Do you use your Turtle?

[Wielder Of Magic.3950]

Just letting me, as the driver, use the cannons if nobody else has hitched a ride to do so, would go a long way for making the mount feel more fun.

[Solitude.2097]

Allow people to use the mount in combat , for 2 sec (mount decaying hp) .

If you cast it near the boss , you will get a debuff like Wing 5 (reclaimed soul) that reduce your HP . So the scenario is avoid aoes => cast a quick ranged shot to boost your dps => join the zerg.

 

Then implant more mount for the same  scenario (for example create 2 mesmers portals in-front of the boss and a location where the majority of the people are)

Edited April 25, 2022 by Solitude.2097

[Veprovina.4876]

6 hours ago, Reborn.1738 said:

I wonder if Turtles would be more useful and used if they were customisable and offered some support roles in combat? Maybe your Jade Bot could augment the turtle and give the driver new abilities based on what it has equipped?

• Offensive Support Turtle -  Apply Jade Tech Offensive buffs to nearby players
• Defensive Support Turtle -  Apply Jade Tech Defensive buffs to nearby players

Ooh, i like that! Thy made the buffs available in open world anywhere anyway so it shouldn't matter that a turtle does it.

Let it stack duration too!

6 hours ago, Reborn.1738 said:

• Heal Support Turtle - AoE heals and regen?
• Damage Turtle - Add a weapon for the driver

It's all open world only so it isn't going to mess up raid/fractal/dungeon/strike meta, and it could promote more useful combat abilities for the combat mount

I'd probably use mine a bit more if I could be a lazy boon buffer!

The problem with "combat" mount is that it can't be better than a player. So while a turtle could provide all that, it would still suck because a player character needs to do it better. Otherwise the turtle becomes the new meta, and everyone runs turtles in events and not their own skills.

 

But it could be a mobile applicator of Canthan buffs, that part i like!

Instead of polluting every map with jade batteries and buff stations, just bring a turtle! 🙂 

[Reborn.1738]

10 minutes ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

Ooh, i like that! Thy made the buffs available in open world anywhere anyway so it shouldn't matter that a turtle does it.

Let it stack duration too!

The problem with "combat" mount is that it can't be better than a player. So while a turtle could provide all that, it would still suck because a player character needs to do it better. Otherwise the turtle becomes the new meta, and everyone runs turtles in events and not their own skills.

 

But it could be a mobile applicator of Canthan buffs, that part i like!

Instead of polluting every map with jade batteries and buff stations, just bring a turtle! 🙂 

Even just adding the Jade Tech buffs would have potential to make Turtles meta for many events. But it's "easy mode open world", so who really cares about what's meta  . As long as turtles aren't allowed in instanced group content it would probably be fine!

There's definitely a fine line between having a combat mount being too strong, and not strong enough. It just feels like it's very much in the "not strong enough" side right now. 

[Mungrul.9358]

There's no scenario I can envisage where I would use the turtle.

It basically feels tacked on, like something "required" to keep the marketers happy.

Except ANet doesn't have marketers, lol.

[Veprovina.4876]

11 minutes ago, Reborn.1738 said:

Even just adding the Jade Tech buffs would have potential to make Turtles meta for many events. But it's "easy mode open world", so who really cares about what's meta  . As long as turtles aren't allowed in instanced group content it would probably be fine!

There's definitely a fine line between having a combat mount being too strong, and not strong enough. It just feels like it's very much in the "not strong enough" side right now. 

True, but since they already are allowed, having a buff-up before the event starts probably won't break any gameplay lol.

But turtle in general feels like they didn't think any of that through, they just wanted another mount, but didn't really think what it'll do and what a "combat mount" means.

 

If you could summon it for like 15 seconds in combat to do a canon burst/buff/CC, then it would make sense.

[Reborn.1738]

19 minutes ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

True, but since they already are allowed, having a buff-up before the event starts probably won't break any gameplay lol.

But turtle in general feels like they didn't think any of that through, they just wanted another mount, but didn't really think what it'll do and what a "combat mount" means.

 

If you could summon it for like 15 seconds in combat to do a canon burst/buff/CC, then it would make sense.

 

Yeah, true. Buffs are what they are, and it's not like it would allow you to stack more boons than you already could.

