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Viable sPvP necro build w/out wurm or spectral walk


Curennos.9307

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I'm bored of being stuck with wurm and spectral walk for ages and rank has lost all meaning, so....

 

Help me out - I'm trying to figure out the best necro build I can possibly manage that still functions in sPvP. No wurm, no spectral walk - either I win the fight or die. 

 

Thoughts?

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A tanky Speed Rune perma Swiftness build can work, but you are crippling yourself not using at least one of the two mentioned utility skills - that's how it is. Any class has a relatively small set of skills/mechanics that are mandatory to be viable in the competitive modes.

For necro these are:

(1) Rune of Speed + Speed of Shadows, (2) Spectral Walk, (3) Flesh Wurm ... at least one of them is mandatory. Pick all 3 if you want to play it super safe.

If you are bored by the above your only option is to switch the class or get wrecked.

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17 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

I guess, you could go for a very annoying blighter boon reaper that vomit weakness and chill with runes of aristocracy.

This sounds fun, thanks! 😄

 

Update - I'm trying a spite/soul reaping/harb build that uses the signet trait + signet heal, harb stunbreak, locust signet, plague signet, and elite harb elite. I have reached plat somehow and expect to be back in gold by the end of today.

4 hours ago, Despot.3048 said:

Might as well play minion master and be done with it. 

Hah. No. I still have *some* dignity left.

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You can gamble on full power counters, since the only condi builds u see are  harbingers (and even those are 50% chance be power) and some ele duelists..

 

So just go reaper with armor + minion shout + whatever

 

If you guessed right - youll be a reaper that can facetank trade with guards.

If you gambled wrong - you play agressive and pray

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10 hours ago, Curennos.9307 said:

This sounds fun, thanks! 😄

 

Update - I'm trying a spite/soul reaping/harb build that uses the signet trait + signet heal, harb stunbreak, locust signet, plague signet, and elite harb elite. I have reached plat somehow and expect to be back in gold by the end of today.

Hah. No. I still have *some* dignity left.

Your build sounds interesting - share?

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Honestly if I were to not use SWalk or Wurm, I'd go for a core Necro build with Wells and just be a giant pain in the behind for melee builds.

Spectral Ring, Well of Blood, Plaguelands. The other two slots could either both be Wells too, or you could do like, Spectral Armor + Corrosive Poison Cloud.
Although I very rarely use it, I seriously think Well of Blood is quite a good heal, and if you're going to be mostly stationary you'll be able to get full value from it.

For obvious reasons it wouldn't be a stellar build, but I think it could have some viability against things that are a little slower and need to be on top of you for most of their damage.

Like this?

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22 hours ago, Curennos.9307 said:

😄UI'm trying a spite/soul reaping/harb build that uses the signet trait + signet heal, harb stunbreak, locust signet, plague signet, and elite harb elite.

Spite Signet Harbinger is inferior to Blood Magic Elixier Harbinger (with elixir trait). Played both for dozens of hours. In fact the PvP/WvW version of the elixier heal is the best heal necro has: 7k heal + regeneration at 20 seconds cooldown. Does even synergize well with blood bank (7k barrier at the beginning of the fight).

Edited by KrHome.1920
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13 hours ago, ZeroSkitzo.5403 said:

Your build sounds interesting - share?

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PSABc2hjlRwWZYsMWLO6XnxSA-zZILjMTherAVGA

 

Basically play it like a squishier version of thief but with more damage. Most of my skills come in 1-2 seconds of heavy burst - AA spam in shroud to get up might stacks, burst (CC into shroud2, or chuck the elite potion beforehand for shroud 3 and 4), get out, while the shroud signet trait keeps my utilities on low cooldowns. I think on average my heal signet is up every 10-15 seconds. The locust signet is there to be mashed in the middle of a teamfight for...whatever you need it for. The healing is decent in teamfights and the boonrip is very nice. The move speed plus Speed of Shadows makes it surprisingly mobile even when soft CC'd or just when running around.

 

The main struggle has been dealing with classes that engage via teleport - in particular I've been getting wrecked by willbenders and heralds lately, since I have no instant wurm TP to get out of trouble. If I get jumped, I need to dodge immediately while popping into shroud and either using the leaps to get away, or the CC skill as fast as possible because otherwise I implode.

