Skills that should be fixed or polished.

[Antycypator.9874]

Sometimes I'm heavily annoyed with specific skills and their features, nature, like unnecessary pathing or requirements.

1. Shadow Flare.

We don't have much AoE skills on Deadeye. Shadow Flare is fine for cleave, but who never saw it landing in half way because of slighty not-flat terrain, then should throw his Shadow Flare at me first... it probably won't hit me anyways. This is a projectile and I think it's trajectory should be fixed.

2. Deadeye's Mark and "no line of sight".

Ever tried to mark an Octovine? Or maybe some structures like forged cannons? Yea, it doesn't work.

3. Shadow Gust.

I still have no idea why does it require a valid path to target.

4. Bounding Dodger (Grandmaster trait /Daredevil).

Everything would be perfect if it could deal that blow only in combat.

5. Smoke Bomb (downed skill).

Because 1 second of stealth feels like nothing in downed state. This should come with longer stealth or AoE blind pulse.

Edited January 7, 2022 by Antycypator.9874
typo

[kash.9213]

Pathing issues are a pain. 

I'm not always in combat right away when I carry a Bounding Dodger down range through Infiltrators Arrow. I know accidently starting a fight with npcs who can one shot you or before your team is ready to start a phase is disruptive but I'd rather just be careful with that.

[Tails.9372]

There sure are a lot of skills and traits, that could use some changes / fixes / improvements.

For traits:

In Critical Strikes:

Signets of Power: 

Change the activation condition from "on kill" to "on crit" and reduce the might gain from the additional Assassin's Signet passive down to one stack / the healing from the additional Signet of Malice passive down to 10% / the endurance gain from the additional Signet of Agility passive to 20% of what it curently is.

Sundering Shade:

Just bring back Sundering Strikes and increase the proc chance to 100%.

Deadly Aim:

Similar to Sundering Shade, just remove it and bring back Ricochet.

In Deadeye:

Collateral Damage:

For Burst of Shadows: reduce the damage and blindness duration, remove the ICD and change the activation condition from "on kill" to "upon hitting the marked target"

Silent Scope:

Change "Enter stealth when you dodge roll with a rifle equipped." to "While your Malice is maxed out replace Brutal Aim / Deadly Aim with Death's Judgment".

For Weapon skills:

For Rifle:

For Brutal Aim, Death's Judgment, Skirmisher's Shot, Double Tap:

Change the attack range to 1500.

For Deadly Aim, Death's Judgment (while affected by "Kneel"), Spotter's Shot, Three Round Burst:

Change the attack range to 3000.

For Kneel:

While under the effect of "Kneel" periodically apply Stability to the player (every second for one second).

For main hand Pistol:

For Vital Shot:

Remove the aftercast.

For Bola Shot:

Swap the effects of Bola Shot and Measured Shot.

For off hand Dagger:

For Cloak and Dagger:

Replace the stab with a dagger throw (range: 900).

For main hand Scepter:

For Shadow Sap:

Turn it into a 600 range ground targeted shadow step.

For the "Dual Wield" profession mechanic:

In general:

Using the same type of weapon in both your main and your off hand should also replace the weapon skill 1 with a "dual wield attack".

For the Pistol / Pistol weapon set:

For weapon skill 1:

Move Unload from 3 to 1. Remove both the initative cost as well as the initiative gain.

For weapon skill 3:

Add a small scale AoE skill.

For the Pistol / Dagger weapon set:

For Shadow Strike:

Remove the forced teleport and replace the stab with a dagger throw (range: 900).

For the Scepter / Pistol weapon set:

For Measured Shot:

As mentined above: Swap the effects of Measured Shot and Bola Shot.

For "well" type skills in general:

If they are offensive in nature don't make them shadow steps.

For Elite skills:

For Thieves Guild:

Make them work as "always active until defeated" like the necro minions (in fact make this the standard for all "minion summoning" skills).

For Shadow Meld (PvE only):

Tripple the applied Stealth duration.

 

12 hours ago, Antycypator.9874 said:

2. Deadeye's Mark and "no line of sight".

Ever tried to mark an Octovine? Or maybe some structures like forged cannons? Yea, it doesn't work.

