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Say goodbye to my last warrior


SoulGuardian.6203

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So I've had it with this useless class.

I've done Dry top runs with every single one of my characters, including elite specs, and this is the only single one that died in dry top while fighting a champion... three times.

 

So it wasn't just a fluke.

It is in fact that this class is complete and utter useless. 

 

There ANet; 

I hope that you're happy.

This is what you want... for some strange reason... you win.

I'm about to delete my only warrior.

 

I don't even care anymore that I don't have my 10 original line up from GW1.

I have literally come to detest this class.

 

Why am I posting this here?

So maybe, if by any chance you read this, you realise how bad the class is, and for those who are warrior mains get some well deserved attention.

So it's for them, not for me... because honestly I no longer give a squat about this class.

I am actually very annoyed over a videogame. 

 

Warrior mains... good luck to you all in the future. 

I'm done with this.

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Weird. I don't have any such issue with my Warrior, and his damage is also extremely high.

I do agree, though, that Warrior could use some tweaks. I hate how often my best attacks get interrupted due to an insane amount of pushes and pulls in certain content (e.g., when fighting Jade Brotherhood groups in Echovald Wilds). Some self-support in terms of Stability, for instance, would be nice.

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It's true that warrior is more dependent on the player skill to achieve similar results than some other classes. 

What isn't true is that Warrior is useless because someone can't solo a specific Champ with it.

Edited by Obtena.7952
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14 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Would you like another reason it's useless instead because boy howdy

 

You can list other reasons you if want; I'm not saying they don't exist and that wouldn't impact what I said either. 

What I know is that someone's inability to solo a Champ isn't one of them. I'm all for people making valid criticism about where Warrior lacks performance, but this isn't. 

Edited by Obtena.7952
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You're having trouble with Warrior in the OPEN WORLD? I'm sorry but this class has heals coming out of its ears and it's second only to Necro in survivability. Two traits that heal on Might application, healing shouts (you could have an entire utility bar filled with healing skills), heal on burst, passive stance that prevents damage for a time... I could go on.

 

I can absolutely see how Warrior would be bad in competitive modes but the open world? Really?

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45 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

Weird. I don't have any such issue with my Warrior, and his damage is also extremely high.

I do agree, though, that Warrior could use some tweaks. I hate how often my best attacks get interrupted due to an insane amount of pushes and pulls in certain content (e.g., when fighting Jade Brotherhood groups in Echovald Wilds). Some self-support in terms of Stability, for instance, would be nice.

Almost everything Bladesworn does will trigger getting Stab via traits like [Brave Stride] and [Dragonscale Defense]. Brave Stride's proc rate especially is totally ridiculous since both Pistol 4 and 5 will proc it. 

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Sure, it has tons of heals; but very tiny tiny ones; Not enough to sustain massive damage inflicted from champions.

 

I'm not going to use every single utility skill as a healing skill. 

Need to cause damage too, need to interrupt some.

I'm using GS and bow.

GS with Torment and Remove a boon.

Bow with vulnerability and bleeding.

(Recommendations? )

Insert bellow:

 

GS is alright, but have to CQC.

One hit from champ devour does average 50% to 90% damage.

I'm running runes of divinity, so balance isn't an issue.

When I need to get away, 2 dodges just about keep distance.

Switch to bow.

Slow, and doesn't seem to cause much damage.

CD, burning for a short period.

Cripple helps a little bit.

Bleeding doesn't seem to do much of anything. Neither does blinding by [smoldering arrow]

 

I think bow either should be slightly faster or cause more damage.

 

Flags are just meh.

 

Utility Skills:

[Signet of might]

[Kick] For when enemies approach while using bow.

[Frenzy] Self explanatory. 

[Signet of Rage]

 

Thoughts?

Edited by SoulGuardian.6203
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3 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Sure, it has tons of heals; but very tiny ones; Not enough to sustain massive damage inflicted from champions.

 

I'm not going to use every single utility skill as a healing skill. 

Need to cause damage too, need to interrupt some.

I'm using GS and bow.

