Are you willing to pay for better balance? And if so, how?

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

There's no agreement among players as to what "balance" is, let alone "better balance." So it's hard to respond to the question at all. There's simply no way to guarantee that balance will be to anyone's liking.

All ANet can really do is update more frequently, so that there's time to adjust whenever major problems or loopholes are discovered. It might also encourage ANet to experiment a bit more, if they know that the game won't be stuck for months with their decisions.

---

A more fruitful line of discussion might be:

• Would you be willing to pay to see balance changes made (at least for PvP) on a monthly basis, with something like four quarterly updates (3 big, one massive) and smaller rebalancing steps every month, to adjust|tweak as players adapt to the major changes.
• How would you be willing to pay for that?

I think, however, it's unlikely that ANet hasn't already considered this and decided that there's not enough demand to pay for the 3-4 extra staff positions this might require.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

i'm actually the runner up for balance president.

[Burnfall.9573]

@bravan.3876 said:

@MyPuppy.8970 said:Money isn't always the answer.

Yeah but no money also isn't a solution :thinking:

7 Years+alpha+beta, what has 'solution thinking' done to improve the game in a healthy competitive learning way?

[bravan.3876]

@Burnfall.9573 said:

@bravan.3876 said:

@MyPuppy.8970 said:Money isn't always the answer.

Yeah but no money also isn't a solution :thinking:

7 Years+alpha+beta, what has 'solution thinking' done to improve the game in a healthy competitive learning way?

:thinking: (means the emote) not thinking as thinking.

[Burnfall.9573]

@bravan.3876 said:

@Burnfall.9573 said:

@bravan.3876 said:

@MyPuppy.8970 said:Money isn't always the answer.

Yeah but no money also isn't a solution :thinking:

7 Years+alpha+beta, what has 'solution thinking' done to improve the game in a healthy competitive learning way?

:thinking: (means the emote) not thinking as thinking.

(understood)either way, it still doesn't change anything

[Daishi.6027]

PvP is not the factor alone, but I'm willing to pay for gems when I am satisfied with the game, and hold back when I find it lacking.

After all the stuff with the skyscale and time gates being reduced from arguing and debating it, I will reward when that kind feedback is acted upon. Even thought it didn't affect me, it should not have been implemented that way and A-net seems to understand that, so they got my money. (Although they clearly goofed in other situations regarding that.) That was my exception since the march update, and the limit that good will bought. Right now, I'm at the point where I don't even want to give A-net money even if they build good will in other parts of the game. It's been a while since I spent anything as a "thanks" for PvP. I recall really being put off since December, but I'm pretty sure that decline started happening around late august 2018 (around the start of S13).

[ZeteCommander.4937]

@hellsqueen.3045 said:

@choovanski.5462 said:

@Cardolan.9123 said:

@choovanski.5462 said:

@Cardolan.9123 said:

@choovanski.5462 said:what makes you think these morons could do it even if you gave them one billion pounds?

You can simply hire better balance devs with way less than one billion pounds.

they have had millions of pounds to spend on Devs for the last 7 or so years this game has been out, and look who they hired, and look what they have done. both HoT and PoF show a massive misunderstanding of what is good for a PvP game.

anet don't know what they are doing. they don't care either. you can't throw money at them to make them understand how balance works for pvp, it will never happen.

Millions of pounds spent on devs of the whole game, not necessarily on PVP. And the expansions did bring some revenue so not a bad call. As for PVP, maybe it was also because there's this consistency of low profit per input over the past 7 years so they just did't have the reason to share their immense resource on it. Can't care what can't be cared.

c'mon my dude. this company has been doing constantly bad balance patches for pvp for years. they don't decide to do bad patches because they don't think the gamemode makes enough money.

don't be stupid.

revenue effects the frequency of updates sure, but not the quality of the actual balance changes made. stupid balancing decisions arnt made to punish the community for not giving them enough money.

no. stupid balancing decisions are made by incompetent devs who don't know what they are doing.

paying them more won't magically teach them how to balance a PvP game. it's something they do not know, and over the last 7 years have not been able to learn.

What makes you think you could do balance better or in a way that doesn't completely mess up other characters?

