EoD a flop?

[Serephen.3420]

On 3/25/2022 at 5:45 AM, mindcircus.1506 said:

They gave a vague promise of a new map and new story.  This is not an announcement of Living World at all. It sure isn't, as the OP I was responding to a "season".
If it were indeed LW, they would have said LW.
But they didn't.
So if indeed it is, as you claim, the same thing, then why didn't they just say that?

Most likely because they are rebranding it and not calling it LW or seasons which is a wise decision imo. At least for being able to get new blood in.

[mindcircus.1506]

1 hour ago, Serephen.3420 said:

Most likely because they are rebranding it and not calling it LW or seasons which is a wise decision imo. At least for being able to get new blood in.

You're right. They should call something new.

Like ummmm.... how about a "Saga"

[Laken.9018]

7 hours ago, mindcircus.1506 said:

You're right. They should call something new.

Like ummmm.... how about a "Saga"

Icebrood's Saga issue wasn't the name. It was how it was marketed. It was the clear way they tried to avoid calling it  Living World.
If they just said "Moving forward we want all Living World Seasons to have names. For Season 5 were going to call it Icebrood Saga and in the next months the old ones will also get names" it  likely gone better.

They tried to make out it wasn't Living World when it was.

[Tukaram.8256]

15 minutes ago, Laken.9018 said:

Icebrood's Saga issue wasn't the name. It was how it was marketed. It was the clear way they tried to avoid calling it  Living World.
If they just said "Moving forward we want all Living World Seasons to have names. For Season 5 were going to call it Icebrood Saga and in the next months the old ones will also get names" it  likely gone better.

They tried to make out it wasn't Living World when it was.

It really made no sense. Obviously it was a new living world series, but they seem to no longer like the name?  It was crazy, and makes no sense. Just say 'we are changing the name'...  

[Healix.5819]

1 hour ago, Laken.9018 said:

Icebrood's Saga issue wasn't the name. It was how it was marketed. It was the clear way they tried to avoid calling it  Living World.

It was the Living World. They avoided calling it Season 5. "The Icebrood Saga" was to keep it memorable for marketing, plus it was originally planned to be something more.

[Obtena.7952]

My favourite part is where doomers be saying the game was done .... 8, 6, 4 and 2 years ago, and probably a little in between all that too. I guess doomers are just preparing speeches for the annual "Game is Dead" convention. I guess doomers be going with "Anet lie" as the standard now we getting good news about the game. 

playa's be playin'

hater's be hatin'

Edited March 26, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Hypnowulf.7403]

What I see as one of the biggest signs that a game is failing is the desperation to slight anyone with a truly legitimate complaint as "haters." Of course, the new term is "doomers" co-opted from anyone who's tired of climate disaster denial, which really isn't a good look. (Yes, that's where that came from, it's what's used to attack people who point out climate disaster science in order to shut them down to serve climate-denial. It doesn't look good to apply it here.)

I've played so many MMOs now. I played the MUDs, I was there for Meridian59 and The Realm. Was it called The Realm? I think so. It was a long time ago. It was this odd side-scrolling thing. I've played a great many and one recurring feature of a title in its death throes was the loyals and the marketing folk flooding the forums with how the haters are terrible people.

If a game is healthy, there wouldn't need to be this defensiveness. It's only when a game is unhealthy, and even the most loyal fans know it that we see this sort of reaction. It's denial. When the game's doing well, the most obsessive fans will just shrug off the complaints as they know that they aren't going to have any effect on the game's reputation.

If a game's hurting though, and they know it's hurting? That's when you see them roll out the bilious ballistas to pelt the upset hordes with dialectic bombardment. They're dishonest, they're just haters. They're here to destroy the game as part of some dark conspiracy to the many-angled, eldritch Ur-God Trolliflex. It's silly, but it's what happens every time. Of course, there are so many complaints because people who were very loyal fans now feel betrayed. It can't be that someone with very sincere feelings about how betrayed they were is driven to air those feelings. Nah, they're haters, they're trolls, and they're doomers.

It isn't the haters who're causing the problem, it's those who won't accept that these complaints are sincere and it's creating an obnoxious, toxic environment.

And that's what signals the death knell.

[Obtena.7952]

32 minutes ago, Hypnowulf.7403 said:

And that's what signals the death knell.

