Bladesworn Feedback Thread

[Grand Marshal.4098]

2 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

the problem is people who like it are the new players with clunky gameplay, who can't feel the clunkiness.

are players who play bearbow and stand auto attacking all day long or just minion mancer everything out of their way.

 

all the plat2+ non warrior main pvpers will tell you how garbage and clunky it is to play.

I'm G3-Plat1 (don't rly pvp every season cause it's a clown Fiesta for warrior mains) , so no God of warr (lol) but even I can see the problems... 

Edited September 22, 2021 by Grand Marshal.4098

[Gambit.9501]

7 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

the problem is people who like it are the new players with clunky gameplay, who can't feel the clunkiness.

are players who play bearbow and stand auto attacking all day long or just minion mancer everything out of their way.

 

all the plat2+ non warrior main pvpers will tell you how garbage and clunky it is to play.

i'm not even one of those players and even i can just feel the spite and egotism radiating off of this comment lol

[Gambit.9501]

19 minutes ago, Mesket.5728 said:

 

Warriors are masters of weaponry who rely on speed, strength, toughness, and heavy armor to survive in battle. Adrenaline fuels their offensive power—the longer warriors stay in a fight, the more dangerous they become. Warriors are masters of physical combat skills.

Engineers are technological and alchemical masterminds. They employ turrets, grenades, elixirs, a variety of other impressive devices, and concoctions to overcome their enemies. As an adventurer profession, engineers wear medium armor.

 

 

BS is a warrior with:

 

+magical bullets

+ technological kit

+ greandes and gadgets

- weapons

- adrenaline

slow and stationary

 

this sounds more of an engie spec than a warrior. This spec would add gameplay to an engineer while it reduces it for warriors.

 

 

ok now describe Spellbreaker 🙄

[crewthief.8649]

2 minutes ago, Gambit.9501 said:

i'm not even one of those players and even i can just feel the spite and egotism radiating off of this comment lol

He’s kind of a big deal. 🤣🤣🤣

[Khenzy.9348]

-By far the clunkiest spec in the entire game. Ironic when its mechanic is called flow. It needs a massive pass in overall cooldowns, casts and aftercasts.

 

-You should be able to move during Dragon Trigger. Albeit very very slowly, like with Guardian's Whirling Wrath. The moment you enter it, if you accidentally push a movement key it gets overly punishing and it also significantly adds to the overall clunky feeling. This little change would massively improve the flow of the spec.

 

-Please consider reducing the time it takes to fully charge Dragon Trigger from 5 seconds to 3 seconds in PvP and WvW only. Adjust damage values to compensate, of course (even though the damage formula is completely broken and/or overly nerfed right now in PvP).

 

-You should be able to stow the Gunsaber. This is extremely important in WvW and PvP, period. No stow on Gunsaber makes it borderline unplayable to me.

 

-Flow fills up a little too slow without other Positive Flow stacks or flow increasing traits. This hinders gameplay in quick encounters such as in Open World, Fractals or WvW and significantly reduces build diversity forcing you to equip flow increasing traits or skills. Consider increasing the rate it increases at just one Positive Flow stack.

 

-Reduce the cooldowns on every single Gunsaber skill, even with charges they are outrageous, they were clearly designed with the Elite Skill (Tactical Reload) equipped at all times, which massively reduces build diversity, a clear design mistake. Even then, with the Elite equiped the Gunsaber cooldowns feel way, way too long for a mandatory weapon.

 

Gunsaber skills in specific:

 

-The third attack of the autoattack chain of the Gunsaber is very underpowered. Reduce the cast time from ¾ to ½.

-Blooming Fire should apply vulnerability stacks for every explosion that hits your target. Reduce aftercast.  Reduce its cooldown.

-Artillery Slash should apply a low duration immobilize if it hits a crippled target (yes, even with leg specialist equipped). Reduce its cooldown.

