Untamed Feedback Thread

[Aleksander Suburb.4287]

My first impressions

++ Fast switching between the unleashed states feels so much better! Now I have more control in which state I want to be.

+ You also get strong effect by the traits. Healing for disabling is pretty cool with leashed hammer (for me it is the hammer trait).

+ The ambush skills are pretty cool. There are some bugs (interrupting hammer ambush with pusing 1 again, area-targeting with shortbow O.o?) Some skills are a bit dissapointing (small and slow leap on one-hand-sword), but they are really cool.

- In unleashed pet mode there is no "beast-skill", so the pet could become just weaker with wrong traits.

- we need a visual effect for unleashed pet/unleashed ranger mode. And no stupid stink cloud. Just a green frame around all skills in unleashed ranger or something. In addition it would be cool, if we get a nice visual effect for ambush ready (not a little boon-icon). Maybe a circle or something around the autoattack.

-- Pet control is really bad. Use the standard keys for attack and return. You can use additionally keys for the other pet skills that nobody uses. In unleashed mode the F1 should be the teleport + attack my target. F3 should be the return + teleport to ranger + projectile shield. So there you don't need additional skills. The unleashed F1 teleport is a really help for the pet to hit something, but I often activate it, while the pet is out of range... that is really stupid. I also activated it, while pet is dead and it goes to reload.

+ The unleashed pet skills are cool and feels pretty strong. The whole class doesn't feel like a beastmaster class, but it is the direction to it.

-- The hammer (especially the unleashed version) feels very uninspired, clunky and a bit disapointing. Sometimes I think it is better to remove the unleash skills of the hammer, because I will use hammer for CC and it is too complicate to remember which skill on which key in which unleash state. In addition the unleashed hammer is only strong if there is another player disabling everyone.

- cantrips just feels disappointing. If the additional boons would be for group support, it could be useful for zergs. But in this state I tested them and then changed to traps (they are also in a bad state, but with disabling hammer they're cool).

 

All in all the untamed ranger feels much stronger and useful, but I think it is beacuase of the many skills (just the elemenalist-rolling-face-over-keyboard-effect). There is much more survivability and a bit more mobility in the hammer skills, that feels much better than previous beta. But its complexity just feels like "I don't know what I do, but pushing all keys seems to help". => Less complexity and more precision

Edited November 30, 2021 by Aleksander Suburb.4287

[Zyreva.1078]

@those complaining about not having autocast pet skills. Just play another spec or class, srsly. Being able to control all pet skills is amazing. Probably the best part about untamed. Don't ruin the spec because of your lazyness.

Overall the spec feels already much better in PvP/WvW, whether it will be good enough remains to be seen. More detailed feedback later, when i had more time to play arround with it.

Just one thing: Please do something about pet survivability. They absolutely melt against more than 1 enemy (and sometimes even in 1vs1) and there is absolutely nothing the player can do about it. It basically kills the entire class (except soulbeast) for anything but duelling and it is just frustrating to be that limited, in WvW in particular.

Edited November 30, 2021 by UmbraNoctis.1907

[Soilder.3607]

1 hour ago, Gorem.8104 said:

 

Oh wow, against a golem that's some cc? What about wvw with ancient seeds? Actual combat and use effectiveness, who actually cares what you can do to a golem, being able to cc a golem a bunch means nothing. Being able to cc a bunch in pve means nothing. in wvw I'd much rather take immob SB/Druid. both can already do Break Bars, and both are better in wvw. 

 

You are addressing the wrong argument. I said nothing about the combat effectiveness of the Untamed and its CC potential in neither WvW nor PvP. I compared the total CC potential between Druid and Untamed in PvE, which was the only thing in the discussion because you claimed that the Untamed has less CC than the Druid, which is demonstratively wrong. Is the form of CC brought by the Untamed less effective in WvW than the Druid? I don't know, and it has nothing to do with my post.

 

Straw man - Wikipedia

[Beddo.1907]

Round 2 of Feedback:

-Unleashed power (red) that has a timer that shows when you can use it so the timing is more visible. (would be great for all traits cooldowns in all classes honestly)

-Unleashed F1 doesn't move the pet if the target is even 1 unit above 900. It should act like Unnatural Traversal at least where is shadowsteps the pet closer.

-Ambush window is a bit short.

-Hammer 4 animation looks wierd.

-Cantrips have too long CD for the effect they provide. It's hard to hit with all spores of Exploding Spores, Unnatural traversal has targetting issues while using action cam, Forest's Fortification has too low duration.

-Restorative Strikes and Ferocious Symbiosis do not benefit conditions which reduces value of condi based weapons and since those weapons have no cc skills aside from 1 on shortbow none of 3rd line traits benefit Condi weapons.

-Hammer 1 chain is quite bland with just damage and no effects.

-Only one new source of Protection lowers the value of the "tank part" of the spec.

-Untamed overall has no synergy with other players which lowers the value of the espec to the point of being outshined by all other options on ranger. DPS is too low and slow, CC has low value, no healing, boons or buffs whatsoever and selfish utility.

