Eurantien.4632

Core ranger currently has the highest win rate in PvP ranked. But this is a rare occurrence and it will likely be nerfed soon.

What would you say if people were saying, nerf the new explosives trait, nerf prot removes condis trait all at once, remove condi cleared is a condi converted to boon trait, remove engi sustain. All at once? Would you say, hey here are some viable counters you could be running but arent for some reason? Would you say, hey if we nerf all of this engi is dead? Or would you let your class potentially get obliterated just because it's the strongest 1v1 side noding spec. Or are you righteous enough to say yeah, for the sake of balance it's fine if we nerf prot holo, its what's best for the game. Despite the fact ranger and weaver are still performing well on side nodes too, and arguably better. If you shaved pets down 20%, they'd still die, hit for a lot less. Weaver would still be a good side noding option, and prot holo would probably become the undisputable king. I'm ok with ranger getting nerfed as long as other things get nerfed too. Right now the side node fights feel almost balanced and I fear we are about to go back to the times where only 1 side noding spec is viable. Funny enough, that's your class Chaith... yet I haven't seen you out here suggesting nerfs or ways to beat prot holo? Meanwhile... We've said pet dmg is a little too high. We've stated the counter - killing the pet. There are videos of it happening. We've mentioned the real problem is WS and the tankiness of the ranger - but that there should be caution here as that's never changed before. We've mentioned that Knights amulet is kind of a problem (demo vs demo prot holo 100% beats core ranger - also makes it a lot easier for Weaver to win the 1v1 - a 1v1 weaver can already win). We've offered potential counter specs - yet top players aren't playing them. Is ranger strong? yes. But people aren't playing the counters to it. People still aren't killing the pets. Sometimes rangers play demo or zerker and people focus the pets now and get meme'd by the ranger - when they should just focus the ranger with those amulets. Is ranger strong? yes. but so is prot holo, and LR weaver, and core necro, and crev, and power rev, and thief, firebrand, and some other side noding specs that people just aren't playing right now. I am ok with nerfing ranger, but I worry that it will lower the skill ceiling even more than it already has AND that it'll just nuke ranger into oblivion while these other classes sneak on by. Do I like the way ranger is right now? 100%. It's a good 1v1er and despite having counters I have the experience to be able to deal with those. Moreover, all these people band wagoning to ranger don't have the experience to be able to win the mirror match up - which in my opinion - is how it should be. It's fucking dumb when people can just pick up a new class they've never played before and immediately get almost equal value vs someone who has thousands of hours on a class - that to me SCREAMS bad balance, something that is just instantly good because of it's numbers. That's not the case right now with ranger. There's a skill differential - I struggle with certain prot holos, I struggle with LR weaver, If I'm struggling with those I believe every other ranger should be losing those 1v1s. In fact, most 1v1s feel like there's a large amount of skill involved and I don't see these band-wagoners successfully being able to do it. That's how it should be imo. But that's not ranked - and thats not how the casual experiences it.

I would give Warrior Offhand sword that reward. I still think engineer MH pistol deserves this title.The 2 and the 3 are pretty solid though. 5 stacks of poison dart volley for 10s each. Then you get confusion and blind on the 3 that bounces! And they're ranged. I'd take that over dagger 2 and 3 right now.

