Catalyst Feedback Thread

[Flori.2194]

7 hours ago, usernameisapain.7163 said:

It would however be comforting if we could get a statement that they were working on the class... 

I guess I can speak for most of the ele mains, myself included, when I say that we all want some kind of statement. I mean at least that they acknowledge the feedback and try to listen to the player base. Looking through this feedback thread and another thread where you could rate the Catathing it's blatantly obvious that over 3/4 of ele mains are either lukewarm, disappointed or straight up sad/mad about this elite spec. So something like "Ele mains, we heard you, we are working really hard on the Arcanist- I mean Catalyst, don't worry" would be really nice.

 

But I guess we can only dream...

[Aedil.1296]

Even more disappointed with Catalyst after seeing Specter and Mecha 🙄. 

The Specter idea is revolutionary, and the Mecha is just so super cool. 

Why can't we have something special on Ele as well for once? 

[usernameisapain.7163]

2 hours ago, Aedil.1296 said:

Even more disappointed with Catalyst after seeing Specter and Mecha 🙄. 

The Specter idea is revolutionary, and the Mecha is just so super cool. 

Why can't we have something special on Ele as well for once? 

 

I think Scepter Assassin(I mean Thief) and Bunny Thumper were not so original since they existed in the meta of OG GW, probably one of the devs mained both and put some love into those classes because of it. Technically the summon golem existed in GW, but in a very limited way.

Elementalist on one hand is the closest that we get to classic guildwars insofar as versatility, even more so with weaver. However back then we only had a select amount of skill slots, but since they could be chosen from two classes we could optimise our build and have widely varied builds even within the same attunement. 

I think a good e-spec for ele would have been to go this path. The e-spec would only have access to one or two attunement bar(s) and weapons, but they could mix and match it however they liked.

 

3 hours ago, Flori.2194 said:

I guess I can speak for most of the ele mains, myself included, when I say that we all want some kind of statement. I mean at least that they acknowledge the feedback and try to listen to the player base. Looking through this feedback thread and another thread where you could rate the Catathing it's blatantly obvious that over 3/4 of ele mains are either lukewarm, disappointed or straight up sad/mad about this elite spec. So something like "Ele mains, we heard you, we are working really hard on the Arcanist- I mean Catalyst, don't worry" would be really nice.

 

But I guess we can only dream...

Fully agree with this statement, there is absolutely no shame for a company to realise that what they released was subpar, and that it needs reworking. It can do a lot to quell the concerns of the community...

[Artyport.2084]

My fix for catalyst 

 

move the spirits to the utilities have them release and apply the boons in the area. Like ranger spirits 
 

turn the elemental ball into the profession mechanic  letting them use energy 

 

apply augments to the hammer where they are missing skills. 
 

make the elite go to the trash 

Edited October 25, 2021 by Artyport.2084

[Kain Francois.4328]

I mentioned this before, but I really want to see Catalyst act more as a sustain-y bruiser with a focus on combo fields, rather than trying to do everything as once. The trailer promises "A steady presence on the battlefield". I want that.

[Avatara.1042]

Yes.  No idea how the Catalyst is supposed to survive on the frontline.

[Kain Francois.4328]

13 hours ago, Avatara.1042 said:

Yes.  No idea how the Catalyst is supposed to survive on the frontline.

To be fair, if you're talking about frontlines, then you're intended to use Water Hammer, which has a lot of self-healing.

The problem is two-fold:

1. Elementalist has the lowest base HP and Armor
2. Catalyst lacks the damage reduction of Tempest, and the Barrier+Vitality bonuses of Weaver.

All Catalyst has is ONE optional trait which boosts damage reduction every time we receive and Aura, but on Hammer that is rarely the case. You also get the celestial bonus from the minor traitline, but it doesn't make a big enough difference.

Where is my "steady presence on the battlefield"?

Edited October 26, 2021 by Kain Francois.4328

[Tabootrinket.2631]

Looking at the Specter in the beta, and I've got to say...
from an ele perspective this is disgusting.