 

1 hour ago, Shroud.2307 said:

Honestly if I were to not use SWalk or Wurm, I'd go for a core Necro build with Wells and just be a giant pain in the behind for melee builds.

Spectral Ring, Well of Blood, Plaguelands. The other two slots could either both be Wells too, or you could do like, Spectral Armor + Corrosive Poison Cloud.
Although I very rarely use it, I seriously think Well of Blood is quite a good heal, and if you're going to be mostly stationary you'll be able to get full value from it.

For obvious reasons it wouldn't be a stellar build, but I think it could have some viability against things that are a little slower and need to be on top of you for most of their damage.

Like this?

I'll give this one a go too, thanks! I tried core nec a few days back as well, but I haven't played it for quite a while and it felt much weaker than I was used to. IIRC some patch notes increased the LF degen in shroud or something? Felt really bad - couldn't stay in shroud as long, felt harder to generate LF. It'll definitely be nice to have a 'get wrecked, melee builds' for all those heralds and willbenders who've been jumping on me at the very start of the fight.

 

1 hour ago, KrHome.1920 said:

Spite Signet Harbinger is inferior to Blood Magic Elixier Harbinger (with elixir trait). Played both for dozens of hours. In fact the PvP/WvW version of the elixier heal is the best heal necro has: 7k heal + regeneration at 20 seconds cooldown. Does even synergize well with blood bank (7k barrier at the beginning of the fight).

I did look at this one too - I just have a deep love of signet builds even if they're meh compared to alternatives. I also eyed Blood Magic because of the dagger trait, but ended up not doing it because I hate how the dagger trait is designed. I'll give this one a go too tho, thanks! Maybe something like http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PSABc2hjlhyWZYMVWLm8WrxSA-z5IWGZmC9WBqMA w/mara amulet and...not sure about the rune, but I figure this setup would take more healing/sustain traits. Wasn't sure what to take for the third utility (left the signet in)

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On 4/12/2022 at 12:36 PM, Curennos.9307 said:

I'm bored of being stuck with wurm and spectral walk for ages and rank has lost all meaning, so....

 

Help me out - I'm trying to figure out the best necro build I can possibly manage that still functions in sPvP. No wurm, no spectral walk - either I win the fight or die. 

 

Thoughts?

 

Then just go class cannon honestly. You can go class cannon reaper or glass cannon core necro

slot in offensive utility that can provide some defensive play when used correctly like well of darkness, spectral ring, plaugelands etc. 

If you want a win the fight or die option then go glass cannon. 

I do recommend keeping spectral walk but yeah drop wurm tbh im not a top rank pvp player but ive always done without wurm so i hardly miss it while everyone raves about it. I personally hate the whole setup of a utility skill not having any value till you are already caught and prefer utility that can always provide value on both the defensive and offensive spectrums. 

At least spectral walk can be used for offensive condi clense and swiftness for getting around / chasing your target. Wurm just has to sit there till you get caught and need to press your panic button. 

Looking at your other post I cannot suggest the healing signet now that anet has changed how its passive works. Before the change when you got hit it was about 400points of healing which is very good passive healing now its like 120 per second and your hit box needs to be touching another players for that passive to trigger. Additionally there is a delay after the cast completes before you get the active heal meaning you 100% can complete the healing cast get cc'ed in the after cast and not receive the heal while putting the signet on full cd. ITs rare that it happens but trust me it 100000% can happen. I cannot recommend that signet to anyone in pvp anymore at all its bad. Just do the right thing and take consume conditions. It pretty much locked to being necro's best heal in pvp without fail.

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1 minute ago, ZDragon.3046 said:

 

Then just go class cannon honestly. You can go class cannon reaper or glass cannon core necro

slot in offensive utility that can provide some defensive play when used correctly like well of darkness, spectral ring, plaugelands etc. 

If you want a win the fight or die option then go glass cannon. 

I do recommend keeping spectral walk but yeah drop wurm tbh im not a top rank pvp player but ive always done without wurm so i hardly miss it while everyone raves about it. I personally hate the whole setup of a utility skill not having any value till you are already caught and prefer utility that can always provide value on both the defensive and offensive spectrums. 

At least spectral walk can be used for offensive condi clense and swiftness for getting around / chasing your target. Wurm just has to sit there till you get caught and need to press your panic button. 

