Daniel Handler.4816

Yall are so disappointing.

Not tried to, did discredit. If your rebuttal is to say "mantras" is a plural word so "mantras are useless" must refer to using 2+ at the same time then this entire thread is stupid and I don't want to participate anymore. There are a plethora of builds that use a single mantra and it is not the same mantra for each build. Mantras, the skill types, are not useless. No. You just want to use two or more. Stop doing that and the current version is better than the previous one.

You are moving the goal posts. I never advocated running two mantras. Nor do I recommend it. And as such I also don't need to make any videos either because there are already an abundance of videos with people using one mantra. Ex watch the first minute. Edit: at 15:13 is a good example of the strengths of the current version of mantras. He is able to get off an interrupt he never would have had access to before because the charges wouldn't have refreshed in time.

Okay but be realistic. They are going to do that. And then wait two years to do this. And even if they do this, it is going to be a reduction in our current speed. I think a lot of people like having 3 in the bank. Mirage isn't supposed to just be purple vindicator. If you've ever tested https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Nomad's_Advance you'll find (at least in my experience) . Leap, wait 3 seconds, leap isn't nearly as fun as leap+leap+leap+leap+leap. A ~5 delay in WvW would be even worse. edit: But I could be biased to my own experience. I wouldn't play mirage without sword.

It's not at odds with itself it's at odds with the other statement Katte made. They said you can't run away or chase down roamers. You can, as you are saying now, you just can't kill them. And my concern is that once you reintroduce that lethality, they will take away our mobility. Even right now you are suggesting they strip the class of speed. Remove the trait interaction that gives us so many ambushes. But you arent proposing an alternative. People say things like make jaunt 3 and fix mirage ambush so it doesn't range check and you can use it as a pseudo blink. But it isn't going to be 20 sword ambushes, and they won't add enough endurance to deception traits that will stop you being chased down by daredevils and willbenders.

Yeah. You're also right. But arguing over what is and is not a one shot isn't really helpful either.

Except @Mell.4873 is correct. There are one shot builds. It's just relatively unlikely you will one shot a good player unless you are exceptionally good. Harping on him for being wrong on the term derails the conversation.

These two comments are fundamentally at odds with each other. And raises a bigger problem, at least for me. 20 sword ambushes a minute means you CAN chase anyone down, and you CAN run away from them. And it is the most fun part of the spec. Even if it can't 1v1 a daredevil. Is there a world where Anet buffs mirage so it can duel the celestial builds you described. But also keeps it as fast as before?

I started playing this game as a child. And Fay/Pyro were older then. It has been 10 years. 🧓 Maybe they have kids.

Hey Mell. The thing is, the people in sPvP want it to be more than fine because other professions are more than fine. They want to win and climb the competitive ladder. There are absolutely one shot builds. But for the vast majority of Mesmer players, myself included, it only works against bad players. There are very very few people who can execute these combos against a good player. Not just because it requires excellent muscle memory, but also because any amount of network latency is going to screw you over. That being said. Because there are people who have the skill and internet speed to do these combos successfully Anet will often balance top down. They might be more flexible about this thinking in the future though. It is very similar to the discussion on not balancing around benchmarks, and they seemed to understand we shouldn't be punished in PvE because people on Snow Crows are min-maxing against golems. But they might be too nervous to make changes in PvP.

Dude. You literally made a post complaining about your experience. If you are having a great time why does this thread even exist? And I don't know what you expect to change about that at this point. Please let me know how Anet can balance skills based upon Jitters not using his entire kit. You don't use escape abilities on scrapper? Well many do, so those skills are going to be balanced for that potential. Mantra skills can be recharged. They are going to only have two charges to compensate. And Anet will expect you to learn how to charge them. Or deal with only having 1. I agree with the first sentence. As for the rest, I gave my opinion. You gave yours. And your opinion was that the skill is useless in wvw. For me that is demonstrably false both in zerging and in roaming. I understand it has impacted your experience. What you don't understand is that it has improved other's experience as well. People who can find the time to recharge these skills greatly benefit from the reduced cooldown. And anet is going to balance the game around the majority. Also there is nothing wrong with a new player using a site like snowcrows.com metabattle.com etc to learn what a proper build looks like. The only problem is when they just accept them as gospel. People should be constantly exploring the class.

I agree somewhat. My advice definitely should not and cannot apply to every circumstance. In this case, it feels like the mantra is overkill. With access to sigils of cleaning, menders purity, restorative illusions, and blurred inscriptions you already have a boatload of cleanse that cannot be stopped. And there are many roaming power builds that do not require conditions at all to kill you. Arcane thievery gives quickness and removes boons.

Yes and you have two charges of power cleanse + the recharge effect of mantra of resolve. My math is very slightly off because there is a 1 second cooldown between charges. Comparing a skill to one part of a chain skill is naive at best, intentionally dishonest at worst.