GS with torment and remove a boon.

Bow with vulnerability and bleeding.

(Recommendations? )

Insert bellow:

What in Balthazar's holy name convinced you that combo was a good idea?

3 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

GS is alright, but have to CQC.

One hit from champ devour does average 50% to 90% damage.

I'm running runes of divinity, so balance isn't an issue.

When I need to get away, 2 dodges just about keep distance.

Switch to bow.

Slow, and doesn't seem to cause much damage.

CD, burning for a short period.

Cripple helps a little bit.

Bleeding doesn't seem to di much of anything. Neither does blinding by smoldering arrow.

Blind and Cripple don't do a whole lot versus a champion... Bleed doesn't hurt much unless you are running full condi, and since you are using a GS it means you are not running full condi.

3 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

I think bow either should be slightly faster or cause more damage.

No, you need to be running Condi stats with it. Core burst needs to pulse every second rather than every 3s though...

3 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Flags are just meh.

 

Utility Skills:

Signet of might.

Kick. For when enemies approach while using bow.

Frenzy. Self explanatory. 

Signet of Rage.

 

Thoughts?

Condi OW Berserker: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PKwAw+NlFwmYOsFmJWaX9NVA-zRIYc09XKBmApGC5GBFXAOMNm4ZD-e

For Core, swap Berserker for Defense Mid/Mid/Mid. Take Bull's Charge instead of WB and Rampage instead of Headbutt, SiO instead of Outrage. Sword OH or Warhorn instead of torch.

Power OW Spellbreaker: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PKwAEh7lJwSYjsLWJOWT9PdA-zRJYiR9fhEWEEYJ0aCo/0IgXLA-e

Get an Ogre Pet whistle. You now have 2 pet allies to pump healing via PS+MM+MMR. Good luck dying. Seriously I run that through Legendary Bounty groups sans pets. My red bubble barely goes below 80% the whole fight.

For Core run Discipline Mid/Bot/Bot and bring an axe instead of the dagger.

BSW... Shout heal through everything. Bring Bull's Charge, Unyielding Dragon, and a CC MH/OH or Hammer for your non Jokesaber weapon.

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Warrior is more heavily reliant on active defense over passive defense. 

44 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Sure, it has tons of heals; but very tiny tiny ones; Not enough to sustain massive damage inflicted from champions.

 

I'm not going to use every single utility skill as a healing skill. 

Need to cause damage too, need to interrupt some.

I'm using GS and bow.

GS with Torment and Remove a boon.

Bow with vulnerability and bleeding.

(Recommendations? )

Insert bellow:

 

GS is alright, but have to CQC.

One hit from champ devour does average 50% to 90% damage.

I'm running runes of divinity, so balance isn't an issue.

When I need to get away, 2 dodges just about keep distance.

Switch to bow.

Slow, and doesn't seem to cause much damage.

CD, burning for a short period.

Cripple helps a little bit.

Bleeding doesn't seem to do much of anything. Neither does blinding by [smoldering arrow]

 

I think bow either should be slightly faster or cause more damage.

 

Flags are just meh.

 

Utility Skills:

[Signet of might]

[Kick] For when enemies approach while using bow.

[Frenzy] Self explanatory. 

[Signet of Rage]

 

Thoughts?

No, this explains why you're having trouble actually. 

There are a couple of options in PvE that will help you mitigate some hits. War requires more active than passive fighting (as in, you cannot build to ignore damage couldnt build to ignore damage before bladesworn.), but GS/bow isnt it, especially if you're just learning. I've only seen Althume play that set to any real effect, and he has a bunch of underlying warrior experience and tailored his build to make it work. 

In addition to that, there are sigils that can give you extra windows to avoid big hits, like Sigil of Energy.

It's definitely more difficult, but you can still do it.

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

You can list other reasons you if want; I'm not saying they don't exist and that wouldn't impact what I said either. 

What I know is that someone's inability to solo a Champ isn't one of them. I'm all for people making valid criticism about where Warrior lacks performance, but this isn't. 

