Change the name of "Infantile Mode," please

[mindcircus.1506]

22 minutes ago, VerdantThorn.9345 said:

you stop telling me how I should feel. Stop telling me to relax, to breathe, to just lie back and enjoy the content, and to do anything else like that.

I have said no such thing.
This is just more you reacting to things that aren't real and making up reasons to get booty bothered.

But grats for putting the RPG in MMORPG at least.

[VerdantThorn.9345]

Okay, to return to the topic - 

 

It should be easy to change the name of the game mode, and the associated achievements/collections. It is just a find/replace exercise, which does not involve mechanics or balance whatsoever. I don't see the harm in doing it. I don't have a single replacement I'd like to see, but basically any of the options - Easy Mode, Beginner Mode, Novice Mode, Bookah Mode, even Progeny Mode - are improvements to varying degrees. For the achievements/collections tied to it, something like "First Steps toward Super Adventure" or whatever seems fine. I'm honestly not the greatest at naming things, so I'm sure someone else could come up with a better name than that. What really matters at the end of the day, at least to me, is that it not sound like the game devs are calling the player a child. I'm sure that was not the intent, but the intent of an action matters less than the effect of that action at the end of the day. 

 

Now, one final thing worth thinking about, in the whole "is this REALLY them calling the players that?" discussion: 

Achievements and collections, absent those that confer unique rewards, don't have an in-world reality to them. They are messages sent largely between the game and the player. As has been pointed out in the thread previous to this, other players would have to work really hard to see any of that, and it's not as though NPCs are voicing any of it. Achievements/Collections are just the game - not SAB, but Guild Wars 2 - talking to the player, through the progression mechanics that are baked into it. All I'd like is for those messages to not be ones telling players who play a certain way that they are babies/children/infants. Similarly, I'd like for in-game messages in the same vein to either be removed or be very clearly denoted as things that NPCs are saying, since things like quest dialog and whatnot aren't ever fully in character and that blurry line is what creates a lot of the problem. 

[Super Hayes.6890]

Um, I hear you OP but I must disagree. I will not tell you how to feel. I simply do not agree that changing the mode's name will solve this issue for you. If the name of the mode upsets you, I do agree that you should stop playing that content. It is sad that you would miss out but this is being generated by your perception. I'm not a dev but I don't believe they named this mode "infantile" to insult anyone. Perhaps I am mistaken. I hope you find other ways to enjoy the game because, honestly, I don't see this changing.

[Ashantara.8731]

I think the names are meant as a joke (i.e., self-irony) for those who play said difficulty mode, not as an insult (i.e., as being looked down upon by others). Even the clouds and sounds are "infantile".

Take it with a wink. 😉

Edited March 31, 2022 by Ashantara.8731

[Teratus.2859]

2 hours ago, VerdantThorn.9345 said:

 

You're right, for someone who hasn't been - like many, MANY disabled people - dealing with this for a long time... it can be hard to understand why this is so bothersome. It can seem irrational. It can seem totally out of proportion, because "infantile" is not a word that gets bleeped or blurred or anything like that in everyday usage. It's not a slur. 

 

But, that doesn't mean it's not causing harm. I'm certain I'm not the only one who's bothered by it, though I might be the only one complaining about it. Disabled folks are routinely told... well, a lot of the things I've been told up the thread... whenever they complain about things like this. No matter how mildly they do it. 

 

Or, heck, maybe I'm alone in this and community consensus on this is it's fine. Whatever. Now that I've seen it I'll just not play SAB. It's not the first gameplay experience in GW2 I've skipped, and won't be the last. I'd rather not skip it for this reason, but that's life for you. It's not the first business - or in this case, element thereof - I've chosen not to patronize because of accessibility issues.

That's a fair point, and it makes it easier to understand your perspective as well.

There is certainly a lot of discussion in these forums regarding disability and accessibility in Gw2, it was even a subject recently discussed by some prominent Gw2 content creators as well.

It's a shame it tends to be a complicated subject when it comes to certain rules Anet have for Gw2 ending up preventing disabled players from using equipment and tools that make the game significantly more accessible to them.
This is definitely something Anet really need to look into going forward.

