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Can you finally delete LEADERBOARD from the game?


DKD.2398

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Stop this nonsense

What is this game system? Games that can't be won because you get to the team of players 500 raiting smaller. For such a game -22 raiting (it doesn't matter at score, you can have 30 kills 0 deaths but still -22). And if you are lucky and win you will get +5.This is the first reason why Ranked is very frustrating for many people. Another reason when you reach something in the leaderboard and then you lose it. Everyone is immediately toxic people are cursing in teamchats. Some people care about it and some don't. Someone just afk the game and ppl loses their title or place in the leaderboard because of it.They start cursing right away and the game is even more toxic. No one of the top player are interested in raiting anymore. Almost every best player hates this system. Let's tell the truth. Today is the time when many people are looking for a way to make things easier. Someone shares an account with a better player to win his title. Someone pays the players to help them win in DuoQ. Someone asks friends to give Q at once and then when they play against each other just throw game. Someone gives Q only when it's night and has a small population (in fact, you can do it anytime) . Normal and most balanced games are when some best player twitches (this is the time when most better players give Q to have at least a little Fun from the game). Currently in the EU more people play AT on Tuesday at 7 in the morning, like Ranked Arena at saturday prime time. 

And LEADERBORD can be responsible for all this, which has ruined all the fun in the game. PvP has never been so bad as now . Remove the entire LEADERBOARD system. Keep it for AT / MAT that's the place to show players who is good or not. We still see a lot of names in TOP and i never see them play in MAT or AT. Why? when they are so good. Return the back pips system or Just keep the Division system without anyone seeing the raiting. And most importantly, cancel all the title rewards for the season.It ruined the whole game. Leave the reward for the season in items. Let us have a title for the number of games (god of wvw is for 10k rank) why don't we have something for 1k rank in pvp and so on? to motivate people to play .Make a normal peaceful place with pvp again. Without the possibility of cheating.No wintrade will interest anyone because it will not have why. Do you want to be the best? go AT / MAT ..

 

 


 

 
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3 hours ago, Avatar.3568 said:

If you don't see them in at's or mat's it's mostly because there games get not streamed or they play at 11pm 2am. Most top player are playing in mat and it's often a pretty stacked tournament 

The game was mostly dead before mats were even introduced.

anyone that tries in this game besides for the lolz has gotta be daft.

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4 hours ago, Avatar.3568 said:

If you don't see them in at's or mat's it's mostly because there games get not streamed or they play at 11pm 2am. Most top player are playing in mat and it's often a pretty stacked tournament 

Nah it's true.

There are a lot of people who ride into top 50 who don't play ATs because they are in truth only mediocre. And likewise, there are a lot of really strong players in ATs who don't even play ranked anymore because it has been reduced to a theater where people RP that they are pvping but don't actually pvp.

 

This was all that needed to be said on the topic, and I couldn't support it more:

7 hours ago, DKD.2398 said:


Stop this nonsense

 

Edited by Trevor Boyer.6524
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8 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Nah it's true.

There are a lot of people who ride into top 50 who don't play ATs because they are in truth only mediocre. And likewise, there are a lot of really strong players in ATs who don't even play ranked anymore because it has been reduced to a theater where people RP that they are pvping but don't actually pvp.

 

This was all that needed to be said on the topic, and I couldn't support it more:

 

 

 

Exactly and mainly this is the reason why pvp is dead. mMany peaple dont play becouse of LEADERBOARD demotivated them . They are 100 times better but they can't stay in the top 50 either. And the further the pvp level goes down and the people leave the game or pvp. I don't know how long arenanet will be waiting (maybe they don't care).

 

 

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The leaderboard is fine, but:

  •  People manipulating it need to be given permanent, visible dishonor,
  • you need to have a paid  account to be visible on the leaderboards, so that if you get banned you cant just ban evade and keep climbing and have to buy another account to return.
  • Rating needs to be more intelligently distributed, with more rating given to individuals in a team that contribute the highest percentages of team effort in skewed matchups, and less given to duos.
  • (Optionally) Premades need to be available in ranked, but rating gain needs to be slower based on how full the premade is, with more rating being given to the pugs if they manage to win. 
Edited by Azure The Heartless.3261
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21 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

 

 

 

So ..

