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Bladesworn Changes 24/11/2021


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Full List of Bladesworn changes:

Dragon Trigger:

  • Dragon Trigger: The rate at which you gain charges has been sped up from 0.5s per charge to 0.25s per charge. Flow cost per charge has been reduced from 10 to 5.
  • Dragon Trigger: Entering Dragon Trigger now places your Gunsaber skills on 0.5s cooldown to prevent accidental use from canceling out Dragon Trigger.
  • Dragon Trigger: Exiting Dragon Trigger after using a Dragon Slash will no longer place Sheathe Gunsaber on cooldown.
  • Dragon Slash - Force: Coefficient on max charge reduced from 49.5 to 20.4 in PvE only.
  • Dragon Slash - Boost: Coefficient on max charge reduced from 24.8 to 10.2 in PvE only.
  • Dragon Slash - Boost: This skill is now considered a movement skill.
  • Dragon Slash - Boost: Reduced the movement speed of this skill by 40%. Distance traveled remains the same.
  • Dragon Slash - Reach: Coefficient on max charge reduced from 39.6 to 16.3 in PvE only.
  • Dragon Slash - Reach: Reduced the size of the projectile visual effect. Changed width of projectile to better match up with the visual effect.

Gunsaber:

  • Cyclone Trigger: This skill is no longer a projectile finisher.
  • Break Step: This skill is now a leap finisher.
  • Break Step: Reduced the movement speed of this skill by 40%. Distance traveled remains the same.
  • Break Step: This skill will now stop in front of your targeted opponent if you reach them before the skill ends.
  • Break Step: Radius of initial attack increased from 120 to 180.

Pistol:

  • Dragon's Roar: Pushback from using this skill is now determined by the amount of ammo expended from this skill.
  • Dragon's Roar: This skill is now considered a movement skill.

Utility Skills:

  • Flow Stabilizer: Now grants Fury when used, instead of Stability. The bonus effect is now triggered if you have Fury instead of Stability.
  • Signet of Fury: Fixed an issue where Signet of Fury granted adrenaline instead of flow when Bladesworn was also equipped.

Traits:

  • Fierce as Fire: This trait has been reworked. It now grants a stacking damage buff for each count of ammunition used.
  • Lush Forest now triggers when the first count of an ammunition skill is activated, instead of the last.
  • Lush Forest now has an internal cooldown of 1 second.
  • Lush Forest will now only recharge warrior skills, excluding Sheathe Gunsaber and Dragon Trigger.
  • Dragonscale Defense: No longer gives Protection when hit during Dragon Trigger. Instead, this trait now gives Stability when entering Dragon Trigger.
  • Immortal Dragon: Now also grants Protection per charge level gained during Dragon Trigger, in addition to its previous effects.
  • Unyielding Dragon: Now grants Might per charge level gained during Dragon Trigger, in addition to its previous effects. 
  • Daring Dragon: Now resets the cooldown of Dragonscale Defense whenever you reenter Dragon Trigger after using a Dragon Slash, in addition to its previous effects.

here is the list of changes from the Beta, do you think they hit the mark or still missing parts, discuss:

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Miss the mark. DT was not the issue the class had, not in PvE, nor in PvP. It was the Gunsaber itself not being great, and instead of buffing it, it looks like they nerfed it by making breakstep slower? 

Edit: Also Lush Forest nerf, while expected *and* justified just exarcerbates that.

Edited by UNOwen.7132
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29 minutes ago, Smoosh.2718 said:

Pistol:

  • Dragon's Roar: Pushback from using this skill is now determined by the amount of ammo expended from this skill.
  • Dragon's Roar: This skill is now considered a movement skill.

This part here is what I have the biggest issue for, Its still super janky to use, it still has such a short range you might as well just use Axe, Warhorn or shield.
The only big possitive out of this change is that now you can break imobolise every 5s gaining swiftness and flow.

I honestly wanted a pistol where you can actually see the projectile and have a mid-range option. What was the point of me making H.O.P.E. if I cant even see it in action?
 