[Rogue.8235]

Changing the name isn't helpful for what is, understandably, a very real underlying issue.  When considering the entire population, projections of self-depreciation can be triggered by everything in the game.  To change the presentation of the game based on each individual's perception is an extreme undertaking, and does not help the core issue.  Treatment of the condition is advisable over treatment of symptoms.  

The OP's perception of infantile mode is very real for the OP, and should not be diminished.  However, the OP must understand that this is a symptom of a deeper condition that will not go away, and the single instance of the label, infantile mode, does not affect everyone equally.  The OP should consider that others may view other aspects of the game that the OP would consider normal in the same light.  Should every aspect of every component of the game be changed to alleviate every possible symptom of every condition present in the player base as a whole?  To change the label, infantile mode, is to suggest that the answer to the foregoing question is "yes."   Otherwise, the argument is to consider only the OP's manifestations and disregard helping the manifestations of others,which is unfair.

This, I personally believe, is a case where such change is unnecessary and risks further harm and complications.  To make this change would be unfair if all changes, presented and argued in like manner,, were not also implemented.  However, the burden would be too vast to undertake if every change, presented and argued in like manner, were implemented.  

 

These statements come from a player who plays infantile mode, because I'm blind.  

 

Edited March 31, 2022 by Rogue.8235
emphasis added

[VerdantThorn.9345]

8 minutes ago, Rogue.8235 said:

Changing the name isn't helpful for what is, understandably, a very real underlying issue.  

 

 

Absolutely true. Adding accessibility options that make the gaming experience enjoyable for the broadest possible range of people is certainly preferable to renaming things, if that's the choice I'm being offered. But, when the problem being addressed is the name of something, then changing the name of that thing is the solution to THAT problem. 

 

Are there broader problems of access for disabled folks in Guild Wars 2? Yes, there doubtless are. I do not think the only paths forward on those are either "solve all of them" or "solve none of them," though. I specifically called out this because it is an easy fix to an event happening right now, being rebalanced (and thus actively worked on) right now, and is a fix that would not in and of itself take a whole lot of time and/or resources.

 

17 minutes ago, Rogue.8235 said:

When considering the entire population, projections of self-depreciation can be triggered by everything in the game.  To change the presentation of the game based on each individual's perception is an extreme undertaking, and does not help the core issue.  Treatment of the condition is advisable over treatment of symptoms.

 

I don't think I'm an edge case. Based on the experiences of friends of mine within a number of different communities, and based on what scant data exists on the subject, it is not an at all uncommon experience. 

 

If by "treatment of the condition" you mean making it such that disabled people are not infantilized by society, yes that would in fact be lovely. However, I think changing the name of this game mode of Super Adventure Box is probably more immediately feasible. If there is a path forward on that, though, I will gladly show up to lend whatever help I can. 

 

24 minutes ago, Rogue.8235 said:

OP must understand that this is a symptom of a deeper condition that will not go away, and the single instance of the label, infantile mode, does not affect everyone equally. 

 

Yes I understand that, thank you. If the heterogeneity with which that label affects people were not clear before I made this post, it very much is now. 

 

(also, side LOL at time marching forward - 8 minutes ago, 17 minutes ago, 24 minutes ago - as I repeatedly quote your post to make mine.) 

 

29 minutes ago, Rogue.8235 said:

The OP should consider that others may view other aspects of the game that the OP would consider normal in the same light.  Should every aspect of every component of the game be changed to alleviate every possible symptom of every condition present in the player base as a whole?  To change the label, infantile mode, is to suggest that the answer to the foregoing question is "yes."   Otherwise, the argument is to consider only the OP's manifestations and disregard helping the manifestations of others,which is unfair.

 

 

I don't see that as unfair. Let them speak up if/when they encounter something that offends them, and I hope they're listened to. To the extent I can and the extent I hear about it, I'll help. What you are essentially asking, though is, 'if we change this, then where does it stop?' and the answer is 'somewhere.' It stops somewhere. I'm respectfully asking the developers to change this name, not mandating - as though I had the power to - that they change all names or gameplay elements that offend even a single person forevermore going forward. I don't think that's unreasonable.