I've been asking for nerfs to marksmanship modifiers, sic em, and base numbers on certain pets for a while now. But it doesn't matter how much ranger gets nerfed people will still cry about it because the general skill level is much lower than it used to be. Base numbers on our weapons should not be nerfed more and neither should the functionality of our weapons. Regardless, I don't use birds and tigers because they are trash pets that only work against builds without physical damage mitigation, without heavy condi pressure, because they also insta die in teamfights and cause me to lose node when the enemy is intelligent enough to pressure them. However, even if I kill the pets, a knights amulet ranger can eat my damage for a solid few minutes without dodging anything and still be able to live... no different than a knights prot holo, bunker core necro, or any other facetank spec that has too much survivability in the current meta. Any other amulet wouldn't be an issue to kill but it's pretty tough to whittle away at a 3200+ armor enemy when damage got nerfed pretty hard. Keep in mind, it's Conquest. You don't need to kill things in order to win. Just sit on node because people can't kill or decap you in a reasonable timeframe. :) Nerf WILDERNESS SURVIVAL and you won't have ranger Face tanking everything with a knights amulet. Mind you it's dolyak rune + knights amulet is what most of these core rangers are using at the moment. Giving them over 3.5k toughness and slightly under 17k health, Swap the knights amulet out for paladin and you'll have 2.9k toughness and slightly under 22k health on the core ranger. Promise you right now the difference in amulet isn't going to change the out come of the ranger face tanking everything. Like i said before the issue isn't Knights amulet with these core rangers, it's wilderness survival IMO and theirs enough traits to legit help this class stay alive with the amount of valuable traits it has at the moment such as oakheart( 5% damage reduction whenever you have regen), Companion defense(2 seconds of protection every time you dodge), Rugged Growth(gain health whenever you have protection), and my favorite one wilderness Knowledge( reduces all survival skills by 20% , Gives you fury AND it clears 2 conditions). Wilderness knowledge is busted regardless of what any ranger main wants to say lol the fact you have 2 stun breaks under that offers Condi removal, Superspeed, Evade, quickness, and Fury is crazy. How Anet let that slide is beyond me. Mind you we aren't even talking about Beast Mastery and What Protect Me as utility has to offer as a THIRD stun break. Instead of blaming Knights amulet for some of these classes over performing as a side node why not look at the traits that allows them to stay alive so easily with no issues at all? Especially a Class like ranger with the BEST stun breaks in the game at the moment with them ALL being 24-32 seconds long at most. Pretty sure ANY side noder with the ability to break out of and HARD cc within every 24 second would not die to anyone 1vs1 or 1vs2 if you know how to properly mange your utilities. Protect me offers Barrier, Protection, Swiftness, and Regen! ON a 24 second cool down but we want to blame a amulet instead as to why certain specs can face tank so easily and not worry about getting bursted down when they have 2 stun breaks and a heal under 25 second each. This is what you call a brain dead build/spec that is EASILY rewarding players because the build carries itself more the then the skill level required to play the class itself. Imagine If prot holo Stun breaks Offer Boons anywhere near what ranger gets and that's also another class that needs heavy nerfs but it isn't because of knights amulet lol. Wilderness Knowledge is the only condi clear we got. Wilderness Survival has always been a busted triatline - and has always been the true root of every ranger problem ever. But without getting condi clear and maybe some small sustain in another line, it is a huge necessity right now. There just arent meta builds without it, and never have been. Which is fine if it stayed with 2-3 condi removal but the fact it OFFERS more then just condi removal is insane eura. I Personally would keep the condi removal on it and remove the Fury and 20% reduction to the skills at least then we can justify the stun breaks not offering so much within such a low CD. That's short sighted. WS cannot be nerfed until we have something gained somewhere else.