Come on Anet, do something ballsy and really change that pistol into something that warrior does have already (I'm not talking nit picking 'but its an ammo skill on short cd' level stuff, I'm talking Ranged one handed, [Still the only class in the game held back with one handed ranged options])., this is the big part for me, not the explody stick.

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PvE perspective: Im pretty indifferent. I still think that this spec has no place in gw2, even if they really want to push it in that way.

- The faster charge is nice, so you get max damage faster (faster t3 bursts). The damage was reduced by like 60% for it. The problem is that you still spend a lot of time just standing around. A lot less though now thanks to lush forest nerfs. Also I see no fixes for the hitbox issues.

- Nothing much to say about the gunsaber changes.

- Even more pushback on pistol? Or less?

- Why not keep the stability on flow stabilizer next to the trait change? The other utilities are still not worth your while.

- Fierce as fire rework was pretty much mandatory and removed any condi damage related from the spec. It might be taken over lush forest now since that one got nuked hard.

- Good changes on the grandmaster traits since they were lackluster before. At least good for competitive and open world PvE. Still useless in group content sorry. I wonder how long the protection will be and how many stacks of stability you get from dragonscale defense. One stack would be a bit... low

 

All in all the dps should fall pretty hard now. I leave the testing to others but I would say that it wont get higher than 45k, probably only 40k (which would make it borderline Useless).

Edited by anbujackson.9564
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Just now, anbujackson.9564 said:

- Even more pushback on pistol? Or less?

Im still trying to get myheald around this, So in your mainhand you 100% have a melee weapon. yet your pistol pushes you away... why? The only weapon that pairs with is sword due to the leap.

Its been said so many times, this weapon needs to be made into the mainhand weapon and reworked to have actual range on its attacks.

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3 minutes ago, Smoosh.2718 said:

Im still trying to get myheald around this, So in your mainhand you 100% have a melee weapon. yet your pistol pushes you away... why? The only weapon that pairs with is sword due to the leap.

Its been said so many times, this weapon needs to be made into the mainhand weapon and reworked to have actual range on its attacks.

Next to that you still want to spend as little time as possible outside gunsaber because you cant access F2. At least I see no change for this 

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31 minutes ago, Smoosh.2718 said:

Im still trying to get myheald around this, So in your mainhand you 100% have a melee weapon. yet your pistol pushes you away... why? The only weapon that pairs with is sword due to the leap.

Pistol 4 is already a leap towards the target which you usually also want to use after using 5 to restock ammunition.

I think you make this a way bigger deal than it actually is.

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  • Dragon Slash - Force: Coefficient on max charge reduced from 49.5 to 20.4 in PvE only.
  • Dragon Slash - Boost: Coefficient on max charge reduced from 24.8 to 10.2 in PvE only.

 

If I'm not mistaken the burst will be cut heavily in PVE. That would reduce peak burst from ~85K to ~43K (~170K with 2.5s charge rather than 400K with 5s charge meaning ~66K DPS burst)  ... which means I don't believe you will take Bladesworn for burst DPS , sustained damage should mostly be intact since the time to charge is halved (  "Dragon Trigger: The rate at which you gain charges has been sped up from 0.5s per charge to 0.25s per charge. Flow cost per charge has been reduced from 10 to 5.").
It's still a hard sell for me as a spec, since holding down a button for seconds and then releasing is pretty mindless.

Edited by Infusion.7149
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To me, it seems to be step in right direction. However, some things were not adressed which is unfortunate, for example not being able to go into Dragon Trigger from any normal weaponset, or always going into Gunsaber after leaving DT.
In PvE, we will still be most likely camping Gunsaber with no reason leaving it. The point of Bladesworn will still be doing as many Dragon Slashes as frequently as possible and rest is irrelevant. We shall see.

Edit: Another thing not addressed in this balance patch: Gunsaber weapon stow. Fortunately, this was pointed out on Mighty Teapot's stream with CMC, so hopefully it will be added before EoD release.