Yeah, the death knell we have had since pre-HoT ... because the fact is that there are always people calling for the end of the game ... and for lots of dumb reasons. It's pretty easy to dismiss the hater rhetoric when they use positive news to predict the end. That's probably the most ridiculous reason to call for the end ... but here we are. But OK, to be fair, every game has an end so it's sort of a big so what when people predict it. The question isn't if, it's when. 

"Oh look everyone ... good news on many fronts ... I guess we need to pack it up and shut it down" 🙄🤣

Edited March 27, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Freya.9075]

3 hours ago, Hypnowulf.7403 said:

What I see as one of the biggest signs that a game is failing is the desperation to slight anyone with a truly legitimate complaint as "haters." Of course, the new term is "doomers" co-opted from anyone who's tired of climate disaster denial, which really isn't a good look. (Yes, that's where that came from, it's what's used to attack people who point out climate disaster science in order to shut them down to serve climate-denial. It doesn't look good to apply it here.)

I've played so many MMOs now. I played the MUDs, I was there for Meridian59 and The Realm. Was it called The Realm? I think so. It was a long time ago. It was this odd side-scrolling thing. I've played a great many and one recurring feature of a title in its death throes was the loyals and the marketing folk flooding the forums with how the haters are terrible people.

If a game is healthy, there wouldn't need to be this defensiveness. It's only when a game is unhealthy, and even the most loyal fans know it that we see this sort of reaction. It's denial. When the game's doing well, the most obsessive fans will just shrug off the complaints as they know that they aren't going to have any effect on the game's reputation.

If a game's hurting though, and they know it's hurting? That's when you see them roll out the bilious ballistas to pelt the upset hordes with dialectic bombardment. They're dishonest, they're just haters. They're here to destroy the game as part of some dark conspiracy to the many-angled, eldritch Ur-God Trolliflex. It's silly, but it's what happens every time. Of course, there are so many complaints because people who were very loyal fans now feel betrayed. It can't be that someone with very sincere feelings about how betrayed they were is driven to air those feelings. Nah, they're haters, they're trolls, and they're doomers.

It isn't the haters who're causing the problem, it's those who won't accept that these complaints are sincere and it's creating an obnoxious, toxic environment.

And that's what signals the death knell.

Ppl don’t react to the criticism itself in these posts. It’s the way they go about it. and all they do is complain about the game not catering to what they feel is good. What they feel is good isn’t necessarily good for the game in general and trusting anet to do the final decision is the right thing to do. Mmos will never be perfect cause it has to cater to so many. Different players with different taste and opinions. There is content I don’t like in the game. Fashion wise and game wise. But since I know a lot of players do like these things I let it be. That’s the difference. Being critical is good. That can improve the game. However posts that get these reactions are not constructive criticism. 

[Bast.7253]

3 hours ago, Hypnowulf.7403 said:

What I see as one of the biggest signs that a game is failing is the desperation to slight anyone with a truly legitimate complaint as "haters." Of course, the new term is "doomers" co-opted from anyone who's tired of climate disaster denial, which really isn't a good look. (Yes, that's where that came from, it's what's used to attack people who point out climate disaster science in order to shut them down to serve climate-denial. It doesn't look good to apply it here.)

I've played so many MMOs now. I played the MUDs, I was there for Meridian59 and The Realm. Was it called The Realm? I think so. It was a long time ago. It was this odd side-scrolling thing. I've played a great many and one recurring feature of a title in its death throes was the loyals and the marketing folk flooding the forums with how the haters are terrible people.

If a game is healthy, there wouldn't need to be this defensiveness. It's only when a game is unhealthy, and even the most loyal fans know it that we see this sort of reaction. It's denial. When the game's doing well, the most obsessive fans will just shrug off the complaints as they know that they aren't going to have any effect on the game's reputation.

If a game's hurting though, and they know it's hurting? That's when you see them roll out the bilious ballistas to pelt the upset hordes with dialectic bombardment. They're dishonest, they're just haters. They're here to destroy the game as part of some dark conspiracy to the many-angled, eldritch Ur-God Trolliflex. It's silly, but it's what happens every time. Of course, there are so many complaints because people who were very loyal fans now feel betrayed. It can't be that someone with very sincere feelings about how betrayed they were is driven to air those feelings. Nah, they're haters, they're trolls, and they're doomers.

It isn't the haters who're causing the problem, it's those who won't accept that these complaints are sincere and it's creating an obnoxious, toxic environment.

And that's what signals the death knell.

Well, I'd be interesting in knowing the opinions specifically within certain demographics. Bad phrasing but I mean new players and ultra casuals versus veterans. As a veteran I feel like I've seen much higher quality in the past and better design choices. But to a new player or someone that just doesn't dedicate that much time to the game anything is going to be exciting. 