[koxsos.6258]

New-new untamed feels still kinda weak, you get 3 buttons on pet to spam and then turn it off, splendid. 

--In previous beta the pet abilities hit like a truck even in that full toughness gear provided, so they seemed awesome, now they are not even all that worth pressing in spite of having the more dpsy gear on.

-- Ambush cooldown seems unreasonably long, given there is so little this spec is actually doing, perhaps giving it a bit more of action would be nice, mirage gets it on every dodge, why do rangers have to wait 15 seconds? It does seem comparable in strength, while mesmers retain more utility.

+ ambush animations are nice though, at least there is something this spec does now, although it does not exactly fit the whole theme, but it would do.

-- difficulty tracking both ambush cooldown and the switch state, I would advise a more distictive icons than now. They are awfully similar.
The glowing "shroud bar" would work too.

Edited November 30, 2021 by koxsos.6258

[Auron.5709]

Feedback from Beta 4.

Found a bug about pets and unleashed mode. If you have the pet on unleashed mode and then you decide to switch to other specs (core, druid or soulbeast), you lose the pet F2 ability entirely. Changing, stowing or pet swapping does not fix this at all. Only switching back to Untamed and unleashing the player so that the pet has it's normal skill will enable the other specs to have normal control on the F2 skill.

Then to feedback about the Untamed functionality itself.

1) Pet control skills and untamed pet skill use should be uniform between the ranger specs. What I mean by this is that we should have Pet attack, Pet call back, Pet skill 1, 2 and 3 on the same F1...etc skills between core, druid, soulbeast and untamed. My suggestion for example is to have pet attack and return as the new F6 and F7 in all spec versions. Pet skills should be at F1-3. A bit odd to use only f2 and no f1 or f3 in core, druid and normal mode soulbeast (soulbeast form the F1-3 would be there for the skills) but the current version is very annoying. You currently need to rewire your habits all the time when you switch in or out of Untamed. Trying to use F3 for return but you are accidentally using a pet skill, or trying to return it but no F7 is in use at all. This needs to be checked before EoD release as the same function should not change places in between a proffessions specs when its about controls.

2) Ambush skill is difficult to notice when it is ready to be used. An icon indicating its availability in the same area as other buffs that you have can easily drown in the middle of the buffs and in the heat of combat you do not notice it. The lack of proper control over the use of Ambush skill is also a problem. I do not have experience with other Ambush skills but what I heard is that Mesmer and Thief have these skills in a way that they appear when you do a specific action like stealth or dogde. Now changing the unleash mode is this kind of thing but the internal cooldown and the easily missed icon on the buff bar makes this difficult to use in a proper way for most common / casual players (i feel). Problem also is the very short timeframe to use the skill until it disappears. Of course you can switch out and back in to unleash to use it then but you can easily miss some needed rotation moments if you want the Ambush skills there.

Edited November 30, 2021 by Auron.5709

[Kaenaydar.5631]

Untamed seems a bit better survivability and what not. All i could say is missing is maybe allowing us to set up pet skills to auto cast. Rest seems far better right down to skills buffing ya more. One thing that was turning me off with Untamed was lack of survivability. I favor a marauder build so i was hoping this might get me out of core ranger Longbow/Axe. I went marksman for my longbow Beastmaster to strengthen my pet and Untamed and it seems at least more viable with hammer instead of axes.

Edited November 30, 2021 by Kaenaydar.5631

[Roben.9175]

Hey guys, I just wanna say one thing. I loved the character Unleashed visuals on my character, maybe you can add an option to see that visual again? Or something bc it was really cool , I know I can see that visual when I switch but eh idk. Or I would like to see something like the soulbeast visuals? I don't know guys , you are the smart people so yea + The new ambush weapon skills look very good too, especially the axe one :0.

Edited November 30, 2021 by Roben.9175

[Levetty.1279]

First thoughts. 

 

• Pretty fun and a lot better then last beta.
• Ambush cooldown seems too long.
• Ambush window is too short. Especially on hammer where you will probably want to use your ambush attack but that means you can't combo your hammer knockdowns into the attacks that do more damage to CC'd foes.
• Sometimes going into Unleashed automatically triggers the ambush, other times it doesn't. This causes problems as pressing 1 again interrupts the ambush and starts auto attacking. I've ended up cancelling my ambush attacks a lot, especially on Hammer.
• Shortbow ambush could do with a bigger aoe, hard to hit things with it.
• Starting a fight with a Mount attack while Unleashed should count as entering Unleashed mode for traits and ambush. Just some QoL for open world and to synergise with opening strike.
• Could do with some more damage in PvE still, not tried it in competitive modes yet.

 

 

Edited December 1, 2021 by Levetty.1279

[Xiaka.2814]

Despite it has improved since last beta and it's good to see that devs reads this forums and try to improve the spec it feels clunky and definitely not fun to play. From a WvW and PvP point of view.