Edited by cryorion.9532
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6 minutes ago, Vancho.8750 said:

Well this way berserker wouldn't be the worst PVP spec in the game. PROGRESS.

Bonus meme torch has more range than pistol.

😆

Bladesworn. Worst e-spec ever.

About the only feedback they listened to was changing Fierce as Fire and Lush Forest and making the charges on DT faster. They literally ignored all the other persistent feedback from all of us.

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13 minutes ago, DemonCrypto.6792 said:

Gaaah, i hate this is true.
Why they didn't make a real gun gameplay? now we're stuck with this kitten close combat gun.

GIVE US LONG RANGE MAIN HAND ANET , THIS IS A GUN.

Yeah, warrior has plenty of melee gameplay options already (spellbreaker is melee, power berserker is melee, core warrior is also melee). One would expect from Anet to give warrior something more different than rifleXgreatsword, but oh well. This is Cantha so it has to be asian themed spec and what fits better than samurai, right? #original

Gunner spec instead of Samurai is more appealing for me too, however, at this point, we just have to accept the fact that Bladesworn will not change drastically which means we will be stuck with lackluster "melee" pistol offhand and Gunsaber that we will camp during combat most of the time. They even wrote this "With this specialization, we're trying to deliver an homage to classic samurai films", which means there is no way they are going to change the theme of the spec (focus on katana looking Gunsaber). This sucks and we can't do much about it. Weebs won. 😡

Edited by cryorion.9532
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2 hours ago, Infusion.7149 said:

If I'm not mistaken the burst will be halved in PVE. That would reduce peak burst from ~85K to ~43K... which means I don't believe you will take Bladesworn for burst DPS , sustained damage should mostly be intact since the time to charge is halved ("Dragon Trigger: The rate at which you gain charges has been sped up from 0.5s per charge to 0.25s per charge. Flow cost per charge has been reduced from 10 to 5.").
It's still a hard sell for me as a spec, since holding down a button for seconds and then releasing is pretty mindless.

Cost and charging time reduced by half but CD remains the same, and now Lush Forest explicitly doesn't affect the CD of Dragon Trigger. It's a big DPS nerf considering how central Dragon Slash was to the rotation. It really depends on how good Fierce as Fire is, but I doubt it makes up for how degenerate the last iteration was. 

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Full List of Bladesworn changes:

Dragon Trigger:

  • Dragon Trigger: The rate at which you gain charges has been sped up from 0.5s per charge to 0.25s per charge. Flow cost per charge has been reduced from 10 to 5.
  • Dragon Trigger: Entering Dragon Trigger now places your Gunsaber skills on 0.5s cooldown to prevent accidental use from canceling out Dragon Trigger.
  • Dragon Trigger: Exiting Dragon Trigger after using a Dragon Slash will no longer place Sheathe Gunsaber on cooldown.
  • Dragon Slash - Force: Coefficient on max charge reduced from 49.5 to 20.4 in PvE only.
  • Dragon Slash - Boost: Coefficient on max charge reduced from 24.8 to 10.2 in PvE only.
  • Dragon Slash - Boost: This skill is now considered a movement skill.
  • Dragon Slash - Boost: Reduced the movement speed of this skill by 40%. Distance traveled remains the same.
  • Dragon Slash - Reach: Coefficient on max charge reduced from 39.6 to 16.3 in PvE only.
  • Dragon Slash - Reach: Reduced the size of the projectile visual effect. Changed width of projectile to better match up with the visual effect.

Gunsaber:

  • Cyclone Trigger: This skill is no longer a projectile finisher.
  • Break Step: This skill is now a leap finisher.
  • Break Step: Reduced the movement speed of this skill by 40%. Distance traveled remains the same.
  • Break Step: This skill will now stop in front of your targeted opponent if you reach them before the skill ends.
  • Break Step: Radius of initial attack increased from 120 to 180.

Pistol:

  • Dragon's Roar: Pushback from using this skill is now determined by the amount of ammo expended from this skill.
  • Dragon's Roar: This skill is now considered a movement skill.

