I wish necro would be nerfed so I could play one.

[AppleSauce.4578]

Honestly I feel such guilt playing a class that is so complained about for being OP. 
 

I really like the theme and both elite specs though. 
 

But I don’t want to be looked at like I’m playing the game with training wheels. 

[Necrid.9601]

I am a hardcore necro main. I have some play time on my warrior and revenant which are fun but its the class that always calls me back. My advice? Play the class you want to play. 9/10 times nobody is gonna care and if they do they have WAY to much time on their hands. Both Reaper and Scourge do more for me than any of the other specs I've tried, so I bounce back and forth between them. At the end of the day its your time and money, so spend them on something you want to rather than trying to play classes you don't like as much to try and fit in. 

[Asum.4960]

Up until recently, at least in PvE, playing Necromancer was grounds for being kicked from groups for "not being a real class". 

The recent shift in perception about the profession, although the Torment changes have done well for Scourge, mostly comes down to influencer sheep herding. 

 

There are plenty builds out there on other professions that can outperform any Necro build in about any aspect, some even all of them combined.

 

As for WvW with it's blob fights, Guardians and Necros will always form the core of that gameplay due to stability and corruptions, almost regardless of the actual performance or other capabilities of those professions, as long as they provide primary access to those mechanics. 

 

For PvP, what or how you play doesn't really matter if you want to avoid getting called out or flamed, it's going to happen either way with people lashing out to compensate for their own shortcomings - just have to live and let live. 

 

If you enjoy Necro, play Necro. For the first time in almost a decade it's in a good place in all gamemodes since the last few months, that's ruffling some feathers - doesn't make it "OP".

[Dadnir.5038]

There is no guilt to have.

It's currently the flavor of the month profession and, as such, have a large popularity just like any other profession have been popular in the past when they were flavor of the month.

Like Asum said, it come down to sheep herding. A few month ago, nobody would have even dared accept anything but a full dps team for PvE raid. What changed is that an influencer that actively tried to make the necromancer meta since HoT release finally managed to prove that a safer team comp than "full glass canon" can achieve close to same clear time than a "full glass canon" team by exploiting some of the necromancer mechanisms to the fullest.

As for the competitive mode "hate", it's mostly peoples that enjoyed the peculiar "1 hit KO" gameplay that refuse to adapt to the fact that it's no longer easily doable. The necromancer being the profession that have the most effective health point is especially hated by these players and they are very vocal about it.

[CafPow.1542]

dude play whatever.

 

i enjoy a lot of classes. I have each class at least 2-3 Times on Max level and on different specs. For me, every class feels a bit dull or boring after i play it for a few Weeks, then i mix it up with another class or specc.

just play what is fun for you, no need to get bad vibes from "pros".

 

as for necro: it is a nice class because it has a lot of viable specs. you can enjoy a variety of Gameplay-Styles with it, and it's quite solid. Yes, Necro is pretty easy but "easy" is not "bad". Overcomplicated classes don't mean automatically "fun" imo.

Edited September 26, 2021 by CafPow.1542

[Fueki.4753]

You shouldn't feel guilty for playing Necromancer, just because it's better than the other professions for many players.

If anyone was to feel guilty, it should be Arenanet for unequal treatment of all professions and intentionally leaving some professions (Warrior and Elementalist) in the gutter.

Edited September 25, 2021 by Fueki.4753

[omgnoob.7860]

im seeing a whole bunch of necro hate in this forum. it sounds to me like bad players upset their favorite class is getting beat by necromancers which are not in any way over powered. 

[Kaladel.1670]

OP is probably trolling and you are all falling for it...

[AppleSauce.4578]

4 hours ago, Kaladel.1670 said:

OP is probably trolling and you are all falling for it...

I am not trolling. It is really a mental block for me in any MMO. I have this thing in my head where I have to play the hardest class or the least played class to be 'respected' or something.

 

Like in WoW I love healing so I literally check out who the worst healing spec is and play that instead of playing the healer that I like the most.

 

I have this problem with feeling guilty playing easy or popular specs.

[Axl.8924]

51 minutes ago, AppleSauce.4578 said:

I am not trolling. It is really a mental block for me in any MMO. I have this thing in my head where I have to play the hardest class or the least played class to be 'respected' or something.

 

Like in WoW I love healing so I literally check out who the worst healing spec is and play that instead of playing the healer that I like the most.

 

I have this problem with feeling guilty playing easy or popular specs.

 

 Um personally i don't like that way of thinking, but i kinda understand too. I lately stay away from necro as its popularity currently kinda turns me off.