 

Too many things to track while playing:

- Normal pet skills CD (while the pet is untamed)

- Untamed pet skills (while the pet is not untamed)

- Your actual state (it's only easy to track while you are on hammer since skills change the color)

 

Too many bindings and not consistent with other ranger specs:

- Too many bindings makes the spec feels clunky. I would prefer removing the untamed state of the pet and having control on "pet skills + the actual untamed effect" this will avoid having to track different CDs on different modes for the 6 different pet skills (instead we will have only 3 but more powerful). I would prefer that attack my target and comeback are also integrated in those skills somehow.

- Of course F1 and F3 should be default for attack and come back just to be consistent with other ranger specs.

 

Hammer:

- I don't like the both modes it has, one mode is CC the other just damage. Having to CC with the pet or with the not untamed skills and then switch to untamed to strike and again switch mode again to keep CCing does not look fun to play and ofc can be hard to track for the enemies. Again this makes the spec too intensive on key pushing (in GW2 when you switch to a "mode" you have some time to use the skills of it, for example druid, berserk, juggernaut, elementalist attunements and you have to wait to come back to it, so you are not forced to constantly being switching modes which is also difficult to track for enemies to know what can they expect). I would prefer to have only one set of skills but more rounded, having both CC and damage in the same skill set, for example in untamed mode n5 knockdowns 1 seconds but deals more damage, in normal mode it knockdowns 2 seconds but does less damage.

- It also needs some kind of evasion, block or whatever to be playable in large groups (as WvW) since it's not a Warrior or guardian with better base armor stats. GS looks more useful.

 

Ambush skills:

- This mechanic looks weird and improvised and imo doesn't fit the spec style (which is supposed to be a brawler). A brawler do not ambush enemies, just fight them all. It looks more for a dueler spec. It will feel better to have an aoe effect around you (or your target with ranged weapons) when you swap to untamed.

- Even with the icon it feels hard to track when you are ready to get your ambush skills.

 

Utilities:

- Perilous Gift: Does not look bad.

- Unnatural traversal: Is nice to have a TP.

- Mutate conditions: Don't know why it has to apply vulnerability on you.

- Elite is supposed to be your main resource of survival when you melee in hard situations, and it looks good but conditions and boon removal will melt you. Has no break stun and it's not instant (in a large fight one second of casting can be your death).

- Exploding spores, the aoe damage looks nice but having to wait too much for it to happen for a melee skills, the knock-down effect is only suited for dueling or small fights since you need to land some inmo or stun first in order to land it.

- Nature's Binding: Maybe a long CD for a utility slot.

 

In large fights (WvW);

- Don't know if it can fit any specific role that other classes are not capable of, since your boons and most of the skills only affect yourself and the hammer CC is not so awesome.

- This specs still has the base ranger problems in large fights in WvW which are known for ages: most of your weapons are projectile based in a game mode where projectile block/reflect is very common, since pet will always die so fast (the pet does not roll nor block and goes in straight line to the target) you will not be able to use his skills or any skill/trait that has an effect on your pet (signet of renewal condi draw as an example) , not having any good sources of own stability (once you are trapped on a CC barrier and your stab is removed you don't have a second chance, your elite skill with a 90s standard cooldown does not look reliable),  pet will always reveal your team when you blast smoke fields for stealth unless you stow your pet but you cannot do it while in combat, you are forced to stick to wilderness survival traitline and skils because not any other good source of condi removal in base ranger and this traitline only benefits yourself and not your party (Untamed only brings one condi removal every 30 seconds), while it removes boons is clearly les effective than spellbreaker or necro so it does not look as a good reason to pick untamed, having to track your pet position to use his skills on this kind of fights is really hard (even in do not attack mode) since it gets always snared by everything.

 

 

 

[ChronoPinoyX.7923]

Right now this is going towards the right direction in terms of adjustments, and the fact that we're not getting sudden nerfs just because of a single trait on the mechanic actually makes it feel far better than it did last beta. That said, we still got issues. 

• Even with the 1 second cooldown on Unleash, Hammer cannot keep up with itself in terms of actually taking advantage of the bonus damage after CC, I think it's better to just get rid of it entirely and keep what you have with Hammer going into either Damage or CC mode. 
• Not sure about the Hammer's overall cooldown on skills right now. From a PvE standpoint, it feels alright since I'm swapping between my other weapons with it, but from a PvP/WvW viewpoint, it could be very different. If this was meant to be used for CC, then the current cooldown doesn't feel like it's gonna make the Hammer do much CC. 
• I'm personally OK with how the Pet Skill buttons have been adjusted between the F Buttons, but since other people have issues with it, move Attack Target and Return to Me in F1 and F2 respectively. That or give us skill customization for Profession Mechanics like with Utilities so we can actually adjust our F buttons based on preference without affecting other characters. 
• Ambush Skills need a longer window of usage because it either doesn't cast or it gets easily interrupted because of chained auto attacks. Unsure about the cooldown right now, if it had the same cooldown as Mirage Ambush, then it would be easily spammable for Untamed, so not sure if that's the wisest cooldown duration, maybe test between 5 to 10 seconds for it, but not 15 seconds, that's way too long at that point. 

