Sir Vincent III.1286

from the wiki that I linked earlier. "The Thief, Burglar, Scoundrel, or Rogue is a character class in many role-playing games, including Dungeons & Dragons, Final Fantasy, World of Warcraft and many MMORPGs. Thieves are usually stealthy and dexterous characters able to disarm traps, pick locks, spy on foes, and perform backstabs from hiding. " a good chunk of the gaming community, and not just GW2, agrees with Redline and my definition of thief...they are rogues. lol.. they are the same thing The Final Fantasy Thief is very different from GW2 Thief. Just as the WoW Rogue is very different from GW2 Thief. Sure they has skills in common but there are many thing that makes them very different. Example:Rogues will use their charm and talk their way to swindle or steal, while the Thief will rather not be seen while stealing. If you don't understand that simple difference, then the problem is on you. Lucky for us the game isn't based around your "lore".Luck for ArenaNet for designing their Thief outside the norm and not just another Rogue archetype by giving them the ability to use Shadow Magic. That's called creativity.

from the wiki that I linked earlier. "The Thief, Burglar, Scoundrel, or Rogue is a character class in many role-playing games, including Dungeons & Dragons, Final Fantasy, World of Warcraft and many MMORPGs. Thieves are usually stealthy and dexterous characters able to disarm traps, pick locks, spy on foes, and perform backstabs from hiding. " a good chunk of the gaming community, and not just GW2, agrees with Redline and my definition of thief...they are rogues. lol.. they are the same thing The Final Fantasy Thief is very different from GW2 Thief. Just as the WoW Rogue is very different from GW2 Thief. Sure they has skills in common but there are many thing that makes them very different. Example:Rogues will use their charm and talk their way to swindle or steal, while the Thief will rather not be seen while stealing. If you don't understand that simple difference, then the problem is on you.

nah, GW2 pretty much went with standard thief/rogue definition in this game when they created the class Not even close. Daredevil is a Rogue class having physical skills. Just because I have the skill to speak Spanish, doesn't make me Spanish. Yes, Thieves has skills of Rogues, but that doesn't make them Rogues. You're confused and dishonest. If you review my post, I never said that the source of stealth is exclusive to Shadow Magic. Rather I said, Engineer uses tools (e.g. gyro) to go in stealth, Ranger uses camo, Mesmer uses Illusion Magic, and Thief uses Shadow magic. Further proof that you really do have reading comprehension problem. Wrong. No matter how many times you try, the fact is, Mesmer uses Chaos magic and Thief uses Shadow magic. That is the fact. You're not only being dishonest about my position, you're also being dishonest about the Thief and the Mesmer. Well, that is so freaking obvious. No one is making a parallel of the two profession. That is your failed attempt to misrepresent my position again. Yet again you're confused. Compare thief to a thief? What? Of course they will be similar, they are both thief. There is more to being support that just healing and protection. Example: Having a friend hold your target in place so you can punch the target unhindered is a very good support skill. No different that the Thief immobilizing the target so that your team can spike the target is an effective support skill that is often overlooked. Where does it say what type of magic each class uses exclusively? You are making up rules to suit your claims. The only person here that is dishonest is you. So, your idea of support thief is just another type of +1ing....lmao. The mesmers "steal", they use stealth. The use trickery and illusions. They are arcane. They are duelists. They are magic thieves, and originally "magic" thieves. Even the description of the mesmer and their skills are closer to what you conjured up on page one then GW2 thief is lmao. Accoriding to this description https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/professions/mesmer/ "Mesmers are magical duelists who wield deception as a weapon. Using powerful illusions, clones, and phantasmal magic to ensure that their enemies can’t believe their own eyes, mesmers tip the balance of every fight in their favor." hmmm....that's not chaos magic....hmmmmmmWhat do you think the Chaos trait line is? lol The key trait that shows the source of the Mesmer's stealth is the GM Chaos trait called Prismatic Understanding - "Increased stealth duration from mesmer skills. Gain random boons while you are in stealth. " So much for your understanding of what the Mesmer is. Again, your argument is moot. Moving through the shadows.Vanish into thin air. Other professions like the Engineer requires a gyro to vanish into thin air, yet the Thief uses nothing. That is Shadow Magic. Shadow Gust has revealed the type of magic that the Thief uses; "Knock away nearby foes with a burst of shadow magic..." There is no denying that fact which includes the fact that "Deadeye is a Thief". Denying that fact is utter dishonesty.

