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CC lockdown is annoying


Infinity.2876

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in spvp heavy cc lock down is annoying it reduces you to a dead weight mass of sitting duck and you get focused down so fast regardless of gameplay

 

is there any other way, I know that you have stunbreaks but on a 12 second cool down?

stability isn't very common except on firebrand(havent seen much of those in spvp) and scrapper.

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Only issue I see is pulsing CC like Harbinger Shroud 5, Gravity Well, and Specters elite Well, etc. If you stun break, you're very likely to just get caught again and have the effort be pointless. 

An easy fix is making you immune to CC of the same skill if you broke any of the pulses. I'm aware this would severely hit Darkrazer's Daring for Renegade, but I personally don't think such ridiculous anti melee CC like a giant 6 second pulsing AoE daze field should even exist. 

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3 hours ago, CutesySylveon.8290 said:

Only issue I see is pulsing CC like Harbinger Shroud 5, Gravity Well, and Specters elite Well, etc. If you stun break, you're very likely to just get caught again and have the effort be pointless. 

An easy fix is making you immune to CC of the same skill if you broke any of the pulses. I'm aware this would severely hit Darkrazer's Daring for Renegade, but I personally don't think such ridiculous anti melee CC like a giant 6 second pulsing AoE daze field should even exist. 

its technically just a timing problem. if you stunbreak and dodge directly after a cc tick of this skills you can easily disengage, since you have a full second to do so. but if you stunbreak 0.9 secs after the cc tick you have just 0.1 sec left to dodge, and will probably fail.

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54 minutes ago, Zero.3871 said:

its technically just a timing problem. if you stunbreak and dodge directly after a cc tick of this skills you can easily disengage, since you have a full second to do so. but if you stunbreak 0.9 secs after the cc tick you have just 0.1 sec left to dodge, and will probably fail.

That's true, but you shouldn't have to blow multiple defensive tools to deal with a single CC skill. Once you break it, that should be the end of that skills CC effects. 

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4 hours ago, CutesySylveon.8290 said:

Only issue I see is pulsing CC like Harbinger Shroud 5, Gravity Well, and Specters elite Well, etc. If you stun break, you're very likely to just get caught again and have the effort be pointless. 

An easy fix is making you immune to CC of the same skill if you broke any of the pulses. I'm aware this would severely hit Darkrazer's Daring for Renegade, but I personally don't think such ridiculous anti melee CC like a giant 6 second pulsing AoE daze field should even exist. 

That is already exactly how harb shroud 5 works.

But also, if you are against pulsing cc then how about wards like guard hammer 5 and staff 4

Edited by agrippastrilemma.8741
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2 hours ago, Telgum.6071 said:

I always thought it should be some form of internal cooldown (like one second, or half second) where you are immune to hard CC if you've been already CCed.

No matter what form you implement passive CC immunity in, as soon as it's noticeable it's already too strong. You are basicly being rewarded for failing to avoid enemy CC. Hard pass, death to everything that's passive!

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1 hour ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

No matter what form you implement passive CC immunity in, as soon as it's noticeable it's already too strong. You are basicly being rewarded for failing to avoid enemy CC. Hard pass, death to everything that's passive!

How is being hit by CC rewarding? It would just make the CC chains more slow and the CC+damage combos more common.

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Arenanet should return the damage to CC abilities.

Most people caught in CC locks die anyway, so with damage on CC abilities, these players would be out of the lock quicker.

Sadly, the CC spam is here to stay and Arenanet is unlikely to do something about it.

Edited by Fueki.4753
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1 hour ago, Telgum.6071 said:

How is being hit by CC rewarding?

Current it isn't. And it shouldn't be. You want players to have an irremovable buff, an immunity for getting hit. That's a reward.

 

1 hour ago, Telgum.6071 said:

It would just make the CC chains more slow and the CC+damage combos more common.

Teamfights are a thing though. What you're envisioning here totally breaks down in any situation that's not strictly 1v1. Why bother with CC+damage combos if my massive 3+ second stun can get denied by a random 1/4th second daze?


So yeah, don't try to implement ideas that basicly reward players for being bad.

Edited by Bazsi.2734
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9 minutes ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

Current it isn't. And it shouldn't be. You want players to have an irremovable buff, an immunity for getting hit. That's a reward.

Not it isn't, this doesn't add up. It's like saying that all the traits and runes that have effects upon receiving conditions or dropping under the HP threshold are rewards. They aren't, they are just combat mechanics. Wonder which builds do you play in PvP, maybe you are being rewarding for being hit?