Yeah, those are the main ones I can think of right now that mostly stood out to me. Gonna keep messing around with it more before I get back to grinding Return To achievements

[Caid.4932]

I think its a lot of fun. Theres pet issues which will limit its use but that is what it is. It has a lot of cc and boonstrip which dont get used often enough in pve content which will limit it a bit more. Maybe they can use the pve / pvp split to move some damage around as appropriate? Reduced damage on cc skills in pvp is another obstacle to the spec.

A lot of its problems are related to game mechanics rather than this specific elite really.

I was playing a marksmanship, attack of opportunity spec with skirmishing. Used traps a bit - Healing well condi cleanse and water field is nice to have and spike trap is a good fit for the class but ended up using 5 cantrips just because.

I really like the cantrips. Mutate Conditions feels like a good one size fits all defensive cooldown that frees up other slots for more interesting utilties. Teleport is great, really like it. Its not always obvious visually when you've gotten the hit for the reduced cooldown without looking at icon would be a small nit pick. CC Rings like the dragonhunter longbow skill are a decent alternative to spike trap, if it ever becomes good in wvw it'll be a nice utility to have. Heal is very strong and quite welcome in terms of throwing caution to the wind re damage, helps keep the pet relevant too. Elite skill helps somewhat too, dont love the cooldown but differentiates it a bit from Strength of the Pack i guess.

Theres probably a bit too much going on with that spec i was playing. 9 pet skills, 14 weapon skills, buffs on pet swap, buffs on weapon swap, ambush on stance swap. Stance 'weaving' for quickness on hammer cc skills and making the most of damage buff against cc'd enemies, pet control - keeping them alive.

Tracking the pet skills and ambush felt particularly ... well i couldn't, I hit the button and hoped for the best basically. Familiarity might bridge the gap and it keeps it interesting so i'm not sure how much of a problem that is. Rolling the unleashed pet skills into the default pet skills might be a good way to just pull things together a bit? Maybe attach ambushes to weapon swap which is 10 sec cooldown. Bit more restrictive but a bit more natural maybe?

Ferocious Symbiosis is a fun trait - thumbs up on that one too.

[Soilder.3607]

WvW Perspective Feedback:

 

Unleashed Ambush skills get cancelled if you click your number 1 skill after they have been activated. I think the ambush skills should not get overwritten by an autoattack because in the middle of battle you are often clicking a single skill multiple times to make sure it activates.

 

Forest's Fortification still needs a shorter recharge time in WvW, 60 seconds would be a fair number.

 

Venomous Outburst, Rending Vines, and Enveloping Haze should apply their conditions unconditionally. It's too difficult to try and ensure someone is CC'd when attempting to strike with these skills in WvW as many players have stunbreaks, stability, dodges and invulnerability. Additonally, these skills deal way way less damage than their PvE counterparts, Venomous Outburst and Rending Vines have almost a 90-95% damage reduction in WvW and they don't even inflict Stun/CC. Enveloping Haze is reduced by about 66% dmg in WvW. Do these really need to deal that little damage?

 

Venomous Ouburst and Rending Vines need a 240 radius; it's difficult trying to hit multiple foes with a 180 radius ability.

 

Exploding Spores is a bit tricky to land in WvW. Since you guys seem to be tinkering with the idea of giving Untamed boon stripping, how about having Exploding Spores remove 2 boons from a foe so long as they are hit by any spore, but it does not trigger more than once per foe (so a foe hit by one spore and a foe hit by all spores both lose only 2 boons, but the foe hit by all spores is also knocked down).

 

Relentless Whirl: This skill should be a whirl finisher since it does a whirl. Also consider giving it projectile reflection for its duration.

 

Savage Shockwave and Unleashed Savage Shockwave: Consider increasing the radius of the first hit from this ability from 120 to 180 as 120 is a very small radius to try and hit with.

 

Thump/Unleashed Thump: Radius increase to 240 would help this skill hit multiple targets. Earthshaker is more or less the same as this skill and has a 240 radius.

 

The hammer also still doesn't have a defensive skill. You guys gave it some mobility with the Thump skill and the Ambush skill but it could still use a skill that evades or blocks. Adding evasion to one of its skills would help.

 

Savage Slash: A lot of boon ripping skills on other professions are unblockable. Right now none of the Untamed's boon stripping abilities are unblockable. Maybe consider making this one unblockable so that atleast some of our boonstrips are harder to avoid?

 

Please have the pet automatically use their skills while they are unleashed. 