I've been asking for nerfs to marksmanship modifiers, sic em, and base numbers on certain pets for a while now. But it doesn't matter how much ranger gets nerfed people will still cry about it because the general skill level is much lower than it used to be. Base numbers on our weapons should not be nerfed more and neither should the functionality of our weapons. Regardless, I don't use birds and tigers because they are trash pets that only work against builds without physical damage mitigation, without heavy condi pressure, because they also insta die in teamfights and cause me to lose node when the enemy is intelligent enough to pressure them. However, even if I kill the pets, a knights amulet ranger can eat my damage for a solid few minutes without dodging anything and still be able to live... no different than a knights prot holo, bunker core necro, or any other facetank spec that has too much survivability in the current meta. Any other amulet wouldn't be an issue to kill but it's pretty tough to whittle away at a 3200+ armor enemy when damage got nerfed pretty hard. Keep in mind, it's Conquest. You don't need to kill things in order to win. Just sit on node because people can't kill or decap you in a reasonable timeframe. :) Nerf WILDERNESS SURVIVAL and you won't have ranger Face tanking everything with a knights amulet. Mind you it's dolyak rune + knights amulet is what most of these core rangers are using at the moment. Giving them over 3.5k toughness and slightly under 17k health, Swap the knights amulet out for paladin and you'll have 2.9k toughness and slightly under 22k health on the core ranger. Promise you right now the difference in amulet isn't going to change the out come of the ranger face tanking everything. Like i said before the issue isn't Knights amulet with these core rangers, it's wilderness survival IMO and theirs enough traits to legit help this class stay alive with the amount of valuable traits it has at the moment such as oakheart( 5% damage reduction whenever you have regen), Companion defense(2 seconds of protection every time you dodge), Rugged Growth(gain health whenever you have protection), and my favorite one wilderness Knowledge( reduces all survival skills by 20% , Gives you fury AND it clears 2 conditions). Wilderness knowledge is busted regardless of what any ranger main wants to say lol the fact you have 2 stun breaks under that offers Condi removal, Superspeed, Evade, quickness, and Fury is crazy. How Anet let that slide is beyond me. Mind you we aren't even talking about Beast Mastery and What Protect Me as utility has to offer as a THIRD stun break. Instead of blaming Knights amulet for some of these classes over performing as a side node why not look at the traits that allows them to stay alive so easily with no issues at all? Especially a Class like ranger with the BEST stun breaks in the game at the moment with them ALL being 24-32 seconds long at most. Pretty sure ANY side noder with the ability to break out of and HARD cc within every 24 second would not die to anyone 1vs1 or 1vs2 if you know how to properly mange your utilities. Protect me offers Barrier, Protection, Swiftness, and Regen! ON a 24 second cool down but we want to blame a amulet instead as to why certain specs can face tank so easily and not worry about getting bursted down when they have 2 stun breaks and a heal under 25 second each. This is what you call a brain dead build/spec that is EASILY rewarding players because the build carries itself more the then the skill level required to play the class itself. Imagine If prot holo Stun breaks Offer Boons anywhere near what ranger gets and that's also another class that needs heavy nerfs but it isn't because of knights amulet lol. Wilderness Knowledge is the only condi clear we got. Wilderness Survival has always been a busted triatline - and has always been the true root of every ranger problem ever. But without getting condi clear and maybe some small sustain in another line, it is a huge necessity right now. There just arent meta builds without it, and never have been.

There's like 5 suggestions here, I wouldn't call that countless.

There should be a GM soulbeast trait where merging refreshes your pet's F2 ability, so you could merge, unmerge and F2 again? Busted? Thoughts?

I would give Warrior Offhand sword that reward. Idk that sticking torment and shitty block (which then has a ton of bleeds) are both decent.

Is ranger dagger main hand the worst weapon in the game?

For every main out there thinking ranger chase potential is good, I invite you to try and chase kill anything with ranger daggers That's the problem tho a lot of us have used swoop to gap close and lb to finish of fleeing opponents, often so..Ranger daggers? So now were talking about ranger daggers? So many classes have weapon kits without mobility built into then. Rangers lucky he has such a versatile weapon with gs to pair with a high damage high ranged(highest in game) weapon in lb. Imagine how broken rangers chase ability would be with one weapon having great instead of good mobility on gs and the dps and range it has on swap to lb lol.Really seems like u want ranger to be broken asf.I was just pointing out to our friend Leonidrex that mesmer staff has nothing to do with the price of tea in China, or this conversation. You're right, ranger gs and lb is a strong pair. Fortunately for everyone, LoS exists, and ranger doesn't have teleports or any meaningful way of dealing with projectile hate. Which means this combo does have counterplay.

For every main out there thinking ranger chase potential is good, I invite you to try and chase kill anything with ranger daggers

I could understand the hate when (traited) swoop was 8s CD block was 12s CD, each of the bugged knockback hit for like 4k. And maul was doing like 40% more damage than it does now. It feels much clunkier now and is honestly fine. This is just another thread that wants to nerf rangers without understanding the root of the balance problems around ranger.

No chase potential wut? Swoop is pretty effective. Cant be perfect at everything lol plus swap to lb, with its damage and range it's great for punishing disengagers lol If you keep pressing W, you're safe from GS. And that's why its often paired with LB. U serious? Swoop and auto while also pressing w? Or hilt or maul? U make zero sense. If they have a disengage skill after u use swoop ur pets can go a decent range at decent speed to cc them while u range them with lb lol if ur soulbeast have 2 swoops. Kits on weapons have to account for the tools and other weapons kits available to the class or the class would be so broken lol. Rangers chase potential is fine when combining its mobility and long ranged high damage potential. Its mobility definitely doesn't need buffed.Due to the aftercast of swoop and hilt bash rooting you when using it, you can't hit someone running away, you also lose ground making them often able to get away from your autos and even maul. But again, thats GS not having chase potential, which is why we use pets and LB and other things like traits to make up for that.

