Bastrii.3047

It's perfect for open world, because it focuses entirely on AoE with the ability to flip to support in a moment's notice. It feels great to play, it's fun, and it melts massive packs in seconds. You're just whining because it's not a minmaxed damage dealer and you can't stand people having fun, I get it. No need to be childish on a forum because people like to hybrid.

"Let's change this hybrid build meant for open world into a non-hybrid build stat wise, surely this is intelligent."

I actually find the spirits really powerful as a hybrid, more than any other utility at times, especially as druid. The damage potential is not absurd (as you're not focusing on one stat), but it's definitely potent on top of powerful sustain. http://gw2skills.net/editor/?POgAMZlJwOYKsN2JO2Tat7BkA-DyIY1oivMCLBatAkf0UgfNQFA-e This is the build I run for general play. It's basically pure AoE. Storm Spirit is a free 7-14k damage. I'm constantly at 25 might. It's raining arrows around me half the time. I can self-blast during Rejuvinating Tides for AoE burst healing, while at the same time pumping out more boons than I can handle. I basically never have to leave longbow because I'm essentially pushing out constant, non-stop, area wide damage, and when I'm on cooldown for longbow skills, I just enter CA. The pros are that this build is super flexible and tanky. Anything around you or your spirits is never going to have a chance to deal damage, because they are 1. Dazed, 2. Rooted, or 3. Blinded. On top of all other effects, like Chilled, Crippled, and Weakened from Call of the Wild. And your damage output, while not game-breaking or topping charts, is decent enough while providing a ton of healing and boon coverage. I'd suspect a build like this would be toxic in PvP, if it didn't have longer cooldowns on the spirits and CA. Because you can use Spirits in stealth, without breaking stealth. Then you can end stealth with CA for free CC. I honestly wouldn't know what to do during this if I was desperately trying to cap a point and suddenly, a hailstorm of CC, AoE, and Condis began to rain down on top of me. And the person doing it all is invisible, and about to dazelock me. Thankfully, the cooldowns in PvP are too long to encourage nuking, and people can still outrun it if they're smart. On top of this, you'd still want CC break, so you'd have to drop *something* for it.

Druid is not broken in output. Basing balancing decisions around non-essential numbers is how you butcher a spec. The overwhelming majority of heals that Druid produces is from passive healing through Regeneration. If you remove Regeneration from whatever healing numbers you have for all professions churning out heals, the healing difference is noticeable. But other professions provide consistent damage negation, auras, and barrier to compensate for this. If you nerfed Druid's healing potential to match any other profession, then their viability plummets dramatically. Regeneration is not a make-all-break-all boon. In PvE, PvP, and WvW, regeneration will not save you if you have 2000 HP left. You should realize that actual health numbers are not as essential as how many actual hits you can take before you are dead. If you have 22,000 HP, that could be a few dozen hits or several depending on the enemy's output. In raids and PvE, this is usually 3-6 hits, in PvP and WvW, it's better to track this as actual survival time due to attack speed variations and how professions operate/how conditions work. Regeneration does not restore a hit every second in PvE. It takes several seconds for a player to restore enough health through regeneration alone to negate an extra hit. In PvP and WvW, Regeneration may give you an extra 0.1 second alive every second it's active. Considering how most time to down is under several seconds without dodging or defensive play, this is entirely negligible healing. If you are being focused without defensive abilities, your health bar could vanish in as little as four seconds. An extra 0.4 seconds will not save you. But boons like Protection give you an effective +33% flat health against Power damage, and Resolution grants the same effect for Condition Damage. Barrier is also affective health. Blocking through Aegis is affective health. Blocking through actual blocking is affective health. Other specs offer these in heaps and spades. Druid does not. Druid offers healing. Not barrier regeneration. Not resolution. They have great condi cleanse, but they also can't really reduce condi damage otherwise. Druid is built around raw numbers. Removing the raw numbers aspect would be similar to removing Barrier generation from Scourge. You would be destroying the niche of the class without cause. Players have a misconception on what provides actual survival to a player, and we don't have tools to really show survival. If you want to see the actual effectiveness of a healing spec, we need better tools to see this in-game. We need to be able to track effective damage reduction and time until death, not raw healing numbers. One of the only ways we can track actual effective healing output is through damage field testing on the Raid Golem, and the numbers and cooldowns aren't the same in this scenario. So we don't have actual tools to track survival in-game. Add ons are also ineffective for tracking survival, as they only provide raw data. If we want to check actual survival rate, we would need a couple people to painstakingly get together on WvW, and have them wail on someone while a healer tries to keep them alive. The healer would need to be in actual gear set ups and know what they're doing. The player should be in average gear and an adventurer profession. The other players should have similar, average DPS outputs in WvW. To perform the test, you would need at least 3 enemy attackers, one player on the healer's team to serve as a target dummy, and one person who has access to all support specs - or multiple people with access to all support specs, and knowledge on how to use them. You would need to make sure that the enemy players fight with the same rotation each and every time. You would also need a scenario where there is at least five allied players clumped together to test group healing and survival. This would be the only way to test actual healing effectiveness. Any other tool, calculator, or other method would no yield useful results. You need a similar scenario every time. Anet devs could add tools to test this in-game, but doing so might be a challenge in of itself.

