What is up with the matchmaker? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

What is up with the matchmaker?

RisenHowl.2419RisenHowl.2419 Member ✭✭✭
edited June 27, 2019 in PVP

https://imgur.com/hoeDw5N

how does the top 2 duo get paired against a team of silver/golds with no duos? 1 of the people on our team hasn't even pvped before?

I'd say maybe the other players on their team were really low rank, but that's definitely not the case. they were better than 3/5 of our team.

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Comments

  • Zexanima.7851Zexanima.7851 Member ✭✭✭

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    https://imgur.com/undefined

    how does the top 2 duo get paired against a team of silver/golds with no duos? 1 of the people on our team hasn't even pvped before?

    I'd say maybe the other players on their team were really low rank, but that's definitely not the case. they were better than 3/5 of our team.

    Links broken, fyi

    No longer playing the game due to PvP being abandon.

  • Yeah lol was in same match with you and I hands down far off to be in the same tier to be grouped against Naru & Xtrverz. As mentioned before I don't mind loosing in my own tier but this was actually fun to see 1st row.

  • Adamixos.6785Adamixos.6785 Member ✭✭
    edited June 24, 2019

    I got paired against a team of JonesBoy (currently rank 5) x Someone with the Best of the Best title (Edit 2: iirc, MLGKorno, rank 6) this morning. If I had to make an educated guess, these guys play on purpose at these hours, basically to farm noobs / lower tiers for their weekly 15 wins. I am gold, and my team was gold / silver.

    They almost owned us even when they lost 1 player to DC, but we were holding our ground fairly well.. Then 2 minutes later, by some strange coincidence, one of our teammates disappeared too, and then they lol-farmed us in 4v4.

    Edit: I actually had half a dozen matches where I got paired against / with high plat players with God of PvP / Indomitable Legend titles. And I am floating between gold 2/3. It has never been this bad during past seasons.

  • RisenHowl.2419RisenHowl.2419 Member ✭✭✭

    @Adamixos.6785 said:
    I got paired against a team of JonesBoy (currently rank 5) x Someone with the Best of the Best title (Edit 2: iirc, MLGKorno, rank 6) this morning. If I had to make an educated guess, these guys play on purpose at these hours, basically to farm noobs / lower tiers for their weekly 15 wins. I am gold, and my team was gold / silver.

    They almost owned us even when they lost 1 player to DC, but we were holding our ground fairly well.. Then 2 minutes later, by some strange coincidence, one of our teammates disappeared too, and then they lol-farmed us in 4v4.

    Edit: I actually had half a dozen matches where I got paired against / with high plat players with God of PvP / Indomitable Legend titles. And I am floating between gold 2/3. It has never been this bad during past seasons.

    Isnt it funny how these coincidences happen?

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:

    @Zexanima.7851 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    https://imgur.com/undefined

    how does the top 2 duo get paired against a team of silver/golds with no duos? 1 of the people on our team hasn't even pvped before?

    I'd say maybe the other players on their team were really low rank, but that's definitely not the case. they were better than 3/5 of our team.

    Links broken, fyi

    fixed, thank you

    @phalaris.5134 said:
    Yeah lol was in same match with you and I hands down far off to be in the same tier to be grouped against Naru & Xtrverz. As mentioned before I don't mind loosing in my own tier but this was actually fun to see 1st row.

    There was nothing balanced about this match man @[email protected] how do brand new pvpers end up against top 2 duo. I could see if we'd be sitting in queue for 5+ minutes, but it popped in 3. So at this point is it even making matches or just grabbing the first 10 regardless of their rank?

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    Lol.

    There are those that actually thinking that the population is still huge....

    Lol.

    There are those that actually think* that the matchmaker should be working instead of putting a top 2 duo on a team of golds vs a silver and 4 golds with a 3m queue. usually you ditch queue if it's been longer than 5 minutes to prevent this exact sort of game.

    How does ditching q prevent it?

    I mean the guys sitting in the long q and waiting still have the ever expanding range. If you are low and re-q, you still get scooped up by that lot.

    The game is gonna take what it has. There are not that many people who q in ranked.

    I have had to play against them too, and I am low level.

    Each game should have 10 people in it. How many people do you think are actively playing at any given time?

    I think it's over bro.

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
    Bring back Impending Dhuum.
    No FotM for me, only thief, weak or strong.