Shake it off removes 4 conditions on a 30 second cooldown. .1333 per second Mantra of resolve removes all/3 +3 + 3 on a ~10.25 to 14.5 second loop. ~.87+ per second. Why are you at all surprised that a skill four to six times as potent also has a longer cast time?

This is the most accurate summary of current events. If I could pin a comment in this thread it would be this one.

THANK YOU. I want mantras to stay as they are now. So what you want is also more important than what I want. Nothing I have said is based upon zerging beyond when I have specifically talked about zerging. But solo roaming is also group play, you randomly dying affects the score. I have also solo roamed quite extensively. I also didn't say need. Your question was " Why would you tell people not to play what they find the most fun and what you think they should play?" You can tell people many things. They don't have to listen. I can voice my opinion as I am doing right now. You are fully welcome to continue playing whatever random builds you play and having a less than stellar experience because Anet cannot and will not cater to the minority . I will continue to advise people because I enjoy winning and I think other people do too. I maintain that 4 mantras is insane and you are better off playing Tempest, deal with it.

Because WvW is also a competitive game mode based on group play. I want to win.

There aren't. And you aren't saving skills to charge mantras. You are already stealthing, repositioning, ccing, shattering etc. Builds that need to use mantras have the time to charge them. If am on an interrupt build and I need to get distraction back up. What does it cost me to use diversion to interrupt them interrupting my cast. What do I lose?

Can't speak to firebrand. Their mantras work in reverse, they have different playstyles, and different access to stab. But if you are running Mesmer mantras for healing then you are running inspiration, which means Resolve is heavily outclassed by traited Signet of Midnight, free expertise with an active that is 1 second invuln + 1 second stealth + stun break + aoe blind + removes 5 conditions. And can even convert 2 additional conditions to boons if need be (though inspiration + chaos is excessive when you also have restorative illusions and mender's purity for cleanse). Recovery+midnight+blink should be sufficient for most things. Any addition problems with condi's would be solved better with arcane thievery or even mimicking the signet. edit: I also did not confuse face your post. I think someone else did because you posted it twice. Not because the content was weird.

I mean if you are running a 4 mantra "healing" build you should probably conform and stop with that nonsense. Or play Tempest instead. But no. Roaming specs absolutely can use mantras as well. https://metabattle.com/wiki/Mesmer read the wvw roaming builds on this site. Then please explore it more on your own, as those builds are not one size fits all solutions.

I don't want to make too many generalizations. But most builds that need to use mantras, only use one and it is integral to the build. Mantra of Distraction with interrupt builds. Mantra of Concentration with utility builds (that are in a group lacking stab, and not running veils) Mantra of Pain with one shot builds Only the first two need to be regular recharged in combat (one shot builds should be out of combat because the target is dead, or you are temporarily retreating because you blew all your cooldowns). And it is important enough that you will want to burn something to get them back up and running. Fortunately interrupt builds also have tools to interrupt people trying to interrupt them, like casting diversion while casting distraction. And utility builds often have stablity, aegis or projectile denial. So most of the time this is fine. You run into issues when you are using two or more mantras. In which case you probably need to be running bountiful disillusionment for extra stab.

Then they would increase the recharge cooldown to compensate which would nerf the people who can regularly recharge them. Just don't use the last charge and you basically have the old mantra back.

There is nothing wrong in trying to have fun in a video game. But there are definitely better or worse ways to play. This isn't the Mesmer Collective. I am glad you think you are safeguarding some secret build, but there really arent that many permutations. You said you had 1.3k healing procs, and are running scepter+sword. It isn't hard to reverse engineer what type of build you are playing. I am not surprised you win 1v1. Most players are new, new players struggle vs bunker condi builds. They don't understand the basics of starting with energy+cleansing + stunbreak + mobility and working up from there. Scaffolding is an important process in learning. It is more helpful to send someone a build like https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Chronomancer_-_Support_Chronomancer and then they tweak it from there. Throwing them into the deep-end just leads to threads like these where people don't understand the full breadth of their kit.

I just want toss out for other people's benefit that sites like https://metabattle.com/wiki/Mesmer and https://hardstuck.gg/gw2/builds/mesmer/ exist I do not cosign every build that is listed here. But it may be helpful for new people to understand what a build even looks like and where/when one might would want to use a mantra. Often the recharge doesnt even matter. You kill something very fast. Or you are fighting something that will let you recharge. https://youtu.be/R8vNdDfWs7I?t=53 WvW has both situations.

I know what I said. "Not every skill is going to be useful in every game mode. Don't use mantras while roaming if you can't use them effectively. There are better alternatives for small scale. Instead of Resolve use Arcane Thievery." I didn't say they are only good in zergs. I said don't use them if you can't use them effectively. I roam in WvW as well on full zerker virtuoso or on celestial mirage if we are doing small scale but heavily outnumbered. Build swap exists and taking a minstrel chrono into a supply camp is a waste of time. I have sympathy for people who play mesmer in PvP. In WvW you have access to PvE gear and ascended food. Post your build. I will be able to tell you what you are doing wrong.