Convinced my friend to buy this, sorely dissapointed

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

5 hours ago, Sicktanick.4369 said:

Was not aware of that, but unfortunately I do not think "spend everything you earned from 1 - 80 and 60 days of dailies to play the first part of the story" is a huge selling point.

 

I guess I am just very confused and lost as to how it makes sense to paywall the story when we are already paying for the game...seems like a different way to run a sub service essentially.

Because its not a paywall, you can buy them with in-game gold, and most players will have that gold by the time they reach the necessary level if they play the game (explore etc.) instead of powering through the story.

 

It only hurts players who want to get it done, right now.

 

To put this into perspective, a Living World bundle costs as low as 960 gems, currently ~269g, Which in turn costs only an amount of gold that most lv80 experienced players make in a few days worth of farming. In comparison, a single Legendary item costs up to 3-4k gold to craft and massive time investments (world completion, etc.).

 

 

The Living World seasons cost less than a single BiS item, combined.

[Linken.6345]

1 hour ago, Loules.8601 said:

As I know you can complete almost all LW story with person who own it (In his party). 
Yep, you wouldn't gain bonuses from it - but you can complete story with other people. 

Only works on season 2 since maps are free to use for any account.

[nosleepdemon.1368]

Yep living world being a hidden expense to new players is unbelievably bad. It doesn't matter that you can buy gems with gold, the exchange rate is atrocious. Besides, nobody wants to unlock a story any other game would give as part of the most recent paid expansion with all the gold they have earned plus more. It's idiotic. People defending LW cost really aren't approaching things from the perspective of a new player who just dropped money on an expansion.

[nosleepdemon.1368]

12 minutes ago, Hannelore.8153 said:

Because its not a paywall, you can buy them with in-game gold, and most players will have that gold by the time they reach the necessary level if they play the game (explore etc.) instead of powering through the story.

 

It only hurts players who want to get it done, right now.

 

To put this into perspective, a Living World bundle costs as low as 960 gems, currently ~269g, Which in turn costs only an amount of gold that most lv80 experienced players make in a few days worth of farming. In comparison, a single Legendary item costs up to 3-4k gold to craft and massive time investments (world completion, etc.).

 

 

The Living World seasons cost less than a single BiS item, combined.

 

This, this right here is the insanity I'm talking about. You really think a new 80 is going to be farming even 20g a day? That's completely unrealistic. Long term players are very, very bad at seeing things from the perspective of a new player who just hit 80. Even the prospect of having to farm for money to buy story content at 80 is crazy. Imagine you just paid for PoF as a new player and realised that all the story inbetween that other games give for free is hidden away in a paid cash shop? It scarcely matters that GW2 has no sub - a new player isn't going to see it that way. They're going to think "well that's dodgy" and nope the heck outa here.

[Ultramex.1506]

18 minutes ago, nosleepdemon.1368 said:

Yep living world being a hidden expense to new players is unbelievably bad. It doesn't matter that you can buy gems with gold, the exchange rate is atrocious. Besides, nobody wants to unlock a story any other game would give as part of the most recent paid expansion with all the gold they have earned plus more. It's idiotic. People defending LW cost really aren't approaching things from the perspective of a new player who just dropped money on an expansion.

Least you can buy them without paying actual money, ESO on the other hand....
Also i joinedthe game late but still managed to bought LW 2 using my gold and that was when exchange rate shoot up

Anet should have been clearer on the purchase page but their options r fair
Edit: also what other game would give? I only know ESO which is close to GW2 in living world story update

Edited September 15, 2021 by Ultramex.1506

[Touchme.1097]

18 hours ago, Sicktanick.4369 said:

I have not played since fractals were introduced, and I fondly remember so many things about the game. I convinced my friend to buy all the stuff up to the new expansion and am severely disappointed with the living world. It seems for him JUST to play what is essentially the story of the game he has to spend upwards of 60+ dollars. With that and the base games he is spending 100+ dollars on the game...needless to say he bailed immediately and got a refund for the purchase approved.

 

Is there something I am missing that makes this more reasonable? Very sad to see that returning players/new players are punished so severely.

If your friend wanted to play FF14 for one year it would cost him14.99 dollars a month or 179.88 dollars a year.

If your friend wanted to play NW it would cost him 40 dollars for the standard edition compared to PoF+HoT+Standard Gw2 game which is periodically on offer at 50% discount, and you also have to take into account that you will have to pay for NW expansions in the future and the game has less content than GW2 being new.