 

To put it another way, though: precisely how many people does a name or whatever have to offend before it becomes worth changing? What is that number, and how was it arrived at? There is clearly already a threshold of offense in the game, above which players and the game developers do not go. There are certain words and phrases that they don't use, and likely certain story elements that they would never include, out of respect for the player base and a desire to not cause overt offense. So, they already pick and choose. I'm asking that in their picking and choosing, they choose not to stick with this name going forward. 

 

49 minutes ago, Rogue.8235 said:

This, I personally believe, is a case where such change is unnecessary and risks further harm and complications.  To make this change would be unfair if all changes, presented and argued in like manner,, were not also implemented.  However, the burden would be too vast to undertake if every change, presented and argued in like manner, were implemented.  

 

These statements come from a player who plays infantile mode, because I'm blind.  

 

 

I disagree with your "slippery slope" analogy. Making this change does not require or imply that the developers should make any future ones. Certainly, if there are any that come to MY attention - whether because they bother me, or bother someone else - then I will argue for them. But, it isn't the case that this becomes some sort of binding precedent upon which ArenaNet MUST act. It's just a request, argued and presented on its own merits, and hopefully acted upon because of the same.

 

Changing a name harms no one. Certainly, no more than changing a zone meta's mechanics, or a boss's DPS, or an item's drop rate, and those are things that ArenaNet does all the time. Does ArenaNet changing ONE boss's enrage timer, or changing the size of their hit box, mean that they must therefore change all other enrage timers or hit boxes in the game if they bother people? We push for them to make - and they DO make - far more impactful mechanical changes all the time. This is purely cosmetic, and is - or ought to be IMO, I'm no computer programmer though so I could be wrong about that - an incredibly simple fix. It's just changing a name. 

 

Given your issue, a good analogy is if they rendered the text in a story section in such a manner that screen readers could not parse it. You could probably find a workaround for it because you've probably got a number of tricks up your sleeve for that, including friends who could just read it to you directly if all else fails... but that still wouldn't fix the problem. The problem would be that they made that gameplay element inaccessible to you, and the solution would be rendering the text in a manner that could be read by the appropriate software. I can just skip SAB this year (and at this point probably will), and I can also just bear that burden. I've borne bigger burdens in my life, surely. But, neither of those is a solution. The solution is doing whatever it takes to remove the burden, and between the two - changing the name of "Infantile Mode" and changing society so that it does not leave many disabled people with a very twitchy relationship toward being infantilized - I think the former is probably a more reasonable request. 

 

However, you do bring up a good point about accessibility issues. I think that needs to be talked about more. Tag me in a thread about those broader issues and lets talk about the ways that Guild Wars 2 can be made more accessible. That applies both for visually impaired and blind people (I'm functionally blind [20/100 acuity and double vision] in one eye, among other things, and that contributes to the aforementioned visual confusion), HoH and deaf people (also HoH - yay multiple sensory deficits!), and the whole spectrum of other neurological, musculoskeletal, cognitive, and other disabilities and states of health that are relevant to game. We can and should talk about those broader issues, while at the same time also isolating and fixing - I hope - these particular issues. 

[VerdantThorn.9345]

(Okay and now that I read the comment as posted and out of edits, those "time marching forward" bits changed to all be the same "time ago" - yay for good programming of the forums' backend! No complaints there LOL!)

[Darklord Roy.2514]

4 hours ago, VerdantThorn.9345 said:

 

Then HECK, call it "progeny" mode. Use the terminology that Asura tend to use when referring to their own children. Sure, it's in character infantilization... but that actually doesn't bother me. In character a**holes exist, and that's fine. I care that they chose a term with out of character emotional weight and baggage attached. 