Fine, fine~ *grumbles* 

Edited by Azure The Heartless.3261
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3 hours ago, Jzaku.9765 said:

Almost everything Bladesworn does will trigger getting Stab via traits like [Brave Stride] and [Dragonscale Defense].

Did I mention I dislike Bladesworn?

P.S. Also, did you fight the bigger Jade Brotherhood groups in Echovald Forest, like in the junkyard area? That's a knockback or pull every few seconds. You cannot compansate that with movement skills.

Edited by Ashantara.8731
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9 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

You can list other reasons you if want; I'm not saying they don't exist and that wouldn't impact what I said either. 

What I know is that someone's inability to solo a Champ isn't one of them. I'm all for people making valid criticism about where Warrior lacks performance, but this isn't. 

While you are right, just let us our spergouts. 

Complaining about Warrior is all we have left. 

 

No literally. I don't even play PvE anymore. 

All I do is a bit of Wvw at the weekend. 

Warrior is so beaten, GW2 is simply not fun anymore. 

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50 minutes ago, Bojjang.1052 said:

*The Warrior Forums*

Warrior is crap, bannersalve boring, other classes can do what warrior things do better

*Someone posts about warrior being harder in open world than other classes*

WHAT BUILD U RUNNING, WARRIOR IS NOT BAD, U DIE IN OPEN WORLD LUL

Warrior is not bad in open world; nothing is.

Warrior works in instanced content but is boring (put banner every min - the reason you are brought, as a 1 of). After the banner rework we will see, its not unlikely qcfb will outright replace war (unless fb gets nerfed).

Warrior in competitive is bad, got bladesworn. Which is expected to get the nerf hammer, and is a glorified core build anyway. And even without nerfs its basically spb with somewhat different tools (and insane sustain). You still sit on a node in spvp, no new role. In wvw you can roam, but that was the case already. Small scale is condi, so no room there. Mid and large scale nothing new, and spb got deleted with winds nerf (so no war there either).

You can ofc play war everywhere its just not meta aside from instanced pve, for now. Which is why war players have complained for a while.

That covers your confusion?

Edited by Hotride.2187
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2 hours ago, Bojjang.1052 said:

*The Warrior Forums*

Warrior is crap, bannersalve boring, other classes can do what warrior things do better

Warrior is crap in competitive. Bannerslave is boring. Other classes can indeed do what warrior does but better. This can all be true while it also being true that in OWPvE that a semi competently built warrior should have no survivability problems. Warrior should the the guy left alive after everyone missed dodging the BBEG attack. I know, because I have to drop battle standard on way too many people way too frequently in OW Metas and Strikes.

2 hours ago, Bojjang.1052 said:

*Someone posts about warrior being harder in open world than other classes*

WHAT BUILD U RUNNING, WARRIOR IS NOT BAD, U DIE IN OPEN WORLD LUL

Because running GS+Bow, a power and a primarily condi weapon, and then complaining about lack of damage is a pretty good indicator that something isn't right in their build. Especially when they are using Kick to push mobs away when LB does better damage at melee range.

What makes warrior survive so well in PvE is the fact that Mobs don't typically kite or dodge, so you can build might on them easily and thus get lots of small healing packets, and more importantly, lots of energy for dodging. The highly telegraphed attacks it has aren't an issue since mobs won't react to them.

@SoulGuardian.6203, with that LB GS setup you should drop your F1 on the mob, use Pin Down, Arcing Arrow in melee range, Fan of Fire in Melee range. Weave Smoldering Arrows in between. If you are going to do GS+LB, then go full Berserker.. Arcing Arrow and Fan of Fire do pretty good strike damage. Arcing Arrow into the F1 fire field is 5 might. If you have Strength slotted and at least MMR, then that is 15 endurance from building momentum from the F1 and another 10 endurance from MMR, half a dodge. If you were taking LB simply for a ranged weapon, then Rifle and a Marauder gear setup might work better. Still. I posted a few builds for you earlier in the thread to try that should work better than what it looks like you were running.

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People,

3 hours ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Warrior is not bad in open world; nothing is.