"People manipulating it need to be given permanent, visible dishonor,"

But you don't know who is really manipulating the match . I'll give you an example. I ended up somewhere in the top 30 this season without cheating wintrade or other manipulation. I didn't dodge any good players or queue for a character i can kill quickly and i play solo all season. BUT! What if next season i ask two my friends who are at the same level as me to give que at the same time like me. When the population is the smallest what is out of prime time still. So basicly I will still play a game where out of 9 players there are 2 with me and it doesn't matter if they will be against me or with me. We will always try to make win for me.And no one can say anything because unfortunately it's no wintrade we just play ranked together because we enjoy it there .. We can say we do it to make the games more balanced .. so we put que at one time. You can't give us ban for that. Thats why the leaderboard makes no sense in this game .. People just leaving the game because of that . I have more than 15k games on the main account.and Believe me, I  played 60+ games a day and I met many times that I played all day against the same players. so it's very realistic to play against people you know. Especially if you queue at the same time.
 

 

"you need to have a paid  account to be visible on the leaderboards, so that if you get banned you cant just ban evade and keep climbing and have to buy another account to return."

The basic game costs 1 euro in eshop. I don't think it is so much. it won't solve anything. And if someone gets ban, they can easily buy a full acc for 30 euros. Or in discount for all datadisk 10e.

"Rating needs to be more intelligently distributed, with more rating given to individuals in a team that contribute the highest percentages of team effort in skewed matchups, and less given to duos"

Sometimes you go to a far where you keep two players on you all the time.
You can have the low dmg heal with team. you won't kill anyone but you still do the most for the team. And then you get less raiting for that? how does someone who support + dps and 10 minutes beat each other and can't be killed? will they get more? that's stupid.

 

"(Optionally) Premades need to be available in ranked, but rating gain needs to be slower based on how full the premade is, with more rating being given to the pugs if they manage to win. "

Premades need own board where raiting will finally mean something. Of course raiting must be for AT / MAT. Otherwise it will be about who will farm more low lvl teams.Because some better teams would dodge Queue agains strong team . We already had such a leaderboard here.

 

 

 

Edited by bdevatsedem.8354
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6 hours ago, bdevatsedem.8354 said:

But you don't know who is really manipulating the match . I'll give you an example. I ended up somewhere in the top 30 this season without cheating wintrade or other manipulation. I didn't dodge any good players or queue for a character i can kill quickly and i play solo all season. BUT! What if next season i ask two my friends who are at the same level as me to give que at the same time like me. When the population is the smallest what is out of prime time still. So basicly I will still play a game where out of 9 players there are 2 with me and it doesn't matter if they will be against me or with me. We will always try to make win for me.And no one can say anything because unfortunately it's no wintrade we just play ranked together because we enjoy it there .. We can say we do it to make the games more balanced .. so we put que at one time. You can't give us ban for that. Thats why the leaderboard makes no sense in this game .. People just leaving the game because of that . I have more than 15k games on the main account.and Believe me, I  played 60+ games a day and I met many times that I played all day against the same players. so it's very realistic to play against people you know. Especially if you queue at the same time.

Sure, but this is more about sending the message that wintrading is being actively moderated. I am sure there will be some cases that look like wintrading, but aren't. That's for Anet to moderate and ultimately decide in the event that people slip up and expose themselves.

Quote

"you need to have a paid  account to be visible on the leaderboards, so that if you get banned you cant just ban evade and keep climbing and have to buy another account to return."The basic game costs 1 euro in eshop. I don't think it is so much. it won't solve anything. And if someone gets ban, they can easily buy a full acc for 30 euros. Or in discount for all datadisk 10e.

I am referring to full accounts here, as in an account with any expansion unlocked, or one of the legacy Heroic edition variants that includes the base game.
Even if the sum is paltry, this is better than what we are currently doing to discourage ban evasion. It definitely won't completely address the issue, but it'll add another hurdle for people that are insistent on manipulating rating. 

Quote


"Rating needs to be more intelligently distributed, with more rating given to individuals in a team that contribute the highest percentages of team effort in skewed matchups, and less given to duos"

Sometimes you go to a far where you keep two players on you all the time.
You can have the low dmg heal with team. you won't kill anyone but you still do the most for the team. And then you get less raiting for that? how does someone who support + dps and 10 minutes beat each other and can't be killed? will they get more? that's stupid.

I'm thinking a higher rating gain for pugs only, a higher rating loss for duos/premades, and a lower rating loss for pug members that contribute highly to one of the conquest aspects. Ideally, you trade some rating speed for duo queueing, and if you get stuck in a team you cant pull entirely, you can buffer your loss by doing something other than afking. If you have a better solution for that, go for it, but something has to be done. 

Quote

Premades need own board where raiting will finally mean something. Of course raiting must be for AT / MAT. Otherwise it will be about who will farm more low lvl teams.Because some better teams would dodge Queue agains strong team . We already had such a leaderboard here.

Fair point. I'm aware its going to be farmfest if it is delivered poorly.