*There is very little wrong with Druid as it stands right now regardless of whatever context you try to conjure up.* You have no data to counter my argument, no actual point to make other than saying "WvW groups" 40x. The entire premise of this thread is that the "numbers are off". They're not. You're not even supposed to *see* the numbers to be fair, that's not even *intended*. One add on in a game that won't even allow you to change the HUD spawned this thread, and now that I've effectively nullified your entire point and argument, you're trying to make this a point in "knowledge". My point still stands. Druids do not need skimming. And if you want to talk about broken builds, Support Scourge can *still* pump 25k DPS, and their only downfall is being slightly composition sensitive. Their barrier output isn't super reliant on healing power, so they can take a utility slot instead of a support and do really well. And since you're so keen on group composition, why not try bringing a Herald alongside them, hm? I will not respond to any of your further posts until you join a WvW fight guild, hop on their discord, and begin playing with them in large scale, organized fights as Support Scourge. If you don't know where to look to find these guilds, you can message me directly and I can get you into many of them. :^) Miss. Miss Bastrii.

Okay, then let's play the math game, since you're going to make claims without cause nor proof. If I give a basic reply, that's fair. But this is unwarranted. You understand that Regeneration is a number ticker, right? But have you done the math on this? How much healing potential is behind regen? Because regeneration accounts for the *overwhelming* majority of healing output for any healer. Not because it gives meaningful heals (if you are being tagged by two players, a couple hundred HP/sec isn't going to save you) but because it's applying consistent, slow burn heals to *every single player* affected by it. If you are in a group of 40 people, and you have not one, but *several* sources of regen, you are going to massively inflate your numbers. Exclude regen from the pool and you see the actual HP/S from all healers, and that's when you'll notice something *DRUID IS THE ONLY CLASS POPPING OUT CONSISTENT AND NEAR OVERWHELMING REGEN.* Even in Valentine's own pictures, there's a boon breakdown on his details. And the druids? They're pumping out *HUNDREDS* of applications of regeneration. It's literally painted on the screen. Now this comes back to healing numbers. Why is this important? Well, if you're pumping out 300-400 hp/s through regen to 5-10 people, your BASE HEAL RATE is - at a MINIMUM - 1500 HP/S. That's WITHOUT your burst heals. Regen is *great* for raids because of this, they repair chip damage. But PvP doesn't revolve around chip damage so much as it does taking down raid lead's call and picks whenever the other zerg scatters in a retreat, or whenever a backline overextends or a squishy shows their head. Sure, tossing 30 AoEs on a single point is effective, but that's not happening unless if you're taking a point, or saving a point from capture. Or, if a wall goes down and there's a rush. You can assume I lack game knowledge, and I'll assume you're lacking basic math skills. Druids numbers are through regen. Nature Magic specifically applies regen on Warhorn and on Beast Skills. Their cleanses come from 2 abilities - one of which is an active ability in Astral Form with a 4 second cooldown (seed of life) and Healing Spring (their healing skill). Healing Spring also applies TONS of regen, further boosting their numbers. And Healing Magic gives a flat +20% extra regen potency as a MINOR trait. On a class that pops out the MOST regen in the game. Players are not limited to just 5 regen targets. They're limited to 5 targets per application. And if you're pulsing out 25 total stacks of Regen through one ability, and you have several abilities that pump out 5 stacks of regen, you've basically suffused the entire raid with at least 20+ outgoing regen applications at the MINIMUM, more if you don't overlap. Tracking numbers is pointless. And again - cleanses. Same problem. One of the best healing abilities in the game is Healing Spring for raids. Because it pops out regen, but it also cleanses 2 conditions every 2 seconds for 10 seconds as long as players are inside of the generous field range. It's a carry in raids because it nullifies a ton of incoming conditions. But in PvP/WvW, it's especially strong, because it can nullify a condi build entirely for 10 straight seconds, while at the same time beefing up your healing numbers tremendously. Tracking HP/s has done nothing but prove that healing spring is a good ability. Problematic? Not really. There are far more concerning things than healing spring, power creep being one of them (and healing spring has always been this good, it's not an issue). In the build in the picture, it's highly likely that the druid could pop out 30 regens within 10 seconds to an entire raid. And with full Concentration, and high spread, they could churn out a solid 400 x 30 hp a second. That's 12k hp/s. But is that effective healing? For chip damage and random AoE, yes. But will it save a life? Not necessarily. What saves a life is large chunk healing (CA 3, Staff 3). These are the crucial healers. And there's a limit to how many you can pop out. Those prevent downs. Those stop a burst. Those counter a power class cleaving someone in half. If you brought turtle and staff, you could block projectiles for a bit. But pets are more often than not dead on arrival in WvW, especially if you push through a choke. So if anything, that leaves staff 5. And guess what Staff 5 does? It gives regen. And it converts projectiles into healing. Regen is amazing in PvE but it doesn't carry hard in PvP. It mitigates AoE and reduces risk/keeps you topped up, but it does NOT prevent the hammer from coming down on some idiot who didn't fall back on the retreat. That would be active healing abilities. That would be barrier. That would be aegis. That would be CA 3 and spamming your heart out on CA 1/2. And if someone goes down, you don't have an instant undo button. You have Glyph of the Stars - amazing! Yes. It can turn the tide if played right. But a Signet rez is instant and straight up unfair at times. And instantly pulling someone up from the ground is superior to Glyph, because it will 100% of the time work. I've had so many Glyphs fail because the damage was too great, the ally was too deep, or the pressure was too high from AoE. I've never had a signet rez fail except whenever a squishy gets up and immediately flops because they're far out of position. From your post, you genuinely don't understand basic math. You're so absorbed in the numbers and what they're trying to convey to you that you've completely detached the actual effectiveness from the profession. The numbers are irrelevant because the in-practice numbers are FAR different. Anyone being focused down is dead regardless of regen. That regen is bloating a number on your screen. You're crying about ALL healing skills as a result, their "overall effectiveness and meta use" because you only see "big healing number" without knowing the actual breakdown of what's going on. Regeneration and passive heals are the number bloater in any encounter. Any profession that pumps out regen is going to be BiS for heals if you're only looking at the surface without digging too deep into it. And druid's actual healing skills, their core abilities in CA, aren't overtuned nor broken. So because people rush to the profession, and see they're doing well and they're pushing big numbers, and people like you crowned it the new meta. Without realizing that preventing damage wholesale and actual mitigation is far more effective than regen. That the actual backbone of the raid is mitigation. Which Druid DOES cover through condi cleanse in Healing Spring, and can prevent some friendlies from being burst down through CA. The Glyph of the Stars? Debatable at best.

