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UX - Legendary Runes - This needs to go back to the drawing board


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d395cLegendary-Upgrades.png

Looking at the UI for the legendary runes and how to pick them, they need to seriously overhaul this before it gets released. The UX for this is going to be absolutely terrible if you have to scroll through all of the options. Why not utilize the PvP design where you break it down by category and can actually search for the rune/stat?

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The UI is probably like this because apparently changing anything UI related in this game's engine takes a LOT of work, it's one of the (many) reasons why Swiss style tournaments and WvW restructuring is taking so long.

Think of trying to change this game's UI like trying to pick a single strand of spaghettini out of a mountain of regular spaghetti. Yeah.

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@Nomad.4301 said:The UI is probably like this because apparently changing anything UI related in this game's engine takes a LOT of work, it's one of the (many) reasons why Swiss style tournaments and WvW restructuring is taking so long.

Think of trying to change this game's UI like trying to pick a single strand of spaghettini out of a mountain of regular spaghetti. Yeah.

That excuse is incredibly tired.

This is a terrible design. Scrolling through dozens of runes like this is ridiculous. A search text field or the simple ability to select your tube line in PvP would be far better.

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@Pifil.5193 said:

@"Nomad.4301" said:The UI is probably like this because apparently changing anything UI related in this game's engine takes a LOT of work, it's one of the (many) reasons why Swiss style tournaments and WvW restructuring is taking so long.

Think of trying to change this game's UI like trying to pick a single strand of
spaghettini
out of a mountain of regular spaghetti. Yeah.

That excuse is incredibly tired.

Not trying to defend Anet here; the UI is awful, but it's Anet's own excuse as they've literally said in the past that UI changes take a lot of time and effort to pull off, even the seemingly simple ones like adding 1 new skill to the Warclaw that's taken them 3+months at this point because they're waiting on "UI changes".

It's pretty common knowledge at this point that the Gw2 engine is likely one of the oldest and most poorly optimized engines still actively used in the industry (Bethesda might have them beat) and a big limitation on what they can actually do in the game specifically regarding the UI depends directly on the engine and how hard it is to change the code they wrote over 7 years ago (longer if you consider this is a modified Gw1 engine). So something as simple as adding a search bar could potentially take some poor dude 250 hours to do because they had to literally re-write half of their 7 year old back-end legacy code to do it.

Yes it is terrible design, but all I'm saying is it might not be terrible by choice.

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@Nomad.4301 said:

@Nomad.4301 said:The UI is probably like this because apparently changing anything UI related in this game's engine takes a LOT of work, it's one of the (many) reasons why Swiss style tournaments and WvW restructuring is taking so long.

Think of trying to change this game's UI like trying to pick a single strand of
spaghettini
out of a mountain of regular spaghetti. Yeah.

That excuse is incredibly tired.

Not trying to defend Anet here; the UI
is
awful, but it's Anet's own excuse as they've literally said in the past that UI changes take a lot of time and effort to pull off, even the seemingly simple ones like adding 1 new skill to the Warclaw that's taken them 3+months at this point because they're waiting on "UI changes".

It's pretty common knowledge at this point that the Gw2 engine is likely one of the oldest and most poorly optimized engines still actively used in the industry (Bethesda
might
have them beat) and a big limitation on what they can actually do in the game specifically regarding the UI depends directly on the engine and how hard it is to change the code they wrote over 7 years ago (longer if you consider this is a modified Gw1 engine). So something as simple as adding a search bar could potentially take some poor dude 250 hours to do because they had to literally re-write half of their 7 year old back-end legacy code to do it.

Yes it is terrible design, but all I'm saying is it
might
not be terrible by choice.

Oh that's fine and I hope you don't feel like I'm having a go at you over this but I'm a principal software engineer (with over 20 years experience) and I've heard that particular kind of excuse a lot in my career (often from people who aren't software engineers themselves) and I frankly don't buy it.

If the code is still that bad then it is effectively by choice: they haven't put the resources into improving it.

If it will take 3 months to get the UI work done for a relatively minor change to the Warclaw skills then that sounds like they simply have a resource bottleneck where the designers are waiting for an engineers time. The people they need to do the work are either tied up doing other things or they've created a little "kingdom" for themselves where they hoard the knowledge needed or (maybe more likely given the recent history) the people with the expertise have left the company. Or some combination of the three.

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@Nomad.4301 said:

@Nomad.4301 said:The UI is probably like this because apparently changing anything UI related in this game's engine takes a LOT of work, it's one of the (many) reasons why Swiss style tournaments and WvW restructuring is taking so long.

Think of trying to change this game's UI like trying to pick a single strand of
spaghettini
out of a mountain of regular spaghetti. Yeah.