Catalyst's "elite" skill is a mere reduction of the cooldown to a decent amount, meanwhile, a mere utility from the Specter brings ALL the F'ing boons, combo field (albeit just dark field but still), alacrity on first tick and all those other perks coming from the spec itself.

As an ele this is unacceptable. Ele's utilities are a spit in the face, and the elite unique is vomit.

Now I'm on my way to the thief section to cry of joy as a thief that finally won't get kicked out on sight in PvE group contents
 

Edited October 26, 2021 by Tabootrinket.2631

[Dadnir.5038]

47 minutes ago, Tabootrinket.2631 said:

Now I'm on my way to the thief section to cry of joy as a thief that finally won't get kicked out on sight in PvE group contents

You should probably take a wait and see approach on that, so far what the specter bring on the table for PvE group content isn't really great. I had some expectation base on what would be GW2 common sense by only reading the specter's skill description but after looking at the skills as a whole the specter seem to defy common sense and that's not great for him in PvE.

 

Catalyst is a spec with an extremly lazy design, it's hard not to be infuriated when comparing it to the work and attention that's been put on some other e-specs. Thus I do understand your frustration but, still, keep in mind that a single target support isn't going to be very popular in group content (for duo roaming in WvW or as a +1 in sPvP maybe, but in PvE, I doubt it).

[Tabootrinket.2631]

1 hour ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

You should probably take a wait and see approach on that, so far what the specter bring on the table for PvE group content isn't really great. I had some expectation base on what would be GW2 common sense by only reading the specter's skill description but after looking at the skills as a whole the specter seem to defy common sense and that's not great for him in PvE.

 

Catalyst is a spec with an extremly lazy design, it's hard not to be infuriated when comparing it to the work and attention that's been put on some other e-specs. Thus I do understand your frustration but, still, keep in mind that a single target support isn't going to be very popular in group content (for duo roaming in WvW or as a +1 in sPvP maybe, but in PvE, I doubt it).

You may be right about it.
However from what I've seen (not much), they seem to provide barrier and alacrity to a whole group (and half a raid group), whenever they pop their utility.
I don't think Specter will be the main source of healing, but they may come in clutch whenever one ally is close to death and everyone is on cool down (the scepter auto is quite fast). They also have an AoE burst healing that scales with shadow force (I think) if you trait for it.

I'm curious how they may fair with a bladesworn in the group. If the two elites work the way Anet envisioned it, there could be some interesting play where Bladesworn charge their full power slash while the Specters try to keep them alive.
Anyway, at least there seems to be something. We'll see whether or not it will stick the landing or not.

Edited October 26, 2021 by Tabootrinket.2631

[Rodril.1385]

Here to just express my total frustration... If same devs were able to do Specter and Mechanist, why Catalyst even exist? Makes it lamest and most uninspired spec out of 9, in my opinion.

[MasterDeere.3417]

catalyst need aura but have no way to get aura via combo when using the hammer. This is fail!

 

[McZero.5318]

1. Everyone wanted a long range weapon, I do too, but I can tolerate the hammer.

 

2. The Jade Sphere is HORRIBLE to use. It has absolutely no feeling when you use it (overloads feel powerful) and forces you to stay in one area which is crippling. There's absolutely nothing enjoyable about it to me whatsoever.

 

3. The augments forcing you to stand in a particular area and in a particular element and during a particular window (sphere is up) makes them useless for PvP. 

 

4. For me the absolute worst part:

  

1 hour ago, McZero.5318 said:

I also find it extremely annoying that my magical character that can summon a STORM OF LIGHTNING using his own power needs a piece of ENGINEER TECH to use his abilities.

 

I'm an Elementalist. When I want to mess around with holograms and junk I play my Engineer.

 

I absolutely detest using this off-theme piece of mechanical trash to use my own magic.

I can summon an ACTUAL PHOENIX MADE OF FIRE with the scepter, yet you want me to use a piece of technojunk to project a fake picture of a dancing water horse?

 

Make it an orb of special magic, not a piece of technology.