There's also the fact that this game attracts a lot of different people for a lot of different reasons and it's probably hard designing a product to address all of those players. Realistically as far as map design goes, these maps aren't too different from Path of Fire as far as being... relatively empty and hard to find fun events.  

Maybe it's just impossible to design a more interactive map when it gets to this large of a scale though, at least consistently. 

Wandering around the jade sea or kaineng is pretty depressing though. Just random mobs copy-pasted everywhere with events that aren't overly exciting spaced way out from each other so you have to traverse the whole zone just to find something meaningful to do.

[Knighthonor.4061]

3 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Yeah, the death knell we have had since pre-HoT ... because the fact is that there are always people calling for the end of the game ... and for lots of dumb reasons. It's pretty easy to dismiss the hater rhetoric when they use positive news to predict the end. That's probably the most ridiculous reason to call for the end ... but here we are. But OK, to be fair, every game has an end so it's sort of a big so what when people predict it. The question isn't if, it's when. 

"Oh look everyone ... good news on many fronts ... I guess we need to pack it up and shut it down" 🙄🤣

Yeah, you mean Pre HoT, back when the game was in a drought and the developers didn't inform the player base that an Expansion was in works until the end of the last Living World update, since originally the developers marketed the game as not having expansions.  Yeah I can see why people would cry doom. Luckily Anet didn't do that this time around

[Cuks.8241]

4 hours ago, Hypnowulf.7403 said:

What I see as one of the biggest signs that a game is failing is the desperation to slight anyone with a truly legitimate complaint as "haters." Of course, the new term is "doomers" co-opted from anyone who's tired of climate disaster denial, which really isn't a good look. (Yes, that's where that came from, it's what's used to attack people who point out climate disaster science in order to shut them down to serve climate-denial. It doesn't look good to apply it here.)

I've played so many MMOs now. I played the MUDs, I was there for Meridian59 and The Realm. Was it called The Realm? I think so. It was a long time ago. It was this odd side-scrolling thing. I've played a great many and one recurring feature of a title in its death throes was the loyals and the marketing folk flooding the forums with how the haters are terrible people.

If a game is healthy, there wouldn't need to be this defensiveness. It's only when a game is unhealthy, and even the most loyal fans know it that we see this sort of reaction. It's denial. When the game's doing well, the most obsessive fans will just shrug off the complaints as they know that they aren't going to have any effect on the game's reputation.

If a game's hurting though, and they know it's hurting? That's when you see them roll out the bilious ballistas to pelt the upset hordes with dialectic bombardment. They're dishonest, they're just haters. They're here to destroy the game as part of some dark conspiracy to the many-angled, eldritch Ur-God Trolliflex. It's silly, but it's what happens every time. Of course, there are so many complaints because people who were very loyal fans now feel betrayed. It can't be that someone with very sincere feelings about how betrayed they were is driven to air those feelings. Nah, they're haters, they're trolls, and they're doomers.

It isn't the haters who're causing the problem, it's those who won't accept that these complaints are sincere and it's creating an obnoxious, toxic environment.

And that's what signals the death knell.

Well I have been playing games and mmorpgs and similar for 2 decades and more and all I see is the entitled crying and threatening because they werent catered to. Basically the usual for any online game expansion or big patch release. Without these I would be more concerned for the game's future.

[voltaicbore.8012]

4 hours ago, Hypnowulf.7403 said:

If a game is healthy, there wouldn't need to be this defensiveness. It's only when a game is unhealthy, and even the most loyal fans know it that we see this sort of reaction. It's denial. When the game's doing well, the most obsessive fans will just shrug off the complaints as they know that they aren't going to have any effect on the game's reputation.

Dunno about this one. Some of the so-called defenders here are longtime players and posters, and have been very, very, pointedly critical of various aspects of the game. In fact, I'd say that their criticisms are particularly sharp because they know what they're talking about and have engaged with the game at a level deeper than most.

I agree with 

49 minutes ago, Freya.9075 said:

Ppl don’t react to the criticism itself in these posts. It’s the way they go about it.

My resistance to the OP is based on interpreting ANet's recent announcement differently, not because I think the game is perfect.

