Why GW2 classes are top tier

[Mell.4873]

Looking over the recent nerfs and many of the previous elites that have had massive changes or standardization (like boons), I noticed a trend.

Arena Net are not afraid to alienate their player base to prevent power creep. I mean its not perfect since most core classes are not as powerful as the elites but ultimately my point holds true.

This goes on to my next point which is how do other MMOs deal with power creep.
Most MMOs  buff other classes or simply mechanics which sounds great since your particular play style is never nerfed but it does create issue around content difficulty. You can see a lot of this with MMO's like Warframe where every new frame has a new way to break the game and rather than trying to balance them they just buff everyone else or make the combat simpler.
ESO is another culprit where they straight up remove mechanics from a class rather than trying to balance them, making every class play the same.

The primary reason I play GW2 is the class diversity and the constant balance along with it. No class plays the same and at the same time no class is to OP.

[Bunny.9834]

3 hours ago, Mell.4873 said:

The primary reason I play GW2 is the class diversity and the constant balance along with it. No class plays the same and at the same time no class is to OP.

Overnerfing with no trades does the exact same thing as constant powercreep. It also reduces build diversity. 

 

 

[DanAlcedo.3281]

For PvP/Wvw player's, Balance Patches should be something exciting and not something to be terrified off. 

Every Balance patch is just nerfs, nerfs and more nerfs. 

It boring. Especially when the outcome usually is dead builds. 

 

[Hotride.2187]

For as long as I have been playing guard, it has dominated 5 player party support. In every game mode. I like playing support, I like competitive and I like 5 player content. What diversity do I have to pick from? Guard and sometimes engi.

But lol the game is balanced and power creep is not a thing. Thats also why no old content gets breezed through with current meta builds.

OK.

Edited May 12, 2022 by Hotride.2187

[The Boz.2038]

We may have balance discrepancies between the professions and elite specs, but the balance here is the tightest I've seen in pretty much any MMO-like RPG-oid game. The game as the most build diversity of anyting on the market, and the tightest balance to boot. Comparing just the top 10 DPS classes of GW2 and WoW tells you all you need to know: 10th spot DPS class in WoW is ~70% of the 1st spot; in GW the 10th is ~95%. 

Edited May 12, 2022 by The Boz.2038

[Gorem.8104]

My personal opinion? every balance they have done since EoD launch, including the launch patch, has been bad and the wrong direction for the game. Why was Spellbreakers nerfed? WvW right now is large melee boon blobs, so they nerfed an ability that helps against the meta. Then they nerf ranged - which is already weak in wvw fights. 
They nerfed sustainability, they nerfed this, and nerfed that. 
They are working towards making the game as boring as possible. By making classes feel the "same" as they put it "bring the player not the class". 
EoD E-specs needed a year of work. They were hardly changed at all and all feedback for every single one of them was ignored from the beta tests. Mechanist mech's have been nerfed multiple times now when it comes to pvp, that means from launch they were unbalanced, and yet now after having their dps stripped and making the classes only viability being bunker, they nerfed bunker. 
Elem's, the downstate class that could at least bring something ranged to wvw, was nerfed for no reason other then to make wvw worse for everyone. Participation in wvw has been nerfed and never fixed after they removed gains from using siege entirely. 

They really need an entirely new balance design team. 

[Xelqypla.6817]

I think people are missing the forest for the trees.

You may not like the balance changes, but the classes are definitely diverse. A mechanist may revolve around a pet, but it's never going to feel like Ranger. A Specter may use shroud, but it's definitely not a Necromancer. Warrior may have gotten an Elite spec of some sort, but it's never going to be loved by Anet. Things like that.

[Dadnir.5038]

1 hour ago, Xelqypla.6817 said:

Warrior may have gotten an Elite spec of some sort, but it's never going to be loved by Anet.

🤣

Edited May 12, 2022 by Dadnir.5038

[Stx.4857]

I disagree.  They over nerf traits basically making them not an option at all to take, removing build diversity.

 

Also, how long has support Firebrand been meta in group pve?  And still is.  

 

Class balance in this game is actually kind of horrendous assuming you want to play a certain elite spec or even if you just want to play condition vs power of any given spec.

[KeoLegend.5132]

GW2 is the most balanced MMO out of the BIG 10

[Gorem.8104]

1 hour ago, KeoLegend.5132 said:

GW2 is the most balanced MMO out of the BIG 10

Is it? Wow that other 9 must have insanely bad balance! Surprised they even exist! 

[Hashberry.4510]

The combat system is perhaps something to which balance may apply. Not so much in the hands of a wide range of player capability.

 

The games best feature as well as somewhat of a curse, this system places us at wildly different levels, which is really deep and involving but maybe not so good for playing together.

[Mell.4873]

20 hours ago, DragonSlayer.1087 said:

Overnerfing with no trades does the exact same thing as constant powercreep. It also reduces build diversity. 

