Quickness Herald doesn't work

[soul.9651]

14 minutes ago, Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:

Yeah some one tried with ritualist and herald/mallyx ? Could be easier with rune of FB rather than full diviner, leadership, and lost of precision !?

Something like http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmwAkeZlpQIMLKidRSMMCiJSgsCSgjukZzE-zRJYyRD/ZkuEIEFgYHA-e

Edit* found this

 

Wellll only missing almost 10k dps, stab and aegis on demand and we are almost as good as qfb :"""""")

[The Boz.2038]

The 1.5>2s patch makes it kinda work, but it still feels like absolute dogpoo. This is not likely to challenge any other q-provider.

[Angesombre.4630]

15 hours ago, Zhaid Zhem.6508 said:

Yeah some one tried with ritualist and herald/mallyx ? Could be easier with rune of FB rather than full diviner, leadership, and lost of precision !?

Something like http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmwAkeZlpQIMLKidRSMMCiJSgsCSgjukZzE-zRJYyRD/ZkuEIEFgYHA-e

Edit* found this. + I didn't know about the 2sec quickness tweak.

 

Come on Anet, one more effort and we'll reach 15k, you're on the right track with all nerfs of the revenant.

Soon there will be no more need for CM the difficulty will already be the norm...

Edited July 10, 2022 by Angesombre.4630

[ButterPeanut.9746]

The power build isn't horrible. Not quite as good as other options, but might, fury, swiftness, prot, regen, quickness, 10 target AOE lifesteal, boon extension and big CC is nothing to scoff at.

 

Here are two builds that are 100% crit exact and 50% boon duration exact, which is fairly comfy. 

 

Force + Accuracy sigils: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmgAwylpQMMLyjdRdMMijJSksCigJ7larE-zRZYBhQrbLkA4ohqSsMioAqIBs9gEGbg3i+LbA-e

 

Force + Air/Impact/Night/etc sigils: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmgAwylpQMMLyjdRdMMijJSksCigJ7larE-zRZYBBRsFStM4ohqSsMarAqIBs9gEGbg3i+LbA-e

 

[Angesombre.4630]

The way the quickness has been imported on the revenant (I will speak mainly on this class) and surely the elem are not top. 

Because if we compare with the harbinger already it has almost no worries gave the quickness with the shroud with 3s for an interval of 3s, it has an elixir for the throw 4s which also makes damages and the elite during 5s, good there is also the scrapper which has a facility for the given via the drone. The scrapper gives also supervitesse, of the fufu, protection finally voila and even by attacking. 

So to get back to the revenant, this is done in a terrible way we have to sacrifice permanent buffs that consume energy with average buffs currently, to use quickness we have to use the Herald skills, in addition to that it does not give enough and all this on a class that has a very low DPS. I would have seen more defensive buffs added on a support class that has the shield as a weapon and put quickness on the vindicator that already has it but could have shared it that would have given it an extra utility (I won't talk about all the flaws of the vindicator). This is just my opinion.

[The Boz.2038]

Scrapper, Firebrand, Harbinger need ~30% BD to be effective.
Warrior, Herald, Catalyst need 80%+ in order to work.

Something ain't right here.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

55 minutes ago, The Boz.2038 said:

Scrapper, Firebrand, Harbinger need ~30% BD to be effective.
Warrior, Herald, Catalyst need 80%+ in order to work.

Something ain't right here.

It isn't necessarily about boon duration.  It's about overall performance once they have that duration.  In theory (and for awhile in practice) you can have a support spec that needs 80% boon duration that has high enough modifiers to still do the same amount of damage as something like Quickbrand and Quickbinger.  

[The Boz.2038]

In theory, yeah... But higher BD requirements also greatly limit the availability of other stats, putting a cap on your performance in non-boon departments.

[Angesombre.4630]

What is unpleasant is that some classes can do it in a simple and practical way while for the others we see the tinkering that does not correspond to the spirit of the specialization to try to tinker something

[ButterPeanut.9746]

On 7/13/2022 at 1:47 AM, The Boz.2038 said:

Scrapper, Firebrand, Harbinger need ~30% BD to be effective.
Warrior, Herald, Catalyst need 80%+ in order to work.

Something ain't right here.

This is not true for herald. I believe the "optimal damage" setup has around 45% boon duration, and 50% boon duration is fairly comfy and allows for some mistakes. See my post above for two example builds. 