That excuse is incredibly tired.

Not trying to defend Anet here; the UI
is
awful, but it's Anet's own excuse as they've literally said in the past that UI changes take a lot of time and effort to pull off, even the seemingly simple ones like adding 1 new skill to the Warclaw that's taken them 3+months at this point because they're waiting on "UI changes".

It's pretty common knowledge at this point that the Gw2 engine is likely one of the oldest and most poorly optimized engines still actively used in the industry (Bethesda
might
have them beat) and a big limitation on what they can actually do in the game specifically regarding the UI depends directly on the engine and how hard it is to change the code they wrote over 7 years ago (longer if you consider this is a modified Gw1 engine). So something as simple as adding a search bar could potentially take some poor dude 250 hours to do because they had to literally re-write half of their 7 year old back-end legacy code to do it.

Yes it is terrible design, but all I'm saying is it
might
not be terrible by choice.

I don't buy that at all. There are clearly components IN THE GAME for this.

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@lukejoe.1592 said:

@Nomad.4301 said:The UI is probably like this because apparently changing anything UI related in this game's engine takes a LOT of work, it's one of the (many) reasons why Swiss style tournaments and WvW restructuring is taking so long.

Think of trying to change this game's UI like trying to pick a single strand of
spaghettini
out of a mountain of regular spaghetti. Yeah.

That excuse is incredibly tired.

Not trying to defend Anet here; the UI
is
awful, but it's Anet's own excuse as they've literally said in the past that UI changes take a lot of time and effort to pull off, even the seemingly simple ones like adding 1 new skill to the Warclaw that's taken them 3+months at this point because they're waiting on "UI changes".

It's pretty common knowledge at this point that the Gw2 engine is likely one of the oldest and most poorly optimized engines still actively used in the industry (Bethesda
might
have them beat) and a big limitation on what they can actually do in the game specifically regarding the UI depends directly on the engine and how hard it is to change the code they wrote over 7 years ago (longer if you consider this is a modified Gw1 engine). So something as simple as adding a search bar could potentially take some poor dude 250 hours to do because they had to literally re-write half of their 7 year old back-end legacy code to do it.

Yes it is terrible design, but all I'm saying is it
might
not be terrible by choice.

I don't buy that at all. There are clearly components IN THE GAME for this.

Coherent UI, but that thing doesn't work well in some circumstances

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@"Vavume.8065" said:Thankfully this won't effect me, I see zero reason to make a legendary rune, absolute waste of gold.

Same, feature wise I find it pointless(?) :open_mouth:. Runes price are slowly getting lower with a steady inflow if symbols(materials unified). Introducing a swappable rune now will only plunge the price. Don't know the materials needed to craft the legendary yet but will it be worth the value and trouble to replace them with "dirt cheap" runes, with no effects? This plus legendary armor allow players to swap runes freely.

For the Ui, not sure if its possible or better to have it work like the wiki? Eg. By choosing the primary stat will filter the possible combinations etc. Pro; will help to filter/streamline the choices, Cons; imagine swapping 6 runes everytime :confounded: time consuming.

Not a programmer, but from my understanding....runes are not stats. Names are given to to specific stats combination. While runes have names, stats and sets. It should be possible to make the Ui for it but will it create a complex spaghetti code? (Genuine question out of curiosity).

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They really should have a test environment where they can test this on a public test realm perhaps and get player feedback that way, it's hard to go over this via a screenshot. I know it's something that will require money to run which is likely why it doesn't but I think it would be a good investment for them as well as players in the long run.

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@Nomad.4301 said:

@Nomad.4301 said:The UI is probably like this because apparently changing anything UI related in this game's engine takes a LOT of work, it's one of the (many) reasons why Swiss style tournaments and WvW restructuring is taking so long.

Think of trying to change this game's UI like trying to pick a single strand of
spaghettini
out of a mountain of regular spaghetti. Yeah.

That excuse is incredibly tired.

Not trying to defend Anet here; the UI
is
awful, but it's Anet's own excuse as they've literally said in the past that UI changes take a lot of time and effort to pull off, even the seemingly simple ones like adding 1 new skill to the Warclaw that's taken them 3+months at this point because they're waiting on "UI changes".

Then it begs the question, if everyone knows that ui is a kitten for them to work and making changes to it is hard then why didnt we ever get any more information on this during the 5 or so months sonce its innitial reveal?

Like a simple "hey this is some early drafts we have internally, nothing final yet amd not really any real work on ui has been made but we wanted to ask what would you like to see added or changed".

Would that really be that extreme to ask for a feature WE KNOW they are working on and intent to release at some point? I can understand the ui being a kitten to change but this is a self caused problem anet yet again has created by not communicating or asking for feedback. They have no excuse.

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