11 minutes ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

Teamfights are a thing though. What you're envisioning here totally breaks down in any situation that's not strictly 1v1. Why bother with CC+damage combos if my massive 3+ second stun can get denied by a random 1/4th second daze?

Quite the contrary, I say this considering when multiple foes perform CC chains over and over against one particular player. Your 3 second stun would hit unless you use it half second after the daze under this idea.

15 minutes ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

So yeah, don't try to implement ideas that basicly reward players for being bad.

Post here your builds, let's see if you are being rewarded for being bad.

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1 hour ago, Bazsi.2734 said:


So yeah, don't try to implement ideas that basicly reward players for being bad.

 there is usually someone that says the "just dodge" statement

which is really hard when elite dh trap requires you to play memory game while trying not to get hit by non aoe traps

 

On 4/1/2022 at 12:47 PM, Zero.3871 said:

what class are you playing, its easier to help if we know what options you have by your class.

I was playing thief (blinding powder and all) and elementalist

 

most of the cc I was facing was ranger both entangle, ranger point blank shot, will bender's heaven palm, and that necro one.

Edited by Infinity.2876
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1 hour ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Not it isn't, this doesn't add up. It's like saying that all the traits and runes that have effects upon receiving conditions or dropping under the HP threshold are rewards. They aren't, they are just combat mechanics. Wonder which builds do you play in PvP, maybe you are being rewarding for being hit?

There are a myriad of ways you can get rewarded for being hit. You can riposte with a wide variety of skills, you can get healed with some healing skills, you can get stunbreaks, boons, cleanses with traits and runes. These all have tradeoffs however, so there are appropriate ways to balance them.
What you're suggesting would have no tradeoff, it's just handholding for bad players. Nothing to balance here, just negating CC-s on players who are too slow/out of it to react in time.

 

1 hour ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Quite the contrary, I say this considering when multiple foes perform CC chains over and over against one particular player. Your 3 second stun would hit unless you use it half second after the daze under this idea.


So you agree, key long lasting CC-s will be negated randomly in teamfights. You cannot control when the enemy does or does not have this irremovable buff, and you can totally waste your Backbreaker or Magic Bullet like this because mEcHaNiCs. And you think this would be a good system. Okay. Holy sh*t. 
Ngl, we won't be able to resolve this. Your goal is what I want to avoid at any cost.

 

1 hour ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Post here your builds, let's see if you are being rewarded for being bad.

I play basicly everything. So just assume I posted every build ever. Now point to a trait that procs reactively and call me bad. You'll totally make me look bad. DO IT.

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33 minutes ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

What you're suggesting would have no tradeoff, it's just handholding for bad players. Nothing to balance here, just negating CC-s on players who are too slow/out of it to react in time.

Bruh, why no tradeoff? This is just how I see it and of course tradeoffs can be added at pleasure, just like with any ingame effect.

33 minutes ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

So you agree, key long lasting CC-s will be negated randomly in teamfights. You cannot control when the enemy does or does not have this irremovable buff, and you can totally waste your Backbreaker or Magic Bullet like this because mEcHaNiCs

What is this stupid take? This situation already happens over and over and over in every single PvP match with players overwritting CC on enemies, or landing massive damage skills to foes that just got dropped by an enemy.

33 minutes ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

I play basicly everything. So just assume I posted every build ever. Now point to a trait that procs reactively and call me bad. You'll totally make me look bad. DO IT.

I don't think you really get what I wrote, otherwise you wouldn't be posting this, but ok. The very first trait of the Defense traitline, Thick Skin, "Reduce incoming damage (-5%) while your health is above the threshold (75%)".  If you don't like this example, then Hardened Armor gives you Resolution when someone critically hits you. Last Stands, for when you are disabled? Cleansing Ire? These examples are all from the Defense traitline by the way, feel free to do some research on the remaining classes.

There are tons of examples like this ingame, both with and without cooldown. Can I then tell that you are being rewarded by being bad, or will you just admit that your message "your proposition only seeks to reward bad players" has no sense?

Edited by Telgum.6071
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13 hours ago, CutesySylveon.8290 said:

Only issue I see is pulsing CC like Harbinger Shroud 5, Gravity Well, and Specters elite Well, etc. If you stun break, you're very likely to just get caught again and have the effort be pointless. 

An easy fix is making you immune to CC of the same skill if you broke any of the pulses. I'm aware this would severely hit Darkrazer's Daring for Renegade, but I personally don't think such ridiculous anti melee CC like a giant 6 second pulsing AoE daze field should even exist. 

