Ailuro.2780

Just to reinforce that it its just the basics that can be easily taught,

They won't, and that's alright. That's the part that is left to learning through time and effort. This. All they need to know is the principles, which is what forms the basis of any good teaching/training mechanism in game-design. It's up to the players where they take it. But having a lightpost than none is the way to go. Through more practise, and live like strikes, raids and fracs, they'll understand themselves but at least they know the direction to go in.

100% That's the point of the second suggestion for better player to player interaction however what about the players that fall in between the cracks? What about the people who aren't all that ready to join a group? And again, the tutorial stuff does not go in deep detail. I do not understand what in my post has led you to believe it is about an in-depth tutorial but it is just an intro the the basics and providing a better structured path to end-game content unlike what it is now.

No, the purpose of it is to make new-game content more in-depth and provide players the opportunity to be more prepared for all content. This means just being able to start and understand it. I really need to make this clear because half of the people on this thread understand my point, and the other are misinterpreting it. The whole point of the suggestion is to just SHOW some level of basic information not go all the way and feed them with a silver spoon. As it stands there is no integration whatsoever between beginner and end-game content, you're just thrown out there. This is faulty game design, in my opinion.

I would like to hear your views on why you believe the complexity of the system is too great. Personally, I agree that to some extent, some parts of the system is indeed complex however I do believe some parts that are left untouched are very very simple to learn. For example, the ideal combo, and why. Every core build has a basic combo, and a "better" combo. This would teach the fundamental "attack" style of any profession and what they're good at for DPS, and what they're not. The combos for different weapons as well. This is an easy solution to just introduce the basics of how to master their profession via the Instructor/sparring/training instance. Another thing is learning about end-game content. Either in the instance via a board, or the NPC can answer questions on "How do I start Fractals?" "What do I need to know about WvW?" or another option that leads to the guild panel tab idea that says here are the guilds that specialize in WvW (which is just the filtered for WvW). Another common issue with new players who reach level 80 is they don't understand what an ideal rotation is. Just supplanting the idea of a basic team that has a basic rotation with the different profession and showing these NPCs rotate around a golem would do a great job of a visual explanation. The number of people that come on to strikes and raids, and have no idea how to co-ordinate nor even intuitively begin to understand the environmental or boss mechanics is insane. A huge issue in this game I've personally encountered is then the elitism of NOT casual players who look down on these players. Everyone starts off somewhere but people should definitely not be starting there for that deep into the game. Plus I believe if we did this, in the future we could have PvE leaderboards showcasing the top 10 guilds that are compeleting the gamemode in the fastest type, this would promote more of a community challenge drive.

Furthermore, if not to solidify my stance, there is a recent post: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/124305/how-to-start-a-new-player#latest Which mentions extra things I have yet to cover, the need for knowledge on how important collections can be, how important is to learn how to navigate the achievements panel and the priority to the things within the achievements panel is non-existent. The lack of information on how someone gets started on fractals, and then progresses. The list of absent information for preparing the new player to end game content just goes on and on.

First of all, please don't insinuate things that I'm not claiming. My post is purely what I think would benefit new players. Like I said, I've been playing for nearly 8 years now. I have no issue reading the wiki or watching youtube for information. The same way you clearly don't have an issue for it. However, you're arguing against the idea of an option of it being in-game but that's purely subjective and an opinion because it suits yourself. Secondly, I've provided repeated examples of players who reach end-game content, and you haven't replied to that at all as if those kinds of players don't exist. There seems to be a very bad habit here in this post of misquoting, and not replying to the full argument. Finally, just answer this one simple question. Should there be an option for players to learn mechanics in-game through the help of incentive missions, NPC, and whatever it it is because many comments have offered alternative but great ideas? If no, then okay that's not the option for yourself but that doesn't mean just because you dont' want to do it, other players shouldn't have the chance to make an option.

