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What is up with the matchmaker?


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@Zexanima.7851 said:

@"RisenHowl.2419" said:

how does the top 2 duo get paired against a team of silver/golds with no duos? 1 of the people on our team hasn't even pvped before?

I'd say maybe the other players on their team were really low rank, but that's definitely not the case. they were better than 3/5 of our team.

Links broken, fyi

fixed, thank you

@phalaris.5134 said:Yeah lol was in same match with you and I hands down far off to be in the same tier to be grouped against Naru & Xtrverz. As mentioned before I don't mind loosing in my own tier but this was actually fun to see 1st row.

There was nothing balanced about this match man @.@ how do brand new pvpers end up against top 2 duo. I could see if we'd be sitting in queue for 5+ minutes, but it popped in 3. So at this point is it even making matches or just grabbing the first 10 regardless of their rank?

@Crab Fear.1624 said:Lol.

There are those that actually thinking that the population is still huge....

Lol.

There are those that actually think* that the matchmaker should be working instead of putting a top 2 duo on a team of golds vs a silver and 4 golds with a 3m queue. usually you ditch queue if it's been longer than 5 minutes to prevent this exact sort of game.

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I got paired against a team of JonesBoy (currently rank 5) x Someone with the Best of the Best title (Edit 2: iirc, MLGKorno, rank 6) this morning. If I had to make an educated guess, these guys play on purpose at these hours, basically to farm noobs / lower tiers for their weekly 15 wins. I am gold, and my team was gold / silver.

They almost owned us even when they lost 1 player to DC, but we were holding our ground fairly well.. Then 2 minutes later, by some strange coincidence, one of our teammates disappeared too, and then they lol-farmed us in 4v4.

Edit: I actually had half a dozen matches where I got paired against / with high plat players with God of PvP / Indomitable Legend titles. And I am floating between gold 2/3. It has never been this bad during past seasons.

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@Adamixos.6785 said:I got paired against a team of JonesBoy (currently rank 5) x Someone with the Best of the Best title (Edit 2: iirc, MLGKorno, rank 6) this morning. If I had to make an educated guess, these guys play on purpose at these hours, basically to farm noobs / lower tiers for their weekly 15 wins. I am gold, and my team was gold / silver.

They almost owned us even when they lost 1 player to DC, but we were holding our ground fairly well.. Then 2 minutes later, by some strange coincidence, one of our teammates disappeared too, and then they lol-farmed us in 4v4.

Edit: I actually had half a dozen matches where I got paired against / with high plat players with God of PvP / Indomitable Legend titles. And I am floating between gold 2/3. It has never been this bad during past seasons.

Isnt it funny how these coincidences happen?

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@RisenHowl.2419 said:

how does the top 2 duo get paired against a team of silver/golds with no duos? 1 of the people on our team hasn't even pvped before?

I'd say maybe the other players on their team were really low rank, but that's definitely not the case. they were better than 3/5 of our team.

Links broken, fyi

fixed, thank you

@phalaris.5134 said:Yeah lol was in same match with you and I hands down far off to be in the same tier to be grouped against Naru & Xtrverz. As mentioned before I don't mind loosing in my own tier but this was actually fun to see 1st row.

There was nothing balanced about this match man @.@ how do brand new pvpers end up against top 2 duo. I could see if we'd be sitting in queue for 5+ minutes, but it popped in 3. So at this point is it even making matches or just grabbing the first 10 regardless of their rank?

@Crab Fear.1624 said:Lol.

There are those that actually thinking that the population is still huge....

Lol.

There are those that actually think* that the matchmaker should be working instead of putting a top 2 duo on a team of golds vs a silver and 4 golds with a 3m queue. usually you ditch queue if it's been longer than 5 minutes to prevent this exact sort of game.

How does ditching q prevent it?

I mean the guys sitting in the long q and waiting still have the ever expanding range. If you are low and re-q, you still get scooped up by that lot.

The game is gonna take what it has. There are not that many people who q in ranked.

I have had to play against them too, and I am low level.

Each game should have 10 people in it. How many people do you think are actively playing at any given time?

I think it's over bro.

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Players: "Look at this laundry list of issues we're facing in PvP. Any word on what's up?"Anet:

Seriously though, issues like these make it really hard for me to play PvP as a competitive mode. Your rank does absolutely nothing. It doesn't represent skill, it doesn't balance matches, it has no purpose other than to make you feel like you suck if you tank.

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@"Zexanima.7851" said:Players: "Look at this laundry list of issues we're facing in PvP. Any word on what's up?"Anet:

Seriously though, issues like these make it really hard for me to play PvP as a competitive mode. Your rank does absolutely nothing. It doesn't represent skill, it doesn't balance matches, it has no purpose other than to make you feel like you suck if you tank.