I have long been very critical of LW as a whole. So far, it's the absolutely most stupidly marketed and delivered DLC I've ever seen. The decision to continue mainline story in what is nominally optional DLC is already a bad idea. To make matters worse, ANet gives away LW episodes to active players, but anyone who joins or returns after that giveaway period is over? Gem gates. The "Ultimate" icing on the cake is that the ultimate collection's 4K gems doesn't even cover the cost of unlocking all the LW episodes even when they're at sale prices.

It's just the absolute worst mix of required-not-required, free-not-free I've ever seen. It seems intentionally designed to alienate new and returning players.

However, I think the decision to remake LWS1 and include it for free, forever, to all accounts is the first sign in a very long time that ANet is making smarter decisions when it comes to treating GW2 as a product for new and returning players. By doing this, they simultaneously get to (1) ensure that every single player is exposed to the system called LW itself, and (2) patch the very large story gap by finally letting many players actually meet the 'new' characters that have stuck around with Dragon's Watch up to this very moment. Also, by not immediately making the rest of LW also free, they get to avoid that whole debate about what to do for people who recently bought into LW with real money. So while this means that the old gem gates are still up, players at least know that LW exists and what kind of stuff it contains. Previously, many new and returning players were blindsided by the holes left by LW. It's probably the best compromise they could have come up with, and seems like an uncharacteristically smart business-end move for ANet.

And there you go. ANet did something I hated for years (bad LW design and marketing, LWS1 just gone forever), then they announced a change that I think fixes the most egregious problems about it. I still think that LW needs to pivot towards true side story content, where we get to explore the world in a way that is free of continuing the main plot that will be delivered through expansions. But the recent announcement seems like a big step in the right direction, and I don't see it as all marketing smoke and mirrors.

[AliamRationem.5172]

4 hours ago, Hypnowulf.7403 said:

What I see as one of the biggest signs that a game is failing is the desperation to slight anyone with a truly legitimate complaint as "haters." Of course, the new term is "doomers" co-opted from anyone who's tired of climate disaster denial, which really isn't a good look. (Yes, that's where that came from, it's what's used to attack people who point out climate disaster science in order to shut them down to serve climate-denial. It doesn't look good to apply it here.)

I've played so many MMOs now. I played the MUDs, I was there for Meridian59 and The Realm. Was it called The Realm? I think so. It was a long time ago. It was this odd side-scrolling thing. I've played a great many and one recurring feature of a title in its death throes was the loyals and the marketing folk flooding the forums with how the haters are terrible people.

If a game is healthy, there wouldn't need to be this defensiveness. It's only when a game is unhealthy, and even the most loyal fans know it that we see this sort of reaction. It's denial. When the game's doing well, the most obsessive fans will just shrug off the complaints as they know that they aren't going to have any effect on the game's reputation.

If a game's hurting though, and they know it's hurting? That's when you see them roll out the bilious ballistas to pelt the upset hordes with dialectic bombardment. They're dishonest, they're just haters. They're here to destroy the game as part of some dark conspiracy to the many-angled, eldritch Ur-God Trolliflex. It's silly, but it's what happens every time. Of course, there are so many complaints because people who were very loyal fans now feel betrayed. It can't be that someone with very sincere feelings about how betrayed they were is driven to air those feelings. Nah, they're haters, they're trolls, and they're doomers.

It isn't the haters who're causing the problem, it's those who won't accept that these complaints are sincere and it's creating an obnoxious, toxic environment.

And that's what signals the death knell.

Yeah, that's nonsense.  This is nothing new.  HoT especially was very contentious, with some players predicting the death of the game as a result and others portraying it as a renaissance.  If this were a sure sign of imminent doom, the game would have already failed years ago.

[Laken.9018]

I have issues with EOD do not get me wrong. Theres a lot of choices made that make me rais emy eyebrow but I'm putting that down to newbies and a massive loss of experience from the company.

I actually think Anets recent annoucement is  a smart move.
1) It addresses a long term outstanding issue in the community of Season 1.
and
2) It makes it clear an expansion IS coming. The big issue Anet has always had is its ping ponged between not wanting to do expansion and doing one and that makes the "sky is falling, game is dead/EOD is a flop" types use it as evidence to say the game is dying. Knowing its there on the horizon means we now know which direction the game is going moving forward and have something to check against.

If EOD sales were as good as they say then I think the game will be fine even if  I myself felt EOD was a little lacking in areas I would have liked.

