Harbinger is Making Roaming Unbearable

[Malkarne.8167]

Everywhere you go there's that FOTM spec. They are by far the most common class now, I barely even see Thieves anymore. Too much damage, too much sustain/mobility, and annoying as hell to fight. Yes I've beat them but frankly it's just not worth fighting them. One wrong move and you're dead before you know it. Please hurry up and fix them, roaming has been miserable since that spec came out.

[Hotride.2187]

+1

[Khenzy.9348]

The fact that they didn't hotfix or nerfed this spec/build last patch shows how disconnected they are with the WvW community as a whole or how little they care about smaller group fights or roaming in general. Because this... THING is broken beyond BELIEF. 

 

Anyone, and I mean ANYONE that dares to defend the current state of Harbinger in WvW small scale, automatically loses all credibility. Period.

 

Ok kitten it, let me go even farther because I'm kittening pissed:

Celestial stats are also a huge problem currently as these stats make Virtuoso busted, 'Nade Scrapper busted, Catalyst or any other kittening kitten D/D variation absolutely kittening busted, Boonbeast annoying as kitten and so on. But so are Minstrels, cleansing sigils, energy sigils, all of them too kittening strong.

Stupid strong boons such as protection or resolution need a hard cap of like 3 to 5 seconds tops. Same with resistance, same witth stability. They should have strategic use, they should NOT be long lasting and spammable whatsokitteningever. NO spec in the game should be able to maintain 100% uptime on 25 stacks of might on its own, EVER, or massively reduce the amount of Power and Condition damage 25 stacks of might provide. Man, I'm spitting so much kittening common sense here, why are those not implemented already?!

Meh, so much stuff is out of wack in this game mode that balance is a kittening mess as a whole. Don't get me started on kittening stealth, this atrociously implemented mechanic with even worse countermeasures. Stealth counter-measures (revealed) are mostly designed to counter Thief, yet they pusnih Ranger, Engineer and Mesmer (these classes sacrifice much more to get on demand stealth) much, much harder than Thief. It's a kittening disaster. WvW needs a massive balance pass to make it even remotely bereable in smallscale. 

 

kitten this game mode.

 

Rant over.

 

Edited May 13, 2022 by Khenzy.9348

[Dawdler.8521]

Tbh I've seen less and less of them lately in favor of the willbender instead. Even the "good" roaming guilds (ie well known gankers) dont seem to run them much, but granted maybe all the harbingers just hide under rocks when I run around in WvW.

[Deniara Devious.3948]

The real problem is the excessive might stacking some builds have, not celestial stats. Without any might celestial hits like a wet noodle.

And yes, Harbinger is broken, but that is partly also might stacking issues. Superior rune of Aristocracy gives +50 % more might duration and 5 stacks of might for 4 seconds (8 sec with stats) after inflicting Weakness.png weakness on a foe. (Cooldown: 1 Second). Corruption turns might into weakness. Harbinger pistol #3 and dagger #5 weapon skills inflict weakness as well, so does weakening shroud trait. Basically Harbinger can output massive damage, spam weakness, which gives it stacks of might.


 

[Morden Kain.3489]

I love it when a Necro turns all my might into weakness, then adds more weakness on top, just for me to flip that weakness back into stacks of might (which were already being regened) to push me up to 25 stacks of might.  Then I get to watch as they melt to the flamethrower I am hitting them with.

[Telgum.6071]

What? That can't be. According to the WvW subforum veterans, who look down other players saying that "there are no good guilds / roamers left", Celestial builds are perfectly fine and if you were to remove it, you would have to remove Marauder as well because they have the same problem.

Edited May 13, 2022 by Telgum.6071
/s

[Kozumi.5816]

5 hours ago, Khenzy.9348 said:

how little they care about smaller group fights or roaming in general.

Seem to only care about boonball guilds GvGing eachother which is what 0% of the player base ever experiences when doing WvW.

[Swagger.1459]

Haters gonna hate! 
 

We finally made it boys and girls! You know you have a more decent roaming build when peeps complain about mobility on Necro! Woop woop! Love it!!! ❤️

[aspirine.6852]

I see more willbenders than harbingers. But could be different on other servers.

[Khenzy.9348]

3 minutes ago, aspirine.6852 said:

I see more willbenders than harbingers. But could be different on other servers.

 

Both are currently OP.

[KrHome.1920]

Willbender is the actual fotm (sth. I like, because I run a hardcounter build).

Cele harbinger has some presence and is almost impossible to kill 1v1 but still easier to get rid of (forced to run away and reset) than any daredevil or deadeye build. So I am fine with it.