-Cyclone Trigger should block all attacks for 1½ seconds, not just proyectiles, reduce damage to compensate. Reduce its cooldown. For a mandatory weapon, you had a great chance to reduce the need to always use a shield, you missed that chance and added a kitten short duration proyectile block.

-Break Step. Reduce its cooldown. If no blocks on all attacks on the above skill, consider adding evade frames to this one.

 

Increase Tactical Reload cooldown but now also adds short duration Alacrity. Reduce cast time from ½ to ¼.

 

When you have the Bladeworn spec equipped, Move Unsheathe/Sheath Gunsaber (the F1) to the 'Swap Weapon Sets' slot in the UI. It now uses the 'Swap Weapon sets' keybind. You can freely swap to your Gunsaber in and out of combat with your normal weapon swap keybind.

 

You can now swap weapon sets while out of combat only with F2 instead.

 

You can now enter Dragon Trigger with F1 whether you're in Gunsaber or not.

 

Dragon Trigger no longer triggers weapon swap cooldown once you exit the mode.

 

Dragon Trigger skills in specific:

Considering they will be your only burst skills ever as this spec, they need a bit more besides just flat damage.

 

-Dragon Slash Force. Consider adding either cripple or vulnerability stacks.

-Dragon Slash Boost. Consider adding evade frames during the attack animation.

-Dragon Slash Reach. Consider adding a short duration daze.

-Triggerguard.Two suggestions. 1 Aegis is too weak. Add 2 seconds of Resistance alongside Aegis. Or no longer provides Aegis, it's a ¾ duration evade plus a forced detarget (you can add a nice blurry effect to it!).

-Flicker Step. Increased range to 400. Reduced cooldown by 10 seconds (30 secs now). Now has 2 charges. Let both Triggerguard and Flicker Step have the same cooldowns and number of charges.

 

Utility Skills:

 

-Combat Stimulant. Nothing, it's honestly a great skill. The delayed healing may seem too long but the pay off is good. The additional choice to cast it again to gain buffs is great. Good job on this one!

-Dragonspike Mine removes immobilize without the need for Warrior's Sprint trait. We already had this discussion years ago with Ranger's Lightning Reflexes. If there wont be a trait to reduce utility cooldowns, consider reducing the CD to 30 seconds.

-Bulletproof Barrier. It provides way too much poyectile block uptime. This game doesn't need more of it, the opposite, it needs less! Reduce duration from 6 secs to 4 secs.

-Electric Fence.  Decent enough skill in WvW group play, potentially. Not much use otherwise honestly.

-Flow Stabilizer. Most boring an plain utility skill ever. This spec needs all the stability it can get to make use of its static burst mechanic, but I don't know if this particular utility should be the answer.

 

Traits:

Most of them are pretty decent. I'd adjust three of them.

 

Dragonscale Defense (Minor trait). Let it have either 50% uptime or just 100% uptime. You need that protection if you're going to stay stationary. To avoid protection stacking, let it pulse 1s of protection every second with a 5s internal CD.

 

Flame Shell Burst (Master trait). Meh. Burning? Really?

 

Daring Dragon (Grandmaster trait). By far the most fun trait in the spec... BUT you shouldn't exit and reenter Dragon Trigger every time you use a Dragon Slash, you should just stay in Dragon Trigger for as long as you have flow, otherwise it becomes a mess of bar swaping and it gets confusing and clunky really fast as you can (very easily) accidentally cast one of the Gunsaber skills which forces you to exit your Dragon Trigger mode which makes it, again, super clunky and it just sucks big time.

Edited September 22, 2021 by Khenzy.9348

[Gatvin.6510]

17 minutes ago, Mesket.5728 said:

This is something to consider also... most people who likes this spec never liked warrior to begin with. I don't know if this is good or bad, but it is something to consider. On the other hand, most people who have doubts or don't like the class (like myself) have been warrior main since closed beta (at least me).