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Removal of the leader board removes the reason to get better at the game and have the journey of learning. If you tihnk the games are bad now imagine when people have nothing to play for outside gold rewards it would make it no different from pve which would destroy the pure pvp population and vastly decrease the quality of the games not to say the quality of games is high now but if you think they can't get any lower oh man i have some news for you.

This is not a prediction by the way you can trust me on this that is what will happen if you remove the leader board.

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16 hours ago, Genesis.5169 said:

Removal of the leader board removes the reason to get better at the game and have the journey of learning. If you tihnk the games are bad now imagine when people have nothing to play for outside gold rewards it would make it no different from pve which would destroy the pure pvp population and vastly decrease the quality of the games not to say the quality of games is high now but if you think they can't get any lower oh man i have some news for you.

This is not a prediction by the way you can trust me on this that is what will happen if you remove the leader board.



People like you shouldn't write anything on the forum .If anet takes an example from people like you, we can't be surprised that the game is in a very bad state. And this is the big mistake that most of the posts in the from are from players who have max Gold3 division in the game. You don't know what you're writing about but you're writing . Have you ever played pvp in the past and now? . People are still leaving and it's worse . Before there was no leaderboard and pvp was played by many more people than today. And it was much better. Have you ever seen twitch? are you watching the top players in the game? Or you just read the whole day forum??? .NA a year ago was in a state like the EU today. Do you know what the NA looks like today? not? so wait a year, it will be the same for the EU.
What reward do you think? We play pvp because we enjoy not because of rewards.Many people dont want to reward titles and other things that have no value or significance. I have a title for the top 10 and I will never use it and I will not be a trash title as well as God Of Pvp. It has no value for people who have a skill and get a little more acquainted with the game. You have seen what is currently happening in the EU or NA. Who got the title of the best player in the game? P1 division players have Legendary titles. and players who are at the TOP level every day are on twitch and they play honestly like a god, they are pushed out of this bad player from top position.Or players who regularly win AT or MAT tournaments will barely stay in the top 50. I want a normal game balanced with top players where I know 100% that it is not manipulated. And that's what most people want. I think inhouse will be the future of PVP. And the rankings are left for people what need wintrad and manipulate the games because they want a title . I have titles from almost every season and they are useless to me same as for most players. But let's not forget that when someone wants to get a title they don't have and can't get it honestly he has to manipulate 120 games per season . And that's just one man but unfortunately there is a lot of them in the game every season. And because of such people, a lot of people don't turn on this game.
Just don't write things you know nothing about

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53 minutes ago, machkop.7951 said:



People like you shouldn't write anything on the forum .If anet takes an example from people like you, we can't be surprised that the game is in a very bad state. And this is the big mistake that most of the posts in the from are from players who have max Gold3 division in the game. You don't know what you're writing about but you're writing . Have you ever played pvp in the past and now? . People are still leaving and it's worse . Before there was no leaderboard and pvp was played by many more people than today. And it was much better. Have you ever seen twitch? are you watching the top players in the game? Or you just read the whole day forum??? .NA a year ago was in a state like the EU today. Do you know what the NA looks like today? not? so wait a year, it will be the same for the EU.
What reward do you think? We play pvp because we enjoy not because of rewards.Many people dont want to reward titles and other things that have no value or significance. I have a title for the top 10 and I will never use it and I will not be a trash title as well as God Of Pvp. It has no value for people who have a skill and get a little more acquainted with the game. You have seen what is currently happening in the EU or NA. Who got the title of the best player in the game? P1 division players have Legendary titles. and players who are at the TOP level every day are on twitch and they play honestly like a god, they are pushed out of this bad player from top position.Or players who regularly win AT or MAT tournaments will barely stay in the top 50. I want a normal game balanced with top players where I know 100% that it is not manipulated. And that's what most people want. I think inhouse will be the future of PVP. And the rankings are left for people what need wintrad and manipulate the games because they want a title . I have titles from almost every season and they are useless to me same as for most players. But let's not forget that when someone wants to get a title they don't have and can't get it honestly he has to manipulate 120 games per season . And that's just one man but unfortunately there is a lot of them in the game every season. And because of such people, a lot of people don't turn on this game.
Just don't write things you know nothing about

This game already obscures post game stats..
This game gives you rewards win or lose..
Your angry at something that apparently doesn't affect you because you play for fun, i have no idea how or why you think more removal of content will bring players back as its been doing the opposite all this time. I'm not exactly sure after saying you only play for fun you continue on about wintrading. Then you go on to say well i have titles already so i don't care well you have the titles already my friend you have done the journey and did the grind and now you want to take that away from other people because you play for fun and don't care about the competitive nature of pvp.