Yup, not even close since 55 monk don't even need items.

nah, GW2 pretty much went with standard thief/rogue definition in this game when they created the class Not even close. Daredevil is a Rogue class having physical skills. Just because I have the skill to speak Spanish, doesn't make me Spanish. Yes, Thieves has skills of Rogues, but that doesn't make them Rogues. You're confused and dishonest. If you review my post, I never said that the source of stealth is exclusive to Shadow Magic. Rather I said, Engineer uses tools (e.g. gyro) to go in stealth, Ranger uses camo, Mesmer uses Illusion Magic, and Thief uses Shadow magic. Further proof that you really do have reading comprehension problem. Wrong. No matter how many times you try, the fact is, Mesmer uses Chaos magic and Thief uses Shadow magic. That is the fact. You're not only being dishonest about my position, you're also being dishonest about the Thief and the Mesmer. Well, that is so freaking obvious. No one is making a parallel of the two profession. That is your failed attempt to misrepresent my position again. Yet again you're confused. Compare thief to a thief? What? Of course they will be similar, they are both thief. There is more to being support that just healing and protection. Example: Having a friend hold your target in place so you can punch the target unhindered is a very good support skill. No different that the Thief immobilizing the target so that your team can spike the target is an effective support skill that is often overlooked.

Anyone who argues that Thief is like a Rogue does not fully understand how Guild Wars really works. The best tank in GW1 is a 55 monk. The best healer in GW1 is debatable between the Monk and the Elementalist. The best elemental caster is the uninterruptible Fast Casting Mesmers. Assassins that uses a sword and a shield and never equip a weapon skill instead casting spells. So on and so fort. This is the identity of Guild Wars and redefining it to look like any other MMO makes GW lose its identity. The Thief is not a Rogue, it never was. Thief specializes in stealing, not brawling, sniping, or assassinating. The sooner that the Thief gets back into focusing in stealing, the better.

Just because you failed to conceive Thieves in support role doesn't necessarily means it cannot happen. Warriors, wearing heavy armor, with daggers are dumb, yet we get a Spellbreaker. In GW2, a heavy armored class Guardian can cast magic spells as easy as a light armored class Elementalist. The armor each profession wears has no bearings in their capability of casting spells. So making an argument based on class difference is moot. In GW1, Assassins are using Shadow Magic offensively from the Deadly Arts tree (e.g. hexes), while Shadow Arts is Shadow Magic for defense. Dancing Daggers are spells in GW1 and seeing that Dancing Daggers applies Torment in GW2 shows that it is still a spell. Torment is an effect that is easily applied by magic users and very limited, almost non-existent, to physical professions like Warrior and Engineer. If the Thief is not allowed to use magic, giving them access to Torment doesn't make any sense. What makes logical sense is that Thief infuses their daggers with Shadow Magic which allows them to apply poison using Lotus Strike without the need to apply Venoms. In the same way they are infusing their daggers with Shadow Magic that allowed them to go in stealth after using Cloak and Dagger. Shadow Strike, aptly named, is a Shadow Magic attack that allows the Thief to apply Torment and at the same time Shadow Step away. There are so many evidence that proves that Thief uses Shadow Magic and Shadow Gust is another proof that the Thief can specialize in using it. Denying the overwhelming evidence is what you call dishonest.