No point in PvP until this kind of shut gets addressed

Good thing there's another PvP gamemode... oh wait the servers lag so badly from wvw that you can't play that either unless you want to stare at your skill bar and watch it blink at you for 30s before casting every skill

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@RisenHowl.2419 said:

@"Zexanima.7851" said:Players: "Look at this laundry list of issues we're facing in PvP. Any word on what's up?"Anet:

Seriously though, issues like these make it really hard for me to play PvP as a competitive mode. Your rank does absolutely nothing. It doesn't represent skill, it doesn't balance matches, it has no purpose other than to make you feel like you suck if you tank.

No point in PvP until this kind of shut gets addressed

Good thing there's another PvP gamemode... oh wait the servers lag so badly from wvw that you can't play that either unless you want to stare at your skill bar and watch it blink at you for 30s before casting every skill

Another PvP mode? I think you mean PPT mode.

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@"RisenHowl.2419" said:There are those that actually think* that the matchmaker should be working instead of putting a top 2 duo on a team of golds vs a silver and 4 golds with a 3m queue. usually you ditch queue if it's been longer than 5 minutes to prevent this exact sort of game.

There was a discussion a while back about how the matchmaker actually works. You see this behavior your witnessing has actually been going on for a very long time. What Crab Fear said is absolutely true about Que dodging...in that que dodging is a placebo.

In the discussion i explained how the Matchmaker matches players together via a two stage system, using a server ping that occurs every 30 seconds. every ping, the server will attempt at initiating a match between a pool of players that are in the que. So lets say there are 9 people in que, the server will attempt to create the match every 30 seconds, returning back a failed marker because there aren't enough people in the que to initiate a match. Once that 10 person hops into the que, the next server ping will attempt to create the match and be successful. So you see, you could have 9 people in que waiting for 15 minutes, and the last person waiting only a few seconds for the que pop. You can imagine that maybe some of those group of 9 people "tryed to que dodge" by canceling their que and then requing it, but they still land in the same pool of potential players, no matter how many times they do this until that 10th player shows up.

Now, aside from how the matchmaker works with regards to the server-wide ping, these matches of high level players vs. low level players was also explained. The fact is that the matchmaker is simply not good enough in determining skill level to create balanced matches. The explanation is a bit long and tedious, but it has to do with

1) Low ranked players getting carried by higher ranked players.2) Balance and how the current balance of the game has shifted the skill floor.

So you'll see silver quality players reaching into platinum ranks, and when versed against good players, they will get decimated because the differential between a bad player with a meta build and a good player with a meta build is staggeringly high.

In addition, the matchmaker uses a number of "data points" to determine a scoring system that assigns you your teams before initiating a match-start. This includes how long you have played, whether you have dishonor, what class you are, what guild tags you have on your team, and slew of other factors.

Anet has said that this has "no effect" on the match but looking at the pseudo code over and over again, what they are telling you is a lie... But it's unfalsifiable since they haven't given us anything. I can go on and on about the matchmaker, but it requires a more organized post, something i won't bother with again. Truth is that the game mode is dying hard, and unless anet actually make some good decisions on what to do about the problems above, nothing will change and spvp will continue to die.

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@"RisenHowl.2419" said:https://imgur.com/hoeDw5N

how does the top 2 duo get paired against a team of silver/golds with no duos? 1 of the people on our team hasn't even pvped before?

I'd say maybe the other players on their team were really low rank, but that's definitely not the case. they were better than 3/5 of our team.

i get this quite alot, but double duo on enemies team and not one duo on my team

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@RisenHowl.2419 said:

@Adamixos.6785 said:I got paired against a team of JonesBoy (currently rank 5) x Someone with the Best of the Best title (Edit 2: iirc, MLGKorno, rank 6) this morning. If I had to make an educated guess, these guys play on purpose at these hours, basically to farm noobs / lower tiers for their weekly 15 wins. I am gold, and my team was gold / silver.

They almost owned us even when they lost 1 player to DC, but we were holding our ground fairly well.. Then 2 minutes later, by some
strange coincidence
, one of our teammates disappeared too, and then they lol-farmed us in 4v4.

Edit: I actually had half a dozen matches where I got paired against / with high plat players with God of PvP / Indomitable Legend titles. And I am floating between gold 2/3. It has never been this bad during past seasons.

Isnt it funny how these coincidences happen?

I was about to say the same thing..Theres no such thing as win trading, but it just so happens that someone from your team will DC the moment you start to win against these players.Cant say youre a top player if you lose to golds right?

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@sephiroth.4217 said:

@"Adamixos.6785" said:I got paired against a team of JonesBoy (currently rank 5) x Someone with the Best of the Best title (Edit 2: iirc, MLGKorno, rank 6) this morning. If I had to make an educated guess, these guys play on purpose at these hours, basically to farm noobs / lower tiers for their weekly 15 wins. I am gold, and my team was gold / silver.