And I guess I was just thinking with a Heal build or a weapon for the driver, it wouldn't really affect balance/gameplay that much. You'd still be a player or 2 down from the turtle, and as long as the turtle isn't dishing out more than (example) 10-15k dps, it isn't going to break that much. It's probably about on par with what I could output on foot if I really gave it my all, and I consider myself fairly average/casual

I dunno, I'm coming from a "this would be fun to add" angle, I'm probably missing some balance issues.

Summoning it during combat would definitely help though. On a cooldown. 

[Ashen.2907]

I might hop onto the turtle momentarily for the visual, but I dont use it in actual play. Using it in events with other players around pretty much guarantees not getting credit for participation. One attack every five seconds reminds me of quitting WoW.

Edited April 26, 2022 by Ashen.2907

[Zaoda.1653]

I don't have the turtle mount because of the strike mission requirement. Even if there was an alternative to the strike mission requirement though (5k skirmish claim tickets and a bunch of WvW achievements, as an example, for a WvW alternative), I don't think I'd use it much simply because I hate the idea of having to require another player to use the cannon. Why not just allow the user to both move and use the cannon? It would be SO much better that way. Even if I had the turtle mount right now as it currently is, I think the only thing I would enjoy is the additional health pool that would be applied to other mounts in the turtle mastery track. That's about it.

 

Until there's an alternative to the strike mission (so players can achieve the same result, but in their own preferred game mode), and the additional player requirement to use the cannon is changed, I can't see myself ever wanting the turtle mount. It's a shame, because the mount itself looks great. It's unfortunate how it was implemented.

Edited April 25, 2022 by Zaoda.1653

[Ashen.2907]

13 hours ago, Zaoda.1653 said:

I don't have the turtle mount because of the strike mission requirement. Even if there was an alternative to the strike mission requirement though (5k skirmish claim tickets and a bunch of WvW achievements, as an example, for a WvW alternative), I don't think I'd use it much simply because I hate the idea of having to require another player to use the cannon. Why not just allow the user to both move and use the cannon? It would be SO much better that way. Even if I had the turtle mount right now as it currently is, I think the only thing I would enjoy is the additional health pool that would be applied to other mounts in the turtle mastery track. That's about it.

 

Until there's an alternative to the strike mission (so players can achieve the same result, but in their own preferred game mode), and the additional player requirement to use the cannon is changed, I can't see myself ever wanting the turtle mount. It's a shame, because the mount itself looks great. It's unfortunate how it was implemented.

For what it is worth, not trying to push you where you dont want to go, the strike is not particularly difficult and the mechanics are interesting. There is no timer so no dps check involved. Maybe about 15 minutes for a casual run through.

Edited April 26, 2022 by Ashen.2907

[Tren.5120]

No.  This mount takes like 10 seconds to pull a u-turn.  Movement is terrible with it.  IMO, critically overrated.

It feels terrible to use outside of events where the skills are purposeful, and you still pretty much need a passenger for that.

Best use for the turtle is the mastery line to add HP to the other mounts.

Hilariously, they sort of screwed themselves a bit in the mount department.  Those we got pre-EoD are already pretty good.  What they've added in EoD is fairly redundant and of very limited use (Skiff, Turtle).

To top of off, the size of the mount is just... impractical... even in fairly open spaces when multiple people pull it out.

Edited April 26, 2022 by Tren.5120

[Tren.5120]

9 hours ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

True, but since they already are allowed, having a buff-up before the event starts probably won't break any gameplay lol.

But turtle in general feels like they didn't think any of that through, they just wanted another mount, but didn't really think what it'll do and what a "combat mount" means.

 

If you could summon it for like 15 seconds in combat to do a canon burst/buff/CC, then it would make sense.

I think the DE meta would become unplayable for most people if that were the case.  There is already too much clutter and I actually think the visual clutter is responsible for about 70% of the deaths when fighting Soo Won, and I can't imaging what the average casual's FPS is on that encounter... Lol

Having turtle mounts randomly appearing/disappearing.  Do you have any idea how much of a nerf to people's player experience that would be in any group/squad/mass PvE content?