Edited December 2, 2021 by Soilder.3607

[Pullin.5091]

I was basically Touring Turtle but I Ran a RGR while doing it and tested it out as well.
I ran LB Hammer
Tiger and sandlion
I like the ambush on the LB, it feels like it is worth using
I appreciate the change in the Untamed Skill, Not only Fashionwise, but the cooldown allows for me to choose how to manage over trying to manage over multiple cooldowns.
I did not have issues with pet skills, they feel balanced to me, aside the closer not going off if the opponent is OOR, it should at least move the pet max range closer to the enemy. IMHO
The AOE's feel right in PVE I can't speak on WVW

 

I would like to have the Ambush skill be more obvious when it triggers, either by overhead effect or by highlighting the skill

Definite improvements!!! Thank you

[Substance E.4852]

It's an objective improvement on the previous iteration but still lacks any real purpose

If I'm correct to assume this is still meant as a "frontline bruiser" then the pet is still DOA on any real push into another zerg and can be totally disregarded

Unleashed Thump, our "big nuke skill" does roughly the same amount of damage as Maul with 4x the cooldown

Greatsword also has a better leap, a block skill, and generates endurance on auto

If I'm expected to swing it with the melee train in WvW, I have no reason to use hammer at this time since GS still offers more and LB is just gold now that retaliation is gone

Short of some use in sPvP and a different way to overworld PvE, I still don't see any real reason to take this over our other specs at this time

Soulbeast likely still does more damage and "no team utility" is definitely less than what the Druid brings

For the overwhelming majority of the game that only PvE's, this still has little to no reason to exist other than a reason to use a hammer after years of greatsword/sword

[Lobomon.6210]

My feedback from the small amount of time I played the spec is that the Ambush attacks feel very good and actually encourage triggering them for the added effects, however, I don't feel very rewarded for Unleashing the pet other than to trigger the Ambush back on me.

Not even the Unleashed pet abilities (F1 F2 F3) would make me want to Unleash the pet, especially because I don't feel the reward for using them over keeping my damage bonus, and they even lose their Beast ability which usually comes with strong effects or utility (either from traits or the actual skill). I also think the bonus for using the Unleashed abilities on a CC'ed target is weak compared to the actual effect of the skill.

My idea for the spec was to be a bruiser where I either Unleash the pet and I CC enemies so the pet can deal more damage to them, or I Unleash myself and the pet can CC enemies so I deal more damage, and that doesn't really happen.

Maybe the Grandmaster minor trait "Vow of the Untamed" could also grant bonus damage to the pet when it's unleashed (and maybe even the damage reduction when not unleashed so the pet can be more durable) or there could be a trait that makes the pet deal extra damage to CC'ed enemies, or at least on the Unleashed F1 F2 and F3 abilities, or just roll that into the actual skills.

Also, I believe there's a bug with the Adept Trait "Blinding Outburst" where it's not granting the 25% damage increase to the Venomous Outburst (Unleashed pet F1), at least it isn't listing it in the description of the skill (I tried doing a couple tests and I think it's not actually applying it)

https://imgur.com/CmbpZPO

This part may be just muscle memory at work but I don't think it makes sense to swap the keybinds around for the pet skills. I'd keep Attack, Return to Me and Guard/Avoid Combat where they are on base ranger and add the other skills on top, including the Beast ability. However, I can see a reason to move Return to Me to F2 and put the Beast Skill on top to always keep the commands and the skills aligned between every available mode / spec. This would be big QoL because imagine playing until lv 80, learning that sequence and then have it change, and then play some Druid or Soulbeast and have it change back again.

While the past two specs either weakened or removed the pet (by merging), this spec brings more focus into the pet, so changes to the pets themselves would also impact this spec the most.

This isn't only Untamed related but maybe the pets can be looked at in general to be more diverse, especially in terms of stats within the families to have aggressive squishy, bruiser and tankier ones (maybe even related to their soulbeast archetype?). Because even with Soldier's equipment + dolyak runes, a lot of families have more toughness than me so they take the aggro, leaving me with some choice of species, but from very few families (around 4).

I believe families could have different attributes within them like a murrelow could be a more offensive bear with less HP and toughness, or a Fern Hound could have less offense and be more Supportive than the other canines. Maybe even look at whole families like Devourers who are ranged but have high toughness so they end up tanking (lower toughness and increase Condi application?).

As you can tell, I really like the pet aspect of the class so I'm really looking forward to playing this spec and I can't wait to play with the new EoD pets.

[Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582]

8 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

@those complaining about not having autocast pet skills. Just play another spec or class, srsly. Being able to control all pet skills is amazing. Probably the best part about untamed. Don't ruin the spec because of your lazyness.

I don't see how it ruins the spec to have the option of putting one or more of the pet skills on auto cast. Needing to press F1 & F3 every few seconds to get the same damage from your pet as Core Ranger is not a good thing and asking for that QoL with all the other things there are going on with this spec is definitely not laziness. 

[Squigglez.1236]

I didn't play this much just felt like saying that ambush skills need some work. It says they can only happen once per interval but I couldn't find the interval anywhere, I had no idea when they were off cooldown and just spammed the unleash swap until the icon changed. The icons look the same except green so it's not the easiest thing to detect and I think this may have an issue similar to mirage ambush in that the ambush just doesn't fire sometimes when you're auto attacking. Only other thing I really tried was the exploding ball utility thing. Says it knocks down enemies if they're hit by all of them but even standing inside hitboxes didn't seem to get all the hits sometimes. Then again I'm bad. Maybe put an effect on the skill bar so you can tell if you're the unleashed or your pet is (when you're not using hammer that is) kind of like how guardian bar gets flames when it's virtue is about to fire.