They almost owned us even when they lost 1 player to DC, but we were holding our ground fairly well.. Then 2 minutes later, by some
strange coincidence
, one of our teammates disappeared too, and then they lol-farmed us in 4v4.

Edit: I actually had half a dozen matches where I got paired against / with high plat players with God of PvP / Indomitable Legend titles. And I am floating between gold 2/3. It has never been this bad during past seasons.

Isnt it funny how these coincidences happen?

I was about to say the same thing..Theres no such thing as win trading, but it just so happens that someone from your team will DC the moment you start to win against these players.Cant say youre a top player if you lose to golds right?

top players lose to golds lol...silvers...me...bronze...

wait or is it bought?

qFxCQmO.jpg

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I'm normally a plat 1-2 player and I just haven't been queueing this season until some of the Rampage Mains are hopefully culled a bit next balance patch. Spellbreaker, holo and scrapper all making up 1-3 members of every team and mostly running rampage, having to potentially deal with 3 rampages a minute is just obnoxious.

I'm normally the type that does a ton of matches and goes up against top players and would probably serve as a buffer against them going up against gold 1s and silvers. There are probably a lot of others in this.

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I've had this happen a handful of times (either enemy or on my team) and it's my main gripe with PvP in this game. Classes being OP or a pain to fight alright w/e... just do not match me against the literal God himself of PvP when I'm barely past gold 3.

"Nice you're gold 3 but lost your last game? How?""Oh you know, just matched up against 'Best of the Best' aka tournament winner and that one guy with 'God of PvP' title""Well shit."

All you have to do is look at the name or title and 9 times outta 10 they're high plat or, back in the day, these people had to have been leaderboard material in order to acquire some of those 'x legend' titles. I don't mind waiting 10 mins, heck 40+ mins for a game at least one would hope they're my skill level/division so we can have a decent match. These matches are whack and legit make the game's PvP player base look tiny, utterly disappointing.

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@"yanniell.1236" said:Oh, look. Naru abusing duoQ + off hours. Shocking.

I wonder how long it gonna take to Anet realizes that duo queue is killing what rest of their game mode.

Yikes homie. If you think I am voluntarily putting myself in games like this you are mistaken. The game OP is referring to I got a +2, and had we lost a -40. Those are also the games we are most susceptible to lose because to average out team rating we have to get low golds/silvers vs golds/plats because of our combined rating. No matter what time we Q we always get 6-8min queues and games like this. It has happened during NA prime, early na, and late na(prime PST for me). Also there is no such thing as 'abusing duo q" how bitter do you have to be to think someone using a feature is abusing it just because they are winning. Ideally we'd like to be in all plat/legend games, those are more fun and less punishing because when you gain +10 and lose -20(carrying 3 plats vs plats/legends is easier than carrying silvers who dont press buttons vs plats/golds) it feels alot better than when you lose -30+ and only gain 2-5. Alot of misinformation just wanted to clarify.

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@NotoriousNaru.1705 said:

@"yanniell.1236" said:Oh, look. Naru abusing duoQ + off hours. Shocking.

I wonder how long it gonna take to Anet realizes that duo queue is killing what rest of their game mode.

Yikes homie. If you think I am voluntarily putting myself in games like this you are mistaken. The game OP is referring to I got a +2, and had we lost a -40. Those are also the games we are most susceptible to lose because to average out team rating we have to get low golds/silvers vs golds/plats because of our combined rating. No matter what time we Q we always get 6-8min queues and games like this. It has happened during NA prime, early na, and late na(prime PST for me). Also there is no such thing as 'abusing duo q" how bitter do you have to be to think someone using a feature is abusing it just because they are winning. Ideally we'd like to be in all plat/legend games, those are more fun and less punishing because when you gain +10 and lose -20(carrying 3 plats vs plats/legends is easier than carrying silvers who dont press buttons vs plats/golds) it feels alot better than when you lose -30+ and only gain 2-5. Alot of misinformation just wanted to clarify.

That's not the fucked up part =/

You got 2 top players + 3 mid golds vs 2 gold 3, 2 gold 2, and a silver 2. Our silver camped the treb for the first 3m of the fight, then ran in and fed you two for the remaining couple minutes.

The match maker straight up failed

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How I’d do match making:

  1. Lock professions on queue
  2. Anet makes pre-set ideal team comps based on role, with 1/5 of the team open to any role, with the goal of creating mirror comps by role
  3. Have players select a role for their build when they queue
  4. Use MMR to create somewhat balanced matches within the above.

A team with no damage won’t win. A team with no support against a team with support (played effectively) will generally lose. Balance by composition and then worry about MMR.

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@"saerni.2584" said:

  1. Have players select a role for their build when they queue

That's the single best idea for match making that I've heard in a very long time.

That way it could prioritize putting together: Support/Team Fight/Decap Plus/Side Noder styled comps.

Not sure how this would realistically effect que times, but it would greatly enhance the quality of matches concerning team comp vs. team comp balance.

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