 

Also, you need to stop dictating to me how I should feel. Just stop doing that. It is rude and condescending. I won't tell you how you should feel; you stop telling me how I should feel. Stop telling me to relax, to breathe, to just lie back and enjoy the content, and to do anything else like that. Not only does that not actually do any of those things (since when has telling someone to relax EVER made them go "oh gee I think I'll take that sage advice"?), it actively makes this whole discussion less productive. If you don't, I just won't reply to any further messages from you. 

You're allowed to feel however you want, that's fine. I won't be one of the people telling you that you shouldn't be bothered by it because that is your personal prerogative and you are going to feel how you feel, that's how humans work.

 

However, on the flip side of the coin, if the naming bothers you this much it is more on your personal matter to either find a way to enjoy it anyway, or find something else to enjoy that doesn't trigger an emotional response. This mode has been in the game for quite a long time and, even if it bothers you personally, it isn't offensive language and we cannot expect the SAB developers to change the joke because that was the entire point of the name in the first place.

 

If you need to take care of yourself that's fine, but it isn't their responsibility to do so on this level. You're welcome to ask but I wouldn't expect anything, and going any steps further to demand it would be censorship.

[VerdantThorn.9345]

2 hours ago, Darklord Roy.2514 said:

If you need to take care of yourself that's fine, but it isn't their responsibility to do so on this level. You're welcome to ask but I wouldn't expect anything, and going any steps further to demand it would be censorship.

 

If a legal mandate on the subject were to happen contrary to the public interest, THAT would be censorship. Anything shy of that would not be. 

 

But, never mind. I'll just sit with my discomfort and write SAB off for the foreseeable future. Y'all enjoy your joke. 

[atomicqueen.5269]

Wow. Despite the fact that the forums literally exist here for people to express their opinions and find community, everyone spent their entire energies on creating pretty nihilistic responses dedicated to convincing OP they're alone and not even bothering to ask more questions to enlighten yourself about an experience you don't have. Or even worse, talking down to OP and suggesting they examine their "triggers" as if they're overly emotional and incapable of regulating their own emotions for having the brain to form a reflective critique of their experience in the first place and channelling it productively and rationally into what was supposed to be appropriate forum. And then doubling down to insist that no one here is being condescending despite all the living evidence? Gawd. Y'all gotta know that when you follow up comments of "your opinion is baffling because I've never encountered it before" with the twisted logic of "therefore your suggested solution has no merit or worth", you're literally trying to use your own ignorance as if it was expertise or evidence itself, yeah? Cringe. OP, I wouldn't blame you for feeling mildly insane after talking to such a brick wall of responses.

 

I've had proximity to both game development in my life, and disability care, and I agree that this is a perfectly reasonable and simple request with fair reasoning behind it. I'm not personally affected by this choice, and for a game that does patches all the time for basic accessibility and gameplay enjoyment reasons, there is no real reason to keep it as is. Certainly no convincing arguments made here.

 

I hope your post catches a dev's eye and gives them something to consider for future patches. If they haven't programmed themselves into a broken little corner the way they did with account name changes - that's the only reason I can think of why a name change to a game mode wouldn't be viable. Even if the achievements keep their names, perhaps the rest could still be changed. There's certainly more achievements than I can count that already have titles disconnected to their quests or content. I have to google them all the time. A few more honestly wouldn't bother me at this point, and I'd rather fellow players all get to feel just as comfortable playing the game than preserve some arbitrary sense of lore fluff in the title (?) that wasn't that internally consistent or inportant in the first place.

And I hope that you don't bother wasting any more time on this forum space. If no change can be made, you at least deserve some basic dignity and respect for the experience you're having, and I hope you have a chill guild who supports that for you at the very least. Peace ✌️

[Kitta.3657]

You've internalized something so banal and are asking the devs to change it to cater to this internalization you did... Surely you can see why people think your suggestion albeit not hard to do, to be absurd. You're taking personal offense over something that's not about you and not speaking about you. I'm sorry OP, but it's 100% on you. I wouldn't care if they did change it but you have to be more self-aware at how absurd your demand is and understand you're victimizing yourself and that'll never lead to anything good in life for you.