  • Zexanima.7851Zexanima.7851 Member ✭✭✭

    Players: "Look at this laundry list of issues we're facing in PvP. Any word on what's up?"
    Anet:

    Seriously though, issues like these make it really hard for me to play PvP as a competitive mode. Your rank does absolutely nothing. It doesn't represent skill, it doesn't balance matches, it has no purpose other than to make you feel like you suck if you tank.

    No longer playing the game due to PvP being abandon.

  • RisenHowl.2419RisenHowl.2419 Member ✭✭✭

    @Zexanima.7851 said:
    Players: "Look at this laundry list of issues we're facing in PvP. Any word on what's up?"
    Anet:

    Seriously though, issues like these make it really hard for me to play PvP as a competitive mode. Your rank does absolutely nothing. It doesn't represent skill, it doesn't balance matches, it has no purpose other than to make you feel like you suck if you tank.

    No point in PvP until this kind of shut gets addressed

    Good thing there's another PvP gamemode... oh wait the servers lag so badly from wvw that you can't play that either unless you want to stare at your skill bar and watch it blink at you for 30s before casting every skill

  • Zexanima.7851Zexanima.7851 Member ✭✭✭

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:

    @Zexanima.7851 said:
    Players: "Look at this laundry list of issues we're facing in PvP. Any word on what's up?"
    Anet:

    Seriously though, issues like these make it really hard for me to play PvP as a competitive mode. Your rank does absolutely nothing. It doesn't represent skill, it doesn't balance matches, it has no purpose other than to make you feel like you suck if you tank.

    No point in PvP until this kind of shut gets addressed

    Good thing there's another PvP gamemode... oh wait the servers lag so badly from wvw that you can't play that either unless you want to stare at your skill bar and watch it blink at you for 30s before casting every skill

    Another PvP mode? I think you mean PPT mode.

    No longer playing the game due to PvP being abandon.

  • Very low population means poor matchmaking or long ques. Winning games at this point feels more like a coin flip, where all that matters is how many high ranking players each side gets.

  • @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    There are those that actually think* that the matchmaker should be working instead of putting a top 2 duo on a team of golds vs a silver and 4 golds with a 3m queue. usually you ditch queue if it's been longer than 5 minutes to prevent this exact sort of game.

    There was a discussion a while back about how the matchmaker actually works. You see this behavior your witnessing has actually been going on for a very long time. What Crab Fear said is absolutely true about Que dodging...in that que dodging is a placebo.

    In the discussion i explained how the Matchmaker matches players together via a two stage system, using a server ping that occurs every 30 seconds. every ping, the server will attempt at initiating a match between a pool of players that are in the que. So lets say there are 9 people in que, the server will attempt to create the match every 30 seconds, returning back a failed marker because there aren't enough people in the que to initiate a match. Once that 10 person hops into the que, the next server ping will attempt to create the match and be successful. So you see, you could have 9 people in que waiting for 15 minutes, and the last person waiting only a few seconds for the que pop. You can imagine that maybe some of those group of 9 people "tryed to que dodge" by canceling their que and then requing it, but they still land in the same pool of potential players, no matter how many times they do this until that 10th player shows up.

    Now, aside from how the matchmaker works with regards to the server-wide ping, these matches of high level players vs. low level players was also explained. The fact is that the matchmaker is simply not good enough in determining skill level to create balanced matches. The explanation is a bit long and tedious, but it has to do with

    1) Low ranked players getting carried by higher ranked players.
    2) Balance and how the current balance of the game has shifted the skill floor.

    So you'll see silver quality players reaching into platinum ranks, and when versed against good players, they will get decimated because the differential between a bad player with a meta build and a good player with a meta build is staggeringly high.

    In addition, the matchmaker uses a number of "data points" to determine a scoring system that assigns you your teams before initiating a match-start. This includes how long you have played, whether you have dishonor, what class you are, what guild tags you have on your team, and slew of other factors.

    Anet has said that this has "no effect" on the match but looking at the pseudo code over and over again, what they are telling you is a lie... But it's unfalsifiable since they haven't given us anything. I can go on and on about the matchmaker, but it requires a more organized post, something i won't bother with again. Truth is that the game mode is dying hard, and unless anet actually make some good decisions on what to do about the problems above, nothing will change and spvp will continue to die.

  • Aeolus.3615Aeolus.3615 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    Lol.

    There are those that actually thinking that the population is still Huge.

    Pvp lacking bots... xd

  • skillze.7689skillze.7689 Member ✭✭

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    https://imgur.com/hoeDw5N

    how does the top 2 duo get paired against a team of silver/golds with no duos? 1 of the people on our team hasn't even pvped before?