I tend to play random classes sometimes i mess around and discover i enjoy parts of a class i never knew about before, like i was messing around with herald, and discovered i really like playing as a support herald. I played warrior became kinda obsessed in discovering secrets about the new spec and eager to go in try different things because i'm actively interested in the mechanics.

I personally do like sometimes simplicity. Reaper i like, but it still feels rewarding. Some classes balance reward with the risk.

Dagger/dagger tempest was kinda neat because its melee range risky death but at the same time it can do good damage in pve.

On the other hand sometimes i get frustrated like with dps chrono. I feel like i'm trying hard to do dps, but can't because all my illusions go on cd and battles end so fast.

In my opinion a class can be simple but fun as long as the mechanics have engagement and enjoyability.

If it is simple yet also mechanically not enjoyable due to overnerfs then forget about it.

Edited September 26, 2021 by Axl.8924

[Kaladel.1670]

15 hours ago, AppleSauce.4578 said:

I am not trolling. It is really a mental block for me in any MMO. I have this thing in my head where I have to play the hardest class or the least played class to be 'respected' or something.

 

Like in WoW I love healing so I literally check out who the worst healing spec is and play that instead of playing the healer that I like the most.

 

I have this problem with feeling guilty playing easy or popular specs.

You know that, contrary to what non-necro seem to believe, the profession will not make you good if you aren't already? Surprisingly, no profession can do that. And necro isn't that easy. Just go in game and make your own opinion, instead of asking for nerf of a profession that's just fine as it is (I'll accept that necro needs a nerf in pve the day firebrand do less dps and utility than scourge, not before)

[Pooh.6897]

can someone please explain where this sudden influx of complaints about necromancer comes from? Did necro get a giant buff that I missed or something? Just a few months ago, the necro sub-forum was so nice, filled with players wanting to get better at necro. Since the first beta-event, all I'm seeing is posts complaining about "hurr necro too stronk". Please, if you want to complain about strong classes, go to the usual suspects such as guardian. Necros are strong, but they also have a lot of counters. There are things necro is very good at, and there are things necro can't do very effectively at all. I tested revevant for a while, and on that sub-forum they're complaining about vindicator being able to only hit 35k. Meanwhile with Reaper, 35k is probably as good as it'll ever get. I honestly don't get the complain-culture that's in multiplayer games nowadays. If you can prove that something is incredibly broken, then make a thoughtful post discussing possible changes. Don't start crying just because a necro whooped your kitten in PvP.

[Fueki.4753]

23 minutes ago, jiggle puff.9347 said:

can someone please explain where this sudden influx of complaints about necromancer comes from? Did necro get a giant buff that I missed or something? Just a few months ago, the necro sub-forum was so nice, filled with players wanting to get better at necro. Since the first beta-event, all I'm seeing is posts complaining about "hurr necro too stronk". Please, if you want to complain about strong classes, go to the usual suspects such as guardian. Necros are strong, but they also have a lot of counters. There are things necro is very good at, and there are things necro can't do very effectively at all. I tested revevant for a while, and on that sub-forum they're complaining about vindicator being able to only hit 35k. Meanwhile with Reaper, 35k is probably as good as it'll ever get. I honestly don't get the complain-culture that's in multiplayer games nowadays. If you can prove that something is incredibly broken, then make a thoughtful post discussing possible changes. Don't start crying just because a necro whooped your kitten in PvP.

Unless you consider 1,5+ years sudden, it's not actually sudden.

Necromancer had been over-performing since that "balance" patch of February 2020 (arguably even before).

This mainly stems from the fact that Necromancer's sustain had hardly been adjusted (if at all) to the lower damage, thus making the already big sustain even bigger in comparison to the damage output.

Since then, it got marginally better by Arenanet shaving off auxiliary slivers of the sustain here and there, but it didn't really hit where it should have. The amount of damage that Shroud can soak, the damage reduction while in Shroud and Blood Bank would all be more impactful targets, yet Arenanet chose specifically not to adjust these and went for less meaningful targets, like minion HP.

[Tails.9372]

1 hour ago, Kaladel.1670 said:

I'll accept that necro needs a nerf in pve

Noone cares about necros sustain in PvE, the complains about necro come pretty much exclusively from sPvP.

[Kaladel.1670]

8 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

Noone cares about necros sustain in PvE, the complains about necro come pretty much exclusively from sPvP.

If you've read the other topics about necro nerf, there are a bunch of people asking exactly for that since the torment change. Which sounds stupid, since the torment change nerf necro in competitive modes (unless I'm mistaken and people don't move in sPvP? I know for a fact they do in WvW, most annoyingly) in exchange for more viability in a non-competitive mode. And even that doesn't make it top the benchmarks.