It looks to me that your friend had no reasons to think that paying for GW2 was a bad deal, because if he bought the Ultimate edition of PoF using the 4000 gems to get his living world season content and preordering the standard edition of EoD he would have spent much less than the other competitors in the market. He missed a chance to join millions of players and buying a product with a huge amount of content to play. His loss.

 

You don't have to feel regrets for your friend, it was his choice, not yours.

Edited September 15, 2021 by Touchme.1097
Editing grammar

[Sicktanick.4369]

I definitely think people are missing my friends point, having not played the game at all, and even if you count it from the latest expansion the game being 4 years old, its base price of the game is not a bad deal at all for what you get. I would also agree that it may be one of the best price point for content you can get from games these days.

 

That being said, finding out that to really play the game to its core, you are paying well over that price. Almost 100 dollars worth (with the sale its less, without it its more). Unless you want to spend everything you have, and then some at 80 to transfer to gems just to have a taste of the living story. Is in fact, very punishing to new people.

 

No game that is 4 years old should cost an upwards of 100 dollars. It would be very easy and reasonable to show up front the actual price you will pay for the game. I would gladly spend, say 80 dollars in a bundle, then spend 40 get hype, and find out I need to spend another 60 down the line.

 

Imagine your favorite game, its refreshing, different, a good time...you are enjoying it...then boom you go to load in to the next area and it asks you for your CC and to pay 15.99 to access this level. You are enjoying it and you are willing to spend the money sure, but that initial reaction is a kitten feeling and I think we can all agree on that.

[Infusion.7149]

The core game is actually free now. You're paying for expansions and DLC (LS2/LS3/LS4/IBS aka LS5).

You gave your friend terrible purchase advice, that's all. They could have tried the core game and decided if the gameplay was worth it.

[Balsa.3951]

In general if ppl invite friend they should be a patron and make the start easy as possible. 

that's just my opinion but GW2 is so much content for peanuts 

 

[Randulf.7614]

4 hours ago, Sicktanick.4369 said:

I definitely think people are missing my friends point, having not played the game at all, and even if you count it from the latest expansion the game being 4 years old, its base price of the game is not a bad deal at all for what you get. I would also agree that it may be one of the best price point for content you can get from games these days.

 

That being said, finding out that to really play the game to its core, you are paying well over that price. Almost 100 dollars worth (with the sale its less, without it its more). Unless you want to spend everything you have, and then some at 80 to transfer to gems just to have a taste of the living story. Is in fact, very punishing to new people.

 

No game that is 4 years old should cost an upwards of 100 dollars. It would be very easy and reasonable to show up front the actual price you will pay for the game. I would gladly spend, say 80 dollars in a bundle, then spend 40 get hype, and find out I need to spend another 60 down the line.

 

Imagine your favorite game, its refreshing, different, a good time...you are enjoying it...then boom you go to load in to the next area and it asks you for your CC and to pay 15.99 to access this level. You are enjoying it and you are willing to spend the money sure, but that initial reaction is a kitten feeling and I think we can all agree on that.

Out of curiosity, what is the cost for a complete set of content in WoW, FF14 or ESO? 

[kharmin.7683]

6 minutes ago, Randulf.7614 said:

Out of curiosity, what is the cost for a complete set of content in WoW, FF14 or ESO? 

Including 9 years of sub fees, too.

[Vilin.8056]

2 minutes ago, kharmin.7683 said:

Including 9 years of sub fees, too.

These players OP mentioned do not play for 9 years, and don't intend to.

Edited September 15, 2021 by Vilin.8056

[Randulf.7614]

1 minute ago, kharmin.7683 said:

Including 9 years of sub fees, too.

Im less concerned about the sub fees, more the upfront cost of buying all the content for those games for a new player and whether it exceeds $100 in direct comparison

[Fuchslein.8639]

Anet should just finaly put an paket on the Site for the seasons and more information to the xpack's.

To all the people saying, just buy it for gold ... yeah ... sure. Nice gaming, just playing to gather enough gold to unlock the next story ...
Gw2 is great for that you have gold-gem. But as a new player I find this a very big task. Especially because you would have to sell everything you find, which is not always the smartest idea.
And for everyone writing here, the ~300g per season doesn't seem like much, but put yourself in the shoes of a new player who might need other things too ^^.