Edited April 26, 2022 by Tren.5120

[Veprovina.4876]

35 minutes ago, Tren.5120 said:

I think the DE meta would become unplayable for most people if that were the case.  There is already too much clutter and I actually think the visual clutter is responsible for about 70% of the deaths when fighting Soo Won, and I can't imaging what the average casual's FPS is on that encounter... Lol

Having turtle mounts randomly appearing/disappearing.  Do you have any idea how much of a nerf to people's player experience that would be in any group/squad/mass PvE content?

First of all, that meta is garbage, and needs a redesign, having turtles in or out won't change that.

But more importantly, it's easy to just slap this onto the meta once it begins, and you can't use turtles anymore, and lo and behold, the meta is undisturbed and still bad as it always was, without turtles.

Edited April 26, 2022 by Veprovina.4876

[Veprovina.4876]

2 hours ago, Zaoda.1653 said:

I don't have the turtle mount because of the strike mission requirement.

 

If you've bought into the propaganda that those strike missions are somehow hard and require specific groups and you need to be a raider to complete them, rest assured that i completed that same strike mission like 5 times with random people who just showed up for their turtle mount, never raided, never did strikes, never did anything other than open world, and we finished it.

 

And please don't pay people to "carry" you into strikes, they're doable with literally anything.

Quote

Until there's an alternative to the strike mission (so players can achieve the same result, but in their own preferred game mode), and the additional player requirement to use the cannon is changed, I can't see myself ever wanting the turtle mount. It's a shame, because the mount itself looks great. It's unfortunate how it was implemented.

That's probably not going to happen as Anet clearly designed multiple things in game to be only obtainable in certain modes exclusively. No matter how much people cry over Gift of Battle, it's still only obtainable in WvW, Raid armor and raid rings requires, well, raids, and turtle requires a strike. 

And a really really easy one at that. 

The fact that people are so scared of them is because all the raiders artificially inflating their difficulty so that they can sell "strike clears" for 250 MC per run. Pathetic.

 

Youtube the strike mechanics so you know what's in there and do the strike. 

If you need a build, there's tons of low effort buidls that do 20k DPS with autoattack, pick one and just avoid red circles while you 111111 the boss.

Edited April 26, 2022 by Veprovina.4876

[Phazon.3975]

It's my favorite chair in the game!

[Veprovina.4876]

10 hours ago, Phazon.3975 said:

It's my favorite chair in the game!

Lmao, that's actually a great idea! 😄

 

[difens.1326]

On 4/26/2022 at 4:02 AM, Veprovina.4876 said:

If you've bought into the propaganda that those strike missions are somehow hard and require specific groups and you need to be a raider to complete them, rest assured that i completed that same strike mission like 5 times with random people who just showed up for their turtle mount, never raided, never did strikes, never did anything other than open world, and we finished it.

 

And please don't pay people to "carry" you into strikes, they're doable with literally anything.

That's probably not going to happen as Anet clearly designed multiple things in game to be only obtainable in certain modes exclusively. No matter how much people cry over Gift of Battle, it's still only obtainable in WvW, Raid armor and raid rings requires, well, raids, and turtle requires a strike. 

And a really really easy one at that. 

The fact that people are so scared of them is because all the raiders artificially inflating their difficulty so that they can sell "strike clears" for 250 MC per run. Pathetic.

 

Youtube the strike mechanics so you know what's in there and do the strike. 

If you need a build, there's tons of low effort buidls that do 20k DPS with autoattack, pick one and just avoid red circles while you 111111 the boss.

I don't like instanced content (especially in this game). I do not play content I don't like. It is a game, not a job. I play at my own pace and so far I have everything I wanted without playing content I did not like. I don't care for turtle mount, it's stupid. I DO hate that I'm not getting any XP/spirit shards in EoD maps, because of this stupid requirement.

 

Edited April 28, 2022 by difens.1326

[Labjax.2465]

On 4/25/2022 at 10:02 PM, Veprovina.4876 said:

If you've bought into the propaganda that those strike missions are somehow hard and require specific groups and you need to be a raider to complete them, rest assured that i completed that same strike mission like 5 times with random people who just showed up for their turtle mount, never raided, never did strikes, never did anything other than open world, and we finished it.

 

And please don't pay people to "carry" you into strikes, they're doable with literally anything.

