried to camouflage with pretentious and unrealistic trauma drama and anguish kitten.

I don't think they plan that far ahead.

Correct. They plan one episode at a time. Her death and resurrection were not planned together for example but as events decided at the start of that episode.

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@Psientist.6437 said:What do you make of Aurne's parting words and last scene in War Eternal? She declares she will reveal All, flaps her wings displacing a fog and revealing the the wide universe. To me, that telegraphs an upcoming and significant revelation concerning The All and that Tyrians are in the dark about the nature of The All.

That's not what she said. She said nothing about The All:

Aurene: I can't explain what's about to happen, Champion...Aurene: But I want to share it with you.Aurene: All of you.

And like I said before, she was talking about ascending into an Elder Dragon, as confirmed by devs in Guild Chat.

@Psientist.6437 said:I never said anything about Bloodstones, why the focus on Bloodstones?

Because the "shrines covering the world to regulate magic" is basically a network of bloodstones. Functionally the same thing.

You may be right and we need 6 Elder Dragons or pseudo Elder dragons but we haven't spent any time in game talking about who they could be. A lot will have to happen very fast if that is the direction we are going.

Because we haven't had the time. It's been one world ending threat (Balthazar) and then another (Kralkatorrik). The beginning of Season 5 will be the first time we got a moment to breath. This is part of why I think part of Season 5 will be finding replacements for Zhaitan and Mordremoth (another part being that last year, Matthew Medina was writing up a way to get Malyck into the game, and "finding a replacement for Mordremoth" seems like a reasonable way to do so).

As for pacing... when has ArenaNet not gone through plots in rapid pacing? Though I think half a season to find, and possibly train and elevate, two Elder Dragon replacements isn't that fast.

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@Randulf.7614 said:

@Eekasqueak.7850 said:The resurrection doesn't bother me inherently because they wrote themselves into a corner with the death itself which IMO wasn't needed.

Or was it? Aurene was not the same dragon after she resurrected. She may have discovered something while dead that set her on the path of revealing the true nature of The All. I wouldn't be surprised if her death and resurrection ended up being important plot points that they tried to camouflage with pretentious and unrealistic trauma drama and anguish kitten.

I don't think they plan that far ahead.

Correct. They plan one episode at a time. Her death and resurrection were not planned together for example but as events decided at the start of that episode.

Not quite. They create a basic outline of the season at the beginning of writing it, but they don't (necessarily) create connections between events or how/why events occur.

They knew they wanted to kill Aurene off fairly early on in the season, and thus they knew they'd bring her back. But it wasn't until they had gotten to writing Episode 6 that they had official thought process into how she comes back.

That said, them planning in the beginning that her death was anything more than a kick for drama is pretty much nulled by their writing process. If they didn't even have plans to resurrect Aurene via Joko's magic when they had planned either event, then they're not likely gonna be planning ahead that her death was part of some grand plan or personal revelation. It was just a shock value in the end, and the reasons for her death being necessary plot-wise got tacted on afterwards.

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