There are some things that are worth adapting to make players more comfortable, especially ones with disability, but disabled people also understand there is a limit to what is reasonable. I have a completely different sense of time due to my ADHD, because of that I need to use timers addons for content like Sabetha or Dhuum because I'm unable to keep track of time while having to focus on what I am doing even though I'm able to multitask. Time works differently for me. I accept that this is a me thing and there's no reason for anet to do things differently. Now compare this to your complaint here. You feel insulted. That's all, that's literally all there is to it. You simply feel insulted. Clearly it's a YOU thing you need to work on rather than ask for things to be changed around you.

Edited April 1, 2022 by Kitta.3657

[Danikat.8537]

You're taking an April Fools joke far too seriously.

That's what SAB is  - a very big, elaborate April Fools joke. The entire thing is a parody of 8 bit (and 16 bit) games, including the naming. Everything about it is supposed to be exaggerated to the point of absurdity because that's what makes it a joke and not just a retro style game (although those weren't nearly as common when SAB was first released).

If this was a serious game I would completely agree. If Tunic (which is inspired by a lot of the same games as SAB) labelled it's 'no fail mode' "Infantile mode" I'd support asking them to change it. But that's because it's a serious game and it's various options should be presented as such. Super Adventure Box is pretty much the opposite. Everything it does is making fun of something, in an affectionate way, but still.

[Dathremar.5089]

On 3/30/2022 at 7:38 PM, VerdantThorn.9345 said:

To start off with, I really have enjoyed the game for the past long while since I came back to it (a bit before the xpac dropped, and consistently since). This is not a general complaint about the quality of quantity of gameplay, the story, or anything like that. That has all been lovely. Soundtracks have been lovely. The visuals have been lovely. The writing of the core story - and side stories - have made me really impressed. Please bear in mind that this request is coming from a fan, someone who really likes and has been impressed with your game so far. 

 

Please change the name of "Infantile Mode," and the associated "Baby's First" achievements. It is not necessary to call them that. I don't know when it got added, or even if I just forgot and it has been there all along, but I think it really needs to be renamed. It's something that is insulting to people who turn on 'easy mode' as an accessibility tool, because of any number of neurological or musculoskeletal disabilities. It also adds nothing to the game, even for people with no accessibility issues whatsoever. The only people it helps are those who want to look down on others for how they play the game, and given the core ethos of Guild Wars 2 seems to have always been "Play How You Want"... a statement like that seems very much antithetical to that goal.

 

Just ask yourself: what would *Taimi* think of "Infantile Mode?" Yes it's a challenge to be overcome, and yes she'd want to overcome it, but would she really appreciate some other Asura calling her an infant? I really, really appreciate the frank and empathetic storytelling focusing on the disabled experience that centers on her; I really don't want that to be counter-weighted by something as tone-deaf as the name of that game mode.

 

For me personally, I find it very very difficult to advance in SAB because of visual confusion issues stemming from post-surgical brain damage and manual dexterity tied to the same. I have overcome much of it (just look at the number of JPs I've been able to do, including ones like Loreclaw Expanse with enough camera shakes to give me vertigo) but I have specific compensatory strategies for that. Sometimes that means using things like an easy mode or a walkthrough, to get me past a particularly hard section. Other times it means other things. Basically all of SAB post 201 has been a Particularly Hard Section for me (judge me for that however you like).

 

I don't think folks in my position, or even folks in the position of just wanting an easier gameplay experience or to *finally* get to the end of SAB, deserve to be called names for it. It's not a hard thing to fix, and would cost you nothing, so I ask that you please do. 

 I like the names and want them to stay this way, and since Anet likes me more than you, good luck getting it changed.

[clown.7148]

17 hours ago, VerdantThorn.9345 said:

 

Then HECK, call it "progeny" mode. Use the terminology that Asura tend to use when referring to their own children. Sure, it's in character infantilization... but that actually doesn't bother me. In character a**holes exist, and that's fine. I care that they chose a term with out of character emotional weight and baggage attached. 

