Bladesworn Feedback Thread

[Tungsten Monarch.6058]

So, without even trying very hard, I hit a Veteran Corrupted Ice Elemental for 62,813 damage, that was within 3 minutes of trying out the class. Followed by hitting a Icebrood Wolf for 25,172 damage, and I have to ask myself.... are you guys at ANet trolling other class developers or something? is this an inside joke of some kind? .... is this with intent? ... seriously?  ... I'm walking around and 1 shot ing stuff, it's a joke.... I about fell off my chair laughing .. 45k this, 62k that .... I'm not even trying very hard, and I know I can build a better damage build once I have access to runes not in my beta kits. ... are you guys at ANet even going to allow this to exist?

Edited September 22, 2021 by Tungsten Monarch.6058

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

57 minutes ago, Tungsten Monarch.6058 said:

So, without even trying very hard, I hit a Veteran Corrupted Ice Elemental for 62,813 damage, that was within 3 minutes of trying out the class. Followed by hitting a Icebrood Wolf for 25,172 damage, and I have to ask myself.... are you guys at ANet trolling other class developers or something? is this an inside joke of some kind? .... is this with intent? ... seriously?  ... I'm walking around and 1 shot ing stuff, it's a joke.... I about fell off my chair laughing .. 45k this, 62k that .... I'm not even trying very hard, and I know I can build a better damage build once I have access to runes not in my beta kits. ... are you guys at ANet even going to allow this to exist?

Now go use it in WvW or PvP and see the real joke.

[Rider.6024]

Bladesworn suffers the same design flaw as Catalyst, its a pve only spec as of now because the new weapon has practically 0 defensive utility

 

the gunblade 4 reflects ya but there is no evade frames or blocks, the reflect doesn't even make sense when considering the awesome wall of reflection 2.0 utility they have access to now. The 5 should really be an evade.

 

both gunslinger and Catalyst are memes for pvp and wvw as they stand now, and fully charged gunslinger attacks in their rooted form deal less damage than regular gs or rifle core f1 in pvp and wvw...like what!?

[Caid.4932]

The difference between potential damage and real world damage with this is going to wide. It'll definitely be moaned about incessantly. I'm pretty ok with it after a brief test because everything else feels pretty weak overall. Some good utilities and the elite was interesting, maybe a bit too mandatory with the gunblade cooldowns? Pistol is quite cool, i liked that.

Obviously the dragon trigger is completely mental but after a 5 second channel and losing all the regular bursts and flow filling up a lot slower than adrenaline making a lot of traits pretty weak, it really, really should be. Its a gimmick spec, that gimmick needs to be strong.

Haven't tried it in pvp or wvw with the lower damage but it feels redundant to even consider it. You'll need to be in combat for a pretty long time to get the flow to use it so any kind of sneak attack or hiding behind corner shenanigans is going to be pretty impossible to pull off I'd think? Haven't tried heal that tops out adrenaline, does that work? It doesn't matter really, it'll kill the odd new player who'll figure out after a fight or two how to counter it and theres not much else to talk about after dragon trigger.

[crewthief.8649]

1 hour ago, Tungsten Monarch.6058 said:

So, without even trying very hard, I hit a Veteran Corrupted Ice Elemental for 62,813 damage, that was within 3 minutes of trying out the class. Followed by hitting a Icebrood Wolf for 25,172 damage, and I have to ask myself.... are you guys at ANet trolling other class developers or something? is this an inside joke of some kind? .... is this with intent? ... seriously?  ... I'm walking around and 1 shot ing stuff, it's a joke.... I about fell off my chair laughing .. 45k this, 62k that .... I'm not even trying very hard, and I know I can build a better damage build once I have access to runes not in my beta kits. ... are you guys at ANet even going to allow this to exist?

Imagine being a Necro main and complaining about literally anything else being OP… 😳😳😳

[leoleez.1243]

Love that the gunsaber works underwater, but it feels really similar to a spear with just ammunition abilities. Might be worth changing up a few skills to differentiate it, but I think it works fine for the most part.

 

Also could it be possible to have the sigils on the non-equipped weapon set trigger on weapon swap for the gunsaber? I think a lack of an ability to add runes can negatively impact some swap traits. This isn't the biggest of deals as this doesn't happen for holo, but thought it worth a suggestion. 

[TheGrimm.5624]

Bladesworn needs love in WvW. In WvW/sPvP for pistol, what about:

• Gunstinger - move to range 900 so it can gap close
• Dragon's Roar - move to 900 and add pierce

That way gameplay would be gap closer with 4, loose a volley at enemy and then you are in melee range for your main hand. If target starts to get away you can gap close again if they haven't gotten to far away. The pierce idea is when you are in group or zerg play, the pierce would allow the Bladesworn to have both a single target in main hand but still provide group fire support by closing and then hitting a target deeper to provide AoE fire support with offhand. 