The first thing has been reported as a bug years ago, sadly still no response / fix. The "no line of sight" is also a big problem and has been reported multiple times, it's especially annoying in WvW.

Edited January 7, 2022 by Tails.9372

[SoftPup.3048]

9 hours ago, Antycypator.9874 said:

2. Deadeye's Mark and "no line of sight".

 

Ever tried to mark an Octovine? Or maybe some structures like forged cannons? Yea, it doesn't work.

I've stopped playing Deadeye in open world because of this. Really needs to be fixed because it makes Deadeye unusable in certain events.

[BobbyT.7192]

4 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

For Cloak and Dagger:

Replace the stab with a dagger throw (range: 900).

Hard to see them making this range, nor would you want it with all the projectile hate in the game. And they definitely wouldn't make an initiative based stealth skill unblockable.

4 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

For Bola Shot:

Swap the effects of Bola Shot and Measured Shot

So you want the ally support part as well? Other than that seems like a down grade for bola shot.

4 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

For Vital Shot:

Remove the aftercast.

That happen before that was caused by a bug, they "fixed it" pretty fast.

Edited January 7, 2022 by BobbyT.7192

[Antycypator.9874]

5 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

For Kneel:

While under the effect of "Kneel" periodically apply Stability to the player (every second for one second).

This would be massive boost and probably for no reason.

 

5 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

Replace the stab with a dagger throw (range: 900).

Dagger throw is already on 4th skill (OH dagger). I was thinking about teleporting behind your target and stabbing it (just like Caithe's ambush attack, but it would be probably too powerful + lazy gameplay, no rewarding).

 

5 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

Change "Enter stealth when you dodge roll with a rifle equipped." to "While your Malice is maxed out replace Brutal Aim / Deadly Aim with Death's Judgment".

Or Death's Retreat/Sniper Cover.

[Tails.9372]

1 hour ago, BobbyT.7192 said:

So you want the ally support part as well?

Only the "enemy target" part.

1 hour ago, BobbyT.7192 said:

Other than that seems like a down grade for bola shot.

Quite the opposite, what MH pistol on thief is lacking is mobility and this would provide it with a disengage.

1 hour ago, BobbyT.7192 said:

That happen before that was caused by a bug, they "fixed it" pretty fast.

Only after some ridiculous complaint on one of the competitive subforums claiming that there was "no counterplay" to it. But the fact of the matter is that even without the aftercast other ranged AAs were still outperforming it and the general feedback was overwhelmingly positive.

1 hour ago, Antycypator.9874 said:

This would be massive boost and probably for no reason.

The reason is in the logic of the skill itself as the whole point of a "sniper stance" is to increase stability. Also a buff here would be justifiable as the inability to "WASD" is a rather big drawback.

Edited January 7, 2022 by Tails.9372

[Antycypator.9874]

3 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

The reason is in the logic of the skill itself as the whole point of a "sniper stance" is to increase stability. Also a buff here would be justifiable as the inability to "WASD" is a rather big drawback.

Many skills have got literally zero logic behind them, but think about perma stability. You don't want players to be literall turrets, that can't be even knocked down off their stance.

[Tails.9372]

3 hours ago, Antycypator.9874 said:

but think about perma stability. You don't want players to be literall turrets, that can't be even knocked down off their stance

I think you're overstating the impact of perma stability in sniper stance a bit. Thief is not a tanky class so a deadeye could still easily be damage pressured off of his position. "perma stability" would be a lot more impactfull outside of kneel but the low duration would make you loose stability the moment you go out of it.

[Lithril Ashwalker.6230]

Id like to see Collateral Damage work better in wvw and pvp where it procs on Downed State trigger AND death.

 

Also add that Seal Area should stop anyone getting in or out without stability. Right now you can heartseeker and clip through it...thicken the walls of it, its a kitten bubble so even if they jump it would keep em in or out.

 

The current power well for specter needs an entire rework, make it a massive boonrip well that steals boons from those that hit and gives to allies around you as well as yourself. If they already have the boon stolen and shared, its refreshed for like 10 seconds.  Any boon intensity tjats greater than yours that was stolen is overwritten and you give and gain that better, higher value instead

 

Bountiful Theft removes full stacks of might and other boons but only gives you  stack bck to you and allies, its not very bountiful and doesnt feel rewarding...allow it to share full stacks, intensity and duration of that which is greater to yourself and nearby allies. If your value is higher, your values are applied, if target's value is higher, its applied.