[Obtena.7952]

2 hours ago, Knighthonor.4061 said:

Yeah, you mean Pre HoT, back when the game was in a drought and the developers didn't inform the player base that an Expansion was in works until the end of the last Living World update, since originally the developers marketed the game as not having expansions.  Yeah I can see why people would cry doom. Luckily Anet didn't do that this time around

Yup, everyone can SEE why people cry doom all the time .. yet here we are 8 years later. So maybe you can see it but obviously seeing it doesn't make it any more real does it. 

[WeightTrainer.3219]

On 3/22/2022 at 10:00 PM, erapago.4387 said:

That's some pretty selective reading. You miss the part about it outselling Path of Fire and and the active population doubling in the last three years?

 

I would be curious to know how EoD did versus Heart of Thorns. I don't want Path of Fire to be the new standard that anet compares new expansions to. I mean wasn't path of fire anet's worst expansion? lol. Hard to go by the last 3 years seeing as how anet had massive layoffs/restructuring in 2019 and it "felt" like the games population dipped pretty low that year.

 

It just seems like while anet was honest with what they said, its also a bit deceptive, in my opinion.

[Izzy.2951]

11 hours ago, Hypnowulf.7403 said:

What I see as one of the biggest signs that a game is failing is the desperation to slight anyone with a truly legitimate complaint as "haters." Of course, the new term is "doomers" co-opted from anyone who's tired of climate disaster denial, which really isn't a good look. (Yes, that's where that came from, it's what's used to attack people who point out climate disaster science in order to shut them down to serve climate-denial. It doesn't look good to apply it here.)

I've played so many MMOs now. I played the MUDs, I was there for Meridian59 and The Realm. Was it called The Realm? I think so. It was a long time ago. It was this odd side-scrolling thing. I've played a great many and one recurring feature of a title in its death throes was the loyals and the marketing folk flooding the forums with how the haters are terrible people.

If a game is healthy, there wouldn't need to be this defensiveness. It's only when a game is unhealthy, and even the most loyal fans know it that we see this sort of reaction. It's denial. When the game's doing well, the most obsessive fans will just shrug off the complaints as they know that they aren't going to have any effect on the game's reputation.

If a game's hurting though, and they know it's hurting? That's when you see them roll out the bilious ballistas to pelt the upset hordes with dialectic bombardment. They're dishonest, they're just haters. They're here to destroy the game as part of some dark conspiracy to the many-angled, eldritch Ur-God Trolliflex. It's silly, but it's what happens every time. Of course, there are so many complaints because people who were very loyal fans now feel betrayed. It can't be that someone with very sincere feelings about how betrayed they were is driven to air those feelings. Nah, they're haters, they're trolls, and they're doomers.

It isn't the haters who're causing the problem, it's those who won't accept that these complaints are sincere and it's creating an obnoxious, toxic environment.

And that's what signals the death knell.

First of all you cant listen to all the people making "feedback" lets say, becouse you actually read the feedback and its nonsense or just breaking the game/company ideals.

Second people are gonna complain always, if Catalyst gets nerf, if they didnt make something they wanted, if this and that... like dragons end event, great for some, horrible for others.

People constatly say nonsense stuff, this is the internet you know? the game is dead... well EoD outsell PoF and theres much more players. I myself thought eod was the last expansion and look.

Edited March 28, 2022 by Izzy.2951

[Knighthonor.4061]

7 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Yup, everyone can SEE why people cry doom all the time .. yet here we are 8 years later. So maybe you can see it but obviously seeing it doesn't make it any more real does it. 

You are speaking in code. What does any of that actually mean in context of what I replied?

[Kozumi.5816]

I haven't played EoD maps in 3 weeks because they give no unique rewards and are atrocious gold/hour.

EoD strikes aren't worth doing besides 2 dailies every 3 weeks.

[Tachenon.5270]

I wouldn't say it's a flop, but the 'new' is wearing off fast and I find that I'm not particularly keen on rinsing and repeating very much of it. Case in point: I decided to finish unlocking druid on my #1 ranger, but instead of going for the hero points in Cantha, I got them in Elona. It's just easier for me to get around in Elona. New Kaineng City in particular gives me a little too much of a 'you can't get there from here' Tangled Depths vibe. It's not quite "Oh, you want to go 50 yards to the east? Go 1500 yards west!" like in Tangled Depths, but close enough. Seitung Province could use a couple more waypoints, maybe. Dragon's End is easier to navigate, but meh. Being there for anything but the meta feels like an intrusion, and the pre-meta events are frustrating due to all the constant running to and fro because of the constantly (and pointlessly) contested waypoints. See also: Jade Maw. I've seen it succeed once. I think there might be something one of my guys needs from it, but whatever it is I'm sure it's not worth it.