That's probably not going to happen as Anet clearly designed multiple things in game to be only obtainable in certain modes exclusively. No matter how much people cry over Gift of Battle, it's still only obtainable in WvW, Raid armor and raid rings requires, well, raids, and turtle requires a strike. 

And a really really easy one at that. 

The fact that people are so scared of them is because all the raiders artificially inflating their difficulty so that they can sell "strike clears" for 250 MC per run. Pathetic.

 

Youtube the strike mechanics so you know what's in there and do the strike. 

If you need a build, there's tons of low effort buidls that do 20k DPS with autoattack, pick one and just avoid red circles while you 111111 the boss.

I did the turtle strike the other day and I think you are understating the difficulty a bit. It's a fairly complex fight (multiple bosses with multiple mechanics to learn) and pretty unforgiving. I imagine it'd be easier with higher DPS, but we killed it pretty slowly and on the 2nd attempt, it got down to half of us finishing a good portion of the fight. When I saw the bubble mechanic and the number mechanic, my thought was something like "so I'm raiding again, huh." I haven't done progression raiding in ages.

AFAIK, there's no enrage timer, which is the part that makes it less raid-like, but it's still no joke if you are working with subpar DPS levels overall and/or limited heals, as the longer the fight drags on, the more taxing it is on people's reflexes, the more opportunities there are to screw up.

And with the main boss, due to how he moves around, downed state won't necessarily save you if you screw up. One mistake can put you in a spot where you're gonna get reamed by him and put other team members in danger if they try to help.

I don't want to scare people off of doing it or something, I just think you're exaggerating a bit in the other direction.

[Mrs Lana.2506]

I only ever use the turtle for core map completion when I'm on a character with only a condi dps build. The turtle's auto attack doesn't dismount you, and does a fair chunk of  damage to structures (supplies, gates, flagpoles, etc) where condi doesn't affect things like that in the base game. Saves time.

[Veprovina.4876]

6 hours ago, difens.1326 said:

I don't like instanced content (especially in this game). I do not play content I don't like. It is a game, not a job. I play at my own pace and so far I have everything I wanted without playing content I did not like. I don't care for turtle mount, it's stupid. I DO hate that I'm not getting any XP/spirit shards in EoD maps, because of this stupid requirement.

 

I understand that, but i'm telling you all that you CAN do that strike at your own pace. It's the same mechanics you needed to do anyway in the story part of that fight, but now with 10 people, it's not that difficult. 

 

Anyway...

 

If you don't care about the turtle, doing strikes once every 2-3 weeks will get you A.S.S. (antique summoning stone) that you can sell. They're still pretty pricey, 8 gold i believe. So, you know, 1 strike is like 30 green shards, that's enough for 3 A.S.S. (1 per week for 10 shards). As you can get up to 5 per week with other currency it adds up. 

 

You don't even have to do that turtle strike, the Junkyard strike is way easier.

 

As for spirit shards...

As long as you filled every mastery bar in EoD fully, and have nothing else to unlock, XP will go toward the spirit shard bar instead.

So you can still level and get spirit shards in EoD without full masteries, just won't see the bar filling up, that'll happen in the background.

 

5 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

I did the turtle strike the other day and I think you are understating the difficulty a bit. It's a fairly complex fight (multiple bosses with multiple mechanics to learn) and pretty unforgiving. I imagine it'd be easier with higher DPS, but we killed it pretty slowly and on the 2nd attempt, it got down to half of us finishing a good portion of the fight. When I saw the bubble mechanic and the number mechanic, my thought was something like "so I'm raiding again, huh." I haven't done progression raiding in ages.

Yeah but come on, doing it on your 2nd try is still doing it. That's nothing compared to how some people are presenting it as impossible, and i bet you didn't even have a "proper" group. But you still did it. If that's not evidence it's easy, i don't know what is.

Sure, there's some mechanics to do, but none of them are hard to do or require super coordinated stuff like Raids do.

And i regularly do it with random people, and i even was often the only one that knew the mechancis.

So if your group can do it on their own, and mine was able without no one knowing the mechanics, i'm sure the strike isn't *that* hard... 

 

If anything, you just proved it's easy. That despite "complex mechanics" (lol) you managed to do it is evidence that it's not as hard as people are saying.