    I'd say maybe the other players on their team were really low rank, but that's definitely not the case. they were better than 3/5 of our team.

    i get this quite alot, but double duo on enemies team and not one duo on my team

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:

    @Adamixos.6785 said:
    I got paired against a team of JonesBoy (currently rank 5) x Someone with the Best of the Best title (Edit 2: iirc, MLGKorno, rank 6) this morning. If I had to make an educated guess, these guys play on purpose at these hours, basically to farm noobs / lower tiers for their weekly 15 wins. I am gold, and my team was gold / silver.

    They almost owned us even when they lost 1 player to DC, but we were holding our ground fairly well.. Then 2 minutes later, by some strange coincidence, one of our teammates disappeared too, and then they lol-farmed us in 4v4.

    Edit: I actually had half a dozen matches where I got paired against / with high plat players with God of PvP / Indomitable Legend titles. And I am floating between gold 2/3. It has never been this bad during past seasons.

    Isnt it funny how these coincidences happen?

    I was about to say the same thing..
    Theres no such thing as win trading, but it just so happens that someone from your team will DC the moment you start to win against these players.
    Cant say youre a top player if you lose to golds right?

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion.
    Apologies if I come off as dry or blunt.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @sephiroth.4217 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:

    @Adamixos.6785 said:
    I got paired against a team of JonesBoy (currently rank 5) x Someone with the Best of the Best title (Edit 2: iirc, MLGKorno, rank 6) this morning. If I had to make an educated guess, these guys play on purpose at these hours, basically to farm noobs / lower tiers for their weekly 15 wins. I am gold, and my team was gold / silver.

    They almost owned us even when they lost 1 player to DC, but we were holding our ground fairly well.. Then 2 minutes later, by some strange coincidence, one of our teammates disappeared too, and then they lol-farmed us in 4v4.

    Edit: I actually had half a dozen matches where I got paired against / with high plat players with God of PvP / Indomitable Legend titles. And I am floating between gold 2/3. It has never been this bad during past seasons.

    Isnt it funny how these coincidences happen?

    I was about to say the same thing..
    Theres no such thing as win trading, but it just so happens that someone from your team will DC the moment you start to win against these players.
    Cant say youre a top player if you lose to golds right?

    top players lose to golds lol...silvers...me...bronze...

    wait or is it bought?

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
    Bring back Impending Dhuum.
    No FotM for me, only thief, weak or strong.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'm normally a plat 1-2 player and I just haven't been queueing this season until some of the Rampage Mains are hopefully culled a bit next balance patch. Spellbreaker, holo and scrapper all making up 1-3 members of every team and mostly running rampage, having to potentially deal with 3 rampages a minute is just obnoxious.

    I'm normally the type that does a ton of matches and goes up against top players and would probably serve as a buffer against them going up against gold 1s and silvers. There are probably a lot of others in this.

    The Psychomancer: Mesmer Elite Specialization Suggestion

  • Zephyra.4709Zephyra.4709 Member ✭✭✭

    I've had this happen a handful of times (either enemy or on my team) and it's my main gripe with PvP in this game. Classes being OP or a pain to fight alright w/e... just do not match me against the literal God himself of PvP when I'm barely past gold 3.

    "Nice you're gold 3 but lost your last game? How?"
    "Oh you know, just matched up against 'Best of the Best' aka tournament winner and that one guy with 'God of PvP' title"
    "Well kitten."

    All you have to do is look at the name or title and 9 times outta 10 they're high plat or, back in the day, these people had to have been leaderboard material in order to acquire some of those 'x legend' titles. I don't mind waiting 10 mins, heck 40+ mins for a game at least one would hope they're my skill level/division so we can have a decent match. These matches are whack and legit make the game's PvP player base look tiny, utterly disappointing.

  • zoopop.5630zoopop.5630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    ya this is a POPULATION BEING SO LOW THAT LEGENDARY PLAYERS CAN GET MATCH WITH GOLD!!!!

    This has been a THING for Year in NA.

  • yanniell.1236yanniell.1236 Member ✭✭✭
    edited June 25, 2019

    Oh, look. Naru abusing duoQ + off hours. Shocking.

    I wonder how long it gonna take to Anet realizes that duo queue is killing what rest of their game mode.

  • RisenHowl.2419RisenHowl.2419 Member ✭✭✭

    @NotoriousNaru.1705 said:

    @yanniell.1236 said:
    Oh, look. Naru abusing duoQ + off hours. Shocking.