I see where you're coming from. There's a big engineer vibe to this spec. Mechanically the gunblade moveset is perfectly in line with the warrior class. It has an adrenaline mechanic. Everything the moveset does could be done as standard samurai flavor, just replace the explosions with "wind slashes" or something. You're right about the utilities being off-flavor, but most of them don't effectively replace any of the existing warrior utilities, but they do expand on the options you have. If you want to block projectiles now, you have a skill for that.

 

If your complaint is that there are problems with the base warrior class, and that this fixes none of them, sure, that's valid. I'm not sure that's what they're looking for feedback on here. If it is, they should definitely pay closer attention to what you're saying because you (I assume) know the class quite well.

 

I certainly feel like every expac should spend like 25% of its class design effort on making sure all the previous specs are still functional.

 

This spec is really coherent and a ton of fun to play. If you guys don't want it, I would be quite happy if they just gave it to the engineer.

[Michel.3986]

Healing Skill Combat Stimulant should be allowed to used while channeling dragon trigger without cancelling it, just like flow stabilizer. 

[Valik Shin.9027]

45 minutes ago, Nayaru.4716 said:

Here you go 

 

Thank you gonna have to try and replicate this. Could be what warrior is looking for in raids 

[rdigeri.7935]

It's been said before, but being able to stow gunsaber would improve QoL a lot.

 

Dragon Trigger would be more intuitive and less ping-dependent if it locked you in place instead of canceling itself when you move. Being able to switch to your weapon after a Dragon Trigger would be much better for flow, especially with how high Gunsaber cooldowns are. (Which, honestly, is way too high, the pvp numbers feel way better.)

 

Gunsaber feels quite underwhelming in pve, other than the surprisingly low damage numbers, skill 4 lacks that oomph.

 

The pvp damage of Dragon Trigger is not very rewarding for the risk you take.

 

having a single evade somewhere on the base kit, either on triggerguard instead of aegis or somewhere among the Gunsaber skills, would help this spec a lot. Gunsaber is said to be a flexible weapon but right now it doesn't do most things too well.

 

In PvE, so far it seems like a quite fun, high skill ceiling option that benefits from game knowledge and it offers a quite new playstyle, i would definitely play it if its issues got fixed and it got tuned a bit.

Edited September 22, 2021 by rdigeri.7935

[Michel.3986]

9 minutes ago, Sylarheart.5673 said:

Healing Skill Combat Stimulant should be allowed to used while channeling dragon trigger without cancelling it, just like flow stabilizer. 

Also, the movement skills are too short on range. The only that is ok is Dragon Slash: Boost which is 750 range, still i think it should be 900. So flicker step should be at least 750 range as well.

[bruakumfd.4817]

I wanted to give this a chance. I really did because I made the first Beta character one. However, the gunsaber is a huge con to me. Don't get me wrong. I don't mind the moves. However, I use the Discipline trait line, and aside from Vengeful Return and maybe one other one, it's rendered useless.

 

While we're here, I find it a little silly that we're going to have to spend 50+ skill points on new moves, and there's no stun breaker in sight. Keep in mind I tried to play as the devs intended this time.

[ledernierrempart.6871]

using f2 skills block you into using the bladesword since the weapon switch enter cooldown. this needs to be changed into a free switching. or make use use the f2 no matter the used weapon.

[Kodama.6453]

8 minutes ago, bruakumfd.4817 said:

While we're here, I find it a little silly that we're going to have to spend 50+ skill points on new moves, and there's no stun breaker in sight. Keep in mind I tried to play as the devs intended this time.

I don't quite get what you mean with "no stun breaker in sight", do you mean you unlock it too late in the skill tree or?

Dragonspike mine looks like a fine stunbreak to me.

[Unwol.7935]

Well, it does seem like a fun mechanic - conceptually.

 

My personal problem is with the targeting of the three Dragon Trigger burst skills.