The existence of these skills and traits proves you wrong;Shadow Refuge, Merciful Ambush, Venom Aura, Shadow Protector, Thrill of a Crime, and Bountiful Theft. Mesmer does not use Shadow Magic. Implying that Mesmer is a Shadow Mage is absurd. The only professions that have access to Shadow Magic are Assassins and Thieves. There you go again. Rangers are adventurers who also employs Nature Magic, just as the Thief is an adventurer who employs Shadow Magic through Shadow Arts. Necromancer's and Mesmer's magic are not built around Arcane arts.The only Scholar that has access to arcane arts is Elementalist, thus the Arcane trait line. The Guardian is not a Scholar, yet they have access to magic."As the rest of our professions began taking shape around the Guardian, she started becoming more magical, and we brought in some elements from the protection Monk and Paragon from the first game. The current Guardian feels very magical in nature...To me, the Guardian feels a lot like playing a caster who wears heavy armor. " - Eric Flannum (Jan 2011) You don't have to be a scholar to use magic. Ranger uses Nature Magic, thus the Nature Magic trait line. They don't just use tools and skills. The Ranger just keeps debunking your argument. I'm now adding the Guardian for good measures. Let's quote you again;"The whole magical and/or support ideas are HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen. for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar" You don't even comprehend your own post. Druids are Adventurers who use magic very similar to Scholars. Astral Force is the Force of Nature and is a specialized form of Nature Magic. Just as the Daredevil is a specialized form of Acrobatics. To command Nature, the Druid has to be magically attuned to it. The Druid was introduced in HoT by giving the Ranger the ability to magically attune to the jungle. "Attune to the LandTrudging with heroic determination into the wild lands of the Maguuma jungle, the druid comprehends that the beauty of the wilderness conceals great danger. As they gain greater experience in Mordremoth’s domain, from the sprawling depths to the soaring canopy, they’ll be able to enhance their celestial form, glyphs, and staff skills to better take the battle to the heart of the jungle." - Meet the Druid: Ranger’s Elite Specialization (Sept 2015) If the Rangers do not know Nature Magic, they will never be Druids.

Druid says hi and disagrees with you. @Crab Fear.1624 said: Scholar . Even if they were to make another support mid-line role, it would fall onto rangers or engineers without a doubt. No he doesn't. Owned Sorry but that shows that he proved himself wrong in the same post. Saying "HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen" then referring to the Druid is self-ownage - no need to point that out, but thanks for highlighting it. no. you are wrong.the context was that it is highly unlikely a thief will get a support role.you said druid says hi as if I didn't acknowledge that there could be mid-line support, but I did. It will be engi or ranger. so, you are wrong. OWNED. and own it, don't try to twist the narrative. No. You are arguing that it is "HIGHLY UNLIKELY" for a magical Thief because they are adventurer, not scholar. Then in the same post you use Ranger, who is an adventurer, not scholar, who has the Druid Elite spec as a support role highly using magic. That is what you call self-owned. I don't need to argue against your points since you're doing an spectacular job. Proving yourself wrong in the same post is simply epic. Chronomancer says hi and disagrees with you. Shadow Refuge, Merciful Ambush, Venom Aura, Shadow Protector, Thrill of a Crime, and Bountiful Theft also says hi and they all disagree with you. you have poor reading comprehension or your are just straight up ignoring words and context. i said if they make midline support it will be what? place answer here__ i said read "core" descriptions you are wrong bro. https://guildwars2.com/en/the-game/professions/thief/ read that, find the word ally, allies, or others you got owned. LOL. now you just straight up dropping words out of my quotes to make it feel like you are right. read some more books, not just memes. your comprehension needs some work It seems you don't even read what you post. You said;"The whole magical and/or support ideas are HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen. for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar" Then you contradict yourself in the same post;"Even if they were to make another support mid-line role, it would fall onto rangers or engineers without a doubt." Guess what? Both Ranger and Engineers are Adventurers. That is called kicking your own as...behind. I'm simply pointing out that it is NOT HIGHLY UNLIKELY since Druid exists. If anyone is having a hard time reading, it's you. You don't even comprehend your own post. highly unlikely =/= impossible and so I acknowledged it, and i also pointed out which classes will get that option if it were to occur. Also is astral force magic? is star wars force magic? also we are in the thief forums, the context was in regards to thief. I also amended that before you responded here: You see? But, it should have been obvious that it was in context to thief because we are in the thief forums, in a thief thread discussing the next thief elite. I didn't say it's highly unlikely that druid exists. I said it's highly unlikely that support and magical ideas are going to happen (and again in context of the thief). I pointed out the descriptions of the classes, the profession types, and their respective roles to further demonstrate how unlikely it is for thief to get that role. Also, I pointed out why their core specs would not lend so well to the ideas of support. A magical thief / shadow mage already exist in game. You see, you are the one that has bad reading comprehension. We are not in the all professions forums, we are in thief forums. That's the context. You misunderstood, and it is confusing to me how you do not see that. The words are saved in quotes.... Spin. spin. You said:"The whole magical and/or support ideas are HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen. for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar" Now you're spinning it to:"I didn't say it's highly unlikely that druid exists. I said it's highly unlikely that support and magical ideas are going to happen (and again in context of the thief)." Tsk tsk. Unless you retract this statement;"for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar" You are self-owning yourself. This is the statement that still contradicts with your new spin. Nice try though. Here's a bit of Guild Wars history, a Paragon is a Warrior with a backline support abilities and a Dervish is Warrior with a frontline support abilities. If they can be support, a Thief has a very high chance of being one. EDIT: typo Why are you leaving how the second part? "Even if they were to make another support mid-line role, it would fall onto rangers or engineers without a doubt.That statement further proof that Adverturers can be support which further contradicts your initial statement. That statement is not your saving grace. Mesmers do not use Shadow Magic. They use Chaos Magic. Shadow Magic is exclusive to Assassins and Thieves through Shadow Arts. I don't have to do anything. Everyone can read for themselves how you owned yourself by making contradicting statements. That does not agree with your statement; "for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar" If that is true, then neither Ranger nor Engineer can be support. The existence of the Druid proves that your claim is false. You're trying to argue that Thief cannot be support because Adventurer is different from Scholar. Then stating that Ranger, which is an Adventurer, can become a support fully contradicts your argument against the Thief. You can't have it both ways. Either Adventurer can be support or not. If not, then you're wrong since Druid exists. If Adventurer can be support, then you should welcome the idea of a Thief Elite Specialization, Shadow Mage or Arcane Thief, as support. That would be best since you only keep digging a deeper hole for yourself.