Warrior works in instanced content but is boring (put banner every min - the reason you are brought, as a 1 of). After the banner rework we will see, its not unlikely qcfb will outright replace war (unless fb gets nerfed).

Warrior in competitive is bad, got bladesworn. Which is expected to get the nerf hammer, and is a glorified core build anyway. And even without nerfs its basically spb with somewhat different tools (and insane sustain). You still sit on a node in spvp, no new role. In wvw you can roam, but that was the case already. Small scale is condi, so no room there. Mid and large scale nothing new, and spb got deleted with winds nerf (so no war there either).

You can ofc play war everywhere its just not meta aside from instanced pve, for now. Which is why war players have complained for a while.

That covers your confusion?

 

I was never confused. Just an observation.

 

1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Warrior is crap in competitive. Bannerslave is boring. Other classes can indeed do what warrior does but better. This can all be true while it also being true that in OWPvE that a semi competently built warrior should have no survivability problems. Warrior should the the guy left alive after everyone missed dodging the BBEG attack. I know, because I have to drop battle standard on way too many people way too frequently in OW Metas and Strikes.

Because running GS+Bow, a power and a primarily condi weapon, and then complaining about lack of damage is a pretty good indicator that something isn't right in their build. Especially when they are using Kick to push mobs away when LB does better damage at melee range.

What makes warrior survive so well in PvE is the fact that Mobs don't typically kite or dodge, so you can build might on them easily and thus get lots of small healing packets, and more importantly, lots of energy for dodging. The highly telegraphed attacks it has aren't an issue since mobs won't react to them.

@SoulGuardian.6203, with that LB GS setup you should drop your F1 on the mob, use Pin Down, Arcing Arrow in melee range, Fan of Fire in Melee range. Weave Smoldering Arrows in between. If you are going to do GS+LB, then go full Berserker.. Arcing Arrow and Fan of Fire do pretty good strike damage. Arcing Arrow into the F1 fire field is 5 might. If you have Strength slotted and at least MMR, then that is 15 endurance from building momentum from the F1 and another 10 endurance from MMR, half a dodge. If you were taking LB simply for a ranged weapon, then Rifle and a Marauder gear setup might work better. Still. I posted a few builds for you earlier in the thread to try that should work better than what it looks like you were running.

 

I am having a much easier time in open world with guardian than with warrior. I understand OP. Why do I die at this champion but when I play DH and put down a few traps it's ez game. This is coming from somebody who disliked paladin classes but once I did the switch last year, well yeah.... why make it harder if I can clear content easier in every single game mode and have diversity.

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28 minutes ago, Bojjang.1052 said:

People,

 

I was never confused. Just an observation.

 

 

I am having a much easier time in open world with guardian than with warrior. I understand OP. Why do I die at this champion but when I play DH and put down a few traps it's ez game. This is coming from somebody who disliked paladin classes but once I did the switch last year, well yeah.... why make it harder if I can clear content easier in every single game mode and have diversity.

Well, to your last point, there are people who find thief easy to solo certain mobs with, but if I tried that I'd be taking a dirt nap with my thief. We each have playstyle preferences that certain classes/specs just so happen to line up with perfectly. Your experience with DH vs warrior can be very different than somebody else's experience.

That said, DH does have lots of blocks available to hit that allow it to keep actively doing damage where as warrior's blocks stop it from doing damage.

If things like Whirling Axe had evade frames, if Blooming Fire had the UW evade frames on land, if Cyclone Trigger had a full block instead of projectile block, if Flurry were a full block (think riposting every attack), and so on, then yeah you would feel like warrior was on par.

There are a number of classes than can stack active defenses that allow them to continue attacking. In fact I think Warrior may be the class with the FEWEST such skills.

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1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

There are a number of classes than can stack active defenses that allow them to continue attacking. In fact I think Warrior may be the class with the FEWEST such skills.

Ding ding ding. And this is what is really holding warrior back in competitive. Other classes can vomit damage whilst mitigating. 