(But I suspect an elementalist conspiracy: they love downstate so much that having a profession preventing them to staying in that state or reaching it easily is infuriating to them)

[Asum.4960]

5 hours ago, jiggle puff.9347 said:

can someone please explain where this sudden influx of complaints about necromancer comes from? 

Multiple of factors. 

 

For one, Necromancer in PvP has always been a focus first priority for a free kill to get a 5v4 which had to be carried by a dedicated support due to a combination of having no invulnerability, blocks, stealth/clones/target drop or much mobility - aka nothing that breaks focus fire and forces the enemy team to retarget. 

Players never really had to learn how to counter Necro since it was just so easy to steamroll. 

 

Since the big damage rebalance for competitive modes, Necro has an actual valuable defense with Shroud and people suddenly have to face a class and mechanics they previously could just pile on and burst to content with. 

So while X profession surviving, escaping, disengaging etc. was normal and accepted, Necro not immediately folding under pressure is not.

 

Generally, but primarily in PvE, one of the most popular GW2 influencers has been pushing Necro extremely, putting it into the consciousness of a lot of players, creating a sort of bandwagon to jump onto the class, mainly Scourge, which then kind of snowballed. 

 

That then coincided with the Torment changes, actually giving Scourge a reasonable Benchmark, further enhanced by (since fixed) bugs at the time with Dhuumfire and Demonic Lore skipping their ICD's, causing a lot of people to jump onto the class and creating the perception that it was OP with everybody suddenly playing Scourge. 

 

In short, something underperforming since years got a slight buff and bandwagoned on and everybody was suddenly playing it, creating the strong perception of it being overpowered due to it's spike of popularity. 

 

Harbinger being among the first Beta Specialisation and pushing 45k DPS (even though it has since been well beaten by things like Bladesworn pushing 55k DPS) and being put on the top of the Benchmarks on sites like Snowcrows certainly didn't help it's case of not looking OP either.

[Kitty La Boom Boom.4065]

10 hours ago, jiggle puff.9347 said:

can someone please explain where this sudden influx of complaints about necromancer comes from? Did necro get a giant buff that I missed or something? Just a few months ago, the necro sub-forum was so nice, filled with players wanting to get better at necro. Since the first beta-event, all I'm seeing is posts complaining about "hurr necro too stronk". Please, if you want to complain about strong classes, go to the usual suspects such as guardian. Necros are strong, but they also have a lot of counters. There are things necro is very good at, and there are things necro can't do very effectively at all. I tested revevant for a while, and on that sub-forum they're complaining about vindicator being able to only hit 35k. Meanwhile with Reaper, 35k is probably as good as it'll ever get. I honestly don't get the complain-culture that's in multiplayer games nowadays. If you can prove that something is incredibly broken, then make a thoughtful post discussing possible changes. Don't start crying just because a necro whooped your kitten in PvP.

lol, "complain culture".  That's a problem everywhere, not just MMO's.  It's a product of self-entitled people not getting or having things go their way.  Can't afford a luxury item?  It's too expensive and the price should be reduced.  Keep getting your butt kicked in raids or PvP?  Either your class is to weak or the opposing class needs to be nerfed.  It's always someone else's fault, and never, "what can I do to improve my skills?"

[Klowdy.3126]

On 9/25/2021 at 3:06 AM, Dadnir.5038 said:

There is no guilt to have.

It's currently the flavor of the month profession and, as such, have a large popularity just like any other profession have been popular in the past when they were flavor of the month.

Like Asum said, it come down to sheep herding. A few month ago, nobody would have even dared accept anything but a full dps team for PvE raid. What changed is that an influencer that actively tried to make the necromancer meta since HoT release finally managed to prove that a safer team comp than "full glass canon" can achieve close to same clear time than a "full glass canon" team by exploiting some of the necromancer mechanisms to the fullest.

As for the competitive mode "hate", it's mostly peoples that enjoyed the peculiar "1 hit KO" gameplay that refuse to adapt to the fact that it's no longer easily doable. The necromancer being the profession that have the most effective health point is especially hated by these players and they are very vocal about it.

My favorite is kiting for that last 2 seconds RS is on CD (with a full bar), with about 200 health, then going shroud spinning away their dodges, freezing them, then fearing them immediately after, and autoing them down. Not the good players, just the ones on my level, lol.

 

Gotta say, though, members are by far the most annoying for me in PvP, on any class. 