[Gorem.8104]

9 hours ago, Beddo.1907 said:

Round 2 of Feedback:

-Unleashed power (red) that has a timer that shows when you can use it so the timing is more visible. (would be great for all traits cooldowns in all classes honestly)

-Unleashed F1 doesn't move the pet if the target is even 1 unit above 900. It should act like Unnatural Traversal at least where is shadowsteps the pet closer.

-Ambush window is a bit short.

-Hammer 4 animation looks wierd.

-Cantrips have too long CD for the effect they provide. It's hard to hit with all spores of Exploding Spores, Unnatural traversal has targetting issues while using action cam, Forest's Fortification has too low duration.

-Restorative Strikes and Ferocious Symbiosis do not benefit conditions which reduces value of condi based weapons and since those weapons have no cc skills aside from 1 on shortbow none of 3rd line traits benefit Condi weapons.

-Hammer 1 chain is quite bland with just damage and no effects.

-Only one new source of Protection lowers the value of the "tank part" of the spec.

-Untamed overall has no synergy with other players which lowers the value of the espec to the point of being outshined by all other options on ranger. DPS is too low and slow, CC has low value, no healing, boons or buffs whatsoever and selfish utility.

Yeah that's one problem I see as well, even SB has a talent that makes its effects effect others around you, meanwhile this spec is incredibly selfish for no payoff. You are essentially playing a spec that has no benefit for others besides maybe a rez or two off with unleashed 3 on your pet, but then other classes do rezes better anyway while offering stuff for the group. This spec just feels so out of place, like it has no purpose. Would Power Rangers really give up GS/LB? And if you are not using hammer, might as well be a SB so you can provide buffs and also good dps. 

[Sir Vincent III.1286]

On 10/27/2021 at 4:58 PM, Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

Visual

- Unleash Pet/Ranger is really clunky. It's hard to tell which state I am in since the icon is too small/similar. A glowing pet portrait will help a ton when unleashed. A glowing health bar for the Ranger.

 

You gotta have to make this easy, Anet. Instead of improving the visual, you even removed it. Now I can never tell. Change the icons making the human face icon looking to right at the very least -- or something. It's really difficult to differentiate them in combat. Make it a pulsating green glowing orb on the chest and back of the player/pet. Something.

 

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Hammer Skills

- All the disable skills are in Unleash Pet (UP), while all damage vs disabled is in Unleash Ranger (UR). If the idea is to UP->disable->UR->big_dmg .. then this execution failed. Each hammer skill has casting time and the Ranger has only 1.5s window to do the combo. I don't see any other skills or pet skill that can combo with this, so I'm not sure what you expect me to do with this kit. This is just too much hassle than its worth.

- One pet can combo with UR Hammer skill is the Iboga pull skill -- that's it. Even then, it's really tiny window. /sigh

 

-sigh- Yay for more damage -- I guess.

 

You make an E.Spec called "Unleashed" yet you leashed every Hammer skills with "disabled enemies" requirement.

 

Remove the unfun "disabled enemies" condition. Unleash the Unleashed, for crying out loud.

 

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Skills

- Perilous Gift -- yeah...I'm sticking with Heal as One. If the integral theme of this spec is to bounce unleash between you and your pet, then why would I drain its HP? Not only that, it has a 30s CD with no other effects. There's not even any traits that boosts Cantrip as Resounding Timbre boosts Command skills. PG is not a good skill.

 

Since you changed the functionality of the skill, you might as well change the name. Perilous Gift no longer makes sense.

Suggestion: "Time to go" as a new name. Because I can see myself using this when low on health and trying to run away.

 

The new functionality is a very good improvement.

 

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- Exploding Spores -- this is PvP and PVE Boss useless. All it can do is deal with trash mobs, but you're better off just bashing them with your hammer. In other words, it looks cool, useless, but cool.

 

The update to the skill is very good. It seems that the spores also pop faster.

 

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- Mutate Conditions -- nobody in the right mind will use this stupid skill. Might as well let the Necro convert them to boons rather than trying to get myself killed. There's also Signet of Renewal -- if the point of Perilous Gift is to kill off my pet, might as well load it conditions before it dies.

 

Why do you insist on trying to kill the Untamed by using their skills? For crying out loud, make a fun skill, not a debilitating one.

 

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- Unnatural Traversal -- this skill should be a CC or a stun break. Speaking of stun breaks.../crickets.

 

/sigh

 

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- Nature's Binding -- this is just a rebranded Ring of Warding (Guardian Hammer #5) and it's not even that great. The Guardian Hammer skill can trap up to 10 targets and last 1s longer. Sure RoW is smaller in radius, but that's perfect since it puts them all within the hammer range.

 

The update to the skill is good. With the cage plus Quickness. I can see the use of this.