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11 hours ago, gmmg.9210 said:

Thank you for posting your story and sharing your frustration. We've all had it with this class and have asked for years and got nothing. We commend you sir.

 

Another reminder that anet must address this class.

I think in this particular case this kind of response does more harm than good. What we have here is an instance of someone being frustrated with their warrior gameplay, while they also run a build that is at least a bit of a mess. Imagine someone who isn't playing a lot of warrior coming across this topic, finding a selection of posts which argue for warrior buffs because someone felt weak while playing a warrior character with a weak build. They would have good cause to believe that we have a few screws loose, since you can put together a nonsensical build on any profession, no matter how overpowered it is in general and then have a bad time in typically easy PvE content. This distracts from the actual problem with warrior balance: The kit that is provided to the warrior profession is covering fewer niches than the average for a profession. In addition, in the build spaces in which warrior can compete with other professions it is generally less efficient than alternative options. In any given situation you can replace a warrior build with a build from another profession and benefit from doing so (except for WoD [now nerfed] and Banners [subject to change]). That is the reason why warrior specializations, skills and weapons need improvements. The fact that it is possible to put together a warrior build which performs poorly isn't an indication that the profession as a whole is bad.

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3 hours ago, ProverbsofHell.2307 said:

Ding ding ding. And this is what is really holding warrior back in competitive. Other classes can vomit damage whilst mitigating. 

Exactly. Evades, blocks, reflects, full invulns/distortion, stealths. Not counting traits, just weapon skills, profession mechanics, and utilities.

Evades. Land only.
Rev: 6. 7 if you include Vindi dodge.
Guard: 2
Engi: 1
Ranger: 10
Necro: 1
Thief: 9, 10 if you include daredevil dodge.
Ele: 12
Mesmer: 4, 5 if you count Mirage dodge.
Warrior: 5

Blocks/Aegis:

Rev: 2
Guard: 13
Engi: 5
Ranger: 3
Necro: 1
Thief: 5
Ele: 2
Mesmer: 8
Warrior: 6

Reflects/projectile block/projectile destruction:
Rev: 3
Guard: 8
Engi: 8
Ranger: 4
Necro: 2
Thief: 5
Ele: 9
Mesmer: 4
Warrior: 5

Distortion (obviously Mesmer only)
7

Shroud based Mechanic:
Necro: 2
Thief: 1

Full Invuln:
Guard: 1
Engi: 1
Ele: 3

I am not counting Psuedo Invulns like EP or Signet of Stone as condi still works on them.

Blind:
Rev: 2
Guard: 6
Engi: 9
Ranger: 8
Necro: 9
Thief: 14
Ele: 12
Mesmer: 7
Warrior: 2

Stealth, not counting blasting smoke fields or traits:
Engi: 2
Thief: 17
Ranger: 1
Mesmer: 5 ("Hide-In-Shadows")


Totals:
Rev: 14 <- Rev is able to stack high amounts of total damage reduction via traits for high/perma durations.
Guard: 30 <- Blue child that is favored by Anet.
Engi: 26 <- Not including Flashbang FYI. Not including the barrier spam either.
Ranger: 24 <- can also perma immob you and stand where you cant hit back.
Necro: 15, but two of those are shrouds which are the single best defense in the game that allow you to do offense at the same time making this misleading. Also can barrier spam and just not take damage.
Thief: 50, one of which is a shroud. See above comment. 
Ele: 38. Can also barrier spam and just not take damage.
Mesmer: 36
Warrior: 18 <- Does not have a mode that completely covers HP while going on full offense. Cannot stack high durations of high damage reduction. Does get some barrier. Had high resustain until Feb2020, that got nerfed. Now BSW is the only spec than has High resustain and barely can reach the adult table.

The three lowest are Rev, Necro and Warrior. As I note above Rev can build very high damage reduction for long periods of time. Shroud lets necro face tank damage while their HP bar is protected as well as getting large barrier access. Both of those are more powerful than warrior's 4 channeled blocks/evade that deny them the ability to attack during the duration.

Edited by Lan Deathrider.5910
typos
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