 

Also, you need to stop dictating to me how I should feel. Just stop doing that. It is rude and condescending. I won't tell you how you should feel; you stop telling me how I should feel. Stop telling me to relax, to breathe, to just lie back and enjoy the content, and to do anything else like that. Not only does that not actually do any of those things (since when has telling someone to relax EVER made them go "oh gee I think I'll take that sage advice"?), it actively makes this whole discussion less productive. If you don't, I just won't reply to any further messages from you. 

Let me start by saying that your feelings are valid. People on your thread are gaslighting you imo. People need to learn to stop telling people how they should feel or whatever. Just change the name of the mode to something else. Its not like it will affect players who are not feeling the same way as you or other players.

Edited April 1, 2022 by clown.7148

[Atria.6729]

Ah yes, a mature response. Bullying people with disablities on the internet...

I doubt that after 9 (?) years anything would be changed in this mode so avoiding the trigger would probably be a way to go. I personally feel that "progeny" or "bookah" mode would be more in lore. Also, since most people here claim that they don't care about the name, I belive that they wouldn't care about a differnet one as well if such change would occure.

[VerdantThorn.9345]

7 hours ago, Kitta.3657 said:

You've internalized something so banal and are asking the devs to change it to cater to this internalization you did... Surely you can see why people think your suggestion albeit not hard to do, to be absurd. You're taking personal offense over something that's not about you and not speaking about you. I'm sorry OP, but it's 100% on you. I wouldn't care if they did change it but you have to be more self-aware at how absurd your demand is and understand you're victimizing yourself and that'll never lead to anything good in life for you.

 

I can certainly see that many people consider it to be absurd, yes. My growing ignore list attests to the heat with which that feeling burns in them. But, I don't think that people on the forums considering something to be absurd is necessarily the same thing as that thing *being* absurd. If the game were designed based solely on the sentiments expressed in the forums it would be a broken, buggy, inconsistent mess. We also (myself included) all simultaneously think OUR idea is a good one, and we all think it should be implemented... but we all also have a very poor perspective on the actual challenges of actually designing the game. Hence, I asked. I'm still hoping a dev will see the request and take it under consideration, if it is indeed feasible for them to do.

 

I didn't, I'm not, and frankly I won't "demand" they change anything. I'll ask, and they either will or they won't. That'll be the end of it. If they don't I just won't play SAB. At this point though, that's less to do with the original issue, and more to do with the ugliness in this conversation - not between you and I, but overall - having left a very, very bad taste in my mouth of which I don't want to be reminded. If they do I will play it. I'll be eternally grateful to them for it, thank them in spades for having heard my request, and probably have a super fun adventure time in Super Adventure Box thereafter. Either way, it's not as though I'm going to take to Change dot org or contact the ACLU about it or something. It's just the name of a game mode for a parody game-within-a-game of a somewhat but not super popular MMORPG. It's something that I think it worth fixing, because it seems incredibly easy to fix, but it's not something that is cataclysmic or apocalyptic in scope or impact. 

 

Finally, lets say this AGAIN...

 

Lots of people are projecting things onto me, including you with words like "internalized" and "personal offense" and "victimizing yourself" but also "triggered" and associated words from posts I've already ignored which suggest some sort of psychological or emotional frailty on my part (e.g. a "victim mentality"). Bearing in mind that you - the broader "you" - have absolutely no idea what life I've lived, and I have no idea what life you've lived, lets just agree to not do that to each other, okay? Maybe take a step back and reassess your approach, if you find yourself doing that. It helps no one, and adds very little of worth to any conversation ever.

 

Note: the above is in reply to your post, Kitta and uses examples drawn from it, but it's also not. You're far from the worst and I'm not admonishing you in particular. It just so happens that the folks I AM directing that to, are folks I've already ignored, and folks who in the future I will ignore without replying to. However, even below the threshold of people I simply ignore, I want to make that note because that aspect of the conversation has both been covered already and is a bridge to nowhere. 

[Darklord Roy.2514]

10 hours ago, VerdantThorn.9345 said:

 

If a legal mandate on the subject were to happen contrary to the public interest, THAT would be censorship. Anything shy of that would not be. 