In games like this, it isn't east to balance multiple classes to come up against each other and you can look at any MMO game to prove it. Heck, you can look at MOBA's to prove it.

Balancing isn't easy.Balancing things that don't have some level of similarity between another makes balancing harder still.

Look at WoW. Heck, even look at Overwatch. Look at League.

Balancing things that are different isn't easy.This isn't like CSGO where you just tweak some numbers on bullets and maybe fire rate and w/e.Everything is different, things require more changes than just number tweaks to bring them in line.

You are being arrogant and cruel to the Devs who aren't necessarily being faced with the easiest job especially when it comes to facing different classes against each other.

PvE complains a tad less about the balance because they don't have to face each other, they get to work with each other.

I don't think the balance of Gw2 is much better than Wow.Ow is far more balanced than the Gw2.

[Arheundel.6451]

Current balance is intentional....brainless gameplay makes the game more alluring for the paying "whales"

[ILoveMonotony.1479]

No additional support from me at this time. That ship has sailed.

[Celestia.9128]

Idk, this is the team that gutted GW1 while it still was massively successful in PvP...still I have this sliver of hope that if they have a more stable income in the form of subscription, it will give them more resources to do it better...hopefully

[Vieux P.1238]

$$$ HeLL nO!

[Ragnar.4257]

@Sorem.9157 said:We need to remember we are customers. We payed for this game. We payed for this service. Like many players here, I have already spent almost 7000 hours in this game, because i have a passion for it, despite the constant disapointment that a few individuals have provided. I'd be willing to pay for a service that satisfies me, but i will not throw my money blindly out of faith that balance will be achieved and that PvP will no longer be the clown fiesta that it is now and that ArenaNet will no longer hide its plans for the future like its some kind of pentagon top secret.

Honestly, the lack of transparency of this company and the way they refuse to listen to feedback or even comment on it is just purely disrespectful to every single player who has given their product time and hard earned money.

/rant

I mean, not saying that everything is fine...... but you've got 7000 hours of entertainment out of, what, $60? And you think you've been ripped off?

[Interpretor.3091]

I know this has nothing to do with balance but with this game’s really good action combat in a moba style on a different client and game would be a lot of fun.Think Classic moba style, items, levels, jungle and minions like smite but with good GW2 action combat would be a great game. Would be easier to balance too. Single map, different classes with like 2 bans for classes. Mini jumping puzzles in jungle for buffs, lords and bosses for buffs. So good.

[hellsqueen.3045]

@ZeteCommander.4937 said:

@hellsqueen.3045 said:

@choovanski.5462 said:

@Cardolan.9123 said:

@choovanski.5462 said:

@Cardolan.9123 said:

@choovanski.5462 said:what makes you think these morons could do it even if you gave them one billion pounds?

You can simply hire better balance devs with way less than one billion pounds.

they have had millions of pounds to spend on Devs for the last 7 or so years this game has been out, and look who they hired, and look what they have done. both HoT and PoF show a massive misunderstanding of what is good for a PvP game.

anet don't know what they are doing. they don't care either. you can't throw money at them to make them understand how balance works for pvp, it will never happen.

Millions of pounds spent on devs of the whole game, not necessarily on PVP. And the expansions did bring some revenue so not a bad call. As for PVP, maybe it was also because there's this consistency of low profit per input over the past 7 years so they just did't have the reason to share their immense resource on it. Can't care what can't be cared.

c'mon my dude. this company has been doing constantly bad balance patches for pvp for years. they don't decide to do bad patches because they don't think the gamemode makes enough money.

don't be stupid.

revenue effects the frequency of updates sure, but not the quality of the actual balance changes made. stupid balancing decisions arnt made to punish the community for not giving them enough money.

no. stupid balancing decisions are made by incompetent devs who don't know what they are doing.

paying them more won't magically teach them how to balance a PvP game. it's something they do not know, and over the last 7 years have not been able to learn.

What makes you think you could do balance better or in a way that doesn't completely mess up other characters?

In games like this, it isn't east to balance multiple classes to come up against each other and you can look at any MMO game to prove it. Heck, you can look at MOBA's to prove it.