For a long time, the most meta PvP build on Druid was Longbow/Staff, and just outranging everything because of balanced and fun class design, cough cough. It was kitten to play against because you'd be glued down almost constantly due to the snare, and the Druid would be pecking away at you from 1200+ units away. Nowadays, Druid can use Shortbow/Axes and do crazy damage with Astral Form. It's an improvement because they're actually viable DPS, not just kitten healers. And 90% of the game's content can be done strictly with just a longbow. If you pick up the Rage and Celerity rune, and run Lead the Wind, you could have essentially 24/7 uptime on Quickness. Your off weapon could be a staff for quick get aways, and you can run Thunder/Sun spirit for AoE CC and damage on top of your Volley. You *can* be viable with a longbow, you just won't be viable for content that's built around clumping up by a tight group of players. Which... is a lot of group content, sadly. Nor will your damage be amazing.

I was referring to WvW, I forgot about SPvP entirely (I just came back from WoW). SPvP is different. I'm referring to WvW.

Providing all of that to a massive group in PvP is difficult at best, impossible at worst, and you can't provide Quickness as a Druid. You can provide a smoke field and some stealth in PvP, but in an organized group with coms, you still wouldn't make an insane play with it due to how chaotic PvP is. They can't provide perma-stability nor stacks of it, at best you'd get a couple from pets and that's it. Aegis is a rarity only provided by one pet, or by stone spirit (which you have to take for nearly 24/7 uptime on Prot). Keeping uptime on Prot, Regen, Vigor, Swiftness, and Fury is a balancing game of dumping ALL of your utilities (and you wouldn't have room for a stunbreak if you did). None of this is effective in practice because players don't clump as well in PvP, ranges are limited, and the cooldowns are different in PvP. On a test dummy or in PvE, it's possible that a Support Druid could provide all of this with almost full uptime, but their healing suffers as a result. They have to choose between taking full uptime heals, damage, or alacrity, which is a problem point for support druid. The projectile denial aspect is no longer relevant to just druid. In fact it's arguable that a Untamed is far superior for Projectile Blocking, as they can take a staff, siege turtle pet, and their pet can pop an additional untamed bubble. Druid only really has turtle and bubble. Group stun break is not limited to just Druid. Any Ranger can take Protect Me!. Group Revive is the most iconic part of druid. Doesn't always see use in PvP, more often people go down 1-3 at a time, not as a huge group. You're more likely to throw down GotS on a few people outside of your Search and Rescue! range. Ranged immob is not limited to just Druid, as any pet with ranged immob can do it. And any Ranger spec can use staff. Super speed and stealth is useful but not game breaking. And all of these added together doesn't make Druid "absolutely loaded", because in group play, people spread out far too often to make any real use of it.

FB and Ele both have amazing fallback options if they're being pressured. FB can switch tomes on the fly and pop a lot of defensives to stay afloat. Ele w/ Earth is notorious for being hard to kill. Druid... doesn't have these same kind of fallbacks. Sure, they produce a lot of healing, but they don't produce a lot of *mitigation*. In fact, a lot of their self sustain is butchered by a flat%. If a druid is being pressured, the best they can hope for is GS block and dropping Astral for an escape. They don't churn out a ton of Aegis or Stability for a group, they don't have a defensive/sustain rotation that makes them hard to kill, and if their pet is dead - a giant chunk of their toolkit is gone. Heal Druids do *best* when there are others in a group pumping out boons that shore up their weaknesses. Having a Guardian to pump out Aegis and Stability is great, and an Engineer to help churn out Barrier is just icing on the cake. Heal Druids are a baseline for support - they're good at providing the foundation. But you need other classes to build the walls and ramparts to keep your group alive. I'd say that Guardian is great for mitigation, while Engineer is great for absorption. With Guardian, you prevent attacks that can cleave health and reduce damage taken, while providing some healing, and can pump out Stability for your team. Engineer, on the other hand, produces a TON of barrier if they run Mechanist, which is perfect for absorbing damage - and they can do it while also popping buffs out like crazy. But Healing Druid focuses on recovering the health bar when both of these options aren't enough on their own, and people start taking crazy damage. If you "shaved the top" on druid, you'd cripple their niche and make them less useful, not make other classes shine. If there was a way to track damage mitigated through Aegis, stuns denied by Stability, damage absorbed by Barrier, you'd see quickly that other classes provide just as much - if not more to the group than Druids do. One stability could be the difference between life and death. 300 points of healing often is not, especially with how explosive DPS is right now.