Btw.: 2 small adjustments would bring harbinger in line:

1. nerf the elixier heal to PvE level

2. cut the duration of the elite elixir boons in half

Edited May 16, 2022 by KrHome.1920

[Kate.3679]

On 5/13/2022 at 2:53 PM, Dawdler.8521 said:

Tbh I've seen less and less of them lately in favor of the willbender instead. Even the "good" roaming guilds (ie well known gankers) dont seem to run them much, but granted maybe all the harbingers just hide under rocks when I run around in WvW.

harbinger gets hard countered by scrapper which most small mans will run

[charrboiledeggs.8164]

On 5/13/2022 at 2:51 PM, Morden Kain.3489 said:

I love it when a Necro turns all my might into weakness, then adds more weakness on top, just for me to flip that weakness back into stacks of might (which were already being regened) to push me up to 25 stacks of might.  Then I get to watch as they melt to the flamethrower I am hitting them with.

a good necro will have more than one boon corrupt lol

[Morden Kain.3489]

2 hours ago, charrboiledeggs.8164 said:

a good necro will have more than one boon corrupt lol

Like a good Necro, a good Engie will have more than 1 converter.

[Dr Meta.3158]

Since wvw is entirely focused on zergs, I don't think they care.

[charrboiledeggs.8164]

5 hours ago, Morden Kain.3489 said:

Like a good Necro, a good Engie will have more than 1 converter.

but necro have more corrupts then you have converters

[Boh.4568]

I'm ok with Harb nerfs as long as they do something in return, such as buffing my reaper (only mine) with something like 1 minute of invuln+big stab for each shroud1 autoattack (0 sec ICD). Please anet

[Bale.3851]

11 hours ago, charrboiledeggs.8164 said:

but necro have more corrupts then you have converters

Have you ever used rune of antitoxin? Its awesome. kittens all condi classes with my ingi/ranger. Not like i needed it but harbinger is freeloot with this.  Plus the weapon swap cleasing sigil and condi can kiss my B U 2x T.

[Sleepwalker.1398]

There are way more runaway Willbenders then solo Harbs tbh.

[solemn.9608]

+1

While they're at it they can balance the other 8+ problem builds which have been problem builds in WvW roaming for like 3 years.

Don't get your hopes up. They haven't cared about WvW for 5 years lmao

[solemn.9608]

3 hours ago, Bale.3851 said:

Have you ever used rune of antitoxin? Its awesome. kittens all condi classes with my ingi/ranger. Not like i needed it but harbinger is freeloot with this.  Plus the weapon swap cleasing sigil and condi can kiss my B U 2x T.

Most are cele and many trait more into power damage even though they can still pump out condis without effort. They do too much damage overall. I know Necro is anets "I'm physically handicapped irl and need something to play" class but this is ridiculous, and core Necro has been OP for way too long as well lol

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Yes, alone cele harb is very strong--but I don't see how it's any more unbalanced than certain condi renegade builds for instance.  

I think above take on reducing the Elixer elite boon time is probably all that is needed here.  Harbinger does have some impressive condi spam from distance, but so do a lot of specs--it's really the boon uptime with cele that puts them over the top.  

[Mikhael.2391]

I dont see how harbinger is more kitten for roaming that the new ELE, MESMER, SPECTER, and still do not forget that grenades engie without facing target exist and almost one shots people, and DE with perma imobilize and condis and stelath and teleports and dodges that neevr end. 

 

Before "fixing" harbinger (which  i play very litle since it does not seem fun with new shroud mechanics" fix all the previous broken meme builds on classes that can run away denie damage stealth and so on with much mor ease.

 

Also do not forget that core necro even bunker eats all the CC untill dead(thanks anet for the idiotic remove of stability on entering shroud years ago so harbinger can have it later which was not needed), reaper is only slightly better, and scourge, well, as the rest needs babysiting if wanst to kill anything.

 

On a similar note, willbender is the only good viable way to roam,not op in anyway since all previous mentioned classes have same burst or better with boon strips more cc and same mobility plus stealth, DH can be easily targeted and killed when focused with very litle ways to escape, firebrand is healbot only and boon giver and core guardian is nowhere to be seen, completly deleted due to nerf in weapons like focus 5 for burst damage and mace 3, and even hammer2 even traited. Almost 0 mobility to run away or means to survive outnumbered fights.

 

This is not for discussion it is as it is.

[solemn.9608]

23 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Yes, alone cele harb is very strong--but I don't see how it's any more unbalanced than certain condi renegade builds for instance.  

I think above take on reducing the Elixer elite boon time is probably all that is needed here.  Harbinger does have some impressive condi spam from distance, but so do a lot of specs--it's really the boon uptime with cele that puts them over the top.  

Condi renegade is also unbalanced

Many things are unbalanced and have been for y e a r s

Anet doesn't care. Don't hold your breath lol