    I wonder how long it gonna take to Anet realizes that duo queue is killing what rest of their game mode.

    Yikes homie. If you think I am voluntarily putting myself in games like this you are mistaken. The game OP is referring to I got a +2, and had we lost a -40. Those are also the games we are most susceptible to lose because to average out team rating we have to get low golds/silvers vs golds/plats because of our combined rating. No matter what time we Q we always get 6-8min queues and games like this. It has happened during NA prime, early na, and late na(prime PST for me). Also there is no such thing as 'abusing duo q" how bitter do you have to be to think someone using a feature is abusing it just because they are winning. Ideally we'd like to be in all plat/legend games, those are more fun and less punishing because when you gain +10 and lose -20(carrying 3 plats vs plats/legends is easier than carrying silvers who dont press buttons vs plats/golds) it feels alot better than when you lose -30+ and only gain 2-5. Alot of misinformation just wanted to clarify.

    That's not the kitten up part =/

    You got 2 top players + 3 mid golds vs 2 gold 3, 2 gold 2, and a silver 2. Our silver camped the treb for the first 3m of the fight, then ran in and fed you two for the remaining couple minutes.

    The match maker straight up failed

  • saerni.2584saerni.2584 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 25, 2019

    How I’d do match making:

    1. Lock professions on queue
    2. Anet makes pre-set ideal team comps based on role, with 1/5 of the team open to any role, with the goal of creating mirror comps by role
    3. Have players select a role for their build when they queue
    4. Use MMR to create somewhat balanced matches within the above.

    A team with no damage won’t win. A team with no support against a team with support (played effectively) will generally lose. Balance by composition and then worry about MMR.

    Northern Shiverpeaks (NSP)
    Deadeye (Thief)
    Commandant of P/D and Apex Predator

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @saerni.2584 said:
    3. Have players select a role for their build when they queue

    That's the single best idea for match making that I've heard in a very long time.

    That way it could prioritize putting together: Support/Team Fight/Decap Plus/Side Noder styled comps.

    Not sure how this would realistically effect que times, but it would greatly enhance the quality of matches concerning team comp vs. team comp balance.

  • saerni.2584saerni.2584 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I will say, you can always balance things yourself if you allow five man queues.

    But we don’t live in that world and the matchmaker simply doesn’t have enough information to be able to distinguish between a support guard and a burst DPS guard. Or a boonbeast vs bunker Druid vs sic em Ranger.

    Anet can’t generate the data but players can (even if some will lie, some will be wrong, and some won’t know how to play their build).

    I’d make everyone select the type every time they queue to prevent “oops I forgot I swapped to X.”

    Northern Shiverpeaks (NSP)
    Deadeye (Thief)
    Commandant of P/D and Apex Predator

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    What if they made an option to restrict yourself to games within smaller thresholds?

    Like an option that tells you it will be a longer wait, but possibly a higher quality match.

    I would like to think that anyone choosing longer waits actually intends on trying hard.

    Since it would be optional, the shard farmers could q at will.

    No more dynamic duo blowing you up.

    The thing is, I don't want to play with high level players.

    Not 400-600 points away from me.

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
    Bring back Impending Dhuum.
    No FotM for me, only thief, weak or strong.

  • In my hubris, I thought that matchmaker used rank, so I intentionally didn't try hard during placement. Just had a 5-loss streak, some where I was top stats, others where I was distracting 2 of the other team mates on a ledge for a SUPER long time and my team couldn't even regain map control outnumbering everyone. Geez.

  • Firebeard.1746Firebeard.1746 Member ✭✭
    edited June 25, 2019

    This is so broken I'm very close to throwing in the towel. The irony being I liked PVP when I first played GW2. It feels so dead now. Even the nonranked queue feels like it has issues. If I can't raid and enjoy it with my chaotic schedule, I'm done with this game.

  • Vieux P.1238Vieux P.1238 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Hahaha ha ah i laugh at you all. You thought making this game casual playing & pve friendly would keep players playing... You werrr wrong! Now i laugh at you all.. mouhahaha caugh.. This game needs to get dirty...

    Winter Nerf is coming!

  • Reikou.7068Reikou.7068 Member ✭✭
    edited June 26, 2019

    said it before, said it again, there needs to be limits on matchmaking.

    Players should only ever be grouped with/against players that are within 100 mmr of themselves.

    Also remove duo queue.

    Only fair way to do this.

  • crepuscular.9047crepuscular.9047 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 26, 2019

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    https://imgur.com/hoeDw5N

    how does the top 2 duo get paired against a team of silver/golds with no duos? 1 of the people on our team hasn't even pvped before?