[Ahi.9673]

that 'optimal' setup has you use your heal and your stun break for quickness while doing less dps than half-afk harbinger still though

[otto.5684]

On 7/13/2022 at 2:47 AM, The Boz.2038 said:

Scrapper, Firebrand, Harbinger need ~30% BD to be effective.
Warrior, Herald, Catalyst need 80%+ in order to work.

Something ain't right here.

I agree. For some elites Anet is exceeding stingy with providing boon access/support while others drop it like candy. This should be normalized around the 50% mark.

Even if the quickness access and dps is improved, I still do not think it is sufficient. If group might access is improved, we might get there.

Edited July 15, 2022 by otto.5684

[Scoobaniec.9561]

Quickness could have been placed on facet of strenght/elements change my mind.
The real question is did herald need one?

Edited July 17, 2022 by Scoobaniec.9561

[Angesombre.4630]

For me, no the herald didn't need it but I would have bet on more DPS for PvE already and probably 1 or 2 defensive buffs. And or/with a shield upgrade already, make him mobile with the shield and not block alone under his dome.

As I said I would have seen this more on vindicator with trait.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Angesombre.4630

[Aeolus.3615]

On 7/17/2022 at 10:31 PM, Scoobaniec.9561 said:

Quickness could have been placed on facet of strenght/elements change my mind.
The real question is did herald need one?

I dont feel herald need it either

Edit:  its ok with power  builds with arround 50% boon duration or more, some actions will perform faster, swap to assassin and have more of it.

 

Edited July 19, 2022 by Aeolus.3615

[Angesombre.4630]

I have just tested the herald with the speed how to say that it is null, even with the max of concentration it is not profitable, if you want to continue on this optics there makes a f3. But I always remain not favorable has that on the herald.

On the other hand with your successive nerves, revenant doesn't look like anything anymore I don't even want to play it while I had a love at first sight for this class almost 7 years ago. Thank you Anet for reducing my addiction to GW2.

Edited July 23, 2022 by Angesombre.4630

[Howluffu.7259]

12 hours ago, Angesombre.4630 said:

I have just tested the herald with the speed how to say that it is null, even with the max of concentration it is not profitable, if you want to continue on this optics there makes a f3. But I always remain not favorable has that on the herald.

On the other hand with your successive nerves, revenant doesn't look like anything anymore I don't even want to play it while I had a love at first sight for this class almost 7 years ago. Thank you Anet for reducing my addiction to GW2.

Same, I'm always checking revenant forum to see if I would return to the game. 

Everyday the same answer: NOPE.

 

I still have hopes tho...

 

[khawki.4205]

Quickness herald does work.

First of all, heal variant is awesome, providing more healing than hfb and bringing very strong projectal block while also beeing easy to play (also, range is nice bonus, way easier to give quick in pugs where people spread more). Yes, it doesn't bring stab if you don't bring jalis. But hey, that's great desing, you need to decide between more healing + block or stab and dmg reduction.

 

As for DPS variant. There is so much possibility here! And you don't need high boon duration either. You can actually run it on full bersersker gear, so if you go to lfg and they ask for quick instead of dps... you change one trait! With this you're also not forced to go "glint shiro". You spend more time in glint (but you also have energy to actually use your weapon skills other than sword 2), and you can take any legend as 2nd depending on fight. Need block? ventari. Need stab? jalis. Need boonstrip? mallyx.

 

Yes, you lose dps compared to blue warriors. But with how many paths you have open and how great desing of it is... I'd say it's great change.

[soul.9651]

1 hour ago, khawki.4205 said:

Quickness herald does work.

First of all, heal variant is awesome, providing more healing than hfb and bringing very strong projectal block while also beeing easy to play (also, range is nice bonus, way easier to give quick in pugs where people spread more). Yes, it doesn't bring stab if you don't bring jalis. But hey, that's great desing, you need to decide between more healing + block or stab and dmg reduction.

 

As for DPS variant. There is so much possibility here! And you don't need high boon duration either. You can actually run it on full bersersker gear, so if you go to lfg and they ask for quick instead of dps... you change one trait! With this you're also not forced to go "glint shiro". You spend more time in glint (but you also have energy to actually use your weapon skills other than sword 2), and you can take any legend as 2nd depending on fight. Need block? ventari. Need stab? jalis. Need boonstrip? mallyx.

 

Yes, you lose dps compared to blue warriors. But with how many paths you have open and how great desing of it is... I'd say it's great change.