Improvisation should increase tethers by 1 since we will lose access to stolen skills.

[Jugglemonkey.8741]

On 2/3/2022 at 6:24 PM, Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:

Improvisation should increase tethers by 1 since we will lose access to stolen skills.

I like the other stuff, but this in particular is a great suggestion. We need incentive to run something other than SA Trickery Specter, at the moment Critical Strikes is only run for the damage if people don't need SA and there is no real reason to run Acrobatics or kitten, this would give you an interesting reason to do so that isn't just numbers based. 

[NorthernRedStar.3054]

I'd love to see Collateral Damage buffed, but it obviously needs to be separated between WvW and PvE. Then again, I doubt DE will ever overtake DD in serious encounters with cleave either way. Kneel is the issue, and I wouldn't go around changing that. I might, however, experiment with removing the initiative cost on its cast - that would smooth things out A LOT.

On 1/7/2022 at 6:41 AM, Tails.9372 said:

For Thieves Guild:

Make them work as "always active until defeated" like the necro minions (in fact make this the standard for all "minion summoning" skills).

For Shadow Meld (PvE only):

Tripple the applied Stealth duration.

Shadow Meld is already a very good elite, it does not need buffs - particularly of this scale. Thieves Guild is already a decent pick for non-CC scenarios in both PvE and PvP. I'm sure no one would appreciate a condi dd buff. As a side node, they should absolutely undo the brutal SoA nerf.

 

On 2/3/2022 at 8:24 PM, Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:

its not very bountiful and doesnt feel rewarding..

You get a massive duration of vigor. That's a very underappreciated part.

[cyberzombie.7348]

Caltrops comes to mind for unpolished skills. With one change I always had in mind is to make it a throwable aoe much like shadow flare. Invigorating precision could also use some love since the global damage nerf made its healing negligible.

[Tails.9372]

11 hours ago, NorthernRedStar.3054 said:

Shadow Meld is already a very good elite, it does not need buffs - particularly of this scale.

If you're going after "needs" than nothing in specific "needs" to even exist but that's not the point of this thread. 3 seconds of self stealth on a 45 second CD is completely useless in PvE outside of stealth attacks (for which the duration doesn't matter that much) and resetting your malice on weapon sets other than the one the e-spec is based around and there are already other skills that let you do that with more benefits on top of it. You can't even use it to effectively open a chest / gather some materials as the stealth runs out before the action finishes. This kind of buff doesn't give you extra stealth attacks either nor has it any other negative impact on PvE. So no, there are various reasons as for why it should be buffed in PvE and "it doesn't need it" is not a valid argument against them.

11 hours ago, NorthernRedStar.3054 said:

Thieves Guild is already a decent pick for non-CC scenarios in both PvE and PvP.

And yet is overall lackluster and outclassed as it's still balanced vs. core Tyria trash mobs so having a duration limit at all is rather unjustified and the CD could also use a rework. This would mostly be a QoL buff anyway and I don't think that things shouldn't be improved just because they're not completely unusable.

Edited February 6, 2022 by Tails.9372

[NorthernRedStar.3054]

11 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

3 seconds of self stealth on a 45 second CD is completely useless in PvE outside of stealth attacks

It's an integral part of DE's DPS rotation. I'm not really sure what else you want - it can be used to break aggro, reposition, salvage a rotation failure, etc. But most importantly, it sees play in higher levels of content. And you can trait it to give 8 seconds of stealth in total - no combo fields etc required. That's not exactly bad if you want to skip content.

 

11 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

And yet is overall lackluster and outclassed

Uh, no? It's a great skill to use for burst phases in legy bounty solo. As long as venom share works w/ the ads, it cannot have an infinite duration.

[NorthernRedStar.3054]

15 hours ago, cyberzombie.7348 said:

Caltrops comes to mind for unpolished skills. With one change I always had in mind is to make it a throwable aoe much like shadow flare. Invigorating precision could also use some love since the global damage nerf made its healing negligible.