 

But, never mind. I'll just sit with my discomfort and write SAB off for the foreseeable future. Y'all enjoy your joke. 

I wasn't making light of the issue, I in fact implicitly pointed out that I am not here to dictate how you should feel about the subject. However, I'm also a realist, and I know that it isn't Anet's job to cater to you personally.

 

The reason why, is that similarly to how you are offended by the term "infantile," there is GOING to be someone in the world offended by the term "easy mode." It is quite literally IMPOSSIBLE for them to create a universal terminology that will appeal to 100% of the player base. That is human nature, and changing the name once means that everyone sees the mindset of "if it bothers me, I can make them change it." Then they change it again. And again. And again, ad infinitum.

 

Something that is right for you is wrong for someone else, always. You have to take that into account when you are in such a small percentage complaining about something like this. It is not possible to make everyone happy, that is ALL that I'm saying. You have to either learn to accept that, or refuse and move on to other avenues.

[VerdantThorn.9345]

1 hour ago, Darklord Roy.2514 said:

I wasn't making light of the issue, I in fact implicitly pointed out that I am not here to dictate how you should feel about the subject. However, I'm also a realist, and I know that it isn't Anet's job to cater to you personally.

 

The reason why, is that similarly to how you are offended by the term "infantile," there is GOING to be someone in the world offended by the term "easy mode." It is quite literally IMPOSSIBLE for them to create a universal terminology that will appeal to 100% of the player base. That is human nature, and changing the name once means that everyone sees the mindset of "if it bothers me, I can make them change it." Then they change it again. And again. And again, ad infinitum.

 

Something that is right for you is wrong for someone else, always. You have to take that into account when you are in such a small percentage complaining about something like this. It is not possible to make everyone happy, that is ALL that I'm saying. You have to either learn to accept that, or refuse and move on to other avenues.

 

That's fair. It's cliché to say "the comments got to me" but they did, and that was just about the point I started simply ignoring people who were being particularly internetty all over the topic. It was less to do with you than others but all the same I'm sorry for taking you at something other than your intended meaning. 

Anyway, what you are essentially saying is that I'm part of an insignificant (on the basis of it being vanishingly small) group and therefore my complaint is not worth acting upon, because if one complaint of one insignificant group gets acted upon then all complaints of all insignificant groups must therefore be acted upon. I disagree with that argument on three points. (also note: I'm not intending "insignificant" there as a pejorative, but more in its scientific usage. As in, "below the threshold of significance." I'm not saying that you are saying I'M insignificant.)

First, while I might be the only one *complaining* about this right now, disabled people who are treated this way are not an insignificant group nor is this a particularly rare experience.

You can look up scientific literature (I found a "Society for Disability Studies" and "Journal for Developmental and Physical Disabilities" article about autism and about a range of disabilities after a brief search, the former of which one may or may not fairly consider a disability but I consider the research itself still relevant to my point) or grey literature (I found pieces on "Medium," "Psychology Today," and others) on the subject to see that it is not something that I've pulled out of thin air. I did that research before I started this topic, because I wanted to check myself to be sure that this was not a "me" thing, even though I was fairly certain it was not. It's not just me. I might be the one feeling this way and I might be the one complaining right now, but I am doing so on behalf - ostensibly, at least - of a larger group of people about a broader problem. There are a lot of disabled people in the world, and while every disabled body and disabled story is unique, this is one fairly common thread running through the disabled experience. Not every disabled person has to or will agree with me and I'm not asking them to, though, which is why I didn't start this post *with* that research or studies. I only wanted to speak for me, because my voice *should* be enough on its own. However, given it is germane to the conversation to mention it... it's not just me, and the group and problem I'm speaking to are not insignificant. 

Second, it does not necessarily follow that if this one change is made that all changes of this type must therefore be made after.