Edited September 23, 2021 by TheGrimm.5624

[Matt H.6142]

Day 1 deleted

Day 2 feeling better about this.  The clanging sound in the gunsaber auto attack is a little to similar to greatsword, and wouldn't want to hear it too much.  It didn't seem as loud today though.

The gunsaber skills take some getting used to; like I'm not entirely sure what it's supposed to do.  I have no reference for how it would behave in life.  Artillery slash shots but it's melee.  I think it can hit behind you as well, at least it did the first day.  I expect Break Step to do damage on landing, not take off.  I thought it was missing a lot of the time.

But when you learn to dragon slash regardless of charges, this actually has a lot of utility in the boost and the reach, like these are fight finishers most of the time.

The utilities are situational, but they have their uses.

Edited September 23, 2021 by Matt H.6142
Second impressions

[TheGrimm.5624]

WvW mode. The drain on flow while not in combat combined with the locked in place while charging up feels double punishing in WvW. Think it might be better that you do have a tell while you are charging that could be countered but allow the player to still move while charging. That would create more skillful game play as you would need to be positioning to where you need to be as you charge up. In PvE I could see the lock in place if you are going to get crazy numbers but not in a WvW setting. Also as seen above some, agree, abilities that allow a player to fill adrenaline in core lines should be a complete fill of flow while using the elite in WvW.

[crewthief.8649]

This post pertains to PvP and the notion of tradeoffs, as that seems to be something CMC leans upon heavily, but seems to have very little actual understanding of what it means. I have copy/pasted my post from the PvP forum:

The whole notion of a tradeoff is that you lose something while gaining something else. It is important that the loss is equitable as it pertains to the gain. Taking Blade Sworn as an example, the following penalties are assessed in order to access the spec mechanic:

- Loss of weapon swap

- Loss of Burst skills

In order to access the “big payoff” (Dragon Slash), in addition to the above, the following is sacrificed:

- Movement (must remain stationary to access big damage payoff)

- Fluidity (must “charge” big damage payoff while remaining stationary, without stability)

The “big payoff” amounts to 4-6k crit in full-on damage gear. So, what’s gained? Honestly? Nothing. Why would you play this over literally anything else (that isn’t an EoD spec)? I find it very difficult to believe that these people (Anet) do not understand the concept of a properly executed tradeoff; something that any Freshman Business major understands halfway through their first semester. Honestly…

Blade Sworn is not a tradeoff at all, it is a strict downgrade.

Edited September 23, 2021 by crewthief.8649

[Noz.4650]

As a high plat PvPer, things I would like to see changed:

• Gunsaber/Dragon Trigger badly need weapon stowing
• Activating Dragon Trigger should let you move at -66% speed (Chilled speed) so you can activate it while moving and because the self rooting is a bit harsh
• Weapon stow to cancel Dragon Trigger
• Gunsaber skills can use a slight damage buff across the board
• Gunsaber 4: I would trade the range damage for a regular short duration block to counterbalance the fact that we're very limited on weapon sets and lose 2 sigil slots, but don't have the tools of an engi or ele
• Gunsaber 5 should deal damage where you land, not where you start
• Some utilities need a rework, maybe make them spend a bit of flow to make them more powerful as Bladesworn isn't starved for it and rarely charges more than a second or two
• Small QoL but I'd really like F1 to be the regular weapon swap and Dragon Trigger to be F1
• The range Dragon Slash needs a lot of work, some times it bends over backwards to hit your opponent, sometimes it misses when they're right in front of you
• The dash Dragon Slash needs to not fling you in the air that much

Edited September 23, 2021 by eksn.7264

[Verdict is Vengence.6912]

Captain's log, Date: 9-22-2021

My second day of playing Bladesworn and I'm starting to see the appeal. When traited into [Daring Dragon], it shines in how it truly feels like a samurai. My main game mode is WvW and there, I've tried both sustain and glass builds.

Sustain build review: Pretty darn good. I used Defense/Tactics/Bladesworn and I had enough sustain to last in a fight as well as enough damage to kill. For reference, I used marauders gear.

Glass build review: No bueno. Muchos unlikeable. The damage wasn't enough to burst anyone down no matter the squishiness of the target. But in team fights if left alone, I could use [Dragon Trigger] along with [Daring Dragon] to zip around the battlefield and position for [Dragon Slash-Force] which hit for about 5k if I recall correctly. That was pretty cool.