[cmdrpengu.3012]

Admittedly I'm a primarily mediocre PvE player here. The F5 is by far what ruined it for me. Besides all the previously stated game play issues, it's just not interesting at all. I thought the Hammer 3 mechanic was much more interesting. I feel like from a fun perspective, baking the Hammer 3 into the attunement swaps (maybe with an internal CD?), reducing it's radius to hit melee targets, and making the F5 be what sends the orbs flying at your target would be more interesting. Maybe a trait that lets it apply boons to the ele (and others in range?) based on what you have circling for as long as you can keep them going.

[Valrynn.1702]

Heya! I don't post much and this is kind of a late post regarding the Catalyst, but I do play Ele a ton. And overall I think the Catalyst has an amazing theme and pretty interesting mechanics. I actually enjoyed the hammer game play. With the time I played with it during the beta event I did throw together some feedback. I'm sure some of these might be repetition from previous posts, but hopefully it will be helpful regardless.

 

Mechanics:

• The Jade Sphere felt like it should have a longer countdown to disappear. Even swapping attunements quickly it still felt like you couldn't keep it around long enough. You really had a to swap quickly to keep it around longer. As the main mechanic of the Catalyst, we need to be able to take advantage of the sphere and it's capabilities. Which seems mainly to supply a combo field.

• To that note, it felt like the Jade Sphere should have been doing something else. I know it has a thing it does in each attunement, like tic damage in Fire attunement, but it felt like there could've been some other kind of action that could've happened with the Sphere. Perhaps a finishing blast either when it dissipates or when you cancel the sphere manually. Something along those lines would give the sphere more of a personality and presence and also strengthen the connection with the Elementalist(player) and the elemental spirits the sphere channels.

• The elemental spirits themselves just kind of stand there, in the middle of the aoe. Summoning these things, I feel, could be more grandiose. And this could probably fit in the Visual section as well but. The spirits you're summoning I feel, could either be larger, or have more of an entrance when you deploy the sphere or swap attunements. The Fire elemental could toss fireballs out around the aoe, in wind maybe the spirit could tether lightning all around the aoe. In earth the turtle could rumble the earth. Something that gives these spirits a connection and presence. 

 

Weapon:

• The #3 skill also felt like it was a little disjointed from the sphere. I enjoyed the mechanic of #3, but I felt again, it didn't last long, and swapping attunements needed to happen so quickly, which didn't seem to synergize well with the deployed sphere. This could also be something where when you shoot off the orbs you create with #3 they interact with the sphere itself and cause a reaction in the sphere aoe itself. Maybe a blast finisher from the sphere when you shoot off the orbs.

• To me it felt like the hammer could've benefited from more combo finishers in its skill set. I believe it has 1 finisher per attunement. 3 Blast and 1 Leap. It would've felt much nicer to have at least 2 per attunement there were a couple that could've easily been whirl finishers or Projectile finishers. Would've added nice variety, options, and lended itself nicely to the sphere aoe. It would make the hammer synergize better, in my opinion, with the Catalyst class that it is there for.

• Also, to me with this class, the hammer felt too split between ranged, and bruiser. I think having ranged skills that benefit from being ranged removes you from utilizing the sphere mechanic.

 

Visually:

The sphere itself:

• I think it would be fitting to have the Sphere floating around you at all times. It is the core mechanic of Catalyst, and it would be nice to see it floating with you as you run around. This would also lend itself well for when you activate the Sphere. it's there hovering above you and then BABOOM, you activate it and a flash of elemental goodness happens and now it hovers around the aoe field it just summoned. Once the aoe field dissipates, it returns to you. This again, gives the class and the mechanic more of a presence, I feel.

 

The spirits associated with the Sphere.

• The spirits look great, however, I also feel like they could be given more of a center stage visually. Summoning and channeling these spirits through the Jade Sphere, should be a powerful experience, and I feel they're entrance and presence throughout could be enhanced to make them more imposing.

 

 

That's just my two cents. I really did enjoy the heck out of the Catalyst, but that doesn't mean it couldn't use more love. Which is why I know you're making these beta's available to us all. I hope this feedback is helpful.

 

Thanks to ALL the teams for all your hard work and for making an amazing MMO experience.

[Phyrak.7260]

After playing through the specs for beta characters; 

The Catalyst felt like it should be the camping spec for ele (a pipe dream/bias of mine...) with the energy mechanic, stat boosting and natural fields - things would ordinarily be lacking if you didn't dance in and out of elements.