Thing is it does work but most of the time u need to camp glint or you will lose that quickness upkeep, and in some situations sometimes maybe you wanna stay at dwarf longer for extra stab or at ventari for the shield as long as you might need, but you just cant and you must swap back to glint asap.. but all in all its not a bad build 

Edited July 27, 2022 by soul.9651

[khawki.4205]

4 minutes ago, soul.9651 said:

Thing is it does work but most of the time u need to camp glint or you will lose that quickness upkeep, and in some situations sometimes maybe you wanna stay at dwarf longer for extra stab or at ventari for the shield as long as you might need, but you just cant and must swap back to glint asap.. but all in all its not a bad build 

I can't think of encounter that would force me to stay in those for so long. And remember you also have heal/alac in your team. I mentioned that design is good because you don't provide everything, but you can adapt to encounter very well

[soul.9651]

29 minutes ago, khawki.4205 said:

I can't think of encounter that would force me to stay in those for so long. And remember you also have heal/alac in your team. I mentioned that design is good because you don't provide everything, but you can adapt to encounter very well

I mean for example sirens reef fractal, at final boss u wanna camp your ventari shield for as long as possible to protect your team, or even mai trin fract where u wanna keep it up for as long as u can too, these are just a few examples which comes to my mind rn but there are prob even more. And yeah assuming u have HAM in your team even the spec is op by itself sometimes you just cant trust the people playing that spec since they can mess up what is usual at pugs xd..

[Buran.3796]

4 hours ago, khawki.4205 said:

Yes, it doesn't bring stab if you don't bring jalis. But hey, that's great desing, you need to decide between more healing + block or stab and dmg reduction.

   ...Or you just run a firebrand and have everything.

   * You have viable mele and ranged weapons, which works with strike or condition damage indistinctly.

   *You share permanent quickness and tons of access to might, plus team stability and aegis, and you lose very little dps while gearing to share those boons.

   *Want to heal and cleanse allies? You have that in spades.

   * Situational utilities? All of them: need to insta-gib a breakbar? Sanctuary. Projectile hate? Tome 3. Projectile reflection? Wall of Reflection. Cleanses? Tome 2, Mantra of Lore, Purging Flames, Cleansing Flame...

 

   Instead Rev has a low dps power mele quickness build which only excels in cc, and a healing build which uses a legend which doesn't even have a breakstun...  Tha's a great design indeed (makes Kalla initially released with the breakstun in the heal to look like a genious feature!).

[khawki.4205]

2 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

   ...Or you just run a firebrand and have everything.

   * You have viable mele and ranged weapons, which works with strike or condition damage indistinctly.

   *You share permanent quickness and tons of access to might, plus team stability and aegis, and you lose very little dps while gearing to share those boons.

   *Want to heal and cleanse allies? You have that in spades.

   * Situational utilities? All of them: need to insta-gib a breakbar? Sanctuary. Projectile hate? Tome 3. Projectile reflection? Wall of Reflection. Cleanses? Tome 2, Mantra of Lore, Purging Flames, Cleansing Flame...

 

   Instead Rev has a low dps power mele quickness build which only excels in cc, and a healing build which uses a legend which doesn't even have a breakstun...  Tha's a great design indeed (makes Kalla initially released with the breakstun in the heal to look like a genious feature!).

It wasn't my intention to prove that herald is superior to firebrand... It is not.

I said that quick herald works. That it is viable, and that it is well designed because you are flexible and can make meaningful choices.

Of course, firebrands are better probably 90% of the time. But it doesn't mean herald doesn't work anymore.

Meta isn't the only way of playing.

[soul.9651]

10 minutes ago, khawki.4205 said:

It wasn't my intention to prove that herald is superior to firebrand... It is not.

I said that quick herald works. That it is viable, and that it is well designed because you are flexible and can make meaningful choices.

Of course, firebrands are better probably 90% of the time. But it doesn't mean herald doesn't work anymore.

Meta isn't the only way of playing.

Idk it still needs more quickness, more dps would be nice too just to get in line with the rest quickness appliers and that might be it. Again i agree its viable rn but it does need some QoL buffs and again give us more dps plz ;-;

[khawki.4205]

4 minutes ago, soul.9651 said:

Idk it still needs more quickness, more dps would be nice too just to get in line with the rest quickness appliers and that might be it. Again i agree its viable rn but it does need some QoL buffs and again give us more dps plz ;-;

There is always room for improvement 😉 cough, hammer rework, cough But I'm positive that Anet is taking herald in right direction. We shall see in next balance patch. (I'd personally love some integration of condi in herald traits as it's mostly boons or strike dmg)