    I'd say maybe the other players on their team were really low rank, but that's definitely not the case. they were better than 3/5 of our team.

    Hence i all for removing duo queue from ranked, it's breaking the matching algorithm; they could have been playing against each with if they can only solo queue, making the match more balanced

    if they want to play together, go AT or unranked

    [RIP Fashion Wars 2005-2018]     [TTS] [KA] [SI]     [RIP Fashion Wars 2005-2018]
    Praise the Inevitable Eternal Transcendent King Palawa Ignacious Joko, the Beloved and Feared Undying Eternal Monarch of All !!!
    ... til Aurene ate him for dessert 😭
  • @NotoriousNaru.1705 said:
    Yikes homie. If you think I am voluntarily putting myself in games like this you are mistaken. The game OP is referring to I got a +2, and had we lost a -40. Those are also the games we are most susceptible to lose because to average out team rating we have to get low golds/silvers vs golds/plats because of our combined rating.

    If you want to make yourself seem more innocent, and lose less + win more at the same time; then maybe you should queue with someone actually close to your rating and not a friend who tanked their own rating on alt specifically to put you in those games you claim you don't want to be in.

    Not that this is always the case, but a lot of the time that happens. If you're seeing +2/-40 then it's very likely you're doing it.

    @NotoriousNaru.1705 said:
    Also there is no such thing as 'abusing duo q" how bitter do you have to be to think someone using a feature is abusing it just because they are winning.

    Therein lies one of many ways to abuse DuoQ, which is definitely doable.

    In Season 13, when DuoQ came out; the entire leaderboard and everyone's rank was inflated and essentially ruined because a DuoQ partner could leave a game and the rest of their team wouldn't lose anything for the impending loss on top of there being no cap on how far apart two ranks can queue together. The latter problem still persists, and the average winrate and ranking of the people who buy the top titles every season has skyrocketed to upwards of 90% because merged queues make it even easier to wintrade than it would be without. Not abusable btw.

    Also probably what went wrong with the matchmaker in that game, to answer OP.

    Remove Ranked DuoQ pls&ty

  • @Vieux P.1238 said:
    Hahaha ha ah i laugh at you all. You thought making this game casual playing & pve friendly would keep players playing... You werrr wrong! Now i laugh at you all.. mouhahaha caugh.. This game needs to get dirty...

    Except it's getting completely ruined by the people who don't play it casually (and a failed matchmaking system). The game mode would be DEAD in an instant if they got rid of any rewards for losers.

  • NotoriousNaru.1705NotoriousNaru.1705 Member ✭✭✭
    edited June 26, 2019

    @Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

    @NotoriousNaru.1705 said:
    Yikes homie. If you think I am voluntarily putting myself in games like this you are mistaken. The game OP is referring to I got a +2, and had we lost a -40. Those are also the games we are most susceptible to lose because to average out team rating we have to get low golds/silvers vs golds/plats because of our combined rating.

    If you want to make yourself seem more innocent, and lose less + win more at the same time; then maybe you should queue with someone actually close to your rating and not a friend who tanked their own rating on alt specifically to put you in those games you claim you don't want to be in.

    Not that this is always the case, but a lot of the time that happens. If you're seeing +2/-40 then it's very likely you're doing it.

    @NotoriousNaru.1705 said:
    Also there is no such thing as 'abusing duo q" how bitter do you have to be to think someone using a feature is abusing it just because they are winning.

    Therein lies one of many ways to abuse DuoQ, which is definitely doable.

    In Season 13, when DuoQ came out; the entire leaderboard and everyone's rank was inflated and essentially ruined because a DuoQ partner could leave a game and the rest of their team wouldn't lose anything for the impending loss on top of there being no cap on how far apart two ranks can queue together. The latter problem still persists, and the average winrate and ranking of the people who buy the top titles every season has skyrocketed to upwards of 90% because merged queues make it even easier to wintrade than it would be without. Not abusable btw.

    Also probably what went wrong with the matchmaker in that game, to answer OP.

    Dawg idfk who u are but heres some advice, actually know what you're talking about before you spout nonsense. EVERY.SINGLE.GAME i have played was duo'd with someone who is higher rated than me so save me that bs. You are literally the epitome of every forum pleb with 0 information acting like they know anything, you dont.

