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And the nerfs to harbinger?


myun.6395

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I knew it necro as usual didn't even get consider.

 

Nerf to vindi gs5 and healing dodge was expected.

Mechanist removed defiance bar is probably the end of the spec, mech will be perma rooted, blinded, cc.

 

But yeah harbinger is completely balanced, a build that even an ape can play.

I rather fight mechanists all day or simply ignore them instead of ratbingers and their gravity well oneshot damage which is impossible to reflect or avoid.

 

Still future years of necro meta, good job.

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Next patch. 
And I expect it won’t take that long to happen either. So many posts from people whining about 6 months of Vindicator Mechanist meta and what did it take?

2 weeks.

Not to mention that the adjustments to both those specs were pretty fair, all things considered, but I’m sure we will hear just as much whining about that as we heard before. 

 

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Just now, Ashgar.3024 said:

We're talking about a Necro build here.

 

Not going to hold my breath.

 True.
But I’m also not sure if I’d rather be fighting Harbies or if I’d rather all those players to go back to unkillable monster AoE fear spamming core necros. 
I might choose the harbies. The float sucks and the damage is over the top, but at least they fall over when you focus them. 

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Harbinger is almost fine. It needs a slight shave to quickness uptime per pulse for Deathly Haste, and the other two GMs need a slight radius buff; then, reduce the blight bonus power damage multiplier for Shroud 4  (maybe 100% -> 50% bonus, so 2.1 power coeff) and voila, Harbinger will be fine. Strong, but fine.

 

CC them in shroud and it’s GG. The harbinger mechanic removes Necro’s main defense, shroud HP, and also has the courtesy of reducing max HP. The damage to survivability trade-off is there.

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7 hours ago, Tulkas.2576 said:

Next patch. 
And I expect it won’t take that long to happen either. So many posts from people whining about 6 months of Vindicator Mechanist meta and what did it take?

2 weeks.

Not to mention that the adjustments to both those specs were pretty fair, all things considered, but I’m sure we will hear just as much whining about that as we heard before. 

 

 

They were good changes, not sure about mechanist one, if the mech is going to be perma rooted, blinded and cc the spec is just dead.

The F abilities are already on pretty long cooldown, and if you can't use them anymore because of blind spams what's the point of playing it over holo?

I didn't have had problems fighting mechanists.

 

But so sad necro is always the special baby to anet.

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Yeah I can’t speak for mechanist cause I haven’t played it yet.
Will be interesting to see how the changes pan out, however the other night I was in a match where we were ahead by a few hundred points so I had a go at a mech’s break bar (the mech itself, not the player)

I was playing Herald and I used Jade winds, Staff 5 into Facet of Chaos and the bloody thing still had about 20% break bar left, which is nuts. That’s quite a bit more than a lot of open world PVE bosses.


If this nerf kills the spec, maybe they could get a break bar back, but something that could be depleted with one solid CC or a couple weaker ones. 

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7 hours ago, Brian.5324 said:

Harbinger is almost fine. It needs a slight shave to quickness uptime per pulse for Deathly Haste, and the other two GMs need a slight radius buff; then, reduce the blight bonus power damage multiplier for Shroud 4  (maybe 100% -> 50% bonus, so 2.1 power coeff) and voila, Harbinger will be fine. Strong, but fine.

 

CC them in shroud and it’s GG. The harbinger mechanic removes Necro’s main defense, shroud HP, and also has the courtesy of reducing max HP. The damage to survivability trade-off is there.

Shroud 5 gravity well also needs a large CD increase and elite elixer power coefficient needs a nerf aswell. 

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1 hour ago, Tulkas.2576 said:

Yeah I can’t speak for mechanist cause I haven’t played it yet.
Will be interesting to see how the changes pan out, however the other night I was in a match where we were ahead by a few hundred points so I had a go at a mech’s break bar (the mech itself, not the player)

I was playing Herald and I used Jade winds, Staff 5 into Facet of Chaos and the bloody thing still had about 20% break bar left, which is nuts. That’s quite a bit more than a lot of open world PVE bosses.


If this nerf kills the spec, maybe they could get a break bar back, but something that could be depleted with one solid CC or a couple weaker ones. 

They will never revert back nerfs like this.

They are still monitoring and considering even more nerfs.