Greatsword/Longbow isn't super viable, but it's still a strong option if you don't want to use Axe (I personally hate axe).

There's 14 pets from Expacs. Not counting aquatic pets (95% of content is on solid ground), this leaves 38 pets. 5 Moas (similar models/animations) 4 Bears (similar models/animations) with an extra bear with a somewhat unique, though hideous, model (similar animations) 5 Drakes (similar models/animations) 4 Boars/Pigs (similar models/animations) 5 Birds (similar models/animations) 4 Spiders (similar models/animations) 5 Hounds (similar models/animations) 4 Felines (almost similar models, similar animations) 4 Devourers (similar models/animations) So in truth, we have 9 pets to choose from with some flavor from the core game, because these pets - for the most part - act nearly entirely similar outside of their F2. The expansions did a good thing, and brought variety - but the variety is small. We don't have any really unique fantasy options. We have some really ugly ones that... personally, I would never tame, but like... nothing that looks super appealing nor any that could fit with any design. 95% of the time I'm in a city space, I just keep my pet stowed, especially in any segment where I talk to NPCs, or other players. They all look bad. It's like... when you think of a Ranger with a cool pet, some amazing things come to mind, fantastical things. A *really good looking phoenix* that catches on *actual* fire would be a great option. Or maybe something like a powerful Elk with branches instead of antlers. The Kirins from Echovald are beautiful! I'd love to tame one of those. Or maybe a small dragon-like beast, or an oriental dragon would be cool (no, drakes/wyverns do not count). The "wyverns" (our choice in "dragons") look like scrawny pitbulls with wing arms. They're hideous. And they're both the same model. The devs have rarely added nice options for pet that aren't disgusting. I want more variety in appearance. I'd also like it if all pets had relatively similar DPS as well outside of their F2. The Rock Gazelle is a good, if simple design, for a pet they added. I'd like something more fantastical, or even just more common creatures to wiggle into the roster. I'd love to tame a deer, for example. A bad design is something like the Jacaranda, which just looks like a floating grass troll doll. It's... extremely ugly. But also one of the most effective pets in-game. So everyone chooses it.

There's very few choices in pretty pets that aren't terrible overall. In fact, the best pets are felines, excluding Jacaranda and Iboga - which are arguably two of the best pets, on top of being absolutely hideous. So if you want a pretty, functional pet, your choices are the lynx, tiger, and jaguar. Otherwise you take the Jacaranda because it's the best for DPS, or maybe the Fern Hound or other specific pet for the situation if you're playing support. Can we get a pet that's both beautiful and useful? I'd love to see something like the Kirin join the list of pets we could take, or even just a normal deer. Hell, make a magic deer in SotO. Make it pretty, give it good DPS, and a useful ability, and all Rangers would thank you. Just make something that isn't a mishmash of random twigs and branches, or another reskin of a spider, or... *shudder*, whatever demonic miscreant you're going to shove onto us. A general passover of pets is really needed, too. When 80% of players use the Jacaranda, it's not because the Jacaranda is over powered or pretty. It's because it's one of the few viable pets of the dozens we have. Not to mention a dozen of our pets are flat out reskins of other pets, and that's just depressing. Not taking the Jacaranda means you miss out on a ton of random AoE, consistent damage, a tanky pet that can self heal, and a snare CC. The only option one could argue is better is the Lynx, which has slightly higher damage - but it has half the health, no self heal, and gets melted. I'm pretty sure if the Devs looked at most used pets, the list would be 10 entries at the very top, and the rest seeing a sub 1% usage rate. And of the 10 most used pets, the majority would be starter pets that new players/alts never took off.