[Kitty La Boom Boom.4065]

On 9/28/2021 at 9:55 PM, Klowdy.3126 said:

My favorite is kiting for that last 2 seconds RS is on CD (with a full bar), with about 200 health, then going shroud spinning away their dodges, freezing them, then fearing them immediately after, and autoing them down. Not the good players, just the ones on my level, lol.

 

Gotta say, though, members are by far the most annoying for me in PvP, on any class. 

Mesmers are the OGOP, lmao, or PPitA (Professional Pain in the Kitten)

Edited September 30, 2021 by Kitty La Boom Boom.4065

[kellenburger.9245]

I would love to give up my necro and play a thief and revenant but they are too powerful and breeze through content easily. I enjoy my gimpy necro that keeps getting nerfed.

[genjonah.1253]

I main revenant even though I do more damage and add more utility (outside of alacren in strikes and certain raids) as both guardian and necro. But I play Rev anyways because it’s my favorite class

 

play your favorite class. Games are supposed to be fun, not a chore

[Aplethoraof.2643]

On 9/26/2021 at 12:19 PM, AppleSauce.4578 said:

I am not trolling. It is really a mental block for me in any MMO. I have this thing in my head where I have to play the hardest class or the least played class to be 'respected' or something.

 

Like in WoW I love healing so I literally check out who the worst healing spec is and play that instead of playing the healer that I like the most.

 

I have this problem with feeling guilty playing easy or popular specs.

MMO balance comes and goes.At some point in an MMO's history, every class will be OP or underpowered in some respect. GW2 is probably one of the better MMOs for this, its highs and lows are far more mild compared to others.

 

Like posters said - for the longest time, necros used to get booted from PUG parties. It is only fairly recently that they have been considered viable.

 

In WvWvW, you can pretty much play anything. Most classes have something they can offer for both blob fights and roaming. Necromancers fair slightly better in blob fights and are terrible to play roaming - compared to others.

 

For sPvP, it doesn't matter what you play, the following holds true always - if you ask enough people, every single profession is both the absolute weakest and the absolute strongest. Until you get to the top 50-100 (and find out that everyone playing seriously will use power reaper or support scourge, unlike the lower tiers where condi scourge can do OK), what you play on necromancer is generally irrelevant - you can do well on a good number of builds with gold/low plat and below players.

 

So yeah - if you are being serious (it doesn't sound like you are FYI). . .stop trying to be a tryhard and play whatever the hell you want.

[Teratus.2859]

Try not to care so much what others think.

Necro's are a great class and there are plenty of skilled Necro players in the game.

Besides most of those who will "criticise" you for playing a Necro are probably only playing a class and build that someone else told them it has "the best dps"

Building your own builds and playing what you enjoy playing is a significantly big part of the fun in this game, so don't listen to people who tell you your "playing the wrong class/build" you're probably having way more fun than they are anyway. 🙂 

[Bezerker.2379]

On 9/24/2021 at 5:30 PM, AppleSauce.4578 said:

Honestly I feel such guilt playing a class that is so complained about for being OP. 
 

I really like the theme and both elite specs though. 
 

But I don’t want to be looked at like I’m playing the game with training wheels. 

I mean... many of us started playing necro when they were a joke. Lol.

[Zero.3871]

On 9/27/2021 at 11:05 AM, Fueki.4753 said:

Unless you consider 1,5+ years sudden, it's not actually sudden.

Necromancer had been over-performing since that "balance" patch of February 2020 (arguably even before).

This mainly stems from the fact that Necromancer's sustain had hardly been adjusted (if at all) to the lower damage, thus making the already big sustain even bigger in comparison to the damage output.

Since then, it got marginally better by Arenanet shaving off auxiliary slivers of the sustain here and there, but it didn't really hit where it should have. The amount of damage that Shroud can soak, the damage reduction while in Shroud and Blood Bank would all be more impactful targets, yet Arenanet chose specifically not to adjust these and went for less meaningful targets, like minion HP.

talking about necro sustain didnt got adjusted is just bias. when anet buffed dmg on ALL classes over 6-7 years until oneshot meta was the only way of playing. many builds could oneshot necro through shroud by using 1-2 skills (in wvw). i cant remember necro shroud mechanic got any buffs till 2012 (plz name examples if im wrong), and no one complaint about non existing necro sustain. (e.g. there existed ranger builds that could oneshot me on reaper when i had 70% shroud LF and 80% HP on full marauder gear by using 1 x maul - gs4) . now when anet reversed some of the dmg buffs they implemented in past, you want adjustments? no one complaint about necro sustain in 2012. and its the same shroud in 2021. 

and if we want talk about some specific skills like lich, that truely overperform in some aspects, we have to talk about those specific skills on every other class as well, since every class has overperforming skills.