Why would they not do it? It's the choice of between reading text and not playing the game, versus engaging in the game. Here the argument that "if it's optional" doesn't really work considering if you weigh the two, it is way more fun to actually learn in the game than read the wiki.Sure, it's subjective but speaking from my own experience, more people would choose to learn it in the game than read from the wiki. There are different ways of achieving this due to the difference in weapons and professions.Letting the players understand exactly how to achieve a higher DPS from a specific combo and understanding their trait lines is not something insulting. I'll say this again, many players come to end-game content with no clue what is the right weapons for them to achieve a high dps, much less knowing about combo effects in their chosen profession. The argument I'm coming from is there is more than enough evidence of people simply having to copy template builds and just forget about everything they've played with prior, it shows that they have poor understanding of the game mechanics. This is exactly why I disagree with: At the very least, if the game did a good job of teaching the necessary skills, then players would have to change a couple chosen traits in their specialization because learning that is pretty time-consuming. As far as I'm aware, a majority of new players who reach lvl 80 don't even understand why they should use a greatsword over axe/mace as as a warrior in PvE modes.

This is a fantastic idea. Transparency and communication is what GW2 really needs right now. In my opinion, if at the very least there were weekly dev streams that pointed out the noteworthy bugs and issues talked about by the Community would give some level of baseline to knowing that hey they're really paying attention and while they might not be fixing it ASAP, they care. If we take a look at a game like Ashes of Creation, which is the current no.1 hyped up upcoming MMORPG, we see this is coming from that great level of interaction with the community and constant weekly back and forth communication and transparency on the issues they're dealing with and what they've noted from us.

As described through the pre-existing examples of the "tutorials" in town and around the beginner maps, those are completely optional. I do not support the idea of mandatory tutorials. That would go against the nature of the hands-off approach in the levelling process of guild wars2. The mission you described is a great idea, and like another person commented on an incentive to get a chest. Here you said: It would be very easy to weave in either the story or around the maps bosses having critical weaknesses and the NPCs saying something. As you already know, the training golems exist and are great to practise rotations with however from my experience, most players never know they exist till they're mentioned by another player. Bringing back what you said, this is the essential thing. There should be the freedom of choice to the player that they can go to either the wiki OR in the game with an NPC OR learn with friends OR learn with friends and they can practise alone when they want but the integration of the idea of practising skills and being conscious of what they actually do is not a well made option in my opinion. Players who prefer the wiki and videos can do that, but not everyone wants to learn this way.

Exactly, players who are dismissive and called it insignificant simply just learn to live with it. That's not the right attitude. A game, especially an MMORPG should always be focused on improving its gameplay, especially the minor inadequacies when they cumulate to the hundreds.

one thing i wish they'd add to the starter zones, though not really an instanced area is a "CC-this-thing corner" with a chest on it kinda like the "dodge-the-spikes corner" with a chest on it. it wont be part of map completion, it would be super optional but it's a very small mini tutorial that could entice players to do it as soon as they can or come back for it later because it's a chest they haven't opened before. a tool tip popup would appear just like the one on the dodge-the-spikes informing the player for the first time how to get to the chest. it can be as simple as a stone pedestal (breakable object with a CC breakbar) with a chest on top that you have to use CC skills/abilities on in order to get the chest down and opened. maybe it's a good and friendly way to introduce breakbars and CC abilities to new players that in the future level 80 content they'd do, they'll get reminded of this "breakbar" That's actually a great idea! Things that promote the incentive to actually understand the essential skills in the game to prepare for end-game content is really needed in GW2. It'd be far simpler adding that than the instructor idea. The only benefit I see with an instanced training area is the fact that it allows the possible integration of playing around with different weapons easier and changing of stats easier as you can also put this in a home instance possibly with a bank.

What is more engaging to learning fractals for example? Playing fractals, and practising with group friends OR looking up a wiki? It's dry. It's bland. It's boring.The focus here isn't for players who don't want to put in effort, it's for players who are trying to find answers IN THE game. More importantly, please do understand that the Instructor idea serves as a place to experiment and practise _over the course of the levelling journey.__That's quite literally asking for the need to put in effort and practise but IN the game, learning mechanics in a clearly designated training area PREPARING new players for end-game content.

I understand but I definitely think that the game could do a better job of demonstrating stats at play in a training mode element. In fact, even today I was helping new players with fractals and dungeons, and they were level 76-80 who had no idea what makes a build useful for their profession. I think my main gripe is with how there is a lack of display on how important weapon skills are and affects what kind of build you should run.

Yep, it is easy to fall into that rift of never really finding players much less having the option of choosing the kind of guild you want to be in.