I didn't hate fishing until I had to catch a specific fish for my Bladesworn to get that ascended pistol. Now? To hell with fishing.

I got the turtle egg on my 7th run at the DE meta, which was right after the 1st 'nerf', I think. Haven't done a full run of it since. As for the turtle, to hell with that, too. Never mind the strike mission, I'm not going to farm or buy the mats for it. Not my idea of fun. In fact, I'll call it exactly what it is: BORING GRIND TO GET TO THE FUN STUFF. Which doesn't look to be all that much fun anyway. Kind of like a two-seater outhouse. Sounds efficient, but...

I find myself spending most of my time in Cantha in the Echovald Wilds, mostly because of the Arborstone portal thing. I like the meta and other events there well enough. Had enough of that kitten moa, though.

Anyway, that's why I say EOD isn't a flop, exactly, but also not... whatever the opposite of flop is.

/e shrug

[Pinkeh.4207]

After getting my turtle i have not played on any Cantha maps b/c better farming efficiency elsewhere. 

[voltaicbore.8012]

49 minutes ago, Pinkeh.4207 said:

After getting my turtle i have not played on any Cantha maps b/c better farming efficiency elsewhere. 

I suspect this will be the long-term issue, people leaving after turtle is done. I suspect that is also why ANet initially put the turtle behind the DE meta and Kaineng Overlook strike - a highly artificial ploy to keep people engaged with Canthan content for as long as possible.

I still have a couple masteries, collections, and map completions I want to get done in Cantha before I leave for good. Surprisingly, I find that some of these optional collections are the most interesting little journeys.

[Naxos.2503]

For me it's an adequate success, but it's not on par with expansions such as Path of Fire or Heart of Thorns for several reasons.

 

1) As much as there are plenty of new Masteries, they do not bring much that is new, but simply give new iterations of something already existing. It is done relatively well, and that is fine. It's not Better, it's essentially more of the same, which can be acceptable.

2)The Elite Specs are for the most part sub par compared to previous installments. Some have appropriate payoffs and trade offs (Bladesworn, Harbinger), others lack the oompf the previous specs have had (Vindicator, Untamed).  Some weapon, skills and trait choices were also questionable (Offhand pistol Bladesworn was a missed opportunity to have a one handed main range option, Mechanist is too reliant on the mech, Harbinger potions icons are still too indistinguishable, Catalyst as a whole makes a piano class even more of a piano class, Willbender is clunky). I have not found -that- many problems in past Elite Specs. 

3) The grind is Way too heavy. Research in particular is obtuse on purpose. Nobody likes to create something just to destroy it. The system doesn't work on several levels : When you train a craft, you're better off salvaging your items normally to recoup materials to continue training, rather than try to get research pages. On the other hand when you no longer need to craft to level up, there is absolutely no need to craft lower quality items, so the point about removing low grade items from circulation falls moot. Higher level crafters can craft higher quality items and receive Way more research pages for it. But we fall back on the unsatisfying feeling of crafting something solely to exchange it for something else. I'll tell you what that makes me feel like : a worker in a fabrication line. It's boring, it adds nothing to the gameplay and the only thing it does is purging materials, some of them already hard to acquire. I'd much rather have missions similar to guild missions where we explore and document things around us. Like a Research project, you know ?

4) Grind aside, some of the meta is disproportionately difficult for what you're getting in return. I like difficulty, I just dont like wasting my time for something that isn't worth the difficulty to succeed. The turtle Is a nice reward for Dragon's End Meta, but it's One time. Few people will go back to it to help people succeed once they're done and got their turtle because it's a grueling meta (good) that doesn't reward anything else beside a couple materials and a couple of skins. I imagine the reward is Better if it succeed, but it apparently is just not worth it, if people who did succeed dont want to come back to it again.

 

I'll say it again, expansion has a good base to build on, but it has cut corners and it shows.

[Obtena.7952]

7 hours ago, Knighthonor.4061 said:

You are speaking in code. What does any of that actually mean in context of what I replied?

No I'm not speaking code. You said you can see why people are complaining. Sure ... but that's irrelevant to the sensational idea that these complaints actually result in the game failing and dying. Those predictions of game failure are especially dumb when they are based on the GOOD NEWS Anet is providing players about the current state and future developments of the game.

I mean, sure, people should be critical and complain about stuff. They should also do it for reasons that aren't nonsensical either. 

Edited March 28, 2022 by Obtena.7952