Druid says hi and disagrees with you. @Crab Fear.1624 said: Scholar . Even if they were to make another support mid-line role, it would fall onto rangers or engineers without a doubt. No he doesn't. Owned Sorry but that shows that he proved himself wrong in the same post. Saying "HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen" then referring to the Druid is self-ownage - no need to point that out, but thanks for highlighting it. no. you are wrong.the context was that it is highly unlikely a thief will get a support role.you said druid says hi as if I didn't acknowledge that there could be mid-line support, but I did. It will be engi or ranger. so, you are wrong. OWNED. and own it, don't try to twist the narrative. No. You are arguing that it is "HIGHLY UNLIKELY" for a magical Thief because they are adventurer, not scholar. Then in the same post you use Ranger, who is an adventurer, not scholar, who has the Druid Elite spec as a support role highly using magic. That is what you call self-owned. I don't need to argue against your points since you're doing an spectacular job. Proving yourself wrong in the same post is simply epic. Chronomancer says hi and disagrees with you. Shadow Refuge, Merciful Ambush, Venom Aura, Shadow Protector, Thrill of a Crime, and Bountiful Theft also says hi and they all disagree with you. you have poor reading comprehension or your are just straight up ignoring words and context. i said if they make midline support it will be what? place answer here__ i said read "core" descriptions you are wrong bro. https://guildwars2.com/en/the-game/professions/thief/ read that, find the word ally, allies, or others you got owned. LOL. now you just straight up dropping words out of my quotes to make it feel like you are right. read some more books, not just memes. your comprehension needs some work It seems you don't even read what you post. You said;"The whole magical and/or support ideas are HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen. for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar" Then you contradict yourself in the same post;"Even if they were to make another support mid-line role, it would fall onto rangers or engineers without a doubt." Guess what? Both Ranger and Engineers are Adventurers. That is called kicking your own as...behind. I'm simply pointing out that it is NOT HIGHLY UNLIKELY since Druid exists. If anyone is having a hard time reading, it's you. You don't even comprehend your own post. highly unlikely =/= impossible and so I acknowledged it, and i also pointed out which classes will get that option if it were to occur. Also is astral force magic? is star wars force magic? also we are in the thief forums, the context was in regards to thief. I also amended that before you responded here: You see? But, it should have been obvious that it was in context to thief because we are in the thief forums, in a thief thread discussing the next thief elite. I didn't say it's highly unlikely that druid exists. I said it's highly unlikely that support and magical ideas are going to happen (and again in context of the thief). I pointed out the descriptions of the classes, the profession types, and their respective roles to further demonstrate how unlikely it is for thief to get that role. Also, I pointed out why their core specs would not lend so well to the ideas of support. A magical thief / shadow mage already exist in game. You see, you are the one that has bad reading comprehension. We are not in the all professions forums, we are in thief forums. That's the context. You misunderstood, and it is confusing to me how you do not see that. The words are saved in quotes....Spin. spin. You said:"The whole magical and/or support ideas are HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen. for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar" Now you're spinning it to:"I didn't say it's highly unlikely that druid exists. I said it's highly unlikely that support and magical ideas are going to happen (and again in context of the thief)." Tsk tsk. Unless you retract this statement;"for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar" You are self-owning yourself. This is the statement that still contradicts with your new spin. Nice try though. Here's a bit of Guild Wars history, a Paragon is a Warrior with a backline support abilities and a Dervish is Warrior with a frontline support abilities. If they can be support, a Thief has a very high chance of being one. EDIT: typo