From what I can tell, the skills can be aimed in the following two ways:

1.  with no target locked in the direction the character was facing when the sheathed charging mode was activated.
2.  with a target locked in the direction of the current target.

At least for me, this makes targeting the skill very finicky to say the least.

Say I want to use skill 2 (Dragon Slash - Boost) in a specific direction. I can currently achieve that in two ways:

1.  having a target, going into dragon trigger mode, charging, teleporting (using skill 5) such that my target is in between me and my chosen direction and then using the skill.
2.  clicking somewhere to deselect my current target (dedicated button for that please), going into dragon trigger mode, charging and then going off in that direction. Which however means I cannot change the direction I'll be going in without leaving dragon trigger mode or targeting something (refer to point 1 above again).

I feel the three dragon trigger skills should really be aimed via ground targeting (see Greatsword - Whirlwind Attack for that), as all of them have an aiming element involved (either due to not hitting 360 ° around the player or by moving or shooting in a specific direction).

I'm already going mad sometimes when trying to detarget in a zerg to be able to determine where I'll be going with sword 2. This current iteration of dragon trigger targeting would probably make me bite my keyboard.

(If, however, I was just too stupid to have found out how to properly aim them - please do tell me!)

Also - why do we need a weapon swap cooldown after dragon trigger usage? Feels bad.

Edited September 22, 2021 by Unwol.7935

[sneakytails.5629]

17 minutes ago, sneakytails.5629 said:

I thought a full healing power Bladesworn would be better buts its not, Spellbreaker is still better due to full counter. Even with a normal weapon swap timer (no disc) Spellbreaker is still better. Once you start throwing in some reasonable amounts of CC from enemies all you see is countdown timers and swapping takes forever on Bladesworn.

 

Strength Spellbreaker can hit easy 9k Arc Dividers while flipping moving.....no self roots required

 

Bladesworn was a complete flop for me. Its definitely a PvE spec to me.

 

The ammo recharge was not as great as I though it would be for shout support as Banner is miles better for smallscale as well. Overall Bladesworn needs some work for me to try and DPS with it, and support is not as good as Spellbreaker.

[Athel.2076]

Although I so far find the bladesworn the most fun spec in this beta event, I'm not feeling the "flow". The best "flow" I've felt was the reaper in HoT, where every skill on GS, the utilities and shroud tied in nicely. Not getting that here. 

 

Offhand pistol is great aestetically, but I don't get how it ties in with the available mainhand weapons. Its like wielding two separate weapon sets- I find myself using the mainhand only, or just the pistol and swapping in gunsabre. 

 

Speaking of the sabre, not sure what its about. It feels awkward to be locked into a weapon that can't be re-skinned, in a game that is very much about cosmetics. And its not like on the engineer, where the kits are tightly knit into the gameplay. Not at all. 

 

I'm really just getting the feeling that lunch is leftovers from yesterday. Pass the ketchup, someone?

[RiyazGuerra.9203]

Tested it yesterday.  Flow gain necessitates getting all the adrenaline increasing traits you can, which just narrows the build possibilities and ends up functioning just like regular adrenaline, so what was the point?

 

Gameplay is horribly unintuitive and not fun.   The pistol range is an utter joke.  Why the 260 range AND pushback???  As a warrior, with a melee weapon equipped in your mainhand, you wanted pistol to add dps as you close the gap to deliver the primary dps from your mainhand, NOT push you back keeping you further away from the target.  If I wanted to get away from the target it would be more effective if I just run away.

 

The bullet system seemed unnecessarily limiting for what gunsaber does, I would've just put cooldowns and the elite should've been self alacrity.

 

Forgive me I cannot remember the name of the poster, but I agree with the idea to scrap the concept of Dragon Trigger altogether and just add several burst skill (F2, F3 etc) when in gunsaber kit.  Entering Gunsaber should be F2, let players keep their F1 burst for their equipped weapons.