Utility Skills:

  • Flow Stabilizer: Now grants Fury when used, instead of Stability. The bonus effect is now triggered if you have Fury instead of Stability.
  • Signet of Fury: Fixed an issue where Signet of Fury granted adrenaline instead of flow when Bladesworn was also equipped.

Traits:

  • Fierce as Fire: This trait has been reworked. It now grants a stacking damage buff for each count of ammunition used.
  • Lush Forest now triggers when the first count of an ammunition skill is activated, instead of the last.
  • Lush Forest now has an internal cooldown of 1 second.
  • Lush Forest will now only recharge warrior skills, excluding Sheathe Gunsaber and Dragon Trigger.
  • Dragonscale Defense: No longer gives Protection when hit during Dragon Trigger. Instead, this trait now gives Stability when entering Dragon Trigger.
  • Immortal Dragon: Now also grants Protection per charge level gained during Dragon Trigger, in addition to its previous effects.
  • Unyielding Dragon: Now grants Might per charge level gained during Dragon Trigger, in addition to its previous effects. 
  • Daring Dragon: Now resets the cooldown of Dragonscale Defense whenever you reenter Dragon Trigger after using a Dragon Slash, in addition to its previous effects.
  • I think all the Dragon Slash changes are great and will really improve the gameplay experience of the spec.
     
  • No notes of being able to go into Dragon Trigger straight from our normal weapon set - weapon swap CD was bugged last Beta Event, so we were locked into Gunsaber anyway, but not being able to access your burst skill from both "weapon sets" is absolutely a feelsbad pain point of the spec. 
     
  • Lush Forest explicitly not affecting Dragon Trigger, and having an ICD, probably also kills it as the DPS option in PVE, which is also good as the gameplay experience it incentivized was awful and I doubt flipping it around changes that. I hope Fierce as Fire is good enough to compensate for it.
     
  • No notes on reducing CDs across the board when obviously a large reason why the CDs were so astronomically high were because of the combined effects of Lush Forest and Tactical Reload existing. Now that Lush Forest has essentially been nerfed, it might be time to reassess? 
     
  • Nothing was done about Gunsaber itself feeling weak and ineffectual despite the spec being forced to use the weaponset.
    Previously you could say that all the power budget went into Dragon Slash and maybe justify it, but now the effectiveness of Dragon Slash has essentially been halved when playing optimally (using a full charge off CD), does that still hold true?

And finally IMO the most important thing:

  • Bladesworn is still taking up exactly the same mechanical space as Berserker as a DPS spec. It's been 9 years since Launch, EOD might be the last GW2 expac, we might not ever get another Elite Spec, does Warrior really not deserve to have some buildcraft variety? 
Edited by Jzaku.9765
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The Good: 

Trait changes are solid. Not as expansive as I would've supported, but solid in their own right imo.

Faster charging is lyfe

No canceling DT by using a skill too early is plus plus (i kittened myself over in quite a few 1vX panic spamming boost to create space then getting nothing out of it)

Weapon swap will actually be usable \o/

The Bad:

Reduced movement speed on Boost and Break step is unfortunate, though I will have to see how it plays. Unless they removed the aftercast and cast on breakstep, this is saddening to me, i liked having the zoomies 😞

The Ugly:
Gun Saber 2 damage wasnt changed in competitive modes, meaning the kit will continue to have no melee presence, handicapping it. It needs about a 50% increase to its damage to have gunsaber have any sort of real melee ability. 

As seemingly the only warrior main who enjoyed competitive mode bladesworn in beta 2, I think these changes are a net positive, as most of the negative views i have of it are from a lack of things changing rather than the actual changes being bad (except the reduced movement speed). The key change I wouldve liked to have seen would have been to increase damage on GB2 (seriously important). However, I'm avoiding any sort of strong opinions on it until I play it in the next beta. Things I'll be looking out for;

does decreased charge time increase the effectiveness of my 1 charge slashes and give me more playability when i can land a 5-8 charge? 