No chase potential wut? Swoop is pretty effective. Cant be perfect at everything lol plus swap to lb, with its damage and range it's great for punishing disengagers lol If you keep pressing W, you're safe from GS. And that's why its often paired with LB.

The only thing that didnt make sense from a balance perspective (and buffed GS) is that Attack of Opportunity used to be on Hilt Bash. They moved it to Maul and made Hilt Bash refresh Maul. Kinda strange, but was a solid buff. The block might be too long, I'd prefer it to be 1s shorter and have the cd be a little shorter. The 2nd knockback on GS is obviously a bug and needs a fix. But with CD nerfs all across it, damage nerfs, the removal of crippling throw, it has actually no chase potential on it's own you can actually just W key away from someone with GS and they cant hit you (unless they use superspeed) and its required to be traited to be playable now. GS has always been a good weapon. Hence why I have always used it. But it has been nerfed a few times recently. Although GS 4 is now easier to use It was arguably better before with crippling throw (although the evade was the strongest addition - also necessary given it roots you in place). The CDs also just got a long increase GS block went from 15s to 25s, swoop increased, etc. We also lost the evade frames on autos. Its really a shell of its former self. For the people complaining about GS and also other stuff on ranger. The balance of ranger revolves around WS being too busted.... just like every other complained about Ranger spec ever. Its 1 traitline that gives you access to two great low CD stunbreaks, sustain, and condi clear (the only way to get competitive condi clear, mind you). This allows for ranger to double down on dps lines and still maintain kill potential on things. I think we mostly see GS being used not because it's so strong but because sword was changed and is now too clunky to be good anymore. It provides too many opportunities during pre and after casts on the evades to find much success. And those are the only options for ranger. Sword or greatsword. You cant go double ranged weapons. And dagger main hand has no defense on it. But like this hate for GS seems very strangely placed.

I've been writing this when I'm able to. I can't even believe people are feeling that pets are OP. It's just absolutely bizarre considering how weak in reality they are. If those pets are nerfed, literally the only pet we have is smoke which aside from its utility - hits almost like a wet noodle now. At the same time I don't want to continue to be locked into one pet only. So 4k auto attacks from AI are perfectly fine while the actual player can do whatever they want? Cool. Been fine for years now Funny how "Pet damage" is the only thinkg rangers have going for them anymore now and suddenly it's "OP" Almost as if this is all part of petty personal grudges and not based on balance at all Almost as if everything else in the game got nerfed but this AI, which you cannot possibly outplay, did not get touched much if at all.0 counterplay?https://www.twitch.tv/videos/591371955?t=03h28m49shttps://www.twitch.tv/videos/591371955?t=03h32m05s Guess not.

I think it's because you get it for free, kind of. You take an offensive/utility weapon and get a strong defensive skill. Let's compare ~~ defensive~~ capabilities of all GS in the game in no particular order:Fixed* 1) Warrior greatswordEvade+Mobility++Damage ++ 2) Ranger greatswordEvade+Mobility+Block+Damage +CC +3) Necromancer greatswordBlind ++Damage ++Pull + 4) Guardian greatswordMobility+Damage ++Pull +Blind + 5) Mesmer greatswordKnockback+Damage ++Ranged +Unblockable/un-projectile-hate-able ++ Fixed it for you.

Nobody tell this guy that rev hammer is ranged. He would probably freak out. It's almost as if... different classes all have their own defensive and offensive options!?!

"This matchup is impossible when he runs smokescale because you can't kill it, and I'm getting gaped." I'd be interested to see how it would play out with a good ranger and a good pet selection xd Smokescale should never be the first pet you kill. Between the smoke assault, smoke cloud, and blasted stealth from marksmanship, the window to kill that pet is very small. However, let's say that the ranger is running Smokescale + Gazelle. After the ranger swaps to Gazelle, avoid charge and head toss and you'll have about 12 seconds to kill it. After Gazelle dies, the next pet swap gives you 48 seconds to kill the Smokescale which is more than sufficient.Who is even bothering trying to kill Smokescale and Gazelle? Ranger is worthless without dps pets.