The issue then becomes making camping one element viable within its confines and allowing growth to occur - hammer in water does this well by putting out damage and healing/condi-cleanse.

Applying that mindset to the other elements would further cement that nature of the elite spec.

As for stats - the natural increase over time, sided with a focus/expansion of what the element does naturally would further improve how the spec plays into the trait lines.

The question becomes thus; what about on attunement swap traits? 

Having them trigger on the Jade sphere using or upon combo-ing within the sphere itself may be a solution to the problem.

I do have an issue with the aura focus due to nature of the hammer itself and how the energy gain/field mechanic feels antithetical to the playstyle that the catalyst feels like it should fall into. Though, that's just me and I certainly think many others would disagree.

Per element;

Water gains damage 

Air should gain healing/cleanse 

Earth should gain crowd control

Fire should gain healing

Again; open for debate - just looking for ways to fill out the elements to make them play smoothly in the way I perceive the spec and it's potential.

An offensive water focused ele could play very different to a defensive healer minded fire ele or tank break bar focused earth ele - further expanding the roster of play and fulfilling another notch in the fantasy style, not to mention the callback to the classical elementalist play of the first Guild Wars.

[Sarm.5923]

I didn't actually try out Catalyst's beta when it was available (neither hammers or the supposed magitech theme vibe with me) but I have a question about a couple of the mechanics for those who did, from reading the wiki on their abilities.

How does Elemental Empowerment work? It looks like a slow ramp-up maintenance buff that will end up falling off if you spend too long out of combat. Between that and energy decay, the impression I get from reading the spec is that you'd want to run around and try to chain enemies together to minimize your out-of-combat time, which sounds absolutely miserable and stressful. Is my impression correct? It reminds me of trying to incorporate those Diablo 3 temporary power orbs, but I never liked those either.

And if I'm right, doesn't that clash with the design of the jade sphere fields being stationary? It sounds like a mechanic that can only shine (and thus be balanced around) stationary boss fights, because it looks like building up the resource punishes you for not having a go-go-go mentality with enemies, only to then turret up at full power when those same enemies are already worn down (if they don't move away) so you won't even get a solid benefit out of using them. But trying to save it for another pull risks buff decay.

Am I looking at it fairly?

[Hawk.6372]

I wanted to try all the beta's before posting. I really enjoyed all of them. I did feel, though that the cata felt unfinished. I like the concept elites loose or alter something from the base class and gain something new. I saw this with the eight other classes, but not with the cata. It gains a field drop, but doesn't loose anything, and so to counter this the jade sphere seems watered down. Even during the arena's preview the reviewer kept pointing out that the sphere provides small amount of damage or boons. I think to make it worth you have to take something away. Maybe like the reverent, the cata looses a element but gains a more powerful sphere. So out of battle you choose which three elements to use along with the jade sphere, which either lasts significantly longer and/or adds more damage/boons. Another note is that it would be nice if the utilities offered an additional effect that changed with the attuned sphere field, instead of only one type of field

[Styx.3278]

Hammer is quite fun, the 3 skill is super cool conceptually but also fairly punishing with the slim margins due to duration vs. cooldowns.
Though the circling projectiles not having an icd that matches its rotation frequency makes its dps extremely volatile/inconsistent which might be hard to balance.

Air 4 looked cool in the trailer but feels pretty bad in game. Having such a large wind up where you’re stationary and locked into the animation kind of negates it’s disengage potential, and if you just want the cc you probably don’t want to be displaced so much. (I feel like other classes would have at least gotten aegis/barrier/stab/prot or *something* during the windup?)