I quit i will not aruge with you further more. It is pointless => OYou will constantly say that thieves have magic and i will constatnly prove to you they dontAnd as i said multiple times Deception is not magic. If you decieve someone you dont use magic you use skill and tricks.I am done with this BS. No more responses to you. You have proven nothing. And Deception is magic and you have not disproved that fact seeing that Mirage has access to it. Trickery is trickery and stealth is not associated with that trait line despite the fact that you have been trying to make it so. Both stealth and shadowstep are Shadow Arts, an art of using Shadow Magic. The undeniable fact remains true is that the Thief has been using Shadow Magic adopted from the Cathan Assassin's Shadow Arts which is a gift from the Human Goddess Lyssa. Those are the facts, yours are just speculations trying to change the narrative.

Druid says hi and disagrees with you. @Crab Fear.1624 said: Scholar . Even if they were to make another support mid-line role, it would fall onto rangers or engineers without a doubt. No he doesn't. Owned Sorry but that shows that he proved himself wrong in the same post. Saying "HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen" then referring to the Druid is self-ownage - no need to point that out, but thanks for highlighting it. no. you are wrong.the context was that it is highly unlikely a thief will get a support role.you said druid says hi as if I didn't acknowledge that there could be mid-line support, but I did. It will be engi or ranger. so, you are wrong. OWNED. and own it, don't try to twist the narrative. No. You are arguing that it is "HIGHLY UNLIKELY" for a magical Thief because they are adventurer, not scholar. Then in the same post you use Ranger, who is an adventurer, not scholar, who has the Druid Elite spec as a support role highly using magic. That is what you call self-owned. I don't need to argue against your points since you're doing an spectacular job. Proving yourself wrong in the same post is simply epic. Chronomancer says hi and disagrees with you. Shadow Refuge, Merciful Ambush, Venom Aura, Shadow Protector, Thrill of a Crime, and Bountiful Theft also says hi and they all disagree with you. you have poor reading comprehension or your are just straight up ignoring words and context. i said if they make midline support it will be what? place answer here__ i said read "core" descriptions you are wrong bro. https://guildwars2.com/en/the-game/professions/thief/ read that, find the word ally, allies, or others you got owned. LOL. now you just straight up dropping words out of my quotes to make it feel like you are right. read some more books, not just memes. your comprehension needs some workIt seems you don't even read what you post. You said;"The whole magical and/or support ideas are HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen. for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar" Then you contradict yourself in the same post;"Even if they were to make another support mid-line role, it would fall onto rangers or engineers without a doubt." Guess what? Both Ranger and Engineers are Adventurers. That is called kicking your own as...behind. I'm simply pointing out that it is NOT HIGHLY UNLIKELY since Druid exists. If anyone is having a hard time reading, it's you. You don't even comprehend your own post.

Druid says hi and disagrees with you. @Crab Fear.1624 said: Scholar . Even if they were to make another support mid-line role, it would fall onto rangers or engineers without a doubt. No he doesn't. Owned Sorry but that shows that he proved himself wrong in the same post. Saying "HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen" then referring to the Druid is self-ownage - no need to point that out, but thanks for highlighting it. no. you are wrong.the context was that it is highly unlikely a thief will get a support role.you said druid says hi as if I didn't acknowledge that there could be mid-line support, but I did. It will be engi or ranger. so, you are wrong. OWNED. and own it, don't try to twist the narrative.No. You are arguing that it is "HIGHLY UNLIKELY" for a magical Thief because they are adventurer, not scholar. Then in the same post you use Ranger, who is an adventurer, not scholar, who has the Druid Elite spec as a support role highly using magic. That is what you call self-owned. I don't need to argue against your points since you're doing an spectacular job. Proving yourself wrong in the same post is simply epic. Chronomancer says hi and disagrees with you. Shadow Refuge, Merciful Ambush, Venom Aura, Shadow Protector, Thrill of a Crime, and Bountiful Theft also says hi and they all disagree with you.

