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Theories why willbender and harbinger didn't get corrected


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btw anet, I thought most of your streamers are decent human beings. I've been generous to a certain ones and all I did was inadvertently dial on discord and I was immediately called a drunk, right in front of my daughter. 

 

Be careful who you allow to represent your brand. I'm still irked by that incident because the insult and defamation was uncalled for. 

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Posted (edited)

Realistically its because they need to go through the software dev process of identifying issues, planning changes, designing them, then developing them, followed by internal QA and then release.

The entire process probably takes like 1-2 months depending on how big the patch is, so they will alway an be slow regarding game balance because it takes said 1-2 months to release a fix for any balance issues identified now.

They *could* by pass this by doing a hotfix or something, but I doubt they would do this  unless it was gamebreaking or something, and lets be real, anything  PvP is not considered gamebreaking by anet.

 

Edited by Reikou.7068
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Been playing sPvP for like one hour and half today. There is no way they see Vindicator overperforming with the Alliance legend and don't see Willbender and Harbinger being present in every single match without exception, sometimes even repeated in the same team. There is simply no way. Even if they are planning some deep changes that may require more time and resources, like the post above suggest, they could simply reduce Willbender numbers or reduce the number of conditions that Harbinger applies. These could be simple and bad changes, but they would help to tone down those disgrace of specs.

Instead, both Harb and WB are not mentioned once on this patch. So while I tend to understand that Anet isn't "an evil company that loves to make their players suffer" like many people here, I'm guessing they want them to be overpowered at least until the june patch, don't know why, maybe because they expect to scratch more EoD sales, or they simply love seeing their two golden babies shine in PvP.

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2 hours ago, Pimsley.3681 said:

Are they waiting for June patch?

June patch is mainly focus on PVE balance (wich lead into some indirect side effect on pvp).

 

PVP balance patch are mostly number tweak on skill/trait. So maybe they don't touch Habinger and Willbender because the PVE balance team already work on some change.

Or maybe the last patch was already set up before the last MAT when Willbender and Harbinger emerge on the top

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Because they collect data before implementing changes and also have a goal of a faster paced meta. Harb and will align with the meta they want even if they deserve nerfs.

Based on what ive seen lately they want smaller, quicker fights and more movement around the map. Personally, I disagree since this just creates snowballs. I would be more okay with a meta like this if bleeding out and a 15s timer werent so punishing. If you made the timer 10s or offered a 5th down skill that auto kills you with a 10s cd it would give more opportunity to reset and try to push as a team.

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3 hours ago, Pimsley.3681 said:

btw anet, I thought most of your streamers are decent human beings. I've been generous to a certain ones and all I did was inadvertently dial on discord and I was immediately called a drunk, right in front of my daughter. 

 

Be careful who you allow to represent your brand. I'm still irked by that incident because the insult and defamation was uncalled for. 

They can be toxic. Naru raged quit on stream with being down 20 points and my buddies both reported him for match manipulation and verbal abuse. 

 

Imagine getting mad at a dead scene in a game. Peeps need a life lol 

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most peeps at the top win trade, cheat and rmt in this game, there is 0 risk for them so they can do whatever the kitten they want.
I came back to do some daily AT with my friend and some randoms and had a top team that shall not be name use teleport hacking guard... against scrub team from gold. Absolutely 0 kittens given from them.

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Posted (edited)

That's not a valid excuse, my theories are:

1: ANet fav childs since a "couple" years.
2: They really have no idea how do pvp works, same goes for wvw, completely ignoring the roamming part.
3: It's not their fault, just bias from the company bosses.

Edited by Zizekent.2398
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Posted (edited)

It's very hard, especially given the history of PoF launch and how certain HoT specs were nerfed around that time, to make room/incentivize playing the "new" spec..

So it's very hard to not see this as the same stuff all over again. Everyone knows guardian had 3 extremely strong builds in pvp. All top tier, or rather plat+ capable.

 

Support core, trapper DH, condi/hybrid core

 

along comes willbender and all of a sudden DH gets nerfed, even though DH and trapper synergy has been known for years, it's no secret. Furthermore, they didn't just nerf it, they cut it's throat. In this case, such language is fair because that is exactly what happened. The stealth duration was never the issue, nor even the superspeed, it was the spammability that was causing the problem. There's a mesmer trait that grants 3 secs of quickness on any interrupt, it has a CD of 3secs. There is absolutely no reason rune of trapper should have functioned any differently, and yet it did, and then anet remained silent about it right up until willbender.

Furthermore, everyone knows willebender is overtuned. Again, this is not a secret, this is not up for debate. It needs trimming at the very least. All of the EoD specs do for pvp. Trimming up and down. They are all out of whack atm.

So yeah, it's a very sour taste. I'm not even a guardian, but what was done to DH, if that's an example of what is to come, I just get bad vibes tbh. That anet can just make such drastic and wanton changes regarding one of it's game modes really makes me want to raise my voice.

 

This is my opinion, and this is how I personally see it. I can only speak for myself.