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/494041688327847936/593334871129194505/unknown.png

    We have been qing duo as r1 and r2 the entire season. He has more games played than me qing with other people so where is this qing with low alts to get easier games bs? I legit just explained to you why high rated players in low rated games = NOT WORTH but you're too dense to even understand basic concepts. Anyone that has run into us this ranked season knows we were both on our mains. This is the last time im posting here to clarify misinformation because clearly no matter how much I explain it some people just lack common sense but keep yelling wintrade and cry because some people are just better than you.

    Edit: because both of us are qing on our mains and not using low alts to tank rating here is how our qs go, and it is exactly why we get put into games we shouldnt be in.
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/478002000076996622/593175266663202847/Screenshot_271_LI.jpg

    and before you cry about offhour qing, look at the time.

  • Les.4872Les.4872 Member ✭✭✭

    I blame anet. This kitten isn't fun for any1, both low and high rated players alike. I think for the sake of your mental health just forget about the game and move on to the next. You barely lose any rating for these types of games anyways.

    Merciless Idiot

  • @NotoriousNaru.1705 said:
    Dawg idfk who u are but heres some advice, actually know what you're talking about before you spout nonsense. EVERY.SINGLE.GAME i have played was duo'd with someone who is higher rated than me so save me that bs. You are literally the epitome of every forum pleb with 0 information acting like they know anything, you dont.

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/494041688327847936/593334871129194505/unknown.png

    We have been qing duo as r1 and r2 the entire season. He has more games played than me qing with other people so where is this qing with low alts to get easier games bs? I legit just explained to you why high rated players in low rated games = NOT WORTH but you're too dense to even understand basic concepts. Anyone that has run into us this ranked season knows we were both on our mains. This is the last time im posting here to clarify misinformation because clearly no matter how much I explain it some people just lack common sense but keep yelling wintrade and cry because some people are just better than you.

    Edit: because both of us are qing on our mains and not using low alts to tank rating here is how our qs go, and it is exactly why we get put into games we shouldnt be in.
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/478002000076996622/593175266663202847/Screenshot_271_LI.jpg

    and before you cry about offhour qing, look at the time.

    All i'm saying is it's a thing people do. Not directly accusing you or anything, but you did try and say that DuoQ isn't exploitable at all, when the reality is; it is being and has been exploited season after season since it was reimplemented.

    Now I may be a misinformed nobody(As that seems to be the go-to insult for top rated players to dealing with any sort of criticism) but I understand at least that the top spots are really volatile, and the formula for determining rank gain screws you, but not to the extent of +2/-40. That isn't even close to normal for that rating. As a content creator that's been in that top spot consistently, I don't see how you can expect people to believe it is.

    Like I say, not accusing anyone of anything. I recognized your mains from the OPs screenshot even. You had just said that DuoQ isn't exploitable even thought it is, and you also gave what is either a pretty gross exaggeration of rank gain compared to rank lost, or; like I say, it could be DuoQing with a smurf because that would do it.

    And it is absolutely practical to do that. If you are satisfied with whatever spot you have on the LB, that would be an easy way to keep your spot and keep up with decay and/or the minimum games LB requirement.

    And that is an argument against DuoQ, not you specifically.

    Remove Ranked DuoQ pls&ty

  • Bazooka.3590Bazooka.3590 Member ✭✭✭

    MM should go to trash. Needs total rework but Anet doesn't give a kitten since the beginning of the game.

  • RisenHowl.2419RisenHowl.2419 Member ✭✭✭

    @Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

    @NotoriousNaru.1705 said:
    Dawg idfk who u are but heres some advice, actually know what you're talking about before you spout nonsense. EVERY.SINGLE.GAME i have played was duo'd with someone who is higher rated than me so save me that bs. You are literally the epitome of every forum pleb with 0 information acting like they know anything, you dont.

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/494041688327847936/593334871129194505/unknown.png

    We have been qing duo as r1 and r2 the entire season. He has more games played than me qing with other people so where is this qing with low alts to get easier games bs? I legit just explained to you why high rated players in low rated games = NOT WORTH but you're too dense to even understand basic concepts. Anyone that has run into us this ranked season knows we were both on our mains. This is the last time im posting here to clarify misinformation because clearly no matter how much I explain it some people just lack common sense but keep yelling wintrade and cry because some people are just better than you.

    Edit: because both of us are qing on our mains and not using low alts to tank rating here is how our qs go, and it is exactly why we get put into games we shouldnt be in.
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/478002000076996622/593175266663202847/Screenshot_271_LI.jpg

    and before you cry about offhour qing, look at the time.