I’m not sure I’m a fan of the extreme synergy with fire traitline and conjurer specifically (for a dps build), I don’t want to be incentivised to use the same utilities (and traits) I’ve used for years.
On that note, augments feel underwhelming and I don’t really like their interaction with the class mechanic. Utilities can usually round out the attunements, e.g. use lightning hammer in earth for damage, or use a defensive cd outside of earth/water. Then of course there’s glyphs which do depend on attunements but have situational uses in all attunements. By contrast the bonus effect on augments (while not essential) is gated behind having f5 active, being inside the field, *and* being in the correct attunements. That feels pretty bad for a utility.
The elite skill also feels lacklustre and seems to want to just force me back into fgs. While yes 8s cdr on all weapon skills is potentially a lot, getting that would actually require having all high impact skills on a 16s+ cd first, then using 8s to apply the cdr, and somehow cycling through all attunements fast enough to make use of it? Maybe I’m too uncreative, but it feels hard to come up with a usecase for it, especially given that hammer 3 and the grandmaster minor trait incentivise cycling through all attunements regularly (not too fast and not too slow but like every 4 seconds). Plus as mentioned above fgs was effectively buffed, so idk.
Also, this is kind of random but the air elemental stun not counting towards vicious empowerment feels really bad. I understand the stun comes from the elemental not the catalyst but it just feels like another strike against any non-fgs elite skills.

Having the jade sphere field stationary, gated behind cd and energy and cast time feels a bit much, especially since that’s the entirety of the class mechanic. I’m not saying it’s unbalanced per se, but it doesn’t particularly *feel* great. Also I personally haven’t tested catalyst in wvw but imagine it would be quite hard to play around such a stationary jade sphere.
Hammer having finishers in every attunement but no fields fits catalyst obviously but it still feels a bit weird, especially since you could of course use other weapons with the spec. But if it has to be either/or I do prefer having a finisher.

Overall I think catalyst is quite strong if played well, but has a really high skill floor (and ceiling probably). Especially because the cooldowns are so tight, that a max dps rotation just barely works with perfect timing and alacrity uptime. I feel like e.g. duration of the hammer 3 could be increased just slightly to make chaining projectiles a little bit more forgiving.

I don’t want this to sound too negative overall. Hammer is pretty great, I love having incentives to use all 4 attunements. The jade sphere animations are extremely beautiful, as are the circling projectiles. And the gameplay is super fast paced (which can be a pro and a con I suppose).

[Savach.7219]

I do not believe that we can expect something more meaningful for him... how

adding a trait to increase inventory, this is the only improvement that I expect for the entire line of elementalists.

it will be more convenient to collect resources and store junk

[Serephen.3420]

On 10/20/2021 at 11:55 PM, Orijah.3750 said:

Let me start this by saying I am relatively new to gw2 and that I have not played the new elite spec yet. I have spent most of my time playing elementalist and was very excited to see what the new expansion would hold for ele. I like so many others, was disappointed with catalyst. I feel like the potential is there for an amazing spec so here are some of my thoughts how the spec may be improved.

 

also, many of these ideas stem from my own personal desire for ele and from what I’ve heard/read about what most people seem to want from the profession. One last note, many people on this thread have far more technical suggestions for catalyst modifications, I am speaking more from a conceptual design of the elite specialisation as I feel like it could do with a bit more love in its foundation rather than the specific implementation of certain mechanics.

hammer:

I like hammer. I was skeptical when I initially heard about the weapon as I would have preferred something that played more into the archetypal mage/caster with long-range, flashy abilities. The more I think about it though the more I realise hammer has exactly that potential. Hammer could be reworked to have large AoE spells, walls of ice, crumbling the ground or projecting a lightning bolt that also places an emphasis on control (not taking too much away from the big spell focus of staff). Hammer has the potential for clear decisive and calculated casting of spells. Currently the hammer appears to be lacklustre with an emphasis on continual rotation of elements to try maximise hammer3. I would like to also move away from the necessity to switch elements just because it has to happen (don’t need weaver 2.0 I guess).

 

While I think it would be amazing to modify hammer, to me it isn’t the most glaring issue. 

 

jade sphere:

Please just remove this. There are plenty of ways this mechanic could be altered to make it feel enjoyable and rewarding but I think elementalist needs more love than a combo field bot. 

 

I don’t know if this has been discussed somewhere in the forums but I feel like the addition of an ‘arcane’ element would open the doors to so many possibilities for ele. The ability to access a new element in a manner similar to druid form mechanics but make the arcane skills still dictated by the weapon type feels so much more elementalist. This could allow some fun versatility by varying your ‘mega’ form with the weapons you choose furthering the options you have as an ele to deal with what is in front of you.