[kharmin.7683]

12 minutes ago, Randulf.7614 said:

Im less concerned about the sub fees, more the upfront cost of buying all the content for those games for a new player and whether it exceeds $100 in direct comparison

However, I think that it should be held in account.  GW2 has released content for free over that span.  How much would that same content have cost if it included a monthly fee?

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

Why do new players need to rush through the game?

Why don't they take the several/few/couple of months to play though each release as intended? 

 

If they did, acquiring enough Gold to purchase a Chapter would not be such an issue.  Or, if need be, buying the one Chapter is only $2.50.  Play it for a couple/few months and save up Gold for the next Chapter.  Rinse/repeat. 

 

(Of course, Seasons are even cheaper when purchased as a bundle.) And, there is no need to purchase all Seasons at once, especially right now when some parts/whole Seasons are given at no cost. 

 

Also, in the Gem Store, without discounts, purchasing all 4 Living World Seasons is 4,160 Gems...a bit over $50.00.  (Would be less right now - 2,720, so about $30.00? - with the free Chapters/Seasons).  I'm not sure where the OP gets the $100.00 lament. 

Edited September 15, 2021 by Inculpatus cedo.9234

[Gehenna.3625]

8 hours ago, Hannelore.8153 said:

Because its not a paywall, you can buy them with in-game gold, and most players will have that gold by the time they reach the necessary level if they play the game (explore etc.) instead of powering through the story.

I don't think it's a strange or unreasonable assumption to make that when you buy a game and its expansions that you're done and you have all the content. And you're not aware of this extra content when you buy the game because they're not mentioned.

 

All the things that people come up with as counter-arguments are technically true but only make sense if you've played the game for a while and are used to it. New players or returning players from before LS2 do not know about this nor do they know about the "solutions" or mitigating factors. So they are confronted with hidden costs and that just leaves a bad taste in their mouths. I can't blame them for that. 

Edited September 15, 2021 by Gehenna.3625

[Dante.1763]

39 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

I don't think it's a strange or unreasonable assumption to make that when you buy a game and its expansions that you're done and you have all the content. And you're not aware of this extra content when you buy the game because they're not mentioned.

 

All the things that people come up with as counter-arguments are technically true but only make sense if you've played the game for a while and are used to it. New players or returning players from before LS2 do not know about this nor do they know about the "solutions" or mitigating factors. So they are confronted with hidden costs and that just leaves a bad taste in their mouths. I can't blame them for that. 

Even being aware of it, itz turned a few friends of mine off from trying it. They have no issues paying for the expansions, but they way they see it the living world seasons are part of the expansion and should come unlocked with it. I cant really argue with that. Each one aside from IBS is tied to an expansion.

[Fuchslein.8639]

15 minutes ago, Dante.1763 said:

Even being aware of it, itz turned a few friends of mine off from trying it. They have no issues paying for the expansions, but they way they see it the living world seasons are part of the expansion and should come unlocked with it. I cant really argue with that. Each one aside from IBS is tied to an expansion.

Yep. For 2 friends i wanted to introduce to gw2 its the hidden part. Its nowwhat clear to new players that you need to buy story-parts extra. They knew only from me, that they don't get the full package, even when they invest in the higher Tier's.

 

---

 

As I said, of course you can earn everything ingame blah blah. But as a new player, at least those who are bothered by it, don't want to put all their earned gold into more story-parts first. Because who needs a month to get through a season?  Sure, maybe the achievment hunters, but even that is done on the side.
The HOT and POF expansions may take a month to get the important mounts and masteries, but core Tyria, lvl a character to lvl 80 and play the story until the first season you have to buy, really only takes a month if you barely play or don't play at all.

But for players who want to play the story first or even only come for the story(at first), I can imagine what a disillusionment that is.

I mean, few people probably expect Anet to give it out for free.Just a clearer communication so that you don't find out about it through detours.
And yes, you can google anything, but if you don't even know that this question exists, how are you supposed to google it?

[Vayne.8563]

I get pretty tired of threads like these. Don't tell your friends to buy the living story right away,. because they don't need it right away. Let them play the game and see if they like it. Each Season of the Living story is what? One month of WoW or FFXIV?  One "optional" month of SWTOR or ESO.

For a game that's not pay to win, and a game that doesn't charge a monthly fee or even optional monthly fee, this game is one of the cheapest AAA MMO on the market.  If you play WoW for a year, you're getting the game for $50, maybe a bit less, and then $165 for the privilege of paying for a year.  Here you're playing less than a year of WoW for all the content that's come out since launch. How is that a rip off?  