 

Give players their weapon swap back.  I don't see how it will be overpowered since most Bladesworn are going to want to sit in Gunsaber mode, the extra options in combat are a plus.

 

Overall I'm very disappointed to be honest.  I really wanted to like the new espec.  Right now, if you scrapped gunsaber altogether, let us keep weapon swap, and just made the offhand pistol 600 range,  skill 4 a basic shot with low cooldown, skill 5 some kind of sticky bomb, it would be more fun and useful for warrior across all game types

[Snowskau.4369]

I'd like to drop feedback on just the gunblade model specifically, as one artist to another.

I think there is a notable mismatch between the rendering style of the weapon textures and the rest of the assets in the game--it lacks any drawn-in shading as if the whole work progress was done in a software environment with fancy PBR shaders doing the work of AO and depth, failing to account for the lack of these in-game. Whereas all the textures on my character and the rest of their equipment have deeply contrasted texturing and shape outlines, the weapon appears extremely flat in comparison. There is a too significant imbalance between the darkness of the handle fabric and the rest of the weapon, but even the darkest spots on this asset doesn't really match the rest of the character. If I had access to this thing in Substance or PS I would just go in there and accentuate the edges and pits a lot more.

As for the model itself I at least have to applaud the handle not being cylindrical (blade aligment is such a simple principle, you have no excuse for failing this!), though the rest begins to fall apart on inspection. The barrel not lining up with the cylinder(?) is such a simple mistake and the way the blade comes out of the complex cylindrical heating-gun-thing underneath looks as if it were two different models just haphazardly clipped into eachother (there is a notable break in the glow texture where the red-hot blade paradoxically meets the hollow bore and just ends), and I feel like that heating contraption should have continued it's shape through to the handle instead of ending halfway. If there's anything I would unfortunately always lambast ArenaNet's art team for it's a widespread seemingly complete and fundamental lack of comprehension of function and purpose when it comes to equipment or vehicle design, where it's usual to just kind of maybe tack on some part or element they remember seeing on a real tool without having any understanding of it's purpose. I have to admit I've wasted several showers and idle moments imagining holding a presentation on simple basics for your art department. Another way to describe the arrangements of its' elements is that remind me a lot of a map artist mashing together different pillar, plate and ring assets to create unique towers and architecute, but... This is a single asset. I don't think it should be built like this. I've attached an imgur album with annotated screenshots.

 

I'll leave other people to detail the actual spec but it does feel jank and ineffective when compared to other warrior builds right now, outside of smacking an idle boss. As much as I would like to say that a different flavor of DPS is okay, reality is not so kind. You seem to have a very clear idea of it's style, but not of it's role and purpose. I feel punished for taking it.

Edited September 22, 2021 by Snowskau.4369

[CalmTheStorm.2364]

16 hours ago, Sovereign.1953 said:

I haven't read through the rest of this thread so sorry if I'm repeating what others say. I only played this spec in PvP, and while I don't want to straight up say the elite spec is bad, it feels bad to play. 

Bladesworn seems to be designed to have 3 weapon sets: main hand, Gunblade, and Dragon Trigger, the latter being hidden behind wielding Gunblade first. I feel the biggest issues with forcing 2 of the 3 weapon sets on us to be the following: 

1. Gunblade and Dragon Trigger have no meaningful defensive skills or hard CC. The fact that 2 of your 3 weapon options offer nothing that actively prevents you from dying means that for the majority of your time alive you will be ill-equipped to handle pressure. 
2. The weapon swap to your main hand shares its cooldown with Dragon Trigger, and so even if you wanted to deal some "damage" in Dragon Trigger (I'm sure there are enough memes about its PvP damage) doing so would lose access to your main weapon set, and thus any defensive skills or CC.
3. Entering Dragon Trigger has no merit as it does not do enough damage for the risk, and as it does not generate any stability, you will just get CCed and your weapon swap will go on full cooldown. 
4. If you forego the Dragon Trigger all-together so that you have reliable access to your defensive skills in your main weapon set, you are left with Flow that literally serves no purpose.