You know what. I am stopping this after i explain this to you. Because you will simply list all the stealth traits thief and when i rationally explain it to you you will simply disagree cuz you want to have magician thief. Shado magic is not a game mechanic. Shadow magic is a theme. Game mechanics are ways how the game allows you to acomplish your goal. = You can walk so you are able to get from point A to point B.Game mechanics are sort of a line you can or have to walk so you've achieved your goal. A theme on the other hand. Is the in game explanation of the game mechanics which is either set with the backstory or lore of the world.It has nothing to do with mechanics. It is only a sticker which tells you = the character moves forward, Yea he walks. The character is invisible. Yea he is in stealth. In lore of GW2 thieves were never mages. Only espec for thief that mentions shadow magic (a theme) is Deadeye. And as i said before. You already got your magical thief themed espec = Deadeye. The Thief or Daredevil on the other hand NEVER had nothing to do with magic. They were acrobattic, sneaky, deceptive, tricksters.I am not going to explain every single trait Thief has to you go to Wiki and read it word by word so you can figure it out. A theme of a Thief is not a mage. A theme of a Thief is THE THIEF. Thank you for your attention lecture is over. As long as Thief has access to Shadow Arts, regardless of the Elite spec, they have access to Shadow Magic. A Daredevil leaping through smoke field is using Shadow Magic to go in stealth. A Daredevil who spec for Shadow Art is using Shadow Magic for defense. Shadow Arts is a core spec of the Thief so saying that both Thief and Daredevil had nothing to do with magic is highly inaccurate. Keep in mind that an Elite Specialization is a specialization, it does not invalidate the core specialization other than another Eilte spec. Meaning a Thief that specialize in physical skills doesn't necessarily mean they no longer have access to Shadow Magic. You still failed to make a case where Engineer needs a gadget to go in stealth while Thief does not. You have yet to debunk that the only stealth access of Thief is through Shadow Magic. Nothing in Trickery nor in Acrobatic that allows for stealth because Thief's Stealth is not a parlor trick, a camo, or a light distortion device, it is real magic in the world of GW2. You are yet to explain why Dust Strike and Signet of Shadows doesn't apply stealth. And why Shadow Refuge applies stealth without blindness. The first profession that used Shadow Arts was the Assassins from Cantha and their patron goddess is Lyssa, who has magic in both deception and illusion. This is why Mirage has access to Deception just as Thief has access to Deception. They share the same magic that was granted by the goddess Lyssa to Tyria. You are also confused what a game mechanic is. A game mechanic is a set of rules. These rules consists of differentiating between a gadget generated stealth vs. a magic generated stealth. The game mechanic requires an Engineer to use their gyro to go in stealth, while the game mechanic does not require the Thief to have any tools to go in stealth. Thief is allowed to go in stealth just by trying to revive a fallen ally -- why? Because Thief is using the game mechanics the rules magic. Weapons are treated like a magical focus and the Thief can channel Shadow Magic to their dagger when using Cloak and Dagger to go in stealth after the dagger attack. CnD does not blind the target nor the Thief uses a gadget, so how does the game mechanic allows the Thief to go in stealth? One answer, magic. EDIT: typos

Druid says hi and disagrees with you. @Crab Fear.1624 said: Scholar . Even if they were to make another support mid-line role, it would fall onto rangers or engineers without a doubt. No he doesn't. OwnedSorry but that shows that he proved himself wrong in the same post. Saying "HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen" then referring to the Druid is self-ownage - no need to point that out, but thanks for highlighting it.

