Vindicator healing skill heals too little on self

[Zoid.2568]

The healing skill is AoE, so that sucks really hard, why not make the healing skill heal full potency? Except the might gain which should be for each enemy struck. This is crucial in pvp for example, where you often don't fight more than 1 or 2 enemies... and it's a channel abillity.

[Zoid.2568]

Does no one agree? 

[phokus.8934]

The heals are kind of jank but being able to use three heals is something to consider too.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

Bumping them up by 100 to 150 per pulse might not be bad.  I think the only way they could get away with that is because they're channeled, though, which does feel punishing in some scenarios since it effectively lets the enemy (both pve and wvw/pvp) freecast on you if you're unable to kite during the channels.

[otto.5684]

3 hours ago, Zoid.2568 said:

Does no one agree? 

PvE wise, no. Probably in PvP.

[Zoid.2568]

58 minutes ago, otto.5684 said:

PvE wise, no. Probably in PvP.

Yes in PvP is the issue.

[Shao.7236]

Disagree for any gamemode. The healing on Vindicator is fine and hardly needs to be tweaked.

To mention in compensation for all the keys to be pressed Balance in Discord exists.

Treesong at best can already heal for nearly 4k while removing 5 conditions and Urn the last threshold also heals for 3k while mitigating 50% of damage.

 

Don't you be saying that Urn kills you because you have low health requirements, it's just 398 hp per tick for essentially doubling your HP instantly with a potent 3k heal with Resistance, Protection and Regeneration at the end of it.

 

This is all with me using Berserker stats without Saint's Shield. Also dislike to see that "You get three heal skills" while it's all scattered around the legend in long casts that cost twice the amount of energy Revenant normally needs. Both heals combined roughly results in the equivalent of any other heal in the game over a larger duration with no additional sustain effects to them.

Edited April 27, 2022 by Shao.7236

[Jthug.9506]

The way that archimorus heal works is not at all good for pvp. I would think mallyx/Jalis/shiro are all better options in pvp.

[Zenith.7301]

22 hours ago, Shao.7236 said:

Disagree for any gamemode. The healing on Vindicator is fine and hardly needs to be tweaked.

To mention in compensation for all the keys to be pressed Balance in Discord exists.

Treesong at best can already heal for nearly 4k while removing 5 conditions and Urn the last threshold also heals for 3k while mitigating 50% of damage.

 

Don't you be saying that Urn kills you because you have low health requirements, it's just 398 hp per tick for essentially doubling your HP instantly with a potent 3k heal with Resistance, Protection and Regeneration at the end of it.

 

This is all with me using Berserker stats without Saint's Shield. Also dislike to see that "You get three heal skills" while it's all scattered around the legend in long casts that cost twice the amount of energy Revenant normally needs. Both heals combined roughly results in the equivalent of any other heal in the game over a larger duration with no additional sustain effects to them.

 

lol, this isn't even an option for DPS power vindicator, though. Swapping to Viktor is a significant DPS hit only to have access to an amount of healing comparable to other specs that don't pay this tax.

[Shao.7236]

16 minutes ago, Zenith.7301 said:

 

lol, this isn't even an option for DPS power vindicator, though. Swapping to Viktor is a significant DPS hit only to have access to an amount of healing comparable to other specs that don't pay this tax.

That's why you fill the gap with your weapons/evade, are you just ignoring the fact that Archemorous is a bigger damage dealer than Shiro? Viktor is no exception to being better at sustaining than Ventari, they are two extremes and yet here we have players asking for the best of both worlds with the focus of the elite being that you have to switch in between as the gameplay highlight.

[Zenith.7301]

1 hour ago, Shao.7236 said:

That's why you fill the gap with your weapons/evade, are you just ignoring the fact that Archemorous is a bigger damage dealer than Shiro? Viktor is no exception to being better at sustaining than Ventari, they are two extremes and yet here we have players asking for the best of both worlds with the focus of the elite being that you have to switch in between as the gameplay highlight.

 

You have no clue how power DPS vindicator is played. The legends used are legendary alliance+shiro, and the evade and weapons are being used regardless of what stance you're in.

 

Why do I even bother with some people...

[Shao.7236]

Just now, Zenith.7301 said:

 

You have no clue how power DPS vindicator is played. The legends used are legendary alliance+shiro, and the evade and weapons are being used regardless of what stance you're in.

 

Why do I even bother with some people...

Boy it is SO complicated to play Vindicator, I should probably stop playing it and go back to Core even though being in Plat like always says otherwise. It's not like as Revenant you always have down time for using weapons exclusively to make up for the fact that you need to swap legends for utility afterwards.

 

Unless you're talking about PvE which in this case not only do I not care but it can't be more complicated than Renegade given how you don't have to even rely over the other half the mechanics of Alliances to deal damage, just buffing after buffing along every other skills. It is in no way viable to ever step away from Archemorous unless there is no damage to be done, that is just the most obvious fact there could be.

[Virdo.1540]

Blue vindis healing is good since it shares its healing with allies. 

Red vindis healing is on paper good, but in reality its bugged and doesnt get counted properly with "amounts of enemies hit" (in heal-scaling)

[QuinQuin.9136]

Honestly, just remove the channel on the deactivation on Drop Urn of Saint Viktor in both PvE and PvP, or shorten it like how it functions underwater. That fixes the issue entirely.