Looking at your other post I cannot suggest the healing signet now that anet has changed how its passive works. Before the change when you got hit it was about 400points of healing which is very good passive healing now its like 120 per second and your hit box needs to be touching another players for that passive to trigger. Additionally there is a delay after the cast completes before you get the active heal meaning you 100% can complete the healing cast get cc'ed in the after cast and not receive the heal while putting the signet on full cd. ITs rare that it happens but trust me it 100000% can happen. I cannot recommend that signet to anyone in pvp anymore at all its bad. Just do the right thing and take consume conditions. It pretty much locked to being necro's best heal in pvp without fail.

Don't get me wrong, I know the signet heal sucks despite the changes. I've just given up on life and decided to run it anyway. I wish they'd change the heal signet to be 450 range pbaoe, two targets base and double to 4 target leech in shroud, but I doubt that'll ever happen. Or something like, it only hits one target and prioritizes players, and each successive hit increases the leech damage and healing. That'd be sweet.

 

I also partially take it cause...signet cooldown reduction and plague signet takes care of my cleanse anyway. It's a nice flavor thing.

 

Wurm is extremely strong, especially when combined with spectral walk - you can activate spectral walk, activate wurm, and then have the option of juking back to your spectral walk port spot. It's very nice when kiting along the z-axis, as you can spectral walk, then hop down a ledge or something and if your enemy follows you, you can pop back up. You can even stomp with the two utility skills in the same way thief stomps with their shadowstep utility. The two skills are necro's only ports and compound in strength when used together, which I imagine if why they've been basically required picks for so long. I just got tired of running em.

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7 minutes ago, Curennos.9307 said:

Don't get me wrong, I know the signet heal sucks despite the changes. I've just given up on life and decided to run it anyway. I wish they'd change the heal signet to be 450 range pbaoe, two targets base and double to 4 target leech in shroud, but I doubt that'll ever happen. Or something like, it only hits one target and prioritizes players, and each successive hit increases the leech damage and healing. That'd be sweet.

 

I also partially take it cause...signet cooldown reduction and plague signet takes care of my cleanse anyway. It's a nice flavor thing.

 

Wurm is extremely strong, especially when combined with spectral walk - you can activate spectral walk, activate wurm, and then have the option of juking back to your spectral walk port spot. It's very nice when kiting along the z-axis, as you can spectral walk, then hop down a ledge or something and if your enemy follows you, you can pop back up. You can even stomp with the two utility skills in the same way thief stomps with their shadowstep utility. The two skills are necro's only ports and compound in strength when used together, which I imagine if why they've been basically required picks for so long. I just got tired of running em.

 

 

I know wurm combos can be strong when you combine it with spectral walk but thats alot of waste for some of the things classes get on a single button press (in some cases not even a utility skill) I just prefer having other options ive never felt wurm was required because i never fell into the trap of depending on it to start with. I prefer almost any other utility over wurm honestly ive just come to terms with the concept of trying to fight my way out rather just having an ez panic escape button you have to pre place. 

If wurm was made so that you port first  and leave a wurm in your location that you could then later return to I would run it all day but in its current state i have little interest in it despite its potential plays when comboed with spectral walk. It is still the weakest blink of the light armored classes in the sense that it needs to be setup first before you can use it which i refuse to overlook. 

Necro only has 2 really strong naturally offensive ports in its kit and one of them is under water and bugged so it dose not even work at the moment. 

Dark path in core shroud which is really strong now that its optional to follow up.

Veracious dive in harbinger under water (but its bugged right now and activates a core shroud skill instead) this skill is also irrelevant to pvp as no spvp maps have underwater.

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42 minutes ago, ZDragon.3046 said:

 

 

I know wurm combos can be strong when you combine it with spectral walk but thats alot of waste for some of the things classes get on a single button press (in some cases not even a utility skill) I just prefer having other options ive never felt wurm was required because i never fell into the trap of depending on it to start with. I prefer almost any other utility over wurm honestly ive just come to terms with the concept of trying to fight my way out rather just having an ez panic escape button you have to pre place. 

If wurm was made so that you port first  and leave a wurm in your location that you could then later return to I would run it all day but in its current state i have little interest in it despite its potential plays when comboed with spectral walk. It is still the weakest blink of the light armored classes in the sense that it needs to be setup first before you can use it which i refuse to overlook. 

Necro only has 2 really strong naturally offensive ports in its kit and one of them is under water and bugged so it dose not even work at the moment. 