 

I toyed with the idea of having a similar form but with one of he four elements that you can select out of combat but I feel like this steps on the tempest’s toes a little.
 

utilities:

this aspect of the spec I don’t have any knowledge about. I have read one or two aspect that mentioned they felt unrewarding and that there really seems like no reason to take them over existing skills but I unfortunately can’t comment or provide any thoughts on this aspect of the specialisation.

 

 

hopefully some of you find this interesting and hopefully it sparks additional discussions. All I want is a fun elite spec for ele 🙂 I look forward to hearing all your thoughts! 

I actually really like your idea of the arcane element being something you switch into like druid's celestial form. But instead of weapon I would change it to the role it plays depends on the last attunment you were in. Like a switch from earth might give arcane skills that block or cc, a switch from air may be more mobile, water may give various boons etc. Would also mean less for them to come up with. 

 

As for the utilities I would suggest ward skills, which were the elementalist take on wells. Like a mix between ranger spirits and necro wells. There is much more potential for catalyst to have interesting gameplay with that, not to mention it being useful in melee or range.  If they wanted they could use the jade orb animations for those so it's not wasted. 

 

Traits could change what your arcane attunment does. And there could be a line for dealing with your wards too.

 

Come on Anet, thinking about that possibility got me so hyped😂

I guess I can dream right?

[Orijah.3750]

25 minutes ago, Serephen.3420 said:

I actually really like your idea of the arcane element being something you switch into like druid's celestial form. But instead of weapon I would change it to the role it plays depends on the last attunment you were in. Like a switch from earth might give arcane skills that block or cc, a switch from air may be more mobile, water may give various boons etc. Would also mean less for them to come up with. 

 

As for the utilities I would suggest ward skills, which were the elementalist take on wells. Like a mix between ranger spirits and necro wells. There is much more potential for catalyst to have interesting gameplay with that, not to mention it being useful in melee or range.  If they wanted they could use the jade orb animations for those so it's not wasted. 

 

Traits could change what your arcane attunment does. And there could be a line for dealing with your wards too.

 

Come on Anet, thinking about that possibility got me so hyped😂

I guess I can dream right?

 

really cool concept from reddit:

 

[Bakeneko.5826]

1 hour ago, Orijah.3750 said:

 

really cool concept from reddit:

 

Honestly, that should have been elite, way better, hell, adapt it for hammer, and it would be better

[HotDelirium.7984]

On 9/25/2021 at 6:46 PM, bruakumfd.4817 said:

I’m glad that ArenaNet proved us wrong with the hammer since Fire and  Air attunements are ranged. Also, I’m convinced the game swapped my games without my permission since I had to fight a Veteran Oakheart with a staff.

 

I also found the limited range could be a bit annoying, and the healing skill wasn’t strong enough for me. On the plus side, the Jade Spheres are so cool, and it’s easy to build up energy.

To solve the combo finisher imbalance I actually think every autoattack should be a combo finisher projectile and mid range, instead of hoping and praying you have enough time to execute a combo with the other skills.

[Savach.7219]

people you were not mistaken in the game?

or is it really important for you how to grow a tree?

The last few years have clearly shown how the elementalist is visible in this game, proof of this is the epitaph for him from the developers: "We feel that the elementalist is in a very good place since the July 2020 balance update." (https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/game-update-notes-may-11-2021/) Even then, elementalists were an endangered species in the LFG. During the game, we saw that even a thief can become a tank in a raid, distributing a sea of benefits.  any of you can open the LFG and count the elementalists and the groups they belong to. I don't see a place for this class in the group with fb and necromancer, under which the last few fractals were made, and I don't think the new weapon will fix this situation, as well as the fact that this class will have the lowest efficiency in any role .

and now in essence, in order to understand what exactly needs to be changed, you need to decide what niche an elementalist with a hammer can occupy after playing in the open world and decided to master t4 and raid? it's a mystery to me

for those who do not play, this is the case now

Edited November 4, 2021 by Savach.7219