Edited April 29, 2022 by QuinQuin.9136

[Thon.3780]

Same heal problem with me .

but. As I check carefully. It seem the skill need me to change habit

coz I normally use heal skill when health less than half . And heal skill normally has long cd.

but vindy need me to use with health less than 3/4. 
cd time is 10sec , so it can use 2 time at 3/4 and 1/4. health 
 

only major problem is I can’t focus on pvp. ( my fingers like squid lock together.

😞

 

[Aeolus.3615]

On 4/26/2022 at 7:18 PM, Zoid.2568 said:

The healing skill is AoE, so that sucks really hard, why not make the healing skill heal full potency? Except the might gain which should be for each enemy struck. This is crucial in pvp for example, where you often don't fight more than 1 or 2 enemies... and it's a channel abillity.

 

I assume cause it is ment to  scale with players that uses heal power stats, and the better heal for  DPS comes from Arch not Victor also  being a 3 legend swap, Jalis has  an amazing heal that also removes 5 condis, the more heals class has the less potent they become unless u invest stats for it, this is called trade off.

One to fully use well Arch and Vic needs to be on something like zealots or celestial stats at least in pve works well if one wants to do bit of both, but this means that wont be able to push limits of one or another, reason many say Arch being heavy on power crit/crit severity stats and Victor being heavy on support stats dont help much and kinda borks up the builds and  theres a bit of conflit in it.

IMO both Arch and victor should be self only stuff, being also Victor  dps based but with defensive acts like damage reducer, longer leap, counter, block, more for self sustain/defensive combat and not support atempt that kidna conflicts with Arch legend.

Elite Victor urn skill should be a damage reducer with dps  increase over health or urn drop :)

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Urn_of_Saint_Viktor_(skill)

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Shield_of_Saint_Viktor

Edited May 4, 2022 by Aeolus.3615

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

On 4/26/2022 at 2:18 PM, Zoid.2568 said:

The healing skill is AoE, so that sucks really hard, why not make the healing skill heal full potency? Except the might gain which should be for each enemy struck. This is crucial in pvp for example, where you often don't fight more than 1 or 2 enemies... and it's a channel abillity.

Vindicator is the most overpowered bunker in the game right now. Their sustain is better than even mech or BS. You can literally outheal 1v2 and never go below 100% hp in a lot of 1v1s. There is no way vindicator sustain should be buffed.

[Za Shaloc.3908]

Vindi heals are very oddly designed, which makes it both underperforming and overperforming depending on the scenario. On one hand it can feel really bad to have your heals get constantly interrupted or have no time to channel. On the other hand, if you have the ability to kite, it has really crazy sustain (though this is also due to Tree Song). 

 

Vindi heals function so much more differently than the rest of the class (Ventari being an exception too) and IMO it makes it hard to balance. To be honest, I think they should normalize the heal: make it 5 energy, 30 second cooldown, and a cast time between 0.75s and 1.25s. Make it a shared cooldown between both legends, not separate. Bring up the numbers and adjust the secondary effects accordingly. Buff urn as a support skill to make up for the loss of constant group healing via Viktor heal.

[QuinQuin.9136]

6 hours ago, Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

Vindicator is the most overpowered bunker in the game right now. Their sustain is better than even mech or BS. You can literally outheal 1v2 and never go below 100% hp in a lot of 1v1s. There is no way vindicator sustain should be buffed.

I want to see this specifically. Cite the source.

[soul.9651]

10 hours ago, Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

Vindicator is the most overpowered bunker in the game right now. Their sustain is better than even mech or BS. You can literally outheal 1v2 and never go below 100% hp in a lot of 1v1s. There is no way vindicator sustain should be buffed.

Pvp  is not the same as pve.. 

[Tulkas.2576]

9 hours ago, QuinQuin.9136 said:

I want to see this specifically. Cite the source.

Bro it’s simple. 
If you 1v1 a lot of core support guards you will probably never go below 100% hp in a lot of 1v1s

[youle.5824]

Big disagree, Vindicator heal skills are freaky strong and I main it...

[Aeolus.3615]

On 5/6/2022 at 9:09 PM, Tulkas.2576 said:

Bro it’s simple. 
If you 1v1 a lot of core support guards you will probably never go below 100% hp in a lot of 1v1s

 

minstrell vs minstrell situation :D

[youle.5824]

Seems some people didn't understand why I would say Vindi heals are broken so let me give some examples. On a support build in pvp you can get up to 9-10 k aoe healing with the blue alliance healing skill only, on a 10 sec cd. That's using flock rune and the Regen trait but still pretty much highest heal to cd ratio ever implemented in pvp. On offensive builds, you still have the super low cd of 10sec on both vindi heals and if using back to back it's a self.healing of 9k on 10 sec cd. Yeah it can be interupted ofc but even with long cast time this is still op by any healing standard. 

[Catchyfx.5768]

11 hours ago, youle.5824 said:

Seems some people didn't understand why I would say Vindi heals are broken so let me give some examples. On a support build in pvp you can get up to 9-10 k aoe healing with the blue alliance healing skill only, on a 10 sec cd. That's using flock rune and the Regen trait but still pretty much highest heal to cd ratio ever implemented in pvp. On offensive builds, you still have the super low cd of 10sec on both vindi heals and if using back to back it's a self.healing of 9k on 10 sec cd. Yeah it can be interupted ofc but even with long cast time this is still op by any healing standard. 

I dont thnik alliances heals have this good scaling. Gotta check that. But For Berserker/Marauder its not that good, both combined are worst then Bladesworn heal.

EDIT: full minstrel and rune of Flock can make this big heal. So if you are dedicated healer your life is good. If you are DPS, its little bit different.

Edited May 10, 2022 by Catchyfx.5768
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