They don't play pvp so they have no clue.

I'm not defending mechanist, i dont even play it.

The could just lowered the powered coefficients of mech skills, nerf about 50% the defiance bar, so you wont need to invest 5 ccs to break it but maybe 2, and it is fine.

 

I didn't check yet, in wvw it's pretty much even more unusable now, inside a zerg your mech is insta dead even faster than ranger's pets and it has no use, in pvp against good players probably same story.

Now harbinger can jump on you and gravity well both you and your mech, blind and chill you both nonstop.

Seems dead to me.

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2 hours ago, Math.5123 said:

My biggest issue with Harbinger is the non existent animations on the elixirs. Especially the elite which chunks for life 7-10k.

This right here is a general issue that could and should be fixed by toggleable skill indicators.

Edited by Master Ketsu.4569
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2 hours ago, myun.6395 said:

I didn't have had problems fighting mechanists.

Thats because you probably play Condi.

I dont have a engineer so i cant put my finger on it and tell you exactly what it is... but there is a very sustainy build on metabattle atm. The insane sustain is enough to stalemate almost any power build and your mech is winning the fight for you.

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11 hours ago, Eugchriss.2046 said:

dodging one was all you need to beat vindicator, but hey just saying.

You actually didn't need to dodge their dodge against the top vindicators because they traited it to heal themselves which is why that specific trait was nerfed. What you needed to dodge was 3 greatsword skills and 3 sword/sword skills vs two shroud skills (when having enough blight to begin with) thats locked behind a 10 second cooldown vs always available burst backed with insane sustain.

 

If you were wasting your dodges on vindictor dodges (that also tells you if you need to dodge it) then that explains why so many people are losing to these classes so badly. People don't know what they're doing and are requesting nerfs to accommodate for their lack of sense.

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3 minutes ago, Metaologist.2487 said:

You actually didn't need to dodge their dodge against the top vindicators because they traited it to heal themselves which is why that specific trait was nerfed. What you needed to dodge was 3 greatsword skills and 3 sword/sword skills vs two shroud skills (when having enough blight to begin with) thats locked behind a 10 second cooldown vs always available burst backed with insane sustain.

 

If you were wasting your dodges on vindictor dodges (that also tells you if you need to dodge it) then that explains why so many people are losing to these classes so badly. People don't know what they're doing and are requesting nerfs to accommodate for their lack of sense.

lol

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11 hours ago, Eugchriss.2046 said:

dodging one was all you need to beat vindicator, but hey just saying.


Against vindi I needed to dodge gs2 (same coefficient as maul), gs3 (slightly less damage, but 3s chilled), gs5 (oneshot), sword2 (on 1v1 it's yet another maul-kind-of hitter), sword4 (or you want to get immobilized?), sword5 (quickstrike can deal some 7k damage), then I also need to dodge everything that comes after a shiro port because it's unblockable.
Additionally, inspiring reinforcements for whatever reason has a 1.5 coefficient (higher than maul, once again) and we have all the various memes with impossible odds, jalis hammers and what not.

The problem with vindi has never been "just dodge gs5". The problem with vindi was that you had to dodge everything before you even have to dodge gs5.

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11 minutes ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:


The problem with vindi has never been "just dodge gs5". The problem with vindi was that you had to dodge everything before you even have to dodge gs5.

How is this a problem? You are supposed to die at some point. You can't just expect to facetank everything and be ok.

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8 minutes ago, Eugchriss.2046 said:

How is this a problem? You are supposed to die at some point. You can't just expect to facetank everything and be ok.


I believe, if you played some other classes (elementalist, mesmer, guardian, whatever), you'd realize how you shouldn't be able to facetank those either, but the damage they deal is not "33% OF YOUR HP BAR IS GONE EVERY TIME THEY PRESS A BUTTON". Some abilities deal more damage and some abilities deal less.

Edited by Terrorhuz.4695
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13 minutes ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:


I believe, if you played some other classes (elementalist, mesmer, guardian, whatever), you'd realize how you shouldn't be able to facetank those either, but the damage they deal is not "33% OF YOUR HP BAR IS GONE EVERY TIME THEY PRESS A BUTTON". Some abilities deal more damage and some abilities deal less.

Ignore him. He's out of arguments and is just trolling at this point.

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