Hey! I made a lil' hybrid build that's tons of fun on its own, but sure to get better when SotO releases. This build is my go-to for open world, Fractals, and could be "alright" in raids once SotO drops. Hope you enjoy! (In SotO, I'm going to replace MH Axe with MH dagger, because I hate axe. I just don't like using axe.) http://gw2skills.net/editor/?POwAMdjlJwUYHsN2JW6TVt7RMH-zxQYhoAqRMfpUQIEWC0aBESEI/DRAahsGCcWBqA-e So, this build focuses on engaging with the Longbow, before moving in close for CA/melee range. The rotation is simple; Rapid Fire into Point Blank Shot/Hunter's Shot. In stealth, move in and summon Sun/Storm spirit. Using Storm Spirit's daze and Sun Spirit's blind as cover, Longbow 5. Switch weapons at this point to your secondary (which will be Dagger/Dagger in Soto). Use Axe 2, Axe 3, Dagger 5, Dagger 4. Pop CA. Spam 2, tap 3, 5, and optionally tap 4. Exit CA, and reposition out of range while your Jacaranda uses their Entangle. Optionally, you can use your Signet/Entangle for more damage, but that's up to you. This basically gives you a strong engage, massive AoE, stacks a ton of condis, and can clear large packs of mobs in seconds. It massacres breakbars and provides tons of sustainable might (I frequently hit 25 might without any real issues, though staying at 25 was a challenge). The damage is around 13k Single Target without any raid buffs or food, and that's just with Longbow, no weapon swaps (I was running staff on my weapon swap when testing, because I use staff in T4 fractals to build CA/heal and I prefer staff for movement/support open world). So with axe, the damage definitely goes much higher. All of this damage, plus CC, makes it really hard to go down in any real scenario. The sustain you get from having bonus heals on CA + 9k healing from Water Spirit makes this an ez mode build for survival. If you don't like spirits, you could swap to Wilderness Survival and take 3/1/3, and pick your own utilities/heal. For Food, it's your choice on what to take. I have some cheap food I cycle through for healing (Holo Drumstick and Delicious Rice Ball) which can bump up your heals with Druid's 2/1/2. You'd also take staff with this and replace Storm Spirit with Stone Spirit, and Signet of the Wild with Search and Rescue. Of course, Glyph of the Stars, too. For offensive food, lean towards Precision/Ferocity or Condi. Condi will get you more value overall, but really, you're pumping out so much control and CC that food choice doesn't matter so much as hitting your buttons. I take Quickness on Longbow as it's my engage, and it basically preps for a speedy CA rotation. The less time in CA = the more Astral power you save, so getting your 3/4/5 out ASAP is important. Having a ton of Concentration (81%) is also very useful. If you don't mind losing Concentration/Survival/Utility, you can take a Berserker longbow to maximize the Power damage, but it's up to you. Keep in mind that while in Stealth, spirits won't break Stealth. You can actually place spirits on mobs/players before engaging, which is kinda important. Additionally, you can save your dodges as a CC cleanse, and you can use CA 2 to clear Root/Slows/Chills that bother you. Overall, this build is solid, and won't even need Axe next patch to be effective. It's not a great starter build, but it's a fun way to play more of a Stealthy/Disruption Druid, allowing you to pop in and out of action while providing cover in the form of Blinds/Daze. It's a ton of fun, and really gives you the feeling of control.

No shield?