Here are some suggestions that might make the gameplay feel better: 

1. Give some defensive skills or hard CC to Gunblade. Right now every attack is an explosion and nobody cares about Gunblade 4's projectile reflect. If you inflicted a low duration weakness or a blind on some of those explosions (see Engineer's flashbang) or gave evade frames to Gunblade 5 it would give players some defensive options instead of feeling like you're forced to trade damage. This would also help with the need to fill your utility slots with purely CC skills in order to survive. 
2. Remove the Dragon Trigger weapon kit and instead, create F2, F3, and F4 to represent Dragon Triggers 1, 2, and 3. Nobody is going to use Dragon Trigger 4 and 5, and the F2-F4 keys could function as a one-shot skill or press-to-activate and press-to-unleash.
3. Allow Dragon Trigger to be accessible even when wielding the main weapon set. 
4. Provide Dragon Trigger with a short duration stack of Stability so that these skills can actually land.

I think these changes would go a long way towards making Bladesworn feel more fun. It's not fun to feel like you have no options because 66% of the weapon skills you have equipped are more-or-less worthless and 33% of your weapon skills are inaccessible because of weapon swap cooldowns. This would drastically free up your utility skills so that you don't just take CC and condition cleanse. I never even got to play with the ammo-based utility skills of Bladesworn because I didn't survive long enough for them to matter. 

Additionally, if you are in Gunblade and use Rampage, your Rampage form has the Gunblade skills. I didn't get to play with this to see if the Gunblade skills were more effective, but you can drop the weapon bundle to return to the normal Rampage skills. It would be kind of cool if Rampage had some synergy this way, but otherwise it's worth reporting as an unintended effect.

These are excellent ideas; thanks for this!

 

I agree with many of the posts here (coming from a PvP perspective): 

1.) Competitive damage is way too low

 

2.) Dragon Trigger is very clunky and very punishing.  Specifically, having any interrupt (either from an enemy or you moving or using a skill) cancel the whole thing and lose all flow is a real problem.  None of Warrior's other bursts work that way; if Arcing slice or eviscerate is interrupted, for instance, the skill goes on 4s CD and your adrenaline is preserved.  Also, having to be in gunsaber AND hit F2 before you can access your best skills is very cumbersome...you have to hit 3 buttons to get off one burst (e.g. F1, F2, 1)!

 

3.) "Flow"  mechanics are, ironically, the opposite of fluidity and runs completely counter to the way other Warrior specs "feel"--which is incidentally much more fluid.  That is, on Core/SpB/Berserker, you develop a rhythm of rotating between damaging and mobility skills which build adrenaline and boons (usually might from Forceful Greatsword, weapon swap, magebane tether; fury from Arcing slice, etc) and effects (e.g., stacks of Berserker's Power or Attacker's insight) which gives the feel of building power and hitting harder as a fight progresses.  It feels fluid and intuitive, and it builds to a crescendo.  With Bladesworn, the Dragon Trigger mechanic effectively makes you stop moving (very foreign to Warrior combat) and sit still for up to 5s (during which time many of your boons and effects will dissipate)... it is anti-flow.

 

4.) Loss of F1 bursts on your normal weapon set drastically limits the utility of that weapon set, as most Warrior weapons are built around their bursts.  For instance, taking Arcing Slice away from GS removes at least 50% of its damage capability.  MH mace is little more than a CC stick at base line, but without skull crack?  It's just....a stick.  MH sword without Flurry is only good for mobility and the very niche role of final thrust when the target is <50% HP.  

 

5.) Pistol should definitely be main hand, and the range of the current pistol skills should be increased.

 

In conclusion, while I think the ideas behind Bladesworn are good and interesting, I think the spec ends up tripping over its own mechanics and falling short of its potential.

 

I have a couple of radical ideas for improvement, largely inspired by @Sovereign.1953's excellent post.  I realize they might sound like a reach, but bear with me...