    All i'm saying is it's a thing people do. Not directly accusing you or anything, but you did try and say that DuoQ isn't exploitable at all, when the reality is; it is being and has been exploited season after season since it was reimplemented.

    Now I may be a misinformed nobody(As that seems to be the go-to insult for top rated players to dealing with any sort of criticism) but I understand at least that the top spots are really volatile, and the formula for determining rank gain screws you, but not to the extent of +2/-40. That isn't even close to normal for that rating. As a content creator that's been in that top spot consistently, I don't see how you can expect people to believe it is.

    Like I say, not accusing anyone of anything. I recognized your mains from the OPs screenshot even. You had just said that DuoQ isn't exploitable even thought it is, and you also gave what is either a pretty gross exaggeration of rank gain compared to rank lost, or; like I say, it could be DuoQing with a smurf because that would do it.

    And it is absolutely practical to do that. If you are satisfied with whatever spot you have on the LB, that would be an easy way to keep your spot and keep up with decay and/or the minimum games LB requirement.

    And that is an argument against DuoQ, not you specifically.

    Pretty sure John from my team was the smurf. Trebbed for 3m, then ran directly to naru to feed on respawn.

    Maybe @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 can clear up how the matchmaker decided this was an even game?

  • Ryan.9387Ryan.9387 Member ✭✭✭
    edited June 26, 2019

    @Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

    @NotoriousNaru.1705 said:
    Dawg idfk who u are but heres some advice, actually know what you're talking about before you spout nonsense. EVERY.SINGLE.GAME i have played was duo'd with someone who is higher rated than me so save me that bs. You are literally the epitome of every forum pleb with 0 information acting like they know anything, you dont.

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/494041688327847936/593334871129194505/unknown.png

    We have been qing duo as r1 and r2 the entire season. He has more games played than me qing with other people so where is this qing with low alts to get easier games bs? I legit just explained to you why high rated players in low rated games = NOT WORTH but you're too dense to even understand basic concepts. Anyone that has run into us this ranked season knows we were both on our mains. This is the last time im posting here to clarify misinformation because clearly no matter how much I explain it some people just lack common sense but keep yelling wintrade and cry because some people are just better than you.

    Edit: because both of us are qing on our mains and not using low alts to tank rating here is how our qs go, and it is exactly why we get put into games we shouldnt be in.
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/478002000076996622/593175266663202847/Screenshot_271_LI.jpg

    and before you cry about offhour qing, look at the time.


    or; like I say, it could be DuoQing with a smurf because that would do it.

    Funny enough the individual you are talking to has been previously dishonored for exactly this.

  • I'm glad this is being looked at.

    [Charr Noises]
    [Plays every class]
    [JUST GIT EVEN GUDDER ITS FINE]

  • RisenHowl.2419RisenHowl.2419 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:

    @Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

    @NotoriousNaru.1705 said:
    Dawg idfk who u are but heres some advice, actually know what you're talking about before you spout nonsense. EVERY.SINGLE.GAME i have played was duo'd with someone who is higher rated than me so save me that bs. You are literally the epitome of every forum pleb with 0 information acting like they know anything, you dont.

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/494041688327847936/593334871129194505/unknown.png

    We have been qing duo as r1 and r2 the entire season. He has more games played than me qing with other people so where is this qing with low alts to get easier games bs? I legit just explained to you why high rated players in low rated games = NOT WORTH but you're too dense to even understand basic concepts. Anyone that has run into us this ranked season knows we were both on our mains. This is the last time im posting here to clarify misinformation because clearly no matter how much I explain it some people just lack common sense but keep yelling wintrade and cry because some people are just better than you.

    Edit: because both of us are qing on our mains and not using low alts to tank rating here is how our qs go, and it is exactly why we get put into games we shouldnt be in.
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/478002000076996622/593175266663202847/Screenshot_271_LI.jpg

    and before you cry about offhour qing, look at the time.

    All i'm saying is it's a thing people do. Not directly accusing you or anything, but you did try and say that DuoQ isn't exploitable at all, when the reality is; it is being and has been exploited season after season since it was reimplemented.

    Now I may be a misinformed nobody(As that seems to be the go-to insult for top rated players to dealing with any sort of criticism) but I understand at least that the top spots are really volatile, and the formula for determining rank gain screws you, but not to the extent of +2/-40. That isn't even close to normal for that rating. As a content creator that's been in that top spot consistently, I don't see how you can expect people to believe it is.