 

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- Forest's Fortification -- this is a good tanking skill, but this is a DPS Elite Spec. This skill is so out of place.

 

Gain defensive boon yet it doesn't grant Protection. This should grant Protection when UR instead of Super Speed.

 

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Traits

- Vow of the Untamed -- "...incoming... damage is increased when you are unleashed"; "...outgoing...damage is decrease when pet is unleashed." WTF is this? So you give the Ranger a hammer but they have to wrap themselves with thorny vines.

 

The updated version is much, much better.

 

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- Top Row -- all these traits trigger when disabling foe, otherwise they do nothing else. The fact that some traits give different boons depending on the state is confusing since the disabling skills are only when UP is active. There's no disabling ability during UR.

 

The only reliable weapon to use for this trait set is using an off-hand axe. The Axe #4 skill gives a consistency that all these traits will trigger regardless of Unleashed state. The hammer is useless for this trait set since all the disabling skills are when the pet is unleashed.

 

They didn't bother to make any changes so it's safe to assume that this is their intention -- to have a set of useless traits even when using a hammer.

 

If you're going to make "disable enemy" as a key requirement for the skills and traits, make sure the the Unleashed has access to disabling skills. Otherwise, you get what you got now -- useless unfun traits and skills.

 

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- Mid Row -- I understand that this is beta, but what's up with all these useless traits?

 

The updated version of the trait set is acceptable. Very tamed and very boring.

 

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- Bot Row -- come on Anet, really? These are ELITE spec traits? Tell me you're not done with the Ranger, because this is just sad.

 

Yeah well, I don't know anymore. I guess Ferocious  Symbiosis is good, but why does it have a CD? Vindicator gets 15% damage just by dodging.

 

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The hammer damage is great but that's as far as this spec goes. If I receive a package labeled Soulbeast and another package labeled Untamed...the Soulbeast package will take two people to carry inside while I punt the Untamed package into the living room.

EDIT: I forgot to mention, Untamed is half-a-spec when not using hammer since none of the other weapons flips depending on the unleashed state. This is really a bummer.

 

I'm very sad to those who main a Ranger. Compare to how OP Harbinger is, Unleashed is just a sad spec and more than likely be DOA at launched. Too many leashes for something that's supposed to be Unleashed.

 

The whole E.Spec is very selfish, more selfish than a core Thief. No party buff, no AoE support -- just the Ranger and her pet.

 

This E.Spec is so boring and monotonous that it gets even worst when using other weapon set. Unleash Ambush is a good idea. don't get me wrong, but to manually trigger it makes it really clunky.

 

I gotta say, I really really do not like this E.Spec -- at -- all. Having the constantly bounce Unleash just to have something happen is not only annoying but it become really frustrating.

 

Suggestions (if not too late):

- The idea behind the Bunny Thumper build is to attack fast to build-up adrenaline, use all adrenaline for a hammer KD, then attack fast for you and your pet. The key skill in the build is Rampage as One (Quickness + Swiftness) which is the missing component.

- Make Unleash passive that bounces every 5s, which makes Unleash Ambush triggers every 10s.

- Make F5 to "Rampage as One" unleashing both the Ranger and the Pet giving them Quickness and Swiftness for 4s duration with 10s CD.

- Remove the "disabled enemies" from the equation.

- Unleashed Thump should cause KD not the other way around.

- Make sure there is a party support trait -- even the selfish Soulbeast has Leader of the Pact.

- Scrap all the traits and start over with the suggestion above in mind.

 

If it's too late, then you have a DOA E.Spec that looks like a leftover Soulbeast. It seems like all the skills and traits that didn't made it into Soulbeast was mixed and matched together to make the Unleashed. That's why there's no cohesion and the whole spec makes no sense -- not even close to the original GW1 Bunny Thumper.

[flowdragon.8635]

The spec seems to be playing nicely, and I see that the team tried to fix the visuals for the Untamed...But mostly it looks like the indicator aura for ranger unleashed was removed. I was more so hoping that the general aesthetic of the class be enhanced, though I could understand if that's too much to change. I honestly thought it was better having the green aura around the ranger so it was easy to tell whom was unleashed at the moment. I think people really just wanted it to look nicer...an aesthetic sort of wild mutation rather than having a look I would only really see coming off of a smelly warthog. It also looks like the other weapon skills got buffed but with no untamed visuals. 

 

So in short I would just suggest optimizing visuals aesthetically, not by removing effects, but by maybe reimagining slightly and adding the unleashed effect to the alternate (non hammer) weapons. The hammer skills look great, its mainly just that the pet skills and the auras look more like visualized odors and sewage rather than having a wilderness feel most people would find pleasant to look at and play with.

Edited December 1, 2021 by flowdragon.8635
clarity

[Khenzy.9348]

I'll just go straight to the point.

My suggestions:

 

-Hammer

Completely merge the hammer skills (with some heavy CC skills doing less damage). Even with a 1 second CD on Unleash the hammer 'intended' combos just don't flow well at all. The unleash mechanic now has a purpose with the new Ambush skills anyways. 