 

1.) Scrap Dragon Trigger altogether.  Instead, as Sovereign suggested, make DT skills 1-3 be the burst skills available while on Gunsaber and make them available F1-F3.  Either make swapping to gunsaber just use the regular weapon swap key or reassign this mode to F4 or something so as to preserve muscle memory for us Warrior mains that F1=burst.

 

2.) Scrap Flow and return to 3 bars of adrenaline.   The old adrenaline system is tried-and-true, and it "flows" much more effectively/fluidly than Flow does.  It also provides better continuity between Bladesworn and the other Warrior specs.

 

3.)  Return F1 bursts on your non-gunsaber weapon set.  This will be made easier by returning to the old bars of adrenaline as well.

 

These changes would streamline the functionality of the Bladesworn spec and solve many of the problems cited by other posters on this thread.  Specifically:

1.)  access to the gunsaber burst skills will be much easier and will feel less clunky

2.)  removes all the issues with trying to stand still and channel DT in a competitive environment where that is simply not realistic most of the time

3.) vastly improves functionality of your non-gunsaber weapon set

 

If, on the other hand, you feel committed to the idea of keeping DT and flow, I would recommend that you be able to keep any  cartridges that you charge up even if you don't use them.  This would allow a player to briefly charge DT to get 1-2 cartridges, dodge or use a skill as needed, and return to DT later and already have those 1-2 cartridges saved up.  In this way, one could power up the burst attacks over time and not be committed to a "well I'm in DT so I've got to use one of the skills or I lose everything" mentality.

 

@Lan Deathrider.5910 @Grand Marshal.4098I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on this.

[Bealis.6023]

Hello, I enjoyed most of the things with Bladesworn, but mainly one trait is on my mind right now: Dragonscale Defense-"If you are struck while in Dragon Trigger, gain protection.".

Problem I see with this trait is that it is a Minor Trait that is bound to the spec skill. You can´t choose it, so you basically always get a protection while in Dragon Trigger, so it would make more sense if the protection was part of the Dragon Trigger and the trait was something different or tweaked. For instance you could get protection by not moving. It would work for both spec skill and other things, like standing still with torment on for example.

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

18 minutes ago, CalmTheStorm.2364 said:

These are excellent ideas; thanks for this!

 

I agree with many of the posts here (coming from a PvP perspective): 

1.) Competitive damage is way too low

 

2.) Dragon Trigger is very clunky and very punishing.  Specifically, having any interrupt (either from an enemy or you moving or using a skill) cancel the whole thing and lose all flow is a real problem.  None of Warrior's other bursts work that way; if Arcing slice or eviscerate is interrupted, for instance, the skill goes on 4s CD and your adrenaline is preserved.  Also, having to be in gunsaber AND hit F2 before you can access your best skills is very cumbersome...you have to hit 3 buttons to get off one burst (e.g. F1, F2, 1)!

 

3.) "Flow"  mechanics are, ironically, the opposite of fluidity and runs completely counter to the way other Warrior specs "feel"--which is incidentally much more fluid.  That is, on Core/SpB/Berserker, you develop a rhythm of rotating between damaging and mobility skills which build adrenaline and boons (usually might from Forceful Greatsword, weapon swap, magebane tether; fury from Arcing slice, etc) and effects (e.g., stacks of Berserker's Power or Attacker's insight) which gives the feel of building power and hitting harder as a fight progresses.  It feels fluid and intuitive, and it builds to a crescendo.  With Bladesworn, the Dragon Trigger mechanic effectively makes you stop moving (very foreign to Warrior combat) and sit still for up to 5s (during which time many of your boons and effects will dissipate)... it is anti-flow.