    Like I say, not accusing anyone of anything. I recognized your mains from the OPs screenshot even. You had just said that DuoQ isn't exploitable even thought it is, and you also gave what is either a pretty gross exaggeration of rank gain compared to rank lost, or; like I say, it could be DuoQing with a smurf because that would do it.

    And it is absolutely practical to do that. If you are satisfied with whatever spot you have on the LB, that would be an easy way to keep your spot and keep up with decay and/or the minimum games LB requirement.

    And that is an argument against DuoQ, not you specifically.

    Pretty sure John from my team was the smurf. Trebbed for 3m, then ran directly to naru to feed on respawn.

    Maybe @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 can clear up how the matchmaker decided this was an even game?

    I could try to look up the match. I'd need the display name of one person in the match, the approximate date/time of the match and to make it easier, the final score.

    Thank you for the response!

    • Egorum.9506
    • 6/24/19 @ 0918 PST
    • Red: 501 Blue: 61
  • OutOfOrder.3719OutOfOrder.3719 Member ✭✭✭
    edited June 27, 2019

    Searching with friends on alternate duo’s with artificially tanked ratings, so that they end up on the abusing team is absolutely possible.

    For example, two top players play on their primary accounts, but have their friends search as Duo on alt accounts every time they search .

    If the team of artificially lower ranked accounts end up on the top team, they obviously play to win.

    If the artificially tanked team ends up as the enemy, they carefully lose the match so it’s not obvious. In the worst scenarios, they intentionally disconnect.

    Harder to investigate but entirely possible with the duo que system.

    Then there is an another Smurphing scenario when top ranked players choose to play on alternate accounts to knock out other Platinium players from the leaderboard down. Although this is not technically abuse, it is extremely unfair as an average plat 1 player will be matched up versus a top 25 player that is severely under rated. The answer to this problem is that all of a player’s account should be linked, so that MMR algorithm will follow and track players each season as they jump between accounts. Again, this would take some effort on ANET’s part to link the majority accounts that play from the same IP address together.

    When I used to play Warcraft 3, players that abused that system would intentionally lose 100 games and then que with their friend in Ranked matches to climb and obtain a top 10 spot on the leaderboard. No system is perfect, and all systems are exploitiable with effort.

  • Marxx.5021Marxx.5021 Member ✭✭✭

    So in other words to satisfy very few high rated duos you lower the match quality for many more player. This focus on a small group of players hurts the game mode.

  • Eddbopkins.2630Eddbopkins.2630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    Re: the matchmaker not keeping high rated players in queue longer: The reward for getting better at the game can't be, "You don't get to play anymore."
    Re: Duo queue - We thought about this for a long time. In the end, we decided it's just not fun to not be able to play with your friends. Additionally, removing a feature is a poor reward for getting better at the game. It also motivated all sorts of bad behavior, which I won't go into.

    The 2 people in legendary shouldn't beable to que together. What ever game they go into will be skewed in their favor 100%of the time. They should be pitted against each other to give each team equal competitive fairness. Im only a g3 player at best 350+points away from the 1st and 2nd NA players. And yet i have had a few games against them. But still it was a total waist of my time participating in that game.

  • Hesacon.8735Hesacon.8735 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Eddbopkins.2630 said:

    @Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:
    Re: the matchmaker not keeping high rated players in queue longer: The reward for getting better at the game can't be, "You don't get to play anymore."
    Re: Duo queue - We thought about this for a long time. In the end, we decided it's just not fun to not be able to play with your friends. Additionally, removing a feature is a poor reward for getting better at the game. It also motivated all sorts of bad behavior, which I won't go into.

    The 2 people in legendary shouldn't beable to que together. What ever game they go into will be skewed in their favor 100%of the time. They should be pitted against each other to give each team equal competitive fairness. Im only a g3 player at best 350+points away from the 1st and 2nd NA players. And yet i have had a few games against them. But still it was a total waist of my time participating in that game.

    Yeah, it was my understanding there was a ceiling above which you could only solo queue, somewhere in the mid platinum region.

    I've been on both sides of the multi-hundred point wins and it certainly sucks the fun out. Looking at my last 10 matches (several of which I was teamed with afk players), I see 3 matches with a >250 point spread and 1 of those had nearly 400 points. I was on the winning side of 2 of those matches, but that still doesn't make them enjoyable.

    The ~400 point game I lost and I lost a ton of rating despite not having any control over the match.

    I guess my question is does the report button for idle or griefing players actually accomplish anything? Part of the reason I haven't played an spvp match in over a month is losing most of an entire rank (because of how the soft reset "placement" matches work) when I get teamed with people who have no intention to play.

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