Overall: Bladesworn could use more damage in WvW. If the damage stays the same, at least consider making [Dragon Trigger] have no cooldown. Also when coming out of [Dragon Trigger], there's no need to put weapon swapping to normal weapon set on cooldown.

That is all. Godspeed everyone,

V.is.Vengence

[Aedil.1296]

2 major crirics:

 

1- GW2 is based aesthetic, why would I work on a legendary if then it just gets replaced by a kit gunblade that looks the same for everyone? 

2- GW2 is famous for its unique fluid and dynamic combat, why would you force people in a static position so easily cancelled with movement? Thief has something similar with rifle but it makes more sense as you are down aiming and u can dodge but you don't cancel it by mistake moving as you are rooted in place. Gunblade static doesn't makes sense to me. Reduce its power and provide movement I would say. 

 

Thank you for reading. 

[TheGrimm.5624]

In WvW, Tactical Reload looks good on paper but I don't think it will be used that often if you are setting your traits planning on getting to zero more often to gain more advantages from middle trait abilities. Would either cut the cooldown from 60 to 30 or have it do additional abilities or increase the amount of ammo it returns. 

[Doomfrost.5728]

Gunsaber in my opinion would have served better as weapon kit listed as an elite armament. Keep the weapon swaps, keep the burst, when you switch to the weapon kit your adrenaline bar is replaced by Flow. Switch in and out of it as desired. Just like the Engie mortar kit. Warriors would effectively get a 3rd weapon to switch to on demand.

[Valik Shin.9027]

3 hours ago, UNOwen.7132 said:

Honestly, I get the feeling people arent using the dragon trigger correctly in PvP. Youre not supposed to charge it the full way. Let it rip at 2 or 3 charges, then use hidden dragon to reenter, that is much more effective.

Why don't I just run spellbreaker and do more damage and have better survival? 

[Verdict is Vengence.6912]

13 minutes ago, Doomfrost.5728 said:

Gunsaber in my opinion would have served better as weapon kit listed as an elite armament. Keep the weapon swaps, keep the burst, when you switch to the weapon kit your adrenaline bar is replaced by Flow. Switch in and out of it as desired. Just like the Engie mortar kit. Warriors would effectively get a 3rd weapon to switch to on demand.

This is the best idea so far imo.

[TugboatSteve.3607]

My only real complaint is the Dragon Trigger.

The fact you can only use it in Gunsaber and that Gunsaber doesn't use the normal weapon swap keybind, combined with the fact that there are two resources, and you have to stand still to power the second resource - and it's like a situational menu of abilities instead of a straightforward burst. It's too much micromanagement for what feels like a clunky, weird mechanic. I really dislike the exponential scaling payoff for standing still. Feels too awkward to use in arena.

I know the spec just dropped, so I'm moving into dragon trigger and find myself wondering when to, in effect, pull the trigger, while scanning targets and having to force myself off the WASD keys and try and remember which situational "burst" ability makes the most sense. It's fighting my gaming muscle memory in a way that doesn't feel good. Flow is definitely not a good name for the resource when the payoff is lacking flow.

I just don't want to play this spec.

Seems like the rest of the spec is geared towards justifying the overall weird dragon trigger mechanic. Classes should generally feel good and fluid to play, this just....does not. And it's just the Dragon Trigger that lacks fluidity, the rest of it has a good rhythm.

I realize they're trying to make it mechanically complex and force you to time it; I just don't really feel a desire to play this long enough to integrate Dragon Trigger into my muscle memory.

Edited September 23, 2021 by TugboatSteve.3607

[imitarate.6518]

Gunsaber is S L O W. I constantly felt like I was auto-attacking while waiting for CDs. Swapping out to my one weapon set didn't help much. 

 

The lack of any reasonable CC in-kit means I had to look at my one weapon set for it. That mostly meant axe/mace, mace/axe, or hammer; mace/mace is too sluggish for being my only out-of-stance option. Running axe/axe or greatsword means limiting my CC AND my dodging/blocking.

 

Lastly, I felt really awkward using armament skills. Everything they do, except the elite, feels like it can be done better with another skill -- with the elite, shouts especially. And, in group content, I'm still going to be running banners anyways.  

 

With a primary mechanic basically acting as a kit, I'm not sure why they didn't just use kits as the primary skill type, with dragon trigger as the elite. Have flow build up, charge bullets with it (have bullets stay out of combat but let flow drain), then have kits use bullets as ammo to boost skills. Armaments feel like they were made different for the sake of being different. Even if the spec locked out second weapon swap in combat, having different kits means you could spec support, utility, CC, etc with the primary mechanic. You know, like engineer already does. It works. 