 

4.) Loss of F1 bursts on your normal weapon set drastically limits the utility of that weapon set, as most Warrior weapons are built around their bursts.  For instance, taking Arcing Slice away from GS removes at least 50% of its damage capability.  MH mace is little more than a CC stick at base line, but without skull crack?  It's just....a stick.  MH sword without Flurry is only good for mobility and the very niche role of final thrust when the target is <50% HP.  

 

5.) Pistol should definitely be main hand, and the range of the current pistol skills should be increased.

 

In conclusion, while I think the ideas behind Bladesworn are good and interesting, I think the spec ends up tripping over its own mechanics and falling short of its potential.

 

I have a couple of radical ideas for improvement, largely inspired by @Sovereign.1953's excellent post.  I realize they might sound like a reach, but bear with me...

 

1.) Scrap Dragon Trigger altogether.  Instead, as Sovereign suggested, make DT skills 1-3 be the burst skills available while on Gunsaber and make them available F1-F3.  Either make swapping to gunsaber just use the regular weapon swap key or reassign this mode to F4 or something so as to preserve muscle memory for us Warrior mains that F1=burst.

 

2.) Scrap Flow and return to 3 bars of adrenaline.   The old adrenaline system is tried-and-true, and it "flows" much more effectively/fluidly than Flow does.  It also provides better continuity between Bladesworn and the other Warrior specs.

 

3.)  Return F1 bursts on your non-gunsaber weapon set.  This will be made easier by returning to the old bars of adrenaline as well.

 

These changes would streamline the functionality of the Bladesworn spec and solve many of the problems cited by other posters on this thread.  Specifically:

1.)  access to the gunsaber burst skills will be much easier and will feel less clunky

2.)  removes all the issues with trying to stand still and channel DT in a competitive environment where that is simply not realistic most of the time

3.) vastly improves functionality of your non-gunsaber weapon set

 

If, on the other hand, you feel committed to the idea of keeping DT and flow, I would recommend that you be able to keep any  cartridges that you charge up even if you don't use them.  This would allow a player to briefly charge DT to get 1-2 cartridges, dodge or use a skill as needed, and return to DT later and already have those 1-2 cartridges saved up.  In this way, one could power up the burst attacks over time and not be committed to a "well I'm in DT so I've got to use one of the skills or I lose everything" mentality.

 

@Lan Deathrider.5910 @Grand Marshal.4098I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on this.

It's a good either/or compromise. IF they want to stay with it as a kit, then they need to treat it as a kit proper and flow and/or the charges need to not decay until used.

OR if they are open to dropping it as a bundle (pun not intended), then having F1 be the core burst outside of Gunsaber and Dragon Slash while in Gunsaber would work. The GM traits could then change Dragon Slash into Force, Boost, or Reach. F2 could be Triggerguard and F3 could be Flickerstep regardless of whether you have Gunsaber out. F1 would consume Adrenaline like it normally does, F2 and F3 would not. The tradeoff would be losing weapon swap for Gunsaber

[Geoff Fey.1035]

2 minutes ago, Bealis.6023 said:

. For instance you could get protection by not moving.

I'm actually in love with this--make it so you get Stability by not moving.

Dragon Trigger is supposed to be a meditative stance. So while you're charging, if you don't move at all, then you should be staying stable and concentrating on building to that final attack.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 minute ago, Geoff Fey.1035 said:

I'm actually in love with this--make it so you get Stability by not moving.

Dragon Trigger is supposed to be a meditative stance. So while you're charging, if you don't move at all, then you should be staying stable and concentrating on building to that final attack.

Why make it protection then? Why not just make it damage reduction while not moving?

[len.7809]

Dragon slash should be high risk high reward, but i dont see that in pvp/wvw, the damage is not proportional to the charge time 

[Geoff Fey.1035]

1 minute ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Why make it protection then? Why not just make it damage reduction while not moving?

Oh, no, not the protection. I meant when you stand still while in Dragon Trigger (either charging up with the F1-F3 as suggested or in the actual Kit Dragon Trigger we have currently), you should pulse Stability baseline.