Ahhh. I dont really know how many times i have to quote this. ''Stealth, also known as cloaking or invisibility, is an effect which allows the stealthed character to be invisible to enemy players and avoid being detected by hostile NPCs. '' It literally says it is a game mechanic. It is in the game because we lack abbilities such as climbing, crouching, hiding, ETC. That is why we can go in Stealth so the game keeps having realistic features altho they are not possible in game. Just because you throw yourself in stealth after you use blinding power it doesnt mean you are under a spellThe Stealth is there to imitate the Blindness you applied to your foe when you threw the dust in his eyes. He could not see you. That is why you are in Stealth. So he couldn't see you. Blindness is the side effect condition that helps to enhance the immersion so he wouldnt hit you for sure. Throw feathers same thing they just have it more diverse so you dont throw only dust at everyone.As far as your Merciful Ambush goes. It is again just a mechanic. Thief could relocate you if we have the abbility. You could hide in near bush or behind a tree or under a slope or rocks or whatever. That is why you have those 2 secs of stealth. Also not to mention if a thief is really sneaky character you wouldnt prolly see him as he approaches the downed player so you dont excpect him to try and revive. Again imitation of real life circumstances.No magic here.It is all just there so it feels a bit real altho it cant be all in the game. Cuz data size, cuz it costs a lot and cuz it would take AGES to make and debug.I am not gonna deal with mesmer skill those are mages they might go invisible = magic. But thief is never invisible they are only either runing around you while you are blinded by their trick. Or they are hiding in some bush or whatever. But since game cant provide this they gave us stealth so we still have the abbility even tho we dont have it. Then explain why Dust Strike and Signet of Shadows doesn't apply stealth. In addition, explain why Shadow Refuge applies stealth without blindness. Shadow Magic is the game mechanic.

Thief uses deception to go in stealth not magic. = They are deception skills. Shadow Arts — focuses on stealth and blinding enemies. Enhances venom and deception skills. Engineer uses tools and gadget for deception (e.g. stealth gyro).Ranger uses natural surrounding for deception (e.g camouflage). When Ranger taps into using magic, they use Druidic Celestial Magic for stealth (e.g. Celestial Shadow).Thief neither need tool, gadgets, or natural surroundings for deception, they have Shadow Magic. Blinding Powder does two things, it blinds and grants stealth. The blinding is caused by the physical powder but the stealth is Shadow Magic. This is no different than the Thief throwing feathers (Throw Feathers) at someone's face; the feather causes blind and Shadow Magic is used to go in stealth. Cloaking and invisibility is physically impossible without magic. Otherwise, a cloaking thief is no different than Naruto trying to blend to a fence with a piece of cloth or Frodo pretending to be a rock. That is not how stealth works in GW2 since it is plainly obvious that it is magic. Deception is the result of using Shadow Magic no different that it is a result of using Illusion Magic. If deception not magic then explain Merciful Ambush (Thief) and Mirage Advance (Mesmer). Take your time. I can wait. @mindcircus.1506 said: I would love to see some kind of shadow mage group buffer and mass debuffer. Something not damage focussed but maybe providing group invisiblity, alacrity and might. Maybe spamming blinds and fumbles on mobs.Maybe group evades? A reliable quickness bot? We have had enough DPS specs for thief. Something supportive that lends to the class fantasy could be really fun.For weapons? Offhand sword could be good...torch would be interesting...maybe even axes. Daredevil and Deadeye are great fun, but I would love to see something support oriented that synergized with some of the core traits and gave us some fun buildcraft ideas. The profession needs a bit more variety The whole magical and/or support ideas are HIGHLY UNLIKELY to happen. for one thing, an Adventurer is different in this game from a Scholar .Druid says hi and disagrees with you.

Thief uses deception to go in stealth not magic. = They are deception skills. Shadow Arts — focuses on stealth and blinding enemies. Enhances venom and deception skills. Engineer uses tools and gadget for deception (e.g. stealth gyro).Ranger uses natural surrounding for deception (e.g camouflage). When Ranger taps into using magic, they use Druidic Celestial Magic for stealth (e.g. Celestial Shadow).Thief neither need tool, gadgets, or natural surroundings for deception, they have Shadow Magic. Blinding Powder does two things, it blinds and grants stealth. The blinding is caused by the physical powder but the stealth is Shadow Magic. This is no different than the Thief throwing feathers (Throw Feathers) at someone's face; the feather causes blind and Shadow Magic is used to go in stealth. Cloaking and invisibility is physically impossible without magic. Otherwise, a cloaking thief is no different than Naruto trying to blend to a fence with a piece of cloth or Frodo pretending to be a rock. That is not how stealth works in GW2 since it is plainly obvious that it is magic. Deception is the result of using Shadow Magic no different that it is a result of using Illusion Magic. If deception not magic then explain Merciful Ambush (Thief) and Mirage Advance (Mesmer). Take your time. I can wait.

Congratulations. You did it. You proved that Deadeye is a magician thief. So since you already got your arcane magical thief. Let us this time have normal elite spec with no magic so we can go back to the Thief theme. A GW2 Thief without magic is either an Engineer or a Ranger. Thief is a Thief because of Shadow Magic. Edit for clarification:Engineer uses gadget to go in stealth.Ranger uses camouflage to go in stealthThief uses Shadow Magic to go in stealth.