Edit : For the record, I am against any top performing pvp spec just randomly getting gutted w/o any warning. This is a serious blow to trapper DH out of nowhere, and my first impressions are this knocks them down from S/A tier to B/C or perhaps even D tier. I don't exactly know, I don't think anyone does atm, but time will tell how far DH will fall from this move of Anet. I am hoping for the best tbh kuz man it's just sad. Imagine waking up and your fav pvp spec is not just nerfed, it doesn't even function anymore.

Edited by Waffles.5632
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19 minutes ago, Zizekent.2398 said:

That's not a valid excuse, my theories are:

1: ANet fav childs since a "couple" years.
2: They really have no idea how do pvp works, same goes for wvw, completely ignoring the roamming part.
3: It's not their fault, just bias from the company bosses.

Looking at the rev and ele nerfs, they have no idea how the blob part works either.

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Posted (edited)

Hmm , what Bunkers were mostly used in the past ?

Can willbenders  and harbingers  , act as those bunker-killers ? Can they become the "final boss" instead of the bunkers ?

Edited by Luci.7018
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Posted (edited)

Both Guardian and Necromancer are Arenanet's love children, thus they don't get sufficiently adjusted downwards.

At this point this should be considered fact, not theory.

Edited by Fueki.4753
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29 minutes ago, Waffles.5632 said:

along comes willbender and all of a sudden DH gets nerfed, even though DH and trapper synergy has been known for years, it's no secret.

Exactly the same is happening with Revenant. Suddently Jalis got two nerfs in two different patches, and the third one reduces the damage scaling of the hammer (which is only used in WvW) and in that same patch the damage side of the alliance legend is buffed.

Arenanet what a company you are.

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See I felt on my own about tail swipe nurf. Yes 7k+ crit on port was hard hitting but it was not top of the list when willy has a utility low cd skill that will do that same dps on port but aoe. Are dps should always be looked at first over single target 

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Theory is simple and nothing fancy, marketing.

 

Guardians and necros are played by 50-60%% of the entire playerbase more or less (I don't have data of course, but seems pretty realistic).

They are meta in pve, pvp, wvw, everywhere.

 

They cannot afford to "lose" this % of players due to big nerfs, those people make them the most money.

 

They finally nerfed core necro after years of complains, they released a more busted spec to keep the necro mains happy and buy the new expansion.

 

Guardians had already core support meta in spvp, they started crying, they immediately overbuffed it and now it's the most broken spec of all game, and instead they nerfed dh with trapper runes 2 years late xD.

 

There isn't some conspiracy behind, it's simple money making.

 

 

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The patch was mainly a WvW patch and especially a Zerg v Zerg patch. That's why they weren't nerfed.

Also, both guardian and necromancer got nerfs in the area that fit the purpose of this patch (bringing down aoe damage in ZvZ).

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46 minutes ago, myun.6395 said:

They cannot afford to "lose" this % of players due to big nerfs, those people make them the most money.

You assume player leave the game because their proff is nerf but people staythe same proff or just change to the next better proff (wich need some time/gold investment to be ready up)

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23 hours ago, Jumpel.3972 said:

June patch is mainly focus on PVE balance (wich lead into some indirect side effect on pvp).

 

PVP balance patch are mostly number tweak on skill/trait. So maybe they don't touch Habinger and Willbender because the PVE balance team already work on some change.

Or maybe the last patch was already set up before the last MAT when Willbender and Harbinger emerge on the top

June patch is supposed to be more WvW focused, but is also going to rework banners and spirits

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On 5/13/2022 at 1:40 PM, Reikou.7068 said:

Realistically its because they need to go through the software dev process of identifying issues, planning changes, designing them, then developing them, followed by internal QA and then release.

The entire process probably takes like 1-2 months depending on how big the patch is, so they will alway an be slow regarding game balance because it takes said 1-2 months to release a fix for any balance issues identified now.

They *could* by pass this by doing a hotfix or something, but I doubt they would do this  unless it was gamebreaking or something, and lets be real, anything  PvP is not considered gamebreaking by anet.

 

I'd love if this was the case. That would mean any balance issue they identify gets fixed within 1-2 months. Compared to what we had for years, this would be awesome.

Hey A-net, ever thought about doing this?

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On 5/13/2022 at 10:36 AM, Luci.7018 said:

Hmm , what Bunkers were mostly used in the past ?

Can willbenders  and harbingers  , act as those bunker-killers ? Can they become the "final boss" instead of the bunkers ?

I wish. What will most likely happen is Willis and Harb will be nerfed like everything else, and then a little bit after June we'll be back to the same stale bunker-centric meta we were on before EoD released.

 

I don't even play guardian or necro, but I still don't want them to be nerfed because bunkers are boring and make the entire game boring so we need a few dedicated bunker busters. Realistically, every profession should be able to do this when they invest their entire build into doing so, but that really isn't a reliable option anymore.

Everyone just runs the same glassy stats, acting all surprised Pikachu and begging for nerfs the moment they die on literal glass cannon builds. The grim reality is that Harb and Willis are the best of a bad situation. They're strong for the meta they're in, but weak compared to anything pre-2/2020.

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