 

Sure it's a big initial investment, because you're buying something all at once, that you don't need all at once.  Not to mention logging in now gives you some of that stuff for free.

Not to mention I've never paid a cent for any living world epsiode, because I play the game. I don't know how much more generous the game can get.

[nosleepdemon.1368]

6 hours ago, Sicktanick.4369 said:

I definitely think people are missing my friends point, having not played the game at all, and even if you count it from the latest expansion the game being 4 years old, its base price of the game is not a bad deal at all for what you get. I would also agree that it may be one of the best price point for content you can get from games these days.

 

That being said, finding out that to really play the game to its core, you are paying well over that price. Almost 100 dollars worth (with the sale its less, without it its more). Unless you want to spend everything you have, and then some at 80 to transfer to gems just to have a taste of the living story. Is in fact, very punishing to new people.

 

No game that is 4 years old should cost an upwards of 100 dollars. It would be very easy and reasonable to show up front the actual price you will pay for the game. I would gladly spend, say 80 dollars in a bundle, then spend 40 get hype, and find out I need to spend another 60 down the line.

 

Imagine your favorite game, its refreshing, different, a good time...you are enjoying it...then boom you go to load in to the next area and it asks you for your CC and to pay 15.99 to access this level. You are enjoying it and you are willing to spend the money sure, but that initial reaction is a kitten feeling and I think we can all agree on that.

I'm afraid most people don't see your point, because seeing passed one's own experiences (often the tip of one's nose) is difficult for the average person. I completely understand where you are coming from, and it's why I don't invite my friends to play. People argue that "hurr the price is less than {other super expensive MMO}" but that is entirely missing the point. It's not the price, it's the expectation, and when what you expect is not what you get that creates a dissonance.

[Vayne.8563]

14 minutes ago, nosleepdemon.1368 said:

I'm afraid most people don't see your point, because seeing passed one's own experiences (often the tip of one's nose) is difficult for the average person. I completely understand where you are coming from, and it's why I don't invite my friends to play. People argue that "hurr the price is less than {other super expensive MMO}" but that is entirely missing the point. It's not the price, it's the expectation, and when what you expect is not what you get that creates a dissonance.

That's why when I invite my friends to the game I explain to them what they get and how much they'll eventually have to spend before they do anything.  Because when my friends buy the game, the expectations they have are set by my knowledge. They obviously don't know anything.

If I say to my friends, everything that's out since launch, contentwise costs about $100 but you don't need it all right away, and it's many many years of content, it's like getting four or five games, they get it.  It's not really that hard to understand if you explain it first.

[TheQuickFox.3826]

All previous Living World episodes should be included in the expansions that are linked to it by now:

 

Core game should come with LW season 1 and 2.

Heart of Thorns should come with LW season 3

Path of Fire should come with LW season 4 and IBS

 

The everything bundle should come with everything. New players don't understand why it isn't in and get frustrated. The expansion shop page also does not warn players that they will be missing the living world chapter when they buy the expansions.

[The Tempestest of Tempests.1308]

Brand new player here - started in early August. Every week, I receive a letter in my in-game mail telling me about the LW season and episode that is available for me to play. I haven't purchased anything in LW seasons 3 or 4, but have S3 episodes 5 and 6 open to me, as well as S4 episodes 1-4. I also have a message on my screen that tells me LW S4 episode 5 will begin in 6 days.

 

I have the base game, as well as the HoT and PoF expansions.

 

I'm not sure if these LW seasons are only available to me for a short time, but I thought I'd let you know. Hope you and your friend are enjoying the game. My husband and I are really having a good time.  🙂

[Randulf.7614]

1 hour ago, The Tempestest of Tempests.1308 said:

Brand new player here - started in early August. Every week, I receive a letter in my in-game mail telling me about the LW season and episode that is available for me to play. I haven't purchased anything in LW seasons 3 or 4, but have S3 episodes 5 and 6 open to me, as well as S4 episodes 1-4. I also have a message on my screen that tells me LW S4 episode 5 will begin in 6 days.

 

I have the base game, as well as the HoT and PoF expansions.

 

I'm not sure if these LW seasons are only available to me for a short time, but I thought I'd let you know. Hope you and your friend are enjoying the game. My husband and I are really having a good time.  🙂

Seasons (except the deleted season 1) are permanent content, but they’ve been offering each episode in turn free for one week. That’s what they are emailing about