5 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

AFAIK, there's no enrage timer, which is the part that makes it less raid-like, but it's still no joke if you are working with subpar DPS levels overall and/or limited heals, as the longer the fight drags on, the more taxing it is on people's reflexes, the more opportunities there are to screw up.

Ok, but you DID do it. You just didn't speedrun it. IDK when speedrunning became the norm that everything now has to have tons of DPS and boons, but it's doable without all that stuff. Just takes longer. And the longer you go - the LESS bosses there are, so less chance to mess up etc. Not that any of the bosses have really strong attacks, you can literally sidestep most of them.

5 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

And with the main boss, due to how he moves around, downed state won't necessarily save you if you screw up. One mistake can put you in a spot where you're gonna get reamed by him and put other team members in danger if they try to help.

The main boss telegraphs his attacks for half an hour each lol, now you're a bit overstating his difficulty. Any aegis, distortion or block will negate his "scary attack" and some classes get those passively. In all my runs on it, if we saw a down, all came to help, raised the person in 2 seconds, and we continued. Even if the big sword swing catches you you're not instant dead. 

Most people found Li actually easier to deal with than the lower platform bosses. 

He's only slightly annoying in the third phase when his attacks can overlap but the only downstate move he does is telegraphed by an arrow showing you where he'll go, and like, enough time to move away from the arrow when you see it.  

5 hours ago, Labjax.2465 said:

I don't want to scare people off of doing it or something, I just think you're exaggerating a bit in the other direction.

And i think you're exaggerating a bit too. All that fearmongering about strike difficulty has lead to raiders selling strikes for 250 MC and poor people getting scammed.

All i said was this strike is doable with pugs and some knowledge of the mechanics. I never said you can just 111111 the boss while standing still, you can't do that in open world so why would you in a strike. 

But it's NOT as hard as many make it out to be, it's doable, and if it's your first time, and someone explains the mechanics, you can do it, even if half of you die when Li's attacks start overlapping.

It might even take 2 or 3 tries, but that's not the indication that it's "difficult" because in comparison, even with knowledge of the mechanics, doing wing1 first boss will be always a faliure if you don't bring certain builds.

In strikes, you can go in with anything, like, yeah it's not gonna be optimal, but you'll do the strike.

 

But this isn't the strike thread, it's a turtle thread, and while those 2 are kinda linked, the thread is about AFTER people completed it and got their turtles and what they do with them.

 

So i'll just stop derailing the thread now. 

[Veprovina.4876]

2 hours ago, Miss Lana.5276 said:

I only ever use the turtle for core map completion when I'm on a character with only a condi dps build. The turtle's auto attack doesn't dismount you, and does a fair chunk of  damage to structures (supplies, gates, flagpoles, etc) where condi doesn't affect things like that in the base game. Saves time.

That's nice too! I think i still have 1 gift of world completion left so i won't have to do another soon, but it's a nice use of the turtle in base content! Cause i was too always struggling with those on condi builds lol, took way too much time hahaha. 😄 

[Khisanth.2948]

It has the weirdest niche of all the mounts. You can use it to help another account unlock all the uncontested WPs on a map. Did that a bit during the beta since money spent on beta account doesn't matter 😛

[Image.8630]

On 4/25/2022 at 7:40 AM, PookieDaWombat.6209 said:

its probably been said, but the biggest downside to the mount is that they literally made it pointless to use on your own, so if you can't fire your own cannons on the thing, why bother.   sure, its cool to have a co-pilot, but when its effectiveness is halved right out the gates, then why even bother?

Exactly!   I tried to sued it a few times but no one would board it, so it becomes totally useless.  Let us use canon if we are alone.

[Tukaram.8256]

22 minutes ago, Image.8630 said:

Exactly!   I tried to sued it a few times but no one would board it, so it becomes totally useless.  Let us use canon if we are alone.

It would make sense to be able to use the cannons.  Anyone that really wants a turtle will have one - so why would they take 2nd seat on someone else's turtle?  And anyone that doesn't like turtle mounts, won't want to ride either.  Most people will end up riding alone... 

[Galmac.4680]

Best use for my turtle is to kill the pocket raptors. One stomp and they are gone. But then it's just a nice-to-have.