What kinda gear are you running if you call the healing negligible? It already makes any core area boss redundant on glassy stats. If anything, the healing is really high, it allows you to TANK full stacks of Legendary Bonekinner death aura as long as you keep on hitting something. That's FAR from negligible, lol.

[cyberzombie.7348]

5 hours ago, NorthernRedStar.3054 said:

What kinda gear are you running if you call the healing negligible?

Marauder/berserk, though I probably should've been more specific that I'm refereing to PvP and WvW because of the damage nerfs in those two modes. Since even with said stats, gaining 20-200 heal per hit does very little for its pacing.

[NorthernRedStar.3054]

1 hour ago, cyberzombie.7348 said:

Marauder/berserk, though I probably should've been more specific that I'm refereing to PvP and WvW because of the damage nerfs in those two modes. Since even with said stats, gaining 20-200 heal per hit does very little for its pacing.

Fair. But thief's gameplay in either mode isn't supportive of very sustain-per-hit style mechanics.

[DeceiverX.8361]

On 2/6/2022 at 6:36 PM, NorthernRedStar.3054 said:

Fair. But thief's gameplay in either mode isn't supportive of very sustain-per-hit style mechanics.

Only on good builds.  P/P and S/P were able to leverage the healing pretty well prior being multi-hit, non-stealth sustained PvP damage loadouts.

CS just lacks meaningful damage elsewhere enough to justify taking it, as a sustain tool when lines like SA and DrD offer more damage and definitively better sustain by significant margins, and D/P/Rifle are unparalleled weapon sets in terms of power damage.

[saerni.2584]

10 hours ago, DeceiverX.8361 said:

Only on good builds.  P/P and S/P were able to leverage the healing pretty well prior being multi-hit, non-stealth sustained PvP damage loadouts.

CS just lacks meaningful damage elsewhere enough to justify taking it, as a sustain tool when lines like SA and DrD offer more damage and definitively better sustain by significant margins, and D/P/Rifle are unparalleled weapon sets in terms of power damage.

One place for Invigorating Precision in WvW is against tanky necro. It's not always necessary but a lot of necros like that will face tank because they don't feel like it's necessary (landing their hits is better use of their focus). You can CS/Tr/DE and just burn them down using M7. 
 

But as you said the method doesn't really work outside of specific 1v1 scenarios and you are better off 95% of the time using different methods. 

[Doggie.3184]

On 1/6/2022 at 4:01 PM, kash.9213 said:

Pathing issues are a pain. 

It's actually really sad how bad it still is when you can't even teleport up two steps~ one that randomly failed with shadowstep utility when I was playing earlier, and bow consistantly fails.

Or how all teleports, including all the new Specter Wells iirc are entirely unuseable on top of WvW walls going from one flat surface to another. (Also excited that Specter will probably still have 0 useable skills in water for the new underwater fights.)

Edited February 9, 2022 by Doggie.3184

[DeceiverX.8361]

10 hours ago, saerni.2584 said:

One place for Invigorating Precision in WvW is against tanky necro. It's not always necessary but a lot of necros like that will face tank because they don't feel like it's necessary (landing their hits is better use of their focus). You can CS/Tr/DE and just burn them down using M7. 
 

But as you said the method doesn't really work outside of specific 1v1 scenarios and you are better off 95% of the time using different methods. 

 

In the current state of the game, absolutely.  IP had some pretty practical purposes in previous metas (like pre-HoT) where the projectile hate wasn't as prominent, and the health disparity between tankier and squishier classes/builds was much larger; it could function as a pretty decent sustain tool into a lot of the more bunker-based point cap/roam off-tank builds like Hambow Warrior which had a lot of health to drain from.

It'd still be pretty decent if fights ended quickly - most people have around 20k hp now (or more), so getting 2-4k extra back per fight (depending on their sustain) is a pretty significant boost/extra heal when you factor in kiting or evasion on P/P and S/P respectively. 

Even ignoring the block/projectile uptime negating the function of this trait, the problem is as mentioned before; CS kill speed is so low that the 10% healed back isn't negating enough damage where it can meaningfully impact the fight.

Edited February 10, 2022 by DeceiverX.8361