Give hammer skills 2 to 5 the Cantrip treatment. Now that hammer skills (from normal to unleashed) are merged, if you're unleashed, your skills give offensive boons if they land, if your pet is unleashed instead, your hammer skills provide defensive boons if they land.

^Very simple to implement. They both round up the hammer as a now decent weapon with its own little unique interaction with the Unleashed mechanic while not having to juggle between two types of skills within the same weapon that also share CDs anymore, which also makes it feel terrible to play.

 

-Unleashed mechanic

Two suggestions, one or the other (not both at the same time):

Added functionality to F2 Rending Vines (Unleashed pet F2). In addition to its current effects, now when you cast Rending Vines, the pet teleports back to you healing 30 or 50% of its HP, if the pet was dead it's revived instead and the CD of this skill is doubled. If this skill lands, the CD of Venomous Outburst (Unleashed pet F1) is reduced by 50%. 

Or

A chain skill to Venomous Outburst (Unleashed pet F1). When you cast Venomous Outburst, you unlock Hasty Retreat (or whatever) for 3 seconds. Your pet teleports back you and is healed for 30 or 50% of its HP, if the pet was dead it's revived instead and the CD of this skill is doubled.

This fixes two key things:

-Pet survivability

-Ranged pets now feel much better as they can regain their distance if you reposition far from your target.

Very few things feel worse than playing with a ranged pet to send it into an enemy's face. This massively undervalues a ranged pet's utility. Pet survivability in group play is also still a problem. This attempts to fix that in ways that are very simple and easy to implement.

 

-Visual ques (for when you're Unleashed and with Ambush skills)

When your character is Unleashed, your entire skill bar (or weapon skills) now has a very visual greenish cloudy effect (but not too visually distracting) to better indicate when you're Unleashed. The effect would be very similar to Virtue of Justice when it procs. It's very easy to lose track of when you're unleased or not unless you look at the tiny little pet skills, it becomes hard in the heat of battle, it should be much easier to identify visually. Having that green cloudy effect on the Unleashed pet would be nice too.

Ambush skills need more visual (or even sound) cues to know when they are ready. Implement a pop up effect with or without sound to know exactly when an ambush skill is ready. Or just let the tiny little icon on the right stay there forever and show its CD when an Ambush skill is used. Or just do both!

 

-General suggestion

When your pet dies, it immediately teleports back to the ranger. All ranger specs can now resurrect their own pets, the ranger kneels for 2 or 3 seconds to fully res their pet. Only the ranger can res their own pet. This should have been implemented a long time ago, no further explanation needed (I'm going to make a separate thread over this one soon).

 

-Things to fix

Ambush skills get interrupted by other attacks (specially autoattacks) all the time making them almost unusable. Please fix this.

^I'll update with new bugs and issues as I encounter them.

Edited December 1, 2021 by Khenzy.9348

[Rider.6024]

Just a few things about the new changes

 

1. Reducing the unleashed swap cd was really great, tbh it might be a little op in pvp but please dont go above 5s

 

2. cantrips feel much better now and are just perfect

 

3. ty for new keybinds for attack/return

 

4. the new unleashed weapon attacks are all great, but the 15s cd and short window couls be adjusted a bit, I reccomend 10s cd and 5s window that isnt canceled but not using #1 first

 

5.I kinda miss the animation but understandable that it had to be reduced to 3s fade out

 

6. pet death 60s cd is just too long in wvw and pvp, please reduce this if something more creative isnt in the works already, I really wanna frontline in wvw and melee in pvp teamfights on node

 

This is so far my favorite traitline in the entire game core / previous expacs included, so happy and thankful to everyone who made this happen!

[Loki.4871]

I reccomend a revenant-style effect to the hud, an 'unleashed' style borders with the vines and shimmering when the unleashed mechanic is on the player. While ambush mode is activated it could be a bit more 'overgrown' with it retreating when it expires?

When you unleash the pet, the border effect moves (visually or just dissappearing off the player's bar and appearing at the F buttons) to the pet's skills.

Idea to this is it would allow a player to very quickly and easily see who's got unleashed, now that it's no longer a permanent visual effect on the characters.

[Kaenaydar.5631]

11 hours ago, Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582 said:

I don't see how it ruins the spec to have the option of putting one or more of the pet skills on auto cast. Needing to press F1 & F3 every few seconds to get the same damage from your pet as Core Ranger is not a good thing and asking for that QoL with all the other things there are going on with this spec is definitely not laziness. 

How i feel about it as well when im in a raid or fractal its nice to just focus on what im doing with my own skills. I also often will let my pets tank while i revive someone so it will be nice to know my pets using its own skills while i help a friend. I see my pets as a partner and not something to micromanage every time im in the field. Its not laziness its just making something less complicated in certain areas. Aside from pet at current i rather like the Untamed class given i wasnt into Soul Beast and my marauder build didnt fit a druid. This Elite spec seems so far best suited for my play style with some tweaks here and there.

Edited December 1, 2021 by Kaenaydar.5631