Did i miss anything?

Edited by Genesis.5169
P.S. I'm sure the people who are left in pvp play it for fun as you said the population is low. You can do two things at once.
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46 minutes ago, Genesis.5169 said:

This game already obscures post game stats..
This game gives you rewards win or lose..
Your angry at something that apparently doesn't affect you because you play for fun, i have no idea how or why you think more removal of content will bring players back as its been doing the opposite all this time. I'm not exactly sure after saying you only play for fun you continue on about wintrading. Then you go on to say well i have titles already so i don't care well you have the titles already my friend you have done the journey and did the grind and now you want to take that away from other people because you play for fun and don't care about the competitive nature of pvp.

Did i miss anything?



Yes you don't know what you're talking about again. 


"This game already obscures post game stats.." 
wow perfect I have all the top states after most games . Great i have a 30 kill- 0 death all game i farmed gold players for lunch on tuesday . this is exactly what I enjoy . straight I can play unranked. or my own arena vs bot. NOOOO! I enjoy the game at prime time when the game has more top players has ever before and we have balanced games.Which is almost never due to the low population. And low population is mainly due to LEADERBORD which discouraged people from playing.


This game gives you rewards win or lose..

For me it is the biggest reward balanced game that ends in a 15 minute timer end or a difference in points by a minimum.


Your angry at something that apparently doesn't affect you because you play for fun, i have no idea how or why you think more removal of content will bring players back as its been doing the opposite all this time.

This stupid content discourages people from playing and does not attract anyone.Makes people toxic and forces them to manipulate wintrade or anyhow cheat .
Anet can still keep divisions so you will have to play to get some reward or better reward for example . but no one will see the stupid wintrade leaderboard . and mainly no one will need wintrade or manipulate 120 game every season to get the division what he needs . The best would be to return the back pips system where when you got some division you cant dropped back. Everyone should have a reason to play.The best players can prove their skill in tournaments that cannot be manipulated . And get your title there . The title could be given to the last teams as well as now for 250 positions. 

Then you go on to say well i have titles already so i don't care well you have the titles already my friend you have done the journey and did the grind and now you want to take that away from other people because you play for fun and don't care about the competitive nature of pvp.

No. Titles have no value for anyone who has them. they don't show you how well you know play or how good a player you are. Calmly let anet remove them from the game .Currently they mean nothing to any good player ... and for those who yes, they are just manipulators. Do you want to win a title? deserve it where it can't be manipulated by fraud.

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Videogames are not sports at all. Leaderboard never show true skill rating. You can cheat other players easily. Play videogames as social communication tool, don't play videogames for competitive sportslike. Especially this Guild Wars 2 is not sportslike competitive. And If you feel frustrated/uneasy to communicate/colaborate with different experience/knowledge/skill/language players, you better leave from this game. It is pain.

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3 hours ago, machkop.7951 said:

snip

I believe anet should just enforce the rules instead of destroying the leaderboard and thats where we depart and always will. And i don't believe obscuring anything helps anything all it does is reinforce bad behavior and makes it harder to see who's throwing in your game. Imagine if you had real post game stats where you can compare people you could easily find the guy throwing in p3 for those wintrades instead of having to guess and do some indepth investigative work you could just report the guy in game because his stats are terrible for his rating and with enough reports a GM should investigate and see he's losing against a particular group of players.

All these little slices at pvp is what makes people quit, year by year you and people like you demand a slice of the game to remove and with it you remove a slice of the community and after 9 years of slicing away amulets sigils runes builds damage underwater combat, i just dont think slicing away the leaderboard will do anything different then just slicing off another segment of the community who wont return.
 

@pukish.5784I'm here for the gameplay as the combat here is unique, i just like to know i'm good player by having something to compare myself to.

1 hour ago, pukish.5784 said:

snip

Edited by Genesis.5169
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5 hours ago, pukish.5784 said:

Videogames are not sports at all. Leaderboard never show true skill rating. You can cheat other players easily. Play videogames as social communication tool, don't play videogames for competitive sportslike. Especially this Guild Wars 2 is not sportslike competitive. And If you feel frustrated/uneasy to communicate/colaborate with different experience/knowledge/skill/language players, you better leave from this game. It is pain.

Don't tell people how they should play the game.

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What a nice thread. Delete conditions, remove CC, now delete the ladder itself... the only thing we're missing is a "delete stealth" thread now, and we'd be set for the week.

And yes I agree, deleting integral and core parts of the game is a good thing. After all when your arm hurts, what else can you do but cutting it off? The inconvenience clearly outweights the utility.

 

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