If a person were to ask for a certain boss's mechanics to be changed because their build is unable to meaningfully engage with the fight due to the unique circumstances OF the fight... would that then imply that all bosses everywhere must therefore have their mechanics changed in the same way? No, of course not. One change does not necessarily imply another. The slope is only slippery if one change makes another easier in some way. Changing things in this way - by speaking up and voicing a concern - is not easy and is not getting easier. You get hate for it. You get abuse for it. You can read up the thread and see what comes of even the mildest of requests, for the smallest and most arbitrary of changes. A reasonable person only walks into that with the utmost reluctance. Absent that, ArenaNet can still say "no" whenever they like, based on whatever interest they feel is applicable. I very much doubt that if this change were made, the floodgates would suddenly open and NPCs or game modes or quests or achievements would be having their names changed every other day in order to suit the whims of individual players who complained. 

Third, even if one were part of an insignificant group, that would not necessarily mean that a complaint weren't worth acting upon.

I would hope that even if it were one person, a genuine complaint of genuine harm would be enough to be worth acting upon. That does not necessarily imply that you need to do the thing the person asks for, because sometimes just an apology and a genuine pledge to try to do better in the future is what's warranted... but one needn't stay silent for harm done up until the point it meets a certain threshold of significance. One can act whenever one wishes to act, and I would hope that one acts as soon as they realize that they've caused harm, and in the way that best rectifies that harm, whatever that happens to be.

 

Look, I get that a lot of people disagree with me about this one. That much is clear. I hope, however, that ArenaNet realizes that sometimes silence is not the same thing as assent, and an idea not being popular on the forums doesn't mean it's bad (nor that it's good, frankly). They'll do what they'll do, ultimately, and I'll accept it. Still, I hope they act to rectify this, because it does still bother me and would mean a lot to me - and, I'm sure, to others - if they did. 

Edited April 1, 2022 by VerdantThorn.9345
Typos

[Super Hayes.6890]

I may not agree with your request but I must say that I respect the calm demeanor in which you are responding. Some of these replies are downright aggressive.

[Randulf.7614]

If renaming, it needs to keep to a fun suggestion or one associated with the tongue in cheekiness of it all.

Rainbow mode or Fluffy mode maybe

Oh bookah mode suggested above is good. 

Edited April 1, 2022 by Randulf.7614

[VerdantThorn.9345]

4 minutes ago, Randulf.7614 said:

If renaming, it needs to keep to a fun suggestion or one associated with the tongue in cheekiness of it all.

Rainbow mode or Fluffy mode maybe

 

That also works for me! It would certainly keep with the aesthetic of the clouds and rainbow bridges. Like I have said before, I'm not fixated on one solution, I'd just like this problem solved in some manner. Whatever is most agreeable and most feasible for ArenaNet to do, and that fixes the problem, I'd like them to do.

[mythical.6315]

44 minutes ago, Randulf.7614 said:

If renaming, it needs to keep to a fun suggestion or one associated with the tongue in cheekiness of it all.

Rainbow mode or Fluffy mode maybe

Oh bookah mode suggested above is good. 

But what if someone else is offended by being called fluffy, a rainbow, or a bookah?

[Spero.1283]

This isn't about someone being "offended." It's about someone saying "Hey, this thing in the game feels like it's replicating a pattern that harms me and many people like me every day, and it'd be cool to not experience that here." It's fine if you, personally, don't get it. That doesn't make it untrue.  

And before anyone pops off with the bad faith argument along the lines of people could say any random thing harms them? Yes, they could. But that doesn't mean harm doesn't ever happen or make the original sentiment expressed here invalid. 

[Wielder Of Magic.3950]

Even after wading through three full pages of comments I still don't see the need to change this. 

You can't cater to everyone and everything, being overly-inclusive is a thing in this case. 

Sorry for how you get treated in the offline world and that because of that the term Infantile Mode triggers you, but that on its own is not enough reason to go through the hassle of changing the gamemode name, ingame text and ingame achievements.

What you feel is valid, nobody can take that away from you, but other people, the majority in fact, do not see it like that and they should not have to cater to you.

 

You have the right to feel offended, others have the right to, frankly, not care about you being offended. 

 

It's a joke, for 99,9999999999% of people a harmless one even. 

There will always be someone offended by something.