I would rather anet just limit the duration of CC. 3 seconds of pulsing CC is just bonkers, and I think landing a CC leading into being able to land one burst skill is a pretty good baseline to work from, and most classes have CC durations - when they land, anyway - far beyond what they need to land burst skills and it really gets into 'this feels awful to use and experience' territory. THe only exception might be warrior, which has longer CC durations (bulls charge 3 sec, shield4 2 sec) but actually needs them because hundred blades is horrendously out of date and actually fully channels for more than 3 seconds.

 

Context - been playing harbringer lately and it just feels dirty when landing the skill and I can fit 3-4 skills into the CC duration, or a few skills plus the pewpewpew AA. Overall though, I really don't like that being CC'd without a stunbreak can easily be a death sentence even at full health - imo, it'd be much healthier for it only to be a death sentence when it lands and everyone uses the 1 sec to land their burst skill. As it is, if I land shroud5 on harb and they're out of stunbreaks, shroud2 is 6-8k, shroud 3 and 4 can be around the same, and I may still have time to get some AA spam in. Which is just stupid.

Edited by Curennos.9307
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1 hour ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Bruh, why no tradeoff? This is just how I see it and of course tradeoffs can be added at pleasure, just like with any ingame effect.

What is this stupid take? This situation already happens over and over and over in every single PvP match with players overwritting CC on enemies, or landing massive damage skills to foes that just got dropped by an enemy.

I don't think you really get what I wrote, otherwise you wouldn't be posting this, but ok. The very first trait of the Defense traitline, Thick Skin, "Reduce incoming damage (-5%) while your health is above the threshold (75%)".  If you don't like this example, then Hardened Armor gives you Resolution when someone critically hits you. Last Stands, for when you are disabled? Cleansing Ire? These examples are all from the Defense traitline by the way, feel free to do some research on the remaining classes.

There are tons of examples like this ingame, both with and without cooldown. Can I then tell that you are being rewarded by being bad, or will you just admit that your message "your proposition only seeks to reward bad players" has no sense?

I tried. I failed. Dumb liberal owned by facts and logic. I belive in god now.
 

Edit: the self-deprecating humor is there to indicate that i determined there is no value in talking to you. Just so you don't try to misinterpret this into something it's not.

Edited by Bazsi.2734
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14 minutes ago, Bazsi.2734 said:

I tried. I failed. Dumb liberal owned by facts and logic. I belive in god now.
 

Edit: the self-deprecating humor is there to indicate that i determined there is no value in talking to you. Just so you don't try to misinterpret this into something it's not.

Yeah yeah, figured out.

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18 hours ago, agrippastrilemma.8741 said:

That is already exactly how harb shroud 5 works.

But also, if you are against pulsing cc then how about wards like guard hammer 5 and staff 4

No, if you break Harb Shroud 5, you can be floated again. 

Wards are actually a bit different because they're barrier skills, not pulses. They can also be gone through if you break as you get pushed back. It's buggy and likely not intended, but again, different kinds of skills. 

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9 hours ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Bruh, why no tradeoff? This is just how I see it and of course tradeoffs can be added at pleasure, just like with any ingame effect.

What is this stupid take? This situation already happens over and over and over in every single PvP match with players overwritting CC on enemies, or landing massive damage skills to foes that just got dropped by an enemy.

I don't think you really get what I wrote, otherwise you wouldn't be posting this, but ok. The very first trait of the Defense traitline, Thick Skin, "Reduce incoming damage (-5%) while your health is above the threshold (75%)".  If you don't like this example, then Hardened Armor gives you Resolution when someone critically hits you. Last Stands, for when you are disabled? Cleansing Ire? These examples are all from the Defense traitline by the way, feel free to do some research on the remaining classes.

There are tons of examples like this ingame, both with and without cooldown. Can I then tell that you are being rewarded by being bad, or will you just admit that your message "your proposition only seeks to reward bad players" has no sense?

Taking a defensive traitline vs a passive effect with no investment. See the difference?

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4 hours ago, CutesySylveon.8290 said:

No, if you break Harb Shroud 5, you can be floated again. 

 

Is this true? Just curious. I played on and against harbinger and never noticed this. Got floated on my ranger and stunbreaked insta out of this. I didnt get floated again. Is this maybe a bug?

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Just now, Bale.3851 said:

 

Is this true? Just curious. I played on and against harbinger and never noticed this. Got floated on my ranger and stunbreaked insta out of this. I didnt get floated again. Is this maybe a bug?

Let me guess, you break it with Lightning Reflex instantly evading out of effect?

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