Balancing isn't easy.Balancing things that don't have some level of similarity between another makes balancing harder still.

Look at WoW. Heck, even look at Overwatch. Look at League.

Balancing things that are different isn't easy.This isn't like CSGO where you just tweak some numbers on bullets and maybe fire rate and w/e.Everything is different, things require more changes than just number tweaks to bring them in line.

You are being arrogant and cruel to the Devs who aren't necessarily being faced with the easiest job especially when it comes to facing different classes against each other.

PvE complains a tad less about the balance because they don't have to face each other, they get to work with each other.

I don't think the balance of Gw2 is much better than Wow.Ow is far more balanced than the Gw2.

Overwatch's balance is the biggest joke I have ever seen.There are characters who have been ruined in design because the core concept of what the character should be was ignored.

Mercy, the already mechanically easy hero made brainlessly easier during ult with no concern that her having weaknesses is what made her balanced.

D.va being turned into a big DPS and nerfing her DM in the wrong ways until finally doing the right one but not changing the other parts back. She is a tank. Shortening DM is good. Everything before it and the micro missiles was poor balance decisions.

The fact that tanks have been made to do more damage and their tanking is punished is crazy ans the fact that unless you are a character who has high burst or OHK or Kill combo potential, you are a wasted slot. And healing was the buffed to ridiculous levels to counter this and yet only tanks could have time to recieve that healing.

I've never had issues with Guild Wars balancing, the way I have had with Overwatch.

Heck, Apex Legends and R6:Siege are better balanced than Overwatch. And even they failed in apsects.

Point is, balancing isn't easy but at least Guild Wars doesn't have the worst balancing I have ever seen and I don't tend to judge it too harshly simply because Guild Wars to me was marketed as a PVE Or WVW experience. The fact that they have a PVP was just an extra bit of excitement for me.

Sure, I would appreciate if they dropped more frequent balance patches for the PVP and WVW game modes. Even updated them in general more often as well, but I am not going to sit here and whine when it was supposed to just be an extra fun addition to the game.I also respect that balancing is hard, especially when any class has the potential to be whatever they want to be. You could build a god damn support thief if you really wanted to, but you don't see them balancing for that, do you?

You cannot have perfect balance in a game like Guild Wars. Mmo's are not MOBA's and therefore they are often harder to balance for PvP because there is no controled points to balance from.

Every class has no defined role.Every class has a multitude of abilities that can change what they do.Every character has different stats that can change what they do.Every class has the potential to overlap in roles of another.Every class has things that can make enemy builds weaker.When removing possible builds if they are decided problematic by removing amulets and runes from play, it leaves room for other builds to be incredibly strong. EG. They removed Cleric's a long time ago, I used to run that on all my support/bunkers but they removed it and I was never able to play those characters with those builds ever again.

Too much variation makes it impossible to have perfect balance. And often perfect balance is already impossible to achieve. The closest to perfect balance something has, the less variables there are. As I said, CS:GO is a good example, everyone has access to the same tools, therefore the weapons become easier to balance against each other. There are set ways they can change them as well.

• Damage
• Fire Rate
• Firing Pattern
• Recoil
• Ammo Capacity
• Reload Speed

These are a lot of ways to balance a gun but they are much more easier to decide on.

[Firebeard.1746]

How come you don't have a 3rd option of: they should fix the game without us having to pay for balance directly? This is a VERY biased poll by tying balance needed with extra money specifically for that.

The problem i have with this is the same problem i have with paying for extra inventory space in f2p games: you're incentivizing them breaking the game now in return for more money on the "fix" later (most f2p games have inventory bloat with tons of filler items and item management is a nightmare). You all are kitten. Support anet with a steady trickle of gem purchases (but rarely use them) and demand a good game or just don't play. Please don't ask anet to turn this game into a f2p flaming garbage can.

[Bazooka.3590]

Find your inner balance and you will find balance in GW2 PVP.Kidding. The balance in this game is a piece of shit.And the saddest thing: the pvp community flood the forums with good balance and mm fix/workaround ideas but the devs don't give a fuck. Basically we are doing a part of their job for free and all they can do is delete the posts what they don't like.This behavior is outrageous and unacceptable.