Did they remove the initial cast and aftercast on breakstep? (this is a big one with the reduced movement speed)

Just my thoughts, though my thoughts on blade tend to be different than most people's xD

edit: the lack of additional traits working off of explosions is once again some what confusing for a spec that introduces them, especially since I think there’s a lot of potential for explosions to work within the especially to give it a lot of different flavors. Then again what do I know, I’m just a rando on the internet.

Edited by oscuro.9720
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Lush Forests definitely needed to be changed. Using the first charge to reduce the CD has some interesting potential, and the gameplay is roughly similar to how it was previously (last charge + tactical reload + last charge + wait + Tactical Reload + last charge is now first charge + Tactical Reload + First Charge + Wait + Tactical Reload + First Charge), and the 1s ICD isn't too huge of a change.

The decrease to the Dragon Trigger coefficient was higher than I expected (59% coefficient reduction) and the loss of reducing Dragon Trigger cooldown hurts. It's possible Gunsaber CD/numbers are undocumented changes, but we'll have to see how this plays out.

I'm curious about Fierce as Fire. Depending on the buff (% increase, duration, max stacks) it's possible that it could provide the damage bump that Gunsaber needed to really shine. I still think that PvE Gunsaber cooldowns should be the same as PvP/WvW (i.e. reduce PvE CD by 50%), but we'll have to see how it all hangs together.

Stability on entering Dragon Trigger is mint--Fingers crossed it's 2-3 stacks for 5s, but I suppose getting 1stack for 3s is good enough. Just need some sort of insurance (Necromancers are probably tittering in the audience).

The reduction of movement speed on different skills is odd. Not sure how that will play out. It was probably to stop the meme-leaps that people were seeing out of the water in WvW.

Immortal Dragon will be great for tanky builds stacking up protection and healing.

Unyielding Dragon getting Might is... okay. Honestly Warrior has never really had issues with generating might. I guess it's just a "nice to have" to hit 25 stacks solo more reliably.

Daring Dragon looks quite interesting as you'll be getting multiple T2 bursts off back to back. It's possible that will become the new "fast dps" trait, but again we'll have to see when Lord Hizen & Co. get their mitts on the spec.

I am disappointed that they didn't add a mainhand pistol, although I understand that it'd be tricky to create/implement with a 2 month turnaround especially if they are still focusing on other aspects of the game. Hopefully they include it in the final release as, like everyone else has said, Warrior does NOT need another offhand (especially a DPS weapon that's literally offhand Axe with extra steps). It's fine if we keep the offhand pistol because why not, but it would be great to get mainhand. I want to go Pistol/Shield.

And of course: Dragon Trigger NEEDS to be accessible in both weapon sets to make the 2nd weapon set usable. There's no way around that, it 100% needs to be accessible in both otherwise they might as well not include pistol and just release the spec with Gunsaber only. Yes, it's possible that you use all Gunsaber skills --> Dragon Trigger --> Weapon Swap --> use all 2nd set skills --> Weapon Swap to Gunsaber --> rinse & repeat, but that feels quite bleh.

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3 hours ago, Jzaku.9765 said:
  • Nothing was done about Gunsaber itself feeling weak and ineffectual despite the spec being forced to use the weaponset.

This is a big one imo. It really revolves around 1 skill (at least in competitive modes); Gun Saber 2. For a long cast time and obvious animation it does very little damage. This is the primary melee pressure on the kit, which results in the kit playing very weak in melee range and functioning predominantly as a mid range. This is extra concerning with the reduced movement speed on break step so it may be harder to kite. 

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Not as bad changes as I'd expect. Still, this should be the natural way for the spec to go. It was borderline unplayable. 

 

What I don't like: lack of explosion synergy, fierce as fire becoming yet another buff trait, flow stabilizer losing it's AoE possibility of stab share to give Fury like we don't have ways to get selfish Fury, DT not being used in normal weapons. 

 

Even worse: PvP joke coeffs, Dragon Slash will still not be able to land I am calling it rn. 

Edited by Grand Marshal.4098
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