 

 

It is a hard thing to get balance. I for one atleast enjoy the current difficulty and build diversity. 

The more build diversity you have the harder it is to balance and it trivialises content so we can't really win.

For example in Eso I had a Nightblade build that could self heal based off damage. Rather than allowing this build to continue the devs removed the passive healing and replaced it with a static heal. I feel like this example never really happens in Gw2. They never straight up remove something rather lower its performance. (maybe torment runes but it is not a class)

[Mell.4873]

19 hours ago, DanAlcedo.3281 said:

For PvP/Wvw player's, Balance Patches should be something exciting and not something to be terrified off. 

Every Balance patch is just nerfs, nerfs and more nerfs. 

It boring. Especially when the outcome usually is dead builds. 

 

That why I think it's good that Arena Net is willing to do it. I mean it's not fair if your favourite class with an OP build gets nerfed but every class is on an equal playing field.

Spellbreaker comes to mind which now is similar to other boon rip classes. 

[Mell.4873]

18 hours ago, Hotride.2187 said:

For as long as I have been playing guard, it has dominated 5 player party support. In every game mode. I like playing support, I like competitive and I like 5 player content. What diversity do I have to pick from? Guard and sometimes engi.

But lol the game is balanced and power creep is not a thing. Thats also why no old content gets breezed through with current meta builds.

OK.

Proves my point even more. How amazing is it that you can still find old content challenging, I mean games like destiny 2 have a really problem with power creep. 

Edited May 12, 2022 by Mell.4873

[Syvaris Laskaris.5247]

1 hour ago, Mell.4873 said:

That why I think it's good that Arena Net is willing to do it. I mean it's not fair if your favourite class with an OP build gets nerfed but every class is on an equal playing field.

Spellbreaker comes to mind which now is similar to other boon rip classes. 

Warrior is literally not played now outside of bannerslave in pve and the few people who still play warrior hate their new eSpec.

[KeoLegend.5132]

2 hours ago, Gorem.8104 said:

Is it? Wow that other 9 must have insanely bad balance! Surprised they even exist! 

some are, some aren't that much.

But you are just complaining with a full stomach.

I've come from ESO, FF and WoW and the balance is much much much worse there. 

[Syvaris Laskaris.5247]

17 minutes ago, KeoLegend.5132 said:

some are, some aren't that much.

But you are just complaining with a full stomach.

I've come from ESO, FF and WoW and the balance is much much much worse there. 

Warrior hasn't been in a spvp tourny for 8~ months, not Core Warrior, WARRIOR.

Edited May 13, 2022 by TheSeraphim.7413

[KeoLegend.5132]

26 minutes ago, TheSeraphim.7413 said:

Warrior hasn't been in a spvp tourny for 8~ months, not Core Warrior, WARRIOR.

you are lying.

Have a good night,

 

[Syvaris Laskaris.5247]

4 minutes ago, KeoLegend.5132 said:

you are lying.

Have a good night,

 

Class frequencies in the 20 games Teapot spectated:
Guardian: 51
Necromancer: 31
Thief: 27
Revenant: 24
Engineer: 22
Ranger: 18
Elementalist: 15
Mesmer: 12
Warrior: 0

 

And by expac:
EoD: 120
Core: 40
HoT: 25
PoF: 15

 

 

Balance looking pretty good. /s

Edited May 13, 2022 by TheSeraphim.7413

[KeoLegend.5132]

6 minutes ago, TheSeraphim.7413 said:

 

 

im sorry where does it shows the past 8 months spvp tourny entries? 

[Syvaris Laskaris.5247]

3 minutes ago, KeoLegend.5132 said:

im sorry where does it shows the past 8 months spvp tourny entries? 

Try reading the thread.

[KeoLegend.5132]

20 minutes ago, TheSeraphim.7413 said:

Try reading the thread.

nope, you want to prove your point, you point me at the exact part.

So far it shows that War hasn't appeared in the last 20 matches he watched. Where does it says over 8 months?

Edited May 13, 2022 by KeoLegend.5132

[CalmTheStorm.2364]

24 minutes ago, KeoLegend.5132 said:

nope, you want to prove your point, you point me at the exact part.

So far it shows that War hasn't appeared in the last 20 matches he watched. Where does it says over 8 months?

You are welcome to go back and watch Teapot's coverage of the MATs from the past 6-8 months (or longer of you wish). I've made numerous threads over the past 6 months or so in the Warrior sub forums.

 

For what it's worth, I recall warrior (strength spell breaker, specifically) being present in 2 matches in high level play (quarterfinals and on) in the 4-6 months leading up to EOD. 

 

 

[Mell.4873]

1 hour ago, KeoLegend.5132 said:

some are, some aren't that much.

But you are just complaining with a full stomach.

I've come from ESO, FF and WoW and the balance is much much much worse there. 

Yeah dude same story for me but rather than those it was ESO, Warframe, Skyforge.