"This matchup is impossible when he runs smokescale because you can't kill it, and I'm getting gaped." I'd be interested to see how it would play out with a good ranger and a good pet selection xd Am good ranger. I run double birds. It can be close, and it's a long fight vs necro. You gotta micro manage the pets like a madman and run away from the lich when they use it to kill your pets. But fuck up just a little. Pet dies. Then you lose. Part of the problem is pets are even squishier now since the only thing keeping them alive is the healing skill which all had their CDs increased. Pets should really get a buff.

It used to be better.

Just because something is in a dps traitline doesn't mean it shouldn't be nerfed #RIPSoulbeast, #RIPpets

What does R55 mean? Also how about Noscoc's Team Dark USA? Isn't Noscoc's team the previous world champions? Given that you cant specialization stack in MOTA and that Toker is on the team and Grim isn't, Helio will side node on whatever is most busted. And Toker will thief. Just like every other monthly when they dont have subs.

Then that's on you misplaying cause menders guard can kill it lol. Also, you arent supposed to be killing smokescale or gazelle. You only need to kill the pets that do decent damage, the birds and the tiger. Everything else is ignorable.

It's not that people are making things up or lying, it's that they aren't able to identify the difference between Ranger build archetypes. Then other forum users call them out on it in the wrong ways, usually aggressively. And that doesn't help for making productive discussion. The biggest problem that creates misinformation and volatile arguments is that non-ranger mains experience all of these build structures in game:Core Rangers with Knight's/ResistanceCore Rangers with Demolisher or Berserker/EagleSoulbeasts with Berserker/Eagle and Sic Em with One Wolf PackAll of which are using a multitude of variations between Marks/Wild/Beast - Marks/Beast/Soul - Wild/Beast/Soul And then because most non-ranger mains are not acutely aware of the differences in build structures they are facing from ranger to ranger they encounter, they just remember these moments that stand out to them, like when they get hit by a 10k Maul or an 8k Tiger Pounce or when a Ranger kites around and doesn't die during heavy focus or when a Barrage/Rapid Fire lands 20k+ damage.. After awhile, all of these encounters add up into a very generalized subjective experience opinion that: "Rangers are dealing a lot of damage and have a lot of sustain all of the time." Players then come into the forum with a plethora of stories that recall how invulnerable Rangers are and how everything they do lands a 10k strike. This queues the ranger mains to show up and defend their class because the way the majority of the community is presenting this feedback, makes it look like ranger in general is outputting this enormously superior amount of both DPS and Sustain over other classes. But the reality is that not all ranger builds are spitting out massive DPS and not all ranger builds are nigh-invulnerable, and that the very separate and individual builds being played that are responsible for this conundrum of a point of view, are in truth barely hanging onto the cusp of viability at all. In my own words, here is pretty much where things stand: If Core Ranger pets are nerfed too much and I mean even if they lose somewhere between 10% and 15% of their current damage output, they'll lose all viability. The only thing Core Ranger has is kill burst threat. If the pets lose too much damage, opponents will be able to stay on node with the ranger and confidently sustain/reset cycle through the damage. Core Rangers already lose brawls to condi based builds, but if they begin being forced off nodes from even power based builds, even if the opponent can't kill the ranger, that's where Core Ranger becomes unviable, when it can no longer hold a node. And that will happen very fast if pet nerfs go deep and Core Ranger loses kill burst threat. Soulbeast is already comparatively bad next to Core Ranger right now. The Maul/Wi nerfs, as well as Beastmastery stat bonus nerfs, alongside of no pet swap while in combat, was a very heavy blow to Soulbeast. It isn't often that Soulbeast is even advantageous to run over Core Ranger in a match with the way things are currently. If anything else gets nerfed that effects Soulbeast, the class is going to lose all viability. I do mean all viability. And then we have Druid, which is a discussion for a different time & a different place. Druid is already F tier bad and for the love of god, does not need to endure pet nerfing upon the pet nerf that it has already received. Arenanet needs to be careful here with it's decision making. There are currently 3 power side noders that are arguably better than core ranger. too. All of which don't have a mechanic that automatically loses them the fight if it dies. And what's really messed up imo. Is that core ranger, in my mind, is 100% getting nerfed, while the meta hasn't fully settled yet. There are builds that can oppress ranger 1v1 and that are just starting to come out in the meta. So ranger is gonna get nerfed... while the oppressive builds won't simply because 1. core ranger came out first and 2. people are starting to l2p and kill the pets.