[Wraith.3524]

6 minutes ago, imitarate.6518 said:

Gunsaber is S L O W. I constantly felt like I was auto-attacking while waiting for CDs. Swapping out to my one weapon set didn't help much. 

 

The lack of any reasonable CC in-kit means I had to look at my one weapon set for it. That mostly meant axe/mace, mace/axe, or hammer; mace/mace is too sluggish for being my only out-of-stance option. Running axe/axe or greatsword means limiting my CC AND my dodging/blocking.

 

Lastly, I felt really awkward using armament skills. Everything they do, except the elite, feels like it can be done better with another skill -- with the elite, shouts especially. And, in group content, I'm still going to be running banners anyways.  

 

With a primary mechanic basically acting as a kit, I'm not sure why they didn't just use kits as the primary skill type, with dragon trigger as the elite. Have flow build up, charge bullets with it (have bullets stay out of combat but let flow drain), then have kits use bullets as ammo to boost skills. Armaments feel like they were made different for the sake of being different. Even if the spec locked out second weapon swap in combat, having different kits means you could spec support, utility, CC, etc with the primary mechanic. You know, like engineer already does. It works. 

Agree with this.

[Peacekid.1463]

well i have to agree....this bladesworn class is  by far the worst joke ive tried to play on...seriously u will die fast in high rank pvp,if u want to retain that ridiculous dmg retain those in pve but pls pls do something in wvw and pvp for its second to garbage atm

[Rising Blade.9206]

1. put gunsaber on "in combat" weapon switch hotkey please, it being on F1 makes it clunky.
2. let us be able to enter dragon trigger regardless if we're using gunsaber or not, needing to be using gunsaber just to enter the stance really doesn't flow well.
3. let the gunsaber be sheathed when out of combat, for aesthetic purposes, also let the sheathed gunsaber be displayed when using the primary weapon.
4. gunsaber damage feels too low in WvW or in general
5. there's quite a delay when entering dragon trigger before being able to use DT skills due to the initial chargeup for the first ammo to pop, hard to use it when you're looking to use Dragon slash 2 for a quick gap closer/escape or just want to use DT with just one charge, i suggest letting it consume a small amount of flow upon first use
6. change Dragon trigger skill 5 to something like a skillshot/directional cursor, was hard using it with as a small AoE circle when you have the lock in range option disabled, also it would feel a lot better to use.
7. utility  skills really fits the bill on being just plain utilities, not saying that it's bad, but the spec goes nicely with physical skills, at least in WvW.

also playing against other bladesworns in WvW is awesome, almost feels anime, i love it.

Edited September 23, 2021 by Rising Blade.9206
added suggestion on item no. 5

[draxynnic.3719]

Brief piece of feedback without reading the rest of the thread because of time constraints:

 

I'd mentioned this in a previous thread, but as a QoL thing, what about making Dragon Trigger available without having the gunsaber drawn? Could possibly make it available only if the weaponswap to gunsaber is available, but since it's an iaijutsu move, it makes sense that you'd be able to put your other set away and go straight to Dragon Trigger, rather than having to draw the gunsaber and immediately sheathe it again.

 

Weaponswapping is also disabled for a period after Dragon Slash, which seems to suggest a post-DS rotation (if you have enough sources of adrenaline/flow) of unloading all your gunsaber skills, switching to the other weapon set and unloading that set's cooldown skills before going back into Dragon Trigger. Being able to Dragon Trigger right out of the alternative weapon set would make that a lot more fluid.

[Malus.2184]

I've suggested that Dragon Trigger attacks also inflicted Defiance damage, since it would fit the concept of someone who probed thier opponent and then made a tactical attack, and I've been thinking of how this could be translated into PvP and xame up with that attacks made in Dragon Trigger would reduce the remaining duration on Boons by 10% for each Charge.

This would give Bladesworn a unique role in PvP and more importantly, a different one than Spellbreakers who goes for Boon removal.

It's also important for the concept that all this is tied to Dragon Trigger as it represents the culmination of a process. If it was a Utility Skill then it would just be something done at will and that's more of a Spellbreaker thing.

[Zekent.3652]

So boring on pve, needs to be more frenetic and fluid, especially on pvp, its so clunky and predictable.

Just needs to be more fluid, make the burst charge have less damage (on pve only), but faster (pvp and pve).

More survibal mechanics, like a dodge on bladesworn 2, longer reflect on bladesworn 4, stop the adrenaline/flow losing out of combat (is this still 2012?), and for the love of gods, please do something on discipline, is way too mandatory on every single non-meme warrior build on every single gamemode.

Not even berserker is that boring and clunky.

Edited September 23, 2021 by Zizekent.2398
Just added a couple things