Exactly as you said.DEADEYE USES MAGIC A wild event appears. Find a word thief in sentences above.Reminder:"The Deadeye is a thief who stalks their targets with patience and brutal accuracy. They use a Rifle to snipe ..."— Official site

The idea that your weapon skills will consist of defensive skills swapping to offensive skills sounds great to me. Sounds perfect with a greatsword too.

also since you like to quote here is some qoutes of my own Shadow arts = Shadow Arts is a core specialization for the thief that focuses on survival, defensive abilities, and stealth. focuses on stealth and blinding enemies. Enhances venom and deception skills.Stealth = Stealth, also known as cloaking or invisibility, is an effect which allows the stealthed character to be invisible to enemy players and avoid being detected by hostile NPCs. (absolutely nothing about magic here it is there to provide for the hiding on the map)Daredevil =Training in the path of the Daredevil does not come easily, but those who dare are rewarded with the reserves that will help them endure as they enter the jungle. Specializing as a daredevil will allow you to wield a staff as a melee weapon and utilize hand-to-hand combat styles with the physical skill category. Additionally, you’ll gain access to a third endurance bar and be able to greatly modify the effects of your dodge ability. Thief =Experts at stealth and surprise, thieves can move through the shadows, vanish into thin air, or steal items from their opponents and use them as weapons. Thieves practice an agile, acrobatic fighting style, which can make them very hard to hit. Again nothing about magic just beacuse thye can vanish into thin air it doesnt mean they are magicians they can simply throw a dust in ur face and hide somewhere that is what stealth is for to substitute for the lack of enviroment or movement abilites such as climbing crouchin sneaking slow walking ETC. Shadowstepping = Shadowstepping is a mechanic that allows the user to move instantly from one place to another. all coming from GW2wiki. g'day to ya"Stealth, also known as cloaking or invisibility" - how? Magic!"thieves can move through the shadows" - how? Magic!"vanish into thin air" - how? Magic!"Shadowstepping is a mechanic that allows the user to move instantly" - how? Magic! Case is closed and you just proved it. So then you agree that ArenaNet can create a new Elite Spec for the Thief that is an Arcane Thief or a Shadow Mage. Good to know.

You and I have very different understanding of a Theif. Where i come from Thieves are brutes and they dont even hide they will simply gank you up beat the kitten outta you and steal your stuff. In this game it is more subtle but anyway card tricks and sleight of hands has nothing to do with any sort of magic. those are pure tricks thus trickery skill line shadow arts are only adaptation of a hide and seek a combat surroundings would provide for lurker. We dont have bushes we dont have shady corners on maps we cant climb we cant hide the way a thief could irl so we are having stealth which provides for this lurking and hiding in shadows/bushes/surrounding objects. since it is MMO they gave it slight spice of being magical but thieves 10/10 are not mages or magicians or anything. game mechanics require some ability of hiding thus stealth because we cant do it in real enviroment where we fight.You claim that they are not magician. I prove to you that they are magician in a sense of performing magic tricks. I also prove to you that their access to Shadow Arts gives them access to Shadow Magic. Stealth, shadowstep, boon strip, et.c are magical skills. If you look at the description of Shadow Gust this is what it says; "Knock away nearby foes with a burst of shadow magic..." Case close.

PLEASE STOP WITH THIEF BEING MAGICIANIT IS NOT MAGICIAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The most common petty thieves are street "magicians" using sleight of hands and misdirection. So instead of parlor "magic" trickery, the Thief profession has access to real magic, shadow magic, that they can use for thievery. Magician or not, Shadow Arts is shadow magic. while i agree the issue i have is that when ppl request a shadow mage spec for thief they usually mean shooting shadow orbs or some nonsense which detracts from the whole subtle street magician vibe current shadow magic has and turns it into a generic spell casterMy post never made such suggestion. The complaint was based solely on the name, not the content of my post.

PLEASE STOP WITH THIEF BEING MAGICIANIT IS NOT MAGICIAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The most common petty thieves are street "magicians" using sleight of hands and misdirection. So instead of parlor "magic" trickery, the Thief profession has access to real magic, shadow magic, that they can use for thievery. Magician or not, Shadow Arts is shadow magic.