Dark path in core shroud which is really strong now that its optional to follow up.

Veracious dive in harbinger under water (but its bugged right now and activates a core shroud skill instead) this skill is also irrelevant to pvp as no spvp maps have underwater.

I mean...yes, lol, you're absolutely right, and it goes to show how stupid strong teleports are in this game that those skills are considered *the* meta pick for 99% of all necro builds. I hope anet takes a look at the utility skills soon - they become more and more necessary the more other classes get powercrept. It was more feasible to run without them pre-EoD, but they sprinkled even more teleports around to the new especs. 

 

Thanks for your input btw 😄 I hadn't known about the vamp signet bug. Maybe I'll fling out another forum post asking for more signet changes.

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You can give up wurm probably, it's what I am trying recently, but spectral walk is a must have in any build, the cleanse is good to have, the juje potential will save you so many times even against good players, basically 2 stunbreaks for 1 skill. Wurm is pretty trash, even more after the nerf. For some reason 90% of the times it bugs out and doesn't teleport you "reaching it" if there is a little bush obstacle between you and the LoS with the wurm, so you basically use it and nothing happens, you consume the skill and teleport 140 range only. It got me killed too many times.

I think they messed up something on the code for those teleports, even on untamed the teleport bugs out too often like 90% of the map is a no port spot. If they don't fix it I wont play worm again, it's a waste of a slot and better run another stunbreak with some utility attached to it.

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I don't understand why people don't get along with what the OP want. No wurm, no spectral walk... The challenge he set up is pretty simple and clear. What's the point of saying: "You absolutely need to have at least one of them, they are just that good!"

If you can't get away, just out sustain your foes. It's not like the necromancer don't have the tools: AoE blind from core and reaper's GS, AoE weakness, self prot/regen, sustain traits, barrier from Blood bank and life leeching.

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11 hours ago, myun.6395 said:

You can give up wurm probably, it's what I am trying recently, but spectral walk is a must have in any build, the cleanse is good to have, the juje potential will save you so many times even against good players, basically 2 stunbreaks for 1 skill. Wurm is pretty trash, even more after the nerf. For some reason 90% of the times it bugs out and doesn't teleport you "reaching it" if there is a little bush obstacle between you and the LoS with the wurm, so you basically use it and nothing happens, you consume the skill and teleport 140 range only. It got me killed too many times.

I think they messed up something on the code for those teleports, even on untamed the teleport bugs out too often like 90% of the map is a no port spot. If they don't fix it I wont play worm again, it's a waste of a slot and better run another stunbreak with some utility attached to it.

Huh, I actually had this happen to me earlier and thought it was a rare one-off thing. I was on capricorn(??? the map with the bell) at mid and tried to use my wurm to teleport up to to the ledge cause I'd just gotten jumped. My character jolted forward an inch or so on my screen and then nothin.

 

That said, I've also found that anet just...hasn't done a very good job with the environment mapping whatsit, most often around nodes with slight steps - the mid node on Djinn map has some little dips/steps that can just ruin your teleports, and thinking back I was standing on/near the little divot thingy at the capricorn mid node as well.

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5 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

I don't understand why people don't get along with what the OP want. No wurm, no spectral walk... The challenge he set up is pretty simple and clear. What's the point of saying: "You absolutely need to have at least one of them, they are just that good!"

If you can't get away, just out sustain your foes. It's not like the necromancer don't have the tools: AoE blind from core and reaper's GS, AoE weakness, self prot/regen, sustain traits, barrier from Blood bank and life leeching.

This is 'm goal! 😄 I was hoping to lean into necro's sustain and was hoping that there were options of similar power to wurm and spectral walk, except in a way that allowed me to sustain in a fight instead of escaping. Obviously I know this isn't the case as there's a reason these utilities are used, but it's been a nice change of pace.

 

Update: Still hovering in plat 😄 Barely. It's been an interesting change in playstyle, and I've had to be MUCH more careful in positioning. It's boggling how much leeway for mistakes teleports were giving me. 

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46 minutes ago, Curennos.9307 said:

Update: Still hovering in plat 😄 Barely. It's been an interesting change in playstyle, and I've had to be MUCH more careful in positioning. It's boggling how much leeway for mistakes teleports were giving me. 

People that think it's easy mode to facetank abuse teleports on other profession and are all necro hater anyway.

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